Stumbling on all these great channels as a fairly new writer. I’m in the middle of my first novel, and I ended up binge watching a few of your videos earlier today. All great advice! Thanks for all you do, great content. Keep it up 🥳
I used this method to write my debut fantasy novel King of the Forgotten Darkness (Roundfire Press, available Apr 1 2025), and ALL the feedback so far has been positive in this regard. Everyone compliments how easy it is to keep reading and how they didn't want to stop and/or they wanted more. So, bravo! Thanks for this, Tim and Shawn
I liked your examples for the stakes, made it clearer. As the writer though my first reaction to these kinds of created questions for the reader are 'Ugh, how the hell am I supposed to know what the MC can do to get out of this???!' Conflict is def a good story driver ofc, but I often don't enjoy writing it.
Hi Tim, this video's and in my opinion what you're saying about intense crises is generally true. I know for myself though, that after a stressful day, sometimes I want to kick back and read something less intense. In fact, sometimes I've stopped reading a book because it's too much, too high stakes, too nerve wracking, and I just want some good, fun escapism.
Hi Naomi, even in “easy reads“ there are high stakes in every scene. They don’t have to be life and death, but there still has to be stakes. Otherwise the reading is boring and nothing happens and it’s going nowhere. You and I face high stakes in our lives all the time that have nothing to do with life and death. They are around relationships, family, work, and other non-violent things. - Tim
I agree with you @NaomiKuttner. This sounds like exactly the nerve wracking story that leaves my nervous system wrecked. I'm looking for something that isn't just yanking my attention chain these days. Some pleasant sailing in between the rise and fall.
I agree as well, @NaomiKuttner. I didn't realize this need for less intensity until I watched the movie "The Boys in the Boat" earlier this year. I kept expecting a big crisis and a lot of stress, but each crisis was resolved fairly quickly (Joe Rantz's life was knocked off balance at the start of the story by being told he'd have to leave if he couldn't pay tuition, shortly after we learn about the rowing team with pay and housing. Next crisis, only 8 people make the team but there are a hundred+ guys trying out...). I enjoyed the movie so much! They could have played up the drama, but they didn't. There were plenty of small crises as the story moved along, but nothing that was nerve wracking. It made the movie such a pleasant watch for me. (I realize, this was a true story kind of thing, so maybe that makes a difference.)
Looking at the trend of cozy fantasy and other cozy genre tells me that there are plenty of slower paced books that still find their audience. Hell, the idea of a slow burn is not even something new.
No. Literally every scene in every type of book. If you study even writers like Ann Tyler and other family dramas, there are high stakes in every scene. They aren’t life and death, but they are still high stakes. You and I face high stakes in our lives all the time that have to do with relationships, work and other non-violent non-thriller things. - Tim
Missing from this video: narrative drive that derives from *surprises* and *twists* within a scene that upset reader expectations and norms, and also protagonist expectations and norms. (I'm not talking about major plot twists that affect the structure of the story.) In a given scene, the reader may expect a painful crisis but instead it falls into farcical comedy. The protagonist may go into a scene expecting a fight (requiring strength and courage) and instead they face public embarrassment (calling forward the inner demons). By analogy to music, these twists are like key changes (modulation), or the Bridge section in popular songs. Yes, these twists still involve stakes for the protagonist and problems to be solved or navigated. But surprises and twists *within a scene* can provide narrative drive and reader engagement in a way that is qualitatively different than the crisis-oriented approach.
Love your content and love StoryGrid! That said, you might notice a recurring comment on this video (and there are only 9 total at this time). As an amateur writer, I feel a little arrogant saying this, but I have a high level of confidence at the same time: You are wrong that EVERY SCENE needs ALL OF THESE THINGS. Just like Joseph Campbell claimed EVERY STORY was the same, there are, can be, and should be different kinds of stories. To me, it sounds like you're talking about writing a Thriller. I think this is invariably what happens any time you try to boil down an art into a formula. I think StoryGrid is a great structure, a great way of planning a story and then of analyzing it once it's written, and I've taken away TONS of great writing lessons and ways of thinking about story. But this black-and-white thinking about an art form should really give you pause, in my humble opinion...
I got a lot of interesting ideas from your previous Videos. But I can not hang in for the lessons in total ignorance. Great title "Shithead". How about "Queer brain dumbass" OR "Head out of your ass iggy" If you want to use any of those great titles go ahead, I will not be using them myself.
Stumbling on all these great channels as a fairly new writer. I’m in the middle of my first novel, and I ended up binge watching a few of your videos earlier today. All great advice! Thanks for all you do, great content. Keep it up 🥳
I used this method to write my debut fantasy novel King of the Forgotten Darkness (Roundfire Press, available Apr 1 2025), and ALL the feedback so far has been positive in this regard. Everyone compliments how easy it is to keep reading and how they didn't want to stop and/or they wanted more. So, bravo! Thanks for this, Tim and Shawn
I liked your examples for the stakes, made it clearer. As the writer though my first reaction to these kinds of created questions for the reader are 'Ugh, how the hell am I supposed to know what the MC can do to get out of this???!'
Conflict is def a good story driver ofc, but I often don't enjoy writing it.
Hi Tim, this video's and in my opinion what you're saying about intense crises is generally true. I know for myself though, that after a stressful day, sometimes I want to kick back and read something less intense. In fact, sometimes I've stopped reading a book because it's too much, too high stakes, too nerve wracking, and I just want some good, fun escapism.
Hi Naomi, even in “easy reads“ there are high stakes in every scene. They don’t have to be life and death, but there still has to be stakes. Otherwise the reading is boring and nothing happens and it’s going nowhere. You and I face high stakes in our lives all the time that have nothing to do with life and death. They are around relationships, family, work, and other non-violent things. - Tim
I agree with you @NaomiKuttner. This sounds like exactly the nerve wracking story that leaves my nervous system wrecked. I'm looking for something that isn't just yanking my attention chain these days. Some pleasant sailing in between the rise and fall.
I agree as well, @NaomiKuttner. I didn't realize this need for less intensity until I watched the movie "The Boys in the Boat" earlier this year. I kept expecting a big crisis and a lot of stress, but each crisis was resolved fairly quickly (Joe Rantz's life was knocked off balance at the start of the story by being told he'd have to leave if he couldn't pay tuition, shortly after we learn about the rowing team with pay and housing. Next crisis, only 8 people make the team but there are a hundred+ guys trying out...). I enjoyed the movie so much! They could have played up the drama, but they didn't. There were plenty of small crises as the story moved along, but nothing that was nerve wracking. It made the movie such a pleasant watch for me. (I realize, this was a true story kind of thing, so maybe that makes a difference.)
@@StoryGrid Well said
Tim, your book 'Shithead" is an excellent example of this process. Congrats!
You guys are awesome and I love watching their videos and learning new things each time. Keep up the good work.
These vids are always so helpful!
Looking at the trend of cozy fantasy and other cozy genre tells me that there are plenty of slower paced books that still find their audience. Hell, the idea of a slow burn is not even something new.
I simply do NOT agree about the formula that there had to be a BIG CRISIS in every scene - the only exception might be a tense action thriller.
No. Literally every scene in every type of book. If you study even writers like Ann Tyler and other family dramas, there are high stakes in every scene. They aren’t life and death, but they are still high stakes. You and I face high stakes in our lives all the time that have to do with relationships, work and other non-violent non-thriller things. - Tim
Think of it as peaks and valleys. You have a down then an up then a down. We all have wins, disappointments, loss, gladness in our everyday lives.
Agreeing with you, Rosie :-)
Missing from this video: narrative drive that derives from *surprises* and *twists* within a scene that upset reader expectations and norms, and also protagonist expectations and norms.
(I'm not talking about major plot twists that affect the structure of the story.)
In a given scene, the reader may expect a painful crisis but instead it falls into farcical comedy. The protagonist may go into a scene expecting a fight (requiring strength and courage) and instead they face public embarrassment (calling forward the inner demons). By analogy to music, these twists are like key changes (modulation), or the Bridge section in popular songs.
Yes, these twists still involve stakes for the protagonist and problems to be solved or navigated. But surprises and twists *within a scene* can provide narrative drive and reader engagement in a way that is qualitatively different than the crisis-oriented approach.
5 words = push it to the limit
Plenty of novels where there aren’t high stakes in every scene. You’re overstating a little here.
Love your content and love StoryGrid! That said, you might notice a recurring comment on this video (and there are only 9 total at this time). As an amateur writer, I feel a little arrogant saying this, but I have a high level of confidence at the same time: You are wrong that EVERY SCENE needs ALL OF THESE THINGS. Just like Joseph Campbell claimed EVERY STORY was the same, there are, can be, and should be different kinds of stories. To me, it sounds like you're talking about writing a Thriller.
I think this is invariably what happens any time you try to boil down an art into a formula. I think StoryGrid is a great structure, a great way of planning a story and then of analyzing it once it's written, and I've taken away TONS of great writing lessons and ways of thinking about story. But this black-and-white thinking about an art form should really give you pause, in my humble opinion...
I totally agree Phoenix :-)
Your kind and degree categories are essentially the same.
I got a lot of interesting ideas from your previous Videos. But I can not hang in for the lessons in total ignorance.
Great title "Shithead". How about "Queer brain dumbass" OR "Head out of your ass iggy"
If you want to use any of those great titles go ahead, I will not be using them myself.