What Is A Battle Card? Magic the Gathering's New Card Type In March Of The Machine
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ก.ย. 2024
- We've got a bombshell today, the first new Magic: the Gathering card type in a very long time! I go over the very first Battle card in Magic: the Gathering history from March of the Machine, and break down what it is and how it works!
#MagicTheGathering #MTG #MTGMOM
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Please note that this card was previewed a few days earlier that it was supposed to be, so we haven't officially heard from WotC how this exactly this mechanic is going to work. This is just my first reaction, but feel free to chime in to how you think it is going to work!
Do you think we could bolt it to get it to transform? or must be attack
after mtg touched base with tag team cards (similar to pokemon)... they now dip into similarities to weiss xd
I think the opponent would search for the lands. Unless protection isnt like “control”.
It saying "...cast it transformed" seems really interesting to me. I don't know the rules well enough to fully understand the implications of that, and it's always possible Battle cards have their own unique rules when it comes to what this triggers and what it doesn't. I'd imagine that at the very least it allows for the back face of the card to be an Instant or Sorcery or something. I'm also really interested in the fact that this has the Subtype of Siege, which sort of implies there are other kinds of Battles that aren't Sieges. It'll be interesting to see what else comes out about Battles tomorrow at the Debut show.
Casting transformed is already supported thanks to Disturb.
I think the biggest thing to note is that it can be countered
Disturbing isn't casting though. 2 painful bond triggers on one cards?
*702.146a* Disturb is an ability found on the front face of some transforming double-faced cards (see rule 712, “Double-Faced Cards”). “Disturb [cost]” means “You may cast this card transformed from your graveyard by paying [cost] rather than its mana cost.” See rule 712.4b.
@Scarlet you might be confusing the wording on this first part of maros spoilers.
• “Whenever a permanent you control transforms or a permanent enters the battlefield under your control transformed,”
• “If the opponent protects it, remove a defense counter from it.”
Crazy thing about this to me is the creature is a land. So many cards saying “target non land permanent”.
It's Ashaya all over again
It's a "Creature - Elemental", not a land.
@@arnisteingrimursteinunnars4489 "Awakened Skyclave is a land in addition to it's other types."
Rules text
So many cards saying target creature :v
@@chasington5102 Addition. Any creature destroying effect gets rid of it. If anything is more vulnerable than a regular creature.
I love it when they are willing to take risks with new mechanics lIke these, especially when it's something that creates a story-like moment through the gameplay.
I'm super interested to learn all of the rules and design space around battles. I was talking with my partner and we thought that since this one has the siege sub-type, there might be some others that you have to defend instead of attack. Very interesting to be sure.
Seems likely!
CGB got some info from what he said was a reliable source, the subtype denotes how you can damage it, siege being any way, so some might only take damage from spells or only from creatures.
one key thing of note the reminder text isn't for battles it's for sieges, which implies other battle subtypes might not work this way exactly
Good catch, wouldn’t be surprised if there was one that you have to defend too
@@JimDavisMTG yeah i would assume they might like the play pattern of planeswalkers with only a static and want to sever that concept from all the PW interactions
Love to see this new design space. It feels like a Planeswalker that you have to kill to get a reward, which is what a battle is like, so that's cool and flavorful
Except that the person who casts it has to attack zendikar...but then gets the benefit of the creature when it destroys zendikar? Flavor fail
@@pr0fess0rbadass I do agree that the design is a bit weird on this one, but I guess you have to think more in terms of giving your opponent the siege weapon and you attacking it down, rather than being the one who is invading
I think the "when it's defeated exile it and cast" is gonna be for commander, that if one of your opponents you didn't pick to defend it kills it, they get the 4/4 or whatever
Also the 3 probably isn't just 3 toughness, it's probably 3 attacks. So the third time it gets swung at
That would make more sense from a balance perspective; at face value it looks like planeswalker loyalty.
@@JimDavisMTG Interesting! What if the owner attacks it with 3 1/1 (or larger) creatures?
@@Ketoinvestor We honestly don't know yet, it looks like this was previewed a day or two early and we haven't gotten the official rules from WotC yet.
Will I be able to Hex Parasite it?
> I think the "when it's defeated exile it and cast" is gonna be for commander, that if one of your opponents you didn't pick to defend it kills it, they get the 4/4 or whatever
Why would anyone ever want to play that then?
You get two tapped lands, and if your opponent can get rid of the siege, they get a 4/4 vigilance, haste elemental land that can tap for a mana of any colour.
I'm really curious about the other battle types. The way the card is formatted, a "siege" is defended by the opp and you want to kill it, maybe a "defense" needs to be defended by yourself, but offers you a benefit for as long as it's in play, a "skirmish" could be attacked or defended by either player, and gives the winner of the conflict a benefit (that would be tricky to balance).
I bet there will be battle cards other than the siege type that you have to defend for some undercosted static bonus and your opponent can attack it to flip it into something good for them. Imagining like a bitter blossom battle card that defends itself but kills all its own tokens if your opponent can take it out, something like that
It doesnt technically say your opponent gets control of it, it just says they defend it.
I absolutely love the "give the opponent something to protect" mechanic. It forces interaction, and interaction is where the game shines. No more sitting around doing nothing until you can play a sweeper, because waiting that long gives your opponent free reign to get full value from their battles. Also, as it seems 'seige' is the one that needs the opponent to protect, there may be other ways battles are used to force interaction, such as a control deck using it to force a combo deck to use some resources to stop an 'encampment' or similar.
The important part is now there's a tool that wizards can use to force a more interactive metagame if things aren't going well. My guess is they'll bring these cards out every few sets, like they do with flip cards and sagas.
Agree strongly
yeah seems like a good balance, you can counter the battle, you can counter the transformation, so it's not like a control killer but definitely adds interaction.
This looks dope. Excited to see more battle cards.
I just realized that if all the battle cards aren't creatures or artifacts and if they can be flipped into one of those it would be possible to have them be a good card in the indomitable creativity decks. Especially ones that use atraxa since she can essentially draw into one
Note it doesn't say that your opponent controls the battle in play, it says they "protect" it. Knowing Magic, that sounds like a different keyword action.
Just playing it then attacking into it with a 4/x to immediately flip it sounds too easy. The 3 on the bottom right probably means it needs to be attacked 3 times to defeat it so it can be flipped over. That's probably why the card states that you and other opponent's can attack into it to flip it over, you would need a full commander rotation to kill it but a regular one-on-one would take 3 turns or 3 attacking creatures.
The sub-type "siege" also might be giving away something here. If the "siege" sub-type is about the opponent defending itself from your and your other opponent's onslaught (a siege on a player if you will), then there must be another subtype where you cast the battle card and it stays on your side of the field and maybe you have to defend it from being attacked to get some kind of effect. Kind of like an attack-able enchantment
This whole battle - siege thing opens up a pretty interesting player dynamic. If the battle - siege card has a flip effect that is so devastating that the opponent would be crazy to let it flip, then he would actually protect it with his own creatures to prevent it from flipping, which suddenly means the opponent is safe from having their life reduced but now they have to protect a card they don't own because the flip might be broken. It's pretty interesting.
"You and others" means that an opponent can attack the siege they are defending or no? This might matter because since it's a cast you might want to defeat it yourself so you can counterspell the backside or wrath.
Pretty sure that's commander/more player game types text right there. We'll get more clarifications as it goes on though.
It's neat. The backside has a cost of sacrificing an unblocked attack basically. I wonder if they will make burn spells that target battles.
If the burn spell says any target I bet it does.
@@peggle09 unless its 3 attacks, rather than 3 health...
I think it's an uncommon because it enters the battlefield under an opponents control. Wouldn't that mean the opponent gets the ETB to search for 2 lands? You get the 4/4 mana dork at the cost of ramping the opponent and having to defeat the battle card.
No, it's not under their control, they're just defending it. At least that's what I'm getting out of it.
This enters the battlefield under your control and you choose an opponent to defend it. You are essentially attacking your own thing and the opponent is given the choice to prevent you from getting the back half.
nothing on the card says you give it to someone else, just that you choose them to protect it
Thank you for being the first person to explain battles to me
What a sad time to be a control player. Can't imagine us getting any useful Battle cards, let alone being able to "defeat" it.
Well you can counter it when it transforms!
Control players know what they did
I hope they make a Defend subtype that you win by defending?
Man if only control had a way to stop things from being cast in the first place.
Oh poor control, it must be impossible for them to stop any spell regardless of type from touching the battlefield in the first place.
If only they had a way to stop spells on the stack. If only!
That’s just one type (siege). There could be more types, maybe ones that need to be defended?
Your opponent doesn't control it, you do. Otherwise they would receive the explosive vegetation effect. Your opponent protects it, as in can block creatures that are attacking it.
Of note, it doesn’t say cast “without paying it’s mana cost”…regardless it can be countered. Cool flavorfully in that you can win the battle but not the “war” or reap the spoils.
Reverse Planeswalker is a really interesting way to look at it. Also cool way to teach people about owning vs controlling that is pretty clear.
The back side has no mana cost though
The backside exile it and then you ""cast it" transformed. There is no additional cost to casting it. I think the reason for the cast is it allows the opponent to counter it as you mentioned. It's probably a balancing decision
@@thesamuraiman seems specific enough that it might matter? But idk doesn’t explain how one “defeats” the battle either (if damage wears off etc)…my bad tho I got excited and was thinking about how dfc’s have the front’s cmc in other zones. Didn’t think about how it says “cast transformed” which would be cmc 0
Seeing the notion about exiling it to recast it, I'm curious to see what comes out in black & red.
"You are already Dead" and "Give one creature death touch" cards just became more relevant with this and I love that it rewards us with a body. What a great idea! It's like enchantment and Planewalker that we toss to the opponent to disrupt and force them to adapt their strategy aorund.
Why are those relevant? Deathtouch and YAAD only apply to creatures.
Doesn't work.
Seems insane in 1v1 formats.
4 mana to ramp 2 lands and get a 4/4 mana dork.
Power level bout to spike off the charts. No wonder they've been OK printing more classic cards
If you destroy it with vindicate I wonder if flips. I kinda hope not.
I can imagine the frustration if a mythic battle with high toughness is about to be defeated and you just bounce it. :)
Edit: well I am assuming it's a permanent but I guess it could be untargettable like an emblem
I would say it wouldn't flip with destroy effects since the card states that it has to be "defeated".
My assumption is, that it can be interacted with like any other permanent but needs to be destroyed by battle in order to get the flip effect.
And the idea of bouncing a battle sounds so hilarious :'D
Key wording: It says "When defeated", not "When destroyed". Indicates to me that it must be combat damage.
Key wording here is "When defeated". To me that indicates it has to die by combat damage to trigger the reward.
What makes its subtype "Siege"? Guess we'll need to see more "Battle" cards to know. Also, presumably Tarmogoyf can now potentially become a 9/10 through its ability.
Target nonland permanent is gonna be so vital next standard
Invasion of Segovia - If a source would deal damage to a player, prevent all but 1 of that damage.
The funny thing is, if people don't use these, they'll put out one that's outright broken to force it into play. That's why they put out Jace, The Mind Sculptor when the first planeswalkers weren't getting used enough, and Urza's Saga when people weren't using the sagas enough.
Yeah :/ thats always WOTCs excuse for broken cards
Imo it's better than what Konami did with link monsters in yugioh, which is forcing people to run them if they wanted to play any extra deck oriented strategy (which is most strategies)
@@dudono1744 Remember when they first printed companions and you could just cast them straight from your sideboard and every game became the same? That was fun. In vintage Black Lotus in your opening hand was 3 free mana every turn for the entire game. Literally every single time.
Just want to point out in the first zendikar PT, one of the pros was asked what he thought of JTMS and he just turned to the camera and said "ill keep using llorwyn jace, I dont think JTMS is very good"
@@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303 Yeah Treasure Cruise was first printed some people didn't understand why we were saying it was broken and would be banned. Their comments are still up lol.
I hope there is something more to this because this mechanic seems SO tempo swingy as you explained it (Be on the play like a good magic player). T4 on the play may well be the first creature attack of the game. Pushing 3 damage out of 20 with that attack is no big deal for the opponent but with this card it would now trade to a crushing amount of value..
We full tower defense now boys.
So Basically +3 life to opponent if you want the Back side.
so can this be targeted by burn? if it acts as a PW style card you should be able to like: play this card, bolt it, then move to combat and be able to swing with it? AND tap it for mana after blocks. this seems like a fun card, and i definitely can't wait to see if there's any rare or mythic versions of this type!
It says "you and others can attack it" so with that wording i don't think noncombat is able to affect it. Perhaps a different subtype will only be affected by noncombat damage
@@nerfinatorrr9981 "can attack" implies that that's an option. i'd like to think there would be some kind of rules text about how it's taken down, like the eternal wanderer saying only one creature can attack it. and in that wanderer text is also says "can attack" and that most definitely is an option as the PW can be burned, bounced, etc. obviously it's gonna be anyone's guess until we get the official rules and such, i'm kinda just asking questions in the air for people to think on
@lordlucario8828 yeah for sure! We definitely don't have much info to go on. It's cool to have a new thing like this to discuss though!
@@nerfinatorrr9981 funny enough though while we were doing this i just finished a cgb video where he was talking about this card and he was given some rules text on battle from wotc. and in it it did say that it enters with defense counters and can be removed in the fashions of PW's but slightly differently. it didn't mention anything about destroy or bounce effects. so it CAN be burned atleast, but now i'm wondering if things like the new glissa or hex parasite would work. i'm hoping we get the official rules of them tomorrow during spoilers!!
I just want to draw attention to the artwork. If the invasion is tearing the crap out of the moon there on Zendikar what does that mean for the invasion in Innistrad? Will that moon be damaged too?
CGB got some interesting info from a source he seems to believe and I really like it so I'm going to be hopefull and believe it
Sub-type denotes how a battle can be damaged Siege being creatures and anything that says any target.
and
your opponent does not control the battle it is still considered under your control but only the person chosen to defend the battle can assign blockers to protect it.
The fact you have to cast the battle a second time makes them pretty weak to counter spells. It'll be interesting to see what benefits the other ones give.
I wonder how burn damage that hits any target will interact with Battles, because if you could bolt it as soon as it hits the field, that would be amazing
That would be busted. Surely you gotta hit it 3 times, not just deal it 3 damage. It's not much of a battle otherwise
Being on the play should make it so much easier to flip the battle, hope it doesn’t end up being a sideboard mechanic only that I always bring in on the play.
I can’t wait to force battles into every deck I have
While I really like the idea, I kind of hate that they have sideways art.
This means that if they are in your hand, you will totally tip it by tilting your head to read it. Also, it's kind of weird that it's a permanent that can't easily be shown to be tapped. I guess it means that no Battle will ever have a tap activation, but it can still be tapped other ways)
The other big thing is the number to its right... does it mean that it has to take that much damage? is this damage like damage on a creature that goes away or does it stick? It looks to high to represent "it needs to be hit this many times". Can it be damaged by "any target" spells? I hope not. That looks too easy
I hope it's like toughness. I hope it means "this needs to take 3 combat damage in a single turn/combat to be defeated"
So does the 4/4 on the front just refer to the creature on the back or do I have to beat it as a 4/4 for the number of defense counters it has?
I'm guessing you could just lighting bolt it if you were playing a red/green deck
So they gave up on printing commander sets and deemed it necessary to print those cards in standard, perfect.
Mana fix AND ramp, then transforms and mana fixes again! I think most decks with green will run this
I don’t understand why I would want to waste an attack on this battle, unlike a planeswalker, it poses no threat, and I feel like in most decks, you would want to deal damage to a player instead
Because you get a 4/4?
@@JimDavisMTG yes that I wouldn’t get to use until turn 5, to me the mechanic just seems gimmicky to add a new card type.
This is like the Day and Night mechanic question mark?
super cool, cant wait to see these in commander
Interesting new card type, I'm excited to see who it plays out
oh i dont like flip cards in paper. its a hassle to unsleeve them and flip them and then you accidentally damage them it just feels so bad...
Its strange to see what MTG has come to be :( But again I remember myself feeling the same back when planeswalkers were introduced :P
Man, these are going to change the game. It essentially adds a small level of “combo” to every deck that runs them. Lol let’s see what the game looks like in six months.
I’d assume either this doesn’t count as a permanent or your opponent doesn’t control it otherwise any sac effect could just toss this. But maybe that’s part of the design.
I don't think the opponent controls it, the wording is specifically "choose an opponent to defend" so I think you could be forced to sac your own battle.
Instead of "Bolt the Bird" its gonna be "Bolt the Battle". Assuming it takes damage like Plainswalkers would.
You have me mistaken, I was actually saying ‘what’s that rattle’
Cool card type - but - the card itself is kinda useless, haste on a creature when you already attacked? Guess its for the mana ability, but isnt it just better to cast a 4/4 haste for 4 mana instead and hit opponents face?
this is gonna be fun on SPELLTABLE.......
Can you bolt it?
when mtg gets into weiss
So this ETBs onto your opponents side.... so dont they get to fetch for lands? And I believe when it flips you cast ir for free.
If it is this good being an uncommon card. How powerful could a rare o mythic battle card be.
What on earth lmao. Ok so does the opponent control it? And can you just bolt it similar to a planeswalker or what?
Edit: Also, this is probably what the defense counters from the Maro teaser are so players could possibly proliferate it to defend. And speaking of which, this is a siege subtype which means there could possibly be a different subtype that you cast and you defend rather than the opponent with a good static benefit.
I think you have to attack it to deal damage
So will they also extend the time of each match because of this new Type? By the first look at it, it seems it will extend the game if you want to get multiple Back side to flip.
Just how planeswalkers extend the game? This won't extend how long games take anymore then planeswalkers already do.
this 3 point can only be reduced by attack? or also can be reduced by burn or some things?
Teferi stops battles, at least that’s thematic?
I think its a nice mechanic
Is the opponent forced to protect it or is a may
Do you think "deal 3 damage to each opponent" effects will kill siege cards?
This is definitely not an opponent. You are choosing an opponent to defend it in this case, but it is just a permanent on the battlefield.
how this will effect modern? i really don't know :D
Ah ah ah not so fast. This probably isn't as good as it looks assuming they'll print cards which give your opponent gets extra benefits if they're defending a siege. Also it's interesting to note that you cast the backside from exile, not return it to the battlefield, so your opponents can minor misstep it which is insane.
My biggest question is, does protecting it count as controlling it? If the opponent gets the benefit of this one, it seems bad to pay four mana to put an opponent up two lands. We'll see what it looks like on the other side, and how the official rules work out, but I really just hope I'm wrong. Be a bad card otherwise.
I doubt, otherwise it would be outrageously bad in any format where mana ramp is even remotely valuable (commander)
Would be much more onboard with this if it were very cheap to cast and had no front side. As it is, its just spells that we had before with even more value tagged onto them. What happend to trade-offs? pfff...
Do you have to pay the casting cost to cast it again? Or is cast for free?
Cast is free
Seems like aftermath with extra steps
Might be fun, but the design seems forced and doesn't really make sense, the idea of casting a 'siege' that your opponent has to defend. It would make more sense to execute a siege on something they already have of their own accord. Just my opinion...
Well lets see what the 3 actually means. is it really just 3HP ? It feels to strong to just get a 4/4 with haste for 'free'
This is so far off from being free, lol.
You didn't hit your opponent's face when you could, so you aren't ahead in damage really until your 2nd hit.
sooooo this is a battle with subtype siege...
oh ho ho ho, so the way a saga uses the whole down side of the card, this will be like a sideways saga. But combat based (of course) I see, I see ...
Ah, yes. Another card type for Teferi, Time Raveler to passive punk.
Looks like a playable card for Amulet Titan\Scapeshift
Hit it with a Valakut trigger, get another as long as I have a Dryad in play...
@@carldooley9344 Valakut can't target it. It's not a creature, player, or planeswalker. Also, the 3 is probably how many times you have to hit it, not its life total
@@sorin_markov I think the 3 stands for at least 3 creatures need to hit this with combat damage.
@@sorin_markov Valakut deals 3 damage to any target.
@@joshuagriffith9191 Yes, which means "creature, player, or planeswalker." Rule 115.4. "Some spells and abilities that refer to damage require "any target," "another target," "two targets," or similar rather than "target [something]." These targets may be creatures, players, or planeswalkers. Other game objects, such as noncreature artifacts or spells, can't be chosen."
Another card that gets got by Teferi Time Reveler 😔
Love everything except the sideways text
Is it considered as a PERMANENT tho? We might have to wait.
I'd think so?
Idk just feels really like the missed the mark with this mechanic, they feel useless in 1v1, commander and multiplayer they could be a tad more interesting
This looks like a star realms card
These will be sooooooooo obvious to spot in the hand...
I like it
Imagine the Rares!! 👀 This card is an uncommon and net cost is 5 CMC to ramp 3 extra lands. That counts the 6 mana spent to cast it and then Lightning Strike it, and counts the payoff, a creature land with haste, so you have added to the battlefield. This is more than playable. Again, imagine the Rares!! 👀
You probably can't lightning strike it, since Bolt only hits creatures and players/planeswalkers, and it's probably 3 hits, not 3 life
@@sorin_markov The creature or player text on lightning strike and bolt has been errata to say deal 3 damage to any target.
So as long as this is a permanent which it appears to be. Yes, yes it falls under the strike/boltable things.
@@joshuagriffith9191 Not necessarily. We don't even know if it counts 3 damage or 3 instances of damage.
@@joshuagriffith9191 You can't bolt lands. Any target currently means "any player, planeswalker or creature." They could add Battles to this rule, but it's not automatically implied.
@@tonysmith9905 Agreed. This is assuming that it is similar to planeswalker abilities. Magic rules change with almost every new card type. It will be interesting to see how it works.
Am I the only one wondering why Wizards is turning mtg into the old Star Wars tcg…? 😒
thanks, I hate it lol
I dont have this green card 🐍🐧🐗
Does this grow goyf?
yes
That's the only positive thing about this new card type.
A 4/4 mana dork with extra steps. Meh.
Wut
I really hope this card type flops and players boycott playing them. It feels like it changes the fundamental gameplay of MTG
YES! LET MTG STAGNATE AND NEVER CHANGE! EVOLUTION IS FOR NERDS!
Let's watch MtG die: Part a Billion
If i had a nickel every time someone said „THIS WILL KILL MTG“ I would have 5917364918183 nickels, and yet the game is still here.
People said this when Planeswalkers came out, heck i even know someone who thought EQUIPMENT killed the game. Please, people, the game is always going to change, that doesnt mean its dying.
@@minecraftfanaaron Companions almost killed the game.
@@minecraftfanaaron Well, M30 and Covid breaks already delivered a nice, silky gold coffin. Companions, overprints, worldbuilding ruination like Lotr crossover and complete messes of mechanics like Initiative or Battles do exactly that. Make MtG even more of a deadbeat version of the already ever so deadbeat YGO. Screw this game big time
Cards for commander BS.