Great video! I've been practicing NVIS for years now and have found that MAKING tons of random contacts has been one of the best ways to learn about NVIS propagation characteristics operating in multiple environments, antennas, transmitters, power levels, modes, times of day, bands, etc. But I totally get your mission here, and great job at it - a network of folks is critically important for emcomm. VOACAP and other planning tools can be helpful to get you ballpark estimates but there's nothing that beats lots of direct experience. You're on the right track in doing this test! One thing I've found is that, more than power levels, mode matters a lot for NVIS - CW and JS8Call present a ~18 to 20 dB gain over voice modes, basically turning your 100 watts on SSB into an equivalent 6,000+ watts using more effective weak signals modes!!!
Ken, it sounds like you are on top of it! Practice until you know by dead reconning. I know what the sky looks like when VHF ducting is active probably 40%-50% of the time, and the weather that leads to VHF ducting. I can probably pick VHF ducting days 60%-70% by dead reconning. Temperature inversions with the low purple haze on an otherwise clear dead are a clear sign of VHF ducting. Most large weather fronts have VHF ducting.
We tried a similar experiment. 2 stations 30 miles distance. Mine on 2800 feet, the other on 1500 feet and separated by mountains 13000 to 14000 feet high. Both stations half wave dipol on 80 m 18 feet above ground. 20 watt output. It just didn’t work… untill we lowered the antenna both to 7 feet. We did it within the same hour. Vocap gave us the same conditions for both tries. 5 and 6 , even with 10 watts. Radiowaves sometimes do funny things. Training makes you successfull❗️ 73 de HB3XBL 👍🇨🇭
No idea what language this guy is speaking. Came here to see if I could set up communication with my family. I now know the people I need to seek out when SHTF
Comms are tough. I thought I would round out my preps 3 years ago by looking into radios for a few weeks. It's been three years. This stuff takes time. Good luck.
Gaston, big thank you for all the great videos. Getting out into the field, operating, and experimenting is the best kind of amateur radio. Keep up the great work, and keep inspiring others!
Thanks for sharing your experience. Personally, I have found lower to work better at the short distances, too. I look at VOACAP more as a "let's get in the ballpark" kind of tool.
Used NVIS a bunch in the military. They are great in the mountains also were line of sight comms just don't work due to giant mountain sitting in the way. As the F1/F2 range changes throughout the day you will have to adjust frequencies.
I have watched several of your videos and find your honesty refreshing. When you did a bug out man pack and found that your HF was lacking you called it a fail. You didn't edit and try to make you sound like a prepared prepper. Thank you for being honest in your assessment. It's a great lesson for all of us.
You're very welcome. This channel has been dedicated to me sharing my journey in practical, offgrid comms for the last 4-years. I'm no expert and make mistakes like everyone else. There's no sense in hiding it. I appreciate the support. Stay tuned for next week's video. It's the AAR on my Arctic Circle field operation. Lots of lessons learned coming. Please consider sharing these videos with your friends. I've been trying to make this my full-time job for the last two years. Have a good weekend.
I recently activated POTA on 40 meters in the morning. My EFHW antenna was only at 15 ft peak, the ends of the antenna were at 5 ft. My initial 10 contacts were all within 50 miles of my location, with several being 30 to 40 miles. I was only running 20 watts. The system works and it's good to practice (train) where ever and when ever you can.
As you were POTA, you may have experience groundwave. It just depends on surrounding terrain elevation along the path to the distant station. If you were getting NVIS you did very well at close range.
I just watched your video and just wanted to say you can build a dipole put it 4 to 8 feet off the ground and get just as good of a signal or maybe better. I have the Cha MPAS lite and love that antenna. I do POTA once a week and it’s my go to antenna. I’m a extra class ham and I love the hobby but sometimes we way over complicated the hobby. You can build a dipole out of a few dollars worth of wire. If you have an old 50’ drop cord a little time and you can built them for free. Look online for a simple dipole calculator. Yes I have tried this and got excellent results. Just putting the info out there for folks who are getting into the hobby and don’t have $1500. Great video.
Thanks for calling this out. If you have time check out the second video in this series. I built a resonant dipole to do exactly this. The build was just few bucks and deployed at about 6' at the apex. Here's the video: th-cam.com/video/ypMM0sCUFZM/w-d-xo.html
that was cool what you did with the audio and video there. I always wonder what I sounded like to the other people. Thats a good test to see what your audio sounds like. Thank you and thank your friend for sharing that.
Currently using the Chameleon Emcomm iii portable as a base hf antenna and have been having lots of fun making dx contacts. I've been very impressed with the performance. Thanks for the video. Chameleon makes some excellent products.
I've taken a greater interest in HF digital communications as a result of your videos. Now I'm participating in a weekly Winlink net. For this net I have been playing with different bands/modes each week. Always enjoy the videos and looking forward to the one on VOACAP! 73
Really glad I found this channel. I'm into preparedness, and along with my father, got my technician license a while back, but haven't done that much with it in practice yet. I bought us both some cheap uv-5r handhelds, and I recently upgraded to yaesu ft5dr and started playing around with APRS a bit. But what I'm really hoping to achieve is a way to make contact with my parents reliably, even if external systems like repeaters are down. They live about 30 miles away point to point. We are in Ohio, so no mountain ranges in between. I'm getting back into studying for my generals now, and I really like the concept of the portable man pack radios that you introduced me to. I honestly view all of this as more of an emergency comm tool. I don't have a desire to buy a ton of radios and equipment for exploring every corner of the hobby. So I really like the idea of buying a portable radio that does every band I would practically need for emergency comms. I see that the 857d is hard to come by with it being discontinued, but some pages have redirected me to the yaesu 891. It looks like the difference between those two is that 891 doesn't do 2m or 70cm? I don't personally think that's too much of an issue, because my use case for HF radio is repeaters being down, and I would think that even with high power/good antennas, it might be hard to make a 30 mi contact over 2m/70cm without the use of a repeater? At any rate, the 891 is somewhere around $650, which is significantly cheaper, and my father is definitely only interested in terms of emergency comms, and has very little interest in the hobby itself. I was thinking of getting that radio for him since it has higher power, and could be used as a base station radio 99% of the time. For myself, I was actually considering the ft-818. I do actually get out and backpack, and I'm also involved in our local SAR group, and we have been looking into a mobile base station radio for use in trainings/searches. Most members don't have their HAM license, but we operate on one of the business bands on the 2m/70cm band pretty much exclusively. So I believe, the ft-818 would do the trick on that front as well as my personal comms with my family 30 mi away, given the right antenna setup? Just looking on some advice to see whether my thought process is way off on any of this. Thanks to anyone who wouldn't mind a few words of wisdom!
Congrats on the short skip QSOs on 80 m. There are a couple of ways you could experiment and try to determine if the 40 mi contacts were NVIS or ground wave. First, try at different times of day on the same frequencies. If the propagation changes much, For example, if it is severely attenuated midday or in the afternoon, it is likely NVIS. Try reorienting your antennas so the end of the wire is pointed toward the other station on each end. With a dipole, that is a pretty strong null for ground wave propagation and I would expect it to be much more difficult to make the contact. Then turn the antennas again so they face broadside to each other's station. If it's ground wave, the signal should increase significantly. If it's NVIS, the signal should be the same in each orientation.
Hey Adam! This is exactly the direction that I needed. Thank you. I have a simpler 75m dipole that I can deploy to more easily change the direction in order to run these tests. It will be fun going through the process. I will be sure to share the results along the way.
Love this experiment and your discussion. I'm into ham radio not for the hobby and fun of it, though that's great, but for emergency preparedness. My goal is to upgrade my ham license to General so I can do this exact sort of thing.
A good HF rig is invaluable. Still using my old Icom 745. Solar cell array, 12 volt batteries, and homebrewed antennas. Very dependable communications. N5QDM. 73's. And yes, the day is coming and who can say when.!!!
You're absolutely correct. HF is perfect for just about any communication range when paired with the right antenna for the job. TYhe Icom 745 is great rig. 73's
I like your objective, concise and organized presentations. Not having a 60 Meter capability is a challenge. You probably would have had a better success and needed less power. There is less D layer absorption on 60 than 75/80. Most "all band" antennas don't resonate will on 5 MHz. You can send both voice and digital traffic on a 60 Meter channel. FEMA and MARS use 60 Meter channels to communicate with hams and obtain situation awareness for very very bad SHTF days. Monitoring those channels could provide good intel. Choosing to not have an antenna tuner limits your choices for 60 Meter capability. A home built end fed half wave 60 meter antenna using a $35 unun and some wire between your poles, even with a cheap tuner would cost a fraction of the Chameleon antenna. Its no surprise that a vertical antenna on 75 Meters would have an adequate signal at the takeoff angle for your 200+ mile circuit. I will look forward to your future presentations.
Gaston, another excellent video. Yes, antennas are a big, big part of the game. +3dBr is effectively 2X power in Watts, but with a near omni direction antenna it takes +6dB (quadrupling power) change to double the effective range. When you use antenna gain you increase transmit and receive passively. So, yes, the Hamsticks are compromised. I am hoping to get back to 80m NVIS in a few weeks. Our closest distance has been about 25 miles. I doubt it was groundwave due to 25ft antenna elevation and strong propagation directly off the end of an EFHW antenna. Regularly I get 50mi with 80m NVIS. Where NVIS and groundwave overlap there can destructive interference. Also, NVIS antennas may be improved with a reflecting element on or near the ground. Mileage and configuration varies. I've lucked out with a chainlink fence as a reflector. Another simplex mode to look at is 2m SSB with horizontally polarized antennas. On Tuesday evenings there is a 2m SSB net that has participation through most of Florida and parts of GA. The net control typically runs stacked loops. Other participants may opt for Yagi antennas. Unless there is active VHF ducting most are running power of 100W-200W, but with that power with +5dBi antenna gain they routinely have 150-200mi range. If there is any VHF ducting their range is 300-500mi. We have played with vertically polarized antennas and it is not as effective. At that point the benefits of SSB over FM become marginal. You can get in the game with your FT-857D at 50W with a 5dBi antenna, but you will not have as consistent results for longer distance. If you go +9dBi and higher antenna gain you'll see reasonable to good results consistently at 50W. The 160W Mirage repeater amps are a popular starting point for power, if you want to run with the big boys. The more you work 80m and 60m, I think you will find them more reliable than 40m, especially during solar minima. The rub being best propagation will typically be near dawn. The plus is effective power can usually make up the difference with 80m or 60m NVIS when propagation is not ideal. 60m the FCC limit is 200W. During solar minima power may not make up the difference for 40m NVIS. Antenna restricted operators, especially digital only should consider dedicated small transmitting or magnetic loop antennas. If you are doing FT8 or JS8Call exclusively and you are antenna restricted loops make very good antennas. Small loop antennas, especially vertically polarized loops, have both high angle and low angle radiation near the ground. It is one antenna for NVIS and DX. A vertical loop only needs to be about 1 loop diameter above the ground for both NVIS and DX. A horizontally polarized loop should be about 4 loop diameters off the ground. Definitions seem to vary, but small transmitting loops seem to be defined as =
Glad you enjoyed the video, Viron. I appreciate you jumping all over the comments. I just added a 136.5' ground reflecting wire. I'll let you and the community know how this performs. As always thanks for the additional tips, tricks and food for thought.
Very good trial and error operation ! One thing I mentioned before was running a wire 5% longer than your antenna wire. Run directly under your antenna and laying on the ground. It is not tied into the antenna. It is only a reflector. It helps focus the signal straight up. This may be helpful for close in coms. It would be worth a try and see if signal strength improves. The Yaesu FT-891 is an excellent 100 watt HF radio for emcom base or portable. It comes in at about $640.00 and is currently available. Keep the videos coming. I enjoy watching and seeing the results you get. I'm glad you tried ham sticks. Wire usually works best and if you can't use a full length antenna on 80 meters, a shortened wire antennas with a coil in each leg that electrically shortens the antenna length may a viable option. These can be made yourself or bought commercially.
@@Chameleon_Antenna It is not grounded to anything or attached to the antenna in any way.. It's a passive radiator, directly on the ground under the antenna wire and from what many say, it does make a difference. I thought I was clear that it was not attached to the antenna in any way in my post. This have nothing to do with the SWR. It is about reflecting the signal upward in more of a streight up pattern upward.
It sounds like you have it going on. I have two FT-857D and one FT-897D. I sold my wide banded IC-706MKiig to a new ham that is visually impaired. As a condo dweller three all band all mode shack in the box radios is enough, but I do miss having a full opened radio option should the need arise.
Evening, John. I just added a ground reflecting wire today that's 136.5'. Now that I have a nice baseline of tests, we'll see how this performs. I'll report back in a future video. I think you may be referring to the FT-891. That is a great rig and hard to beat for the price. I have one of those, too. We'll spend some time looking at the rig in the future. I lent it to a friend for a few months.
I ran this test today in a couple of different configurations. I'll send you an email with the details. Unless I screwed something up, it threw off the SWR on a few bands, but I am still very new to this, so I could be wrong.
So after I have been doing this for a long time, what I have found is that after the first bounce, polarity does not matter at all. Now I'm sure I will find someone out there with a science degree that will tell me this is wrong, but in my years of doing this I have found what is good on paper almost never shakes out in the real world.
I've got a similar setup, but built on an aluminum frame which loads into a SAW can for storage / safety. I've managed to cram an 857d, tuner, battery, and SWR meter in there, along with a power distribution block and hookups. It's fully removed from the can when in use, so no extra connections or heat issues. Perhaps not as portable, but very functional, and armored.
I really enjoyed this video. I don't have much money, so I can't have the station I would like to.... I have an Icom IC-7200 (LOVE the Rig!), which goes to an LDG Auto-Tuner and out to a 1/2 Wave Dipole for 80 Meters with the Apex at about 22 Feet. That was as High as I could safely get up in our Cedar Tree, LOL! I've had VERY good luck with this configuration-The Antenna is a home-brew that I built. I have worked 40 States and 9 Countries with this, running at 100 Watts. The VHF Rig is a Yaesu FTM-200D
I've had excellent results with NVIS using a Chameleon EMCOMM II horizontally @ 10'. A feedline choke and a counterpoise on the ground parallel to the radiator were included. 40m day contacts from 5 miles to 300 miles were no problem. Icom IC-7300 @ 100 watts. 80m night looks promising, but I haven't experimented enough with this (coming soon).
Great video Gaston. In Canada you require Basic with Honours (B+) for HF with a power restriction. Another option for antenna is a fan dipole which can be made relatively cheap.
Thanks, Malen. I was running a linked dipole for a bit, but started to get annoyed with the constant manually connecting and disconnecting of links. A fan dipole would solve this problem.
I am just starting out.. Know almost nothing about radios. Whenever I see someone who is proficient in their trade.. I am always impressed. That's partly because of the lack of intelligence, in general, all around US.
An NVIS antenna is my goto antenna. 200ft of stainless steel cable off a tuner at just 7ft. Works great. BUT you must test and tweak your setup. Also works for long distance contacts perpendicular to the antenna.
couple of ideas: first, ALE! not all bands can be open at all times, but a good ale setup with 160,80,75,60,40 plan will give you a very high success rate for a link in the area (excluding a nuclear blast scenario perhaps ;) second, a circular polarization in both antennas should improve communication on NVIS. now the challenge is having the antenna to be both ale capable multi-band, as well as circularly polarized. I would be glad to hear a simple solution for this one. third, a backup plan bird with an vhf repeater onboard should provide an alternative in case no other comms available, for around 30min flight time, so scheduled comms in this case.. and lastly a satellite messenger for the last resort.
The CHA LEFS 8010 is an eight band, no- tuner, High Frequency (HF) antenna for use on the 80, 40, 30, 20, 17, 15, 12, and 10 meter Amateur Radio Service (ham) bands (60 meters with a tuner). So it would have been possible to use 60M if you had a tuner to see the difference between 40M and 60M. Another option beside the CHA LEFS 8010 would be the CHA EMCOMM III P which has been very popular this year with the different branches of the US MILITARY.
I have the Emcom III P. It is very well built, but so far I prefer my 80m-10m EFHW for performance. Especially on 80m & 40m, but I am still playing with choking and ground radials to find the optimal configurations for 80m NVIS etc. The EFHW was so-so until I started choking and grounding at the feed point. The Emcom III P as a non-resonant antenna probably will never quite perform as well as a resonant antenna but I believe it has more I haven't tapped into. Its part of my man-portable kit. The EFHW is too big.
The RFI choke at the feed point is critical with this antenna. I learned this lesson today. I ran some experiments where I added 15' of coax to the feed point, then added a barrel connector, and then added the CHA 50' RG58 coax with RFI coax and it threw off the SWR on most bands. My plan was to attach a counterpoise with an alligator clip to the barrel connector. I'll talk about this failed experiment at some point. In the end, I went back to the CHA 50' RG58 with RFI choke, but I left the 136.5' of wire (5% longer than the CHA LEFS 8010) on the ground unattached. It does not affect the SWR, but I still need to see if it works as a reflector and improves performance. Can't wait to test this tomorrow.
@@TheTechPrepper I was going to mention the wire on the ground trick, I think you'll find it helps, especially when working over some types of ground. I like a simple EFHW on electric fencer stakes. They are about 5' high and work pretty good, cost peanuts and are very quick to deploy.
Stirred up fond memories of NVIS techniques during wintertime roundtable roundtable chats in the 1980s when i was home for Xmas university semester break...a low dipole or a horizontal quad 10-15ft off the ground did a great job for day comms, in a 100mile+ radius on the 75 meter band. Nowadays, this aspect of ham radio plays a role in a Post-Apocalyptic fiction adventure series i have authored...it will be of interest to Preppers, Bushcraft fans, Post-Apoc story fans and of course, Hams!.
I use my ft 450D for my NVIS setup, from here in Tacoma, i can reach all 4 boarders and about 100 - 200 miles past thoes as well here and there.... Using full power btw.. but interesting Lee enough when you use 2 m Sideband (different radio), from my location I'm able to get up into north Canada Vancouver area and south I'm able to hit the outskirts of Portland and all the West Coast areas in Washington... While most of the west side kind of cuts off in the Olympic mountain range.. by the way I'm here in Tacoma
Out Bloody Standng mate many thanks for that and greetings from the UK.I have also found the having similar antennas for Tx and Rx stations is very important for NVIS
Data modes are a great way of cutting through. JS8 is amazing for weak signal work. You can do amazing things with, digital modes, 5 watts and a wire. Take care.
A buddy sent me a link to your real-life inReach video, given we are both experimenting with inReach for short text comms. I decided to stick around. I can do VHF/UHF via the repeater system here at the house. For HF I have to operate portable. So I'm an experienced portable operator. If you're looking for a non-random contact in the Carson City area, let me know. I picked up a FT-857D a couple of years ago, thinking that I would put it in my 4Runner. When that didn't happen, I thought about selling it. But I managed to capture a 500Hz CW filter for it by buying another radio (with one installed). Collins 2.5KHz phone filters are still available so I decided to keep the radio. It's a solid radio and I deployed it a couple of times for POTA activations. With the new filters and the excellent form factor, I think it's a great field radio and it has all-mode VHF/UHF capability as well. If your buddies with HOA restrictions or compromise antenna systems are up for some experimentation, they might try a random loop antenna strung around the perimeter of their backyard fencing. Use a 9:1 Unun for the match (it will need a tuner) and a common-mode choke before taking the coax into the house. It will definitely be NVIS at about 6ft AGL and is relatively stealthy. Test it with an analyzer for using to be sure it is not close to resonance on any band they intend to use. Keep the coax run as short as possible to minimize loss. I stapled some electric fence wire to my wooden fence, connected one end to the "antenna" connection and the other to the "counterpoise/ground" connection of the 9:1 Unun. I was able to make FT8/JS8Call contacts using the antenna and 25w. The tuner (impedance matching unit) in my Elecraft K3 matched it just fine. My location is too noisy for much else, although I have been able to work a few CW operators during the weekly CWT events. This is good content. 73 de AG7TX
Welcome to the channel and thanks for giving the channel a chance. Yes, I'd love to make a contact. Look me up on QRZ. I am also a portable operator. Check out my earlier SOTA videos. 73 de KT1RUN.
Hey Ron! The FT-891 is a great rig. I have one, but it's currently being borrowed by the nice folks over at ARMOLOQ. That rig is an excellent choice for the money and will definitely get you up and running on HF for about $1,000. 73
meh, had one, put it on the shelf for a few months, tried to use it again and this was the result. It was 3mo out of warranty. Got a IC-7200, far more rugged of a radio and much happier with it, less menus to deal with. th-cam.com/video/Zc8QtMBySNk/w-d-xo.html
i have both the 991a and 891 as a backup. When my 991a was down for a few weeks, I hardly missed it. Made tons of dx contacts on the 891 from Texas, including Raratonga in the S. Cook Islands, on a homebrew fan dipole. Klunky menus... yeah but the DNR circuitry is pretty killer. Klunky menus are something you can overcome by USING the radio a lot. Also love NVIS. Can cover most of tx with NVIS on 80m on good days. K5MWA
As a side note. NVIS is hard to direction find. The government has equipment that can Direction Find NVIS stations and pinpoint their location.. In tests they ran, when a station limited power output to 100 milliwatts and using FT-8, their equipment could not DF the station. They could locate stations using higher power. So if keeping Uncle from finding you becomes important, it's going to have to be very low power and FT-8. They were successful in making contacts with just the 100mw using FT-8. You may not always be able to make a contact at this low of a power level, but it would be worth a try if stealth is important. I think FT-8 will be your only option at these low power levels.
It sounds like we have been feeding on the same info. As being DF is always a possibility I consider uncompromised throw away easy to deploy antennas to be of high value. Cheap aluminum electric fence wire cut for a 80m or 40m EFHW 49:1 antenna. That with asynchonous store and forward capability can get your stationary antenna time to 10min, and TX DF exposure time to 2-3min. Also, loading up existing structures as antennas. But, visually remaining a Chameleon is another trick.
That is correct. My Elmer indicated that point to me last year. They do a lot of fox hunting. The signal looks like it's coming from everywhere. Thanks for sharing this point in the comments.
@@DonHavjuan Well I know it's very hard for us regular hams to DF NVIS, so you must know something about Uncle Sugar that the rest of us don't. Enlighten us....The RF sensing bird in space ? The conclusion of the test is that the very low wattage just did not provide enough signal for the technology being used. Things do change.
Love your content! You may want to talk directly into the mike rather than across it. I may be wrong, but I’m fairly confident that it will improve your audio and make you sound louder. I know that is often the case with CB mics anyway.
Great video! I've did a lot of NVIS experiments. Best performing antennas are single band: Dipole and Full Wave Loop which give max gain to zenith. EZNEC is your friend as are NOAA ionosondes. Digital modes like VARA allow for reliable QRP NVIS. The Winlink network is a great tool for experimenting with antennas. Keep it up! 73
It must be nice to have the realestate for a fullwave loop on 40m or 80m. As a condo dweller that is a dream. I am trying to persuade the club to do a 160m loop. Our antenna farm is an abandoned softball field. We would need to add 3 poles. One past 1st and 3rd base, and one in center field.
Thanks. I have had great luck with resonant, single band dipoles. Check out episode II in this series. I've been meaning to try out a full wave loop. Last week I had decent success on 6 watts using the same antenna system, however, it was ARDOP. I'll switch to VARA HF/FM once it is more stable under Linux.
I'm using a homemade cubical 2 meter quad with 3 directors and have vertically oriented it. The signal locally is very clear. The vertical technique does not work farther than 30 miles for 2 meters but I've about dialed it in.
Good demonstration. I am adding an inverted V to my base antenna, but been wanting to get a Yeasu Ft897 (obsolete, but still a good portable rig) and do some POTA. I think the sloper may be a better choice than throwing a random wire in a tree. I'll have to try it out.
Good luck with your experiment. The FT-897 is fantastic rig. I love the dual hot swappable batteries. I am still kicking myself for not picking up an old-new stock 897 at the last hamfest.
It was buried in the closet. I thought I lost it. Thanks for the assist here. We need to get you on fldigi/flmsg so that you can help me test EmComm Tools on HF.
I find my 144 foot doublet is about 40 feet high, and 60 feet wide in the flat middle section, each end zig zags and slopes down to fit a city lot; manages regional 80M connections handily. It does not do 20M well to the east, and since I am on the Pacific Coast that means most of America. I do the Oregon Emergency Net, and the ORCA Digital Net.
Our problem here is getting antennas high enough. Our trees (Palo Verde) top out around 15' here. That's great that you're able to get your antenna 40' in the air. Take care.
The FCC has the “OTARD” rule (47 C.F.R. Section 1.4000) that prevents restrictions being set by an HOA as long as your antenna follows federal regulations. Your HOA is also prevented from punishing you for an "eyesore" antenna as long as the rules are followed.
Those square cage structures we see on German WWII Command Cars in 1940s vids are NVIS antennas. That's how German Unit Commanders passed Enigma Traffic via HF Radio.
FWIW: I am not sure how much HF long distant 2 way comms will be useful. Other than getting some distance news, there isn't really much benefit. I think SDR or wideband reciever is probably more practical since you can monitor local emergency responders (fire, police) presuming they aren't using encrypted digital comms. As far as contacting distant family: odds are the other party won't have the equipment or license, and syncing the time & frequency is going to be difficult. Odds in a crisis, power will be un-reliable, & likely HF band traffic would be significantly higher making it difficult to converse. Consider if a dozen other people are using the frequencies you choose during the scheduled time. What if one of the parties has a problem and cannot fulfill the schedule you established. Right now comms traffic on HF bands is pretty much nothing as few people are using it, but in a crisis odds are HF traffic would increase significantly For the most part I think FRS,GRMS radios are more practical, because in a crisis, you can hand them out and have the means to communicate with neighbors which you can work with. Maybe a neighbor needs some help to address a problem, or for a neighbor watch system. The short range of FRS, GRMS are a benefit since its unlike nefarious people some distance away can listen in and target you unexpectedly. Beyond that, 2 way comms has little practical use, and using a long range comms put you at risk for crime. a competent HF operator likely wouldn't have to much trouble locating your position, if they are short on supplies there is a risk they might pop on over with nefarious intentions. In a SHTF, I would only monitor HF bands for news, but I would never transmit. A few low cost SDRS with a good antenna is a practical option since you can use a low cost SDR to monitor the HF bands. FWIW: These are my recommendations for future video topics: 1. SDRs and how to monitor P.25 transmission & emergency responder traffic 2. GRMS\FRS radios to communicate within the neighborhood 3. Electronic monitoring systems: PIR RF motion sensors to detect movement on your property, Trail cameras, IP cameras. IR beam intrusion detection systems. 4. Grid down alternative power systems, Small quiet inverter generators (ie Honda 2200i), whole house inverter systems. 5. Livestock perimeter defense using electric fence systems.
I covered 2 and 4 already and did a mini series on SDR's. I even planned to make one final video on P25 monitoring with a pair of SDR's, but have not had time to finish that project. I took a different view on community communications and prefer MURS over FRS/GMRS: th-cam.com/video/wq-ky0iE1c8/w-d-xo.html My quiet generator: th-cam.com/video/Dk07XA_i0MI/w-d-xo.html We use this alot when the power goes out. It's nice running the fridge and home office simply by wheeling this around in doors. You can't do this with a gas/propane generator.
@@TheTechPrepper Sorry, I don't mean to be abrasive, & I haven't had time to watch all of your videos (your channel was recently recommended). I will to watch your video about MURS, although I already have a bunch of GMRS radios, since they can operate at higher wattages. For generators I have the portable Honda 2200i, an noisy Gas Generator, and a diesel genset on order.
Another good one. Those contacts that failed would have easily been made with a digital mode such as Olivia. Would be interesting to see those contacts repeated with digital to see the difference. Take care.
Digital rocks for getting through. I think Winlink and JS8Call are probably the most useful digital tools. Both allow asynchronous communication by store and forward. NBEMS also does this. Each mode has its limits on store and forward.
That is the plan. We are going to try fldigi/flmsg with Olivia as well as a few other modems. Everyone is all over JS8Call, but I have developed some very nice extensions to fldigi/flmsg that my local group has been using on VHF/UHF FM using the MT63-2KL and 8PSK1000F modems. We're getting ready to test them with Olivia on HF very soon. There will be a video.
I did not realize NBEMS did "store and forward". Details please? I was about to implement my own as one of the many extensions that I have made on top of fldigi/flmsg. I owe you guys a demo of these capabilities.
@@jeffallen6459 The flmsg generates an html file for regular Internet email and a txt file. The message in the inbox can be retransmitted. Everytime you retransmit a serial number is incrementally appended to the end, ie 202211120538.01 etc ...538.02. In this case it is manual forwarding not like Winlink or JS8Call. I almost exclusively use the simplified Android NBEMS software. The PC version I believe has a store and forward option similar to JS8Call, but I haven't done it. Two of my buddies did it while I was using Android last year. The PC version can be a bit of a booger in getting settings correct, so if you aren't using it at least once a month it can be a pain at times. The Android version is missing about 25% of the modes and one or two other items. However, for the simplicity and reliability I absolutely love it. I run it on my Galaxy +S9 phone and acoustically couple to any radio. If I had bluetooth on the radio I could bluetooth. As long as I am not Net Control, it is more than I need. Net Control should have a real keyboard and lose the audio squawking.
There's plenty of digital modes to fall back on. I've been doing some PSK31 lately with HRD software. Made a few contacts on 20m mostly. One contact on 40 and one on 10m. For digital modes, JS8 is probably the most reliable and doesn't decode "garbage," aka atmospheric noise. On occasion, there is some packet loss. Had many great QSO'S on JS8.
JS8Call is great, but I have an ulterior motivation for using fldigi/flmsg. I have written a secure communications front-end for that works with fldigi/flmsg under the hood that my local group will be using very soon. I really like the store and forward feature of JS8Call.
I haven't tried the store and forward feature yet. It can also be used a relay. All of my contacts have been direct. I do like to get on from time to time and see if there's anyone around. Almost every one hangs out on either 20 or 40m. Every now and then 80m. I've tried the higher bands, 17-10m and no luck yet.
Hello Gaston! Thank you for making these very informative videos. I was wondering if I could ask you for some advice. I've had my license for a couple years, and have been playing with my VX6R and FT2DR since then with simplex, repeaters, and APRS via the FT2DR. In my area most of the activity is on 2m FM repeaters. There are also a couple of 2m digipeaters with iGates. My question is: which would be the first ham shack radio you would recommend? Do you recommend I go with a dual band, dual TX/RX radio so that I can monitor/talk and also utilize the data at the same time? Or should I aim for a more dedicated 2m data radio, and then another radio for voice comms (maybe a couple of FTM-6000R's, or a FT-2980R and a FTM-6000)? Thank you, Rob.
Do you plan on getting an upgrade to your license? Budget is also a question, buy the radio you’ll need in a year or two preferably an all band with decent power if you’re setting a base station up at home then you can grow into it
Rob, everyone's needs will be different. I guess the real question is whether you are going to move into HF? Personally, if I had to start from the beginning again, I wished I had gone with a shack-in-the-box. I am intrigued by the Yaesu FT-991A. It has modern features like a built-in sound card for digital modes, has a waterfall display and is all-band, all-mode, allowing you to work HF/50/VHF/UHF. The FT-2980 is an interesting radio. I like the simplicity of it as well as its power. My only issue with it is that if I want to switch between operating voice and digital, I need to disconnect/reconnect the hand mic and speaker cable. I am running the DigiRig Mobile with it now. It works great for either application, but not both at the same time. Hands down my favorite radio for monitoring two stations on VHF/UHF and doing voice and digital at the same time is the Yaesu FT-8800/8900. This is radio is discontinued, but is a dual VFO rig. I like running digital modes (with the DigiRig) on band A and voice on band B. It can do crossband repeat, too. You can still find these on the used market. I would not personally go with the FTM-6000R. I have two them and primarily bought it for use as a manpack, but it is not a great rig for switching between voice and digital modes unless you use the same frequency for both and digital. Do your homework and assess what you need. There are tons of options on the market.
@@TheTechPrepper Thanks for replying Gaston. I do have my HF licence here in Canada, and would like to explore it eventually. I do have to prioritize at the moment as I have a lot of prepping areas to spread my resources across, as well as raising a family :) I live in a remote mountainous region in BC - the nearest well used repeater is 32 miles away over a lot of mountainous terrain - I can hear it on my HT's, but cannot transmit. In a SHTF scenario, we are going to stay put, as we have lots of natural resources available. My first priorities are to be able to communicate via that repeater, as well as have increased simplex distance. I would also like to be able to listen to airband, FRS, GMRS etc. as there is likely a lot of information to be gained from those in an emergency. My next priority is to have packet radio capability and connect with likeminded individuals in my area to establish procedures to transmit data. It seems like the FT-8800/8900 would be able to do all of this, they are challenging to find here though. The other option as I mentioned would be to go with 2 radios, one for voice and one for data (perhaps the FTM-6000 and FT-2980R). That would provide some redundancy, although I don't think I could use them simultaneously on one antenna.
@@pewtuber243 I do have my HF licence here in Canada. I do need to prioritize since I have a lot of other prep areas to focus on as well. My main priority is to be able to transmit to the local repeater (which I can't reach right now with my HT's).
@@TheTechPrepper thanks for the reply and advice! I ended up taking your advice about a true dual band radio, with no 8800/8900 for sale here, I found a Kenwood TMV71A in great condition, which should make a good voice/packet radio. Now I am thinking about dipping my feet into HF. I do like the weight and portability of the 817/818 but realistically I will probably be using the radio at the shack most of the time until I figure out the intricacies of HF. I would then bring it along on hikes, ski tours etc. Is the 891 the logical choice for this scenario?
Most unlicensed preppers will find themselves in a world of hurt when SHTF. They will have all the right equipment, but fail in implementing, especially HF and digital, because they didn't get licensed and enjoy the hobby. Clubs are great for mentoring and learning different ways to enjoy the hobby. For me its QRP and other simplex activities on VHF and HF. I got a club member that had been hamming for probably 15 years longer than me to finally play QRP. He thought it would be easy and he didn't want to take preparedness hints. This club president had a number of fails with equipment before having any success. He likes to improvise as I do, but even being able to improvise takes some preparedness and practice. One of his first fails was not being able to hookup the battery to the radio. He didn't need power connectors of any sort, he thought. Just strip the end of the wire and screw it to the battery, he thought.
I have my Technician, and some of your altitude, I've got the radio and the antenna, but without the General, what I can't get is HF practice, except on 10m... I need to get my General...
I have a similar need for my Parks on the Air hunts. Having hard time reaching neighboring states on 20m. Im skipping over KS and WY from CO. I think ill try this NVIS setup to see how i do. Good info here…
For those in the Houston area, the Oak Forest ARC will have its monthly meeting or at TranStar at 9 AM local. I will bring my FTM6000 phone/Digi combo. WinLink demo using Digirig. D I not have to be a member or a ham to come. Also testing for all classes. We have started being a go set up so a new ham can get on the air under 3rd party rules as soon as they pass tech. Any advice welcome.
I'm going to go a different route for my home NVIS set up and use a 40/60/80 meter fan dipole. This would accomplish everything you are trying to do and perform better than using a EFHF. And at the same time, have 60 meters. The EFHW could then be put at a greater height to allow it to perform better. I also am going to use something like the painters poles you are using at the ends. I found some 22' painters poles that have snap out clips to raise and lower. Really fast to adjust. This will allow me to quickly lower each end of the antenna. My plan is to cut the 80 meter antenna for the 3.800 Mhz portion of the band and then have an add on section of wire with quick disconnect ends to add additional lengths of wire on each end to get a better SWR match in the 3.500 Mhz portion of the band. The additional length of wire on each end, which will be a about 2.5 + feet and can just hang down. This will allow me to have a very good SWR on both ends of the band. I know, the antenna will work fine at 1.6 to 1. I'm just anal about having the lowest SWR possible. If it proves to help, a linked piece of wire under the dipole can act as a reflector. I may or may not have to remove the unused portions of the reflector when changing bands. Time will tell on that one. I already have a lightweight linked 20/40/60/80 dipole for field use. I know there can be a little interaction with a fan dipole, but I'll figure it out. If it does not perform as I want, I'm only out a little bit of wire. Like you, I also want to be able to operate on 60 meters. Antenna building has always been an interest of mine. Saves a lot of $$$$ to. P.S, I was just going to build a 40/80. You got me thinking about how useful it would be to have 60 also. Thanks.
@@TheTechPrepper There is usually more than one way to accomplish a goal. It's what works best for you and meets your needs, expectations and goals. That is the great thing about Ham Radio, lots of good options. So much depends on the mission. Your not going to get to fancy for a quick field set up. That said, maybe you are not able to get that close in NVIS contact and it's important that you do. That is a case where a piece of wire laid down under the antenna may make a difference. Something like having an EFHW and a dipole with you....have a back up plan. It's all a balance. One person mentioned antenna height. An excellent point. Again, love the series. It's good to be able to share ideas. I try to learn something from every post. Your posts are well thought out and planned. Thank You for your efforts.
@@johnk23705 You nailed it one the head. It's all about "your" needs and goals. This is part of the reason why open each video in this series with the mission objective. My Elmer calls this "radio with a purpose." 73's
Open question to all. "Is there a good video on how to setup the NVIS antenna in this video?" I have the discontinued FT-897D and the Discontinued Chameleon V1 10-80meter vertical. Not sure how to test it and neither are the hams in my group since it needs a 9:1 unun and it messes with their gear. So time for a new antenna.
It's custom software that I wrote. It has not been released. It will be part of the Community Edition of my EmComm Tools software project that we kicked off last month on Bug Me a Coffee.
How are you planning to communicate with family say if all power goes out? Do you have a plan with say your wife that if we have no internet and say I’m out at work or something she know’s to turn on the radio at a certain frequency and or time? Does she(or family ) just monitor that channel until you come on? That’s the part I’m very interested in hearing from you.
Very good video. I'm running an I-Com IC 705 with the EMComm III wire antenna with the transmission point 65' in the air sloped 45' and the counterpoise straight down. Works well for NVIS on 80 meters. Thanks for your insight .73 KF0CA
I’m going to add an update to this setup.. as of August 2024 xiegu is putting out an expansion board available for the X6200 (and hopefully the 6100 and g90 also) which will allow for include UHF/VHF Bands on the radio, on top of its already 10 watts HF and SDR. Combine this with a Digirig / digirig Lite and your toughbook/Rugged 14 laptop and add FT8 and Js8call or even add in a RTL-SDR and an optional 50w - 100w Amplifier and you have a not just a regional but national and even worldwide comms setup in still a pretty small package considering the X6200 is TINY. I would recommend adding an additional external battery as well to power your radio with the amplifier and possibly your laptop if need be. Grab a Chameleon antenna or for a price savings grab a Gabil’s multi a band antenna system that comes with swappable pretuned band coils for easy and lighter weight than carrying both HF and a dual band antennas. Also pick up a Gabil antenna tripod with the built in radial mounts. It’s incredibly handy and made of all lightweight aluminum construction. This is what I think is the new SHTF Mobile/Portable Comms kit (if you want to all of the available bands and modes including digital that is). Oh and don’t forget your Mini DMR/Dstar/p25 hotspot over at bridgecom. Package will cost a pretty penny but boy you’re going to be really working the bands with it.
I had an unusual experience with a a NVIS antenna, I was in the desert near Salton Sea and make a contact in Washington state. I am sure it was a fluke but I did twice on different dates. This was about 1200 miles (your mileage my vary). I was using a folded dipole from Cobra. N6JAI
I found the same. You will still get some low take off angles with antenna deployed at these lower heights, so that would explain the farther contacts.
Full sized 80m, 60m, or 40m antenna 1/8wl to 1/4wl above the ground, possibly with a reflecting element on the ground. A magnetic or small transmitting loop about one loop diameter above ground also works at slightly reduced efficiency for very well built loops.
That attempted QSO with K7IAL that failed is nearly identical to what I need to accomplish between where I work and my QTH (39 miles with a 1,300 foot mound of dirty in my way). And the proposed test that @K6ARK mentioned in the comments could simulate the field setup I need… i.e., your setup at the QTH works, the field exercise is to go to K7IAL with that deployable dipole to secure NVIS contact with your QTH. I’d love to see a nerd video on the success of that exercise.
Better to overestimate, rather than underestimate the initial equipment outlay, but I think you can build a decent 100W HF station using new quality major brand for $1000. But just ‘cause you can, doesn’t mean a ham will. Let’s face it, ham’s tend to be suckers for gear. 😊
Well, just a quick thought, The FT-891 is a 100W HF portable rig for $640, and there are several wire antenna options for $200 or less. Add a battery or AC power supply (if you don’t already have one from the Tech rig), and you can keep it basic for ~$1k.
The FT-891 is a great choice. I have that rig, too. They're still very affordable and will put you in at a budget around $1,000. I actually use that rig in the two NVIS videos below. If you're adventurous, check out my NVIS video where I build a couple of antennas for next to nothing: * th-cam.com/video/yYXVKtu3nwk/w-d-xo.html * th-cam.com/video/-pKLZCuWZY4/w-d-xo.html
It's the PRC/117G pouch from High Ground Gear. I've made a few videos on the FT-857D manpack page. If you're interested, search my channel page for manpack and ft-857d.
Morning, Joe. Glad you enjoyed it. Please note: the mugs are printed on-demand, so they take about 7 days to arrive. I appreciate your support. Here's the new store: shop.thetechprepper.com/
Good luck with your tests. I have been on the fence about the IC-705 for a long time. I am not a fan of the form factor for what I do, but if Icom ever releases a 20 watt version, I may have to give it another serious look. Cheers.
Another great video! At 1:34 you indicated the mission objective was to make contact with three known 'quantities', did you mean entities? If not, could you please elaborate?
I have a question re the battery pack I see you use. Do you regulate the voltage after it? Do you just charge it up to 15v ? If regulated, have you checked for noise from the regulator and or got a link?
I have a qyt kt 8900d as my base with a dual band Ringo ranger I have a yaesu ft65 and a u s9x3 handhelds I use them daily on frs gmrs and the 2 meter murrs bands
What radios are these being used?? Can this work with cb radios too??. This is neat. If going from radio to radio and is there a repeater set up with what is going with the set up. ??.
It's something custom I wrote. I'm calling it EmComm Tools. It's not yet released. It's a 100% offgrid communications platform. I made a video earlier in the year called The "EmComm Tools Story".
Actually, I am going to attempt a field exercise in about 1 hour...I'm pulling out my old ATAS-25 vertical antenna. I am shooting for line-of-sight and/or ground wave for the test, but it should be a fun experiment. This will be tomorrow's video (Sunday).
I like that you're thinking ahead. Comms can be challenging. I find it best to determine what your needs are first by asking these questions. Who do you want to talk to? How far they? What information do you intend send?
Love your channel just wondering are you a vet you sound like one. I spent 8 years USMC Avation mechanic, but had a collateral duty of comms for the nuclear weapons security force 2nd MAW. Been a ham for 45 years but now am disabled and play with radios all day mostly. Try an inverted V antenna at a low height 15ft or less but install a ground rod and a shadow set of ground counterpoises right underneath your V that should blast you signal straight up and be great NVIS comms. You can actually do 40 and 80 like an x and feed both in the center. More power is needed when on 80 quite often. Keep up the good work. Chuck AA4CP Ft Pierce FL
Thank you for serving our great country. No, I am not a vet. If I could talk to my younger self, I would have insisted that I enlist either before or after college. I'm in my 40's and sadly to old join up. I appreciate the antenna tips. Take care.
Another great video! Wouldn’t it make more sense from a tactical and logistical standpoint to have a callsign where the number matches the district in which you live in? From my point of view…. It drives me crazy when stations don’t have a callsign that matches the district with which they live in. I’ve changed mine every time I’ve changed districts.
It would, but unfortunately I put in for my vanity call as soon I was licensed in 2017 and did not know better. Unfortunately, too many people know me by this call. Unfortunately, it will simply have to drive some people crazy.
@@TheTechPrepper I don’t really care how many people knew me by my old callsigns I still change it. I really wish the FCC would go back to that policy. Back then it was a lot of paperwork so I get it, but today really no paperwork involved. I’m still trying to figure out what KT1RUN is supposed to stand for.
Great video I've just recently renewed my licence after a long break due to life... I work full time in the industry as a Snr Comms N/W Eng'r Hoping to go out in a few more weeks & buy some new gear. Trying to work out if it is worth also spending $$$ on at least some "common" digital gear like DMR & Apco as apposed to each brands proprietary digital ( D-Star for Icom, Fusion for Kenwood & so on ) or just stick to Analogue.? Hope to maybe make the contact one day on H.F. Just courious what prediction software do you use ?, take care, & stay safe. Thx Rgs Wayne VK3ECS ( Australia)
That was great. It's always nice to hear the received signal. Did you have a chance to use lower power with the Henderson station? I'm always curious about that. With your first local contact, what a surprise, it seems like it would have just worked! Goes to show, we've all gotta have a solid PACE plan. Pretty neat Gaston. I need one of those mugs.
The VOACAP analysis indicates that 5 watts should have worked, but we had very little time. I was on a coffee break from work, so I only had about 10 minutes to test. I need to test lower power next time. I am still experimenting with the online store. These mugs are printed on demand, so they are bit pricier as I do not have the time to run to the post office to ship orders. Take it easy, man.
Today the MUF was near 9mhz you would think 40m would be hopping but not so much, my go to station is 230mi and I have found that closer to 300mi under these conditions fyi
The foF2 map is great! That's part of the reason why embedded the image into EmComm Tools. The current MF is 3MHz (0400 Arizona time). I need to wait a few more hours to get on 75m!
Great video! I've been practicing NVIS for years now and have found that MAKING tons of random contacts has been one of the best ways to learn about NVIS propagation characteristics operating in multiple environments, antennas, transmitters, power levels, modes, times of day, bands, etc. But I totally get your mission here, and great job at it - a network of folks is critically important for emcomm. VOACAP and other planning tools can be helpful to get you ballpark estimates but there's nothing that beats lots of direct experience. You're on the right track in doing this test! One thing I've found is that, more than power levels, mode matters a lot for NVIS - CW and JS8Call present a ~18 to 20 dB gain over voice modes, basically turning your 100 watts on SSB into an equivalent 6,000+ watts using more effective weak signals modes!!!
Ken, it sounds like you are on top of it! Practice until you know by dead reconning.
I know what the sky looks like when VHF ducting is active probably 40%-50% of the time, and the weather that leads to VHF ducting. I can probably pick VHF ducting days 60%-70% by dead reconning.
Temperature inversions with the low purple haze on an otherwise clear dead are a clear sign of VHF ducting. Most large weather fronts have VHF ducting.
We tried a similar experiment. 2 stations 30 miles distance. Mine on 2800 feet, the other on 1500 feet and separated by mountains 13000 to 14000 feet high. Both stations half wave dipol on 80 m 18 feet above ground. 20 watt output. It just didn’t work… untill we lowered the antenna both to 7 feet. We did it within the same hour. Vocap gave us the same conditions for both tries. 5 and 6 , even with 10 watts. Radiowaves sometimes do funny things. Training makes you successfull❗️
73 de HB3XBL 👍🇨🇭
Lots of variables to consider, with antenna height being one of them. Good Post !
No idea what language this guy is speaking. Came here to see if I could set up communication with my family. I now know the people I need to seek out when SHTF
Comms are tough. I thought I would round out my preps 3 years ago by looking into radios for a few weeks. It's been three years. This stuff takes time. Good luck.
Gaston, big thank you for all the great videos. Getting out into the field, operating, and experimenting is the best kind of amateur radio. Keep up the great work, and keep inspiring others!
Thanks for sharing your experience. Personally, I have found lower to work better at the short distances, too. I look at VOACAP more as a "let's get in the ballpark" kind of tool.
Used NVIS a bunch in the military. They are great in the mountains also were line of sight comms just don't work due to giant mountain sitting in the way. As the F1/F2 range changes throughout the day you will have to adjust frequencies.
Community building and training are probably the number one factors. Effective em coms requires organization and coordination.
More good stuff.
👍👍
That it does. Personally, I have found this approach to be pretty successful. You get out, what you put in. Cheers.
I have watched several of your videos and find your honesty refreshing. When you did a bug out man pack and found that your HF was lacking you called it a fail. You didn't edit and try to make you sound like a prepared prepper. Thank you for being honest in your assessment. It's a great lesson for all of us.
You're very welcome. This channel has been dedicated to me sharing my journey in practical, offgrid comms for the last 4-years. I'm no expert and make mistakes like everyone else. There's no sense in hiding it. I appreciate the support. Stay tuned for next week's video. It's the AAR on my Arctic Circle field operation. Lots of lessons learned coming. Please consider sharing these videos with your friends. I've been trying to make this my full-time job for the last two years. Have a good weekend.
I recently activated POTA on 40 meters in the morning. My EFHW antenna was only at 15 ft peak, the ends of the antenna were at 5 ft. My initial 10 contacts were all within 50 miles of my location, with several being 30 to 40 miles. I was only running 20 watts. The system works and it's good to practice (train) where ever and when ever you can.
As you were POTA, you may have experience groundwave. It just depends on surrounding terrain elevation along the path to the distant station. If you were getting NVIS you did very well at close range.
I just watched your video and just wanted to say you can build a dipole put it 4 to 8 feet off the ground and get just as good of a signal or maybe better. I have the Cha MPAS lite and love that antenna. I do POTA once a week and it’s my go to antenna. I’m a extra class ham and I love the hobby but sometimes we way over complicated the hobby. You can build a dipole out of a few dollars worth of wire. If you have an old 50’ drop cord a little time and you can built them for free. Look online for a simple dipole calculator. Yes I have tried this and got excellent results. Just putting the info out there for folks who are getting into the hobby and don’t have $1500. Great video.
Thanks for calling this out. If you have time check out the second video in this series. I built a resonant dipole to do exactly this. The build was just few bucks and deployed at about 6' at the apex. Here's the video: th-cam.com/video/ypMM0sCUFZM/w-d-xo.html
that was cool what you did with the audio and video there. I always wonder what I sounded like to the other people. Thats a good test to see what your audio sounds like. Thank you and thank your friend for sharing that.
Thanks. It was nice having the received audio for 2 of 3 stations. When possible, I will try to capture this. Glad you liked this format. 73's
Currently using the Chameleon Emcomm iii portable as a base hf antenna and have been having lots of fun making dx contacts. I've been very impressed with the performance. Thanks for the video. Chameleon makes some excellent products.
I've heard great things about the CHA EMCOMM III PORTABLE. Glad to hear that it's a winner and perform well for you.
I have one too. The element is a little short for 80m. It will work but it’s not as good as 130ft element.
Making my own now thanks to the Tech Prepper videos. So fun and educational.
@@randlecarr3257 That's great. Good luck!
I've taken a greater interest in HF digital communications as a result of your videos. Now I'm participating in a weekly Winlink net. For this net I have been playing with different bands/modes each week. Always enjoy the videos and looking forward to the one on VOACAP! 73
Bravo! Keep up the good work and pray you never have to use it.
Glad to hear that. It's great to see others growing and learning together. The VOACAP video is coming. Keep up the good work! 73's
Really glad I found this channel. I'm into preparedness, and along with my father, got my technician license a while back, but haven't done that much with it in practice yet. I bought us both some cheap uv-5r handhelds, and I recently upgraded to yaesu ft5dr and started playing around with APRS a bit. But what I'm really hoping to achieve is a way to make contact with my parents reliably, even if external systems like repeaters are down. They live about 30 miles away point to point. We are in Ohio, so no mountain ranges in between.
I'm getting back into studying for my generals now, and I really like the concept of the portable man pack radios that you introduced me to. I honestly view all of this as more of an emergency comm tool. I don't have a desire to buy a ton of radios and equipment for exploring every corner of the hobby. So I really like the idea of buying a portable radio that does every band I would practically need for emergency comms.
I see that the 857d is hard to come by with it being discontinued, but some pages have redirected me to the yaesu 891. It looks like the difference between those two is that 891 doesn't do 2m or 70cm? I don't personally think that's too much of an issue, because my use case for HF radio is repeaters being down, and I would think that even with high power/good antennas, it might be hard to make a 30 mi contact over 2m/70cm without the use of a repeater? At any rate, the 891 is somewhere around $650, which is significantly cheaper, and my father is definitely only interested in terms of emergency comms, and has very little interest in the hobby itself. I was thinking of getting that radio for him since it has higher power, and could be used as a base station radio 99% of the time.
For myself, I was actually considering the ft-818. I do actually get out and backpack, and I'm also involved in our local SAR group, and we have been looking into a mobile base station radio for use in trainings/searches. Most members don't have their HAM license, but we operate on one of the business bands on the 2m/70cm band pretty much exclusively. So I believe, the ft-818 would do the trick on that front as well as my personal comms with my family 30 mi away, given the right antenna setup? Just looking on some advice to see whether my thought process is way off on any of this. Thanks to anyone who wouldn't mind a few words of wisdom!
Congrats on the short skip QSOs on 80 m. There are a couple of ways you could experiment and try to determine if the 40 mi contacts were NVIS or ground wave. First, try at different times of day on the same frequencies. If the propagation changes much, For example, if it is severely attenuated midday or in the afternoon, it is likely NVIS. Try reorienting your antennas so the end of the wire is pointed toward the other station on each end. With a dipole, that is a pretty strong null for ground wave propagation and I would expect it to be much more difficult to make the contact. Then turn the antennas again so they face broadside to each other's station. If it's ground wave, the signal should increase significantly. If it's NVIS, the signal should be the same in each orientation.
Hey Adam! This is exactly the direction that I needed. Thank you. I have a simpler 75m dipole that I can deploy to more easily change the direction in order to run these tests. It will be fun going through the process. I will be sure to share the results along the way.
Love this experiment and your discussion. I'm into ham radio not for the hobby and fun of it, though that's great, but for emergency preparedness. My goal is to upgrade my ham license to General so I can do this exact sort of thing.
A good HF rig is invaluable. Still using my old Icom 745. Solar cell array, 12 volt batteries, and homebrewed antennas. Very dependable communications. N5QDM. 73's. And yes, the day is coming and who can say when.!!!
You're absolutely correct. HF is perfect for just about any communication range when paired with the right antenna for the job. TYhe Icom 745 is great rig. 73's
I like your objective, concise and organized presentations.
Not having a 60 Meter capability is a challenge. You probably would have had a better success and needed less power. There is less D layer absorption on 60 than 75/80.
Most "all band" antennas don't resonate will on 5 MHz.
You can send both voice and digital traffic on a 60 Meter channel.
FEMA and MARS use 60 Meter channels to communicate with hams and obtain situation awareness for very very bad SHTF days. Monitoring those channels could provide good intel.
Choosing to not have an antenna tuner limits your choices for 60 Meter capability.
A home built end fed half wave 60 meter antenna using a $35 unun and some wire between your poles, even with a cheap tuner would cost a fraction of the Chameleon antenna.
Its no surprise that a vertical antenna on 75 Meters would have an adequate signal at the takeoff angle for your 200+ mile circuit.
I will look forward to your future presentations.
Thank you, Steve. I love diving into experiments with a plan. I'll try my MFJ manual tuner and give 60m a try. At the moment, it has 3.6:1 match.
In HOA's in the Houston area, people are placing wire antennae on wood fences using electric fence insulators.
I've heard several people doing this with the decent performance.
Gaston, another excellent video. Yes, antennas are a big, big part of the game. +3dBr is effectively 2X power in Watts, but with a near omni direction antenna it takes +6dB (quadrupling power) change to double the effective range.
When you use antenna gain you increase transmit and receive passively. So, yes, the Hamsticks are compromised.
I am hoping to get back to 80m NVIS in a few weeks. Our closest distance has been about 25 miles. I doubt it was groundwave due to 25ft antenna elevation and strong propagation directly off the end of an EFHW antenna. Regularly I get 50mi with 80m NVIS.
Where NVIS and groundwave overlap there can destructive interference.
Also, NVIS antennas may be improved with a reflecting element on or near the ground. Mileage and configuration varies. I've lucked out with a chainlink fence as a reflector.
Another simplex mode to look at is 2m SSB with horizontally polarized antennas. On Tuesday evenings there is a 2m SSB net that has participation through most of Florida and parts of GA. The net control typically runs stacked loops. Other participants may opt for Yagi antennas.
Unless there is active VHF ducting most are running power of 100W-200W, but with that power with +5dBi antenna gain they routinely have 150-200mi range. If there is any VHF ducting their range is 300-500mi.
We have played with vertically polarized antennas and it is not as effective. At that point the benefits of SSB over FM become marginal.
You can get in the game with your FT-857D at 50W with a 5dBi antenna, but you will not have as consistent results for longer distance. If you go +9dBi and higher antenna gain you'll see reasonable to good results consistently at 50W. The 160W Mirage repeater amps are a popular starting point for power, if you want to run with the big boys.
The more you work 80m and 60m, I think you will find them more reliable than 40m, especially during solar minima. The rub being best propagation will typically be near dawn. The plus is effective power can usually make up the difference with 80m or 60m NVIS when propagation is not ideal. 60m the FCC limit is 200W. During solar minima power may not make up the difference for 40m NVIS.
Antenna restricted operators, especially digital only should consider dedicated small transmitting or magnetic loop antennas. If you are doing FT8 or JS8Call exclusively and you are antenna restricted loops make very good antennas.
Small loop antennas, especially vertically polarized loops, have both high angle and low angle radiation near the ground. It is one antenna for NVIS and DX. A vertical loop only needs to be about 1 loop diameter above the ground for both NVIS and DX. A horizontally polarized loop should be about 4 loop diameters off the ground.
Definitions seem to vary, but small transmitting loops seem to be defined as =
Glad you enjoyed the video, Viron. I appreciate you jumping all over the comments. I just added a 136.5' ground reflecting wire. I'll let you and the community know how this performs. As always thanks for the additional tips, tricks and food for thought.
I need to make know contacts
5-25miles away with no LOS with both stations running 50watts and yagi antenna 2m SSB think I can make these contacts?
Very good trial and error operation ! One thing I mentioned before was running a wire 5% longer than your antenna wire. Run directly under your antenna and laying on the ground. It is not tied into the antenna. It is only a reflector. It helps focus the signal straight up. This may be helpful for close in coms. It would be worth a try and see if signal strength improves. The Yaesu FT-891 is an excellent 100 watt HF radio for emcom base or portable. It comes in at about $640.00 and is currently available. Keep the videos coming. I enjoy watching and seeing the results you get. I'm glad you tried ham sticks. Wire usually works best and if you can't use a full length antenna on 80 meters, a shortened wire antennas with a coil in each leg that electrically shortens the antenna length may a viable option. These can be made yourself or bought commercially.
I don't think that adding a 5% longer wire grounded to the PL-259 of the antenna will influence the SWR at all. It should be an easy test to do!
@@Chameleon_Antenna It is not grounded to anything or attached to the antenna in any way.. It's a passive radiator, directly on the ground under the antenna wire and from what many say, it does make a difference. I thought I was clear that it was not attached to the antenna in any way in my post. This have nothing to do with the SWR. It is about reflecting the signal upward in more of a streight up pattern upward.
It sounds like you have it going on. I have two FT-857D and one FT-897D. I sold my wide banded IC-706MKiig to a new ham that is visually impaired. As a condo dweller three all band all mode shack in the box radios is enough, but I do miss having a full opened radio option should the need arise.
Evening, John. I just added a ground reflecting wire today that's 136.5'. Now that I have a nice baseline of tests, we'll see how this performs. I'll report back in a future video. I think you may be referring to the FT-891. That is a great rig and hard to beat for the price. I have one of those, too. We'll spend some time looking at the rig in the future. I lent it to a friend for a few months.
I ran this test today in a couple of different configurations. I'll send you an email with the details. Unless I screwed something up, it threw off the SWR on a few bands, but I am still very new to this, so I could be wrong.
So after I have been doing this for a long time, what I have found is that after the first bounce, polarity does not matter at all.
Now I'm sure I will find someone out there with a science degree that will tell me this is wrong, but in my years of doing this I have found what is good on paper almost never shakes out in the real world.
I've got a similar setup, but built on an aluminum frame which loads into a SAW can for storage / safety. I've managed to cram an 857d, tuner, battery, and SWR meter in there, along with a power distribution block and hookups. It's fully removed from the can when in use, so no extra connections or heat issues. Perhaps not as portable, but very functional, and armored.
I really enjoyed this video. I don't have much money, so I can't have the station I would like to....
I have an Icom IC-7200 (LOVE the Rig!), which goes to an LDG Auto-Tuner and out to a 1/2 Wave Dipole for 80 Meters with the Apex at about 22 Feet. That was as High as I could safely get up in our Cedar Tree, LOL!
I've had VERY good luck with this configuration-The Antenna is a home-brew that I built. I have worked 40 States and 9 Countries with this, running at 100 Watts. The VHF Rig is a Yaesu FTM-200D
Can't say enough good things about the trusty old 7200. It does everything I need and it does it well!
@@candyman__87 I had one as well, foolishly sold it. Looking for another.
It sounds to me like you have very capable setup. Both rigs are excellent.
I've had excellent results with NVIS using a Chameleon EMCOMM II horizontally @ 10'. A feedline choke and a counterpoise on the ground parallel to the radiator were included. 40m day contacts from 5 miles to 300 miles were no problem. Icom IC-7300 @ 100 watts. 80m night looks promising, but I haven't experimented enough with this (coming soon).
Glad to hear. Several people have mentioned good results with EMCOMM II for NVIS. Good luck with your 80m experiments.
Great video Gaston. In Canada you require Basic with Honours (B+) for HF with a power restriction. Another option for antenna is a fan dipole which can be made relatively cheap.
Thanks, Malen. I was running a linked dipole for a bit, but started to get annoyed with the constant manually connecting and disconnecting of links. A fan dipole would solve this problem.
I am just starting out..
Know almost nothing about radios.
Whenever I see someone who is proficient in their trade.. I am always impressed.
That's partly because of the lack of intelligence, in general, all around US.
An NVIS antenna is my goto antenna. 200ft of stainless steel cable off a tuner at just 7ft. Works great. BUT you must test and tweak your setup. Also works for long distance contacts perpendicular to the antenna.
couple of ideas:
first, ALE! not all bands can be open at all times, but a good ale setup with 160,80,75,60,40 plan will give you a very high success rate for a link in the area (excluding a nuclear blast scenario perhaps ;)
second, a circular polarization in both antennas should improve communication on NVIS. now the challenge is having the antenna to be both ale capable multi-band, as well as circularly polarized. I would be glad to hear a simple solution for this one.
third, a backup plan bird with an vhf repeater onboard should provide an alternative in case no other comms available, for around 30min flight time, so scheduled comms in this case..
and lastly a satellite messenger for the last resort.
The CHA LEFS 8010 is an eight band, no- tuner, High Frequency (HF) antenna for use on the 80, 40, 30, 20, 17, 15, 12, and 10 meter Amateur Radio Service (ham) bands (60 meters with a tuner). So it would have been possible to use 60M if you had a tuner to see the difference between 40M and 60M. Another option beside the CHA LEFS 8010 would be the CHA EMCOMM III P which has been very popular this year with the different branches of the US MILITARY.
I have the Emcom III P. It is very well built, but so far I prefer my 80m-10m EFHW for performance. Especially on 80m & 40m, but I am still playing with choking and ground radials to find the optimal configurations for 80m NVIS etc.
The EFHW was so-so until I started choking and grounding at the feed point.
The Emcom III P as a non-resonant antenna probably will never quite perform as well as a resonant antenna but I believe it has more I haven't tapped into. Its part of my man-portable kit. The EFHW is too big.
I'll have to bust out my MFJ manual QRP tuner and the RigExpert and tune up 60m. Thanks for all the support, Carl. Your gear is phenomenal.
The RFI choke at the feed point is critical with this antenna. I learned this lesson today. I ran some experiments where I added 15' of coax to the feed point, then added a barrel connector, and then added the CHA 50' RG58 coax with RFI coax and it threw off the SWR on most bands. My plan was to attach a counterpoise with an alligator clip to the barrel connector. I'll talk about this failed experiment at some point.
In the end, I went back to the CHA 50' RG58 with RFI choke, but I left the 136.5' of wire (5% longer than the CHA LEFS 8010) on the ground unattached. It does not affect the SWR, but I still need to see if it works as a reflector and improves performance. Can't wait to test this tomorrow.
@@TheTechPrepper I was going to mention the wire on the ground trick, I think you'll find it helps, especially when working over some types of ground.
I like a simple EFHW on electric fencer stakes. They are about 5' high and work pretty good, cost peanuts and are very quick to deploy.
@@TheTechPrepper clip the wire directly at the feed-point of the LEFS coax.
Stirred up fond memories of NVIS techniques during wintertime roundtable roundtable chats in the 1980s when i was home for Xmas university semester break...a low dipole or a horizontal quad 10-15ft off the ground did a great job for day comms, in a 100mile+ radius on the 75 meter band. Nowadays, this aspect of ham radio plays a role in a Post-Apocalyptic fiction adventure series i have authored...it will be of interest to Preppers, Bushcraft fans, Post-Apoc story fans and of course, Hams!.
I use my ft 450D for my NVIS setup, from here in Tacoma, i can reach all 4 boarders and about 100 - 200 miles past thoes as well here and there.... Using full power btw.. but interesting Lee enough when you use 2 m Sideband (different radio), from my location I'm able to get up into north Canada Vancouver area and south I'm able to hit the outskirts of Portland and all the West Coast areas in Washington... While most of the west side kind of cuts off in the Olympic mountain range.. by the way I'm here in Tacoma
Great video. Thanks for all your videos and the knowledge you are willing to share.
My pleasure! Thanks for taking the time to pop in and say hello. Cheers!
Out Bloody Standng mate many thanks for that and greetings from the UK.I have also found the having similar antennas for Tx and Rx stations is very important for NVIS
I am humbled. Thank you. Cheers from across the pond.
For short distances like that, we found top band 160m worked best for us also data modes cuts through very good as well.
Data modes are a great way of cutting through. JS8 is amazing for weak signal work. You can do amazing things with, digital modes, 5 watts and a wire. Take care.
More great content Gaston! Good job again.
Thanks, Tim. Sorry for the delay in response.
A buddy sent me a link to your real-life inReach video, given we are both experimenting with inReach for short text comms. I decided to stick around.
I can do VHF/UHF via the repeater system here at the house. For HF I have to operate portable. So I'm an experienced portable operator. If you're looking for a non-random contact in the Carson City area, let me know.
I picked up a FT-857D a couple of years ago, thinking that I would put it in my 4Runner. When that didn't happen, I thought about selling it. But I managed to capture a 500Hz CW filter for it by buying another radio (with one installed). Collins 2.5KHz phone filters are still available so I decided to keep the radio. It's a solid radio and I deployed it a couple of times for POTA activations. With the new filters and the excellent form factor, I think it's a great field radio and it has all-mode VHF/UHF capability as well.
If your buddies with HOA restrictions or compromise antenna systems are up for some experimentation, they might try a random loop antenna strung around the perimeter of their backyard fencing. Use a 9:1 Unun for the match (it will need a tuner) and a common-mode choke before taking the coax into the house. It will definitely be NVIS at about 6ft AGL and is relatively stealthy. Test it with an analyzer for using to be sure it is not close to resonance on any band they intend to use. Keep the coax run as short as possible to minimize loss.
I stapled some electric fence wire to my wooden fence, connected one end to the "antenna" connection and the other to the "counterpoise/ground" connection of the 9:1 Unun. I was able to make FT8/JS8Call contacts using the antenna and 25w. The tuner (impedance matching unit) in my Elecraft K3 matched it just fine. My location is too noisy for much else, although I have been able to work a few CW operators during the weekly CWT events.
This is good content. 73 de AG7TX
Welcome to the channel and thanks for giving the channel a chance. Yes, I'd love to make a contact. Look me up on QRZ. I am also a portable operator. Check out my earlier SOTA videos. 73 de KT1RUN.
HRO has the Yaesu FT 891 for $639. That would be a great value for a 100 watt rig.
My FT-891 works great for portable ops. 50 watts is usually enough to an EFHW wire.
Hey Ron! The FT-891 is a great rig. I have one, but it's currently being borrowed by the nice folks over at ARMOLOQ. That rig is an excellent choice for the money and will definitely get you up and running on HF for about $1,000. 73
@@TheTechPrepper Cool, thanks!
meh, had one, put it on the shelf for a few months, tried to use it again and this was the result. It was 3mo out of warranty. Got a IC-7200, far more rugged of a radio and much happier with it, less menus to deal with.
th-cam.com/video/Zc8QtMBySNk/w-d-xo.html
i have both the 991a and 891 as a backup. When my 991a was down for a few weeks, I hardly missed it. Made tons of dx contacts on the 891 from Texas, including Raratonga in the S. Cook Islands, on a homebrew fan dipole. Klunky menus... yeah but the DNR circuitry is pretty killer. Klunky menus are something you can overcome by USING the radio a lot. Also love NVIS. Can cover most of tx with NVIS on 80m on good days.
K5MWA
WONDERFUL video, everything you need in one concise 17 min video, love it !
Glad you enjoyed it!
As a side note. NVIS is hard to direction find. The government has equipment that can Direction Find NVIS stations and pinpoint their location.. In tests they ran, when a station limited power output to 100 milliwatts and using FT-8, their equipment could not DF the station. They could locate stations using higher power. So if keeping Uncle from finding you becomes important, it's going to have to be very low power and FT-8. They were successful in making contacts with just the 100mw using FT-8. You may not always be able to make a contact at this low of a power level, but it would be worth a try if stealth is important. I think FT-8 will be your only option at these low power levels.
It sounds like we have been feeding on the same info.
As being DF is always a possibility I consider uncompromised throw away easy to deploy antennas to be of high value. Cheap aluminum electric fence wire cut for a 80m or 40m EFHW 49:1 antenna. That with asynchonous store and forward capability can get your stationary antenna time to 10min, and TX DF exposure time to 2-3min. Also, loading up existing structures as antennas.
But, visually remaining a Chameleon is another trick.
That is correct. My Elmer indicated that point to me last year. They do a lot of fox hunting. The signal looks like it's coming from everywhere. Thanks for sharing this point in the comments.
Field deployable ammo can simplex repeaters with USDx and micro mobile VHF radios in them + Jamming unit decoys.
HAHAHA keep thinking this Kaelberer. Keep thinking this. lol
@@DonHavjuan Well I know it's very hard for us regular hams to DF NVIS, so you must know something about Uncle Sugar that the rest of us don't. Enlighten us....The RF sensing bird in space ? The conclusion of the test is that the very low wattage just did not provide enough signal for the technology being used. Things do change.
Love your content! You may want to talk directly into the mike rather than across it. I may be wrong, but I’m fairly confident that it will improve your audio and make you sound louder. I know that is often the case with CB mics anyway.
I’m new to Ham Radio and I really enjoy the content. Keep the video’s rolling..👍👍👍👍
Glad to hear it. Welcome to the hobby. You're going to find that amateur radio has a lot of rabbit holes to explore. Enjoy the ride.
I've had to do vertical to get around some hills in our area. It works great with a high gain antanna.
Great video! I've did a lot of NVIS experiments. Best performing antennas are single band: Dipole and Full Wave Loop which give max gain to zenith. EZNEC is your friend as are NOAA ionosondes. Digital modes like VARA allow for reliable QRP NVIS. The Winlink network is a great tool for experimenting with antennas. Keep it up! 73
It must be nice to have the realestate for a fullwave loop on 40m or 80m. As a condo dweller that is a dream.
I am trying to persuade the club to do a 160m loop. Our antenna farm is an abandoned softball field. We would need to add 3 poles. One past 1st and 3rd base, and one in center field.
Thanks. I have had great luck with resonant, single band dipoles. Check out episode II in this series. I've been meaning to try out a full wave loop. Last week I had decent success on 6 watts using the same antenna system, however, it was ARDOP. I'll switch to VARA HF/FM once it is more stable under Linux.
Awesome project!! Thanks!
You're welcome!
Wow love the analysis
Thanks, Brad. Live long and take copious notes. ;-)
I'm using a homemade cubical 2 meter quad with 3 directors and have vertically oriented it. The signal locally is very clear. The vertical technique does not work farther than 30 miles for 2 meters but I've about dialed it in.
Good demonstration. I am adding an inverted V to my base antenna, but been wanting to get a Yeasu Ft897 (obsolete, but still a good portable rig) and do some POTA. I think the sloper may be a better choice than throwing a random wire in a tree. I'll have to try it out.
Good luck with your experiment. The FT-897 is fantastic rig. I love the dual hot swappable batteries. I am still kicking myself for not picking up an old-new stock 897 at the last hamfest.
Love that shirt bro!
It was buried in the closet. I thought I lost it. Thanks for the assist here. We need to get you on fldigi/flmsg so that you can help me test EmComm Tools on HF.
I find my 144 foot doublet is about 40 feet high, and 60 feet wide in the flat middle section, each end zig zags and slopes down to fit a city lot; manages regional 80M connections handily. It does not do 20M well to the east, and since I am on the Pacific Coast that means most of America. I do the Oregon Emergency Net, and the ORCA Digital Net.
Our problem here is getting antennas high enough. Our trees (Palo Verde) top out around 15' here. That's great that you're able to get your antenna 40' in the air. Take care.
The FCC has the “OTARD” rule (47 C.F.R. Section 1.4000) that prevents restrictions being set by an HOA as long as your antenna follows federal regulations. Your HOA is also prevented from punishing you for an "eyesore" antenna as long as the rules are followed.
Those square cage structures we see on German WWII Command Cars in 1940s vids are NVIS antennas.
That's how German Unit Commanders passed Enigma Traffic via HF Radio.
FWIW: I am not sure how much HF long distant 2 way comms will be useful. Other than getting some distance news, there isn't really much benefit. I think SDR or wideband reciever is probably more practical since you can monitor local emergency responders (fire, police) presuming they aren't using encrypted digital comms.
As far as contacting distant family: odds are the other party won't have the equipment or license, and syncing the time & frequency is going to be difficult. Odds in a crisis, power will be un-reliable, & likely HF band traffic would be significantly higher making it difficult to converse. Consider if a dozen other people are using the frequencies you choose during the scheduled time. What if one of the parties has a problem and cannot fulfill the schedule you established. Right now comms traffic on HF bands is pretty much nothing as few people are using it, but in a crisis odds are HF traffic would increase significantly
For the most part I think FRS,GRMS radios are more practical, because in a crisis, you can hand them out and have the means to communicate with neighbors which you can work with. Maybe a neighbor needs some help to address a problem, or for a neighbor watch system. The short range of FRS, GRMS are a benefit since its unlike nefarious people some distance away can listen in and target you unexpectedly.
Beyond that, 2 way comms has little practical use, and using a long range comms put you at risk for crime. a competent HF operator likely wouldn't have to much trouble locating your position, if they are short on supplies there is a risk they might pop on over with nefarious intentions. In a SHTF, I would only monitor HF bands for news, but I would never transmit. A few low cost SDRS with a good antenna is a practical option since you can use a low cost SDR to monitor the HF bands.
FWIW: These are my recommendations for future video topics:
1. SDRs and how to monitor P.25 transmission & emergency responder traffic
2. GRMS\FRS radios to communicate within the neighborhood
3. Electronic monitoring systems: PIR RF motion sensors to detect movement on your property, Trail cameras, IP cameras. IR beam intrusion detection systems.
4. Grid down alternative power systems, Small quiet inverter generators (ie Honda 2200i), whole house inverter systems.
5. Livestock perimeter defense using electric fence systems.
Agreed. I build 25w ammo can repeaters for this reason. Deploy with slim Jim hung 50-75ft in tree. can get you reasonable distances.
I covered 2 and 4 already and did a mini series on SDR's. I even planned to make one final video on P25 monitoring with a pair of SDR's, but have not had time to finish that project.
I took a different view on community communications and prefer MURS over FRS/GMRS: th-cam.com/video/wq-ky0iE1c8/w-d-xo.html
My quiet generator: th-cam.com/video/Dk07XA_i0MI/w-d-xo.html We use this alot when the power goes out. It's nice running the fridge and home office simply by wheeling this around in doors. You can't do this with a gas/propane generator.
@@TheTechPrepper Sorry, I don't mean to be abrasive, & I haven't had time to watch all of your videos (your channel was recently recommended).
I will to watch your video about MURS, although I already have a bunch of GMRS radios, since they can operate at higher wattages.
For generators I have the portable Honda 2200i, an noisy Gas Generator, and a diesel genset on order.
Another good one. Those contacts that failed would have easily been made with a digital mode such as Olivia. Would be interesting to see those contacts repeated with digital to see the difference. Take care.
Digital rocks for getting through. I think Winlink and JS8Call are probably the most useful digital tools. Both allow asynchronous communication by store and forward. NBEMS also does this. Each mode has its limits on store and forward.
@@vironpayne3405 I didn’t know that. Where is the store and forward in fldigi?
That is the plan. We are going to try fldigi/flmsg with Olivia as well as a few other modems. Everyone is all over JS8Call, but I have developed some very nice extensions to fldigi/flmsg that my local group has been using on VHF/UHF FM using the MT63-2KL and 8PSK1000F modems. We're getting ready to test them with Olivia on HF very soon. There will be a video.
I did not realize NBEMS did "store and forward". Details please? I was about to implement my own as one of the many extensions that I have made on top of fldigi/flmsg. I owe you guys a demo of these capabilities.
@@jeffallen6459 The flmsg generates an html file for regular Internet email and a txt file. The message in the inbox can be retransmitted. Everytime you retransmit a serial number is incrementally appended to the end, ie 202211120538.01 etc ...538.02. In this case it is manual forwarding not like Winlink or JS8Call.
I almost exclusively use the simplified Android NBEMS software. The PC version I believe has a store and forward option similar to JS8Call, but I haven't done it. Two of my buddies did it while I was using Android last year.
The PC version can be a bit of a booger in getting settings correct, so if you aren't using it at least once a month it can be a pain at times. The Android version is missing about 25% of the modes and one or two other items. However, for the simplicity and reliability I absolutely love it.
I run it on my Galaxy +S9 phone and acoustically couple to any radio. If I had bluetooth on the radio I could bluetooth. As long as I am not Net Control, it is more than I need.
Net Control should have a real keyboard and lose the audio squawking.
There's plenty of digital modes to fall back on. I've been doing some PSK31 lately with HRD software. Made a few contacts on 20m mostly. One contact on 40 and one on 10m.
For digital modes, JS8 is probably the most reliable and doesn't decode "garbage," aka atmospheric noise. On occasion, there is some packet loss. Had many great QSO'S on JS8.
JS8Call is great, but I have an ulterior motivation for using fldigi/flmsg. I have written a secure communications front-end for that works with fldigi/flmsg under the hood that my local group will be using very soon. I really like the store and forward feature of JS8Call.
I haven't tried the store and forward feature yet. It can also be used a relay. All of my contacts have been direct.
I do like to get on from time to time and see if there's anyone around. Almost every one hangs out on either 20 or 40m. Every now and then 80m. I've tried the higher bands, 17-10m and no luck yet.
Good video Gaston. I'm in a valley so I'll definitely need to try NVIS for short contacts... when I get HF. 🍻👍
Hello Gaston! Thank you for making these very informative videos. I was wondering if I could ask you for some advice. I've had my license for a couple years, and have been playing with my VX6R and FT2DR since then with simplex, repeaters, and APRS via the FT2DR. In my area most of the activity is on 2m FM repeaters. There are also a couple of 2m digipeaters with iGates. My question is: which would be the first ham shack radio you would recommend? Do you recommend I go with a dual band, dual TX/RX radio so that I can monitor/talk and also utilize the data at the same time? Or should I aim for a more dedicated 2m data radio, and then another radio for voice comms (maybe a couple of FTM-6000R's, or a FT-2980R and a FTM-6000)? Thank you, Rob.
Do you plan on getting an upgrade to your license? Budget is also a question, buy the radio you’ll need in a year or two preferably an all band with decent power if you’re setting a base station up at home then you can grow into it
Rob, everyone's needs will be different. I guess the real question is whether you are going to move into HF? Personally, if I had to start from the beginning again, I wished I had gone with a shack-in-the-box. I am intrigued by the Yaesu FT-991A. It has modern features like a built-in sound card for digital modes, has a waterfall display and is all-band, all-mode, allowing you to work HF/50/VHF/UHF.
The FT-2980 is an interesting radio. I like the simplicity of it as well as its power. My only issue with it is that if I want to switch between operating voice and digital, I need to disconnect/reconnect the hand mic and speaker cable. I am running the DigiRig Mobile with it now. It works great for either application, but not both at the same time.
Hands down my favorite radio for monitoring two stations on VHF/UHF and doing voice and digital at the same time is the Yaesu FT-8800/8900. This is radio is discontinued, but is a dual VFO rig. I like running digital modes (with the DigiRig) on band A and voice on band B. It can do crossband repeat, too. You can still find these on the used market.
I would not personally go with the FTM-6000R. I have two them and primarily bought it for use as a manpack, but it is not a great rig for switching between voice and digital modes unless you use the same frequency for both and digital.
Do your homework and assess what you need. There are tons of options on the market.
@@TheTechPrepper Thanks for replying Gaston. I do have my HF licence here in Canada, and would like to explore it eventually. I do have to prioritize at the moment as I have a lot of prepping areas to spread my resources across, as well as raising a family :) I live in a remote mountainous region in BC - the nearest well used repeater is 32 miles away over a lot of mountainous terrain - I can hear it on my HT's, but cannot transmit. In a SHTF scenario, we are going to stay put, as we have lots of natural resources available. My first priorities are to be able to communicate via that repeater, as well as have increased simplex distance. I would also like to be able to listen to airband, FRS, GMRS etc. as there is likely a lot of information to be gained from those in an emergency. My next priority is to have packet radio capability and connect with likeminded individuals in my area to establish procedures to transmit data. It seems like the FT-8800/8900 would be able to do all of this, they are challenging to find here though. The other option as I mentioned would be to go with 2 radios, one for voice and one for data (perhaps the FTM-6000 and FT-2980R). That would provide some redundancy, although I don't think I could use them simultaneously on one antenna.
@@pewtuber243 I do have my HF licence here in Canada. I do need to prioritize since I have a lot of other prep areas to focus on as well. My main priority is to be able to transmit to the local repeater (which I can't reach right now with my HT's).
@@TheTechPrepper thanks for the reply and advice! I ended up taking your advice about a true dual band radio, with no 8800/8900 for sale here, I found a Kenwood TMV71A in great condition, which should make a good voice/packet radio. Now I am thinking about dipping my feet into HF. I do like the weight and portability of the 817/818 but realistically I will probably be using the radio at the shack most of the time until I figure out the intricacies of HF. I would then bring it along on hikes, ski tours etc. Is the 891 the logical choice for this scenario?
When SHTF be sure to report unlicensed transmissions. Unlicensed civilians have no right to survive without government permission.
Lol
I started to smile at this but then….most of the local radio clubs seem to think this way. 😵💫
Most unlicensed preppers will find themselves in a world of hurt when SHTF. They will have all the right equipment, but fail in implementing, especially HF and digital, because they didn't get licensed and enjoy the hobby. Clubs are great for mentoring and learning different ways to enjoy the hobby. For me its QRP and other simplex activities on VHF and HF.
I got a club member that had been hamming for probably 15 years longer than me to finally play QRP. He thought it would be easy and he didn't want to take preparedness hints. This club president had a number of fails with equipment before having any success. He likes to improvise as I do, but even being able to improvise takes some preparedness and practice.
One of his first fails was not being able to hookup the battery to the radio. He didn't need power connectors of any sort, he thought. Just strip the end of the wire and screw it to the battery, he thought.
I have my Technician, and some of your altitude, I've got the radio and the antenna, but without the General, what I can't get is HF practice, except on 10m... I need to get my General...
Really? You would deny providing aid to an unlicensed operator with emergency conditions and SHTF?
I love NVIS!
Ditto. Morning, Steve!
I have a similar need for my Parks on the Air hunts. Having hard time reaching neighboring states on 20m. Im skipping over KS and WY from CO. I think ill try this NVIS setup to see how i do. Good info here…
For those in the Houston area, the Oak Forest ARC will have its monthly meeting or at TranStar at 9 AM local. I will bring my FTM6000 phone/Digi combo. WinLink demo using Digirig. D
I not have to be a member or a ham to come. Also testing for all classes.
We have started being a go set up so a new ham can get on the air under 3rd party rules as soon as they pass tech.
Any advice welcome.
I'm going to go a different route for my home NVIS set up and use a 40/60/80 meter fan dipole. This would accomplish everything you are trying to do and perform better than using a EFHF. And at the same time, have 60 meters. The EFHW could then be put at a greater height to allow it to perform better. I also am going to use something like the painters poles you are using at the ends. I found some 22' painters poles that have snap out clips to raise and lower. Really fast to adjust. This will allow me to quickly lower each end of the antenna. My plan is to cut the 80 meter antenna for the 3.800 Mhz portion of the band and then have an add on section of wire with quick disconnect ends to add additional lengths of wire on each end to get a better SWR match in the 3.500 Mhz portion of the band. The additional length of wire on each end, which will be a about 2.5 + feet and can just hang down. This will allow me to have a very good SWR on both ends of the band. I know, the antenna will work fine at 1.6 to 1. I'm just anal about having the lowest SWR possible. If it proves to help, a linked piece of wire under the dipole can act as a reflector. I may or may not have to remove the unused portions of the reflector when changing bands. Time will tell on that one. I already have a lightweight linked 20/40/60/80 dipole for field use. I know there can be a little interaction with a fan dipole, but I'll figure it out. If it does not perform as I want, I'm only out a little bit of wire. Like you, I also want to be able to operate on 60 meters. Antenna building has always been an interest of mine. Saves a lot of $$$$ to. P.S, I was just going to build a 40/80. You got me thinking about how useful it would be to have 60 also. Thanks.
Good luck going down the path you laid out. That's a solid plan.
@@TheTechPrepper There is usually more than one way to accomplish a goal. It's what works best for you and meets your needs, expectations and goals. That is the great thing about Ham Radio, lots of good options. So much depends on the mission. Your not going to get to fancy for a quick field set up. That said, maybe you are not able to get that close in NVIS contact and it's important that you do. That is a case where a piece of wire laid down under the antenna may make a difference. Something like having an EFHW and a dipole with you....have a back up plan. It's all a balance. One person mentioned antenna height. An excellent point. Again, love the series. It's good to be able to share ideas. I try to learn something from every post. Your posts are well thought out and planned. Thank You for your efforts.
@@johnk23705 You nailed it one the head. It's all about "your" needs and goals. This is part of the reason why open each video in this series with the mission objective. My Elmer calls this "radio with a purpose." 73's
Consider out on one frequency and back on another
Im interested in a SHTF type all in one radio like these... Great Stuff!
Excellent vid!
Great video, Gaston. FWIW, what’s the closest you’ve ever made an NVIS contact? Thanks!
Usually about 50 miles is the closest. This contact my have actually been ground wave.
Open question to all. "Is there a good video on how to setup the NVIS antenna in this video?" I have the discontinued FT-897D and the Discontinued Chameleon V1 10-80meter vertical. Not sure how to test it and neither are the hams in my group since it needs a 9:1 unun and it messes with their gear. So time for a new antenna.
I showed the setup in. my last video. Whether it's good is another story. Good luck.
th-cam.com/video/utK9AwR6c5o/w-d-xo.html
What Mapping Software are you using in this video? Thank you for make such helpful videos. I enjoy watching them.
It's custom software that I wrote. It has not been released. It will be part of the Community Edition of my EmComm Tools software project that we kicked off last month on Bug Me a Coffee.
Outstanding thanks.
Very welcome!
what is the brand of the red power supply? can't read the label. thanks. keep up the good work.
How are you planning to communicate with family say if all power goes out? Do you have a plan with say your wife that if we have no internet and say I’m out at work or something she know’s to turn on the radio at a certain frequency and or time? Does she(or family ) just monitor that channel until you come on? That’s the part I’m very interested in hearing from you.
Very good video. I'm running an I-Com IC 705 with the EMComm III wire antenna with the transmission point 65' in the air sloped 45' and the counterpoise straight down. Works well for NVIS on 80 meters. Thanks for your insight .73 KF0CA
Thanks. That's a nice combo you have.
I’m going to add an update to this setup.. as of August 2024 xiegu is putting out an expansion board available for the X6200 (and hopefully the 6100 and g90 also) which will allow for include UHF/VHF Bands on the radio, on top of its already 10 watts HF and SDR. Combine this with a Digirig / digirig Lite and your toughbook/Rugged 14 laptop and add FT8 and Js8call or even add in a RTL-SDR and an optional 50w - 100w Amplifier and you have a not just a regional but national and even worldwide comms setup in still a pretty small package considering the X6200 is TINY. I would recommend adding an additional external battery as well to power your radio with the amplifier and possibly your laptop if need be. Grab a Chameleon antenna or for a price savings grab a Gabil’s multi a band antenna system that comes with swappable pretuned band coils for easy and lighter weight than carrying both HF and a dual band antennas. Also pick up a Gabil antenna tripod with the built in radial mounts. It’s incredibly handy and made of all lightweight aluminum construction. This is what I think is the new SHTF Mobile/Portable Comms kit (if you want to all of the available bands and modes including digital that is). Oh and don’t forget your Mini DMR/Dstar/p25 hotspot over at bridgecom. Package will cost a pretty penny but boy you’re going to be really working the bands with it.
I had an unusual experience with a a NVIS antenna, I was in the desert near Salton Sea and make a contact in Washington state. I am sure it was a fluke but I did twice on different dates. This was about 1200 miles (your mileage my vary). I was using a folded dipole from Cobra. N6JAI
I found the same. You will still get some low take off angles with antenna deployed at these lower heights, so that would explain the farther contacts.
Well done. I've been wanting to play with NVIS and was wondering about the config of that setup.
Full sized 80m, 60m, or 40m antenna 1/8wl to 1/4wl above the ground, possibly with a reflecting element on the ground.
A magnetic or small transmitting loop about one loop diameter above ground also works at slightly reduced efficiency for very well built loops.
Thanks, Christian. Let me know if you ever want to test. I believe you're local to the Southwest region, right? 73 de KT1RUN/
That attempted QSO with K7IAL that failed is nearly identical to what I need to accomplish between where I work and my QTH (39 miles with a 1,300 foot mound of dirty in my way). And the proposed test that @K6ARK mentioned in the comments could simulate the field setup I need… i.e., your setup at the QTH works, the field exercise is to go to K7IAL with that deployable dipole to secure NVIS contact with your QTH. I’d love to see a nerd video on the success of that exercise.
Better to overestimate, rather than underestimate the initial equipment outlay, but I think you can build a decent 100W HF station using new quality major brand for $1000.
But just ‘cause you can, doesn’t mean a ham will. Let’s face it, ham’s tend to be suckers for gear. 😊
What equipment were you thinking for a “budget build” ?
Well, just a quick thought, The FT-891 is a 100W HF portable rig for $640, and there are several wire antenna options for $200 or less. Add a battery or AC power supply (if you don’t already have one from the Tech rig), and you can keep it basic for ~$1k.
The FT-891 is a great choice. I have that rig, too. They're still very affordable and will put you in at a budget around $1,000. I actually use that rig in the two NVIS videos below. If you're adventurous, check out my NVIS video where I build a couple of antennas for next to nothing:
* th-cam.com/video/yYXVKtu3nwk/w-d-xo.html
* th-cam.com/video/-pKLZCuWZY4/w-d-xo.html
icom 718, about $650
Nice setup what type of backpack are you using for the manpack
It's the PRC/117G pouch from High Ground Gear. I've made a few videos on the FT-857D manpack page. If you're interested, search my channel page for manpack and ft-857d.
Good video. I'm an extra class up near Show Low. Love to get a mug!
Morning, Joe. Glad you enjoyed it. Please note: the mugs are printed on-demand, so they take about 7 days to arrive. I appreciate your support. Here's the new store: shop.thetechprepper.com/
Great information thank you
What is your radio/ bag setup…? Thank you sir
Here you go: th-cam.com/video/5QHVq3P_xWI/w-d-xo.html
@@TheTechPrepper much obliged 👊🏻💥
great video
Well done 👍
Thanks, Jason. I appreciate you watching at chipmunk speed (1.5x speed). ;-)
We are getting ready to do some of these test in Texas. wondering if my ic-705 will pull it off at 10W. Will let you know.
Good luck with your tests. I have been on the fence about the IC-705 for a long time. I am not a fan of the form factor for what I do, but if Icom ever releases a 20 watt version, I may have to give it another serious look. Cheers.
Another great video!
At 1:34 you indicated the mission objective was to make contact with three known 'quantities', did you mean entities? If not, could you please elaborate?
Sorry. I meant... Make three contacts to three known quantities (three known individuals in my training group).
I have a question re the battery pack I see you use. Do you regulate the voltage after it? Do you just charge it up to 15v ? If regulated, have you checked for noise from the regulator and or got a link?
Thank you
You're welcome
I have a qyt kt 8900d as my base with a dual band Ringo ranger I have a yaesu ft65 and a u s9x3 handhelds I use them daily on frs gmrs and the 2 meter murrs bands
I missed the frequency you were using for this experiment. I’ve been wanting to work on this same project as well 73’s W4ERC
We used a couple: 7.285 MHz and 3.980 MHz.
What radios are these being used?? Can this work with cb radios too??. This is neat. If going from radio to radio and is there a repeater set up with what is going with the set up. ??.
This is the, now discontinued, Yaesu FT-857D.
What software are you using in the video? The one you used to put the callsign in to lookup?
It's something custom I wrote. I'm calling it EmComm Tools. It's not yet released. It's a 100% offgrid communications platform. I made a video earlier in the year called The "EmComm Tools Story".
@@TheTechPrepper i will have to check out that video cause I just signed up for ARES & RACES with my local amateur radio club.
A horizontal loop at fence top height around the backyard might work better
I wonder if you both used a vertical like a chameleon sticks mpas or chamil2.0 or a loop?
never mind after seeing the mountains between you two doubt it would work.
Actually, I am going to attempt a field exercise in about 1 hour...I'm pulling out my old ATAS-25 vertical antenna. I am shooting for line-of-sight and/or ground wave for the test, but it should be a fun experiment. This will be tomorrow's video (Sunday).
What battery setup do you have with this Man pack I know you've mentioned other batteries in the past but I was just wondering for the specific build
Thanks for this. It seems a bit far off for me, but I'd like to have some kind of commo should the worst happen.
I like that you're thinking ahead. Comms can be challenging. I find it best to determine what your needs are first by asking these questions. Who do you want to talk to? How far they? What information do you intend send?
Love your channel just wondering are you a vet you sound like one. I spent 8 years USMC Avation mechanic, but had a collateral duty of comms for the nuclear weapons security force 2nd MAW.
Been a ham for 45 years but now am disabled and play with radios all day mostly. Try an inverted V antenna at a low height 15ft or less but install a ground rod and a shadow set of ground counterpoises right underneath your V that should blast you signal straight up and be great NVIS comms. You can actually do 40 and 80 like an x and feed both in the center. More power is needed when on 80 quite often.
Keep up the good work.
Chuck AA4CP Ft Pierce FL
Thank you for serving our great country. No, I am not a vet. If I could talk to my younger self, I would have insisted that I enlist either before or after college. I'm in my 40's and sadly to old join up. I appreciate the antenna tips. Take care.
Another great video! Wouldn’t it make more sense from a tactical and logistical standpoint to have a callsign where the number matches the district in which you live in? From my point of view…. It drives me crazy when stations don’t have a callsign that matches the district with which they live in. I’ve changed mine every time I’ve changed districts.
It would, but unfortunately I put in for my vanity call as soon I was licensed in 2017 and did not know better. Unfortunately, too many people know me by this call. Unfortunately, it will simply have to drive some people crazy.
@@TheTechPrepper I don’t really care how many people knew me by my old callsigns I still change it. I really wish the FCC would go back to that policy. Back then it was a lot of paperwork so I get it, but today really no paperwork involved. I’m still trying to figure out what KT1RUN is supposed to stand for.
@@truckinguy92 I'm a trail runner. Have been for 20 years. I should have put in for KT7RUN.
Transmitting during the wrong situation is like turning on a giant spotlight in complete darkness.
Great video I've just recently renewed my licence after a long break due to life...
I work full time in the industry as a Snr Comms N/W Eng'r
Hoping to go out in a few more weeks & buy some new gear.
Trying to work out if it is worth also spending $$$ on at least some "common" digital gear like DMR & Apco as apposed to each brands proprietary digital ( D-Star for Icom, Fusion for Kenwood & so on ) or just stick to Analogue.?
Hope to maybe make the contact one day on H.F.
Just courious what prediction software do you use ?, take care, & stay safe.
Thx
Rgs
Wayne VK3ECS ( Australia)
Welcome back to the hobby! Glad you like the video.
Think of NVIS as shinging a flash light on your white ceiling to provide light in a room.
That was great. It's always nice to hear the received signal. Did you have a chance to use lower power with the Henderson station? I'm always curious about that. With your first local contact, what a surprise, it seems like it would have just worked! Goes to show, we've all gotta have a solid PACE plan. Pretty neat Gaston. I need one of those mugs.
The VOACAP analysis indicates that 5 watts should have worked, but we had very little time. I was on a coffee break from work, so I only had about 10 minutes to test. I need to test lower power next time. I am still experimenting with the online store. These mugs are printed on demand, so they are bit pricier as I do not have the time to run to the post office to ship orders. Take it easy, man.
Today the MUF was near 9mhz you would think 40m would be hopping but not so much, my go to station is 230mi and I have found that closer to 300mi under these conditions fyi
The foF2 map is great! That's part of the reason why embedded the image into EmComm Tools. The current MF is 3MHz (0400 Arizona time). I need to wait a few more hours to get on 75m!