Your videos are simply superb. Having been a columnist for an audio and music magazine for over 20 years and also having a TH-cam channel myself, I can tell you that the talking parts of your videos are so real and emotional that they truly bring me back to my articles. But you do it on camera! And the performance sections of your videos are the icing on the cake. You are a very talented musician, producer and story teller!
That’s so kind! Thank you very much indeed! I’m deep into editing the next one and it’s hard to keep up with comments but I’ve just seen the notification and this is a very supportive comment to start the day with :) Who did you write for?
@@DistortThePreamp my pleasure! I wrote for a Brazilian magazine called Audio, Música & Tecnologia. It was the biggest publication of its kind for decades but sadly they’re no longer being published. I engineered, mixed, mastered and synth programmed quite a few albums through life and your videos have been really inspiring. Looking forward to the next ones. Best! Enrico De Paoli
I don't know why I'm watching this. I once spent thousands of dollars and thousands of hours making synth music in my 20s in the 2000s. I married, have family and I feel like that life has long passed me by. I guess I can live vicariously through you guys who kept at it.
Never too late to pick up a few Behringer synths for not a lot and go back to it. Start with a second hand Model D, a TD3, an RD8 and a Keystep pro and you’re up and running!
@Sharkpuss I bought a Juno 106 (among about 15 other 80s and analog synths) in 2008 for $300, sold it for $600 to Jay Z two years later. I just looked at the price and a tear almost came to my eye. Lol. I'm thinking about it. The passion is there. It's just the time...50 hour work week inspecting welds with two young kids at home makes it very hard. This was all my choice of course and don't regret kids at all but the love for the art is still there.
@Sharkpuss It's not so much the price, I just have so little time for anything. Also, the idea I could ever make a living at it picking it up again in my 40s is so ridiculous it's depressing. I guess it's a bit of a nostalgic midlife crisis getting to me, Lol. I'm thoroughly enjoying seeing other people doing so much with the art though, I just feel left out or left behind. I may pick up a fee pieces of gear though and just make some music for myself. My kids might get into it when they're older.
I appreciate your honesty in sharing the heart-felt story of the striving, failure, the nagging unresolved thing for years, then finally triumphing over the problem. Also appreciate the honesty to yourself as a musician, during those different time periods, of differentiating between technical achievement vs true musical achievement (i.e the desired emotional effect coming across).
The main takeaway from this video for those that dont have half an hour is: a good gating effect needs an attack&release which are super fast and the side-chain path has a filter. thats it!
@@aradderunfortunately it won’t because it won’t make the gating distortion effect that the drawmer did, it created extra clicks and bumps to the signal that it was gating due to rise time of the gate opening and a sort of door closing sound when the gate closed again, this I believe came as side effect of the electronics special to the drawmer gates, this is why it had to be a drawmer, possibly by not being the most expensive piece of equipment it was actually a limitation , but as it was back then you took „mistakes“ or „limitations“ and made them a part of the sound, I have worked with many other manufacturers of gates and they are in effect very transparent, and therefore do not give you the drawmer clicks and bumps, it was for example put, you would think unnecessarily, on drum machine kicks to give them that edge and lift to the initial impulse and by manipulating hold and release completely change the character, I suppose it’s that famous analog non linearity and distortion that are possibly technical limitations but very useful ones…
Haha - that’s some Level 19 Fortune Telling! It’s such a good track though. As is most of their stuff from around that period. I can’t imagine what it must have been like in the band though - I gather Stephen was programming all day with the producer (also Stephen) while the others were in the pool.
This video made my day! The 80s was a special time. Now understanding this technique on a song I have forever loved- it is much appreciated. Thank you.
It really was a special time. I’m planning to make a lot of videos which try to unpack why the pop songs from that era are lasting so well. There are so many factors which aren’t even specifically to do with music - limited studio time, producers going independent, financial pressure to have a hit - so hopefully this is going to be a fun ride! Thanks for watching. It’s very much appreciated.
You are a fantastic storyteller, teacher, and an entertaining musician/composer. I am a fan. (A child of the 60’s and 70’s who came out in the 80’s and left a big chunk of my heart and music appreciation there (despite always priding myself on being a consumer of progressive new and moving music in a plethora of genres). 60 year’s old, always learned various musical instruments, never incredibly well (I blame ADHD.). A wandering hobbyist, a dabbler. But I am a child of the computer age, became a programmer for a living, and synth music has always been front and centre for me in my personal listening. Now I want to learn how it works, and how to make it, for myself, “from scratch.” And then I found you and your channel! (oh Great and Wonderful Algorithm of TH-cam!) Thank you for your very EMOTIONAL and infectious enthusiasm, that is so very detailed, personal and inspiring. Have I used enough of a rainbow of adjectives yet? 😅
Thank you so much! I love that you want to make it from scratch - I think it will be right up your street (as a programmer). I’m still trying to get to grips with how to do content quickly (this channel has only been going since late March) but I’m trying to get shorter ‘how to’ videos out (like the recent Zaps video) as well as the epics. Thank you again for all your kind words. They mean a lot.
Try this out = Get your favourite Electric Guitar and an Ebow and play a long drawn-out part on the Guitar using the Ebow and record two takes. Then pan each take hard left & right then reverse the recordings of the two parts and then insert the Drawmer Gate over the stereo pair. When you hear the result you will feel like the choir of Angles that speak for God are speaking to you.
Haha - you’ve foreshadowed one of the things I’m going to show in another video I’m prepping for later in the year all about gating guitars! I’m currently trying to get my Ebow fixed - the blue light has stopped turning on - but what you’re describing is a wonderful effect.
One of the most inspirational music tech videos I’ve ever seen. As a 49 year old who has tinkered with music production for the best part of 25 years you have reignited a flame in me to get back into it and explore the sounds of the music and eras I love. It helps that I chose Bizarre Love Triangle to be played at my wedding as it is my favourite song by God’s Own Backing Band (trademark Melody Maker 1993) New Order
Thank you so much for such a fantastic comment! I’m so pleased that you like the video, and it would be amazing if it played a small role in getting you back into music. I am a huge believer in the power of music and music making to make people’s lives better, and there is no better decade than the 80s. I hadn’t heard the monicker “God’s Own Backing Band”! It’s funny because it’s true.
@DistortThePreamp No Thank You. It's not nostalgia for me, yes there are great memories, but I have the biggest smile on my face and joy when recreating these sounds. They unlock more secrets than just the music.
For those who might be a bit impatient the process links are in the description which you can click directly to. Then you can return to the introduction and back story at your leisure. DAWLESS PROGRAMMING AND GATE SETUP 13:17 Timer starts 13:34 Basic drums 14:15 Setting up the trigger key for the gates 15:04 Gated pads and classic Drawmer DS201 setup 16:15 Moog bass 16:55 Strings 19:34 Fantasy 20:10 Slap bass 20:49 FM bass 21:18 Snare fill 22:30 Orch stab
After watching your video I tried this with the stock plugins on pro tools and could not get them to come anywhere close to useable no matter how much I dialed them in. I have an old pro tools mix plus system with pro tools 5 that has the drawmer plugins. I ran the same sounds through it and immediately got the pumping sound. It was like magic. Fine tuning could easily control how fast and how long you want the pumping effect to be in action. This is awesome. Drawmer baby! Thank you for posting this video. Really appreciate it. Amazing
I did NOT know! (And I’ve corrected my earlier comment). I knew there was a bus compressor but not a gate. I will check it out! My theory is that part of the ‘sound’ is that the waveform is being ripped when the gate opens which produces a very natural kind of distortion (you’re effective forcing waves to start at a point that isn’t the beginning of their natural cycle). Or something like that anyway! I’m hoping to visit Drawmer at some point and I’ll see if I can ask the engineers!
This is amazing! I have always wanted to capture the emotion of gated chords and failed because of it sounding too clinical. Thanks so much for this video!
So pleased you like it! Your experience is exactly the same as mine - there’s probably more magic in the Drawmers that the points I mention in the bideo( for example the preamps, some slight distortion on the waveforms when the attack kicks in, and the fact the two sides of the stereo are set slightly differently) but they really do sound amazing! Thank you for watching and commenting - I really appreciate it.
That’s absolutely true. I would probably do that at the mix stage because I’ve run into trouble before when I tracked sounds with slow sweeps and then had to either do a drop in or dupe the part. But slow sweeps are lovely on this sort of thing…
Great! You’ve talked about the pet shop boys, new order, Duran Duran Vince Clarke and the smiths, now I just need the cure and OMD. Absolutely love your thorough videos on my favorite bands
Awesome! There’s a video coming that’s about a very interesting (and forgotten) production technique, and the example is indeed a well-known OMD track. I’ve even talked to the producer to double-check the technique. Videos featuring techniques used by bands like The Cure will probably come when the channel enters ‘Phase 2’ and I start to talk about sounds that aren’t made by synths ;) I promise you, this is all coming. Remember this channel is only just past being three months old! (I can hardly believe it myself)
Oh wow -- is that the famous TH-cam algorithm at work, or were you searching for something? Really great that you found it! Thanks for watching, and really appreciate the comment!
You are spot on. The 201 became the gate to use, Drawmer must have sold bucket loads. I wouldn’t use any other gates, even plug ins. I recently added the key inputs to my patchbays so the option is always there. It can be very experimental.
Exactly. Nowadays whenever I record into a DAW I always record a couple of trigger tracks in anticipation of Drawmer action. I don’t really know definitively why it sounds better than plugins but it really does. Very characteristic sound. There’s something about the transient…
As a child of the 80s (79 born) this sound is ingrained in my consciousness. Really love it. Great video. Thanks. We also seem to have started at the same time with the same version of Ableton. Crikey not far off twenty years now and I'm still no " Power User. " Best regards. PK
So glad you like the video! I pretty much became a power user and even ended up writing my own Max4Live devices but then went over to the dark side with another DAW that’s pretty much the opposite of Ableton. So now I track in that, process midi in Ableton, but do all my production in a hardware sequencer. I find the latter so refreshing and extremely fast, which you probably saw in the video. It’s also not that expensive when you consider that, unlike plugins, the gear probably retains its value. But you def need a lot more space and, sometimes, a bit more patience - nothing like staring at a rack wondering why you can’t hear anything to get you to question your choices ;) Thank you so much for watching, and for the comment.
@@DistortThePreamp The Dark Side of DAWS hmm? I won't ask. Are you familiar with the band Ozric Tentacles? I've been a major fan for about 30 years although sadly their last few efforts have been underwhelming. I mention them because they make great use of ethereal, mesmerising gated pads, and swirling synth lines. I've been trying to get close to the sound for yonks but it's beyond my capabilities I think. If you don't know them please have a listen to any of their pre-2000s work. I think you'd enjoy it.
Oh yes, I (obv) know Ozric Tentacles! Very interesting sound. Once this channel settles down I’ll be expanding beyond synths into guitar textures so watch this space :)
Thanks for making this video. I own 2 Drawmer Ds201 and 1 Drawmer mx40 gates. They are fantastic. Not as useful as they used to be at one time but there's a reason they are racked up by my synths. Panning effects are also a very cool using 2 Drawmer Ds201's and alternating key sources. The MX40 does something special to any percussive element. It adds something to the transients and makes drums more punchy. Love Drawmer products.
So pleased you like the video! Have you seen my previous video about using the DS201 for dawless kick ducking? There’s a third video coming too which is all about using the DS201 for various ‘special effects’ - I won’t spoil it, but they all come from producers I know who were active in the 80s. Your panning effect is one of them (you can also at a pinch set one side to duck, though I tend to prefer the method you mention of unlinking the channels and using two triggers). You can also obv run one trigger through a delay etc etc etc. I really am soooo pleased you like the video, especially being a Drawmer fan :)
That’s a great idea! You *would not believe* how sloppy midi can get even with modern equipment made a few years ago, but using it for sends is perfect! Really appreciate your watching the video and commenting :-)
@@DistortThePreamp people often comment about MIDI being sloppy but I've never experienced that. I used to slave my Atari to my Tascam 244 (I added a dbx bypass switch) and it was always tight enough for me. I know it could be problematic for PCs (especially Windows 3.1) but I've never used MIDI on a PC. These days (ignoring the internal operations of my MPC) I just use MIDI to sync hardware sequencers or layer synths, again with no noticeable problems. I never chain MIDI. I built myself a MIDI Thru box soon after getting the Atari.
Wow, yet another great video. I’m known in two bands for using a particular gated sound quite often. It just sounds so good! Loving these videos, great work sir. 🙏
Fantastic! How do you do it live? And are you guitar or keys? Back in the day I used to use a midi controlled sequence to open and close the volume on a guitar effects box. It didn’t sound ANYWHERE NEAR as good as the Drawmers but it was just about okay. I’ve been thinking about what I would use if I played live and I reckon I would take a deep breath and rack up a Drawmer. They’re cheaper than some of the guitar pedals I’ve got, plus I would really want them to go after the amp. Blah blah blah.
@@DistortThePreamp Ah, well there are often quite a few layers of guitar on our tracks so when we play live they are generally left on the backing track and I play a heavier sound over the top. I’m mainly software based in my studio so I found a plug in called Syntorus (actually a chorus effect) that does lots of weird and wonderful gating effects. It isn’t quite as magical as your Drawner gates, I suspect my band mate Tim Dorney may have those in his extensive outboard collection at Flightpath V Studio!
@@faylonbiryani Oh I know Syntorus! By D16 right! I use their Antresol plugin which is the ONLY plugin that actually sounds like an Electric Mistress. I’ve tried literally every flanger pedal ever made and the only ones I like are the Electric Mistress (which I have) and the Maxon. And I had totally given up on plugins until I found the Antresol which actually restored my faith in digital modulation. Prior to that I would have said that all digital modulation sounded weak and lacked any analog ‘thickness’. So now D16 have proved that it really can be done one has to wonder why all those digital chorus pedals on multi fx boxes sound so terrible 😂 All the D16 stuff is great. I also use their Decimort bitcrusher, particular on snares to make them sound more modern.
@@DistortThePreamp Yes, Syntorus 2 is one of my got to plug-ins. It’s brilliant 🤩 But when our music gets mixed by Mr Dorney I send him dry guitars too so they can go through his extensive outboard arsenal!
Great video. You got it at the end. Sounds beautiful. I can understand you very well. The re are some things in music or any other art stuff that haunt you for decades until you get answers how it was done.
Using a special device as in the Blade Runner movie I was able to zoom in the secret bass screen and I can see it says: PLAY SINGLE I21 Lately Bass OT: If you like Drawmers, grab a DL221. I guarantee you will love it!!
Hahahaha! Actually ‘C15 LatelyBass’ but I have no idea how you did that! It’s the Yamaha TX81Z which is a vintage FM synth, a bit like the DX7 only much worse. It’s one redeeming feature is that on bank C patch 15 is one of the most amazing bass sounds ‘LatelyBass’ or simply ‘Lately’. It’s been used by everybody and is all over Pet Shop Boys records, New Order, etc. There are a few TH-cam videos about it but none goes into the difference playing rather than programming it makes, so I’m probably going to make one. Also, 100% in the DL221. Such an amazing company!
@@DistortThePreamp It was my lame attempt making a joke. :)))) I own TX81Z and really like it. There is another bass that can be imported into it, originates from DX100 and is absolutely all over Detroit techno and UK house. It's called Solid Bass, similar to Lately but harder. Factory SYX bank will have it: Group 2 Preset 01
Oh sorry! It’s been a long day and I’m feeling really frazzled. Yeah, I know Solid Bass and it’s great. As you say, its a little ‘hardier’ but still really good. However the thing I’ve grown to love about Latelt is what happens when you play it softly - you get sooo much bass. It’s a really good patch to play wirh your hands and get loads of articulation in terms of the hardness of the sound. If I’m lazy I’ll play in a 4 bar phrase and repeat it, but if possibly I always try to track in (to the sequencer) as long as take as possible.
@@DistortThePreamp Agreed! BTW there is another cool "gate" out there. Waldorf Pulse+ (Plus), though mono input. But gives full envelope shaping for some creative gating. It gates from the MIDI which saves a few cables and has LFO controlled stereo panner. As a synth it is VERY beefy. A true sleeper, IMO.
So I looked at the manual of the Drawmer Ds201 and it looked like the gate signal is an audio signal that controls the gating and not a gate signal... my Quadraverb also does gating but it gets sent midi signal. But now i'm fascinated by the possibility of drone/noise gated rhythms cheers!! And now i'm looking for a Drawmer DS201.
Yes :) I’ve used all sorts of audio triggers. Very short square waves, but also squares out of a synth so that I can control the gate length. It’s a lot of fun!
Oh man, I would have listened to this in 1986-87 in the US and been enamored with your band! This is amazing work your doing mate, thank you! Also, +100 for your watch!
I knew a whole load of engineers who used to refer to using key triggers on the Drawmer as 'Shamen mode'! Did I already make this comment? My brain is addled -- I'm having TH-cam upload problems 😣. So the Shamen records I have use the Drawmers on guitars which makes them sound like a synth -- Move and Mountain is a really good example of this. Is that what you mean by guitar-driven synths? Or were they routing guitars through synth filters? Such huge talent.
@@DistortThePreamp I think in live shows they made use of the Roland GR707 as well. But yeah, as soon as I heard your demos of the drawmers my mind went straight to some of their classic tracks.
Hahah! Don’t cringe too much - that’s what a lot of people do ;) If I had to make gated pads in the box I would probably use an envelope tool to, rather than a gate plugin. Either that or find a way of drawing in some kind of volume automation. LFO Tool and Shaper Box are pretty good and both let you trigger off a key. Although they don’t sound quite the same as the real thing…
Fantastic video. I'm only halfway through so far but I'm loving the way you explain this - which resonates immensely with me as also a lifelong (more like off/on) maker of electronic / synthy pop music, having been enthralled emotionally by those wondrous 80s synth-pop gems. For me, growing up in the early 00s, the first thing like this I had was the "Slicer" effect on my Yamaha DJXII Keyboard - it basically did the slicing right (symmetrical patterns only), but with obnoxious clicks at the start/stop. And then my Roland D2 (MC-505 knock-off) Groovebox also had slicer DSP, and the Korg MicroKorg had the arpeggio with the 8 buttons (representing steps you can turn on/off)....in 2015 ish I returned to trying to make this effect with Logic Pro 9's Sculpture software instrument, it had a "groove delay".
When I recently got the Behringer K2 (Korg MS-20), I started using the drum signal as a CV input controlling the LPF (or alternatively, as the gate trigger) and that got me 90% there, I was loving it. Now, seeing your video, I want to do your method which may be a smidge better.
Bought 2x DS201 (XLR versions) back in 89, they're so useful, even today. The Butterworth key filters are superb for mixing, they can bracket sounds within the mix like nothing else, - also, I've never had an issue with either unit. Same can be said for all the Drawmer DL compressors I still have too, and their dynamic noise filter, the DF320. If I want punch I use my dbx units, and I then process the dbx units through a DL241, or 251, to bring back the meat and weight that the dbx process always tends to eat up a little bit. Those Crimson equalisers are also very underrated, I have a couple of the fully parametric versions, the 3012 ones.
Such an interesting comment! I spoke to Drawmer (the company) before making this video and they confirmed that there were only ever a couple of revisions to the DS201 back in the day which were to do with the unbalanced/balanced connectors, and essentially the unit has been in continuous production since it was introduced with no changes (apart from when components had to be changed because old components were no longer available). I find it hilarious that the only differences between my units are the logo alignment :) As a matter of interest, which dbx compressor(s) do you have? And it’s amazing that you have the 3012 EQ. A producer friend has the Indigo which is like mine only tube instead of solid state and he likes to drive it. As you say, it’s underrated, like a lot of the TLA stuff. I use mine pretty much exclusively for adding 1-2dB of 8k (shelf) when tracking vocals. It’s nothing special, but it does the job fine. Thank you so much for watching, and for commenting!
@@DistortThePreamp Hey there, - regarding the dbx units, my current favourite is the 166A,- I have one earlier model, with the external metal XLR fixing plates, and one second gen, - the second generation sounds slightly cleaner, but that's probably just age more than anything else. I know many knock the lower cost dbx units, but I'm really into heavy Electronica, and for that purpose they are perfect, especially drums, individual or buss. One of my favourite artists/producers is Jack Dangers of *Meat Beat Manifesto,* and I learned in the early 90s that he used an old dbx118 to get a particular drum sound, and it was a sound I really liked, so over the 90s I picked up 2x 118 units myself, - they're essentially the poor mans dbx160vu. I later heard he had used 166A units on his album *Subliminal Sandwich,* so I had to get a couple. I use all my dbx processors as, essentially, transient shapers, I just really like the process, - but I know many hate it, they find the way they "slam the drums" too much. I also bought a 1066, probably early 2000s, which I didn't gel with for years, but over the last 10 years or so I've found them quite useful, the trick with the 1066 is to barely let the gain reduction meter show any action, one or two red LEDs showing is all one wants, - the threshold and ratio controls on the dbx1066 really don't appear to follow the markings around each control, so keeping a low Ratio and high Threshold is the only way I've found, personally, to make good use of them, - but set up just right, they can sound very much like the 166A, just a little clearer, - so I now have 2 of them also. I bought a 166xl, just to see, - absolute rubbish really, - to get the classic dbx action, the compressor needs to work fluidly in *Auto* mode, - the 166xl really craps out in this regard. so out of what I've got, 1. 166A 2. 118 3. 1066 4. 166xl - avoid at all costs - but like I mentioned previously, they do suck some of the weight out of the sound, apart from the 118 units, which do, but nowhere near as bad. So, to get the sound I really want out of the 166A and the 1066 units, - I will either follow them with a Drawmer DL compressor, which really thickens the sound back up, or, what is more common, for me, as I tend to work from a top down approach, - I just strap a Drawmer DL251 over the main buss inserts, after an equaliser, and mix into that, while having a 166A, etc set up on a stereo buss drum group, - that way what ever I'm doing with the dbx units within the desk, they're already hitting some of that Drawmer meat, iykwim. And, as I always say when posting on forums, - I ain't no professional, just another idiot with enough money to spend on toys that feed my autistic need for sonic manipulation. love to ALL
Very interesting. I had a 166XL too and it sounded terrible. The only use I ever found for it was to add punch to organ transients and, well, that’s not much of a reason to keep it. I love the dbx sound which as you might know is mainly to do with the fact that the detection circuit works on RMS rather than peak. It surprises me how few people in TH-camLand understand the difference this makes, but it’s really critical to the way they slam drums and pin a vocal. The 1176 is obviously peak, and don’t get me started on the LA-2A. I think I’m going to make an entire video about how the latter is literally destroying vocals because it’s release time of 15s means that the compressor doesn’t reset between lines. So your drop ins are compressed differently. Blah blah blah. ;)
The drawmer made a „Click“ Impulse when opening and sometimes closing which gave the sound an impulse that you couldn’t get from instruments, while new sound
That’s exactly correct - it affects the transient and it’s particularly noticeable on softer sounds :) Reallt appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment. Thanks Murray :)
Oh that’s amazing! Pretty sure it will hold its value too. Let me know if the pots are scratchy (ie if you get a scratchy sound when you turn them) as that is a very easy fix. I’m going to do at least one more video on the DS201 about special studio effects, but I might also do a fourth specifically about gating guitars! Thank you so much for watching…
@@DistortThePreamp Congrats on a successful video!!! Can't wait for your next one. Just got my Drawmer today. Haven't set it up yet but if it makes a scratchy sound I'll let you know.
This is so great! Sorry my videos are coming out a bit slowly. I’ve literally got a list of the next twenty and I want to be doing about 2 or 3 a week but I’m slightly struggling to do 1 a week at the moment! That’s for the supportive words though.
@@DistortThePreamp I could have 3 of these i used for drums im really looking forward to trying them on synths, thanks so much for sharing, love the relaxed vibe of your videos. 10/10
Seems like this video really took off! There's not enough new wave/post punk synth and production content on TH-cam. Thanks for being here and making videos!
That's a very kind thing to say! I've got a very long production list of videos to make but hopefully I'll be able to get on a regular schedule... Thanks for watching, caring, and commenting :-)
Yeah I’m enjoying the different focus of this channel…trying to see the glass half full and all, but it would be so much more inspiring and useful for my personal taste if more synth geek vids weren’t geared to techno bangers and “atmospheric” stuff! I like those things too, just nice to find some variety 😊
Thank you! I really appreciate this. Don’t think this is a canned response - I’m still quite overwhelmed by the positive responses. The whole channel was started in mid March. It’s all very new.
Used to use the DS201 for the live stuff when big analogue mixers and racks of outboard was a thing. Was an industry standard on all the rider specs. Did repair the last of what we had kicking about which got sold on, the FET used for the actual audio attenuation was obsolete but i managed to find some NOS. These where quite a common failure along with the pots wearing out, which again where an oddity but Drammer always had good stock of them. There were a few classic rack unit's of the time that everyone had in that world.
Oh is the FET now obsolete? Surely Drawmer still use FETs, no? Fascinating if they don’t. At some stage I’ll go up to Sheffield and see if I can get to look around the factory…
@@DistortThePreamp I just had a look into it. Looks like the 2N4091 is the one that gets used today which is available. I remember at the time i had a real problem sourcing replacements as they weren't readily available. I can't remember off hand what the original spec'd one was. This single fet is what's doing the actual gating of the audio. I think they still might be making them, I've seen like at least 3 different production versions of the 201 where parts changed. If you manage to get a look around the factory that would make a good video if they allow it. I think they probably would be OK with it, they were always a friendly bunch to deal with.
Yes, very friendly :) I contacted them for research before I made the video and they were very helpful. Basically the unit hasn’t changed since it was introduced apart from the balanced/unbalanced thing and substitute componsents when old ones no longer were available. I’m going to Sheffield in the next few weeks and I’m sure they’ll let me drop in :)
Yes! It’s funny to think that if I’d started the channel a year before I did I’m sure I would have been able to interview Ivor Drawmer himself. But the guys I’ve spoken to there have been working there for 30+ years. Proper continuity, proper manufacturing, and proper quality.
Haha! You win all of the prizes! 🏆 I don’t think it’s left that patch for years 😂 What not so many people know about that patch (unless they’ve got the unit themselves) is how well it responds to velocity. It’s an incredibly articulate sound - soft velocities are full with loads of low end, and harder velocity make it sort of ‘twang’. This is why I never programm it and always play it (albeit into a sequencer). When you see me fiddling about before I take the part I’m not only working out the notes, I’m also testing the right velocity for the song. Really appreciate you watching, and doing the inevitable reveal :)
It's a bobby dazzler of a sound. The first time I heard gated sounds like that was on Strawberry Switchblade's Another Day (1985 incidently) and it blew my mind. So glad I subbed.
Oh amazing! Do you know ‘Since Yesterday’ also by Strawberry Switcgbkade? The whole track is gated at the end of the middle section. Such a cool sound!
@@DistortThePreamp Yes, It does sound gorgeous and it's on the same album produces by David Motion & Phil Thornally. You're doing a fantastic job keep up the brilliant work.
Bro, what is going on with this channel? IT'S FRICKING GREAT! Wow, we live in the best time for information and learning. I'm so glad I came across this. This is gold for anyone getting into synths and hardware. Heck, it's gold for anyone who is in love with understanding how music is/was made. I'm 50 years old and I absolutely love trying to produce music. Spent more than half of my life playing multiple instruments in bands. Not the best musician but not the worst - I know a few chords. For the last couple years I have been consumed with learning how to mixing music and produce with affordable analog synths. I bought a Soundcraft Signature 22 MTK mixing board... It is slowly changing my life. I also have that Arturia Keystep Pro connected to a bunch of stuff. It's a lot of fun. I could go on and on..... Ha! Also, I see that Behringer TR3. I have the MonoPoly, RD-8 and the VC340. If I would have never bought that first Behringer synth I would not be on this video right now. Glad I found this channel! Its really great! MUSICIANS UNITE, and CREATE!!!!!!!!!! LETS GO!
Thank you so much for this awesome comment! My main problem is that the videos are taking too long, but hopefully I will be able to solve that soon :) The Soundcraft boards have always been great. You just need the space for it 😂 I often wish I had an RD-8 and will definitely get one. Even when I’m using my Roland R8 I rely on my RD-9 hats but I often really want 808 hats or snare. And samples are *not the same*. Really appreciate you watching and your very, very kind comment which is inspiring :)
Great video. Back in the 90s I had a couple of different Tascam mixers (at different times) which had MIDI mutes on the channels that I used for gating. Although with MIDI being a bit slow, you'd had have to move the trigger sound forward a 1/96th note as to not lose the attack. The Yamaha digital mixers did it really well too with their built in gates. That all said, I'll take your word for it that the Drawmer's the best!
This has been ever so slightly controversial, but I stand by it :) MIDI gates are such a great idea in theory - and I used to use them - but they’re not fast or consistent enough to keep strict time. That’s not necessarily a problem, but it usually is. A few people have been noting that there are “other gates” and of course there are. But those Drawmers are built like tanks, haven’t changed design for 40 years, and are still in production. It’s also the only gate I used to see racked up in ‘proper’ studios. Really appreciate you watching, and for the comment :)
omg! im so happy to see someone who is also obsessed with that new order intro sound. when i was a kid, i used to ask my dad, who was also a musician, “what is that sound?”. he said that it was probably an arpeggiator. i wasn’t able to play with an arp til i was in my late teens. tho i loved it, i knew that wasn’t it. it wasn’t until recently i figured it was a gate. thanks for sharing this! although i think the sound being gated isn’t a continuous pad. to me it sounds like a patch that has a bit of sustain and release, coz if you listen to the record, the last bits of the gated sound sort of dies down, sounding a bit like a delay. so i think it’s probably not a continuous pad. just my opinion. 🙂 cheers!
That’s an interesting observation - I’m going to listen forensically. I actually haven’t put this on for years and did it from memory so, although I’m pretty sure the parts or approximately right, I may also have got the rhythm wrong. Before I listen I’m going to double down on my guess that it’s a continuous sound being gated, partly down to Hague’s production methods. Then again, I’m hearing gates everywhere now - when I was playing the background music against my commentary I was turning the blend (range) knob up and down and suddenly heard the Chariots of Fire intro which I’m now convinced was Vangelis playing his CS-80 through a rhythmic gate with a low blend. I can’t be sure, but the sound is very convincing. Really appreciate you watching and your comment very much!
Just listened to it and I’m pretty sure it’s a gate over chords that change every bar, but with a faint quarter note delay. The reason I think it’s a gate is that I think I can hear that the first stab of every bar has a slightly different attack, and the delay is obvious once you listen to it :) Having said that, it sounds quite different to my version and the version in my head. Amusingly I prefer the sound of my gated pads, at least compared to the version on Brotherhood. I will now wash my mouth out with soap and water 🤣
I really appreciate that you do things by feel and spirit. Like a recreation or homage maybe should be an expression of one's own unique ear and individuality. The Fantasy string's part for example, so exhilarating to hear.
Yes! I actually still haven’t checked my version against the original, so apologies if some of the parts aren’t quite right. And I think I’m specifically remembering the Stephen Hague mix from a Factory sampler tape - that’s the version that’s burned into my memory, mainly because of the gated arps. It was so fun to remake that I’m thinking I might do live streams whereby people suggest synthpop songs and I program them up on the fly… what do you think?
To be honest it might sound exactly the same once you've dialled it in. But check out the 'noise solo' at 34:35 on the recent 'The Power of Noise' video. This kind of thing isn't for everyone, but it's a little hard to do with plugins. Not that I'm hating on DAWs or plugins -- I'm 100% in the box for mixing and editing. Really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment :)
Liking the style of your videos - can't think of any other channels out there that gives the background, or a back story that explains why a sound was searched for. Keep it up, think you've got a niche here. Quality over quantity - the views will follow.
Your Dawless setup is fascinating but I'm not sure if I would ever have the patience for it. :) Incidentally, I keep stumbling on videos talking about gating sounds based on percussion. I recently saw the same technique about the Prince song 'Kiss". Hats off for using the NO song as inspiration. No complaints there.
Yes, I know that video and it *really* surprises me as it would have been much easier to gate off a trigger sound that copied the hi-hat rhythm. After all, the hats were programmed on a Linn, right? In my experience although hats have enough attack for a gate trigger the unpredictable decay doesn’t give you enough control when gating. Having said that the Linn hat sound is actually itself a continuous loop with a VCA that opens and closes so now I’m writing this it’s probably fine 😂 You make an interesting point about dawless setups. I’m not recommending them but I certainly work *a lot * faster than I used to when I was programming in the daw. I also like the way that it keeps me in a ‘right brain’ state of mind - I came to believe that working in a daw made me more on an engineer and less of a player/produver. Though who knows 😂 Really appreciate you watching, and the comment…
What's most amazing is the fast arps on the Proteus' awful strings actually sound good 😮 After decades of keeping my Proteus solely as a harsh reminder to never settle for less (once I'd settled and blown my savings on the E-mu, the desired Roland U-220 became unobtainable 😭) I am trying to rehabilitate it and find a few gems. It's actually quite a good match for controlling from my Roland AE-30 wind synth.
Oh I think the Proteus strings are amazing! They’re basically a port of Mercato strings from the Emulator. The trick is to play them like string parts. You’re going to laugh (given your comment) but they were the reason why I got the Proteus. They’re amazing for disco strings too if you play them in the right way!
@@DistortThePreamp I'll have to give them a try for disco strings. I'm currently developing a live jam inspired by classic disco/funk so thanks for the tip! With so many of these sounds it's a task of finding their hidden strengths! 😀
Rather than record them stereo, I tend to record them mono and double them. I know in this video I sequenced them, but I almost always play the strings parts. I mean violinists are nowhere near a grid right!
Good video. The Shamen used this a lot. I was never sure about how they did it but I figured it wasn't chopping the samples - too much effort to be used so much.
That’s exactly right! The used exactly this gate - the Drawmer DS201. The main rhythmic lead sound on Move Any Mountain (that goes x-x-x-xx-xx-x-x-) is actually Will’s guitar through the gate with an external trigger doing the rhythm. The used it so much that engineers used to call using the gate in this way “putting it in Shamen mode” 😂
There are so many ways to do this in a DAW now. All midi, or using midi to control audio, or audio to control audio. And I like to play with track delay just in case it feels like it needs to come forward a bit.
Yes there are. Track delay is a very good trick. The one thing that I find difficult with daws is playing in real time. It’s not quite impossible, but it feels very different. And obviously the more complex the session, the more accumulated latency. So what started as an issue with sound is really mainly an issue with playability. If you programme stuff then this isn’t an issue. But if you want to play in your parts and ‘tune in the gates’ so you are responding to them then for now it’s still a problem. Having said that, when ever I add gates to stuff once I’m in the box and use plugins it does sound different. Not necessarily worse, just different. I think it’s down to the way an analog gates produces distortion when it clamps down on the volume. Who knows. But certainly doing everything inside a daw is legitimate.
@@DistortThePreamp Best thing I've tried for live playing is the arpeggiator/sequencer on the NI FM8. Don't know why it just feels good and can reset when you play new notes etc. Shame you can't tap tempo it outside of a DAW. Maybe you can i'm not sure.
Haha! I sold my 3630 quite recently. It's not nearly as 'dirty' as people make out -- you just need to know how to set it. Unless, of course, you want it to sound 'dirty'. I originally bought mine for about £30 but unfortunately people try to charge a lot more because of the Daft Punk factor.
Hahaha -- no I'm afraid I don't! It was done in about 1989 and I'm not sure we even own the rights anymore. Maybe one day I'll negotiate to get them back and release a 'lost' album! Really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment :)
@@DistortThePreamp Although I know your goal was to improve upon this genre, it's a fantastic song ! I hope maybe you're able to upload it someday. 🤞 🎶 Fantastic video !
This is such an unexpected response! A few people have said the same thing and it wasn’t what I was expecting at all. All I can say is that record companies didn’t agree in 1989 😂 Thanks for watching - really appreciate it :)
Oh that's a great bit of kit. One of my theories about analog gear versus plugins is that all the preamps in the chain make a significant difference in aggregate. The ProMix 01 would have sounded great I suspect.
@@DistortThePreamp Well the gates did an awesome job. It was super easy to assign a gate to a channel and assign a different channel as sidechain, then all the controls were there for attack, release, depth. I was too inexperienced to realize how crappy its EQ was though.
Oh my gosh, I was taken back to my youth😮. I saved up months, from my meagre earnings, for a Korg ms20 synth. (I went on to update much later with a Juno and a few others), I’ll have to dust of the ms20 for old times sake, my husband will be over the moon with that 😂.Thanks for this slice of wonderful nostalgia🎉
You can do this using the stock gate in ableton. All the controls you need are there including the few extras the drawmer doesn't have. The hardware is fun though and at £75 I might grab one. Some further experiments you should consider for a part 2 of this video is adding delay and reverb. Try adding reveb before the gate. After the gate. And before and after the gate. use delay after the gate. I learned a lot of these tricks when I coincidentally covered BLT as well. It's on my soundcloud if you want to have a listen.
That’s a great point about reverb before the gate and delay after - that’s exactly what I do (when I do it). Reverb after the gate just gets too mushy and detracts from the rhythm. The only reverb I add to gated pads in the mix is a very short ‘ambience’ (like the old 480L patch) though even that is often too much for my taste. And bouncing dotted 8s delays can sound lovely on the gated sound. One way to have a bit more fun in the box if you’re not using hardware is to split the channel into left and right (in Ableton you’d use a rack), gate each side from the same key trigger, but have ever so slightly different parameters on the gates. You could even rig up a macro to dial in the amount of variation. This after all is what’s happening out of the box because I never even both trying to get the left and right channels the same, and this includes the range which in effect is the blend. Maybe that’s one of the reasons why it feels like it widens the image? Really appreciate your watching and taking time to comment. I’ll check out your SoundCloud…
I was wondering ....the BOSS Slicer pedal allows you to control the duty cycle..... have you ever compared its effect with the Drawmer? And another question I have is: There are probably other noise gate, sidechaining units in the RACK format. What about them? Thank you beforehand.
Interesting question. Let me answer in reverse order. I’ve used a few rack gates over the years including some which were midi-triggerable but in my experience the Drawmer wins simply because it’s so fast and accurate. To give you some context, the Drawmer’s faster attack speed is 10 microseconds (millionths of a second). If you’re running a DAW session at 48kHz then every sample is 20.83 microseconds. So the Drawmer is technically faster than a single sample. For a gate this is hugely important. Midi triggers are basically a non-starter because the protocol is too slow. And the speed and accuracy is why the Drawmer became such a studio standard as soon as it was introduced. It’s so fast that you can even use it to do transient design by seoarating the transient and non-transient audio from, say, a snare. And that’s before you get into the other features the Drawmer has. Not to mention its build quality which is very high. And the final crazy point which is that they’re really not very expensive second hand - you could probably pick one up for less than a new Slicer. So now turning to the Slicer, all I can say is that it looks like a huge amount of fun but I’ve never used one! I wouldnt necessarily trust it to be as super-accurate as the Drawmers but that probably isn’t the point. It looks like a really good way to spark creativity and get new sounds out of an instrument. BTW - I know I sound like I’m shilling for Drawmer, but I genuinely am not aware of any other gate that exceeds the spec.
It's amazing that thing you described where you can try 1000 different ways to do something, every one of them exactly the same on paper, but its just NEVER right! Then when you find the thing you're looking for and you can't describe why it's right, it just is🤦♂️🤣
I think I learned about the technique from Mixmaster Morris talking about his 1992 album Flying High which is extensively based on rhthmic gating of samples. Maybe he got it from The Shamen.
Two things spring out at me here. First is the first time I heard the gated synth sound was on Visage's The Damned Don't Cry from 1982 (I was 14). Second is when I started my career in the electronics industry a couple of years later, it was in printed circuit board manufacture and assembly. One of our regular customers was Drawmer electronics. So I probably made and/or assembled some of the electronics and the circuit boards in those 201s in 1985/86 to 1990. If I'd have known then what I was making (I was a huge synth music fan) I would have probably bought one. All hand assembled and soldered together by hand too.
I absolutely love that record and still play it all the time. I considered using it as the example but it’s not as well known. I didn’t know the Drawmers were assembled by hand but it makes perfect sense - I’ve opened all mine up and the build quality is outstanding! Really appreciate you watching and commenting.
Oh I should have mentioned - don’t know if you’ve watched the latest video about synth bass but that’s (obviously) a photograph of the whole of Visage outside Blitz Club right at the top of the video. So not only Steve Strange but John McGeoch, Rusty Egan, a very young looking Midge Ure, the whole gang…
Sounds great! Though having not had hands on one of these myself I do wonder why you can't do it with the built in gate (in Ableton, in my case - it's pretty good in my experience). Mostly just a "I don't have room for more rack gear right now" sort of thought, rather than trying to say anyone is doing things wrong (whatever way gives you the most joy is the right way!). Edit: I've just tried it, and it does indeed work how I was expecting. I'll give you it doesn't quite have the immediacy of hardware, especially with a patch bay, as I had to: 1. configure my drum machine to send the rimshot channel to a separate output, removing it from the mix output; 2. set up a separate input channel in Ableton from my mixer, with the rimshot channel on it; 3. configure the default gate device for sidechain input set to the channel I just added; 4. play with the settings to make it sound good. Since it's sidechained audio straight from the drum machine which is my master clock, it is perfectly in sync as you might expect. But once I was done, it did work. Does it sound as good as that hardware? I don't know, your video is my only experience with them. But I can't really tell the difference by my ears...
This is an excellent question and an excellent point. In truth, once you've got the sound it really doesn't sound much different, or maybe not different at all. The same is true for mid-range soft synths that mimic vintage synths with DCOs -- I can't really tell the difference between, say, a Tal-U-No soft synth and the Juno 60. What _is_ different however, as you allude to, is the workflow and the immediacy. I very much enjoy being able to 'throw up sounds' quickly on physical hardware, and that can make a difference in the kind of sounds you get. So with a physical gate like the Drawmer, for example, it's very easy for me to try the hold, try the decay, balance the two, then tune in the range. With plugins this process is a little tricker, but not impossible at all. BTW if you want to experiment, try using an Ableton rack to split the stereo into left and right, rig up a gate on each channel, map the gate controls to macros, but then have an extra macor which changes some of the parameters ever so slightly on one of the channels. I would start with the range, but the hold would be another one. A tiny amount of thise can make a mono sound much wider. So in conclusion, there's really nothing wrong soundwise with processing in the box, and it's a sensible choice. Just FWIW I do all of my editing and mixing 100% in the box. One final note: watch the 'noise solo' at 34:35 on my latest 'The Power of Noise' video where I play the Drawmer like an instrument. The head on shot is live but the side shot is from another take. This is tricky to do with plugins not because plugins don't sound good, but just because of the physicality of throwing knobs and switches around. Really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment!
@@DistortThePreamp I'm with you! I'm currently watching the noise video... MIDI mapping parameters to a hardware controller is my usual way around what you say, but yes - while you can get somewhere eventually, just having the knobs in front of you ready to go makes a big difference (one reason I try to have my little studio set up with a default live set with everything mapped, my MIDI router pre-configured, etc).
Such a huge compliment Colette! I'm a massive OMD fan and will definitely be doing some programming based on early OMD soon... Thanks for watching, and for the awesome comment!
Absolutely The Damned Don’t Cry! I thought that was too obscure to mention but it’s an excellent example. Once you know the Drawmer character you can even hear that it’s specifically a Drawmer gate because there’s a slight thump to the transient which for some reason I don’t hear with plugin gates. Go figure.
Oh my god, i want a copy of your 80s demo!!! 😍 Your gated sound was its own thing, and the problem about the 80s vs now is that there's a wider range of appreciation of sounds that aren't 100% what they set out to be. I heard emotions in your demo. It was coming from a different direction. It almost trailblazing in that there was a hint of later indie rock
That’s extremely kind! I think the rights to the recordings were owned by somebody else but I’ve considered doing a remake ever since I found the demo tape a couple of years ago. There’s a funny story about a house that I used to own in a famous university town, a bass player in a world famous rock band, and a carrier bag that eventually showed up 20 years later with this demo tape. I literally had to buy a cassette deck and use Izotope RX to recover the audio. At the time I think we made the gated guitar sound using a Yamaha FX500 multi-effects unit and triggering the gate via midi. It wasn’t perfect, and it wasn’t quite the sound we were going for, but it was definitely a mood. Ah, if only we’d had the internet… Really appreciate your kind words, and thank you for watching!
You're so welcome..I have done the exact same process with my cassette demos. And what a wonderful story you shared. I was in the Bay area at the same time, but everything you said there brought me back to that era having musical adventures as such. Only yours sounded more larger scale..but still..man. what a time to have been alive in
Hahaha! That should be in a video I’ve got planned about oscillator sync sounds and aggressive buss compression 🤣 Hopefully the New Order track wasn’t too much of a let down ;)
Hey! Fabulous and inspiring post... Could it be possible re-edit the audio track by lowering the background sequence? There are times when you are barelly heard.
Sorry about that :( Can't re-do the video but I promise to do better next time. This is a very new channel and TBH I don't really know what I'm doing yet. I'll also upload a corrected captions file so at least you'll be able to read what I'm saying! Thanks for watching and commenting -- really appreciate it!
i like your approach! i've been using a boss slicer pedal but all the presets can be really overwhelming and easy to forget which one does what if i don't write it down or take a pic on my phone
That’s interesting to hear. A lot of people think that the Boss Slicer is easier - it’s certainly easier to carry! - but I can believe that it’s a bit overwhelming…
Absolutely. Depends if you want hardware or plugins. For hardware which is best for real time playing (because there’s no latency) you could have a look at the Boss Slicer Pedal. It’s a slightly different effect but a great vibe. Plus, remember that most hardware including pedals keep their value more than plugins. In terms of plugins for in the box work, of course you can rig up a stock gate and send a trigger to it, but for more fun I’m a fan of the Gatekeeper Plugin which was done by the Infected Mushroom guys. Other plugins like LFO Tool and ShaperBox (both of which I own) do an excellent job of gating from a trigger, but Gatekeeper is a lot of fun and you can pretty much page through presets till you find something you like and then build a track around that rhythm. It’s not like the 80s thing, but it’s pretty creative and inspiration is probably more important than authenticity!
Oh excellent! It was done from scratch although I used a template so I had tracks pre-mapped to the synths I was going to use, though *all* of the programming was done in real time! I’ve been considering making some deeper videos just about the Pyramid, but I wasn’t sure if anyone would be interested! Really appreciate you watching, and the comment!
Also, I should say that the way I programme the Pyramid for these speedruns is a little different to the way I programme it for actual productions because in those I use Track patterns. Those are a little more complicated and slightly slower and less fluid. But happy to show you both if you would like :)
Awesome video as always! I'm wondering that does the Drawmer DS 201 have some 'magic' in it, that I can't achieve with plugins like the Shaperbox volume shaper? I'm just asking because I'm working almost entirely out of the box, but for example the rhythmic pads I'm doing in software. Does it worth to go out of the box and get a Drawmer for this duty?
Thank you! Just before I give you a very long and definitive answer 😂 can I just check your process… you work mainly outside the box but then track into the box for editing and mixing? Assuming that answer is yes, then when you track in are you using your DAW clock to generate, say, drum sounds from drum machines? Or are you pressing play on a drum machine or hardware sequencer and tracking ‘free’? I should also ask what DAW you’re using as, believe it or not, it makes a different to the answer..
@@DistortThePreamp thanks for the reply! :) All my sound sources are coming from hardware, old 80s and early 90s stuff, that I record into the daw, which is Ableton. Mainly playing/writing midi, and then sending it out to the synths for recording. The drums are also written in midi, and sent out to stuff like the E-Mu procussion or the Korg DDD-5. For creative effects I also use old racks and pedals, as send effects, sometimes inserts, but all the mixing duties (eq/compression) are done in Ableton with plugins. I’m making ‘tropical synthpop’ so rythmic synths are essential, but I don’t know if it worth to bring it out of Ableton or no… I really like the shaperbox plugin, but maybe the Drawmer adds something extra?
@@DistortThePreamp I don't want to hurry you, but I'm really interested in your insight on the matter about does it worth for me to get a DS 201 or no? :) (the answers for your questions are in my previous reply)
Sorry for the delay! Yes, I think you would have fun with a DS201. Assuming you buy it for a sensible price second hand, then it’s not really a risk if it doesn’t work out. The main think you would use it for (obviously) is creative gating. There are a few tricks to integrating this into a hybrids setup like yours (and mine) but the main thing I would ALWAYS do is to make sure you record the trigger/pulse track on a separate track in your DAW. This means that you will always be able to do endless overdubs where you re-trigger the gates at exactly the same time. This is particularly critical if your drum machines aren’t perfectly on the grid. I know mine aren’t and I prefer to leave them that way. If you get one and you get really stuck then reach out to me and I’m sure I’ll be able to help :) In my experience the Drawmer is a lot more fun, inspiring, and musical than using an envelope plugin like ShaperBox or LFOtool. I have both of those (as well as the FabFilter Pro-G) and I use them when mixing for kick duxking, but not for gating. Hands on feels a lot better, and there’s some ‘magic’ that the Drawmer seems to add to the transient.
Your channel is really inspiring. ❤ The hardware gates sound awesome: musical and punchy. I think plugins can't achieve that. At least I don't know any with such quality. As you are a big fan of gates, as me, I recommend Ken Hiwatt Marshall's video about Radio-Gator. He is an audio engineer and works a lot for Skinny Puppy. He also makes heavy use of creative gating-techniques. Maybe you can draw something out of it. Enjoy. 🎉
Your videos are simply superb. Having been a columnist for an audio and music magazine for over 20 years and also having a TH-cam channel myself, I can tell you that the talking parts of your videos are so real and emotional that they truly bring me back to my articles. But you do it on camera! And the performance sections of your videos are the icing on the cake. You are a very talented musician, producer and story teller!
That’s so kind! Thank you very much indeed! I’m deep into editing the next one and it’s hard to keep up with comments but I’ve just seen the notification and this is a very supportive comment to start the day with :) Who did you write for?
@@DistortThePreamp my pleasure! I wrote for a Brazilian magazine called Audio, Música & Tecnologia. It was the biggest publication of its kind for decades but sadly they’re no longer being published. I engineered, mixed, mastered and synth programmed quite a few albums through life and your videos have been really inspiring. Looking forward to the next ones. Best! Enrico De Paoli
Oh excellent! :)
I don't know why I'm watching this. I once spent thousands of dollars and thousands of hours making synth music in my 20s in the 2000s. I married, have family and I feel like that life has long passed me by. I guess I can live vicariously through you guys who kept at it.
Never too late to pick up a few Behringer synths for not a lot and go back to it. Start with a second hand Model D, a TD3, an RD8 and a Keystep pro and you’re up and running!
And a second hand little mixing desk with a couple of sends, a reverb and a delay…it’s crazy how inexpensive this gear is nowadays.
@Sharkpuss I bought a Juno 106 (among about 15 other 80s and analog synths) in 2008 for $300, sold it for $600 to Jay Z two years later. I just looked at the price and a tear almost came to my eye. Lol. I'm thinking about it. The passion is there. It's just the time...50 hour work week inspecting welds with two young kids at home makes it very hard. This was all my choice of course and don't regret kids at all but the love for the art is still there.
@Sharkpuss It's not so much the price, I just have so little time for anything. Also, the idea I could ever make a living at it picking it up again in my 40s is so ridiculous it's depressing. I guess it's a bit of a nostalgic midlife crisis getting to me, Lol. I'm thoroughly enjoying seeing other people doing so much with the art though, I just feel left out or left behind. I may pick up a fee pieces of gear though and just make some music for myself. My kids might get into it when they're older.
I wouldn’t worry - not many people are making a living making music anymore…
I just enjoy the process nowadays :)
I appreciate your honesty in sharing the heart-felt story of the striving, failure, the nagging unresolved thing for years, then finally triumphing over the problem. Also appreciate the honesty to yourself as a musician, during those different time periods, of differentiating between technical achievement vs true musical achievement (i.e the desired emotional effect coming across).
Thank you 🙏🙏🙏 Very much appreciate the comment :)
The main takeaway from this video for those that dont have half an hour is:
a good gating effect needs an attack&release which are super fast and the side-chain path has a filter.
thats it!
which makes it weird that he says the Ableton gate won't do it. It totally will.
@@aradderunfortunately it won’t because it won’t make the gating distortion effect that the drawmer did, it created extra clicks and bumps to the signal that it was gating due to rise time of the gate opening and a sort of door closing sound when the gate closed again, this I believe came as side effect of the electronics special to the drawmer gates, this is why it had to be a drawmer, possibly by not being the most expensive piece of equipment it was actually a limitation , but as it was back then you took „mistakes“ or „limitations“ and made them a part of the sound, I have worked with many other manufacturers of gates and they are in effect very transparent, and therefore do not give you the drawmer clicks and bumps, it was for example put, you would think unnecessarily, on drum machine kicks to give them that edge and lift to the initial impulse and by manipulating hold and release completely change the character, I suppose it’s that famous analog non linearity and distortion that are possibly technical limitations but very useful ones…
Saw this comment just as I was hearing him say “So let me tell you a little bit about myself…” hahaha 😂 Thanks for the tl;dw!
Yeah, I'm not sure what the big secret was or how it took him so long to 'discover' it.
One’s trash, another one’s gold! Go out to play kiddies
When I saw 1986, I knew Bizarre Love Triangle would be mentioned!
Haha - that’s some Level 19 Fortune Telling! It’s such a good track though. As is most of their stuff from around that period. I can’t imagine what it must have been like in the band though - I gather Stephen was programming all day with the producer (also Stephen) while the others were in the pool.
This video made my day! The 80s was a special time. Now understanding this technique on a song I have forever loved- it is much appreciated. Thank you.
It really was a special time. I’m planning to make a lot of videos which try to unpack why the pop songs from that era are lasting so well. There are so many factors which aren’t even specifically to do with music - limited studio time, producers going independent, financial pressure to have a hit - so hopefully this is going to be a fun ride! Thanks for watching. It’s very much appreciated.
You are a fantastic storyteller, teacher, and an entertaining musician/composer. I am a fan. (A child of the 60’s and 70’s who came out in the 80’s and left a big chunk of my heart and music appreciation there (despite always priding myself on being a consumer of progressive new and moving music in a plethora of genres). 60 year’s old, always learned various musical instruments, never incredibly well (I blame ADHD.). A wandering hobbyist, a dabbler. But I am a child of the computer age, became a programmer for a living, and synth music has always been front and centre for me in my personal listening. Now I want to learn how it works, and how to make it, for myself, “from scratch.” And then I found you and your channel! (oh Great and Wonderful Algorithm of TH-cam!)
Thank you for your very EMOTIONAL and infectious enthusiasm, that is so very detailed, personal and inspiring. Have I used enough of a rainbow of adjectives yet? 😅
Thank you so much! I love that you want to make it from scratch - I think it will be right up your street (as a programmer). I’m still trying to get to grips with how to do content quickly (this channel has only been going since late March) but I’m trying to get shorter ‘how to’ videos out (like the recent Zaps video) as well as the epics. Thank you again for all your kind words. They mean a lot.
Try this out = Get your favourite Electric Guitar and an
Ebow and play a long drawn-out part on the Guitar
using the Ebow and record two takes. Then pan each
take hard left & right then reverse the recordings of
the two parts and then insert the Drawmer Gate over
the stereo pair. When you hear the result you will feel
like the choir of Angles that speak for God are speaking
to you.
Haha - you’ve foreshadowed one of the things I’m going to show in another video I’m prepping for later in the year all about gating guitars! I’m currently trying to get my Ebow fixed - the blue light has stopped turning on - but what you’re describing is a wonderful effect.
And now I am fascinated.
One of the most inspirational music tech videos I’ve ever seen. As a 49 year old who has tinkered with music production for the best part of 25 years you have reignited a flame in me to get back into it and explore the sounds of the music and eras I love. It helps that I chose Bizarre Love Triangle to be played at my wedding as it is my favourite song by God’s Own Backing Band (trademark Melody Maker 1993) New Order
Thank you so much for such a fantastic comment! I’m so pleased that you like the video, and it would be amazing if it played a small role in getting you back into music. I am a huge believer in the power of music and music making to make people’s lives better, and there is no better decade than the 80s. I hadn’t heard the monicker “God’s Own Backing Band”! It’s funny because it’s true.
As always - I LOVE your journey and to me, teaching.
You have truly UNLOCKED my heart with the music my soul yearns for. THANK YOU AGAIN.
That’s a very kind thing to say! So glad you liked the video 🙏
@DistortThePreamp No Thank You.
It's not nostalgia for me, yes there are great memories, but I have the biggest smile on my face and joy when recreating these sounds. They unlock more secrets than just the music.
For those who might be a bit impatient the process links are in the description which you can click directly to. Then you can return to the introduction and back story at your leisure.
DAWLESS PROGRAMMING AND GATE SETUP
13:17 Timer starts
13:34 Basic drums
14:15 Setting up the trigger key for the gates
15:04 Gated pads and classic Drawmer DS201 setup
16:15 Moog bass
16:55 Strings
19:34 Fantasy
20:10 Slap bass
20:49 FM bass
21:18 Snare fill
22:30 Orch stab
I really love hearing you ramble on about the past and about the production techniques. It's so absorbing and your experience is very well received.
Thank you so much!
After watching your video I tried this with the stock plugins on pro tools and could not get them to come anywhere close to useable no matter how much I dialed them in. I have an old pro tools mix plus system with pro tools 5 that has the drawmer plugins. I ran the same sounds through it and immediately got the pumping sound. It was like magic. Fine tuning could easily control how fast and how long you want the pumping effect to be in action. This is awesome. Drawmer baby! Thank you for posting this video. Really appreciate it. Amazing
@elanyadan695 I actually didn’t know there were Drawmer plugins 😂 That’s so interesting.
@ you did or didn’t know? The plug-in is a gate and a compressor. Pretty cool. No patch cables 😅
I did NOT know! (And I’ve corrected my earlier comment). I knew there was a bus compressor but not a gate. I will check it out! My theory is that part of the ‘sound’ is that the waveform is being ripped when the gate opens which produces a very natural kind of distortion (you’re effective forcing waves to start at a point that isn’t the beginning of their natural cycle). Or something like that anyway! I’m hoping to visit Drawmer at some point and I’ll see if I can ask the engineers!
You sir, can spin a yarn! This is now my favorite channel, Jackanory for gear heads of a certain vintage. Please keep this up.
Hahahaha!!! That’s such an awesome comment! I’ll get a photo of Bernard Cribbins and work it into the next video 😂😂😂
This is amazing! I have always wanted to capture the emotion of gated chords and failed because of it sounding too clinical. Thanks so much for this video!
So pleased you like it! Your experience is exactly the same as mine - there’s probably more magic in the Drawmers that the points I mention in the bideo( for example the preamps, some slight distortion on the waveforms when the attack kicks in, and the fact the two sides of the stereo are set slightly differently) but they really do sound amazing! Thank you for watching and commenting - I really appreciate it.
You should make sure there’s movement in the chords too or a phaser/flanger can be good
That’s absolutely true. I would probably do that at the mix stage because I’ve run into trouble before when I tracked sounds with slow sweeps and then had to either do a drop in or dupe the part. But slow sweeps are lovely on this sort of thing…
Amazing channel! Looking forward to more videos like this.
Thank you! That’s very kind 🙏
Great! You’ve talked about the pet shop boys, new order, Duran Duran Vince Clarke and the smiths, now I just need the cure and OMD. Absolutely love your thorough videos on my favorite bands
Awesome! There’s a video coming that’s about a very interesting (and forgotten) production technique, and the example is indeed a well-known OMD track. I’ve even talked to the producer to double-check the technique. Videos featuring techniques used by bands like The Cure will probably come when the channel enters ‘Phase 2’ and I start to talk about sounds that aren’t made by synths ;) I promise you, this is all coming. Remember this channel is only just past being three months old! (I can hardly believe it myself)
Lucky to randomly find this. Great video
Oh wow -- is that the famous TH-cam algorithm at work, or were you searching for something? Really great that you found it! Thanks for watching, and really appreciate the comment!
You are spot on. The 201 became the gate to use, Drawmer must have sold bucket loads. I wouldn’t use any other gates, even plug ins. I recently added the key inputs to my patchbays so the option is always there. It can be very experimental.
Exactly. Nowadays whenever I record into a DAW I always record a couple of trigger tracks in anticipation of Drawmer action. I don’t really know definitively why it sounds better than plugins but it really does. Very characteristic sound. There’s something about the transient…
1972 here 🇨🇭🇨🇭🇨🇭🇨🇭 since 2019 i am making exactly that music i grew up with
That’s definitely living your best life!
As a child of the 80s (79 born) this sound is ingrained in my consciousness. Really love it. Great video. Thanks. We also seem to have started at the same time with the same version of Ableton. Crikey not far off twenty years now and I'm still no " Power User. " Best regards. PK
So glad you like the video! I pretty much became a power user and even ended up writing my own Max4Live devices but then went over to the dark side with another DAW that’s pretty much the opposite of Ableton. So now I track in that, process midi in Ableton, but do all my production in a hardware sequencer. I find the latter so refreshing and extremely fast, which you probably saw in the video. It’s also not that expensive when you consider that, unlike plugins, the gear probably retains its value. But you def need a lot more space and, sometimes, a bit more patience - nothing like staring at a rack wondering why you can’t hear anything to get you to question your choices ;) Thank you so much for watching, and for the comment.
@@DistortThePreamp The Dark Side of DAWS hmm? I won't ask. Are you familiar with the band Ozric Tentacles? I've been a major fan for about 30 years although sadly their last few efforts have been underwhelming. I mention them because they make great use of ethereal, mesmerising gated pads, and swirling synth lines. I've been trying to get close to the sound for yonks but it's beyond my capabilities I think. If you don't know them please have a listen to any of their pre-2000s work. I think you'd enjoy it.
Oh yes, I (obv) know Ozric Tentacles! Very interesting sound. Once this channel settles down I’ll be expanding beyond synths into guitar textures so watch this space :)
Thanks for making this video. I own 2 Drawmer Ds201 and 1 Drawmer mx40 gates. They are fantastic. Not as useful as they used to be at one time but there's a reason they are racked up by my synths. Panning effects are also a very cool using 2 Drawmer Ds201's and alternating key sources. The MX40 does something special to any percussive element. It adds something to the transients and makes drums more punchy. Love Drawmer products.
So pleased you like the video! Have you seen my previous video about using the DS201 for dawless kick ducking? There’s a third video coming too which is all about using the DS201 for various ‘special effects’ - I won’t spoil it, but they all come from producers I know who were active in the 80s. Your panning effect is one of them (you can also at a pinch set one side to duck, though I tend to prefer the method you mention of unlinking the channels and using two triggers). You can also obv run one trigger through a delay etc etc etc. I really am soooo pleased you like the video, especially being a Drawmer fan :)
Cubase has a midigate.
Secret tip : I also use it to trigger gated sends to a delay or reverb
That’s a great idea! You *would not believe* how sloppy midi can get even with modern equipment made a few years ago, but using it for sends is perfect! Really appreciate your watching the video and commenting :-)
@@DistortThePreamp people often comment about MIDI being sloppy but I've never experienced that. I used to slave my Atari to my Tascam 244 (I added a dbx bypass switch) and it was always tight enough for me.
I know it could be problematic for PCs (especially Windows 3.1) but I've never used MIDI on a PC.
These days (ignoring the internal operations of my MPC) I just use MIDI to sync hardware sequencers or layer synths, again with no noticeable problems. I never chain MIDI. I built myself a MIDI Thru box soon after getting the Atari.
Wow, yet another great video. I’m known in two bands for using a particular gated sound quite often. It just sounds so good! Loving these videos, great work sir. 🙏
Fantastic! How do you do it live? And are you guitar or keys? Back in the day I used to use a midi controlled sequence to open and close the volume on a guitar effects box. It didn’t sound ANYWHERE NEAR as good as the Drawmers but it was just about okay. I’ve been thinking about what I would use if I played live and I reckon I would take a deep breath and rack up a Drawmer. They’re cheaper than some of the guitar pedals I’ve got, plus I would really want them to go after the amp. Blah blah blah.
@@DistortThePreamp Ah, well there are often quite a few layers of guitar on our tracks so when we play live they are generally left on the backing track and I play a heavier sound over the top. I’m mainly software based in my studio so I found a plug in called Syntorus (actually a chorus effect) that does lots of weird and wonderful gating effects. It isn’t quite as magical as your Drawner gates, I suspect my band mate Tim Dorney may have those in his extensive outboard collection at Flightpath V Studio!
@@faylonbiryani Oh I know Syntorus! By D16 right! I use their Antresol plugin which is the ONLY plugin that actually sounds like an Electric Mistress. I’ve tried literally every flanger pedal ever made and the only ones I like are the Electric Mistress (which I have) and the Maxon. And I had totally given up on plugins until I found the Antresol which actually restored my faith in digital modulation. Prior to that I would have said that all digital modulation sounded weak and lacked any analog ‘thickness’. So now D16 have proved that it really can be done one has to wonder why all those digital chorus pedals on multi fx boxes sound so terrible 😂 All the D16 stuff is great. I also use their Decimort bitcrusher, particular on snares to make them sound more modern.
@@DistortThePreamp Yes, Syntorus 2 is one of my got to plug-ins. It’s brilliant 🤩 But when our music gets mixed by Mr Dorney I send him dry guitars too so they can go through his extensive outboard arsenal!
Great video. You got it at the end. Sounds beautiful. I can understand you very well. The re are some things in music or any other art stuff that haunt you for decades until you get answers how it was done.
Using a special device as in the Blade Runner movie I was able to zoom in the secret bass screen and I can see it says:
PLAY SINGLE
I21 Lately Bass
OT: If you like Drawmers, grab a DL221. I guarantee you will love it!!
Hahahaha! Actually ‘C15 LatelyBass’ but I have no idea how you did that! It’s the Yamaha TX81Z which is a vintage FM synth, a bit like the DX7 only much worse. It’s one redeeming feature is that on bank C patch 15 is one of the most amazing bass sounds ‘LatelyBass’ or simply ‘Lately’. It’s been used by everybody and is all over Pet Shop Boys records, New Order, etc. There are a few TH-cam videos about it but none goes into the difference playing rather than programming it makes, so I’m probably going to make one.
Also, 100% in the DL221. Such an amazing company!
@@DistortThePreamp It was my lame attempt making a joke. :)))) I own TX81Z and really like it. There is another bass that can be imported into it, originates from DX100 and is absolutely all over Detroit techno and UK house. It's called Solid Bass, similar to Lately but harder. Factory SYX bank will have it: Group 2 Preset 01
Oh sorry! It’s been a long day and I’m feeling really frazzled. Yeah, I know Solid Bass and it’s great. As you say, its a little ‘hardier’ but still really good. However the thing I’ve grown to love about Latelt is what happens when you play it softly - you get sooo much bass. It’s a really good patch to play wirh your hands and get loads of articulation in terms of the hardness of the sound. If I’m lazy I’ll play in a 4 bar phrase and repeat it, but if possibly I always try to track in (to the sequencer) as long as take as possible.
@@DistortThePreamp Agreed! BTW there is another cool "gate" out there. Waldorf Pulse+ (Plus), though mono input. But gives full envelope shaping for some creative gating. It gates from the MIDI which saves a few cables and has LFO controlled stereo panner. As a synth it is VERY beefy. A true sleeper, IMO.
Very interesting… will check out…
So I looked at the manual of the Drawmer Ds201 and it looked like the gate signal is an audio signal that controls the gating and not a gate signal... my Quadraverb also does gating but it gets sent midi signal. But now i'm fascinated by the possibility of drone/noise gated rhythms cheers!! And now i'm looking for a Drawmer DS201.
Yes :) I’ve used all sorts of audio triggers. Very short square waves, but also squares out of a synth so that I can control the gate length. It’s a lot of fun!
Oh man, I would have listened to this in 1986-87 in the US and been enamored with your band! This is amazing work your doing mate, thank you! Also, +100 for your watch!
Thank you! That’s so kind! And I’m really glad you appreciate the watch 😂
Was just about to mention the Shamen, glad you included them too! Big users of the gated sound and guitar-driven synths.
I knew a whole load of engineers who used to refer to using key triggers on the Drawmer as 'Shamen mode'! Did I already make this comment? My brain is addled -- I'm having TH-cam upload problems 😣. So the Shamen records I have use the Drawmers on guitars which makes them sound like a synth -- Move and Mountain is a really good example of this. Is that what you mean by guitar-driven synths? Or were they routing guitars through synth filters? Such huge talent.
@@DistortThePreamp I think in live shows they made use of the Roland GR707 as well. But yeah, as soon as I heard your demos of the drawmers my mind went straight to some of their classic tracks.
Oh that’s interesting. I actually saw them when they were still a band called Alone Again Or support The Associates. Even then they were pretty great.
One of my favorite tutorial videos to date
That’s very kind! There’s amother Drawmer gate video I’m due to make about special tricks, but my production schedule is very backed up… 🙈
Very cool, I'll be cringing a bit now every time I use an LFO for my gated pads! :)
Hahah! Don’t cringe too much - that’s what a lot of people do ;) If I had to make gated pads in the box I would probably use an envelope tool to, rather than a gate plugin. Either that or find a way of drawing in some kind of volume automation. LFO Tool and Shaper Box are pretty good and both let you trigger off a key. Although they don’t sound quite the same as the real thing…
The demo tape sound, wow! That’s the kind of music that defines my generation ❤
That’s so kind! It’s funny because the demo extract was supposed to be an example of the sound not working, but *a lot* of people loved it anyway 😂
Fantastic video. I'm only halfway through so far but I'm loving the way you explain this - which resonates immensely with me as also a lifelong (more like off/on) maker of electronic / synthy pop music, having been enthralled emotionally by those wondrous 80s synth-pop gems. For me, growing up in the early 00s, the first thing like this I had was the "Slicer" effect on my Yamaha DJXII Keyboard - it basically did the slicing right (symmetrical patterns only), but with obnoxious clicks at the start/stop. And then my Roland D2 (MC-505 knock-off) Groovebox also had slicer DSP, and the Korg MicroKorg had the arpeggio with the 8 buttons (representing steps you can turn on/off)....in 2015 ish I returned to trying to make this effect with Logic Pro 9's Sculpture software instrument, it had a "groove delay".
When I recently got the Behringer K2 (Korg MS-20), I started using the drum signal as a CV input controlling the LPF (or alternatively, as the gate trigger) and that got me 90% there, I was loving it. Now, seeing your video, I want to do your method which may be a smidge better.
omg you're right, these Drawmer gates are totally available cheaply online! Not for long...
Bought 2x DS201 (XLR versions) back in 89, they're so useful, even today. The Butterworth key filters are superb for mixing, they can bracket sounds within the mix like nothing else,
- also, I've never had an issue with either unit.
Same can be said for all the Drawmer DL compressors I still have too, and their dynamic noise filter, the DF320. If I want punch I use my dbx units, and I then process the dbx units through a DL241, or 251, to bring back the meat and weight that the dbx process always tends to eat up a little bit.
Those Crimson equalisers are also very underrated, I have a couple of the fully parametric versions, the 3012 ones.
Such an interesting comment! I spoke to Drawmer (the company) before making this video and they confirmed that there were only ever a couple of revisions to the DS201 back in the day which were to do with the unbalanced/balanced connectors, and essentially the unit has been in continuous production since it was introduced with no changes (apart from when components had to be changed because old components were no longer available). I find it hilarious that the only differences between my units are the logo alignment :) As a matter of interest, which dbx compressor(s) do you have? And it’s amazing that you have the 3012 EQ. A producer friend has the Indigo which is like mine only tube instead of solid state and he likes to drive it. As you say, it’s underrated, like a lot of the TLA stuff. I use mine pretty much exclusively for adding 1-2dB of 8k (shelf) when tracking vocals. It’s nothing special, but it does the job fine. Thank you so much for watching, and for commenting!
@@DistortThePreamp Hey there, - regarding the dbx units, my current favourite is the 166A,- I have one earlier model, with the external metal XLR fixing plates, and one second gen, - the second generation sounds slightly cleaner, but that's probably just age more than anything else. I know many knock the lower cost dbx units, but I'm really into heavy Electronica, and for that purpose they are perfect, especially drums, individual or buss. One of my favourite artists/producers is Jack Dangers of *Meat Beat Manifesto,* and I learned in the early 90s that he used an old dbx118 to get a particular drum sound, and it was a sound I really liked, so over the 90s I picked up 2x 118 units myself, - they're essentially the poor mans dbx160vu.
I later heard he had used 166A units on his album *Subliminal Sandwich,* so I had to get a couple. I use all my dbx processors as, essentially, transient shapers, I just really like the process, - but I know many hate it, they find the way they "slam the drums" too much.
I also bought a 1066, probably early 2000s, which I didn't gel with for years, but over the last 10 years or so I've found them quite useful, the trick with the 1066 is to barely let the gain reduction meter show any action, one or two red LEDs showing is all one wants, - the threshold and ratio controls on the dbx1066 really don't appear to follow the markings around each control, so keeping a low Ratio and high Threshold is the only way I've found, personally, to make good use of them, - but set up just right, they can sound very much like the 166A, just a little clearer, - so I now have 2 of them also.
I bought a 166xl, just to see, - absolute rubbish really, - to get the classic dbx action, the compressor needs to work fluidly in *Auto* mode, - the 166xl really craps out in this regard.
so out of what I've got,
1. 166A
2. 118
3. 1066
4. 166xl - avoid at all costs
- but like I mentioned previously, they do suck some of the weight out of the sound, apart from the 118 units, which do, but nowhere near as bad. So, to get the sound I really want out of the 166A and the 1066 units, - I will either follow them with a Drawmer DL compressor, which really thickens the sound back up, or, what is more common, for me, as I tend to work from a top down approach, - I just strap a Drawmer DL251 over the main buss inserts, after an equaliser, and mix into that, while having a 166A, etc set up on a stereo buss drum group, - that way what ever I'm doing with the dbx units within the desk, they're already hitting some of that Drawmer meat, iykwim.
And, as I always say when posting on forums,
- I ain't no professional, just another idiot with enough money to spend on toys that feed my autistic need for sonic manipulation.
love to ALL
Very interesting. I had a 166XL too and it sounded terrible. The only use I ever found for it was to add punch to organ transients and, well, that’s not much of a reason to keep it. I love the dbx sound which as you might know is mainly to do with the fact that the detection circuit works on RMS rather than peak. It surprises me how few people in TH-camLand understand the difference this makes, but it’s really critical to the way they slam drums and pin a vocal. The 1176 is obviously peak, and don’t get me started on the LA-2A. I think I’m going to make an entire video about how the latter is literally destroying vocals because it’s release time of 15s means that the compressor doesn’t reset between lines. So your drop ins are compressed differently. Blah blah blah. ;)
The drawmer made a „Click“ Impulse when opening and sometimes closing which gave the sound an impulse that you couldn’t get from instruments, while new sound
That’s exactly correct - it affects the transient and it’s particularly noticeable on softer sounds :) Reallt appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment. Thanks Murray :)
Great video! New Order! I just picked up a Drawmer Ds201 because of your videos.
Oh that’s amazing! Pretty sure it will hold its value too. Let me know if the pots are scratchy (ie if you get a scratchy sound when you turn them) as that is a very easy fix. I’m going to do at least one more video on the DS201 about special studio effects, but I might also do a fourth specifically about gating guitars! Thank you so much for watching…
@@DistortThePreamp Congrats on a successful video!!! Can't wait for your next one. Just got my Drawmer today. Haven't set it up yet but if it makes a scratchy sound I'll let you know.
This is so great! Sorry my videos are coming out a bit slowly. I’ve literally got a list of the next twenty and I want to be doing about 2 or 3 a week but I’m slightly struggling to do 1 a week at the moment! That’s for the supportive words though.
man this is epic ,this gate is class, so snappy
Now that is the truth! So fast! Crazy to think that they’ve been making them since the 80s without any changes - it’s a very classy product.
@@DistortThePreamp I could have 3 of these i used for drums im really looking forward to trying them on synths, thanks so much for sharing, love the relaxed vibe of your videos. 10/10
Thanks! I’ve got three and I wish I had another three 😂
Your videos are a wealth of knowledge, absolutely spot on!
That’s a very kind thing to say! Thank you!
Bro...that is LEGIT 80's sound. 🔥🔥🔥
Yes. Love the 80s synth pop sound.
It's such a great sound, right!
Seems like this video really took off! There's not enough new wave/post punk synth and production content on TH-cam. Thanks for being here and making videos!
That's a very kind thing to say! I've got a very long production list of videos to make but hopefully I'll be able to get on a regular schedule... Thanks for watching, caring, and commenting :-)
Yeah I’m enjoying the different focus of this channel…trying to see the glass half full and all, but it would be so much more inspiring and useful for my personal taste if more synth geek vids weren’t geared to techno bangers and “atmospheric” stuff! I like those things too, just nice to find some variety 😊
Oh my goodness! You found out what I asked myself for ages! Whot ay naaise video!
Thank you so, so much!!!
This makes me very, very happy! Thank you so much for watching, and for the comment!
been chasing this sound for a minute. happy to have found your video.
Oh that’s amazing! It’s such an emotional sound - precise and organic at the same time. So happy that you enjoyed the video!
You are such a talented story teller 👍
That’s a very kind thing to say! Thank you :)
Great video, story and impressive live demo!
Thank you! I really appreciate this. Don’t think this is a canned response - I’m still quite overwhelmed by the positive responses. The whole channel was started in mid March. It’s all very new.
Another superb video that explains something I’ve always been wondering about! And another fantastic mic decoration 😂
I just wish I could give another thumbs up every time I watch this.
Oh wow, that’s an awesome thing to say! Thank you so much!
Thank you for sharing this great story
Used to use the DS201 for the live stuff when big analogue mixers and racks of outboard was a thing. Was an industry standard on all the rider specs.
Did repair the last of what we had kicking about which got sold on, the FET used for the actual audio attenuation was obsolete but i managed to find some NOS. These where quite a common failure along with the pots wearing out, which again where an oddity but Drammer always had good stock of them.
There were a few classic rack unit's of the time that everyone had in that world.
Oh is the FET now obsolete? Surely Drawmer still use FETs, no? Fascinating if they don’t. At some stage I’ll go up to Sheffield and see if I can get to look around the factory…
@@DistortThePreamp I just had a look into it. Looks like the 2N4091 is the one that gets used today which is available. I remember at the time i had a real problem sourcing replacements as they weren't readily available.
I can't remember off hand what the original spec'd one was. This single fet is what's doing the actual gating of the audio. I think they still might be making them, I've seen like at least 3 different production versions of the 201 where parts changed. If you manage to get a look around the factory that would make a good video if they allow it. I think they probably would be OK with it, they were always a friendly bunch to deal with.
Yes, very friendly :) I contacted them for research before I made the video and they were very helpful. Basically the unit hasn’t changed since it was introduced apart from the balanced/unbalanced thing and substitute componsents when old ones no longer were available. I’m going to Sheffield in the next few weeks and I’m sure they’ll let me drop in :)
@@DistortThePreamp Don't forget your camera :)
Yes! It’s funny to think that if I’d started the channel a year before I did I’m sure I would have been able to interview Ivor Drawmer himself. But the guys I’ve spoken to there have been working there for 30+ years. Proper continuity, proper manufacturing, and proper quality.
“Secret bass” is YamahaTX81Z with the Lately bass patch.
Haha! You win all of the prizes! 🏆 I don’t think it’s left that patch for years 😂 What not so many people know about that patch (unless they’ve got the unit themselves) is how well it responds to velocity. It’s an incredibly articulate sound - soft velocities are full with loads of low end, and harder velocity make it sort of ‘twang’. This is why I never programm it and always play it (albeit into a sequencer). When you see me fiddling about before I take the part I’m not only working out the notes, I’m also testing the right velocity for the song. Really appreciate you watching, and doing the inevitable reveal :)
...or a DX100 playing "Solid Bass"
@@leolovetopartySolid Bass is subtly different from Lately Bass.
@@infindebula interesting. I’ll have to research that. Most people who acquire a DX100, do so 99% for this patch…
Yes it is :)
The intro synth to Visage’s “The Damned Don’t Cry” uses this effect.
Yes it does! I love that record!
It's a bobby dazzler of a sound. The first time I heard gated sounds like that was on Strawberry Switchblade's Another Day (1985 incidently) and it blew my mind. So glad I subbed.
Oh amazing! Do you know ‘Since Yesterday’ also by Strawberry Switcgbkade? The whole track is gated at the end of the middle section. Such a cool sound!
@@DistortThePreamp Yes, It does sound gorgeous and it's on the same album produces by David Motion & Phil Thornally. You're doing a fantastic job keep up the brilliant work.
Verry nice tutorials! Keep up the good work( vibe)!
Thank you very much! That’s very kind :)
getting a drawmer immediately thanks
Bro, what is going on with this channel?
IT'S FRICKING GREAT!
Wow, we live in the best time for information and learning. I'm so glad I came across this. This is gold for anyone getting into synths and hardware. Heck, it's gold for anyone who is in love with understanding how music is/was made.
I'm 50 years old and I absolutely love trying to produce music. Spent more than half of my life playing multiple instruments in bands. Not the best musician but not the worst - I know a few chords. For the last couple years I have been consumed with learning how to mixing music and produce with affordable analog synths. I bought a Soundcraft Signature 22 MTK mixing board... It is slowly changing my life. I also have that Arturia Keystep Pro connected to a bunch of stuff. It's a lot of fun. I could go on and on..... Ha!
Also, I see that Behringer TR3. I have the MonoPoly, RD-8 and the VC340. If I would have never bought that first Behringer synth I would not be on this video right now.
Glad I found this channel! Its really great!
MUSICIANS UNITE, and CREATE!!!!!!!!!!
LETS GO!
Thank you so much for this awesome comment! My main problem is that the videos are taking too long, but hopefully I will be able to solve that soon :) The Soundcraft boards have always been great. You just need the space for it 😂 I often wish I had an RD-8 and will definitely get one. Even when I’m using my Roland R8 I rely on my RD-9 hats but I often really want 808 hats or snare. And samples are *not the same*. Really appreciate you watching and your very, very kind comment which is inspiring :)
Great video. Back in the 90s I had a couple of different Tascam mixers (at different times) which had MIDI mutes on the channels that I used for gating. Although with MIDI being a bit slow, you'd had have to move the trigger sound forward a 1/96th note as to not lose the attack. The Yamaha digital mixers did it really well too with their built in gates. That all said, I'll take your word for it that the Drawmer's the best!
This has been ever so slightly controversial, but I stand by it :) MIDI gates are such a great idea in theory - and I used to use them - but they’re not fast or consistent enough to keep strict time. That’s not necessarily a problem, but it usually is. A few people have been noting that there are “other gates” and of course there are. But those Drawmers are built like tanks, haven’t changed design for 40 years, and are still in production. It’s also the only gate I used to see racked up in ‘proper’ studios. Really appreciate you watching, and for the comment :)
been watching a few of your vids Lately. Bass sounds nice...
Oh fantastic! Do you mean the bass on this video sounds nice? Or that you have been watching some of the videos I did about bass?
omg! im so happy to see someone who is also obsessed with that new order intro sound. when i was a kid, i used to ask my dad, who was also a musician, “what is that sound?”. he said that it was probably an arpeggiator. i wasn’t able to play with an arp til i was in my late teens. tho i loved it, i knew that wasn’t it. it wasn’t until recently i figured it was a gate. thanks for sharing this! although i think the sound being gated isn’t a continuous pad. to me it sounds like a patch that has a bit of sustain and release, coz if you listen to the record, the last bits of the gated sound sort of dies down, sounding a bit like a delay. so i think it’s probably not a continuous pad. just my opinion. 🙂 cheers!
That’s an interesting observation - I’m going to listen forensically. I actually haven’t put this on for years and did it from memory so, although I’m pretty sure the parts or approximately right, I may also have got the rhythm wrong. Before I listen I’m going to double down on my guess that it’s a continuous sound being gated, partly down to Hague’s production methods. Then again, I’m hearing gates everywhere now - when I was playing the background music against my commentary I was turning the blend (range) knob up and down and suddenly heard the Chariots of Fire intro which I’m now convinced was Vangelis playing his CS-80 through a rhythmic gate with a low blend. I can’t be sure, but the sound is very convincing. Really appreciate you watching and your comment very much!
Just listened to it and I’m pretty sure it’s a gate over chords that change every bar, but with a faint quarter note delay. The reason I think it’s a gate is that I think I can hear that the first stab of every bar has a slightly different attack, and the delay is obvious once you listen to it :) Having said that, it sounds quite different to my version and the version in my head. Amusingly I prefer the sound of my gated pads, at least compared to the version on Brotherhood. I will now wash my mouth out with soap and water 🤣
Amazing video! Youre super entertaining!
That’s very kind, thank you! This is a very new channel so I’m still finding my feet, and I really appreciate comments like this 🙏
86 is 38 years ago, thank you very much :P
Hahaha. Quite ;)
Oh l. ok! Math capability!
I really appreciate that you do things by feel and spirit. Like a recreation or homage maybe should be an expression of one's own unique ear and individuality. The Fantasy string's part for example, so exhilarating to hear.
Ohhh, New Order, Bizarre love triangle, lovely!😍😍
Yes! I actually still haven’t checked my version against the original, so apologies if some of the parts aren’t quite right. And I think I’m specifically remembering the Stephen Hague mix from a Factory sampler tape - that’s the version that’s burned into my memory, mainly because of the gated arps. It was so fun to remake that I’m thinking I might do live streams whereby people suggest synthpop songs and I program them up on the fly… what do you think?
@@DistortThePreamp Definitely my friend. Great fun idea.
Appreciate this feedback. I’m getting a lot of really nice comments, but I’m definitely going to be looking for a steer from viewers!
That music sounded new and alive, and it still works now.
I know, right! I It still sounds so fresh 40 years later. Appreciate you watching and the comment.
Software: Logic x - Step FX - just use the Gate - adjust gate shape to taste - use on any instrument
Yea, I feel like it would sound the same honestly.
To be honest it might sound exactly the same once you've dialled it in. But check out the 'noise solo' at 34:35 on the recent 'The Power of Noise' video. This kind of thing isn't for everyone, but it's a little hard to do with plugins. Not that I'm hating on DAWs or plugins -- I'm 100% in the box for mixing and editing. Really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment :)
Liking the style of your videos - can't think of any other channels out there that gives the background, or a back story that explains why a sound was searched for. Keep it up, think you've got a niche here. Quality over quantity - the views will follow.
That’s really kind and a huge vote of confidence, and that’s exactly what I’m trying to do. Really appreciate you watching and the comment :)
Your Dawless setup is fascinating but I'm not sure if I would ever have the patience for it. :) Incidentally, I keep stumbling on videos talking about gating sounds based on percussion. I recently saw the same technique about the Prince song 'Kiss". Hats off for using the NO song as inspiration. No complaints there.
Yes, I know that video and it *really* surprises me as it would have been much easier to gate off a trigger sound that copied the hi-hat rhythm. After all, the hats were programmed on a Linn, right? In my experience although hats have enough attack for a gate trigger the unpredictable decay doesn’t give you enough control when gating. Having said that the Linn hat sound is actually itself a continuous loop with a VCA that opens and closes so now I’m writing this it’s probably fine 😂 You make an interesting point about dawless setups. I’m not recommending them but I certainly work *a lot * faster than I used to when I was programming in the daw. I also like the way that it keeps me in a ‘right brain’ state of mind - I came to believe that working in a daw made me more on an engineer and less of a player/produver. Though who knows 😂 Really appreciate you watching, and the comment…
What's most amazing is the fast arps on the Proteus' awful strings actually sound good 😮
After decades of keeping my Proteus solely as a harsh reminder to never settle for less (once I'd settled and blown my savings on the E-mu, the desired Roland U-220 became unobtainable 😭) I am trying to rehabilitate it and find a few gems. It's actually quite a good match for controlling from my Roland AE-30 wind synth.
Oh I think the Proteus strings are amazing! They’re basically a port of Mercato strings from the Emulator. The trick is to play them like string parts. You’re going to laugh (given your comment) but they were the reason why I got the Proteus. They’re amazing for disco strings too if you play them in the right way!
@@DistortThePreamp I'll have to give them a try for disco strings. I'm currently developing a live jam inspired by classic disco/funk so thanks for the tip! With so many of these sounds it's a task of finding their hidden strengths! 😀
Rather than record them stereo, I tend to record them mono and double them. I know in this video I sequenced them, but I almost always play the strings parts. I mean violinists are nowhere near a grid right!
Good video. The Shamen used this a lot. I was never sure about how they did it but I figured it wasn't chopping the samples - too much effort to be used so much.
That’s exactly right! The used exactly this gate - the Drawmer DS201. The main rhythmic lead sound on Move Any Mountain (that goes x-x-x-xx-xx-x-x-) is actually Will’s guitar through the gate with an external trigger doing the rhythm. The used it so much that engineers used to call using the gate in this way “putting it in Shamen mode” 😂
There are so many ways to do this in a DAW now. All midi, or using midi to control audio, or audio to control audio. And I like to play with track delay just in case it feels like it needs to come forward a bit.
Yes there are. Track delay is a very good trick. The one thing that I find difficult with daws is playing in real time. It’s not quite impossible, but it feels very different. And obviously the more complex the session, the more accumulated latency. So what started as an issue with sound is really mainly an issue with playability. If you programme stuff then this isn’t an issue. But if you want to play in your parts and ‘tune in the gates’ so you are responding to them then for now it’s still a problem. Having said that, when ever I add gates to stuff once I’m in the box and use plugins it does sound different. Not necessarily worse, just different. I think it’s down to the way an analog gates produces distortion when it clamps down on the volume. Who knows. But certainly doing everything inside a daw is legitimate.
@@DistortThePreamp Best thing I've tried for live playing is the arpeggiator/sequencer on the NI FM8. Don't know why it just feels good and can reset when you play new notes etc. Shame you can't tap tempo it outside of a DAW. Maybe you can i'm not sure.
God i miss that decade.
You and me both. Unquestionably the best decade for music.
I still remember when I realized that I could use the gate function 3630 compressor gate to get this... Very funny!
Haha! I sold my 3630 quite recently. It's not nearly as 'dirty' as people make out -- you just need to know how to set it. Unless, of course, you want it to sound 'dirty'. I originally bought mine for about £30 but unfortunately people try to charge a lot more because of the Daft Punk factor.
@Distort the Preamp @2:44 This song is amazing ! Do you have it uploaded on TH-cam ?
Hahaha -- no I'm afraid I don't! It was done in about 1989 and I'm not sure we even own the rights anymore. Maybe one day I'll negotiate to get them back and release a 'lost' album! Really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment :)
@@DistortThePreamp Although I know your goal was to improve upon this genre, it's a fantastic song ! I hope maybe you're able to upload it someday. 🤞 🎶 Fantastic video !
That is such a kind thing to say! Thank you!
Man that demo sounds cool!
This is such an unexpected response! A few people have said the same thing and it wasn’t what I was expecting at all. All I can say is that record companies didn’t agree in 1989 😂 Thanks for watching - really appreciate it :)
Sick video, man.
Thanks! Really appreciate the comment :)
Back in around 1998 I had great success achieving this effect using the built-in gates on the Yamaha ProMix 01.
Oh that's a great bit of kit. One of my theories about analog gear versus plugins is that all the preamps in the chain make a significant difference in aggregate. The ProMix 01 would have sounded great I suspect.
@@DistortThePreamp Well the gates did an awesome job. It was super easy to assign a gate to a channel and assign a different channel as sidechain, then all the controls were there for attack, release, depth. I was too inexperienced to realize how crappy its EQ was though.
Oh brilliant! Lol about the EQ
Oh my gosh, I was taken back to my youth😮. I saved up months, from my meagre earnings, for a Korg ms20 synth. (I went on to update much later with a Juno and a few others), I’ll have to dust of the ms20 for old times sake, my husband will be over the moon with that 😂.Thanks for this slice of wonderful nostalgia🎉
The MS20 is a wonderful synth! Have you still got the Juno and the others?
Your 80s band was 110% legit! Nice!
You can do this using the stock gate in ableton. All the controls you need are there including the few extras the drawmer doesn't have. The hardware is fun though and at £75 I might grab one. Some further experiments you should consider for a part 2 of this video is adding delay and reverb. Try adding reveb before the gate. After the gate. And before and after the gate. use delay after the gate. I learned a lot of these tricks when I coincidentally covered BLT as well. It's on my soundcloud if you want to have a listen.
That’s a great point about reverb before the gate and delay after - that’s exactly what I do (when I do it). Reverb after the gate just gets too mushy and detracts from the rhythm. The only reverb I add to gated pads in the mix is a very short ‘ambience’ (like the old 480L patch) though even that is often too much for my taste. And bouncing dotted 8s delays can sound lovely on the gated sound. One way to have a bit more fun in the box if you’re not using hardware is to split the channel into left and right (in Ableton you’d use a rack), gate each side from the same key trigger, but have ever so slightly different parameters on the gates. You could even rig up a macro to dial in the amount of variation. This after all is what’s happening out of the box because I never even both trying to get the left and right channels the same, and this includes the range which in effect is the blend. Maybe that’s one of the reasons why it feels like it widens the image? Really appreciate your watching and taking time to comment. I’ll check out your SoundCloud…
I was wondering ....the BOSS Slicer pedal allows you to control the duty cycle..... have you ever compared its effect with the Drawmer? And another question I have is: There are probably other noise gate, sidechaining units in the RACK format. What about them? Thank you beforehand.
Interesting question. Let me answer in reverse order. I’ve used a few rack gates over the years including some which were midi-triggerable but in my experience the Drawmer wins simply because it’s so fast and accurate. To give you some context, the Drawmer’s faster attack speed is 10 microseconds (millionths of a second). If you’re running a DAW session at 48kHz then every sample is 20.83 microseconds. So the Drawmer is technically faster than a single sample. For a gate this is hugely important. Midi triggers are basically a non-starter because the protocol is too slow. And the speed and accuracy is why the Drawmer became such a studio standard as soon as it was introduced. It’s so fast that you can even use it to do transient design by seoarating the transient and non-transient audio from, say, a snare. And that’s before you get into the other features the Drawmer has. Not to mention its build quality which is very high. And the final crazy point which is that they’re really not very expensive second hand - you could probably pick one up for less than a new Slicer. So now turning to the Slicer, all I can say is that it looks like a huge amount of fun but I’ve never used one! I wouldnt necessarily trust it to be as super-accurate as the Drawmers but that probably isn’t the point. It looks like a really good way to spark creativity and get new sounds out of an instrument. BTW - I know I sound like I’m shilling for Drawmer, but I genuinely am not aware of any other gate that exceeds the spec.
It's amazing that thing you described where you can try 1000 different ways to do something, every one of them exactly the same on paper, but its just NEVER right! Then when you find the thing you're looking for and you can't describe why it's right, it just is🤦♂️🤣
I think I learned about the technique from Mixmaster Morris talking about his 1992 album Flying High which is extensively based on rhthmic gating of samples. Maybe he got it from The Shamen.
Great album - and yes its all over it! Also tons on the Orbs stuff from that period
That’s entirely possibly. Apparently after Move any Mountain engineers used to talk about putting the Drawmer ‘in Shaman mode’ 😂
Absolutely - Adventures Beyond the Ultraworld etc
Two things spring out at me here. First is the first time I heard the gated synth sound was on Visage's The Damned Don't Cry from 1982 (I was 14).
Second is when I started my career in the electronics industry a couple of years later, it was in printed circuit board manufacture and assembly. One of our regular customers was Drawmer electronics. So I probably made and/or assembled some of the electronics and the circuit boards in those 201s in 1985/86 to 1990. If I'd have known then what I was making (I was a huge synth music fan) I would have probably bought one. All hand assembled and soldered together by hand too.
I absolutely love that record and still play it all the time. I considered using it as the example but it’s not as well known. I didn’t know the Drawmers were assembled by hand but it makes perfect sense - I’ve opened all mine up and the build quality is outstanding! Really appreciate you watching and commenting.
Oh I should have mentioned - don’t know if you’ve watched the latest video about synth bass but that’s (obviously) a photograph of the whole of Visage outside Blitz Club right at the top of the video. So not only Steve Strange but John McGeoch, Rusty Egan, a very young looking Midge Ure, the whole gang…
@@DistortThePreamp Yes, I have watched it. That is what led me on to this video. 🙂
Amazing!
Sounds great! Though having not had hands on one of these myself I do wonder why you can't do it with the built in gate (in Ableton, in my case - it's pretty good in my experience). Mostly just a "I don't have room for more rack gear right now" sort of thought, rather than trying to say anyone is doing things wrong (whatever way gives you the most joy is the right way!).
Edit: I've just tried it, and it does indeed work how I was expecting. I'll give you it doesn't quite have the immediacy of hardware, especially with a patch bay, as I had to: 1. configure my drum machine to send the rimshot channel to a separate output, removing it from the mix output; 2. set up a separate input channel in Ableton from my mixer, with the rimshot channel on it; 3. configure the default gate device for sidechain input set to the channel I just added; 4. play with the settings to make it sound good. Since it's sidechained audio straight from the drum machine which is my master clock, it is perfectly in sync as you might expect.
But once I was done, it did work. Does it sound as good as that hardware? I don't know, your video is my only experience with them. But I can't really tell the difference by my ears...
This is an excellent question and an excellent point. In truth, once you've got the sound it really doesn't sound much different, or maybe not different at all. The same is true for mid-range soft synths that mimic vintage synths with DCOs -- I can't really tell the difference between, say, a Tal-U-No soft synth and the Juno 60. What _is_ different however, as you allude to, is the workflow and the immediacy. I very much enjoy being able to 'throw up sounds' quickly on physical hardware, and that can make a difference in the kind of sounds you get. So with a physical gate like the Drawmer, for example, it's very easy for me to try the hold, try the decay, balance the two, then tune in the range. With plugins this process is a little tricker, but not impossible at all. BTW if you want to experiment, try using an Ableton rack to split the stereo into left and right, rig up a gate on each channel, map the gate controls to macros, but then have an extra macor which changes some of the parameters ever so slightly on one of the channels. I would start with the range, but the hold would be another one. A tiny amount of thise can make a mono sound much wider. So in conclusion, there's really nothing wrong soundwise with processing in the box, and it's a sensible choice. Just FWIW I do all of my editing and mixing 100% in the box. One final note: watch the 'noise solo' at 34:35 on my latest 'The Power of Noise' video where I play the Drawmer like an instrument. The head on shot is live but the side shot is from another take. This is tricky to do with plugins not because plugins don't sound good, but just because of the physicality of throwing knobs and switches around. Really appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment!
@@DistortThePreamp I'm with you! I'm currently watching the noise video...
MIDI mapping parameters to a hardware controller is my usual way around what you say, but yes - while you can get somewhere eventually, just having the knobs in front of you ready to go makes a big difference (one reason I try to have my little studio set up with a default live set with everything mapped, my MIDI router pre-configured, etc).
Oh that’s perfect!
Thanks for sharing this knowledge.
That’s such a nice thing to say! Really appreciate you watching :)
This sounds like a crossover between New Order and OMD❤
Such a huge compliment Colette! I'm a massive OMD fan and will definitely be doing some programming based on early OMD soon... Thanks for watching, and for the awesome comment!
all I can say it’s brilliant!
That's *really* kind! I've been slightly overwhelmed by all the comments, but I'm working hard to produce more content... :-)
The perfect Pet Shop Boys sound! 👍
By the way... The Damned Don't Cry... 😉
Absolutely The Damned Don’t Cry! I thought that was too obscure to mention but it’s an excellent example. Once you know the Drawmer character you can even hear that it’s specifically a Drawmer gate because there’s a slight thump to the transient which for some reason I don’t hear with plugin gates. Go figure.
In the eighties it was such a creative period in U.K. music scene . Where has all that creativity gone , I wonder.
Oh my god, i want a copy of your 80s demo!!! 😍 Your gated sound was its own thing, and the problem about the 80s vs now is that there's a wider range of appreciation of sounds that aren't 100% what they set out to be. I heard emotions in your demo. It was coming from a different direction. It almost trailblazing in that there was a hint of later indie rock
That’s extremely kind! I think the rights to the recordings were owned by somebody else but I’ve considered doing a remake ever since I found the demo tape a couple of years ago. There’s a funny story about a house that I used to own in a famous university town, a bass player in a world famous rock band, and a carrier bag that eventually showed up 20 years later with this demo tape. I literally had to buy a cassette deck and use Izotope RX to recover the audio. At the time I think we made the gated guitar sound using a Yamaha FX500 multi-effects unit and triggering the gate via midi. It wasn’t perfect, and it wasn’t quite the sound we were going for, but it was definitely a mood. Ah, if only we’d had the internet… Really appreciate your kind words, and thank you for watching!
You're so welcome..I have done the exact same process with my cassette demos. And what a wonderful story you shared. I was in the Bay area at the same time, but everything you said there brought me back to that era having musical adventures as such. Only yours sounded more larger scale..but still..man. what a time to have been alive in
So true, so true
When you started talking about you history in music, i was waiting for a daft punk song to come on at any moment, but it mever did... it never did...😂
Hahaha! That should be in a video I’ve got planned about oscillator sync sounds and aggressive buss compression 🤣 Hopefully the New Order track wasn’t too much of a let down ;)
Cool stuff!! Thanks for sharing
Thanks Brian! Appreciate you watching, and the comment :)
Hey! Fabulous and inspiring post... Could it be possible re-edit the audio track by lowering the background sequence? There are times when you are barelly heard.
Sorry about that :( Can't re-do the video but I promise to do better next time. This is a very new channel and TBH I don't really know what I'm doing yet. I'll also upload a corrected captions file so at least you'll be able to read what I'm saying! Thanks for watching and commenting -- really appreciate it!
i like your approach! i've been using a boss slicer pedal but all the presets can be really overwhelming and easy to forget which one does what if i don't write it down or take a pic on my phone
That’s interesting to hear. A lot of people think that the Boss Slicer is easier - it’s certainly easier to carry! - but I can believe that it’s a bit overwhelming…
any suggestions on similar devices when a dawmer isn't available?
Absolutely. Depends if you want hardware or plugins. For hardware which is best for real time playing (because there’s no latency) you could have a look at the Boss Slicer Pedal. It’s a slightly different effect but a great vibe. Plus, remember that most hardware including pedals keep their value more than plugins. In terms of plugins for in the box work, of course you can rig up a stock gate and send a trigger to it, but for more fun I’m a fan of the Gatekeeper Plugin which was done by the Infected Mushroom guys. Other plugins like LFO Tool and ShaperBox (both of which I own) do an excellent job of gating from a trigger, but Gatekeeper is a lot of fun and you can pretty much page through presets till you find something you like and then build a track around that rhythm. It’s not like the 80s thing, but it’s pretty creative and inspiration is probably more important than authenticity!
I'd also love to see some details of your Pyramid project for this song.
Oh excellent! It was done from scratch although I used a template so I had tracks pre-mapped to the synths I was going to use, though *all* of the programming was done in real time! I’ve been considering making some deeper videos just about the Pyramid, but I wasn’t sure if anyone would be interested! Really appreciate you watching, and the comment!
Also, I should say that the way I programme the Pyramid for these speedruns is a little different to the way I programme it for actual productions because in those I use Track patterns. Those are a little more complicated and slightly slower and less fluid. But happy to show you both if you would like :)
I love rhythmic synth patches.
I know, right! Totally hypnotic!
tip for Cubase users: you can do this with the "Midi Gate" Plugin - you can trigger Midi notes live to gate and stuttering the audio track!
Awesome video as always! I'm wondering that does the Drawmer DS 201 have some 'magic' in it, that I can't achieve with plugins like the Shaperbox volume shaper? I'm just asking because I'm working almost entirely out of the box, but for example the rhythmic pads I'm doing in software. Does it worth to go out of the box and get a Drawmer for this duty?
Thank you! Just before I give you a very long and definitive answer 😂 can I just check your process… you work mainly outside the box but then track into the box for editing and mixing? Assuming that answer is yes, then when you track in are you using your DAW clock to generate, say, drum sounds from drum machines? Or are you pressing play on a drum machine or hardware sequencer and tracking ‘free’? I should also ask what DAW you’re using as, believe it or not, it makes a different to the answer..
@@DistortThePreamp thanks for the reply! :) All my sound sources are coming from hardware, old 80s and early 90s stuff, that I record into the daw, which is Ableton. Mainly playing/writing midi, and then sending it out to the synths for recording. The drums are also written in midi, and sent out to stuff like the E-Mu procussion or the Korg DDD-5. For creative effects I also use old racks and pedals, as send effects, sometimes inserts, but all the mixing duties (eq/compression) are done in Ableton with plugins. I’m making ‘tropical synthpop’ so rythmic synths are essential, but I don’t know if it worth to bring it out of Ableton or no… I really like the shaperbox plugin, but maybe the Drawmer adds something extra?
@@DistortThePreamp I don't want to hurry you, but I'm really interested in your insight on the matter about does it worth for me to get a DS 201 or no? :) (the answers for your questions are in my previous reply)
Sorry for the delay! Yes, I think you would have fun with a DS201. Assuming you buy it for a sensible price second hand, then it’s not really a risk if it doesn’t work out. The main think you would use it for (obviously) is creative gating. There are a few tricks to integrating this into a hybrids setup like yours (and mine) but the main thing I would ALWAYS do is to make sure you record the trigger/pulse track on a separate track in your DAW. This means that you will always be able to do endless overdubs where you re-trigger the gates at exactly the same time. This is particularly critical if your drum machines aren’t perfectly on the grid. I know mine aren’t and I prefer to leave them that way. If you get one and you get really stuck then reach out to me and I’m sure I’ll be able to help :)
In my experience the Drawmer is a lot more fun, inspiring, and musical than using an envelope plugin like ShaperBox or LFOtool. I have both of those (as well as the FabFilter Pro-G) and I use them when mixing for kick duxking, but not for gating. Hands on feels a lot better, and there’s some ‘magic’ that the Drawmer seems to add to the transient.
@@DistortThePreamp this is awesome, thanks a lot for these insights, it was really helpful!!
Cracking job
Very much appreciated!
Your channel is really inspiring. ❤
The hardware gates sound awesome: musical and punchy. I think plugins can't achieve that. At least I don't know any with such quality.
As you are a big fan of gates, as me, I recommend Ken Hiwatt Marshall's video about Radio-Gator. He is an audio engineer and works a lot for Skinny Puppy. He also makes heavy use of creative gating-techniques. Maybe you can draw something out of it. Enjoy. 🎉