The car was pretty good with an excellent ride, almost Citroen like. Trouble is it's in the British psyche to trash everything we make, a kind off self harm I guess. The only odd thing is it looked like a hatch back, but it wasn't. I loved it's looks and still do, a million times better looking than a Cortina
@supernumery That's not very polite is it. Yes I've driven one when it was brand new a 2200 HLS automatic. When you talk about the accumulators you mean spheres which is something completely different. Yes a few leaked but units were designed to last 15 years. Citroen had problems with their system too. I think you need to look at the competition at the time, many of which were using leaf springs on a live axle which isn't great
Well I had 2! First one was an 1800 not in very good condition. Front wheel collapsed at a junction, and the carbon clutch release bearing went at an awkward time. Second was a 2200HLS with automatic transmission, and power steering, an altogether much better car. Took a family of 5 on a touring holiday from the south coast uk, up the west coast-lake district-loch Lomond-isle of Skye-then across to Inverness - Edinburgh-down the east coast to Nottingham -York and then home to Sussex. 2,121 miles in ten days. Never missed a beat (apart from a slight engine timing adjustment -by ear-at lake Windermere, to cure very slight pinking). Did the Hardknot pass amongst others. Great car, powerful and very comfortable. Surprisingly quick off the lights if you floored it, particularly with the auto box (3 speed), tended to surprise other drivers😊
i still have one here in italy, it's beat up,but...hardly misses a beat ! people stare at it and say.....what an ugly car, so what, it is so confortable ,and maybe in 10 years her odd lines might be more appreciated. WELL DONE POSTING SUCH A NICE MEMORY !!
Yes, I'm sure that's right. Build quality was very varied. But it was fundamentally a good car. My first one was a Mk 1 1800. It was about 7 years old when I traded it in with poor paintwork and a leaking petrol tank. My second one was a Mk 2 2000 and it still drove like new with shiny paint when I traded it in for a new 1700 Ambassador. Both cars had a wonderful ride and were excellent family cars. The unions set about trying to destroy the British car industry and finally succeeded. You might look up Red Robbo on: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derek_Robinson_(trade_unionist) Anyway, my American friends complained when the door handle fell off their new Mercedes - so build standard was variable there too!
Had a 2 litre wedge in Vermillion Red as a Taxi which would embarrass the newer Ford Sierras in performance and ride quality... and rear seat room was second to non.
My dad had one. Good memories. Except the 1981 holidays. It broke down numerous times. The temperature kept going up. It was a nightmare. It took us 6 days to reach Garda Lake in Italy from Holland.
The theme tune is Terry and June. In this programme from 1979-87 Terry's first car was a blue Mk2 Ford Granada, but he had two Princesses and an Ambassador before the Ford Sierra. The Princess looked like a big Allegro, and was roomy and comfortable. A distinctive shape, and the next BL car up was the Rover SD1 (never travelled in one). Like the Morris Marina that was facelifted and renamed Ital, the Princess became the Ambassador before the Montego appeared in 1984.
HJP1 HJP2 To be fair it also became a hatchback when it became the Ambassador and it only shared the floor pan with the Princess also they dropped the six cylinder engine in favour of the 2.0 O series which was never as good as the E+ engine.
I bought a mk5 Cortina trade many years ago but had to take a w reg princess 1700 auto as a job lot so I left the princess there a few days did not really want it but eventually I had to pick it up I was surprise how nice it drove and comfortable it was to the extent that I put it in for a m.o.t and it passed though the Cortina sold for a lot more money then the princess in my eyes the princess was more comfortable and drove nicer
As a boy I thought that the Princess looked pretty cool. I only once rode in one being used as a taxi from Windermere station and I can confirm that it was one of the most comfortable rides I have ever had and being prone to car sickness I would know. The seats were indeed fabulous.
My dad had a W reg HL in jobby brown 2.2 litre for taxiiing, i was driving it at 17 , the steering was so light and it went like fook, shame as he scrapped when the clutch pedal went stiff, my dad wasnt mechanically minded but a very nice riding car, in every sense........
The Hydrogas suspension and probably it's most refined form in the Princess is advanced even by today's standards. How many other cars Including the Allegro today in this price range have fully independent rear suspension...none, you have to make do with a torsion beam. The ride was almost Citroen like as in hydropneumatic
the cool thing about these old cars is they stand out next to your bog standard modern car when on the road. speaking of old cars i wish they would bring back the hillman imp, keep the shape but modernise the engine etc, would be amazing
Never previously heard thew full theme for "Terry & June". I actually liked the short lived Ambassador which replaced the Princess. Shame no one though to offer a straight six and five speed box. Ambassador made do with twin-SU O series engine.
Watching those bastards on Top Gear abusing the Princess by filling it with water made me so angry. There can't be many left now & the one they were abusing looked immaculate.
Its even worse than you think. Apparently the one used on Top Gear had actually been restored not long before James May bought it and the BBC lowered the hydrogas suspension on purpose for comedy effect!
When I was a kid, we regarded these as an old man's car. But looking at them now, they were a pretty cool design. Just a pity the unions screwed up production and BL management used to have a lineup of cars that competed against itself. Crazy.
Excellent!! Love the Princess Tribute video!! Also love your Allegro Tribute video!! You just gotta complete the set of 1970's Austins and do an Austin Maxi Tribute video!! :o) Remember there were three versions:- Mk1 1969-1971 ~ Mk2 1971-1980 ~ Mk3 1980-1982 (badged as a Maxi2)
Initially known as the Austin/ Morris 1800/2200 and Wolseley Six with different headlamps looking so different to the previous landcrab, before the Princess name was chosen for all models, and facelifted in 1981 to become the Ambassador. The only Princess I have travelled in was a taxi.
supernumery You're right in so far as the only body component common to the ambassador and Princess was the floorpan but mechanically they were the same as the Princess 2. On the launch course at the factory the official line was that they had produced the Ambassador as a hatchback because Maxi production was finishing and the reason they didn't produce a six cylinder version was because they felt it would affect sales of the new Rover SD1 2300/2600 cars which is also why they killed off the Triumph 2000/2500. all very different cars catering for different markets but BL couldn't see that at the time.
I used to drive my dads blue Austin Princess in the late 80's early nineties and loved driving the car as it was very easy to drive and very smooth to be honest, shame when it went, I think it was after the dog decided to chew the front seats after my dad left the dog inside, so can't blame the dog lol
Old guy in my street had a Woleseley version of this with a 2.5 straight six and power steering etc, illuminated woleseley badge on the grille, it had fuel injection and it burned to the ground when it developed a high pressure fuel leak in the engine bay :(
i love "automatic LOL from everyone around me " so I love to drive around in my little princess 2200 HLS ;-) By the way the mighty ISO Lele V8 has the same style and aproach like the Princess...Lele is Italian fo Lilly, so in a Lele Iso you are driving around in a Lilly ;-)))
+Haffschlappe arm... sorry, but italian for "lilly" is "giglio" the therm "lele" must be some Gallo-Romance (northern italian,Piedmont, Lombardy, Emilia) term.
@piesior Not at all bad...had it fettled and through the MOT then drove it back from Devon to London, no problems. Cassette player thrown in. Two weeks later the alternator belt went but that`s hardly the car`s fault. If you know these cars instead of being brainwashed by Jezza et al , you know what excellent value they represent for space and comfort. My only regret is the lack of power steering which is heavy at parking speed-still, I need the exercise.
These were terrifically good cars. More fools the British public for not buying them in sufficient numbers. I had a gold coloured Princess 2 (2200). I never figured out when you got a vinyl covered roof or a painted roof (which I would have preferred), or a painted roof, with a vinyl panel behind the side windows. Did I miss a rear hatch? No. Not really. But they could have made the interior facia, a bit nicer.
Until this thing was released, the Princess name was reserved for large cars of genuine luxury and presence that royalty found fit to be seen in. BL had the immense ability to ruin anything of any value others had spent years creating - Triumph, Rover, Vanden Plas.
As conceived the car was pitched at the fleet car market on the assumption that the market would size up half a size again in 75 as it had done with the Cortina mk2 in 67 and mk3 in 71. So it's modest performance from its 1800 B series engine and a drive focussed on comfort rather than performance was considered acceptable. However the fuel crisis happened and the sector stayed the same size with the Cortuna mk4 So the car found itself being too big and expensive for the fleet market and lacking the Grace and Pace for executive market.
@@musclerent No not really as the sales figures show, private customers preferred the European offerings such as the CX or an SD1 2300 which offered better performance and features such as a 5 speed gearbox and fleet customers opted for the Granada 2.3 or SD1 2300. The 2200 had no market traction and of course when the Ambassador reskin came along, they dropped it.
@@grahamariss2111The SD1 was a more expensive car and more sophisticated in some ways. The Princess did suffer in that the engines were really old along with the gearbox and quality wasn't that great, mind you neither was the SD1. The truth is the Princess was basically a good car perhaps lacking image, or the right one at least and deserved to do better being genuinely different and offering a ride only the Citroen could match but without the complexity and cost. Brits don't love anything that's different from the bog standard, certainly in the late 70's anyway...it's a real shame
@@musclerent At no point did I say itvwas a bad car, but the point was that it was because the market did not develop as expected was it was squeezed out between the executive class with the basic SD1 / Granada and the fleet market that was defined by the Cortina. As for ride yes its ride was good but very soft in part due to the decision to run very low tyre pressures which endowed it with very uninspired handling. But the biggest failing was the lack of speed the 1800 was a sub 100 mph car on a par with a Cortina 1600 and the 2200 whist better was not much better. Whilst this would have acceptable in the rep car market it was not in the executive class it found itself priced into., but there was little motive to resolve the issue, because whilst giving it more pace and firming up the handling would not have been that hard, would have put up against the SD1 2300 which was in the same price bracket as a 2200 HLS.
@@grahamariss2111 It was never intended to be an executive car. It didn't compete with the more expensive SD1 as that was a Rover and the Princess an Austin, technically interesting but lower down the food chain at BL. The handling was fine, it was never meant to be driven like a sports car, you could buy a more expensive Triumph 2500 for that
I'm so conflicted when it comes to the Princess. I'm on both sides of the Marmite fence. I both love and dislike its styling. There's a lot that's so very good and cool as about it and a lot that's naff and frumpy. It has a Lamborghini Espada/1971-2 mid-sized Mopar muscle car look about it; that sassy alternative Chrysler coolness (even though it's BL not Rootes). "Oh, cripes DM!!!" (Penfold)
Fairly solid wedge when you look at it. Could of done with a lot more power though. The 0-60 time of the 2200HL took about 14 seconds according to most reports! Not good against the Essex V6 Granada!!
Wolsley 18,22 just about hacks it stylewise, but this car could have been a lot better, around the time don't forget that British engineers, once being ploughed into British industry, could get paid more abroad. Hence, resulting car - minus hatchback - was 'the thin edge of the wedge!' I mean BL was finished and if the new Rover had been given the Aussie engine etc...
We have quite a number of these in the 80's, but they rust like mad. Engines oil leaks. AUCKLAND NEW ZEALAND. Motor Corporation in Takapuna, New Market to name a few.
Very interesting comments. I have to say I did not own a Princess but did own other BL cars. Seems to be a mixed bag. My BL cars never let me down and were a good cars. One of my friends had a 2.2 Princess very comfortable like riding on air and contory to what is said was reliable. I think the problem is comes down to the experience each person had with there cars. I had a good experience with BL cars and many of my friends did. I also know many people had problems with BL cars but how many of them had cars that were second hand and not serviced properly?
I think that would be more realistic with the SD1. Imagine if we could still get new bodyshells from India - which is where, (I think) the tooling ended up.
It is a very distinctive car and boasted an excellent ride and massive passenger space. However, early reliability problems and strikes sealed its fate even if the Princess came good later on. Same as everything else BL made in the seventies and eighties, though it wasn't as bad as the Montego, which was rubbish.
@supernumery There was nothing wrong with the Hydrogas suspension and it was fully developed. The way it worked was similar to the Citroen system in many ways but without the complexity, weight and cost. The Citroen system also has reliability issues and cost a fortune to fix. Citroen themselves have now dropped their system mainly due to cost and adopted clever dampers to mimic many of the traits of the hydropneumatic system. Something else people forget is the BL Hydrogas system allowed a fully independent rear suspension which is increasingly only available on premium cars today. To sum up the BL Hydrogas nitrogen suspended cars were unique and advanced even by today's standards. You'd need to spend £40,000+ today to equal what was standard on cars ranging from very low budget to high mid range then.
laszlo katona It’s a pity that the British automotive industry committed suicide but a relieve that Honda and the other japanese car brands would step in and help britain regain it’s former glory as a car producing nation.
musclerent I guess that it’s fairly simple if you think about it. Dodgy design and a quality control below all reasonably measures. Not even the chinese could produce such a load of rubbish. The buyers wanted reliability and deacent quality. They got that from Toyota and Mazda.
@@kasperkjrsgaard1447 The designs were far from dodgy, quality was. In many respects the cars were technically superior to the competition, which were Ford, and GM or Vauxhall and produced in the UK and neither of which were exciting or very good. I assume your reference to the Japanese is them coming over into the UK and producing cars?. That happened largely because we were inviting and in the EU, unfortunately that looks set to end and thus any reason for them being here
Still better than any crap imported to the U.S.A. Beats the opel G.T., M.G.B. not real great, X1-9 Fiat good lord thats the worst car ever (although cornering was amazing). Then U.S.A. had pinto, mavric, gremlin and crappy as# pacers. That Austin looks cool as hell compared to those!
Don,t like those UGLY square headlights! Round headlight model were much better looking. My Father owed two Princesses, an 1800 manual and a 2000 auto, very comfy riding LOADS of room inside, tons of room in the engine bay, never seen more room not even in a V8 car.
Harris Mann, David Bache, Spen King to name a few of the designers. Yes it was an odd shape but all the designers at BL were hamstrung for various reasons......coin, government bureaucracy etc. Both the Allegro and the Princess (to name a few of the BL range) were far removed from the initial drawings/clay mockups that were the beginnings. Not forgetting the strikes that beset BL, the trade unions and incompetent management....:/
@@paulanderson79 I think the board of directors were a bunch of old farts insulated from the real world. Many innovations did get through but sooooooo much more could have been done. Hydrolastic and Hydrogas suspension, the transverse engine, 60/40 rear seat are just some that come to mind. The true reason that BL failed can be summed up by the development of the Marina, you couldn't have dreamt it up, almost like a Carry On film...
@@musclerent very very apt analogy. Nice one. Regressing to rwd for a start. There are arguments for rwd but in mainstream cars fwd make perfect sense.
Well put! My dad had one for his first company car. My best memory was at Windsor safari Park and the monkeys pulled of the wipers and side repeaters and then had a go at the vinyl roof. It's was a MG Maestro after that, then he saw sense and went for Ford cars!
@supernumery although reliability wasn't great the car reviews at the time were very positive. No other manufacturer could match it on interior space and ride quality for the price. Yes I was around in the late 70's and I remember Ford having problems too!. What BL did exceptionally badly was PR, truly appalling, whilst Ford got their cars into exciting police programmes BL was stuck with Terry and June. Oh just one further thing, I've found a company restoring old Princesses to a new condition...and I'm thinking about buying one, why?, nostalgia and I know just how got they are when they are working!!
This video looks happy. Im watching it over 10 years.
My father had an 1800 with the beautiful round headlights. I used to drive my girlfriend home in it. I loved the car. Spacious and comfortable.
We had the Austin Princess; burgundy with black roof!! Classic car, I loved it when I was younger!!!
I don't know why this car is mocked so, it's a good looking car.
LOL!
The car was pretty good with an excellent ride, almost Citroen like. Trouble is it's in the British psyche to trash everything we make, a kind off self harm I guess. The only odd thing is it looked like a hatch back, but it wasn't. I loved it's looks and still do, a million times better looking than a Cortina
@supernumery That's not very polite is it. Yes I've driven one when it was brand new a 2200 HLS automatic. When you talk about the accumulators you mean spheres which is something completely different. Yes a few leaked but units were designed to last 15 years. Citroen had problems with their system too. I think you need to look at the competition at the time, many of which were using leaf springs on a live axle which isn't great
@paul austin I don't think so, what makes you think that?
supernumery No, no. That's not fair. The cassette DID work. On mine it was fine unless you wanted to rewind the tape.
The Princess was actually a really good car and one of the best BL ever made. I think it's got a reputation it doesn't deserve.
It was crap
@supernumery I still do, great car!
I had the 2200 HLS, like driving an armchair, great car, was sorry when my wife talked me into a new Maestro.
You can’t find a used one in Europe so either the owners keep them or they’ve just disappeared into the thin air.
@@DaveCorbey It was a nice, comfortable car with reasonable performance for a family saloon.
Well I had 2!
First one was an 1800 not in very good condition. Front wheel collapsed at a junction, and the carbon clutch release bearing went at an awkward time.
Second was a 2200HLS with automatic transmission, and power steering, an altogether much better car.
Took a family of 5 on a touring holiday from the south coast uk, up the west coast-lake district-loch Lomond-isle of Skye-then across to Inverness - Edinburgh-down the east coast to Nottingham -York and then home to Sussex. 2,121 miles in ten days. Never missed a beat (apart from a slight engine timing adjustment -by ear-at lake Windermere, to cure very slight pinking).
Did the Hardknot pass amongst others.
Great car, powerful and very comfortable.
Surprisingly quick off the lights if you floored it, particularly with the auto box (3 speed), tended to surprise other drivers😊
Bloody cheek!
i had a t reg 1.8 and i still regret selling it, one of my best ever cars, like driving in your armchair
what a car i had one in british racing green.....god did i have some fun in 1983
Loved this car.
Had one for seven years, 200,000+ km without any problems.
i still have one here in italy, it's beat up,but...hardly misses a beat ! people stare at it and say.....what an ugly car, so what, it is so confortable ,and maybe in 10 years her odd lines might be more appreciated. WELL DONE POSTING SUCH A NICE MEMORY !!
Yes, I'm sure that's right. Build quality was very varied. But it was fundamentally a good car. My first one was a Mk 1 1800. It was about 7 years old when I traded it in with poor paintwork and a leaking petrol tank. My second one was a Mk 2 2000 and it still drove like new with shiny paint when I traded it in for a new 1700 Ambassador. Both cars had a wonderful ride and were excellent family cars.
The unions set about trying to destroy the British car industry and finally succeeded. You might look up Red Robbo on:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derek_Robinson_(trade_unionist)
Anyway, my American friends complained when the door handle fell off their new Mercedes - so build standard was variable there too!
I like this car the Austin princess THE 2200 HLS NICE CAR .
Brilliant car, one of the few marques I would happily buy again, comfort, speed space, great.
@@michaelhunt4445 good car i had one
Why didn't it get the Dolomite Sprint engine?
Had a 2 litre wedge in Vermillion Red as a Taxi which would embarrass the newer Ford Sierras in performance and ride quality... and rear seat room was second to non.
My dad had one. Good memories. Except the 1981 holidays. It broke down numerous times. The temperature kept going up. It was a nightmare. It took us 6 days to reach Garda Lake in Italy from Holland.
The theme tune is Terry and June. In this programme from 1979-87 Terry's first car was a blue Mk2 Ford Granada, but he had two Princesses and an Ambassador before the Ford Sierra. The Princess looked like a big Allegro, and was roomy and comfortable. A distinctive shape, and the next BL car up was the Rover SD1 (never travelled in one). Like the Morris Marina that was facelifted and renamed Ital, the Princess became the Ambassador before the Montego appeared in 1984.
HJP1 HJP2 To be fair it also became a hatchback when it became the Ambassador and it only shared the floor pan with the Princess also they dropped the six cylinder engine in favour of the 2.0 O series which was never as good as the E+ engine.
The music is just perfect for this tribute.
Seems like a very nice car indeed, I'd like to own one some day.
I think it's the theme for Terry & June isn't it?
Quite a nice car back in the day - with rear seat comfort and legroom that was fantastic. The best was the 2.2 6 cylinder version , a really nice car.
I bought a mk5 Cortina trade many years ago but had to take a w reg princess 1700 auto as a job lot so I left the princess there a few days did not really want it but eventually I had to pick it up I was surprise how nice it drove and comfortable it was to the extent that I put it in for a m.o.t and it passed though the Cortina sold for a lot more money then the princess in my eyes the princess was more comfortable and drove nicer
@supernumery and how many years did that take?
Most comfortable backseats ever :)
Provided it's not being driven.
As a boy I thought that the Princess looked pretty cool. I only once rode in one being used as a taxi from Windermere station and I can confirm that it was one of the most comfortable rides I have ever had and being prone to car sickness I would know. The seats were indeed fabulous.
My dad had a W reg HL in jobby brown 2.2 litre for taxiiing, i was driving it at 17 , the steering was so light and it went like fook, shame as he scrapped when the clutch pedal went stiff, my dad wasnt mechanically minded but a very nice riding car, in every sense........
The Hydrogas suspension and probably it's most refined form in the Princess is advanced even by today's standards. How many other cars Including the Allegro today in this price range have fully independent rear suspension...none, you have to make do with a torsion beam. The ride was almost Citroen like as in hydropneumatic
the cool thing about these old cars is they stand out next to your bog standard modern car when on the road. speaking of old cars i wish they would bring back the hillman imp, keep the shape but modernise the engine etc, would be amazing
Never previously heard thew full theme for "Terry & June". I actually liked the short lived Ambassador which replaced the Princess. Shame no one though to offer a straight six and five speed box. Ambassador made do with twin-SU O series engine.
@supernumery a totally different car...hmmmm
Watching those bastards on Top Gear abusing the Princess by filling it with water made me so angry. There can't be many left now & the one they were abusing looked immaculate.
Its even worse than you think.
Apparently the one used on Top Gear had actually been restored not long before James May bought it and the BBC lowered the hydrogas suspension on purpose for comedy effect!
@@Car_and_classic_lover BBC faking things, never.
I thought that too, what else should we have expected from them?
I owned a couple of these back when people gave them away, I always found them a decent drive, very comfy although the 1700 was underpowered
When I was a kid, we regarded these as an old man's car. But looking at them now, they were a pretty cool design. Just a pity the unions screwed up production and BL management used to have a lineup of cars that competed against itself. Crazy.
David you are now an old man sooo...
Excellent!! Love the Princess Tribute video!! Also love your Allegro Tribute video!! You just gotta complete the set of 1970's Austins and do an Austin Maxi Tribute video!! :o) Remember there were three versions:- Mk1 1969-1971 ~ Mk2 1971-1980 ~ Mk3 1980-1982 (badged as a Maxi2)
Initially known as the Austin/ Morris 1800/2200 and Wolseley Six with different headlamps looking so different to the previous landcrab, before the Princess name was chosen for all models, and facelifted in 1981 to become the Ambassador. The only Princess I have travelled in was a taxi.
supernumery You're right in so far as the only body component common to the ambassador and Princess was the floorpan but mechanically they were the same as the Princess 2. On the launch course at the factory the official line was that they had produced the Ambassador as a hatchback because Maxi production was finishing and the reason they didn't produce a six cylinder version was because they felt it would affect sales of the new Rover SD1 2300/2600 cars which is also why they killed off the Triumph 2000/2500. all very different cars catering for different markets but BL couldn't see that at the time.
The Wolseley Six was the previous car aka the "landcrab".
Nice cars. Just saw one on The Professionals. :D
I used to drive my dads blue Austin Princess in the late 80's early nineties and loved driving the car as it was very easy to drive and very smooth to be honest, shame when it went, I think it was after the dog decided to chew the front seats after my dad left the dog inside, so can't blame the dog lol
I want one!
I feel sorry for those from the old days because they were unable to enjoy driving Honda civic like we can today.
Old guy in my street had a Woleseley version of this with a 2.5 straight six and power steering etc, illuminated woleseley badge on the grille, it had fuel injection and it burned to the ground when it developed a high pressure fuel leak in the engine bay :(
Doo you mean 2.2?
A great passion wagon a mobile bed
I enjoyed this a lot. Thanks
I loved this car faultless.
i love "automatic LOL from everyone around me " so I love to drive around in my little princess 2200 HLS ;-)
By the way the mighty ISO Lele V8 has the same style and aproach like the Princess...Lele is Italian fo Lilly, so in a Lele Iso you are driving around in a Lilly ;-)))
+Haffschlappe arm... sorry, but italian for "lilly" is "giglio" the therm "lele" must be some Gallo-Romance (northern italian,Piedmont, Lombardy, Emilia)
term.
If the ISO has been made in Britain would it have been called the UK-Lele?
the front end reminds me of a peugeot 504
Lol i can't unsee it now 😂
@piesior
Not at all bad...had it fettled and through the MOT then drove it back from Devon to London, no problems. Cassette player thrown in. Two weeks later the alternator belt went but that`s hardly the car`s fault. If you know these cars instead of being brainwashed by Jezza et al , you know what excellent value they represent for space and comfort. My only regret is the lack of power steering which is heavy at parking speed-still, I need the exercise.
1:42 - love the expression on the face of the girl!
These were terrifically good cars. More fools the British public for not buying them in sufficient numbers.
I had a gold coloured Princess 2 (2200). I never figured out when you got a vinyl covered roof or a painted roof (which I would have preferred), or a painted roof, with a vinyl panel behind the side windows.
Did I miss a rear hatch? No. Not really. But they could have made the interior facia, a bit nicer.
Until this thing was released, the Princess name was reserved for large cars of genuine luxury and presence that royalty found fit to be seen in. BL had the immense ability to ruin anything of any value others had spent years creating - Triumph, Rover, Vanden Plas.
As conceived the car was pitched at the fleet car market on the assumption that the market would size up half a size again in 75 as it had done with the Cortina mk2 in 67 and mk3 in 71. So it's modest performance from its 1800 B series engine and a drive focussed on comfort rather than performance was considered acceptable. However the fuel crisis happened and the sector stayed the same size with the Cortuna mk4 So the car found itself being too big and expensive for the fleet market and lacking the Grace and Pace for executive market.
It had the grace, especially in 2200 form
@@musclerent No not really as the sales figures show, private customers preferred the European offerings such as the CX or an SD1 2300 which offered better performance and features such as a 5 speed gearbox and fleet customers opted for the Granada 2.3 or SD1 2300. The 2200 had no market traction and of course when the Ambassador reskin came along, they dropped it.
@@grahamariss2111The SD1 was a more expensive car and more sophisticated in some ways. The Princess did suffer in that the engines were really old along with the gearbox and quality wasn't that great, mind you neither was the SD1. The truth is the Princess was basically a good car perhaps lacking image, or the right one at least and deserved to do better being genuinely different and offering a ride only the Citroen could match but without the complexity and cost. Brits don't love anything that's different from the bog standard, certainly in the late 70's anyway...it's a real shame
@@musclerent At no point did I say itvwas a bad car, but the point was that it was because the market did not develop as expected was it was squeezed out between the executive class with the basic SD1 / Granada and the fleet market that was defined by the Cortina. As for ride yes its ride was good but very soft in part due to the decision to run very low tyre pressures which endowed it with very uninspired handling. But the biggest failing was the lack of speed the 1800 was a sub 100 mph car on a par with a Cortina 1600 and the 2200 whist better was not much better. Whilst this would have acceptable in the rep car market it was not in the executive class it found itself priced into., but there was little motive to resolve the issue, because whilst giving it more pace and firming up the handling would not have been that hard, would have put up against the SD1 2300 which was in the same price bracket as a 2200 HLS.
@@grahamariss2111 It was never intended to be an executive car. It didn't compete with the more expensive SD1 as that was a Rover and the Princess an Austin, technically interesting but lower down the food chain at BL. The handling was fine, it was never meant to be driven like a sports car, you could buy a more expensive Triumph 2500 for that
saw an ornage one the other day, 70s or what! Actually looked good
just saying, we had at the same time 2 VW Passat... the first run for 21 years and the 2nd for 14 years in the family... 55hp and 75hp
I'm so conflicted when it comes to the Princess. I'm on both sides of the Marmite fence. I both love and dislike its styling. There's a lot that's so very good and cool as about it and a lot that's naff and frumpy. It has a Lamborghini Espada/1971-2 mid-sized Mopar muscle car look about it; that sassy alternative Chrysler coolness (even though it's BL not Rootes).
"Oh, cripes DM!!!"
(Penfold)
"...and he's brought a piece of cheese"
Jeremy Clarkson: "...and he's brought a piece of cheese." :D
Was once tempted to buy the Wolseley version, not too many of them made
You would need a fair wedge to buy that version of the wedge.
Fairly solid wedge when you look at it. Could of done with a lot more power though. The 0-60 time of the 2200HL took about 14 seconds according to most reports!
Not good against the Essex V6 Granada!!
Wolsley 18,22 just about hacks it stylewise, but this car could have been a lot better, around the time don't forget that British engineers, once being ploughed into British industry, could get paid more abroad. Hence, resulting car - minus hatchback - was 'the thin edge of the wedge!' I mean BL was finished and if the new Rover had been given the Aussie engine etc...
We have quite a number of these in the 80's, but they rust like mad.
Engines oil leaks. AUCKLAND NEW ZEALAND. Motor Corporation in Takapuna, New Market to name a few.
Very interesting comments. I have to say I did not own a Princess but did own other BL cars. Seems to be a mixed bag. My BL cars never let me down and were a good cars. One of my friends had a 2.2 Princess very comfortable like riding on air and contory to what is said was reliable.
I think the problem is comes down to the experience each person had with there cars. I had a good experience with BL cars and many of my friends did.
I also know many people had problems with BL cars but how many of them had cars that were second hand and not serviced properly?
,,,I want one
Did bjorn borg drive one of these?great post thanks.
I'd love to convert a fleet of these to electric motors and see what they're like to drive.
I think a curse would happen and they would refuse to charge.
I think that would be more realistic with the SD1. Imagine if we could still get new bodyshells from India - which is where, (I think) the tooling ended up.
My grandad had one In dark brown and he got crashed into be a Renault estate back In the 90s and was almost killed
It is a very distinctive car and boasted an excellent ride and massive passenger space. However, early reliability problems and strikes sealed its fate even if the Princess came good later on. Same as everything else BL made in the seventies and eighties, though it wasn't as bad as the Montego, which was rubbish.
1:50 - the usual low one side Hydragas suspension. Shame BL didn't go the whole hog and do it Citroen's way.
@supernumery There was nothing wrong with the Hydrogas suspension and it was fully developed. The way it worked was similar to the Citroen system in many ways but without the complexity, weight and cost. The Citroen system also has reliability issues and cost a fortune to fix. Citroen themselves have now dropped their system mainly due to cost and adopted clever dampers to mimic many of the traits of the hydropneumatic system. Something else people forget is the BL Hydrogas system allowed a fully independent rear suspension which is increasingly only available on premium cars today. To sum up the BL Hydrogas nitrogen suspended cars were unique and advanced even by today's standards. You'd need to spend £40,000+ today to equal what was standard on cars ranging from very low budget to high mid range then.
Listen to the people not the "experts"
British nostalgia: on the continent nobody wanted it.
The challenging Brit answer to Citroën CX !
Annoyingly the CX was copied from the Pininfarina styled BMC Areodynamica 1800 1967. Have a Google you will be shocked. 😊
Where did you upload the "Terry and June" theme? Pity you didnt include a clip of NMO 49W...with Terry Scott at the wheel!!
Captain Nemo eating meat and 2 veg with Arthur Scargill. Don't tell me that's not how you remembered the registration! 😂
Liked the ambassador but not princess. Ambassador was more eighties in style and beefed up
Im buying my second one of these on Monday. Wish me luck ! What other car gets stared at quite as much ? You can keep yer bloody Murcielago.
9 years late but.... good luck :) wonder if they still have it?
Im 30 years younger now!
Its a shame that the brits handed over technology to honda ...
laszlo katona
It’s a pity that the British automotive industry committed suicide but a relieve that Honda and the other japanese car brands would step in and help britain regain it’s former glory as a car producing nation.
In what way did we the "Brits" hand over technology to Japan?
@@kasperkjrsgaard1447 How did three British car industry commit suicide? and how is Japan going to help?
musclerent
I guess that it’s fairly simple if you think about it. Dodgy design and a quality control below all reasonably measures. Not even the chinese could produce such a load of rubbish.
The buyers wanted reliability and deacent quality. They got that from Toyota and Mazda.
@@kasperkjrsgaard1447 The designs were far from dodgy, quality was. In many respects the cars were technically superior to the competition, which were Ford, and GM or Vauxhall and produced in the UK and neither of which were exciting or very good. I assume your reference to the Japanese is them coming over into the UK and producing cars?. That happened largely because we were inviting and in the EU, unfortunately that looks set to end and thus any reason for them being here
I reckon the ambassador looked better personally. In and out.... but what do i know?
Order Of Magnitude - The Paranormal & Personal Personal choice it would be a sad world if we all liked the same.
@@philnewstead5388 thank you. Agreed.
NMO 49 W
I'll leave that here...
EPC 243V
I had one of these, without doubt the worst car I ever had
The WORST most UNRELIABLE car I have ever owned
Still better than any crap imported to the U.S.A. Beats the opel G.T., M.G.B. not real great, X1-9 Fiat good lord thats the worst car ever (although cornering was amazing). Then U.S.A. had pinto, mavric, gremlin and crappy as# pacers. That Austin looks cool as hell compared to those!
I remember my father own,s one an it was rubbish nothing but problems.
Designed by Pininfarina, ^oo^
Even Pininfarina made mistakes.
Not a Farina design.Harris Mann.
The British version of the Ford Pinto with one exception the gas tank probably didn't explode in a rear end collision
Why Princess..only for girls?😱 instead of lighter it had a lipstick
Terry & June....
I bet the name didn't help
It suited the nature of the car, graceful
Higher Wages for Crappier Cars!
Lol same song from the top gear video. Lol
Don,t like those UGLY square headlights! Round headlight model were much better looking. My Father owed two Princesses, an 1800 manual and a 2000 auto, very comfy riding LOADS of room inside, tons of room in the engine bay, never seen more room not even in a V8 car.
Great looking cars but poorly engineered!..
Who was the designer for bl everything he did was atrocious
Harris Mann, David Bache, Spen King to name a few of the designers. Yes it was an odd shape but all the designers at BL were hamstrung for various reasons......coin, government bureaucracy etc. Both the Allegro and the Princess (to name a few of the BL range) were far removed from the initial drawings/clay mockups that were the beginnings.
Not forgetting the strikes that beset BL, the trade unions and incompetent management....:/
@@garethmccash5986 It was a great shape ahead of all the others. If Ford had built it with 5 doors then it would have been a winner.
Sorry, great tribute but what a shockingly bad looking lump...
Dreadful and a very poor reliability and these are the good points
i would scrap every single one of these Leyland scrap boxes . a stain on the british motor industry .
Why
BL had an unfortunate habit of designing out innovation thanks to committee over-riding the genius of Harris Mann, CSK, David Bache, amongst others.
@@paulanderson79 I think the board of directors were a bunch of old farts insulated from the real world. Many innovations did get through but sooooooo much more could have been done. Hydrolastic and Hydrogas suspension, the transverse engine, 60/40 rear seat are just some that come to mind. The true reason that BL failed can be summed up by the development of the Marina, you couldn't have dreamt it up, almost like a Carry On film...
@@musclerent very very apt analogy. Nice one. Regressing to rwd for a start. There are arguments for rwd but in mainstream cars fwd make perfect sense.
@supernumery based on what?, and what was good at the time?
I would not have wanted to be seen in any of them dead or alive. The car had no style let alone class.
They did do a hearse version so we can sort out the former for you Robert! The car has style and class in abundance .
tbf they were made in the 70s and 80s so style was quite different
The wedge,what a classic crap car.
You joke, one of the classic marques. Certainly not crap, you want crap, try a Montego when they first came out, now THATS crap
Well put! My dad had one for his first company car. My best memory was at Windsor safari Park and the monkeys pulled of the wipers and side repeaters and then had a go at the vinyl roof. It's was a MG Maestro after that, then he saw sense and went for Ford cars!
@supernumery although reliability wasn't great the car reviews at the time were very positive. No other manufacturer could match it on interior space and ride quality for the price. Yes I was around in the late 70's and I remember Ford having problems too!. What BL did exceptionally badly was PR, truly appalling, whilst Ford got their cars into exciting police programmes BL was stuck with Terry and June. Oh just one further thing, I've found a company restoring old Princesses to a new condition...and I'm thinking about buying one, why?, nostalgia and I know just how got they are when they are working!!
@@musclerent link for the company please
scrap the lot