IDRIVEACLASSIC reviews: Armstrong Siddeley Lancaster
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 มี.ค. 2022
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Armstrong Siddeley Lancaster
The Lancaster is a rare beast in 2022 and wasn’t a massive seller at the time of launch. The car came to market in 1945 and just over 3,500 cars were made.
The car was announced just before the end of the war in May 1945 at a point companies had begun to funnel efforts into post war manufacturing and the Lancaster was one of the first of the post war cars to be announced.
Although the car launched in 45, the first cars were delivered in 1946 and production ceased in 1952.
The Lancaster was named after the famous WW2 aircraft and along with the Hurricane, created a lot of excitement for what was to come in the world of automotive post war. The body was produced for Armstrong Siddeley by Mulliners of Birmingham.
Despite being a post war car, Armstrong Siddeley like many businesses, had focused their efforts elsewhere during wartime and whilst the car was new, the engine and transmission unit from the pre-war 16hp saloons were used alongside a Stromberg carb. Although this changed in 1949 when the car was available with an 18hp engine.
This particular car we’re testing today is the 16hp.
Another interesting fact on this car, is aside from a handful of Whitleys, the Lancaster was the only car of the 16/18hp range to feature a sunshine roof.
Aside from the engine and interesting post war automotive information, for me the most interesting thing on this car is the Wilson pre-selector box which provides the transmission for this car.
The Wilson pre-selector box was a pre war invention and at the time of launch was hailed as the most revolutionary device since the introduction of the motor car.
It was said to allow gear changes to implemented with utmost speed and with minimal risk of miscalculation, damage or noise. In a world of crash boxes, this was a far easier and smoother gear change process than evert before.
To use a pre selector box, which we will demo in this video, you choose your preferred gear without touching the clutch pedal and then once ready to proceed into your preferred gear, you fully depress the clutch and release.
Although this sounds a bit of a faff when we go for a drive you’ll see it’s easier than you think!
Now before we go for a drive, let’s meet owner Jon, one of the youngest Armstrong owners in the UK. - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
Armstrong Siddeley used to make a 'ute' version for the Australian market called a 'Station Coupe', I used to see one running around Frome years ago, it's reg was PUG something, I think it still survives
Jonathan, we actually made two different utes, here in Australia. A Coupé Utility and a Station Utility. The Coupé has 4 seats and was more luxurious and then the more basic, but bigger bed, Station version.
@@paulscountrygarage9180 I guess we got them as a rolling chassis maybe and the bodies were put on here hence the different versions? I wonder how many came here?
@@peterriggall8409 I think you are correct.
There is one of your Australian ute versions here in New Zealand
I agree with you on the leather front (and Im a vegetarian) When I got my car retrimmed, there wasn't that much difference in the costs of vinyl vs leather as labour is a ig part of the costs...
And any color can be matched with leather.
The leather they put in cars these days is rubbish though....unless it's a Rolls. They put this micro thin leather on a material backing.
Loved this! Took me back to 1959, when 6-year-old me rode in one of these (only my second or third car ride!). I remember being fascinated by that pre-selector. Meant to add that I once read that this led to the cars being advertised as suitable "for the daughters of gentlemen" (!)
Regarding the trafficators, you can now get flashing LED bulbs for them, which makes them far more visible and instantly understood. I've got them on my Minor, and had no problems with people not seeing/understanding them.
Funny - thought of doing this, Didn't realize it has already been done
My grandfather had one of these for years, we once got 80mph out of it on the motorway, was absolutely terrifying.
A very nice review of a lovely car! I’ve seen a single Armstrong Siddeley here in the USA, years ago. I remember its solidity and elegance. Thanks!
Preselect gearboxes were very common on urban buses in the mid 20th century because of the ease of driving with stop-start traffic and closely spaced bus stops, much easier than a crash box. London Transport standardised on preselect from the 1930s to 1950s. On buses the preselect box was eventually displaced by the semi-automatic (based on the same Wilson technology but with no 'clutch' pedal), or (in London especially) fully automatic transmission.
The saracen, ferret, saladin armoured vehicles in the Army had fluid flywheels, pre selectors, main thing is to keep them well topped up, they started in second just the same.
As did London Transport's AEC RT double deck buses
@@alastairqueen7973 and the AEC Regal IV's and Guy Arab's in Western Australia!
This car of course had a centrifugal clutch, not a fluid flywheel.
According to Wikipedia "the Armstrong Siddeley Owners Club Ltd. now owns all the patents, designs, copyrights and trademarks, including the name "Armstrong Siddeley"
Quite right Michael, but perhaps of greater relevance is that when the company stopped offering service facilities and parts for Armstrong Siddeley cars the then relatively newly formed Armstrong Siddeley Owners Club purchased the entire stock of remaining parts to ensure that owners could keep their cars on the road. Today the club still has some of this stock, augmented by many remanufactured parts and useable second hand items too. The major part of these stores is for post-war cars but there are still a good number of parts for pre-war cars too.
I'm in Australia and when I was 17 back in the early 70s I bought an Armstrong Siddeley Utility Coupe. Which was based on the Lancaster. I loved it! ThecPre selector box was amazing. Your video brings back some wonderful memories!
I am told the Army called them the Gear Change Pedal. London Transport called them the Operating Pedal. Nearly three thousand STL type buses had the floor mounted selector and mechanically linked operating pedal, and 7000 odd RT type buses had the column selector and compressed air operating pedal. The Routemaster, (RM) took the idea one step further, with electro pneumatic operation of the epicyclic gear bands, with direct selection of the gears via the column selector, or automatic changes,(fourth gear position) triggered by the speed sensitive generator, pulling off in second gear, changing to third at 12 m0ph, and top, at 18 to 20 mph, giving a nice progressive ride to passengers and Conductor, but with the option to use first gear and higher gears to best effect for terrain and to maintain time.
This car is 73 years old, King George VI was the monarch when it was new.
What a treat to see such a rare classic. I love to see these long gone old British marques. Thanks for taking us along for the ride.
I agree with you that the dealer having the seats re-trimmed in vinyl rather than leather is a disappointment! Looks a lot of fun to drive though, and if the values are lower than other luxury competitors from the same era, then maybe tidy vinyl seats are better than the thread-bare-leather would have been. Maybe a leather scented air freshener would be the answer! 😉 It was interesting to see the preselector in action. I gather that part of the idea was that you could have the higher or lower gear ready and waiting the press the pedal to make the change at the exact moment as required. So up a gear just as the engine was getting to the top of the rev range or down a gear on the apex of a bend (or maybe on the way into a bend at least) to accelerate out the other side. Plus it didn’t require any clutch control skills from the driver! Thanks for another good video of an older car that is outside of my normal late 60’s to early 00’s knowledge base!
Ooh , you lucky thing , what a gorgeous vintage car and weather for driving it .
Gosh this takes me back to 1966 when I was in secondary school, some kind person donated a Armstrong for our mechanics course, the car that was donated was far superior to this one.
It had it own Jack's fitted to the chassis to enable you to change a wheel, in the rear seating area there were tastes to hold onto that were suspended from the roof area, pull out wooden (chestnut) foot rests, fold down pick nick trays from the rear seats.
Everything about this car was pure luxury!
Unfortunately some thugs broke into the school grounds and wrecked this priceless beautiful car!
I often think of her.
I love your older car drives,makes me want one.
Steph, what a lovely car. It takes me back to when my boss in the early 1980s had a Star Sapphire. It was a real limo, almost as good as a Rolls Royce, but much rarer. It had a conventional auto as opposed to a pre-select box. It was lovely as well with lots of wood and leather.
TNT says I had one and lurved it.
London Busses had pre-selector gearboxes.
Used to be 3 or 4 of these in sargents scrap yard in canterbury in the 70s, a crying shame
Lovely car! Back when I was a teenager, a friend of mine had a Sapphire. It was a real junker, but you could still feel the quality coming through. It also had the pre-selector gearbox, but it was a later version - controlled by a switch on the end of a fixed "column shift" type lever, and had the conventional "H" pattern. BTW, it is NOT a clutch pedal! It is a gear selector pedal! There is no clutch, but there is a "fluid flywheel" - an early form of torque converter as used in automatics. You select the gear on the switch, and press the pedal when you want it to change. Unlike a clutch, it doesn't need any delicacy! It is, if you like, a similar system to a modern paddle shift automatic. Once in top gear, my friend always used to immediately select third, so that when he needed it, all he had to do was press the gear-change pedal. Happy days!
Excellent review, I've always wondered how a Pre-Selector gearbox worked and you've now answered that question for me, thanks Steph.
The pre selector gear box is quite is quite good an it is surprising more cars did not come with it. Good to see you got the hang of it.
Awesome video.
🙂🌞🙂🌞
The big advantage of a preselect gearbox over a crashbox is, of course, that you will never suffer from the embarrassment of grating gears. However by the 50s synchromesh (at least on the upper gears) gearboxes were pretty much standard. In the post war period Armstrong Siddeley gave their buyers the choice of manual synchromesh boxes or preselect gearboxes and by the early fifties automatic gearboxes were available for the Sapphire 346 cars. So whatever your transmission preference there was an Armstrong Siddeley to suit you.
I have never seen a Lancaster, either. Armstron Siddeley have a very active owner's group, so it should be possible to keep one running. I remember a number of Sapphires in regular use in New Zealand in the 80s, In fact, a classmate's parents had one that I rode in a few times.
Nice description of the preselector box. I remember traveling in old busses with the same arrangement on school trips in the 80s.
What a treat! Armstrong Siddeley were real innovators and made a quality car. I’m glad that you gave the Wilson preselector a whirl. Perhaps you’ll have the opportunity to drive a Star Sapphire in future.
Thanks Steph for another classic test drive. I first came across that model in a book that I first had late in 1983, one of a series published by the Olyslager Auto Library, British Cars of the Early Fifties. I also have a bigger book which I first bought in September 1986 about the Cars of 1945-70. According to info in the bigger book, there were only 12,570 examples of that car made between 1946 and 1953. I just love your road tests, they're just based on the original format of the original Top Gear TV show as I first remember seeing in the 1980s before those three hooligans Clarkson, May & Hammond ruined the whole thing and made it their own. I bet your reviews & road tests will just about KO Clarkson & company. Great stuff, love ya Steph.
Thank you. Star Sapphires definitely came to NZ and the last one I saw here was a beautiful restoration with a nice bright green paint job.
If I owned a car like this, I would feel I had to drive everywhere in a 3-piece suit and a trilby hat! It has that sense of occasion that few modern cars can manage. I see it has plenty of beehive headroom, these things are important (not so much in my case, admittedly).
Another really interesting video. When I was at school in the 50`s, I was, to say the least, a reluctant scholar, so was always getting the cane or detention. Our deputy headmaster had a Lanchester, and as a punishment, he got me to wash it at lunchtime. One thing I did have an interest in though, was cars. I noticed the gearchange was different than my uncle`s Fordson lorry. He explained it was a pre select box. I never saw one again until I started on London Transport and started driving the old RT`s and RF`s, which all had pre select boxes. And just to be picky, a pre select doesn`t have a clutch, it`s called an operating pedal, as they have fluid flywheels.
I did not realise that the Routemaster had a pre-select gear change. Thanks!
@@roygardiner2229 No, the Routemaster was semi automatic / automatic. Basically, you could leave it in 4th and it worked as an auto, or you could use it as a semi auto by changing gear as normal. There was no clutch / operating pedal, as it also had a fluid flywheel. The RT, which was the predecessor of the RM was the one with pre select, as was the RF single decker.
Up till the mid 1930s, London buses generally had crash gearboxes, which must have been hard work for the drivers in central London traffic with no power steering, so a preselect drive with fluid flywheel was seen as a big advance in making the driver's job easier. I don't think synchromesh manual boxes came onto the market for buses until after WW2.
@@jamesadlam9875 Around the late 70`s, I worked on United Counties buses for a while, which had a variety of vehicles, with manual and semi boxes, but they still had some crash box vehicles, in the form of the Bristol F Lodekkas, with either 4 or five speed crash boxes. Put my double declutching skills to the test.
@@bustersw1760 that must have been tough work!
What a lovely lady you are and a breath of fresh air. I’ve viewed many of your videos by now and love how you come across sympathetically but truthfully. For decades, Ive owned many classic cars - currently a series 1 Landrover.
It’s wonderful to see younger people like yourself also taking to keeping our older historical vehicles going with much enthusiasm.
Keep going with your channel - excellent😊
Another fantastic video Steph.
Love the pre-selector gearbox.
Such a great car.
Another brilliant video Steph. You are very brave taking out all these different vehicles belonging to other people and getting stuck in, driving them with all their quirks, particularly in this case with the pre-select gearbox. Always wanted to try driving a Wilson although Iʻve driven a later Bristol bus with Self Changing Gears (heavier version of same thing developed by same company) I can remember as a little tike riding in the Armstrong Siddeley Sapphire of a friend of my mother - I can still smell the wood and leather. I canʻt remember hearing of the Lancaster model but there were plenty of Sapphires, Whitleys, Typhoons and Tempests in New Zealand and there are still a few around. A friend had a Typhoon or Tempest, canʻt remember which, not far from here a few years back. Keep the videos coming, really enjoying them as most of the older English cars featured, we had in New Zealand!
I'd never heard of the Armstrong Siddley Lancaster before and I love the connection to the Lancaster Bomber. Just like John, my grandfather had an Armstrong Siddley - a Sapphire - and dad tells great stories of being a boy and being able to stand up in the boot. Love the quirky gearbox too.
Great review as always. Hopefully I'll get to say hello to you this weekend again too.
Brilliant review Steph, so much into in such a short time!
God, I love it!!!! These majestic British luxury cars are from a bygone time, but oh so important in preserving! Even the name conjures up class, distinction, and refinement. Perfection!
What a really nice car you've shown us there, you are the one and only person ever to have grasped my interest with pre 1950 cars. Good luck with the quest to lose weight Steph, I can tell your heart is really in it and I'll keep my fingers crossed you achieve your goal.
Another brilliant video! John's camera skills are very good too!
One of the rarest versions would be a station coupe or what we in Australia would call a ute or a utility
Wow what a gorgeous car.
Excellent video and details however I have to agree with you that the vinyl interior looks very wrong. Almost circa 1976 Morris Marina.
Another great film Steph. Armstrong Siddeley is one of those classic names - thanks for showing us around this one and for bringing it to life. Dare I suggest that this one looks better from the back than from the front?
Quintessential British car.
As British as the Citroen DS was French, the Mercedes 300 SL was German, and the Cadillac was American.
Lovely looking car. Interesting information on the pre selector gear system.👍
Oh bless you Steph. As a vegetarian I couldn't care less about the vinyl seats ♥️ What a lovely car
Thank you for showing us this awesome car! It is really beautiful; I love cars from this era
One of THE most beautiful cars ever made full stop.. Mulliners did coachwork for the Queen's cars. The elegance and striking good looks set this apart from dreary, samey, bland cars.. A thing of pure beauty.!
The AEC LT buses of London (and other regions) had Wilson pre-selector boxes that hissed slightly when used.
Thanks for the excellent vid!
Love all ur videos. Unique & unpretentious and full of fun. Really appreciate the effort 👍👌Many thanks
in the early 60s I got to ride in a Armstrong Siddeley Star Sapphire, to young to appreciate it then, think I fell asleep in it
I must subscribe to your channel, I remember an Armstrong Siddeley show room in Tottenham North London where I lived in the 50s 60s, they had 2 on show there they were 2 tone, siver and grey, they were the more expensive cars to buy. thanks for posting.
Hi Steph, thanks for another great video. That is a lovely classic, those were really high-quality cars, I remember my grandad mentioning them. My favourite is the Sapphire...I'd love you to test drive one!
Nice review! Well balanced and thoughtfully done.
A couple of other nice little touches; the steering wheel boss doesn't move with the wheel, so you never have to go hunting for the trafficators and dip switch, and the front shut lines of the front doors really add to the overall styling of the side of the car. The expansive (and very foot accommodating) curve immediately stood out in the sea of staight up and down shut lines of today.
Manually canceiling trafficators ;-)
Thank you for uploading this!
16HP as the RAC rating-actual 70HP and the top speed was a around 75MPH.
Thanks Steph , lovely old bus ! Agree on the seats , they just look wrong , doesn’t detract much from the car though.
I love the ridiculous hunk of wood on the dash. Looks very classy
There was a two tone green one running around in Cape Town in the later sixties, it used to fill up at my dads garage in Ottery , it fascinated me as a school boy.
I had them when I was a kid. One reason they are pleasant to drive is that the steering is remarkably light for a car of that size and vintage. My brother still has several Armstrong Siddeleys as does my best mate. Brother has the convertible version of this shape called the Hurricane. Mate has Lancaster like this and a Coupe Utility. ( pickup )
Grand vlog that! Thank you, it really took me back..thank you
More to do with it's age I think. I drove these as kid and I'm pretty sure the indicators were self cancelling when fully operational.
Steph, a cracking film. Thank you.
Love this its looks alot like American 1940s cars more then British with the headlight and grill layout
I misread that as Lanchester at first but that was a different make of luxury car. If you ever get chance to test drive a Lanchester I would be interested. I was a student at what was once called Lanchester Polytechnic (now Coventry University).
I drove a pre selector bus when I was a student in Glasgow . AEC s and Daimlers all had them and they were great in the city .
Fabulous car! You need to turn off your turn indicator though, it made me smile....
Never knew they existed. Beautiful interior!
Great video. Such an interesting car. Always amazed 40s and 50s cars are still about.
One of my loveliest memories was sitting on the front armrest of an A.S. Star Sapphire in 1963 when I was about 7 years old as my grandfather drove it at 100 mph on the A12.
That Sphinx bonnet emblem is a beaut! What a lovely car! Thanks for reviewing it……..
I can remember my mum having an Armstrong Sidley Saffire an there was 2 saffires parked up near Broomfield hospital on old a130 about 15 years back . Lovely motors big respect girl xx
Realy nice experience !
It looks to me that Armstrong Siddely knew how to build a quality saloon .
It looks well put together , verry well proportioned , with a tippicaly Brittish interrior , so inviting !
What allways surprises me is the attention to detail , every component no matter how smal , is designed and made very well .
Just that Art Deco ashtray alone !
I guess it was quite an expensif car back then , i reccon above the Rover P3 and 4 .
I wish the current owner much plessure with this beautiful car .
Hey thanks for making this vid, very interesting and love that bonnet ornament, so cool
With my name I had to love this! Beautiful vid, where do you get that sunshine from? Looked very like a Riley to me. Hen's teeth come to mind.
Thanks Stef 😀👍
I have been known to drive a Daimler bus at a local museum fitted with a Pre-Selector box. Although the pedal for changing gear is in the clutch position it isn't a clutch pedal. It should really be referred to as a speed change pedal. There is no clutch on a Pre -selector box but rather a fluid flywheel.
Armstrong Siddeleys used centrifugal clutches, as did Riley.
Daimler / Lanchester used fluid flywheels .
With a pre select gearbox it's not a clutch pedal it's a gear change pedal. Anyone familiar with Ferret scout car will be at home with this. Compared with cars of this era the horn on modern cars sound a bit wimpy. and anaemic.
Nice old car you made me smile when you was talking about shourt people not being able to reach the peddles when I was young in the 50s and 60s the solution was to screw a 2"-3"thick block of wood to the peddles you would see an old lady looking over the top of the steering wheel it looked like nobody was driving the car until you got really close to see the top of her head it was so funny.
Thank you for the video 👍😊
When I was a boy there was one of these lived round the corner. Also, our mayoral car was an AW Whitley limousine, which was very impressive in formal black.
Nice one Steph, didn’t know much about these and can’t even remember seeing one. 16hp and top speed of 60 isn’t Santa Pod but I bet driving one is something special.
That's 16 fiscal horsepower, not 16 bhp. The Lancaster probably produces something like 60bhp, maybe even 70 or 80bhp. Cars like this aren't about top speed, but I would expect 60mph to be its cruising speed not top speed.
@@saxon-mt5by well I’ve learned something, thanks, I didn’t know that!
Another great video Steph. Armstrong Siddeleys must be quite rare in general, as I've seen very few, and haven't heard people talk about them. The body of that car reminds me of a Rolls Royce or a Jagaur.
A lovely old lady she is too. Yes Steph the seats let it down, being a former upholster I noticed that straight away. It could easily be rectified at a later date. That driving experience must have been strange at first but I think it is spot on for the era of the car. Thanks for the video Steph take care.👍👍
The pedal you call the clutch is correctly known as GEAR CHANGE PEDAL
Well presented.
Love the Sphinx, body style and wood/'leather' interior. A classy ride back in the day.
Brilliant, really enjoyed that
I want one! (with a leather interior...). Another great road test video, thanks
Shock... It's a Pre-Select Transmission that doesn't sing in 2nd gear!!
You're also the first person I've heard refer to the gear change pedal as a "clutch" in a vehicle with Pre-Select, Steph!
Great video as always too, btw!
Great video!
Another point about the preselector is that you can think much further ahead than just the few seconds shown here - for example, if you're driving along in top, it's odds-on that the next gear you're going to want will be third, so you can move the lever to 3rd at any time and just leave it there. Come time to change down, reduce speed, then just press the gear change pedal, and done.
Nice drive! Probably best to call it the Gearchange pedal rather than the clutch. The best Wilson box variant was the prewar Talbot with what they called the Traffic Clutch. You engaged first, moved off and then just stamped on the pedal when the box would change up a gear with the lever moving by itself. More than 7000 London Transport RT type buses were Wilson equipped as were many of British Railways' first generation diesel trains; these also had a freewheel like many Rovers.
Sorry Steph I had to laugh your haircolor and that of the wooden dash are the same, I realised that at the end. Had a good chuckle, thank you for that and showing this car I never heard of let alone ever seen.
What a treat!
A real piece of quality.
Gorgeous!
Great video today Steph. I'd never heard of a pre selector gearbox before, so I've learnt something interesting this time. Maybe Jon could hire the car out for weddings too?
Great video,interesting car,thanks for sharing 👍.
I had a 1949 18hp for many years. Lovely smooth drive but what a temperamental beast!
That's not typical for these cars, They are normally pretty reliable. I had them when I was a kid. Being young and stupid I drove them way too hard but they stood up well.
@@chasermalloy7406 True. They're pretty sturdy. I had issues with the wet sleeve "O" rings & also the hydraulic lifters which are now unobtainable.
@@grantparsons6205 Maybe mine were much younger. It was 50 years ago !
@@chasermalloy7406 hahahaha. And mine was in Australia & had to contend with above 30 degree heat!
@@grantparsons6205 Yeah I was in Australia too. I think it was overheating and a blown head gasket that got my main one. Never got to repairing it but I'm sure a head gasket is all it needed.
For those that saw the Tucker movie, they used a preselector that was borrowed from the defunct pre-war Cord.
Love the wood.
A lot of these were exported to the "Colonies" - Australia etc. There was a slightly later version built as a Utility (pick up) for the Australian market. Sturdy, long lasting cars!
A neighbor in the sixties had one of these.And to this day it’s the only one I have seen.They were rare back then.
Lovely car, beautifully crafted. It has so many little features and luxuries and lovely cream bakelite too. I take your point about the vinyl upholstery. It does take away from the luxury feel but I suppose it is easy to maintain. Maybe the owner will go mad and have it re-trimmed in leather and you can do another test in the future. 😊
Star sapphire, Daimler, both used pre. Select. Get used to the system quite quickly. Had a Daimler in 0/s wing wrecked , wing changed, boss and his son took the Daimler back to the owner, son stayed in the Daimler, owner not at home, decided to bring the Daimler back to the garage, unfortunately the son had left the car in gear with engine switched off. Yes started the car ,said car lept forward and wrecked the same wing. Came across disc brakes for the first time on star sapphire, what a leap forward to drum breaks.