The community isn't wrong for wanting the new animal to feel like an animal. I dont think they should have gotten rid of the cougar, but I do think it needs to be updated. Maybe they can't make it stalk you throughout the whole world but they could put tracks when it's in the region and have it growl when it's near by only to let you know it's hunting you. They don't have to have you see it until it's running at you to give you a small chance. I do like the attack animation, though. Also, if people say that Hinterland won't have the time and resource to change the cougar to something the community likes, then they shouldn't have tried to tackle a project like this. I love their game, and I'm sure they'll make the cougar better. Great video. I loved your commentary.
Basically this. The sound design for the cougar is absolutely incredible, as evidenced in this video. The music, the hisses, growls and screeches etc. all really atmospheric and immersive. If they can add visual cues to the game of the same quality, then it's going to be really amazing. The less reliance on HUD notifications, the better.
I like this topic so I’ll get my hefty 2 cents in (haven’t watched the video fully btw) So coming from someone who lives very near to and has been in lots of cougar country (and from a gameplay design) this cougar wasn’t at all bad or in need of a fix. Personally, I wasn’t fully on board once I learned it’s mechanics, but I would’ve been able to suck it up and deal with it since I didn’t absolutely hate it. Going to real life for a moment, unless you get lucky or have a very keen eye, you will NOT see a cougar unless it wants you to, but that *doesn’t* mean you won’t see it til it’s on top of you. The game is actually very generous by giving the chance to live afterward (Even though it would be bad game design) because a cougar would absolutely Rock. Your. Shit. If it pounced on you the way it does in game, the caveat being unless your vitals are extremely protected (especially your neck) you would more or less stand a chance. The clothing worn in game I feel can fit this fine, so I have no major complaints. The game and real life are different, I’m aware, but there’s no reason to disregard it’s ability to emulate real things. As far as gameplay, there are plenty of arguments for both sides. I’m mostly a fence-sitter, but I am happy to see the cougar getting revised. I didn’t like the fact the game directly told you when the cougar was after you. It was tense, sure, but ultimately, sounds and tracks would be your only indication that it’s in the area, which also wouldn’t directly indicate its after you. It just didn’t feel random or surprising enough since I could expect it, even with the ”random encounter” mechanics. The game had to be fair, I get it, but the cougar, in all reality, isn’t fair. My own thoughts for a good fix : - have a random timer set instead of a fixed one, and once it’s up, don’t inform the player by immediately presenting the red symbol and music, but give them signs from the environment (scratchmarks, pawprints, distant growls, etc.) with increasing frequency. - Give the player a *chance* to see it before it attacks. Much like all other wildlife in the game, no two encounters are the same. They’re all unique, it would be nice if they player had an opportunity to defend themselves from the cougar before it attacked. Not 100% of the time mind you, just sometimes. Heck, I’d be fine with 25-30%. Just something to make it less cut and dry. - Lastly, (and this might be asking for too much) *Region Favorship* I would LOVE to see this, especially with the random timer I mentioned earlier and a “set” number of cougars. This would cause some regions to be more dangerous to visit than others. For some regions, the kill timer could be 5-7 days. Other might be a month. Some might be safe from cougars entirely. Point is the regions residing the cougars would be more risky. Of course there would be a random roll with every run. One run might have cougars in HRV, Broken railroad, and Blackrock. Another run might have them in Ash canyon, Mystery lake, and Desolation point. A percent to roll certain regions would make it much nicer too. Say the Timberwolf mountain area (and all regions around it) had a 60-80% chance of having one of the three since it’s much nicer cougar country, while bleak inlet and the muskeg had a 15-30% being much less cougar friendly. Instead of just being an extremely glorified cabin fever, this would shove some more character into the world and the cougars. It would be a *very* complex system, but would absolutely adore it if something similar were added. Feel free to pick apart anything you like, my ideas are never perfect and I like nice discussion. Cheers ✌️
@@alloftherun1174 ooooooh the different timers for each region is such a good idea!! Thank you for the comment, and thanks for adding context for cougars in real life. I don’t live in cougar territory, and everything I know about them is from the internet, so it’s nice to have your POV too ❤️
@@QilleWolf for sure! I’ve got plenty of secondhand stories from family that’ve had direct experience with em. Heck, one of em came after my uncle after he shot a deer. That’s a whole story, and too long for text to tell, but man, when you see em, they’re scary. And I haven’t even seen one out there in person! XD (at least not up close)
Personally I think region-locking the cougar would have been a better idea than the timed arrival mechanic they went for. Limit the cougar's presence to the region containing it's den, and neighbouring regions. After all, Hinterland described it themselves as being territorial. Then if you start hearing and/or seeing evidence of it's presence, you know to be very careful and to avoid the area until you're adequately prepared (or adequately crazy). I think Hinterland said that the HUD cues were needed to make sure players didn't miss the danger they were in. To which I say, what about a "warning shot" attack? The first time the cougar pounces you, it knocks you down and sends you sprawling, but that's it. No time to react, just a "I'm here, get out or get wrecked" moment. I'd also like to see an animation where it take a swipe at you as you get to the top of a rope climb or rock climb, before vanishing again while you freak out. The more in-game interactions and less reliance on the HUD, the better.
Your ideas are brilliant. It seemed weird to me to see a cougar in a coastal region. I'm not knowledgable about cougars but the name MOUNTAIN lion doesn't suggest it lives close to the shore. Before it was added I had hoped the cougar wouldnt just spawn behind you. Instead it spawns right on you, in which case spawning behind you would be preferable. I think the cougar spawning on you would make sense when walking through certain kinds of terrain. Under cliffs, in forests and such where an ambush would be impossible to notice. In open spaces the cougar could spawn behind the player and have very silent footsteps. That would encourage the player to plan his routes to avoid the zones of greater danger
@@gerwrant Thanks! 🙏 Yeah, it kinda subverted my expectations a bit with the “all region lock” I’m not terribly concerned with how the cougar spawned. Of course I’d like the small chance of self defense, but other than that it was fine. The only issue with “death from above” (and I think Quille mentioned this) is that it’s a tall order, much like my suggestion with region favorship. TLD isn’t manned by an elite game team, just some people with jobs in a small studio. I’m sure they could find an easy workaround such as “pouncing zones” under cliffs and such that increase risk of being attacked, but even then that’s a niche system. I love the idea, but just like mine, it’s complex
To be honest, the only thing I didn't like about the cougar is that it's not an entity, just a scripted event. I LOVE the idea of it stalking and harassing you for days, and jumping at you when you least expect it, but I just wish you could interact more with it. For example, maybe you could catch it silently stalking at you from the woods, and you could try to take it on before it attacks you. It could also try to attack you while you're sleeping outside without a fire, making staying outside REALLY dangerous when the cougar is around. Or even it could find it sleeping on some treetops, the same way you can find bears sleeping, and you could hunt it right there. Being hunted by a cougar should reward players who keep their guard up, and not just be an anti-camp measure lol.
@@daimon7421 I agree, that would have been super cool, but they’re not Sony, they can’t spend all that time designing a complex AI for a predator that most players will only see once every 100 days. It certainly would have been awesome to see it stalking you through the map, but I understand why they added it the way they did (scary for the player, not the programmer). Cougars are super stealthy in real life as well, most people never even know they’re being stalked until they get jumped. I don’t remember if I put it in the video, but I pitched that it would have been a good compromise to be able to find the cougar in the world during an aurora, which made it disoriented and distracted
@@daimon7421 and randomly when you’re walking under a tree, a dead animal falls out of it because the cougar was trying to hide the meal for later nothing like a good old jump scare
@@QilleWolf even if it's not very realistic the feeling of being stalked would make the jumpscare so much better and would TERRIFY people. Since jumpscares aren't as good without fear. Even if it would be hard, I wonder if a png could work, rather than having an in-game model. Honestly anything that got rid of the "cougar is coming" pop-up and timer would be better.
@@Crev_ce3 did you watch the video? I was terrified by just the noises and the music, because the directional noise made it sound like there was something lurking behind me. My imagination did the rest of the work. It was the perfect amount of scary, and they don’t need to add anything else to it
@@QilleWolf yeah, I just think they could add a tiny bit. As someone said (who I think was you in the video lmao) it might be scarier with it charging. After sleeping on it: I think that they should get rid of the timer, and make the cougar screams a bit more common (and slowly get more frequent as it comes time for the attack) to balance out the lack of a timer. I think right before it attacks you should hear footsteps. These very minor changes could make it perfect, which it very nearly is.
the cougar is great it just needs some tweaks to make it scarier and less emersion-breaking it shouldn't be removed just edited- no stupid timer and "THE COUGAR IS APPROACHING" just seeing it in the corner of your eye, faint cougar screams, ect. At the climax, when you're paranoid as ever THEN the cougar attacks. Some people (like me lol) didn't think a jumpscare like it is would be good but as long as there's a bit of paranoia beforehand it would work really well. It's just emersionbreakting to have a timer rather than being stalked and slowly realizing. (but dont be too subtle or you wont have the paranoia) As someone mentioned in another comment it shouldn't be a set number of days before the cougar comes, but a range like for example 10-20 days in a certain difficulty. Makes it scarier :D I admit I dont play the game (mainly because the lack of predator diversity and some other reasons that are hard to put into words) but I do know a bit about the community and survival games in general and emersion + fear is generally good. sorry for the rant you can probably tell I love talking about game design and stuff also subscribed you seem cool edit: watched a bit more of the video and confirmed you are infact cool edit 2: even if it would be kinda hard to make having pngs in the corner of your vision (so you turn around and are like "did I just see that WHAT"), audio files of it growling, tracks and scratches on tree shouldn't be super hard to make? Idk but it seems simpler than a ton of AI like for wolves. edit 3: After sleeping on it: I think that they should get rid of the timer, and make the cougar screams a bit more common (and slowly get more frequent as it comes time for the attack) to balance out the lack of a timer. I think right before it attacks you should hear footsteps. These very minor changes could make it perfect, which it very nearly is.
The point about health bars as a resource is a good observation. Health is a resource that can be easily restored. I came back to the game recently after playing very sheltered years ago. I noticed that I would limit my loot or make multiple trips because of my insane overpreparing clothing wise. now I am usually welcoming of a slow cooling off outside, as I feel less overpacked. I feel like hinterland did a good job of trying to make the cougar as user defined and easily avoidable, personally that pulled me out of it a little bit, but I appreciate what they were aiming for.
16:36 I lost a run that had a great start to a forgotten infection risk :/ I spawned in HRV, looted the signal fire and got to the bunker which happened to be stocked. Right before the bunker however I was attacked by a wolf by the bushes you need to break. In fact it was a double attack because the wolf got confused in the confined space. I got out with like 10% hp. Everything about that run was blessed and I simply forgor about an infection and died in my sleep
I have to say as someone who plays dark souls games aswell all i can say is get gud scrubs. Sorry but come on people. I don't hear people say they want the old bear in game yeah because it was hard and the cougar is that a very hard interaction but a shot not the smashing the button. If you can't make the shot then your not going to make the shot on the cougar you are asking for is my 1st thought.
First things first, I love the Long Dark, and I love so much of what they've done with the Cougar. The ambient noises, the music, the attack animation, the den and model - all superb. Atmospheric, anxiety inducing and scary as all hell
All that said, I disliked the implementation. The HUD prompts and notifications were just too much, and too immersion breaking. I would much prefer to rely entirely from in-game evidence. Like I said, the soundtrack and ambient cues are incredible, I was hoping for visual cues to match
The timed nature of the encounter bugged me as well. In the original implementation you're only ever likely to encounter the cougar if you wait for it - essentially forcing it to happen, rather than it being something that happens naturally during the course of normal play. Players who don't read the updates or follow the dev notes could potentially go through the game without ever knowing it was there
Honestly, I'd prefer if it was limited to areas close to it's den. If/when you encroach on it's territory, you get warnings. If you don't heed the warnings and linger too long, you're at risk of getting pounced.
I will leave my thoughts of the cougar here to offer my view and feedback of it. I will leave a TLDR at the end, the rest is for those who want my context of why I think the way I do. One thing I do want to talk about is that I managed to get the Big Cat badge from killing 3 cougars. I fought them in Mystery Lake and Transfer Pass and did find that they tend to spawn when on the roads and near trees. I say this to show that I at least went and got into a few encounters with the big cat. First off the things I love about it; The atmosphere and music is fantastic. Literally chilling to be walking around with the drums and the hissing of the big cat after you. It's fear when you first encounter it and tense after you get accustom to it after a few encounters. That is something that I think TLD is good to have occasionally to remind you that you are at nature's mercy. I also love some of the small details they throw in like all the animals despawn when the cougar enters the region. No wolves, bears, deer, rabbits, all of them disappear when the threat of a cougar arrives. I LOVE that detail that everything knows a dangerous predator is near and none want to mess with it. I also like the mini-game of the retaliation shot that you go though after it attacks you. As you are disoriented and do your best to get that lucky shot to put down the beast and in Astrid's words "I'm going to kill you and eat you, you bastard!" A very unique struggle for one of the most hyped creatures in TLD With that I do have a few complaints. The UI is one thing that I find off-putting but no way disruptive of the game or affect gameplay. With how much they try to keep the UI uncluttered and simple, I find it strange that you get big warning sirens that the cougar is encroaching and a flat accurate timer of when it appears. With how loud the cougar is I will be surprised if you are caught off-guard when it start to have interest with you. I would also love more environmental clues that it is in the area like dead animal caraccas but those are unneeded and would be fun details to add. Also might provide an interesting risk and reward to get a little bit of free food and hides for those who are crazy. Now the for the things that I didn't like. It takes effort to gain the cougar's attention. I had you go almost 100 (takes around 30 days for stalker/voyager) days in order to get the cougar 3 times and that was intentionally going through my supplies to hibernate all that time. That's a very long time to go though to get a glorified cut-scene of being attacked and get 1 shot of killing it. Cougar 1.0 it more of an affliction of outdoor cabin fever rather than feeling like an actual animal in the game. If I had to suggest ideas to fix what I think is wrong. Maybe make the cougar have regions where it is active and hunting. Making those places dangerous to travel though until the timer runs out and it moves on to a new area. If it happens to move into a region you are into you will hear the noises that it is encroaching and it is time for you to prepare to fight or move for a few days. I would also decrease the timer of when it moves around, like every 10 to 15 days it decides to move. I am also a fan of the idea that it spawns 10 feet behind you and pounces on you. So if you have your gun or bow out you may get a lucky shot to ward it away or use a flare/flare gun to scare it off and if you are REALLY lucky maybe kill it. This is the alpha predator it should be treated as such. You should WANT to avoid it. TLDR; Love the atmosphere and music, very intense and terrifying for your first encounters. They should remove the huge warning UI's as it has enough environment details of when it is getting closer. They should also make it spawn quicker and have active regions where it can spawn behind you and attack if you travel in its region or if it moves into your region.
@@graygunshot739 this was a really good comment, love the suggestions. To play devils advocate about the HUD notification, I think it’s good to remember that there will always be new players in the future, or people who return to the game after a long time, who don’t read the update notes or watch the TH-cam videos, and those folks will NEED that HUD warning. I once took a five-year break from the game and when I came back I had no idea what auroras did, and got killed by a glowing bear. If I had never played the game before and decided to pick it up in a year, I would totally need the HUD update for something as rare and deadly as the cougar. And if I were a brand new player, I would much rather have the HUD tell me a cougar is taking interest rather than have to tab out and look at the wiki for what that scary noise is
@@QilleWolf That is a good point and I won't deny it. I know if I heard the cougar without outside knowledge, I would likely stay inside a few days out of fear and wonder why it was still there after a few days. Then followed with being attacked after going fishing to get rid of scurvy. Nothing else in the game works like that so it is a completely unique mechanic to deal with the cougar. A counter-point I will offer is that the Devs added the cheat-death system to allow players to have the security with experiencing those types of deaths. I know some older players are purist about the cheat-death system but it is there to help players learn the game or give players a way to continue old saves if they were to die in unexpected ways.
@@graygunshot739 very true, I think it’s awesome that they added Cheat Death at the same time as the cougar. That way if you get unfairly ganked by the cat or caught off guard, it’s not the end. I haven’t played around with Cheat Death yet, but I’ve heard it’s tough to recover from, so a newer player might just die anyways, but yeah. This game is so good
@@isaaco5679 I didn’t mention it in this video, but afterwards I realized it was realistic that the cougar didn’t attack me when I was on the ice. Nowhere to ambush from! So I think that might already be a feature in the game (hard to tell with such a small sample size tho)
@QilleWolf i like your idea of it spawning real close (too close to ready most weapons) behind you, but just have in only happen near rocks and trees. That would make getting a shot at it way more difficult with more things to potentially block the shot!
You're feeling like I did when I was first being hunted in Alien: Isolation. In THAT game you spend a LOT of time sneaking around, jumping IRL when you hear the xenomorph drop nearby, hiding in lockers while holding your breath...oh, and you can't kill it; it's basically the cougar but on steroids.
@@QilleWolf I kept telling my son (who kept telling me I'd "love" the game before I bought it on Steam) I thought I was going to have a heart attack. The game WAS fun, and I've done a few playthroughs (and played through the DLCs), but I secretly think he just wanted to inherit early. 😆
@@ex-navyspook HAHAHA! Yeah, I’ve only ever played thru the first chapter or two, but it’s on my list of games to play during Halloween. Looking forward to the tension!
@@O3oel2owlek if I did, it’ll be outdated soon. They’re reworking where all the wildlife spawns in one of the next updates. That being said, if you see areas where the bark has been scraped off trees, those are moose markings. Check that area every few days and a moose will eventually spawn
So people complained that the difficult, unforgiving, LITERALLY and clearly warns you that it it SUPPOSED to kick your ass survival game, was too hard, so they removed the cougar? Lame. Can't believe our community let that happen.
Well, I've heard from other people that they aren't 100% removing it. They're just tweaking some stuff to the animal to improve it. After all, Hinterland cares for their fans, so of course they'll try to keep their audience happy.
thats not why people disliked it- they disliked the emersion breaking jumpscare and timer. They wanted to get a chance to feel the terror of being stalked.
Firstly, most people weren’t upset at the difficulty, they were upset about the absolute lack of control. Secondly, they didn’t just remove it. They agreed to rework it.
The general concept of the cougar is fine. The execution was poor. Most people playing a survival game like the idea of planning and preparing for unfortunate circumstances. With a cut scene, automatic damage and one brief opportunity to get the kill, all that planning and prep feel meaningless. It’s not just that it’s challenging, it’s an unfairness of saying here is a resource you MUST take serious damage to acquire. No matter how skilled, how well you prepare, and how proactive or creative you are - that resource ALWAYS comes at a life threatening cost. It should be a very dangerous and elusive entity, not just a cut scene. And no, it’s not accurate to real life. Not that TLD is ‘about’ realism.
18:52 those that were rude on Twitter get a special update that randomly they’ll get a ailment that no other person in the game gets, it’ll be something that they wouldn’t get in real life because they’re armchair warriors, a good case of jock itch.
The community isn't wrong for wanting the new animal to feel like an animal. I dont think they should have gotten rid of the cougar, but I do think it needs to be updated. Maybe they can't make it stalk you throughout the whole world but they could put tracks when it's in the region and have it growl when it's near by only to let you know it's hunting you. They don't have to have you see it until it's running at you to give you a small chance. I do like the attack animation, though. Also, if people say that Hinterland won't have the time and resource to change the cougar to something the community likes, then they shouldn't have tried to tackle a project like this. I love their game, and I'm sure they'll make the cougar better. Great video. I loved your commentary.
Basically this. The sound design for the cougar is absolutely incredible, as evidenced in this video. The music, the hisses, growls and screeches etc. all really atmospheric and immersive. If they can add visual cues to the game of the same quality, then it's going to be really amazing. The less reliance on HUD notifications, the better.
I was hoping the cougar would be Grey mother in a nightie who cooks you pancakes when you spend the night with her in Milton
I like this topic so I’ll get my hefty 2 cents in (haven’t watched the video fully btw)
So coming from someone who lives very near to and has been in lots of cougar country (and from a gameplay design) this cougar wasn’t at all bad or in need of a fix. Personally, I wasn’t fully on board once I learned it’s mechanics, but I would’ve been able to suck it up and deal with it since I didn’t absolutely hate it.
Going to real life for a moment, unless you get lucky or have a very keen eye, you will NOT see a cougar unless it wants you to, but that *doesn’t* mean you won’t see it til it’s on top of you. The game is actually very generous by giving the chance to live afterward (Even though it would be bad game design) because a cougar would absolutely Rock. Your. Shit. If it pounced on you the way it does in game, the caveat being unless your vitals are extremely protected (especially your neck) you would more or less stand a chance. The clothing worn in game I feel can fit this fine, so I have no major complaints. The game and real life are different, I’m aware, but there’s no reason to disregard it’s ability to emulate real things.
As far as gameplay, there are plenty of arguments for both sides. I’m mostly a fence-sitter, but I am happy to see the cougar getting revised. I didn’t like the fact the game directly told you when the cougar was after you. It was tense, sure, but ultimately, sounds and tracks would be your only indication that it’s in the area, which also wouldn’t directly indicate its after you. It just didn’t feel random or surprising enough since I could expect it, even with the ”random encounter” mechanics. The game had to be fair, I get it, but the cougar, in all reality, isn’t fair.
My own thoughts for a good fix :
- have a random timer set instead of a fixed one, and once it’s up, don’t inform the player by immediately presenting the red symbol and music, but give them signs from the environment (scratchmarks, pawprints, distant growls, etc.) with increasing frequency.
- Give the player a *chance* to see it before it attacks. Much like all other wildlife in the game, no two encounters are the same. They’re all unique, it would be nice if they player had an opportunity to defend themselves from the cougar before it attacked. Not 100% of the time mind you, just sometimes. Heck, I’d be fine with 25-30%. Just something to make it less cut and dry.
- Lastly, (and this might be asking for too much)
*Region Favorship*
I would LOVE to see this, especially with the random timer I mentioned earlier and a “set” number of cougars. This would cause some regions to be more dangerous to visit than others. For some regions, the kill timer could be 5-7 days. Other might be a month. Some might be safe from cougars entirely. Point is the regions residing the cougars would be more risky. Of course there would be a random roll with every run. One run might have cougars in HRV, Broken railroad, and Blackrock. Another run might have them in Ash canyon, Mystery lake, and Desolation point. A percent to roll certain regions would make it much nicer too. Say the Timberwolf mountain area (and all regions around it) had a 60-80% chance of having one of the three since it’s much nicer cougar country, while bleak inlet and the muskeg had a 15-30% being much less cougar friendly.
Instead of just being an extremely glorified cabin fever, this would shove some more character into the world and the cougars. It would be a *very* complex system, but would absolutely adore it if something similar were added.
Feel free to pick apart anything you like, my ideas are never perfect and I like nice discussion.
Cheers ✌️
@@alloftherun1174 ooooooh the different timers for each region is such a good idea!! Thank you for the comment, and thanks for adding context for cougars in real life. I don’t live in cougar territory, and everything I know about them is from the internet, so it’s nice to have your POV too ❤️
@@QilleWolf for sure!
I’ve got plenty of secondhand stories from family that’ve had direct experience with em. Heck, one of em came after my uncle after he shot a deer. That’s a whole story, and too long for text to tell, but man, when you see em, they’re scary. And I haven’t even seen one out there in person! XD (at least not up close)
Personally I think region-locking the cougar would have been a better idea than the timed arrival mechanic they went for. Limit the cougar's presence to the region containing it's den, and neighbouring regions. After all, Hinterland described it themselves as being territorial.
Then if you start hearing and/or seeing evidence of it's presence, you know to be very careful and to avoid the area until you're adequately prepared (or adequately crazy).
I think Hinterland said that the HUD cues were needed to make sure players didn't miss the danger they were in. To which I say, what about a "warning shot" attack? The first time the cougar pounces you, it knocks you down and sends you sprawling, but that's it. No time to react, just a "I'm here, get out or get wrecked" moment. I'd also like to see an animation where it take a swipe at you as you get to the top of a rope climb or rock climb, before vanishing again while you freak out. The more in-game interactions and less reliance on the HUD, the better.
Your ideas are brilliant. It seemed weird to me to see a cougar in a coastal region. I'm not knowledgable about cougars but the name MOUNTAIN lion doesn't suggest it lives close to the shore.
Before it was added I had hoped the cougar wouldnt just spawn behind you. Instead it spawns right on you, in which case spawning behind you would be preferable. I think the cougar spawning on you would make sense when walking through certain kinds of terrain. Under cliffs, in forests and such where an ambush would be impossible to notice. In open spaces the cougar could spawn behind the player and have very silent footsteps. That would encourage the player to plan his routes to avoid the zones of greater danger
@@gerwrant Thanks! 🙏
Yeah, it kinda subverted my expectations a bit with the “all region lock”
I’m not terribly concerned with how the cougar spawned. Of course I’d like the small chance of self defense, but other than that it was fine. The only issue with “death from above” (and I think Quille mentioned this) is that it’s a tall order, much like my suggestion with region favorship. TLD isn’t manned by an elite game team, just some people with jobs in a small studio. I’m sure they could find an easy workaround such as “pouncing zones” under cliffs and such that increase risk of being attacked, but even then that’s a niche system. I love the idea, but just like mine, it’s complex
To be honest, the only thing I didn't like about the cougar is that it's not an entity, just a scripted event. I LOVE the idea of it stalking and harassing you for days, and jumping at you when you least expect it, but I just wish you could interact more with it. For example, maybe you could catch it silently stalking at you from the woods, and you could try to take it on before it attacks you. It could also try to attack you while you're sleeping outside without a fire, making staying outside REALLY dangerous when the cougar is around. Or even it could find it sleeping on some treetops, the same way you can find bears sleeping, and you could hunt it right there. Being hunted by a cougar should reward players who keep their guard up, and not just be an anti-camp measure lol.
@@daimon7421 I agree, that would have been super cool, but they’re not Sony, they can’t spend all that time designing a complex AI for a predator that most players will only see once every 100 days. It certainly would have been awesome to see it stalking you through the map, but I understand why they added it the way they did (scary for the player, not the programmer). Cougars are super stealthy in real life as well, most people never even know they’re being stalked until they get jumped. I don’t remember if I put it in the video, but I pitched that it would have been a good compromise to be able to find the cougar in the world during an aurora, which made it disoriented and distracted
@@daimon7421 and randomly when you’re walking under a tree, a dead animal falls out of it because the cougar was trying to hide the meal for later nothing like a good old jump scare
@@QilleWolf even if it's not very realistic the feeling of being stalked would make the jumpscare so much better and would TERRIFY people. Since jumpscares aren't as good without fear. Even if it would be hard, I wonder if a png could work, rather than having an in-game model.
Honestly anything that got rid of the "cougar is coming" pop-up and timer would be better.
@@Crev_ce3 did you watch the video? I was terrified by just the noises and the music, because the directional noise made it sound like there was something lurking behind me. My imagination did the rest of the work. It was the perfect amount of scary, and they don’t need to add anything else to it
@@QilleWolf yeah, I just think they could add a tiny bit. As someone said (who I think was you in the video lmao) it might be scarier with it charging.
After sleeping on it:
I think that they should get rid of the timer, and make the cougar screams a bit more common (and slowly get more frequent as it comes time for the attack) to balance out the lack of a timer.
I think right before it attacks you should hear footsteps.
These very minor changes could make it perfect, which it very nearly is.
the cougar is great it just needs some tweaks to make it scarier and less emersion-breaking
it shouldn't be removed just edited- no stupid timer and "THE COUGAR IS APPROACHING" just seeing it in the corner of your eye, faint cougar screams, ect. At the climax, when you're paranoid as ever THEN the cougar attacks. Some people (like me lol) didn't think a jumpscare like it is would be good but as long as there's a bit of paranoia beforehand it would work really well.
It's just emersionbreakting to have a timer rather than being stalked and slowly realizing. (but dont be too subtle or you wont have the paranoia)
As someone mentioned in another comment it shouldn't be a set number of days before the cougar comes, but a range like for example 10-20 days in a certain difficulty. Makes it scarier :D
I admit I dont play the game (mainly because the lack of predator diversity and some other reasons that are hard to put into words) but I do know a bit about the community and survival games in general and emersion + fear is generally good.
sorry for the rant you can probably tell I love talking about game design and stuff
also subscribed you seem cool
edit: watched a bit more of the video and confirmed you are infact cool
edit 2: even if it would be kinda hard to make having pngs in the corner of your vision (so you turn around and are like "did I just see that WHAT"), audio files of it growling, tracks and scratches on tree shouldn't be super hard to make? Idk but it seems simpler than a ton of AI like for wolves.
edit 3:
After sleeping on it:
I think that they should get rid of the timer, and make the cougar screams a bit more common (and slowly get more frequent as it comes time for the attack) to balance out the lack of a timer.
I think right before it attacks you should hear footsteps.
These very minor changes could make it perfect, which it very nearly is.
The point about health bars as a resource is a good observation. Health is a resource that can be easily restored. I came back to the game recently after playing very sheltered years ago. I noticed that I would limit my loot or make multiple trips because of my insane overpreparing clothing wise. now I am usually welcoming of a slow cooling off outside, as I feel less overpacked. I feel like hinterland did a good job of trying to make the cougar as user defined and easily avoidable, personally that pulled me out of it a little bit, but I appreciate what they were aiming for.
Agree with every word! ❤ thx for the video
16:36 I lost a run that had a great start to a forgotten infection risk :/
I spawned in HRV, looted the signal fire and got to the bunker which happened to be stocked. Right before the bunker however I was attacked by a wolf by the bushes you need to break. In fact it was a double attack because the wolf got confused in the confined space. I got out with like 10% hp. Everything about that run was blessed and I simply forgor about an infection and died in my sleep
@@gerwrant oof, RIP to your run o7
I have to say as someone who plays dark souls games aswell all i can say is get gud scrubs. Sorry but come on people. I don't hear people say they want the old bear in game yeah because it was hard and the cougar is that a very hard interaction but a shot not the smashing the button. If you can't make the shot then your not going to make the shot on the cougar you are asking for is my 1st thought.
First things first, I love the Long Dark, and I love so much of what they've done with the Cougar. The ambient noises, the music, the attack animation, the den and model - all superb. Atmospheric, anxiety inducing and scary as all hell
All that said, I disliked the implementation. The HUD prompts and notifications were just too much, and too immersion breaking. I would much prefer to rely entirely from in-game evidence. Like I said, the soundtrack and ambient cues are incredible, I was hoping for visual cues to match
The timed nature of the encounter bugged me as well. In the original implementation you're only ever likely to encounter the cougar if you wait for it - essentially forcing it to happen, rather than it being something that happens naturally during the course of normal play. Players who don't read the updates or follow the dev notes could potentially go through the game without ever knowing it was there
Honestly, I'd prefer if it was limited to areas close to it's den. If/when you encroach on it's territory, you get warnings. If you don't heed the warnings and linger too long, you're at risk of getting pounced.
The fish voice-acting was the best 🤣
Also love the drawing 😁
I will leave my thoughts of the cougar here to offer my view and feedback of it. I will leave a TLDR at the end, the rest is for those who want my context of why I think the way I do. One thing I do want to talk about is that I managed to get the Big Cat badge from killing 3 cougars. I fought them in Mystery Lake and Transfer Pass and did find that they tend to spawn when on the roads and near trees. I say this to show that I at least went and got into a few encounters with the big cat.
First off the things I love about it; The atmosphere and music is fantastic. Literally chilling to be walking around with the drums and the hissing of the big cat after you. It's fear when you first encounter it and tense after you get accustom to it after a few encounters. That is something that I think TLD is good to have occasionally to remind you that you are at nature's mercy.
I also love some of the small details they throw in like all the animals despawn when the cougar enters the region. No wolves, bears, deer, rabbits, all of them disappear when the threat of a cougar arrives. I LOVE that detail that everything knows a dangerous predator is near and none want to mess with it.
I also like the mini-game of the retaliation shot that you go though after it attacks you. As you are disoriented and do your best to get that lucky shot to put down the beast and in Astrid's words "I'm going to kill you and eat you, you bastard!" A very unique struggle for one of the most hyped creatures in TLD
With that I do have a few complaints. The UI is one thing that I find off-putting but no way disruptive of the game or affect gameplay. With how much they try to keep the UI uncluttered and simple, I find it strange that you get big warning sirens that the cougar is encroaching and a flat accurate timer of when it appears. With how loud the cougar is I will be surprised if you are caught off-guard when it start to have interest with you.
I would also love more environmental clues that it is in the area like dead animal caraccas but those are unneeded and would be fun details to add. Also might provide an interesting risk and reward to get a little bit of free food and hides for those who are crazy.
Now the for the things that I didn't like. It takes effort to gain the cougar's attention. I had you go almost 100 (takes around 30 days for stalker/voyager) days in order to get the cougar 3 times and that was intentionally going through my supplies to hibernate all that time. That's a very long time to go though to get a glorified cut-scene of being attacked and get 1 shot of killing it. Cougar 1.0 it more of an affliction of outdoor cabin fever rather than feeling like an actual animal in the game.
If I had to suggest ideas to fix what I think is wrong. Maybe make the cougar have regions where it is active and hunting. Making those places dangerous to travel though until the timer runs out and it moves on to a new area. If it happens to move into a region you are into you will hear the noises that it is encroaching and it is time for you to prepare to fight or move for a few days. I would also decrease the timer of when it moves around, like every 10 to 15 days it decides to move.
I am also a fan of the idea that it spawns 10 feet behind you and pounces on you. So if you have your gun or bow out you may get a lucky shot to ward it away or use a flare/flare gun to scare it off and if you are REALLY lucky maybe kill it. This is the alpha predator it should be treated as such. You should WANT to avoid it.
TLDR; Love the atmosphere and music, very intense and terrifying for your first encounters. They should remove the huge warning UI's as it has enough environment details of when it is getting closer. They should also make it spawn quicker and have active regions where it can spawn behind you and attack if you travel in its region or if it moves into your region.
@@graygunshot739 this was a really good comment, love the suggestions. To play devils advocate about the HUD notification, I think it’s good to remember that there will always be new players in the future, or people who return to the game after a long time, who don’t read the update notes or watch the TH-cam videos, and those folks will NEED that HUD warning. I once took a five-year break from the game and when I came back I had no idea what auroras did, and got killed by a glowing bear. If I had never played the game before and decided to pick it up in a year, I would totally need the HUD update for something as rare and deadly as the cougar. And if I were a brand new player, I would much rather have the HUD tell me a cougar is taking interest rather than have to tab out and look at the wiki for what that scary noise is
@@QilleWolf That is a good point and I won't deny it. I know if I heard the cougar without outside knowledge, I would likely stay inside a few days out of fear and wonder why it was still there after a few days. Then followed with being attacked after going fishing to get rid of scurvy. Nothing else in the game works like that so it is a completely unique mechanic to deal with the cougar.
A counter-point I will offer is that the Devs added the cheat-death system to allow players to have the security with experiencing those types of deaths. I know some older players are purist about the cheat-death system but it is there to help players learn the game or give players a way to continue old saves if they were to die in unexpected ways.
@@graygunshot739 very true, I think it’s awesome that they added Cheat Death at the same time as the cougar. That way if you get unfairly ganked by the cat or caught off guard, it’s not the end. I haven’t played around with Cheat Death yet, but I’ve heard it’s tough to recover from, so a newer player might just die anyways, but yeah. This game is so good
The only thing I want them to fix with the cougars is to make it so you only get attacked near ambush points, like trees, cliffs etc.
@@isaaco5679 I didn’t mention it in this video, but afterwards I realized it was realistic that the cougar didn’t attack me when I was on the ice. Nowhere to ambush from! So I think that might already be a feature in the game (hard to tell with such a small sample size tho)
@QilleWolf i like your idea of it spawning real close (too close to ready most weapons) behind you, but just have in only happen near rocks and trees. That would make getting a shot at it way more difficult with more things to potentially block the shot!
You're feeling like I did when I was first being hunted in Alien: Isolation. In THAT game you spend a LOT of time sneaking around, jumping IRL when you hear the xenomorph drop nearby, hiding in lockers while holding your breath...oh, and you can't kill it; it's basically the cougar but on steroids.
@@ex-navyspook YES!!! That’s exactly what it feels like!
@@QilleWolf I kept telling my son (who kept telling me I'd "love" the game before I bought it on Steam) I thought I was going to have a heart attack. The game WAS fun, and I've done a few playthroughs (and played through the DLCs), but I secretly think he just wanted to inherit early. 😆
@@ex-navyspook HAHAHA! Yeah, I’ve only ever played thru the first chapter or two, but it’s on my list of games to play during Halloween. Looking forward to the tension!
@@QilleWolf You'll spend more time (if you're SMART) on your knees than a Clinton intern. As Riddick said in "Pitch Black:" "Just don't run..."
Nice
Totally agree! Cougar was FUN
Like the point of tld is to be hard, unpredictable and scary!!!!
She does create supraphysiological levels of cortisol in the body.
My bad I thought that I was subscribed 👍
Im relativity new to tld could u make a guide for moose spawns or sum?
@@O3oel2owlek if I did, it’ll be outdated soon. They’re reworking where all the wildlife spawns in one of the next updates. That being said, if you see areas where the bark has been scraped off trees, those are moose markings. Check that area every few days and a moose will eventually spawn
So people complained that the difficult, unforgiving, LITERALLY and clearly warns you that it it SUPPOSED to kick your ass survival game, was too hard, so they removed the cougar? Lame. Can't believe our community let that happen.
Well, I've heard from other people that they aren't 100% removing it. They're just tweaking some stuff to the animal to improve it. After all, Hinterland cares for their fans, so of course they'll try to keep their audience happy.
thats not why people disliked it- they disliked the emersion breaking jumpscare and timer. They wanted to get a chance to feel the terror of being stalked.
Yeah, that's not why people complained at all. It's also only been temporarily removed to be reworked, and it will be back.
Firstly, most people weren’t upset at the difficulty, they were upset about the absolute lack of control. Secondly, they didn’t just remove it. They agreed to rework it.
The general concept of the cougar is fine. The execution was poor. Most people playing a survival game like the idea of planning and preparing for unfortunate circumstances. With a cut scene, automatic damage and one brief opportunity to get the kill, all that planning and prep feel meaningless. It’s not just that it’s challenging, it’s an unfairness of saying here is a resource you MUST take serious damage to acquire. No matter how skilled, how well you prepare, and how proactive or creative you are - that resource ALWAYS comes at a life threatening cost. It should be a very dangerous and elusive entity, not just a cut scene.
And no, it’s not accurate to real life. Not that TLD is ‘about’ realism.
18:52 those that were rude on Twitter get a special update that randomly they’ll get a ailment that no other person in the game gets, it’ll be something that they wouldn’t get in real life because they’re armchair warriors, a good case of jock itch.