I think this is my favorite video thus far. I grew up in reenacting believing that I needed all of this extra junk in my haversack. Thank you for the videos and the inspiration to do better!
True, it’s a different matter to just pack a daily serving of raw food and cook in the woods once or twice than to live many days with what you carry with you. Thanks for the videos!
I remember reading somewhere (Not entirely sure where precisely, though I think it was actually the Peninsular Wars or Crimean War as opposed to the Civil War), that some soldiers would put whatever hardtack they could not carry in their haversack, bundled it in another pokesack/in some paper, and actually carried it on their head in their forage cap. I'd reckon that might be awkward/uncomfortable
Love your videos. Especially things that pertain to soldiery. One question though and probably just an oversight... Why didn't you put a loaded poke sack into the cup then into the haversack? It wouldn't take up much more room and you'd still have easy access to it at camp for the night if you had ditched the knapsack during combat.
That is a great tip! Will often puts his cup hanging off his pack. With he size of the cup and handle it doesn't fit well in a full haversack. I do tend to put a sack in my boiler inside my haversack. Usually rice, coffee, or sugar so if it spills it might be contained in the boiler! Jeremy
Really good video! what type of haversack is that and where did you get it?, it is really nice. Also where do you get the sanitary commission poke sack? Thank you for providing such a great resource
About how much salt pork is that? And I’m assuming that it was boiled just by your preference and that if could have been cooked by any method and then placed in the poke sack. Am I correct in that?
I hope your still answering questions. Is that haversack proper size? I've seen bigger ones. I have a White cotton haversack that I applied Linseed oil too. A very good way to water proof canvas.
This one was made by a highly recommended vendor. It is pulled from an original. Do you know where the ones you have seen were made from and what example they were based off of? That is usually a good guideline to work with. Of course, over the millions issued, some sizes varied a little bit. Hope this helps!
@Paul Revere Only if it is still "wet" Mine has dried completely and will not burn. I've tested it. Now the "Tarred" Haversack those will melt in hot sun.
Soldiers used what they were issued or could pick up. The haversack was gvt property and they were issued one. It seems rather rare, given that, that you’d see a soldier carrying two.
I tried making some orignal Hard Tack and form what some Civil War Veterans say I did it right Hard as a Brickbat! Both My Dad's Grandfathers fought 1 for the Union 1 for the South
I would advise against wearing you cup hanging from your haversack , been to several events where a fellow in camp after a hard day drank from a cup that had been in contact with poison ivy or poison oak , not a pretty sight and the end of your event , just saying , take care Mike HOGG MESS
The ingredients were very simple but the process was somewhat different. Connect with us through our website on the contact us page and request a copy of the video we have on hard tack production. Happy to send it to you for free!
*LIKED* another fine video... I was issued rations this weekend and the most notable difference was the sanitation of the environments - out on the filed its a lot more difficult to keep everything clean. --- *1st Minn Sharpshooters* channel with Civil War reenactor live fire, hard marching, and rustic adventures ... enlist today.
So as I'm re watching these videos on how to better use my own haversack. The sanitary polk sack you put the pork in, would that have been something they would have had back then; or is this a modern idea by the man you mentioned to keep the food safe and you from getting sick from cross contamination?
They are not sanitary coccyx. They are poke sacks that were made by the united states sanitary commission and the United States Christian commission. The pattern comes out of Civil War era sources. They certainly would have been there, for at least some of the soldiers.
Hi Collin, The poke sack seen in the video is made from a pattern seen in a US Sanitary commission bulletin. The pattern specifies the materials and dimensions of it, and would have been made by volunteers to be distributed among the army, much as there were patterns for US Sanitary Commission socks to be made by for distribution. During the war many towns took great pride in the amount of items they provided the USSC for distribution to soldiers.
+Thaddeus Hogwood good question! We had an account shared with us yesterday on our Facebook page by Charles Brewer. The book is "When this Cruel War is Over." He wrote specifically, 20 miles from Richmond, Sunday May 18th 1862........Dear Mary.......I am writing in what you would consider a very uncomfortable position, lying flat on my side, with my woolen blankets folded up for a table to write on. This comprises my furniture. My pantry is an enamelled cloth bag, or rather a double bag, and it's contents just now are two pounds of sugar, one half pound of coffee, one tablespoon full of salt and half a dozen hard crackers, 3 papers of tobacco, half dozen envelopes, 1 dozen sheets of paper, one ink stand, one pen + holder, two woolen night caps (made by my sister Mary) one rubber O coat, 1 opera or field spy glass (to spy out rebels when on picket) and one pair cork soles. This pantry is provided with a strap which goes over my shoulder and suspends the whole institution at my right side, when on the march the military name for this concern is Haversack and it has caused my poor shoulder many an ache, and will cause it many more. This comprises my whole outfit of housekeeping except, a tin cup of one quart capacity, which I buckle on to the Haversack when on the march. From the letters of Charles Harvey Brewster "When This Cruel War Is Over"
+Civil War Digital Digest - I share this because it was the first time I've seen an account of where the cup was actually put. Thanks to Bob Bartlett for sharing it. I'm buying the book! - Will
+Thaddeus Hogwood inside or outside would be okay, personal preference. Outside it can clang around and get dirt in it. Of course, a full haversack and you may not have another choice.
Civil War Digital Digest would love to see an episode on writing materials and customs. I hear that many soldiers Carrie writing materials and often wrote letters hom. What did they use, and what did this look like?
I took a few inches of old canteen strap and sewed a button on one end, and a button hole on the other, and use it to hook the cup to my haversack strap outside the bag. I used to attach it to the leather bucle strap but it started to tear it away from the haversack.
That seems like a lot of hardtack, would that be the normal amount to be issued all at one time? I also see some comments requesting a video on hats, I think that would make for a great video. Great video as always
In this example, it's a three-day ration size; it was not uncommon at the time to be given multiple days rations at once, especially if it was an army on the move. One day's ration was about 10 pieces.
Anna Angelo Yes, I do still sell the USSC poke sacks. They are available under the personal items category at www.wyattreproductions.com . Thank you for your interest!
+B .Wheatley given the use the survival rate would be very low. I would not dare to make assumption on that for how common. I do think they are probably over represented in reenacting in comparison to the real soldiers. Scraps of fabric, sacks of various types, paper, and nothing was used. As reenactors we can't get past just tossing a piece of meat into the haversack with nothing around it for various reasons. No doubt the real men had little choice many times.
Questions for you on this video about haversacks:1. Why use the commissary bag for the salt pork?2. Other than making hard tack yourself, is there a source to purchase? I had hear the original company was still around and made it?3. I have read some accounts where the hard tack was broken into pieces - could that be a different way to carry the ration and put into a poke bag?4. The writing desk you have - does it roll out and make a flat surface to write on?
1. Help contain the meat juice from getting all over everything else. 2. Bents is now out of business from hardtack last I heard. It was one of the original suppliers and the previous owner was keeping it going. Due to machine issues and new owners that stopped. There are some home makers out there that sell. 3. Always enjoy reading new sources. I have not read that but can see getting the bottom of a crate and toss those in a sack if the solider had one. 4. Yes, there is a piece of wood to give it support to write on. Thanks for watching - Jeremy
Quite often, the hardtack gets broken up just from carrying it, and leaning or falling against the haversack. As pointed out, haversacks can be rather messy after you've had it for a while. I once left a potato in mine over the winter without realizing it was there. Come spring, I looked in it, and the bottom was moving. Yep.....maggots. Took a while to get it cleaned out. The bread bag was a total loss.
Because the Sanitary commision bag is tarred, and gives everything else some protection form the meat. Hard tack is really easy to make. www.shadowlandstudios.com/2nd_US_Cav/Instructions/Hardtack_Recipe.pdf
Common misconception. Per the regulation, it is this. I have seen where cracker boxes were left open for men to grab what they want in diaries. I have also seen where there wasn’t enough and they were issued by piece per man. This is from the regulation, and this is where it starts from. Then we dive into primary source documents as far as what was actually done in the field.
Hello, Yes there are many ways for women to be involved in reenacting (coming from a female that is a reenactor). You can find a unit near you. Many women portray an aspect of civilian life they find interesting: a wife, teacher, laundress, nurse etc.
You can be a camp follower, camp cook, wife who came along on the campaign, and a host of other things. And since there were sometimes women who disguised themselves as men and actually fought in battles, that's an option too, though I don't know if the purists would like it.
I am hoping you are still answering questions. How big is that Haversack? I have the white cotton canvas version and it seems smaller. Mine is 10x12x3 inches, it seems kind of small to me. Nice video by the way. I was at Shiloh for the 150th anniversary. Since my Great Great Grandfather fought there, and survived. I even have a full uniform.
always laugh at people keeping things other than food or basic cooking/eating implements in a haversack. its for food, thats it. i use mine for bushcraft, and its simply used to carry my food and silverware.
Behavior like this is part of why it's so hard to get new recruits. Instead of practicing drill for a half hour, we're trying to convince Howie History Buff that we're not going to mock and torment him for being new.
civil war soldiers put personal items in there haversack all the time...it was standard practice!!..anyone who says other wise hasn't done enough research
Yes, but nothing was as important as food. Nothing. There was always another place to put personal items, but rarely any other easy way to carry food. Like anyone, soldiers experimented, and a personal item in a haversack seemed to be done when that item was used constantly, which you could do if you carried it in a blanket roll or pack. The haversack was first and foremost a food bag, not just in America, but around the world, and stayed this way until well after WWII. And convenient pouch will have an item or three of personal gear, or military gear it it, but this doesn't change the fact that it was a food bag, and food came first. If a soldier had enough food to completely fill the bag, the personal items went somewhere else until he ate enough room in the bag to store something else in it.
Modern backpacker here... It is amazing and revolting what our servicemen had to go thru in days gone by. Thanks, veterans. Of all eras.
"Fire at Will!" Finally I know who they are talking about.
Lol,ha,ha, oh my gosh,, poor fellow.
Lol
I just say to shoot all of them, we'll get to Will eventually.
What’d Will do to them?
You sir just got yourself another subscriber. I am a beginner to reenacting and I'm trying to learn as much as possible. Thank you!! God speed. ❤️
Welcome to the hobby and thank you for the kind words! Hope you find a lot here!
I’m going to start reenacting after the pandemic
I think this is my favorite video thus far. I grew up in reenacting believing that I needed all of this extra junk in my haversack. Thank you for the videos and the inspiration to do better!
+Michael Shafto thank you for watching and sharing with friends.
Yep, never have I ever been able to carry a full load of three days hard tack in my bag along with all the other bits!
That's when after the crowd goes home, you send out some foragers to Mr. Mc"D's" for fresh meat and cheese!
Thank you, Will. This is where the wheat falls from the chaff.
+BocageTiger You are very welcome. We can all learn, improve and enjoy! Will
This has become one of my new favorite channels
Thank you! Glad you found us!!
True, it’s a different matter to just pack a daily serving of raw food and cook in the woods once or twice than to live many days with what you carry with you. Thanks for the videos!
Another informative episode, thank you for bringing this great history and living history to us!
+thebeautyandageek.com thank you for watching!
Another great episode keep up the fantastic work.
+WeVikings thank you!
The best place for the writing kit is in a package you mail home after you break winter quarters.
I remember reading somewhere (Not entirely sure where precisely, though I think it was actually the Peninsular Wars or Crimean War as opposed to the Civil War), that some soldiers would put whatever hardtack they could not carry in their haversack, bundled it in another pokesack/in some paper, and actually carried it on their head in their forage cap. I'd reckon that might be awkward/uncomfortable
Love your videos. Especially things that pertain to soldiery. One question though and probably just an oversight... Why didn't you put a loaded poke sack into the cup then into the haversack? It wouldn't take up much more room and you'd still have easy access to it at camp for the night if you had ditched the knapsack during combat.
That is a great tip! Will often puts his cup hanging off his pack. With he size of the cup and handle it doesn't fit well in a full haversack. I do tend to put a sack in my boiler inside my haversack. Usually rice, coffee, or sugar so if it spills it might be contained in the boiler! Jeremy
Another fine video!
Great video!
+boone674 thank you!!
Excellent!!!
Yes another video yay
Another great vid...Huzzah!
Really good video! what type of haversack is that and where did you get it?, it is really nice. Also where do you get the sanitary commission poke sack? Thank you for providing such a great resource
Hi Scott, the USSC Poke sack seen in the video is available for purchase here: www.wyattreproductions.com/product-p/001.htm
About how much salt pork is that? And I’m assuming that it was boiled just by your preference and that if could have been cooked by any method and then placed in the poke sack. Am I correct in that?
That is about 2.25 lbs - three day's rations. You are right, it would be cooked by any means available - boil, fry, roast all are good options. Will
Civil War Digital Digest awesome! Thank you for the quick reply!
I hope your still answering questions. Is that haversack proper size? I've seen bigger ones. I have a White cotton haversack that I applied Linseed oil too. A very good way to water proof canvas.
This one was made by a highly recommended vendor. It is pulled from an original. Do you know where the ones you have seen were made from and what example they were based off of? That is usually a good guideline to work with. Of course, over the millions issued, some sizes varied a little bit. Hope this helps!
@Paul Revere Only if it is still "wet" Mine has dried completely and will not burn. I've tested it. Now the "Tarred" Haversack those will melt in hot sun.
Were the sanitary commission poke sacks used for flour or cornmeal as well? Or just meat
Since they were a gift of the commission to a soldier, I have to believe the soldier put whatever he needed into it.
I usually attach my canteen half to the outside of my canteen via string
I used to. However, I have yet to see it in a photo so I stopped. Will
What were the regs about another or bigger haversack?
Soldiers used what they were issued or could pick up. The haversack was gvt property and they were issued one. It seems rather rare, given that, that you’d see a soldier carrying two.
It's been years, but who are the go-to sutlers for gear now?
That really depends on which piece of gear specifically you were talking about. There are a lot of good vendors and each have their strength.
I agree do an episode on hats!!!!
Gary Turner an episode on hats would be priceless, to many reenactors are doing it wrong
I tried making some orignal Hard Tack and form what some Civil War Veterans say I did it right Hard as a Brickbat!
Both My Dad's Grandfathers fought
1 for the Union 1 for the South
Hard as a poplar chip!
I would advise against wearing you cup hanging from your haversack , been to several events where a fellow in camp after a hard day drank from a cup that had been in contact with poison ivy or poison oak , not a pretty sight and the end of your event , just saying , take care Mike HOGG MESS
were haversacks ever made using webbing for a strap , like the stuff from FHW , thanks , Mike
I’m honestly not sure. Sorry!
@@CivilWarDigitalDigest i did find a picture of one , the haversack of Michael B. Herring Co.B 50th N.C. infantry , died 1/31/65
so , found a picture of another one using a web strap ; the " Co.F 10th Virginia Infantry haversack , Muhlenberg Rifles"
Well, were those crackers like the crackers we can get today only larger, or were they made with more ingredients in them for a more sustainable diet?
The ingredients were very simple but the process was somewhat different. Connect with us through our website on the contact us page and request a copy of the video we have on hard tack production. Happy to send it to you for free!
So I read some where some guys would crush some of the hard tack as soon as it was issued
So did the men typically boil the salt pork ration before packing it away? I'm assuming they typically had to eat that within a few days of doing so.
They would boil it, fry it, roast it or maybe even just have to consume it raw at times.
*LIKED* another fine video... I was issued rations this weekend and the most notable difference was the sanitation of the environments - out on the filed its a lot more difficult to keep everything clean. --- *1st Minn Sharpshooters* channel with Civil War reenactor live fire, hard marching, and rustic adventures ... enlist today.
So as I'm re watching these videos on how to better use my own haversack. The sanitary polk sack you put the pork in, would that have been something they would have had back then; or is this a modern idea by the man you mentioned to keep the food safe and you from getting sick from cross contamination?
They are not sanitary coccyx. They are poke sacks that were made by the united states sanitary commission and the United States Christian commission. The pattern comes out of Civil War era sources. They certainly would have been there, for at least some of the soldiers.
ya that would be cool please do a episode about hats
Where can I get this bag
This one isn’t sold any more but email the contact form on our website and I can share a few good options.
What is a "Sanitary Commission" poke sack? I've never heard of that.
Hi Collin,
The poke sack seen in the video is made from a pattern seen in a US Sanitary commission bulletin. The pattern specifies the materials and dimensions of it, and would have been made by volunteers to be distributed among the army, much as there were patterns for US Sanitary Commission socks to be made by for distribution. During the war many towns took great pride in the amount of items they provided the USSC for distribution to soldiers.
South Union Mills makes the CC poke sack.
Michael Decker Are these available for purchase? They look great!
Derrick Lindow they are available under the personal items section at www.wyattreproductions.com Thanks!
Michael Decker Thank you! I'll be ordering one once they are in stock!
Did you put all the stuff in the white bag part or did you put it outside the white lining.
In this case, I put the food in the white bag and the other items below or behind it. Will
I do the same thing
Would attaching the tin cup to the haversack via the strap be a reenactorism? I don't have a knapsack yet, but want to do things the right way.
+Thaddeus Hogwood good question! We had an account shared with us yesterday on our Facebook page by Charles Brewer. The book is "When this Cruel War is Over." He wrote specifically,
20 miles from Richmond, Sunday May 18th 1862........Dear Mary.......I am writing in what you would consider a very uncomfortable position, lying flat on my side, with my woolen blankets folded up for a table to write on. This comprises my furniture. My pantry is an enamelled cloth bag, or rather a double bag, and it's contents just now are two pounds of sugar, one half pound of coffee, one tablespoon full of salt and half a dozen hard crackers, 3 papers of tobacco, half dozen envelopes, 1 dozen sheets of paper, one ink stand, one pen + holder, two woolen night caps (made by my sister Mary) one rubber O coat, 1 opera or field spy glass (to spy out rebels when on picket) and one pair cork soles. This pantry is provided with a strap which goes over my shoulder and suspends the whole institution at my right side, when on the march the military name for this concern is Haversack and it has caused my poor shoulder many an ache, and will cause it many more. This comprises my whole outfit of housekeeping except, a tin cup of one quart capacity, which I buckle on to the Haversack when on the march. From the letters of Charles Harvey Brewster "When This Cruel War Is Over"
+Civil War Digital Digest - I share this because it was the first time I've seen an account of where the cup was actually put. Thanks to Bob Bartlett for sharing it. I'm buying the book! - Will
+Thaddeus Hogwood inside or outside would be okay, personal preference. Outside it can clang around and get dirt in it. Of course, a full haversack and you may not have another choice.
Civil War Digital Digest would love to see an episode on writing materials and customs. I hear that many soldiers Carrie writing materials and often wrote letters hom. What did they use, and what did this look like?
Where do you like to put your tin cup?I personally like to put it outside of my Haversack.
I took a few inches of old canteen strap and sewed a button on one end, and a button hole on the other, and use it to hook the cup to my haversack strap outside the bag. I used to attach it to the leather bucle strap but it started to tear it away from the haversack.
That seems like a lot of hardtack, would that be the normal amount to be issued all at one time? I also see some comments requesting a video on hats, I think that would make for a great video. Great video as always
Wow, I never realized the hardtack ration was so large
In this example, it's a three-day ration size; it was not uncommon at the time to be given multiple days rations at once, especially if it was an army on the move. One day's ration was about 10 pieces.
Where can I purchase a haversack
Wal-Mart
can you post the information about Michael Decker? I wanna get some poke sacks for rations
+Ian Melendez he has posted in the comments here. Look on this list.
Does Michael Decker sell those poke sacks?
Anna Angelo Yes, I do still sell the USSC poke sacks. They are available under the personal items category at www.wyattreproductions.com . Thank you for your interest!
What reenactment group are you a part of? Looking for a hardcore Federal or Confederate group in Michigan.
Where did you get your haversack
S&S Sutler in Gettysburg.
Who made your forage cap?
+Doug Davis that was made by Greg Starbuck. Will
Cool. I'm in the market for one. Thanks!
Oh shit I know Tom! Small world
Food and mess gear. And a pencil. 😆
Solid list!
@@CivilWarDigitalDigest Oops! Just checked it. My tobacco pouch is in there too 😅
Liked your episode here. Can't wait for my haversack smells so hardcore as the source wrote about. First Rate.
What is that on his back? 0:42
Double-bag knapsack. Early version of a backpack.
@@captainpanda5533 why don’t we use that? Oh wait we do lol
is that regular sugar or is it like brown sugar or something?
+Matthew Schott if I recall it was raw sugar which had a tan color to it.
Civil War Digital Digest thank you for the info love this channel it is very informative.
how common do you really think poke sacks were? I tend to think they are kind of overdone.
+B .Wheatley given the use the survival rate would be very low. I would not dare to make assumption on that for how common. I do think they are probably over represented in reenacting in comparison to the real soldiers. Scraps of fabric, sacks of various types, paper, and nothing was used. As reenactors we can't get past just tossing a piece of meat into the haversack with nothing around it for various reasons. No doubt the real men had little choice many times.
Questions for you on this video about haversacks:1. Why use the commissary bag for the salt pork?2. Other than making hard tack yourself, is there a source to purchase? I had hear the original company was still around and made it?3. I have read some accounts where the hard tack was broken into pieces - could that be a different way to carry the ration and put into a poke bag?4. The writing desk you have - does it roll out and make a flat surface to write on?
1. Help contain the meat juice from getting all over everything else.
2. Bents is now out of business from hardtack last I heard. It was one of the original suppliers and the previous owner was keeping it going. Due to machine issues and new owners that stopped. There are some home makers out there that sell.
3. Always enjoy reading new sources. I have not read that but can see getting the bottom of a crate and toss those in a sack if the solider had one.
4. Yes, there is a piece of wood to give it support to write on.
Thanks for watching - Jeremy
Quite often, the hardtack gets broken up just from carrying it, and leaning or falling against the haversack.
As pointed out, haversacks can be rather messy after you've had it for a while.
I once left a potato in mine over the winter without realizing it was there.
Come spring, I looked in it, and the bottom was moving. Yep.....maggots. Took a while to get it cleaned out. The bread bag was a total loss.
Because the Sanitary commision bag is tarred, and gives everything else some protection form the meat.
Hard tack is really easy to make. www.shadowlandstudios.com/2nd_US_Cav/Instructions/Hardtack_Recipe.pdf
Weren't they issued 3 hard tacks per meal total 9 per day
Common misconception. Per the regulation, it is this. I have seen where cracker boxes were left open for men to grab what they want in diaries. I have also seen where there wasn’t enough and they were issued by piece per man. This is from the regulation, and this is where it starts from. Then we dive into primary source documents as far as what was actually done in the field.
I love your episodes keep making. I was also wondering if a female could do Civil War reenactment because Love American Civil War.
Hello, Yes there are many ways for women to be involved in reenacting (coming from a female that is a reenactor). You can find a unit near you. Many women portray an aspect of civilian life they find interesting: a wife, teacher, laundress, nurse etc.
Thank you
You can be a camp follower, camp cook, wife who came along on the campaign, and a host of other things. And since there were sometimes women who disguised themselves as men and actually fought in battles, that's an option too, though I don't know if the purists would like it.
I am hoping you are still answering questions. How big is that Haversack? I have the white cotton canvas version and it seems smaller. Mine is 10x12x3 inches, it seems kind of small to me. Nice video by the way. I was at Shiloh for the 150th anniversary. Since my Great Great Grandfather fought there, and survived. I even have a full uniform.
Original haversacks varied in size. But are around 11x12 to 13x13 and many other variations. Great to have those items! Jeremy
always laugh at people keeping things other than food or basic cooking/eating implements in a haversack. its for food, thats it. i use mine for bushcraft, and its simply used to carry my food and silverware.
Behavior like this is part of why it's so hard to get new recruits. Instead of practicing drill for a half hour, we're trying to convince Howie History Buff that we're not going to mock and torment him for being new.
civil war soldiers put personal items in there haversack all the time...it was standard practice!!..anyone who says other wise hasn't done enough research
Yes, but nothing was as important as food. Nothing. There was always another place to put personal items, but rarely any other easy way to carry food. Like anyone, soldiers experimented, and a personal item in a haversack seemed to be done when that item was used constantly, which you could do if you carried it in a blanket roll or pack.
The haversack was first and foremost a food bag, not just in America, but around the world, and stayed this way until well after WWII. And convenient pouch will have an item or three of personal gear, or military gear it it, but this doesn't change the fact that it was a food bag, and food came first. If a soldier had enough food to completely fill the bag, the personal items went somewhere else until he ate enough room in the bag to store something else in it.
James Ritchie agreed
Not if you don't want those personal items to get covered in grease and food.
Looks like the poor bastards was handeling the same problem soldiers handle now; to little space in their backpacks.
What did the confederate soldiers get?
*
We will work on that? Will
Parched corn was common
Any grits maybe, rice I know.
Obviously we're bigger on average now and are much better fed now, but still, to think that was supposed to last you 3 days...
Obviously not a womans handbag.
Not at all! Lol
Unbelievable they can live off of that meager diet. I wonder they were sick all the time