Need Coaching? Enquiries here: docs.google.com/forms/d/15_F8NS9vWIZUGlPXv-jGeFO9vVCyEKUFTmwuJo3RHlA/viewform?edit_requested=true Want personalised advice but not ready for Coaching? View my non-coaching, one off bespoke services here: fazlifts.co.uk/collections/services All My Training Programs On Boostcamp. Use my code FAZLIFTS for a free 2 week premium trial: www.boostcamp.app/#fazlifts eBooks: fazlifts.co.uk/collections/e-books My Training Fundamentals Playlist: th-cam.com/play/PLcBzFSqsHKhs5muajYxG70uCcwGJ8IV3h.html
"Everybody wants to be a bodybuilder... but nobody wants to do 52 sets of lengthened partials with an 18 second cadence at 5 RIR using Concurrent Periodisation for Hypertrophy. " - Issac Newton
I legit put my back and legs on maintenance volume so I can grow my arms, 4 sets per week on back and legs and they are growing and my strength is skyrocketing 😂
Upon reading the title I thought the number was going to be a reference to how much somebody spent on gear, upon listening a few minutes I'm going to start upping my imaginary sculpture game 😂
I'm here because of GVS. Big recommendation to reach out to Big Paul over at anabolic bodybuilding, they have a Sunday 11am ET show and love having people hang and talk lifting.
On the other hand, you have Dr. Pak who shows 3 sets/week is effective, and while interviewing Schoenfeld, he admitted that 4 sets/week is effective. Over and above that, what is OPTIMAL depends on the individual's MRV. Plus it varies from exercise to exercise.
Pak is one of the better ones, as he tends to just say "ignore the studies and do the lifts you like in the way you like". Admittedly, he tends to say that towards the end of 12 minutes of "the sciences sez...".
all this fancy machines look so nice ! Great analogy. Also it's funny because In France, we call smooth talkers "hot air sculptors and smoke stirrers." (des sculpteurs d'air chaud, et brasseurs de fumée).
Phronesis - practical wisdom gained via experience- is one of the classical Aristotelian virtues. You can assume an experienced lifter is going to have more of that in spades than someone who is just citing a study and nothing else. Also, that incline chest press machine looks amazing with the ability to adjust where the handles actually start, seems very helpful for long wingspan guys.
Regardless of whether the volume studies are flawed, your arguments don't apply because these studies are not theoretical, abstract or imagination. They are concrete studies done with actual people that get tangible results. How and why they get these results and what they mean is another story, but they're not "outside reality" or "just imagination"
What I see over and over are studies referred to by other influencers and no mention of the control groups. Who was tested? Ages? Veterans or newbies? Men, women, or a mix? If I am going to base what I do on "the newest study just out" the first thing I'm doing is finding the study and reading it, discerning the control group populations and then determining if it is applicable to my situation which, time and again, I've found it is not. You see this in medicine as well. Who was tested matters, it's crucial, in fact, in self-application.
Science says "stand on one leg (unilateral force production & enhanced rate coding)"... Science says "sit on one of the benches all morning (dose response relationship)"... Science says "bounce up and down (lengthened partial squats)"... "Lift increasing poundage, with good form, in moderate rep ranges.". Whoopsie, you didn't say "SCIENCE SAYS"!!!
Appreciate the training footage bro. And the tone of the video. Talking about the 52 set study with pinkies raised with a haughty laugh sounds like the right thing to do. Do you yhink jts worth training obliques directly? Seem to be conflicting opinions ive seen on this. But big obliques wont grow in a day like some people make it out to be lol
I have a question is there any benefit for squeezing the muscle for 1 or 2 sets at the top example incline DB Press or does it depend on certain exercises?
You might have noticed my comment. One guy said "Who told you to do 32 sets!?" i then linked a video of Mike Israetel saying some lifters should do as many as 40 sets of side delts. He then replies defensively saying "aCtUaLlY he doesn't recommend that" Perfect example of the cognitive dissonance you speak of between getting behind the theoretical circle jerk, but logically understanding how proposterous all of this is in practice.
I did! That was a brilliant reply 😂 Reddit is where people who don't know what they're doing go and argue with others who don't know what they're doing. So I try to avoid it.
My training arc is similar to Faz, I’m also 43 and been doing this seriously about 21 or so years. Here’s what I know to be true, weekly volumes are just a distraction to what matters. I’m training with roughly 4 sets per miscle every 4ish days on an upper/lower. Basically I train every other day and I’m still gaining strength and muscle. When i get lost in the volume science and try to adjust my training it fails. I always end up back to where I am, low to moderate per session volumes with adequate recovery time to allow me to progress.Its that simple. All of this TH-cam content exists to make faux celebrities out of irrelevant personalities.
Is there even research in the area of hypertrophy that can be qualified as scientific? All the studies I have looked into show muscle growth (volume, thickness or crosssectional area) in the order of 5% after 8 to 12 weeks (typically). Those increases are even reported in studies that exclude beginners. Extrapolate those gains to a year … How can that be? Imagine we intermediates could grow our arms by 20%+ per year. Something is really wrong with the research in this field.
I had to go and read up about that ‘sculpture’ because I couldn’t believe that was true. Turns out, the artist has apparently sold more than 1 ‘invisible sculpture’! 😂 Good vid Faz 👍
It's wild what people try and pass off as art. I remember John Cage "composed" a piece of music called 4'33", and instructed the orchestra to sit still and not play a note for 4 mins 33 seconds. Then the audience would clap at the end of the "performance" 😂😂😂
@@martinpharrison yes, I remember being told about that! 😂 it’s crazy how much of a fine line there is between doing something like that and it being hailed as a profound event rather than someone exhibiting signs of madness 😂
I dunno man. It sounds like you just didn't SEEEEE the sculpture. You've gotta use your internal eye. 32 sets is just one eye open. 52 is both eyes wide. SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I am not sure i quite agree. A study is a study. It tests things under certain conditions. When the authors of the study themselves promote lower and medium volumes, but suggest that in case they do not work you should consider a higher volume specilization phase, i do not think it is their fault. They made 5 hour video about it. If you wish to watch a tiktok about it then go ahead and do whatever. you want, but how is that a peoblem with the science? I read the study and they have a freaking table showing that the first 4-6 sets are the most important of ALL the volume you do. At the same table they show that after the 10-20 range you are getting so much less. If doing more sets takes away from the intensity and focus, then they are probably not worth doing. If you wish to specialise in a specific muscle group they even mentioned that you would have to take MORE important sets from other muscle groups, so you can do more sets that matter LESS for the muscles groups you chose. That's what I got from their explanation of their paper. How is that misrepresenting anything?
I'm literally training with your arms and delts specializatio for the past year. And I think that there is no conflict between that and the research to be honest. In fact the only money I've spent is on your ebooks (before they were free on boostcamp- still worth it btw) and GVS's books. I do not need to pay anything to read a study. And I can also count the sets for biceps on the berserker (counting bench for 0.5 for example for tris) and find 30 sets for biceps. So I am literally wandering what the big deal is with 30 sets when you sell a program that has that much volume. @@Fazlifts
What you’re saying is nonsense. The guy you're referring to clearly doesn’t understand the science behind increasing volume. It's not about doing high volume indefinitely-it’s about short, focused periods of increased workload. If you’re not progressing, it means the volume is too much, as progressive overload isn’t being achieved. Also, his argument ignores basic facts: progress isn’t endless, and side delts (or any small muscle group) have limited growth potential. With poor genetics, he might gain 100-200 grams of muscle on his delts over 2-3 years, and that could be his genetic limit. Bigger muscles like lats or quads have more potential for growth, but even then, recovery and connective tissue impose limits. The real issue is a lack of understanding. You can’t just start with 50 sets per muscle group. Training smarter means prioritizing specific muscle groups in phases while maintaining others. That’s how you make meaningful progress. Lastly, this misunderstanding isn’t the fault of science. Experts like Mike Israetel emphasize that studies explore human limits, not general prescriptions. If you're making progress with fewer sets, great-less is more. But if progress stalls, consider adding volume as a tool for progressive overload, along with adjusting calories or tweaking your program. Science provides TOOLS, not dogma. It’s not a “bible” you accept on faith. You need to understand that studies focus on averages, and you might differ from the "average Joe." If that’s the case, it’s not the fault of “useless” science-it’s a misunderstanding of how to apply its findings to your individual context.
I'm the guy who does the 32 sets. My logic was that if my initial workload (around 10-15 sets/week) didnt work, I just needed to keep hitting them harder, and more. My big jump from 15 sets to 24 sets, and my jump from 24 to 32 sets both resulted in very small strength gains (less than 5 lbs), before quickly hitting another plateau. This leads me to beleive that my only hope of really maxing out my side delts potential is in increasing my workload until I reach a place where I can't reasonably perform more, and then ill drop my volume down to 20 sets and focus on another muscle. People in the thread were giving varied opinions, but I really couldnt see any of their tips resulting in more side delt gains. I personally have only ever been able to clearly break plateaus by either adding volume, or adding intensity (which is difficult when your already taking every single set to failure)
@@aidangarrity7620 I don’t see a problem with focusing on your side delts if that’s your priority. However, you need to find out what works for you and weigh the time cost and effort against the potential gains. For example, adding an extra hour to your weekly program just to gain 100-200 grams on your side delts over 1-2 years might not be worth it for everyone. Your side delts won’t grow indefinitely. Sooner or later, you’ll hit your genetic ceiling (if you haven’t already). You might only be able to add 100 grams more to your side delts, and that’s it-they’re a very small muscle group. Delts are generally weaker compared to larger muscle groups, so it’s unrealistic to expect lifting 100 pounds in lateral raises. The only way to train them effectively is with high volume, including drop sets and similar techniques. But it’s also important to remember that the coveted V-shape isn’t just about side delts. The time you invest in side delts could be spent developing other muscles that contribute to the V-shape, like your lats or chest. If you’re willing to commit to this, that’s fine-just make sure you’ve explored all possibilities. A volume of 20-30 sets per week for side delts seems reasonable. Maybe increasing it to 32-40 sets might give you an extra 10% growth-or no growth at all if you’ve already reached your genetic potential.
try less volume and splitting your volume into more exercises. Trying different variations of side delt raises might help you find a better way of doing things. Overall, you can’t really rush side delt growth and expect increases as fast as you would for other bigger muscles. For most muscles I can assess progress every 1-2 months to make sure my program is working. For side delts I have to assess over a 3-4 months timeframe, because they’re just small compared to other muscles. For insurance, get stronger on overhead press and lateral raise (any variation for each) over a long period of time. For lateral raises just put the work in and check In 3-4 months if progress has been made, don’t worry about the short term.
Guys, don't engage with trolls/bots. It gives them more incentive to waste their life. Ignore it and don't talk about it. Ironic I know, I am leaving a comment under one, but I hope it deters people from engaging with this.
Faz is 43 I believe. If you've watched anything of Faz you'll know he's been training for over 20 years and he's not some random dude off the street, he knows bodybuilding inside out. 43 isn't that old, he admits being bigger in the past and is happy that he has downsized, not something someone who would take something to keep size would feel
Need Coaching? Enquiries here: docs.google.com/forms/d/15_F8NS9vWIZUGlPXv-jGeFO9vVCyEKUFTmwuJo3RHlA/viewform?edit_requested=true
Want personalised advice but not ready for Coaching? View my non-coaching, one off bespoke services here: fazlifts.co.uk/collections/services
All My Training Programs On Boostcamp. Use my code FAZLIFTS for a free 2 week premium trial: www.boostcamp.app/#fazlifts
eBooks: fazlifts.co.uk/collections/e-books
My Training Fundamentals Playlist: th-cam.com/play/PLcBzFSqsHKhs5muajYxG70uCcwGJ8IV3h.html
"Everybody wants to be a bodybuilder... but nobody wants to do 52 sets of lengthened partials with an 18 second cadence at 5 RIR using Concurrent Periodisation for Hypertrophy. " - Issac Newton
hahahaha, right!?
1 less RIR on any exercise and my lower back wouldn't recover so 5 RiR is optimal.
@@kgc0609No way bro, 0-1 RIR or you may as well be muh EXeRciSe ScIenTiStths and start pinning Dr Mike semen by the gallons.
😂
Thank you Greg.
I had to rewatch the whole video. I was to distracted with the awesome equipment the first time.
I am very lucky! Best gym in England on my doorstep 🥹
I legit put my back and legs on maintenance volume so I can grow my arms, 4 sets per week on back and legs and they are growing and my strength is skyrocketing 😂
Where do you get the nerve, sir...
@seawhales1000 try it for yourself and see
im the reddit OP LMFAOO
RIP
Upon reading the title I thought the number was going to be a reference to how much somebody spent on gear, upon listening a few minutes I'm going to start upping my imaginary sculpture game 😂
I sculpted 20 statues this morning!
(Had to change the video title, didn't do well)
I'm here because of GVS. Big recommendation to reach out to Big Paul over at anabolic bodybuilding, they have a Sunday 11am ET show and love having people hang and talk lifting.
I am aware of Paul, he's a good dude but our primary audiences are quite different.
Would love to see a collab video here! 😊
@@lindsays8849 yeah sure I'm open to it, like I say he's a good dude.
On the other hand, you have Dr. Pak who shows 3 sets/week is effective, and while interviewing Schoenfeld, he admitted that 4 sets/week is effective. Over and above that, what is OPTIMAL depends on the individual's MRV. Plus it varies from exercise to exercise.
Pak is one of the better ones, as he tends to just say "ignore the studies and do the lifts you like in the way you like". Admittedly, he tends to say that towards the end of 12 minutes of "the sciences sez...".
18,000 set imaginary side delts incoming
That made me almost spit out my tea, lmao. Infinite imaginary gains!
Great info! "The Emperor's New Clothes"...was written in the early 1800's. Takes a while for some folks to catch on.
What a fool! He should be doing 64 sets of lengthen cable laterals
all this fancy machines look so nice !
Great analogy. Also it's funny because In France, we call smooth talkers "hot air sculptors and smoke stirrers." (des sculpteurs d'air chaud, et brasseurs de fumée).
I like that expression!
Phronesis - practical wisdom gained via experience- is one of the classical Aristotelian virtues. You can assume an experienced lifter is going to have more of that in spades than someone who is just citing a study and nothing else. Also, that incline chest press machine looks amazing with the ability to adjust where the handles actually start, seems very helpful for long wingspan guys.
Regardless of whether the volume studies are flawed, your arguments don't apply because these studies are not theoretical, abstract or imagination. They are concrete studies done with actual people that get tangible results. How and why they get these results and what they mean is another story, but they're not "outside reality" or "just imagination"
What I see over and over are studies referred to by other influencers and no mention of the control groups. Who was tested? Ages? Veterans or newbies? Men, women, or a mix? If I am going to base what I do on "the newest study just out" the first thing I'm doing is finding the study and reading it, discerning the control group populations and then determining if it is applicable to my situation which, time and again, I've found it is not. You see this in medicine as well. Who was tested matters, it's crucial, in fact, in self-application.
Your gym looks amazing!
Science says "stand on one leg (unilateral force production & enhanced rate coding)"... Science says "sit on one of the benches all morning (dose response relationship)"... Science says "bounce up and down (lengthened partial squats)"... "Lift increasing poundage, with good form, in moderate rep ranges.". Whoopsie, you didn't say "SCIENCE SAYS"!!!
Appreciate the training footage bro. And the tone of the video. Talking about the 52 set study with pinkies raised with a haughty laugh sounds like the right thing to do.
Do you yhink jts worth training obliques directly? Seem to be conflicting opinions ive seen on this.
But big obliques wont grow in a day like some people make it out to be lol
Brilliant, elegant, powerful
-amen
Faz what’s your opinion on the pullover machine ?
Saw that thread too. Don't ask for advice if you're just gonna double down
@fazlifts hey Faz, love your content. Quick questions about your shoes in this clip, adidas powerlift?
Adipowers original
Thanks Faz!
I have a question is there any benefit for squeezing the muscle for 1 or 2 sets at the top example incline DB Press or does it depend on certain exercises?
You might have noticed my comment. One guy said "Who told you to do 32 sets!?" i then linked a video of Mike Israetel saying some lifters should do as many as 40 sets of side delts. He then replies defensively saying "aCtUaLlY he doesn't recommend that"
Perfect example of the cognitive dissonance you speak of between getting behind the theoretical circle jerk, but logically understanding how proposterous all of this is in practice.
I did! That was a brilliant reply 😂
Reddit is where people who don't know what they're doing go and argue with others who don't know what they're doing. So I try to avoid it.
My training arc is similar to Faz, I’m also 43 and been doing this seriously about 21 or so years. Here’s what I know to be true, weekly volumes are just a distraction to what matters. I’m training with roughly 4 sets per miscle every 4ish days on an upper/lower. Basically I train every other day and I’m still gaining strength and muscle. When i get lost in the volume science and try to adjust my training it fails. I always end up back to where I am, low to moderate per session volumes with adequate recovery time to allow me to progress.Its that simple. All of this TH-cam content exists to make faux celebrities out of irrelevant personalities.
I want to clarify that This channel is not irrelevant. I’m referring to the peddlers of volume snake oil.
I understood what you meant and agree :) Appreciate you Kevin
Unc lookin' absolutely peeled🤙
Thanks for noticing! I just finished a 10 week pretty aggressive diet phase.
I'm 90% sure the imaginary statue thing is some sort of money laundering, add 5% to that considering the sculptor is Italian.
Is there even research in the area of hypertrophy that can be qualified as scientific?
All the studies I have looked into show muscle growth (volume, thickness or crosssectional area) in the order of 5% after 8 to 12 weeks (typically). Those increases are even reported in studies that exclude beginners.
Extrapolate those gains to a year …
How can that be?
Imagine we intermediates could grow our arms by 20%+ per year.
Something is really wrong with the research in this field.
Interpolation is considered a relatively reasonable modeling practice, all things being equal, extrapolation can become dangerous very quickly.
I had to go and read up about that ‘sculpture’ because I couldn’t believe that was true. Turns out, the artist has apparently sold more than 1 ‘invisible sculpture’! 😂
Good vid Faz 👍
It's wild what people try and pass off as art. I remember John Cage "composed" a piece of music called 4'33", and instructed the orchestra to sit still and not play a note for 4 mins 33 seconds. Then the audience would clap at the end of the "performance" 😂😂😂
@@martinpharrison yes, I remember being told about that! 😂 it’s crazy how much of a fine line there is between doing something like that and it being hailed as a profound event rather than someone exhibiting signs of madness 😂
Think money laundering and trafficking and art world makes more sense.
When the notification actually goes off at the right time 🎉
Looking incredibly stout in the thumbnail Faz
Yeah thanks man. I just finished a 10 week pretty aggressive diet phase.
I dunno man. It sounds like you just didn't SEEEEE the sculpture. You've gotta use your internal eye. 32 sets is just one eye open. 52 is both eyes wide. SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I wish I had a ketchup gym to train in.
It's pretty sweet
@@Fazlifts lol good one
💪💪
Are you natty?
Yes
Algorithm
Hey faz I just noticed you look like Silvester Stallone
Bruh, I always thought that too! He's like a British Rambo.
I am not sure i quite agree. A study is a study. It tests things under certain conditions. When the authors of the study themselves promote lower and medium volumes, but suggest that in case they do not work you should consider a higher volume specilization phase, i do not think it is their fault.
They made 5 hour video about it. If you wish to watch a tiktok about it then go ahead and do whatever. you want, but how is that a peoblem with the science?
I read the study and they have a freaking table showing that the first 4-6 sets are the most important of ALL the volume you do.
At the same table they show that after the 10-20 range you are getting so much less.
If doing more sets takes away from the intensity and focus, then they are probably not worth doing.
If you wish to specialise in a specific muscle group they even mentioned that you would have to take MORE important sets from other muscle groups, so you can do more sets that matter LESS for the muscles groups you chose.
That's what I got from their explanation of their paper.
How is that misrepresenting anything?
Hope you find a nice spot for your statue.
I'm literally training with your arms and delts specializatio for the past year.
And I think that there is no conflict between that and the research to be honest.
In fact the only money I've spent is on your ebooks (before they were free on boostcamp- still worth it btw) and GVS's books. I do not need to pay anything to read a study. And I can also count the sets for biceps on the berserker (counting bench for 0.5 for example for tris) and find 30 sets for biceps. So I am literally wandering what the big deal is with 30 sets when you sell a program that has that much volume.
@@Fazlifts
What you’re saying is nonsense. The guy you're referring to clearly doesn’t understand the science behind increasing volume. It's not about doing high volume indefinitely-it’s about short, focused periods of increased workload. If you’re not progressing, it means the volume is too much, as progressive overload isn’t being achieved.
Also, his argument ignores basic facts: progress isn’t endless, and side delts (or any small muscle group) have limited growth potential. With poor genetics, he might gain 100-200 grams of muscle on his delts over 2-3 years, and that could be his genetic limit. Bigger muscles like lats or quads have more potential for growth, but even then, recovery and connective tissue impose limits.
The real issue is a lack of understanding. You can’t just start with 50 sets per muscle group. Training smarter means prioritizing specific muscle groups in phases while maintaining others. That’s how you make meaningful progress.
Lastly, this misunderstanding isn’t the fault of science. Experts like Mike Israetel emphasize that studies explore human limits, not general prescriptions. If you're making progress with fewer sets, great-less is more. But if progress stalls, consider adding volume as a tool for progressive overload, along with adjusting calories or tweaking your program.
Science provides TOOLS, not dogma. It’s not a “bible” you accept on faith. You need to understand that studies focus on averages, and you might differ from the "average Joe." If that’s the case, it’s not the fault of “useless” science-it’s a misunderstanding of how to apply its findings to your individual context.
I'm the guy who does the 32 sets. My logic was that if my initial workload (around 10-15 sets/week) didnt work, I just needed to keep hitting them harder, and more. My big jump from 15 sets to 24 sets, and my jump from 24 to 32 sets both resulted in very small strength gains (less than 5 lbs), before quickly hitting another plateau. This leads me to beleive that my only hope of really maxing out my side delts potential is in increasing my workload until I reach a place where I can't reasonably perform more, and then ill drop my volume down to 20 sets and focus on another muscle. People in the thread were giving varied opinions, but I really couldnt see any of their tips resulting in more side delt gains. I personally have only ever been able to clearly break plateaus by either adding volume, or adding intensity (which is difficult when your already taking every single set to failure)
@@aidangarrity7620 I don’t see a problem with focusing on your side delts if that’s your priority. However, you need to find out what works for you and weigh the time cost and effort against the potential gains. For example, adding an extra hour to your weekly program just to gain 100-200 grams on your side delts over 1-2 years might not be worth it for everyone.
Your side delts won’t grow indefinitely. Sooner or later, you’ll hit your genetic ceiling (if you haven’t already). You might only be able to add 100 grams more to your side delts, and that’s it-they’re a very small muscle group.
Delts are generally weaker compared to larger muscle groups, so it’s unrealistic to expect lifting 100 pounds in lateral raises. The only way to train them effectively is with high volume, including drop sets and similar techniques. But it’s also important to remember that the coveted V-shape isn’t just about side delts. The time you invest in side delts could be spent developing other muscles that contribute to the V-shape, like your lats or chest.
If you’re willing to commit to this, that’s fine-just make sure you’ve explored all possibilities. A volume of 20-30 sets per week for side delts seems reasonable. Maybe increasing it to 32-40 sets might give you an extra 10% growth-or no growth at all if you’ve already reached your genetic potential.
try less volume and splitting your volume into more exercises. Trying different variations of side delt raises might help you find a better way of doing things. Overall, you can’t really rush side delt growth and expect increases as fast as you would for other bigger muscles. For most muscles I can assess progress every 1-2 months to make sure my program is working. For side delts I have to assess over a 3-4 months timeframe, because they’re just small compared to other muscles. For insurance, get stronger on overhead press and lateral raise (any variation for each) over a long period of time. For lateral raises just put the work in and check In 3-4 months if progress has been made, don’t worry about the short term.
God you sound like a pencil neck.
99% of fitness content on social media is silly slop
Yeah it's no wonder content creators resort to entertainment before education.
That's what people want to see ☹️
YOU are fakeNatty bro admit that you are on TRT+
he is 50 years old he take test it is normal this days
@@rrrBIGBOYno it's not normal. It's common, but it's not normal.
A 1 day old account dropping an unoriginal troll comment 🥱 come on, at least come up with something funny or new
Guys, don't engage with trolls/bots. It gives them more incentive to waste their life. Ignore it and don't talk about it. Ironic I know, I am leaving a comment under one, but I hope it deters people from engaging with this.
Faz is 43 I believe. If you've watched anything of Faz you'll know he's been training for over 20 years and he's not some random dude off the street, he knows bodybuilding inside out. 43 isn't that old, he admits being bigger in the past and is happy that he has downsized, not something someone who would take something to keep size would feel