"Tonight on Smash Face Off, We'll see who would win in a fight between Fox and Marth. Who do you think would win Mark?" "I don't know Larry, lets run the simulation and find out."
In what way specifically? bc I feel like a lot of people just arbitrarily assign value to controller now and ignore the decades of melee that was highly technical already
@@sageryfrekenstein Haha don't worry, I'm 33, and I played melee competitively for 20 years. So I don't ignore these decades. What's very hard to do with a controller is very cleans long dash dances mixed with short ones. With a boxx, or frame1 or keyboard, it's actually very easy. Also the backair after a jump is quasi impossible to do with a controller, or you have to switch your grip to claw, a thing I do in some particular situations, but for example, this jump double jump moving forward backair at 11:28 seems very Boxx'y. Another thing that makes me think it's human can be described at 12:07, why doing dash-dances and then jump left like that? To me this looks like a missed wavedash (too early air-dodge which leads to nothing). Many many interactions and combos are human-like. I'm not saying there are for sure human, I'm saying it looks very very human to me and I don't feel like they are soooo technical. Ice/Leffen/Hax/Mango/etc... are more technical than that. If you find some clip where it's obvious it's AI, please answer me with the timestamp :D
30 seconds into the and the Marth immediately dash back grabbed and tried to cheese, then landed from angel platform and spammed fsmash. The Fox naired into the corner then got smoked by fsmash. Melee is a universal language. Thank you for giving me the ammunition to justify calling my fsmash spamming Gold Marth opponents bots.
I'm guessing it's a result of AI giving "points" or value to anything that results in less frequent deaths. Or it could be that the AI learned or was programmed to shine-stall if recovery was impossible. This would be helpful in cases where both players have no possible way to recover in a last stock situation. I don't think it helps recovery distance.
@@Jack-vx5ge it’s funny you mention that because they seem much more aggressive against real people. I saw a Marth last night try to CC dtilt falco and Falco just countered it with cc into an aerial.
"Tonight on Smash Face Off, We'll see who would win in a fight between Fox and Marth. Who do you think would win Mark?"
"I don't know Larry, lets run the simulation and find out."
looks very very human to me, I would even say the fox seems to play on a frame1
In what way specifically? bc I feel like a lot of people just arbitrarily assign value to controller now and ignore the decades of melee that was highly technical already
@@sageryfrekenstein Haha don't worry, I'm 33, and I played melee competitively for 20 years. So I don't ignore these decades. What's very hard to do with a controller is very cleans long dash dances mixed with short ones. With a boxx, or frame1 or keyboard, it's actually very easy. Also the backair after a jump is quasi impossible to do with a controller, or you have to switch your grip to claw, a thing I do in some particular situations, but for example, this jump double jump moving forward backair at 11:28 seems very Boxx'y.
Another thing that makes me think it's human can be described at 12:07, why doing dash-dances and then jump left like that? To me this looks like a missed wavedash (too early air-dodge which leads to nothing).
Many many interactions and combos are human-like. I'm not saying there are for sure human, I'm saying it looks very very human to me and I don't feel like they are soooo technical. Ice/Leffen/Hax/Mango/etc... are more technical than that.
If you find some clip where it's obvious it's AI, please answer me with the timestamp :D
51:20 fox circle camping lmao
Their interactions are so strange
30 seconds into the and the Marth immediately dash back grabbed and tried to cheese, then landed from angel platform and spammed fsmash. The Fox naired into the corner then got smoked by fsmash.
Melee is a universal language.
Thank you for giving me the ammunition to justify calling my fsmash spamming Gold Marth opponents bots.
16 seconds in, fox cheesed Marth with shines
at 49:54, the fox wanted to dash left shield but he instead slipped and did shield dash which result in a left roll, this loooks so human, it's insane
Fun to watch
This is so epic lmfao, would love to see a peach
so cool to see
Nice, does the AI have any delay in receiving inputs? Like having some reaction time instead of instantly responding to its environment?
@@andrewdinunzio they have different AIs with different reaction time.
th-cam.com/video/m7Vx6XzyQcM/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/m7Vx6XzyQcM/w-d-xo.html
insane sequences
Are these based on blind reinforcement learning?
Doesn't look like it.
0:40 does this shine stalling actually help recovery distance?
I'm guessing it's a result of AI giving "points" or value to anything that results in less frequent deaths. Or it could be that the AI learned or was programmed to shine-stall if recovery was impossible. This would be helpful in cases where both players have no possible way to recover in a last stock situation. I don't think it helps recovery distance.
Shine stops the horizontal momentum, which is detrimental for recovery, especially from afar.
have you taught them about crouch cancelling?
@@Jack-vx5ge it’s funny you mention that because they seem much more aggressive against real people. I saw a Marth last night try to CC dtilt falco and Falco just countered it with cc into an aerial.
is there a reason it seems like its in slow mo?