Remember that a Godskin Noble is blocking the path to Ranni’s real body at the Divine Tower of Liurnia. So, the Godskin are aware of Ranni in some way.
The Godskin Apostles are clearly looking to rekindle or replace the power source of their Black Flame. They were at the Liurnia Divine tower for that purpose because it housed half a curse mark of death. I wonder perhaps if they just dropped into the fight with Iji to get the Black Knives held by the Black Knife Assassin because they're imbued with destined death.
I think the Godskins are somehow connected to the Divine Towers themselves. The boss hidden at the bottom of the Divine Tower in Caelid is a Godskin Apostle guarding the Godslayer's Great Sword (AKA the Gloam Eyed Queen's sword)
@@jschemel3921 they're at that tower probably because that's where GEQ was defeated. that's near Gurranq, who defeated her. they're likely near Ranni's body to guard it, because they worked alongside the Black Knife Assassins, because Rykard and Ranni were allies. the Godskins are heavily associated with Mt. Gelmir and Volcano Manor.
@@seratoxin3825 Can't say I was aware of a connection at the Volcano Manor. Altough now that you mention it, there is a Godskin bowling ball boss in the chapel at the Manor and the Godskins have alot of serpent like abilities and visuals, similar to the snake men
The Blind Swordsman is especially interesting because there a lot of items with info relating to him. The Talisman that depicts him training Melania, The Blue Dancer Charm, The map of the lake of rot, the sword with his ash of war.
The presence of the dancing warrior is recurrent in the other Souls. The dancer of the boreal valley, Ciaran, Tomoe in Sekiro, there is still information to dig !
@@smileandnodd on a side note I happen to agree with Shabriri. I do not like the idea of sacrificing Melina, at all. I always take the frenzied flame, burn the tree, then remove it. I just wish there was an alternative storyline to include that route.
@@mattfromtinder9803 I also agree with Shabriri. In all my playthroughs of Elden Ring, I never once sacrificed Melina and always choose to get the Frenzied Flames instead. Of course, fighting Blade of Miquella is a pain but I always do it. That's because I too believe that Melina shouldn't have to die for you to become Elden Lord, even if it is her wish. It's Ironic though. The closer you get to the Frenzied Flames, the more Melina encourage you to turn back. She kept saying that despite how cruel life is, it is also beautiful which makes it worth living for. Yet, she herself is choosing to die rather than to live on. And when you actually give her the chance to live, she resent you for it. Like you, I really wish there is an alternate ending where you didn't have to end in bad terms with Melina.
@@mattfromtinder9803 that what I do too, but I don't think there should be an alternative rote to this yet, I believe that just like Patches did reappear in the Ringed City, some characters that we let alive can reappear in the Elden Rings DLCs
Another thing to consider is we (the player) are coming in RIGHT at the final bell of the world. Even entering the capital and hearing the somber horns to both welcome and let us know there isn't much time left tells us we are at the last moments. The world is about to end. So we have a LOT of things that we do not know that led up to that moment. Huge gaps of history.
Yea. The game of thrones guy said it was 5000 years from the shattering till we come along. Like the school for magics been closed that long but the one guy who wants an extra key and the woman we meet and find trapped to a wall (names slipping atm).
@@dont-touch-mepg1392 I don't tjink it was literally 5000 years. GRRM also said that the game is a sequel to dark souls. I think it's just something he said out of misunderstanding or to give a general number without being specific.
I'm certain a DLC entry point will be one of three places: Miquella's Egg in Mohgwyn Palace (Miquella dream DLC?) Girl With Wolves In Maliketh's Arena (Probably Marika's past and Gloam Eyed Queen DLC) The Ship off the coast of Radahn's Arena (Probably a Badlands DLC) I think any of these would be so cool and the all fit really well for DLC concepts and entry points
Maybe. The DS2 model for DLC puts the entry points near to areas of thematic significance. The DS3 model is much less obvious. It really depends on what story they want to tell. The assumption that DLC will involve Miquella etc. in such direct ways has not panned out in the past and I see no reason why they would do something so obvious now.
I don't think there's any point going to the badlands, it's the realm of mortals as far as I see it. We know it's just a place of hardship & fighting & getting from there to the lands between is extremely difficult, so there wouldn't be a good enough reason why we'd be leaving the land between, so it would need to be a visiting the passed DLC which other than flushing out the backstory of the many tarnished we meet, even more than already in game (which as I'm writing this does sound cool), there's really not much point & probably plenty of other more rich & entertaining places to explore more.
Don't forget the location of the Cinquedea that happens to line up well with the rest of the divine towers. It also has an interesting and often not touched-upon lore piece about when the beasts were granted intelligence and how the hand is a representation of that blessing. It is also used by the priest as a weapon and a base for the black blade to wrap around. Maybe it will act as a key to use the divine towers to go back in time and stop the shattering, or who knows.
I want to find out if i assumed right about this. Cause some how i always did. I always just thought the fingers were made from the erd tree and sculpted to look that way once i saw they were wood. Hence how they speak for the will of the tree. So when they "die" they turn back to the wood of the tree.
Here's something that's been driving me crazy. When Seluvis makes the amber draught, he says that this was once the fate of a demi-god. So one of the demi-gods is actually just a puppet, but... who? The amber starlight shard is at the foot of a Miquella/Malenia statue. So was Malenia just Miquella's puppet? She says that she dreamed for so long at the start of her fight, so was the spell broken when Mohg kidnapped Miquella? Miyazaki grant us eyes, the lore is too deep.
There are tens to hundreds of other demigods we don't know about bcos they are all minor characters, I'd sooner say it's one of them, hell it could even be the Selivis we meet as I suspect he's not actually the real or original Selivis.
Arguably every demigod apart from ranni is a puppet to some higher being. Malenia for the scarlet rot, mohg for the formless mother. Miquella to some unknown one but he tried to escape. Morgott to the golden order, rykard to the god devouring serpent and radahn is a puppet of his hunger due to the rot and before that he bound the stars as a way to halt his families fate, meaning he was a puppet to the golden order by keeping the current state. Rennala is a puppet to the desire of rebirth, which we could attribute to godwyn or the ones living in death. And godrick is a puppet to his desire to impress godfrey who himself is a puppet to grace.
its highly unlikely, Miquellas charms dont work on the strong, and its very different from the puppets of Seluvis, who all display a complete lack of personality or speech, plus the fact he worked so hard to cure her and everything else indicates the loyalty was both genuine and mutual, if he simply desired her as a strong warrior he could have gone and made radahn or a number of demigods puppets i also dont think the amber draught has any effect on the the demigod whos fate it came from(except perhaps freeing them of there fate) considering it can be used on anyone, i think the potions work by basically taking fate and distilling it, turning it into a form the puppetmaster can manipulate and force on another, what that fate was before doesent matter since its remade, only that the fate is strong enough to effect demigods, its possible it did come from Mellania though, to free her of her fate as the goddess of rot
I think Godwin was chosen during the night of black knives because he was likely a strong believer in the golden order and would have gone against Ranni and Merika’s plot against the golden order. He is Godwyn the “Golden” so he was probably a fervent believer in the Golden Order.
First reply: Godwyn was far from a pacifist. He won the war against the dragons. Secondly, he probably wasn’t as strict a believer as you think. He integrated dragon worship and acceptance, supported Miquella’s goal, and overall seemed pretty open minded. It really was just right place and time mostly to the guy who was there, unfortunately the guy keeping things good and smooth
I agree with this but also I think because he was they only "known" demi god of the golden order because morgott and mohg were omens so they weren't known to be from the golden order because of that morgott supported the golden order just as much godwyn so technically godwyn was Ranni's only option because she wouldn't have known about morgott or mohg
No joke, I have a lot of respect for Iji. He, an old blacksmith, slew several of the Black Knife Assassins in open combat. That’s impressive. Also, am I the only one who’s wondering how many of those damn women are there?
What if though that the black knife assasins were not there to kill Iji, but were there to protect him? The flame coming from Iji's corpse is black flame. And black flame is used by the Godskin. And aren't the assasins loyalists to Rani? Didn't she lead the assasination? I'm so confused. Am I wrong?
Pretty sure ranni had to kill blaid as he was given to her from the two fingers. Ranni wanted nothing to do with them so she had to get rid of him. As for iiji I believe she said she had to get rid of him too. This was I think from the eternal city from the miniature ranni doll dialogues.
@@TheSlickmicks I got you bro. The Godskins created the black flame to kill gods but the true power was sealed when the rune of death/Destined Death was sealed away. Black Knife Tiche’s ash summon expand on why she allied with Ranni. So it can be inferred that the death of Tiche’s father is why her and the other assassins she was aligned with were willing to kill Godwyn because it’s almost like being betrayed by your own people as it happened under Marika’s rule. At this point her omen children are banished and the twins are quite young so the only one left is Godwyn. The Black Knife Assassins are still women of Nox/Numen that are also related to Marika. Nokrom/Nokstella was shoved underground and forced to live under a false starry sky because they chose to forge their own god so there is hate towards a god they have appointed to them. With that context, maybe only Tiche allied with Ranni, Tiche recruited others, and embedded their blades with the flame that was capable of killing a god in their entirety which is why it’s red and black. Black and white means it can’t slay a god. Ranni was selected as the Empyrean by the Fingers to rule. When you put everything together, Ranni more than likely used the BKA to kill Godwyn as it assisted her in her goal but to kill 2 birds with one stone, they turned on Ranni as well because of what her destiny was. Tiche had her blade imbued with Destined Death and used it to kill Godwyn, then she killed Ranni causing Destined death to be split in 2 (body and spirit.) Now I don’t know if Ranni was playing chess but having her body destroyed meant that she no longer is an empyrean because she was killed. Godwyn being killed caused Malenia and Miquella to flee entirely because the Golden Order couldn’t help either of them with their ailments, which were the other Empyreans meant to rule. Ranni severed any connection the Greater Will and the Fingers had to any Empyrean that would rule for them. FAST FORWARD and the assassins now aware that Ranni still lived stopped at nothing to kill her and any of her Allies. Any of the BKA you fight away from Ranni’s allegiances just kinda stab you in the back and that’s it. The ones that once allied with Ranni used Black Flame to kill Iji and Seluvis in search of her but their flames are black and white; The Black Knife Tiche Summon still has a red and black flame because like I said, the power to slay a god was an honor given to her then when she was inevitably killed for avenging her father. The other assassins probably sought out the Godskins after to help them because they, too, want to slay all the gods but the true power was sealed away again by Maliketh after the assassination.
The thing with Ranni’s two fingers and the destroyed cathedral is that it was said that Radahn had caught wind of Ranni’s plan and wanted to stop it, so he had hauled the movement of the stars an sealed away her two fingers. The rest the cathedral is destroyed is because after Radahn dies, her two fingers crashes there.
Ranni's Divine Tower is the only one which has no Two Fingers at the top, instead the corpse of her original body lies there. So maybe her fingers were located there originally, but her actions somehow caused them to crash into that building - and probably that was intentional, after all Ranni would want to isolate her Two Fingers as much as possible before she has the means to kill them, and nobody except her has access to the moonlight altar area.
Some think that Radahn had her two fingers suspended in space so she couldn’t reach them. When you defeat him all kinds of stuff crashes down including her two fingers.
@@mattfromtinder9803 no I think both of you are mixing 2 things up. I'm quite sure her 2 fingers have always been at manus celes to serve as a guide for an empyrean or demi god. This is why when you give her the fingerslayer blade she states she sets on her own journey indicating she knows where she is heading. Also Ranni specifically states that she destroyed her physical body to escape her determined (empyrean) fate of the 2 fingers . Radahn halting Ranni's fate has to do with the star that Radahn keeps suspended in the cosmos that is supposed to crash and serve as an entrance to nokstella and the fingerslayer blade. Without Radahn's interference this would have happened already allowing Ranni to continue her fated path to slay her 2 fingers.
correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't ranni the golden child of the greater will?Didn't the greater will try to lead her to combine the elden ring to become the next elden lord? Is that not why she rejected her original body and split her soul off so she didn't become bound to the destiny the greater will was leading her on?
10:20 the symbol behind Malakith is the complete Elden ring with all parts still intact. You can actually see every single rune that you’re able to earn in game, along with the roots of the great tree, which would symbolize the crucible, as well as the rune of death being present, front and center.
@@jaymor1916 pieces were removed from the Elden ring long before the shattering. Distant death was part of the Elden ring. It was more removed from it. The only time that we know they old and we do have ever been whole is on the greater will first came to the planet.
For why Godwyn was killed, I think it just makes sense if you think about Ranni's options, she had 7 demigods to chose from, Rykard was working with Ranni, Radahn, Malenia, and Miquella were all powerful, but weren't exactly super relevant as they were younger, so probably not the greatest bang for their buck, out of the three eldest, Mohg and Morgott were Omen who were kept out of the public eye, and the other was one of the most beloved men of all time, who was also probably trying to make peace with the dragons with Fortissax, so she not only shakes the lands to their very core, but potentially re-sparks the war with the dragons, I would've chosen Godwyn too. Meanwhile I have my own question; why can the Omen harness the Prince of Death's flame? the revenants and mausoleum knights make sense, they're linked quite clearly with death, but why can the horned Omen use the same flames, I experimented myself, and the Omen's flames do holy damage, just like the Eclipse Shotel's unique skill, which is said to harness the prince of death's flames, there's no way they aren't related as the flames look exactly the same.
Godwyn life path resembles his father's, Godfrey, and this would easily put him ahead of the other Demigods politically, who else is better suited to take over Marika than the child who closely resembles the First Elden Lord Godfrey.
@@ZomifiedHam but what relation do the Omen have to him in the first place? Morgott can imbue his sword with the flames as well, and while that could be explained by Morgott and Godwyn being brothers, it doesn't explain why random horned omen can harness it too, and only the horned ones, the ones with their horns cut off can't. Plus, in the item descriptions for both Omen Bairn items, it calls the projectiles "Wraiths" as in the exact same thing the wraith callers in Liurnia summon, also, there are a few wraith callers and a revenant in the sewers where the Omen live, so there's obviously some sort of connection, but what is it?
@@canadiangopnik7007 The "wraiths" are referred to as "rancor spirits" elsewhere, such as the Rancorcall spell and the Rykard's Rancor spell. The Wraith Caller Bell calls them wraiths. We find them in multiple different energy forms, not just deathblight. The wraith caller bell states that they are the spirits of people who died while cursed. So perhaps the type of energy they embody is based on the type of energy they were afflicted with upon death. The omen themselves seem connected to the crucible because they grow horns, and the deathblight energy has a tinge of red between the gold and black. Red tinged gold is the colour of the crucible. There's also some suggestion that upon death people return to the tree. So perhaps an omen's soul was somehow tainted by the deathblight energy in the tree.
@@TonkarzOfSolSystem so you're implying that the wraiths, rancors, and rykard's rancor, are all the same thing essentially, but different only in the manner of death? And I suppose if the Omen are that closely tied to the crucible, it might make sense as to why they could use the flames of the prince of death, seeing as almost right next to the remnants of that primordial tree of the crucible, lies Godwyn, it's not hard to imagine that the crucible has been influenced by his power since the deathroot reaches all across the lands between already. That actually makes a good bit of sense
9:22 If Marika is the Erdtree, and all those who die rejoin it. The fact the Tarnish leaves the center seemingly (At start of game) - is interesting. As if a piece of herself (Marika) decides to take a chance gamble with fate. When Melina Burns herself - its reflected in the Burning of the Erdtree itself. It pushes me to believe that Melina (is also Marika) just as much as Radagon is. And that what we find inside the Erdtree is a Husk of Marika with Radagon is an animated male-ego; (The Animus). Which are the male-traits within the female psyche. Essentially the whole idea of (Shattering) of a God, who manifests the world and existance, where other entities-and-beings are trapped within (The lands between). This God is splitting and shedding all its inner facets (To understand the proper way). These are the so-called; Persona (Marika), Shadow (Maliketh), Anima (Melina), Animus (Radagon), Puer Eternus (Miquella, always young), Senex (Malenia, rotting), The Collective unconscious/conscious/desires and Ego (Godwyn, Mogh, Morgott, Rykar, Radan) etc... Which are all various Archetypes of Carl Jung analytical psychology. But there is an interesting mixture of (Hunduism) mixed within Elden Ring's mythology. If Marika is a (Deva). In Hindu-mythology, she has trapped everyone into a stage of karmic-death/reincarnation. And other beings, souls and Entities like her, have manifested and added to this pergatorial-like existance and place (The Lands between). Which they state is (home) to their souls. As long as she and/or others are tethered with desires similar to the GreaterWill/Marika. Then they are stuck on this spoke of the Karmic Wheel... (The Lands between). Ranni, is of particular note in the story, as she pushes and progresses the lands and all the entities within it, past the previous edge of a Karmic precipous. She's shed her flesh, removed her tethers to friends and familly and has become a new (Deva). To form her own world.
I would just add a little bit of Buddhism in that Elden Ring as a concept always reminded me of the Law of Dharma ( from Buddhism )... the universal governing law. Now imagine that broken, not only that it would be impossible to leave Samsara, ever, but local world would have its own mini version of eternal Samsara ( death and rebirth ) without the ability to escape it no matter how much you meditate and untether yourself from the world, without learning through incarnations and progressing in any way. Basically a world frozen in place with its cycle of death and rebirth that is going into eternity without any..any at all.. change. All inhabitants and creatures you kill do exactly the same things in next incarnation, make the same moves and choose the same choices...forever. Now Ranni would be as you said, but i would go with Buddhist comparison and call her a Buddha of that world ( there were many Buddhas, not just one widely known as Buddha..thats a title, not a name ).
But wouldn't rabbis mother and some other things not line up then. Because her mom's still alive. She didn't get rid of her and it's ranni we hear when the second stage of her boss fight comes. Given I don't quite understand that whole fight and scene. And why keep us. These r genuine questions and am not trying to nit pick ur shit lol.
Also a side note about Iji that I just noticed while watching this video: his death pose is similar to that of Seluvis’ puppets (and Seluvis’ death pose himself, and he is potentially a puppet as well).
@@fiahpoa Sellen explains it I think... About how their true self's were placed into a Crystal and that the Bodies are just Empty puppets that they transfer their consciousness into pretty much.
I've always assumed Godwin was loved by a lot of people, so nobody would've likely thought about trying to kill him, therefore he'd have the least amount of guards making him a prime target for an assassination
He was also the strongest, being an uncorrupted child of a Godfrey with Grace and a Marika that hasn't broke the Elden Ring, so like they all also probably thought no one would be dumb enough to try lol
I like the idea of the statue in Farum being a representation of a kind of process to elevate one to godhood in the lands between. You have the woman surrounded by 3 wolves, and it could be Merika, as well as those who were chosen before Merika. Ranni also had 3 companions, and she too was chosen by the two fingers to take Merika's place in the lands between.
I feel the statue is a symbol of their relationship. It may look like the wolves are attacking her but then you look up and see the lit up Elden ring shining down on her making it look asf if she is holy and worthy of protection. Which gives a whole new meaning to the wolves and that they will hold death for her and what is dark.
Ranni knows immediately that you have Torrent in your care, and he's in Melina's possession up until then. She refers to a "former master" which could mean the tarnished before you, or Melina. Regardless, she somehow knows that you have him. My likely guess is that Kalé tells Blaidd, as he is most likely to have seen you riding Torrent, and it gets passed to Ranni. However, it makes little sense as to why she would put Kalé to sleep if he's assisting her. It could also mean that Ranni and Melina are allied to some degree as the Godskins oppose the Golden Order as well, were Melina actually the GEQ. If she was the Queen, then it would make sense as to why she is now bodiless, since it is said that she is "defeated" and not explicitly dead in the mentions of her. It's also apparent Melina fights like one of the Black Knife assassins, which could mean she was apart of their order as well, and her weapon states "The one who walks alongside flame, shall one day meet the road of Destined Death." This doesn't specify what type of flame though, as there are many, Giant's Flame being the most obvious, but Blackflame still considerable. However it puts a pin in the reason why Iji is burning with Blackflame surrounded by the Black Knives. It does imply that the Assassins attacked Iji, since they all attack you too, but since it's not red then and they were previously allied with Ranni, it implies they were all attacked by the Godskins. Destined Death was sealed away AFTER the night of Black Knives which is the reason why the Godskins lost their power. Blackflame lost the ability to kill gods after Destined Death was sealed, which might be the reason why the Godskins attacked Iji and guard Ranni's body. They might feel that Ranni is to blame as to why Melina, or at least the GEQ, is now defeated. It's also explicit that Maliketh defeated the GEQ, and it could mean that her punishment for aiding the Black Knives is why her body was burned, effectively the same fate that Ranni has, albeit not within a doll to wield a weapon like Ranni can wield the Fingerslayer Blade. It's only after Ranni proposes to you and kills her fingers that Iji dies, and up until then, the Godskins had no reason to attack Ranni's followers. Another thing is that Blaidd is also attacked, with assassins littered around him, so it's entirely possible that Iji was never intended to live, due to an unavoidable influence that the Greater Will can have on him despite the helmet, and that the flame color is just a graphical error.
But why GEQ (if we assume Melina is GEQ) is so fixated on restoring the cycle, and why is she so opposed to frenzied flames? Also, I think it's Ranni who kills her followers. As I wrote three times in this comment section, three wolves spawn outside of Ranni's tower. The do not spawn when Blaidd appears there, they stop respawning after Blaidd dies. And that is when Ranni severs her connection to the Erdtree. And on top of that, there's a mystery of the girl, three wolves and an erdtree statue, which kind of implies some form of connection between those three pieces.
Blaidd maybe killed the BKAs because he was mad, just like he attacks the player or Ranni send them to kill him because he now was a threat to her. The only question is what the BKAs get in return for further helping Ranni.
It makes sense as does her being Marika's daughter. The way I see it having seen the fall of the Dragon Order and its God during the age of the Crucible, I think Marika took steps to avoid a similar fate and that why she removed the rune of death from the Elden Ring then took out Melina who became the Gloam Eye-ed when the fingers chose her to wield destined death because she didn't trust the Greater Will and so sought to make so that she and her Golden would live up to her Eternal Namesake but she left Melina burned and bodiless and banished the Tarnished to act as a failsafe/escape clause so that should she ever want to end her order she could do so through them.
It’s my opinion that Melina is similar to Millicent. An offshoot of Marika. Spawned from the golden seeds. The trigger for Marikas shattering being Godwyn being killed, and the trigger for Melanias mind shattering being the disappearance of Miquella. Millicent also spawns from seeds that are left behind by Malenia blooming(or shattering of her mind). I think the two events are very similar if you really get down to it. With the exception of the differing effects that each had on the world. The way in which they both regain memories seems like it fits a similar narrative as well. With Millicent at the very least we can say she is Malenia at least in part. Otherwise using waterfowl dance wouldn’t be possible. There is no way Gowry could have taught her that move, she simply instinctively knows it. Lots of ifs on this but it makes the most sense to me personally.
@user-tp5yp2bv6z Keep in mind that we don't really know what Ranni looks like. The form we see is just a doll, her real body is the one burned up on top of Liurnia's Divine Tower.
@@VIctorcerezini11 I would say when people compare Melina and Ranni they are probably at least in part correct. There are a lot of striking similarities between Ranni and Melina. I can’t really deny that. We just don’t know enough and we are all interpreting the story from different angles. I’m not really holding out hope for DLC to further explain anything though, since that usually isn’t how From soft operates when creating DLC.
I might have an answer to the Iji situation. We can see that the ash of war of the Gargoyle's Blackblade throws the destined death flame (the same one as the black knife) but the impact on the ennemies actually creates a black flame aura around them, like the godslayer spells or the one on Iji. So we can assume that the destined death flames can actually cause that black and white aura. So it can be safe to assume that the black knives were the reason of his death.
Why would they leave their dead members behind though? Why not take them with and cover the tracks? Imo they tried and failed and someone else finished the job, leaving the bodies to cover their tracks and blame them
@@rezokiladze2334 Well, first off, we can see that the black knives don't realy care about their dead members, as we can still see a corpse of a black assasin in the snowfields. Second, if there's a puppet master behind the black knives attacks, i don't think it would that useful to cover the tracks, and this event happens instantly after the end of Ranni's quest, so i don't think that the black knives (Or the one who would've done the attack) had Time to get rid of the corpses. And for the third one, i actually don't realy see anybody that can create the black flame and would've had something to care about killing Iji and trying to kill Blaidd and even more about covering the attack.
@@mattfromtinder9803 I had the theory that it was a Black Blade Kindred that killed him, the motivation is there, Ranni stole death from Maliketh, Iji is a servant of Ranni, and the Kindreds are servants of Maliketh, and it would make sense why he's looking up, because they're tall as fuck, if he collapsed from the black flame taking it's toll on him, he'd be looking up at it when he fell, also, the Corpse Wax Cutter skill on the Black Gargoyle Greatsword shows a DD blade cutting through the ground, but when it hits, it applies a black flame effect, best theory I got
2:50 about that, I noticed that if you use the ash of war of the gargoyle black blade the enemies you hit are covered in black flames even if the sword has the power of destined death. This is exactly what happens with the black knifes and Iji's body, they wield the power of destined death but the flames are black for some reason. I don't think that the Godskin are involved, the assassins simply killed Iji and Blaidd but the flames are wrong
They could really solve a lot of these puzzles with one dlc that took us back to the past, to the age of the crucible. We already have a mechanic in the game that takes us in the past, wouldn’t be too far from the stretch of imagination. If we were able to play through maybe right at the prime of the Crucible and then it goes all the way until the night of the black knives, I think it would answer all of our questions for Melina, Godwyn, and the Crucible. Two DLCs, one for explaining the past and one for exploring Miquellas dream would be perfect.
Except, fromsoft never really makes dlc specifically for certain questions to be answered, If anything dlc will add more questions with some main game mysteries cleared up here and there.
@@drunken1967 Bloodborne DLC did answer a lot of questions. Like what Kos is, about Lady Maria, about Ludwig and Laurence etc. All of those are names that were mentioned in the base game. DS3 did also give us answers about the Painted World(s) plus the Pygmies and the Dark Soul itself. Maybe we get something similar with Elden Ring so I could see us getting some important answers about characters or places mentioned in the base game.
About Iji, the Black Flame was the flame of Death weakened after Destined Death was removed from the Elden Ring. So my interpretation is that Black Knives killed Iji and the leftover power from their knives turned from the flame of Destined Death into the weakened Black Flame
Ok so I'll immediately debunk your "How did Iji Die" mystery with the simplest answer possible: It was an oversight by fromsoftware. An old unused voice recording for when you defeat Maliketh and burn the Erdtree said: "The rune of death is unbound. Black Flames have devoured the Erdtree, and the Lands Between are shrouded by Death's dark fate." This means that a while ago the black flame and the rune of death (destined death) were directly linked, meaning that the black knife assassins would use the black flame too. That explains why iji is burning with black flames, Destined Death was supposed to be the black flames and they simply didn't consider it a crucial detail when polishing the game
would this not have been updated or patched out by now if it wasn't intentional? especially on what is essentially the climax of a major questline in the game. we're on version 1.08.1
@@exeterd9 and yet fires deadly sin is still buggy af The game was rushed af it most definitely is an oversight that isn't incredibly important in their eyes
I’m personally more of the idea that Melina is indeed Marika and Radagon’s daughter. The hair color matches between both, she has the bodiless curse and shares a naming pattern with the demigods Miquella and Malenia. It’s just that she’s not a twin and may have been much more recent, compared to the demigods.
i mean if she was bodiless as a curse from birth like the twins it would be possible there triplets, after all only two bodies would come out, noone, not even the midwife, or radagahns would no, the only one who could know was there mother who could feel them
@@seelcudoom1 I really like this theory, she might have been a more recent edition, especially with the fact that she says she has a mother but also hints at the fact that she doesn't know what a mother's love feels like during Boc's questline, and the bodiless curse could be a side effect of being born from one demigod just like Malenia's rot and Miquella's Eternal youth
@@seelcudoom1 I saw a video by masked nintendo bandit on her being born from the great rune of death to assist us in bring it back into the world, great video that honestly makes sense and could be right. Idt I could really explain it here but i think you should really check it out
I think the relation to the death of Ranni's followers is Melina. I'm convinced she's a demigod related to Ranni, and also the Gloam Eyed Queen. That makes Melina related to the black flame, and we already knew that she has relations to the Black Knife Assasins as well because of the way she fights. Maybe Melina is secretly trying to hinder you from getting Ranni's ending by killing Ranni's followers? Kinda like she turns on you during the frenzied flame ending.
What I found weird is that we have an example of her trying to stop you from getting an ending and, if she is the gloam eyed queen, why is a godskin protecting ranni's body? Doesn't seem all that bothered by you joining ranni at all
Did you save Melina then quell the frenzied flame? Did the little jar tell you his intentions to go on a quest? And did you get the letter from Rya telling you of her intentions to go on a quest? It may be wishful thinking but I’m hoping that there actually is something planned for these particular fates.
Personally I think that with Ranni's two fingers it was hiding underneath the earth. And a meteorite leading Ranni's fate crashed into the church revealing the way to the fingers. Similar to how the giant meteorite opens the way for us to visit Nokron. I think the many starlight shards are evident of that. I remember talking to Gideon how he always saids the two fingers have long lost their purpose. That compounded with how everyone else's two fingers are dead as well and that Ranni and her two fingers were at odds ends. More like a game of hide and kill each other.
I think Rannis two fingers was suspended in space by Radahn. All kinds of stuff comes crashing down to the ground when he is defeated, not just the void monster we fight on the way to the moonlight alter. It’s even mentioned that her fate is held in place along with the stars. Radahn likely was aware of her plans and stopped her at some point from going through with it. Whether or not it was an antagonist or a protective action against her I suppose we can’t know. Seeing how Radahn was pretty into the golden order though I’d say he was probably not on her side.
About the Wolves ashes, Ranni mentioned it was owned by the previous owner of Torrent. This is interesting since through Torrent, there is a link between Ranni and Melina before they met the Tarnished.
I was thinking that Melina could be a black knife assassin, because her battle moveset is the same as the black knife assassins, and she says that she is going to deliver destined death in the frenzied ending, like the black knife assassins do. but the thing is that she is using the opposite of the black knife, she doesn't wear the armor and she's helping the Tarnished. also, aren't the godskins related to the destined death in some way? the black fire is similar to the black-red destined death fire and life sapping
I think AgtJake had the right answer to the first one. He talks about it in his recent Tarnished video. Although we physically enter the Erdtree at the end of the game, the Erdtree is usually connected to memories and spirits, and the roundtable hold might actually be inside the Erdtree. He said the reason we are seemingly able to teleport to the chapel of anticipation is that our physical body was already in the chapel; it was our spirit that had to move from the Erdtree back to our bodies. So the opening scene is a remembrance of the inside of the Erdtree, similar to how the roundtable hold we visit throughout the game is a remembrance of the physical location.
I tend to agree since when you burn the tree the round table hold Melina takes us too also appears to burn. But that solution also creates a logical fallacy, since Melina wants to go to the foot of the Erdtree, but can also already go there?
After watching this I had a thought about our Fingermaiden and realized a connection with other dead Fingermaidens we see. Out of all the possibilities of who killed our FM, only one person is *very near* the scene who already knows what/who you are: Melina, and she’d know your FM was waiting for you. Melina wants to find her purpose. She can’t do that if a Fingermaiden (or Frenzy Flame) usurps that. She threatens to deliver you Destined Death for thwarting her - a FM would certainly be a disposable threat in her way. We personally see 4 definitively dead bodies of FMs: Ours, Vyke’s, Irina, and the Shack of the Lofty burned Maiden - all potential threats to fulfilling her destiny found dead along the Path. She and Shabriri are like counters to each other with the same need to manipulate the Tarnished through FM’s. As for bloody hands mercy-deather Varré - perhaps he just dipped into our FM’s blood rather than doing the deed. How else would he have known ‘any Maiden’s blood’ would work for the Favor? He just needs blood - Melina needs them gone.
From what I understand destined death is connected to both the black and white godslaying flame and the black and red flame of destined death. They are in different forms. I can't remember what lore video breakdown i watched that talked about it though. But the black and white flame pre-dates the red and black flame. The black and white flame was *designed* with the purpose to kill gods while perhaps the red and black flame is a more pure expression of destined death. Doesn't explain what happened to Iji but at the very least the two flames I believe are related.
Ranni tells you she's the one who stole part of the Rune of Death. She was the mastermind behind The Night of The Black Knives. She created the black knives. She had them kill Godwyn, and at the same time she killed herself, half the rune of death in each of them, she killed her body, Godwyn's soul was killed. She then betrayed them, as we have the leader of the black knife assassins locked in an Evergoal. They refuse to give her the Fingerslayer blade (it's in Nokron, and The Black Knife Assassins were all Numen Women, aka the Nox of Nokron & Nokstella) so she has you go steal it. When they learn it's gone, they go to kill Ranni, but she already left, so they killed Iji instead.
about the girl with the wolves: it’s highly likely that it’s marika. smith master hewg has very close ties to marika, and seems to know her personally. we learn from him that roderika has the same eyes as someone he knows; and he teaches roderika what that someone else told him about her ability to interact with spirits. it stands to reason that the original spirit tuner would be marika.
Iji, seeing his end fast approaching, called in a favor from his boy Miriel who, having been given the heretical godskin prayer book (by us), nuked the area with black flame, killing the assassins. Unlikely? Unfathomably so. Entertaining to think about? Absolutely.
I just think the Black Knife assassins killed him and the color the flame is just wrong. Hell it wasn't even present until the 1st patch so it was definitely a hastily made addition.
@@Terminalsanity That's a bit odd though as they've been quietly going through and correcting things like maps and other visual lore indicators, yet Iji's "wrong" flame color has survived to this day.
I’m guessing Radahn must have known about his sister Rannis plan and using gravity magic sealed Rannis fate among the stars by casting her fingers into space so she cannot kill them 🤷♂️
Imagine a marika boss fight if we go back in time, I mean honestly she is also one of the characters we know the least about even though she’s the one who set the whole game in motion, we also already fought radagon in the normal game so it makes perfect sense that we’d someday be able to face her
I think the statue in Maliketh’s boss room tells us who Melina is. It’s a statue of a young girl resembling Melina surrounded by three wolves, which matches with Ranni’s first voice lines to us when she gives us the spirit calling bell as a gift from Torrent’s former master (i.e. Melina). In Farum Azula, we see statues of a king, a queen, and a young child. We know the dragons were able to take on human form. With Placidusax being an Elden Lord, this would imply his queen was the previous vessel for the Elden Ring during the age of the Crucible. Their child may have been an empyrean. When Marika’s armies fought and defeated Placidusax, Placidusax’s wife would have died, and Marika could then claim the Elden Ring. If Melina was the daughter of Placidusax, she may have hid, then taken her mother’s body and (in a fashion similar to Radagon) turned her into the Godslaying Greatsword. Think of it. Melina sends us to Farum Azula. Her statue is in Farum Azula. The godskins are in Farum Azula (which is essentially a giant mausoleum). That is why the Gloam-Eyed Queen wanted to kill the demigods. She wanted revenge on Marika, but Marika sent Maliketh who defeated her and sealed Destined Death away. Then Melina was forced through Erdtree burial, and was “born at the foot of the Erdtree” where she says “my purpose was given to me by my mother.” Marika had her reborn in the Erdtree, and used her affinity to flame-based powers to burn the Erdtree and free herself from the Elden Beast’s control. That’s my two cents on the matter, anyway.
Holy shit, that makes alot of sense! Altough I am on the fence about the Elden Lord having to have a human form. Placidusax might have had a dragon god, as it was an all together different, and ancient, time period. But it would make sense that Placidusax took a human form to become Elden Lord, much like how Hoarah Loux took on Serosh and became Godfrey.
I think Melina is to Ranni what Radagon is to Marika. Except Ranni separated her other self from her. Maybe even as an unintentional consequence of The Night of Black Knives plot. We know Ranni is an Empyrean , which means she was a candidate to replace Marika/Radagon as a vessel for the power of The Greater Will. We also know that the current vessel is in fact two people, Marika and Radagon. We also know that Ranni is Radagon's/Marika's daughter so it stands to reason that she'd inherit this dual-personhood from her parent(s). But then Ranni killed her body, effectively severing her connection to Radagon/Marika and therefore The Greater Will. I think Melina is the spirit of Ranni's other self. That explains why the glowing spirit attached to Ranni's current body looks like Melina. It also explains why they both have a connection with Torrent. Their goals also seem to align. Ranni wants to effectively usurp The Greater Will. However, her ending dialogue implies she instead plans to simply find a new world. Burning the Erd Tree may have been an earlier plan that has since been abandoned, hence Melina's own apprehension towards her own purpose earlier in the game. There's also a lot of aesthetic parallels between them. Melina has off-red hair which implies a tenuous connection to Radagon, who is Ranni's estranged father. Melina notably first introduces herself to our Tarnished during a clear night where the moon is visible, the same as Ranni, even using the same sort of effect when appearing before us. Melina and Ranni's eyes are mirrored and it's at the point where they're mirrored that they are bound as seen on Ranni's current body, implying that they are two sides of the same person.
For why Godwyn was killed: During a mixture of Ranni and Fia’s questline, its made clear that in order for Ranni to escape her two fingers she needed to shed her physical form. Godwyn was used as a scapegoat for Ranni. Godwyn’s soul was killed but his body remained and festered, which allowed Ranni to turn around and kill her body but save her soul. As for why exactly why Godwyn was picked? Theres a couple theories littered around, but I’m not entirely sure. I would think it has something to do with his presence being a direct conflict to the order she (Ranni) wishes to bring onto the lands between.
Have you ever noticed in the demi-human forest ruins (in weeping pennisnsula) that when you defeat the the demi human queen all the monkey men start to cower in fear. Almost as if that was their god and they were just trying to defend it😢 and then we come in and just ruin their whole universe lol. If u read the demi queen staffs bio it says “it can be wielded by those with little intelligence”. Maybe the monkey men finally found a god/mentor that could teach them even with their low int, and we just unknowingly destroyed it on our quest:(
Maybe the fingers were built as wooden anchors that a sort of 'old god' latched onto and replace with flesh. Maybe the fingers take that form only as a limitation of the construction of these anchors? --- Perhaps Melina was once combined with Ranni and when they split their new identities changed the timeline in some way? Because of the identical overlaying symmetrical eye seals they both have.
What pisses me off in ER storytelling is that I feel like it's trying so hard to hide information from you even if it doesn't make sense. In DS1 not knowing much felt much more natural. It made more sense there. In ER it feels like every npc is like "do what I tell you to and don't ask questions" when they can easily provide information you would certainly be curious about.
Isn't The Blind swordsman Malenia? I thought we have already established this. The fairy taught her how to wield the flowing sword and she sealed her Rot with sheer determination of a swordsman while her Brother miquella desperately looked for ways to completely seperate the influence of the rot god from her through unalloyed gold. The only question is who the fairy actually is. The ending of millicents questline where she refused to bow down to anyone trying to control her and would rather die and how she asks you to return something back to malenia to remind her what she has sacrificed of her determination as a swordsman when she used the scarlet rot to double suicide with Radahn, nicely ties in malenias state as a swordsman that gave up her pride or her will power to let gods decide her battles for her.
The blind swordsman is seen on the Curved Sword Talisman and in the Prothesis-Wearer Heirloom description it says the following: "Though born into the accursed rot, when the young girl encountered her mentor and his flowing blade, she gained wings of unparalleled strength" Meaning obviously that Malenia had a mentor. On the talisman there is Malenia with another person (the blind sowrdsman). Malenia is blind and he trained her as her mentor.
@RedEye yes, malenia is with the blue dancing fairy, her mentor. Fact 1: Blue fairy taught a blind swordsman, blind swordsman sealed the rot god. Fact 2: young girl encountered her mentor and his flowing blade and gained wings of unparalleled strength. This is simply not two separate events. Its two accounts of the same event. There is one person that gives power to someone to accomplish something. One account calls him a fairy and the other calls him mentor. The fact that she gained 'wings' of strength from her mentor should signify why he was called a fairy in that account. Subtle yet amazing way to separate points of view.
My internal gut thought that the Roundtable Hold in Leyndell is the same as the one we fast travel too. However the version that we travel to is in a different point in time in the past. I mean the pick ups seem to be the dead drops of the NPCs in the same positions of those NPCs, and the structure is identical. When you get there and find the NPC's stuff it seemed like they had died in the past and you showed up in the present to pick it up.
All of these are definitely unsolved, but I'd like to add another one to the list: The Age of the Duskborn, and specifically what it entails outside of including life within death into the order. Most notably, the item description for the death prince mending rune says that the new order under this rune will be one of "Death restored", given back; however, this Death really can't be anything other than Destined Death as it was the only Death that was removed/taken away in the first place, and yet we had to release it in order to even reach the elden ring and place in said rune. Could that then mean that the death prince rune is instead the only one that keeps Destined Death unbound in the coming Age? That all the other endings barring the frenzied flame one rebind Destined Death? According to Blaidd, shadows can't truly die so long as their respective two fingers exist, and since Blaidd's at Manus Celes is the only one that was truly killed, it means Maliketh never really died after our fight in Farum Azula, so it wouldn't be impossible for him to come back and thus reseal Destined Death again.
there's a solid case to be made that the fairy that taught the blind swordsman was the Siofra river, which shares its name with a fairy from a scottish folk story. The legend in game would then be a mythologized story about the swordsman developing his flowing style and signature waterfowl dance in imitation of the flowing waters of the river, rather than there being a literal fairy.
Destined Death infused weaponry like the Gargoyle Greatsword use red flame attacks that leave black flames when they hit the target. This may be a mechanical limitation, but the black flame and the red flame of death are both Death's Flame.
My reason for Godwyn being chosen is that he was also an Empyrean. Malenia and Miquela are both under the influence of outer gods (formless mother and the god of rot), so that left Marika without any viable candidate. It would be pointless for Ranni to slay herself only for Marika to pick another (that and the half-death thingy) I think Melina is both the Gloam-eyed queen and Marika's daughter. She's an empyrean that failed to be a lord or a god.... "But should ye fail to become aught at all, ye will be forsaken. Amounting only to sacrifices..." (capital outskirts dialog). She rebeled against Marika and lost, so amounting to nothing. She was than submited to some dark rituals that put her into that burnt and bodyless state, like the Official's Attire description suggests (It's found right beside the Blade of Calling). Unless I'm missing something, nothing prevents the Elden Beast of being Placidusax's consort. Clearly a god, dragonlike, and the way that it uses Radagon's body as a sword seems more spiteful than anything. My theory is that those balck knives are not real black knives. The Baleful shadow is a fake Blaidd that uses black flame. The black knives helped Ranni in her plot, so Ranni's foes impersonate them in order to try to fool Iji. The black flame points to Godskin people, the reasoning would be that they are simply anti-god, Marika or otherwise.
Godwyn was only a demi-god not an Empyrean. Remember of the Demi-gods only Ranni, Miquella and Malenia had that title. Ranni literally tells us this and nowhere in the game is Godwyn referred to as an Empyrean the only other Empyreans mentioned aside from Ranni, Miquella and Malenia are Marika and the Gloam-Eyed Queen. Interestingly enough given Ranni's goal I think she entered into the Night of black knives conspiracy planning that Radahn was to be slain not Godwyn as Radahn kept Ranni fate suspended for an age so targeting Radahn would have been a 2 for 1 death but as things turned out Ranni's ultimate ambitions were stalled out indefinitely since Godwyn was slain in his place. I suspect the Black Knife assassins did this intentionally specifically to sabotage Ranni's and that's why plan that that's why Ranni has their Leader Alecto Locked up in the Evergoal in the immediate aftermath of the Night of Black Knives. I suspect this was done at the behest of Miquella and the Black Knife Assassins had been persuaded into him serving as their long awaited lord of Night(I mean he did try to eclipse the sun) and were then by him to enter into conspiracy with Ranni and Rykard's using their ambitions to further his own and had Godwyn killed instead of Radahn orchestrating the fall of the Golden Order to make way for his own Order of unalloyed Gold while sidelining the only known Empyrean that could and would rival his own order Ranni which would then also explain why the Black knife assassins attack Iji and Blaidd once Ranni has slayed her two fingers and is in position to establish her order. (the Black flames on Iji being nothing more than a coloring error the flames were actually part of the 1st patch and the Gargoyles Blackblade which attacks with the red tinted flame of the death rune has a similar coloring error as in inflicts a black flame on enemies)I suspect Miquella controlling the Black Knife Assassins because you 4 living Black Knife assassins guarding the seal to the haligtree in Ordinia along with Albanaurics you even find the Black Armor set there. In regards to Placidusax I assume his God was an Empyrean in dragon form that the Greater Will eventually abandoned as the age of the Crucible gave to the ae of the Erd tree and its for that reason Marika having seen the Greater will and the Elden Beast/ring abandon its one time vessel and God not wanting to be one day replaced or discarded herself, that once The greater will through the two finger appointed her Daughter Melina to be the weilder of destined Death and became the Gloam Eye-ed Queen Marika then took it upon herself to remove the Rune of death from the Elden ring and had Maliketh defeat The Gloam-Eyed queen so she could then seal destined death so the greater will could not similarly discard her or her Golden Order but left Melina burned and bodiless to like the tarnished act as a failsafe to burn the erd tree should Marika decide to end things which she did when she resolved to shatter the Elden Ring.
Last time I was playing I was just spending some time in Limgrave taking it all in when I realized that I didn’t see a sun anywhere and then it hit me that I don’t think I ever had in all the lands between. It seems like the erdtree is the main source of light. Has anyone else noticed this? It’s not a huge lore discovery or anything but it has interesting implications.
9:40 "Ashen remains in which spirits yet dwell. Use to summon the spirits of three lone wolves. Spirits of wolves chased from their pack. They later encountered a nameless Tarnished, who welcomed them as hunting companions. The wolf spirits overwhelm enemies with their agility, aiding the summoner in combat." Who is this Tarnished in the description? Could it be the Tarnished Of No Renown? Or perhaps someone else entirely?
I heard a theory once that Ranni killed them and right before you grab her hand in her ending it’s cuts away but you get stabbed in the back by the assassins.
@@mattfromtinder9803 I don't think Ranni controls the assassins, it makes no sense, they are with Queen Marika, Ranni's goal conflicts with the will of the Elden Ring.
@@Cybershroom well personally I don’t think that theory is correct as well, however I’m not so sure that the assassins are with Marika. I think it’s more likely it’s someone else. I get that they are Numen women like Marika but that would imply that Marika had Godwyn killed, which doesn’t make sense if the prevailing theory of why the elden ring was shattered was because Marika was distraught by the death of Godwyn. Also, Ranni admits to stealing a fragment of the rune of death to forge the black knives. It’s just a thought but perhaps Ranni tricked the assassins in some way and they seek revenge. Or, and like I said not likely, she’s straight up evil and had everyone she cared about killed.
I think beast mark on Melina`s face and the fact that there is 'gloamy' eye beneath it pretty much confirms that she is the Gloam-eyed queen defeated by the Maliketh, who is a beast after all. Also she says that she will 'deliver you destined death'.
I believe Godwyn was killed because he was the only logical Demigod for Ranni to use when the rune of death was craved upon the two of them. And also because Ranni needed another Demigod in order for the rune of death to function properly. When it comes to the well known Demigods, Ranni probably never knew about Morgott and Mohg because they were imprisoned under Leyndell. Godrick wouldn’t work because he isn’t a true Demi god. Miquella and Malenia’s location were probably unknown to Ranni. And Ranni couldn’t use Rykard or Radahn because they were her brothers.
The Hand is what crashed onto the Lands Between. Two Fingers (pinky and ring) represent stability. Three Fingers (thumb, index, and middle) represent chaos. This game is extremely meta and can’t be fully understood without the meta concept. When we hold our controllers, our pinky and ring fingers stabilize (Order) our controller. Our thumbs, index, and middle fingers control the buttons, which brings destruction (Chaos). Also, the Chapel of Anticipation is where we start because we were placed there as soon as we started to hype (anticipate) the game years before release.
I think the idea of all these God-like beings coming from space is cool because it opens up the possibility of there being more Elden Ring games or DLC taking place somewhere else in the galaxy.
The black flame is from Godskin Apostles, children of Goddess of Death, Gloam eyed Queen, the girl which always talks about Destined Death, and Black Knife Assassins also got that with them, Destined Death.
If you look super closely, while standing in Leyndell, you can just barely make out the "Great Cosmic Cheese" up in the sky. It's a sight to behold. It shines it cheesy light upon the lands between, and empowers us all.
On why was Godwyn chosen to die - I honestly think this is just GRRM being inspired by Nordic mytjology and Godwyn being a stand-in for Baldur. He had to die exactly because he was beloved champion, because his death put the things in motion and it led to change. His role is purely to be the catalyst. Even his fate as the Prince of Death- to be forever dead and soulless- is similar to Baldur's fate. On what fingers are: As I figured it out: I think fingers fell/Great Old One cut it from itself and threw it where Ranni slayed hers and other fingers acting as antennas we see in the game are just minor manifestations, similar to Erdtree and minor trees. And yes, they are both flesh and wood because they have the same creator and you have to have special items to destroy them. Cutting the fingers/burning the tree literally means cutting the GW off, so that's how I chose to interpret it. Until DLC comes out and lore hunters provide, I will roll with it. And one question I want to know is were Marika and Radagon always one which would require further explanation on how that actually worked, or were they separate beings joined later in some freak fertility experiment that resulted in twins. Thanks for video, Zio!
Rani could maybe be dead already and Melina is her flesh body and rani is the spirit. We know this is how spirits and bodies work in the Elden ring universe generally. And we know dead bodies can be inhabited by other forces or beings with sentience. And the spirits of the dead bodies have goals or aspirations like the dung eater. I’m kind of typing this as it’s coming to mind but don’t either also supports the idea that a body and spirit can make separate decisions and have separate memories. So I believe Ronnie and Melanie are two forces that originate from the same place, that being her death by three wolves, and that is why Ronnie has three wolves to give you. I used voice to text for this and there’s no way I’m going to edit this long of a comment so who cares about spelling if anything makes no sense go ahead and ask I’ll be mulling over this and would love to get a rebuttal and some thoughts on this idea
Hey Zio, got some good input on your speculation about Melina. I think Melinas identity is related to Ranni, here's why. Melina has a tattoo on her eye of a crows foot. But if you'll notice it's actually missing one of the toes. If you line up Melina with Rannis spirit face, you see they're actually extremely similar and a marking on the spirit face looks like the missing toe off the crows foot. The fact that this marking is the foot of a crow makes me think about the Twinbirds and death, and it made me realize both Melina and Ranni are heavily associated with death and Spirits. There are many dualities that exist in Elden Ring, notably an extremely old one between Fire and Ice. However, when you start looking into Ice you find everything associated with the cold is associated with spirits as well, even down to the Cold Ghostflame and Frozen Lightning Wisps in Siofra, it's consistent and unique from Glintstone magic. All of this is associated of course with Ranni, the Snow Witch herself. Melina on the other hand is associated with fire, she calls herself the one who walks alongside flame. So taking all of this into account, and the fact that the Twinbirds primarily utilize Ghostflame (literally a cold flame made of angry spirits) I think Ranni and Melina are actually reincarnations of the Twinbirds themselves. (Now thinking about it, they could be literal Twin Birds, like twin girls born as the aspect of death for two different faiths, twins because of Dadagon.)
Ranni isn't the Snow Witch though .. She introduces herself as *Renna* the Snow Witch, which is a lie. According to item descriptions her doll is made to resemble her mentor, the Snowy Crone. But the duality and connection between Melina and Ranni is undeniable
@holding on only to let go thanks gamer, I'll give you some more too. The Flame of Ruin is inside the faith of the Erdtree. It was always meant to burn it, Marika threw out everyone who was pointing this out. So the Flame of Ruin is like the aspect of death for the Erdtree, it represents the end. Rannis Cold magic doesn't have a strong connection like this to death necessarily, but it is associated with Spirits and thus Death by association. Melinas closed eye is the same closed eye on Rannis spirit face, and its the same eye that holds Destined Death. Again reinforcing that they share one parent who passed this "embodiment of Death" on to them, good old Dadagon, a Fire Giant himself. Further, many (and by that I mean most) Erdtree Burial sites use Ghostflame torches to light the room, and some are guarded by Zamor. Also, Rennala was an Astrologer who studied the Primeval Current in the Mountaintops. The Primeval Current is weirdly associated with Cold Sorcery, as Rannis discovery of the Dark Moon (potentially the Black Moon of Noxstella) is reminiscent of the Astrologers discovery of the Primeval Current, which the Nox are associated with as well as Cold Magic. It's a lot gamer.
Could the blind swordsman possibly be a small legend of Zelda reference? A fairy, a warrior, and a special sword specifically used to defeat a powerful enemy?
Varre and Melina... I believe he killed our maiden as we were being resurrected. Her body is against the wall when we wake up, and he instantly knows we are maidenless when we first emerge, and has blood on his gloves. The point to which our Maiden would be speaking to us Melina shows up on Torrent and assumes the role, seemingly having picked us in particular. While even he doesn't mention or acknowledge her existence, he clearly has something to do with her. He is also the character that introduces us to invading other people's worlds, where maybe he met her or communicated with her.
Melina is the GEQ in the sense that Marika was the GEQ. Melina being a sort of daughter clone of Marika and Radagon which Marika devised as a way of escaping the Erdtree (and Radagon and a whole bunch of things tbh). She's the soul of Marika rebirthed through the Erdtree. This is why nobody knows about her. She is relatively new to the Lands Between while also being the prime mover and shaker of said lands.
I just hope the DLC focuses on one of three things, 1. where exactly tarnished come from/places beyond the Lands Between. 2. How things were before the Elden Ring was shattered. 3. More information on the other Outer Gods.
Ranni was behind the black knives business. Iji gets killed by black knife assassins once she achieves her goals and her associates all outlive their usefulness. I think what happened there is SHE sent them to wrap things up for her. Even though her dialogue points out she feels she owes to them, I guess she also felt this was something that had to be done. A bit of grey morality for the top waifu that she got rid of her teammates, and we'd probably been another one she'd sent assassins after if we hadn't ended up her consort.
I think Godwyn was chosen to be assassinated simply because he was the first demigod destined to die. It’s stated by the finger crone reader before entering the correlating underground city. Now I believe hawksaw implied that Marika had a hand in Godwyn’s death but regardless, the crone stated(paraphrasing) “godwyn was supposed to be the first of the demigods to die and become a true prince of death but, not like this” or something like that. It might’ve been Ranni or Marika’s plan due to “well he’s gonna die anyway”.
Black Knife, black flame, Iji. There is a huge connection. In the time of the Gloam Eyed Queen, she channeled Destined Death through her sword to create the god-killing black flame and distribute the power to kill among her Godskins. When Destined Death was claimed by Maliketh, the black flame lost the potency required to cause death. The black flame is muted destined death. I think it is reasonable to connect the two groups, Godskins and Black Knives, either as parts of the same general organization or an “anticipation of” sort of thing. Where would Ranni have learned how to bind a fragment of Destined Death to a weapon if not from the Gloam Eyed Queen? There are suggestions enough to make the connection between Godskins and Ranni, if not the whole Carian family. And it is very clear that Ranni uses the Black Knives.
As far as how the Tarnished gets to the chapel, my theory is that there are waygates linking the other lands to the Lands Between, and the destination location just happens to be in the chapel.
Anyone else find it off that the dragon god used to be elden lord. But when you see it, it has 2 heads standing straight up just like the 2 fingers waiting for the greater will to speak to it. Also when you look at the dragon is has 5 heads, but 3 are cut off. It's skin around the necks look similar to the 2 fingers and 3 fingers flesh.
The statue might be Rani's human demi-god form. With her 3 protectors. Iji, Blaide, and you represented as her wolves. And it goes with the symbolism of the 3 spirit wolves she give you. And wolves howl (serve) at the moon. Plus she was next inline to take Marika's place but she rejected it.
I have a theory, even though it’s a bit far fetched but what if the black knife assassins were there to help protect blaidd and iji. Cause if you look at iji his corpse had black flame and the black knife assassins are dead but they can’t/ don’t use the black flame. Now with blaidd, we know he was going insane and iji had him locked up so what if he killed those black knife assassins in a fit of rage. The reason we do not see the black knife assassins earlier is because they can be invisible. So what if the godskin or some other magic user came to eliminate ranni, and found her guarded by iji and the black knifes and killed them but didnt go further cause ranni was missing and the other black knifes showed up and that person ran. Then when blaidd shows up he thinks the black knifes killed iji or he was simply unaware that he was being guarded by them and he didn’t know why they were there so he killed them in a fit of rage and confusion.
I honestly think they legit just third party-ed, pointed down and did the L dance, went to knock on Rannie's door to see if she was home, shrugged it off and left lmao.
I found something the other day when u go back to rannis chambers after finishing her quest, u can talk to her ranni doll again and she asks you to join her, can't remember exact dialogue but something to do with helping her remake the world in the stars or something.
Ngl I love the fact that we can pick Warrior and BE the person that taught Melania,not a forced thing,but a choice to immerse yourself IF you want it....or some person that looted him....
My interpretation of the Blaidd/Iji/Black Knife Assassins was based on something Iji himself said. He mentioned that since Ranni was starting to stray from her purpose, as given by the Greater Will and Two Fingers, that Blaidd, her shadow, would eventually go insane and try to kill her. It's why Iji locks Blaidd in the evergaol that housed Darriwil; he knew Blaidd was starting to lose his mind. If you release Blaidd, Iji will say something that he understands what's about to go down, and accepts fate. I believe the Black Knife assassins were there to protect Ranni (remember, they served under her and helped her with the Night of Black Knives, and they desire to see her Order come about, so there's no reason they would attack her,) and they, with Iji, fought against Blaidd. I believe Blaidd is responsible for Iji's death. I'm just not sure how the black flame is connected.
I wonder if Ranni and the Black Knives weren't fully at odds like some hypothesize, and they were helping Iji fight off the godskin nobles and perhaps were "helping" in a "merciful" sense Blaidd.
2:48 the gargoyles black blade weapon also uses the red flames of destined death but whenever it hits an enemy the flames are black so it might just be an inconsistency with designers or these black knives DIDNT have access to pieces of the rune of death so their flames came out black without any hints of destined death being similar or the same as the godskin’s black flame
The fingers on top of the towers are burnt. I think these towers were used for some kind of punishment, where the "neer-do-wellers" were scorshed by the magic fire stones you can see lining the rim of the towers.
As far as a technical explanation for the black flames on Iji goes, it could be that the black flames and destined death flames looked the the same before the devs differentiated their color, and Iji's corpse was just something that got overlooked.
My take on the roundtable hold is complete conjecture, but I think it is... A remembrance. The original hold is a wreck in lyndell, it's been destroyed, 'killed' - But it was important, and so its memory is "hewn into the Erdtree" like the others. It's not physically located inside, but the erdtree anchors that memory, so whatever metaphysical 'place' it exists within burns up along with the tree.
Godwyn was killed because Marika was attempting to find the Finger Slayer Blade (A weapon to slay a God. See also, the band of the inverted hawk) but could not. So, she endeavored to do what the Nox had done all those years ago and, by killing Godwyn but allowing his body to continue living, would have attempted to create a new Finger Slayer Blade from him. That she didn't expect what would happen would happen does not change the fact that this is the only series of events that makes even the remotest bit of sense given what we are told in game.
Interesting that Melinas closed eye turns out to be how I would describe a gloam eye looking. In general though I think I really enough that this question is never definitely answered. The speculation is more fun then having an answer.
I have seen Blade of Death have black flame after effect on me when hit by it so it likely WAS them. It likely was an oversight on their part(of which there are others particularly the "Flightless Bird" and "Prophecy" paintings as well as Oleg and Engvall ashes being in switched spots). As for why Iji died, you loot his helmet off of his anvil implying he took it off(his model is modified hence why it still has it on) with the flavor text being that it guarded against tracking from the Two Fingers and their vassals implying a connection of some kind between the Black Knives and the Two Fingers. Ironically, a lot of Two Finger incantations(particularly those associated with Crespus a Roundtable Hold assassin) involve stealth and assassinations.
I don't think I can agree with the speculation on Manus celest as pretty much all the churches of Marika have their roofevs caved in and I think this tracks further into ruins in the real world. Rooves tend to be held up with wood which rots while walls are stone and last a while longer. Furthermore I think it's unlikely that a impact that could bury rannis two fingers 20? Meters underground would be more then capable of knocking down the walls of the church. It's still possible though that the church was built after the two fingers impacted the area.
When it comes to igji, it was his own princess, she killed him off to cut all ties before becoming queen to the elden lord, Merikas curse also activates and drives blaidd insane, why he screams “NO I CANT BETREY HER” when you go back to the tower after achieving most of her quest
Remember that a Godskin Noble is blocking the path to Ranni’s real body at the Divine Tower of Liurnia.
So, the Godskin are aware of Ranni in some way.
The Godskin Apostles are clearly looking to rekindle or replace the power source of their Black Flame. They were at the Liurnia Divine tower for that purpose because it housed half a curse mark of death. I wonder perhaps if they just dropped into the fight with Iji to get the Black Knives held by the Black Knife Assassin because they're imbued with destined death.
Most likely being after the cursemark of death.
I think the Godskins are somehow connected to the Divine Towers themselves. The boss hidden at the bottom of the Divine Tower in Caelid is a Godskin Apostle guarding the Godslayer's Great Sword (AKA the Gloam Eyed Queen's sword)
@@jschemel3921 they're at that tower probably because that's where GEQ was defeated. that's near Gurranq, who defeated her. they're likely near Ranni's body to guard it, because they worked alongside the Black Knife Assassins, because Rykard and Ranni were allies. the Godskins are heavily associated with Mt. Gelmir and Volcano Manor.
@@seratoxin3825 Can't say I was aware of a connection at the Volcano Manor. Altough now that you mention it, there is a Godskin bowling ball boss in the chapel at the Manor and the Godskins have alot of serpent like abilities and visuals, similar to the snake men
The Blind Swordsman is especially interesting because there a lot of items with info relating to him. The Talisman that depicts him training Melania, The Blue Dancer Charm, The map of the lake of rot, the sword with his ash of war.
Totally forgot about those
Malenia learned waterfowl dance from him, I can only imagine how OP this guy was
Millicent using the same ash and one of her sisters using two of his swords.
Even the Warrior starting class is linked to the Swordsman.
The presence of the dancing warrior is recurrent in the other Souls. The dancer of the boreal valley, Ciaran, Tomoe in Sekiro, there is still information to dig !
Melina is mentioned by Shabriri, not by name, but he acknowledges her existence and knows she's planning on sacrifice herself to burn the Erdtree
Possibly but I think it’s more likely he just knows what is required to enter the erdtree. He probably has no idea who your maiden is at this point.
@@mattfromtinder9803 That theory is very likely to be the case because Shabriri probably said the same thing to Vyke as well.
@@smileandnodd on a side note I happen to agree with Shabriri. I do not like the idea of sacrificing Melina, at all. I always take the frenzied flame, burn the tree, then remove it. I just wish there was an alternative storyline to include that route.
@@mattfromtinder9803 I also agree with Shabriri. In all my playthroughs of Elden Ring, I never once sacrificed Melina and always choose to get the Frenzied Flames instead. Of course, fighting Blade of Miquella is a pain but I always do it. That's because I too believe that Melina shouldn't have to die for you to become Elden Lord, even if it is her wish. It's Ironic though. The closer you get to the Frenzied Flames, the more Melina encourage you to turn back. She kept saying that despite how cruel life is, it is also beautiful which makes it worth living for. Yet, she herself is choosing to die rather than to live on. And when you actually give her the chance to live, she resent you for it. Like you, I really wish there is an alternate ending where you didn't have to end in bad terms with Melina.
@@mattfromtinder9803 that what I do too, but I don't think there should be an alternative rote to this yet, I believe that just like Patches did reappear in the Ringed City, some characters that we let alive can reappear in the Elden Rings DLCs
Another thing to consider is we (the player) are coming in RIGHT at the final bell of the world. Even entering the capital and hearing the somber horns to both welcome and let us know there isn't much time left tells us we are at the last moments. The world is about to end. So we have a LOT of things that we do not know that led up to that moment. Huge gaps of history.
Yea. The game of thrones guy said it was 5000 years from the shattering till we come along. Like the school for magics been closed that long but the one guy who wants an extra key and the woman we meet and find trapped to a wall (names slipping atm).
@@dont-touch-mepg1392 thop and sellen
@@dont-touch-mepg1392 I don't tjink it was literally 5000 years. GRRM also said that the game is a sequel to dark souls. I think it's just something he said out of misunderstanding or to give a general number without being specific.
I'm certain a DLC entry point will be one of three places:
Miquella's Egg in Mohgwyn Palace (Miquella dream DLC?)
Girl With Wolves In Maliketh's Arena (Probably Marika's past and Gloam Eyed Queen DLC)
The Ship off the coast of Radahn's Arena (Probably a Badlands DLC)
I think any of these would be so cool and the all fit really well for DLC concepts and entry points
I just wish we get to see a Godwyn riding for Fortissax bossfight lol
Maybe.
The DS2 model for DLC puts the entry points near to areas of thematic significance.
The DS3 model is much less obvious.
It really depends on what story they want to tell. The assumption that DLC will involve Miquella etc. in such direct ways has not panned out in the past and I see no reason why they would do something so obvious now.
I don't think there's any point going to the badlands, it's the realm of mortals as far as I see it. We know it's just a place of hardship & fighting & getting from there to the lands between is extremely difficult, so there wouldn't be a good enough reason why we'd be leaving the land between, so it would need to be a visiting the passed DLC which other than flushing out the backstory of the many tarnished we meet, even more than already in game (which as I'm writing this does sound cool), there's really not much point & probably plenty of other more rich & entertaining places to explore more.
Don't forget the location of the Cinquedea that happens to line up well with the rest of the divine towers. It also has an interesting and often not touched-upon lore piece about when the beasts were granted intelligence and how the hand is a representation of that blessing. It is also used by the priest as a weapon and a base for the black blade to wrap around. Maybe it will act as a key to use the divine towers to go back in time and stop the shattering, or who knows.
I want to find out if i assumed right about this. Cause some how i always did. I always just thought the fingers were made from the erd tree and sculpted to look that way once i saw they were wood. Hence how they speak for the will of the tree. So when they "die" they turn back to the wood of the tree.
Here's something that's been driving me crazy. When Seluvis makes the amber draught, he says that this was once the fate of a demi-god. So one of the demi-gods is actually just a puppet, but... who? The amber starlight shard is at the foot of a Miquella/Malenia statue. So was Malenia just Miquella's puppet? She says that she dreamed for so long at the start of her fight, so was the spell broken when Mohg kidnapped Miquella? Miyazaki grant us eyes, the lore is too deep.
There are tens to hundreds of other demigods we don't know about bcos they are all minor characters, I'd sooner say it's one of them, hell it could even be the Selivis we meet as I suspect he's not actually the real or original Selivis.
It's puppets all the way down!
The Greater Will was Pidia all along!
Arguably every demigod apart from ranni is a puppet to some higher being.
Malenia for the scarlet rot, mohg for the formless mother.
Miquella to some unknown one but he tried to escape.
Morgott to the golden order, rykard to the god devouring serpent and radahn is a puppet of his hunger due to the rot and before that he bound the stars as a way to halt his families fate, meaning he was a puppet to the golden order by keeping the current state.
Rennala is a puppet to the desire of rebirth, which we could attribute to godwyn or the ones living in death.
And godrick is a puppet to his desire to impress godfrey who himself is a puppet to grace.
its highly unlikely, Miquellas charms dont work on the strong, and its very different from the puppets of Seluvis, who all display a complete lack of personality or speech, plus the fact he worked so hard to cure her and everything else indicates the loyalty was both genuine and mutual, if he simply desired her as a strong warrior he could have gone and made radahn or a number of demigods puppets
i also dont think the amber draught has any effect on the the demigod whos fate it came from(except perhaps freeing them of there fate) considering it can be used on anyone, i think the potions work by basically taking fate and distilling it, turning it into a form the puppetmaster can manipulate and force on another, what that fate was before doesent matter since its remade, only that the fate is strong enough to effect demigods, its possible it did come from Mellania though, to free her of her fate as the goddess of rot
Ranni is the puppet Demi-God....
It's her that Seluvis is talking about.
I think Godwin was chosen during the night of black knives because he was likely a strong believer in the golden order and would have gone against Ranni and Merika’s plot against the golden order. He is Godwyn the “Golden” so he was probably a fervent believer in the Golden Order.
And because he was likely a pacifist,and the only other options were…well😂
And it might be related to the fate of the solar Celtic god Lugh
I believe ranni said it was completely random and that Godwyn just happened to be in the wrong place at the right time.
First reply: Godwyn was far from a pacifist. He won the war against the dragons. Secondly, he probably wasn’t as strict a believer as you think. He integrated dragon worship and acceptance, supported Miquella’s goal, and overall seemed pretty open minded.
It really was just right place and time mostly to the guy who was there, unfortunately the guy keeping things good and smooth
I agree with this but also I think because he was they only "known" demi god of the golden order because morgott and mohg were omens so they weren't known to be from the golden order because of that morgott supported the golden order just as much godwyn so technically godwyn was Ranni's only option because she wouldn't have known about morgott or mohg
No joke, I have a lot of respect for Iji. He, an old blacksmith, slew several of the Black Knife Assassins in open combat. That’s impressive. Also, am I the only one who’s wondering how many of those damn women are there?
What if though that the black knife assasins were not there to kill Iji, but were there to protect him? The flame coming from Iji's corpse is black flame. And black flame is used by the Godskin. And aren't the assasins loyalists to Rani? Didn't she lead the assasination? I'm so confused. Am I wrong?
Pretty sure ranni had to kill blaid as he was given to her from the two fingers. Ranni wanted nothing to do with them so she had to get rid of him. As for iiji I believe she said she had to get rid of him too. This was I think from the eternal city from the miniature ranni doll dialogues.
@@TheSlickmicks I got you bro. The Godskins created the black flame to kill gods but the true power was sealed when the rune of death/Destined Death was sealed away. Black Knife Tiche’s ash summon expand on why she allied with Ranni. So it can be inferred that the death of Tiche’s father is why her and the other assassins she was aligned with were willing to kill Godwyn because it’s almost like being betrayed by your own people as it happened under Marika’s rule. At this point her omen children are banished and the twins are quite young so the only one left is Godwyn. The Black Knife Assassins are still women of Nox/Numen that are also related to Marika. Nokrom/Nokstella was shoved underground and forced to live under a false starry sky because they chose to forge their own god so there is hate towards a god they have appointed to them.
With that context, maybe only Tiche allied with Ranni, Tiche recruited others, and embedded their blades with the flame that was capable of killing a god in their entirety which is why it’s red and black. Black and white means it can’t slay a god. Ranni was selected as the Empyrean by the Fingers to rule.
When you put everything together, Ranni more than likely used the BKA to kill Godwyn as it assisted her in her goal but to kill 2 birds with one stone, they turned on Ranni as well because of what her destiny was. Tiche had her blade imbued with Destined Death and used it to kill Godwyn, then she killed Ranni causing Destined death to be split in 2 (body and spirit.) Now I don’t know if Ranni was playing chess but having her body destroyed meant that she no longer is an empyrean because she was killed. Godwyn being killed caused Malenia and Miquella to flee entirely because the Golden Order couldn’t help either of them with their ailments, which were the other Empyreans meant to rule. Ranni severed any connection the Greater Will and the Fingers had to any Empyrean that would rule for them.
FAST FORWARD and the assassins now aware that Ranni still lived stopped at nothing to kill her and any of her Allies. Any of the BKA you fight away from Ranni’s allegiances just kinda stab you in the back and that’s it. The ones that once allied with Ranni used Black Flame to kill Iji and Seluvis in search of her but their flames are black and white; The Black Knife Tiche Summon still has a red and black flame because like I said, the power to slay a god was an honor given to her then when she was inevitably killed for avenging her father. The other assassins probably sought out the Godskins after to help them because they, too, want to slay all the gods but the true power was sealed away again by Maliketh after the assassination.
The thing with Ranni’s two fingers and the destroyed cathedral is that it was said that Radahn had caught wind of Ranni’s plan and wanted to stop it, so he had hauled the movement of the stars an sealed away her two fingers. The rest the cathedral is destroyed is because after Radahn dies, her two fingers crashes there.
Ranni's Divine Tower is the only one which has no Two Fingers at the top, instead the corpse of her original body lies there. So maybe her fingers were located there originally, but her actions somehow caused them to crash into that building - and probably that was intentional, after all Ranni would want to isolate her Two Fingers as much as possible before she has the means to kill them, and nobody except her has access to the moonlight altar area.
Some think that Radahn had her two fingers suspended in space so she couldn’t reach them. When you defeat him all kinds of stuff crashes down including her two fingers.
@@mattfromtinder9803 that is probably true actually, that would explain why her "destiny" is held in place by radahn
@@mattfromtinder9803 no I think both of you are mixing 2 things up. I'm quite sure her 2 fingers have always been at manus celes to serve as a guide for an empyrean or demi god. This is why when you give her the fingerslayer blade she states she sets on her own journey indicating she knows where she is heading. Also Ranni specifically states that she destroyed her physical body to escape her determined (empyrean) fate of the 2 fingers . Radahn halting Ranni's fate has to do with the star that Radahn keeps suspended in the cosmos that is supposed to crash and serve as an entrance to nokstella and the fingerslayer blade. Without Radahn's interference this would have happened already allowing Ranni to continue her fated path to slay her 2 fingers.
correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't ranni the golden child of the greater will?Didn't the greater will try to lead her to combine the elden ring to become the next elden lord? Is that not why she rejected her original body and split her soul off so she didn't become bound to the destiny the greater will was leading her on?
@@Beeelzebud Ranni, Malenia, and Miquella were all candidates as far as replacing Marika. Its not really clear who was leading that pack though.
10:20 the symbol behind Malakith is the complete Elden ring with all parts still intact. You can actually see every single rune that you’re able to earn in game, along with the roots of the great tree, which would symbolize the crucible, as well as the rune of death being present, front and center.
But what about the egg rennal has it's supposed to be a great rune but somehow radagon had it before the shattering of the elden ring
@@jaymor1916 pieces were removed from the Elden ring long before the shattering. Distant death was part of the Elden ring. It was more removed from it. The only time that we know they old and we do have ever been whole is on the greater will first came to the planet.
For why Godwyn was killed, I think it just makes sense if you think about Ranni's options, she had 7 demigods to chose from, Rykard was working with Ranni, Radahn, Malenia, and Miquella were all powerful, but weren't exactly super relevant as they were younger, so probably not the greatest bang for their buck, out of the three eldest, Mohg and Morgott were Omen who were kept out of the public eye, and the other was one of the most beloved men of all time, who was also probably trying to make peace with the dragons with Fortissax, so she not only shakes the lands to their very core, but potentially re-sparks the war with the dragons, I would've chosen Godwyn too.
Meanwhile I have my own question; why can the Omen harness the Prince of Death's flame? the revenants and mausoleum knights make sense, they're linked quite clearly with death, but why can the horned Omen use the same flames, I experimented myself, and the Omen's flames do holy damage, just like the Eclipse Shotel's unique skill, which is said to harness the prince of death's flames, there's no way they aren't related as the flames look exactly the same.
Godwyn life path resembles his father's, Godfrey, and this would easily put him ahead of the other Demigods politically, who else is better suited to take over Marika than the child who closely resembles the First Elden Lord Godfrey.
Omen spirits are gold/black in appearance and scale off int and fth, I feel like this says more about what kind of death he’s the prince of
@@ZomifiedHam but what relation do the Omen have to him in the first place? Morgott can imbue his sword with the flames as well, and while that could be explained by Morgott and Godwyn being brothers, it doesn't explain why random horned omen can harness it too, and only the horned ones, the ones with their horns cut off can't.
Plus, in the item descriptions for both Omen Bairn items, it calls the projectiles "Wraiths" as in the exact same thing the wraith callers in Liurnia summon, also, there are a few wraith callers and a revenant in the sewers where the Omen live, so there's obviously some sort of connection, but what is it?
@@canadiangopnik7007 The "wraiths" are referred to as "rancor spirits" elsewhere, such as the Rancorcall spell and the Rykard's Rancor spell. The Wraith Caller Bell calls them wraiths.
We find them in multiple different energy forms, not just deathblight. The wraith caller bell states that they are the spirits of people who died while cursed. So perhaps the type of energy they embody is based on the type of energy they were afflicted with upon death.
The omen themselves seem connected to the crucible because they grow horns, and the deathblight energy has a tinge of red between the gold and black. Red tinged gold is the colour of the crucible. There's also some suggestion that upon death people return to the tree. So perhaps an omen's soul was somehow tainted by the deathblight energy in the tree.
@@TonkarzOfSolSystem so you're implying that the wraiths, rancors, and rykard's rancor, are all the same thing essentially, but different only in the manner of death?
And I suppose if the Omen are that closely tied to the crucible, it might make sense as to why they could use the flames of the prince of death, seeing as almost right next to the remnants of that primordial tree of the crucible, lies Godwyn, it's not hard to imagine that the crucible has been influenced by his power since the deathroot reaches all across the lands between already.
That actually makes a good bit of sense
9:22
If Marika is the Erdtree, and all those who die rejoin it. The fact the Tarnish leaves the center seemingly (At start of game) - is interesting. As if a piece of herself (Marika) decides to take a chance gamble with fate.
When Melina Burns herself - its reflected in the Burning of the Erdtree itself. It pushes me to believe that Melina (is also Marika) just as much as Radagon is. And that what we find inside the Erdtree is a Husk of Marika with Radagon is an animated male-ego; (The Animus). Which are the male-traits within the female psyche.
Essentially the whole idea of (Shattering) of a God, who manifests the world and existance, where other entities-and-beings are trapped within (The lands between). This God is splitting and shedding all its inner facets (To understand the proper way). These are the so-called; Persona (Marika), Shadow (Maliketh), Anima (Melina), Animus (Radagon), Puer Eternus (Miquella, always young), Senex (Malenia, rotting), The Collective unconscious/conscious/desires and Ego (Godwyn, Mogh, Morgott, Rykar, Radan) etc... Which are all various Archetypes of Carl Jung analytical psychology.
But there is an interesting mixture of (Hunduism) mixed within Elden Ring's mythology.
If Marika is a (Deva). In Hindu-mythology, she has trapped everyone into a stage of karmic-death/reincarnation. And other beings, souls and Entities like her, have manifested and added to this pergatorial-like existance and place (The Lands between). Which they state is (home) to their souls. As long as she and/or others are tethered with desires similar to the GreaterWill/Marika. Then they are stuck on this spoke of the Karmic Wheel... (The Lands between).
Ranni, is of particular note in the story, as she pushes and progresses the lands and all the entities within it, past the previous edge of a Karmic precipous. She's shed her flesh, removed her tethers to friends and familly and has become a new (Deva). To form her own world.
Okay, now this is deep. And I like it.
I would just add a little bit of Buddhism in that Elden Ring as a concept always reminded me of the Law of Dharma ( from Buddhism )... the universal governing law.
Now imagine that broken, not only that it would be impossible to leave Samsara, ever, but local world would have its own mini version of eternal Samsara ( death and rebirth ) without the ability to escape it no matter how much you meditate and untether yourself from the world, without learning through incarnations and progressing in any way. Basically a world frozen in place with its cycle of death and rebirth that is going into eternity without any..any at all.. change.
All inhabitants and creatures you kill do exactly the same things in next incarnation, make the same moves and choose the same choices...forever.
Now Ranni would be as you said, but i would go with Buddhist comparison and call her a Buddha of that world ( there were many Buddhas, not just one widely known as Buddha..thats a title, not a name ).
But wouldn't rabbis mother and some other things not line up then. Because her mom's still alive. She didn't get rid of her and it's ranni we hear when the second stage of her boss fight comes. Given I don't quite understand that whole fight and scene. And why keep us. These r genuine questions and am not trying to nit pick ur shit lol.
@Lee who said he impregnated her? Miquella and Malenia are flawed, and their flaws might be coming from an unnatural process of their creation.
@@Almoniification or maybe they are actually sons of Marika and another outer good, hence their "flaws", which might be just perks
Also a side note about Iji that I just noticed while watching this video: his death pose is similar to that of Seluvis’ puppets (and Seluvis’ death pose himself, and he is potentially a puppet as well).
They're all puppets, I thought this was well known.
@@xLionsxxSmithyx How do you know?
@@fiahpoa Sellen explains it I think...
About how their true self's were placed into a Crystal and that the Bodies are just Empty puppets that they transfer their consciousness into pretty much.
@@xLionsxxSmithyx I knew Seluvis was (Pidia’s, I believe the common theory is), and Ranni is sort of but also not really, but I didn’t know Iji was.
@@S2Pot_Gaming I'm still not 100% on iji tbh but yeah.
I think the challenge would be "10 things we DO know about Elden Ring's Lore"
I've always assumed Godwin was loved by a lot of people, so nobody would've likely thought about trying to kill him, therefore he'd have the least amount of guards making him a prime target for an assassination
He was also the strongest, being an uncorrupted child of a Godfrey with Grace and a Marika that hasn't broke the Elden Ring, so like they all also probably thought no one would be dumb enough to try lol
I like the idea of the statue in Farum being a representation of a kind of process to elevate one to godhood in the lands between. You have the woman surrounded by 3 wolves, and it could be Merika, as well as those who were chosen before Merika. Ranni also had 3 companions, and she too was chosen by the two fingers to take Merika's place in the lands between.
Ranni also has three wolves outside of her tower.
I feel the statue is a symbol of their relationship. It may look like the wolves are attacking her but then you look up and see the lit up Elden ring shining down on her making it look asf if she is holy and worthy of protection. Which gives a whole new meaning to the wolves and that they will hold death for her and what is dark.
Ranni knows immediately that you have Torrent in your care, and he's in Melina's possession up until then. She refers to a "former master" which could mean the tarnished before you, or Melina. Regardless, she somehow knows that you have him. My likely guess is that Kalé tells Blaidd, as he is most likely to have seen you riding Torrent, and it gets passed to Ranni. However, it makes little sense as to why she would put Kalé to sleep if he's assisting her.
It could also mean that Ranni and Melina are allied to some degree as the Godskins oppose the Golden Order as well, were Melina actually the GEQ. If she was the Queen, then it would make sense as to why she is now bodiless, since it is said that she is "defeated" and not explicitly dead in the mentions of her. It's also apparent Melina fights like one of the Black Knife assassins, which could mean she was apart of their order as well, and her weapon states "The one who walks alongside flame, shall one day meet the road of Destined Death." This doesn't specify what type of flame though, as there are many, Giant's Flame being the most obvious, but Blackflame still considerable.
However it puts a pin in the reason why Iji is burning with Blackflame surrounded by the Black Knives. It does imply that the Assassins attacked Iji, since they all attack you too, but since it's not red then and they were previously allied with Ranni, it implies they were all attacked by the Godskins.
Destined Death was sealed away AFTER the night of Black Knives which is the reason why the Godskins lost their power. Blackflame lost the ability to kill gods after Destined Death was sealed, which might be the reason why the Godskins attacked Iji and guard Ranni's body. They might feel that Ranni is to blame as to why Melina, or at least the GEQ, is now defeated. It's also explicit that Maliketh defeated the GEQ, and it could mean that her punishment for aiding the Black Knives is why her body was burned, effectively the same fate that Ranni has, albeit not within a doll to wield a weapon like Ranni can wield the Fingerslayer Blade.
It's only after Ranni proposes to you and kills her fingers that Iji dies, and up until then, the Godskins had no reason to attack Ranni's followers. Another thing is that Blaidd is also attacked, with assassins littered around him, so it's entirely possible that Iji was never intended to live, due to an unavoidable influence that the Greater Will can have on him despite the helmet, and that the flame color is just a graphical error.
But why GEQ (if we assume Melina is GEQ) is so fixated on restoring the cycle, and why is she so opposed to frenzied flames?
Also, I think it's Ranni who kills her followers. As I wrote three times in this comment section, three wolves spawn outside of Ranni's tower. The do not spawn when Blaidd appears there, they stop respawning after Blaidd dies. And that is when Ranni severs her connection to the Erdtree. And on top of that, there's a mystery of the girl, three wolves and an erdtree statue, which kind of implies some form of connection between those three pieces.
Blaidd maybe killed the BKAs because he was mad, just like he attacks the player or Ranni send them to kill him because he now was a threat to her. The only question is what the BKAs get in return for further helping Ranni.
I feel like melina being the gloam eyed queen is so obvious it has to be true
It makes sense as does her being Marika's daughter. The way I see it having seen the fall of the Dragon Order and its God during the age of the Crucible, I think Marika took steps to avoid a similar fate and that why she removed the rune of death from the Elden Ring then took out Melina who became the Gloam Eye-ed when the fingers chose her to wield destined death because she didn't trust the Greater Will and so sought to make so that she and her Golden would live up to her Eternal Namesake but she left Melina burned and bodiless and banished the Tarnished to act as a failsafe/escape clause so that should she ever want to end her order she could do so through them.
It’s my opinion that Melina is similar to Millicent. An offshoot of Marika. Spawned from the golden seeds. The trigger for Marikas shattering being Godwyn being killed, and the trigger for Melanias mind shattering being the disappearance of Miquella. Millicent also spawns from seeds that are left behind by Malenia blooming(or shattering of her mind). I think the two events are very similar if you really get down to it. With the exception of the differing effects that each had on the world. The way in which they both regain memories seems like it fits a similar narrative as well. With Millicent at the very least we can say she is Malenia at least in part. Otherwise using waterfowl dance wouldn’t be possible. There is no way Gowry could have taught her that move, she simply instinctively knows it. Lots of ifs on this but it makes the most sense to me personally.
@user-tp5yp2bv6z Keep in mind that we don't really know what Ranni looks like. The form we see is just a doll, her real body is the one burned up on top of Liurnia's Divine Tower.
@@VIctorcerezini11 I would say when people compare Melina and Ranni they are probably at least in part correct. There are a lot of striking similarities between Ranni and Melina. I can’t really deny that. We just don’t know enough and we are all interpreting the story from different angles. I’m not really holding out hope for DLC to further explain anything though, since that usually isn’t how From soft operates when creating DLC.
Brooo the DLC NEEEEEDS to be about Godwyn or Miquella they have too little lore implications and they are so mysterious WE NEED TO KNOW
Agreed
I might have an answer to the Iji situation. We can see that the ash of war of the Gargoyle's Blackblade throws the destined death flame (the same one as the black knife) but the impact on the ennemies actually creates a black flame aura around them, like the godslayer spells or the one on Iji. So we can assume that the destined death flames can actually cause that black and white aura. So it can be safe to assume that the black knives were the reason of his death.
Why would they leave their dead members behind though? Why not take them with and cover the tracks? Imo they tried and failed and someone else finished the job, leaving the bodies to cover their tracks and blame them
@@rezokiladze2334 Well, first off, we can see that the black knives don't realy care about their dead members, as we can still see a corpse of a black assasin in the snowfields. Second, if there's a puppet master behind the black knives attacks, i don't think it would that useful to cover the tracks, and this event happens instantly after the end of Ranni's quest, so i don't think that the black knives (Or the one who would've done the attack) had Time to get rid of the corpses. And for the third one, i actually don't realy see anybody that can create the black flame and would've had something to care about killing Iji and trying to kill Blaidd and even more about covering the attack.
@@rezokiladze2334 DD does DoT, so it's possible that Iji killed the 3 knives then succumbed to his wounds
I have another question. Why is he in a death pose similar to the puppets that are in Selivus’s secret chamber?
@@mattfromtinder9803 I had the theory that it was a Black Blade Kindred that killed him, the motivation is there, Ranni stole death from Maliketh, Iji is a servant of Ranni, and the Kindreds are servants of Maliketh, and it would make sense why he's looking up, because they're tall as fuck, if he collapsed from the black flame taking it's toll on him, he'd be looking up at it when he fell, also, the Corpse Wax Cutter skill on the Black Gargoyle Greatsword shows a DD blade cutting through the ground, but when it hits, it applies a black flame effect, best theory I got
2:50 about that, I noticed that if you use the ash of war of the gargoyle black blade the enemies you hit are covered in black flames even if the sword has the power of destined death. This is exactly what happens with the black knifes and Iji's body, they wield the power of destined death but the flames are black for some reason. I don't think that the Godskin are involved, the assassins simply killed Iji and Blaidd but the flames are wrong
They could really solve a lot of these puzzles with one dlc that took us back to the past, to the age of the crucible. We already have a mechanic in the game that takes us in the past, wouldn’t be too far from the stretch of imagination. If we were able to play through maybe right at the prime of the Crucible and then it goes all the way until the night of the black knives, I think it would answer all of our questions for Melina, Godwyn, and the Crucible. Two DLCs, one for explaining the past and one for exploring Miquellas dream would be perfect.
Except, fromsoft never really makes dlc specifically for certain questions to be answered,
If anything dlc will add more questions with some main game mysteries cleared up here and there.
So you know the dlc will be neither of these things lmao
@@drunken1967 Bloodborne DLC did answer a lot of questions. Like what Kos is, about Lady Maria, about Ludwig and Laurence etc. All of those are names that were mentioned in the base game. DS3 did also give us answers about the Painted World(s) plus the Pygmies and the Dark Soul itself. Maybe we get something similar with Elden Ring so I could see us getting some important answers about characters or places mentioned in the base game.
About Iji, the Black Flame was the flame of Death weakened after Destined Death was removed from the Elden Ring. So my interpretation is that Black Knives killed Iji and the leftover power from their knives turned from the flame of Destined Death into the weakened Black Flame
Ok so I'll immediately debunk your "How did Iji Die" mystery with the simplest answer possible: It was an oversight by fromsoftware. An old unused voice recording for when you defeat Maliketh and burn the Erdtree said: "The rune of death is unbound. Black Flames have devoured the Erdtree, and the Lands Between are shrouded by Death's dark fate." This means that a while ago the black flame and the rune of death (destined death) were directly linked, meaning that the black knife assassins would use the black flame too. That explains why iji is burning with black flames, Destined Death was supposed to be the black flames and they simply didn't consider it a crucial detail when polishing the game
would this not have been updated or patched out by now if it wasn't intentional? especially on what is essentially the climax of a major questline in the game. we're on version 1.08.1
Dude i think after 9 months this oversight would have been brought to their attention countless times
@@exeterd9 and yet fires deadly sin is still buggy af
The game was rushed af it most definitely is an oversight that isn't incredibly important in their eyes
I’m personally more of the idea that Melina is indeed Marika and Radagon’s daughter. The hair color matches between both, she has the bodiless curse and shares a naming pattern with the demigods Miquella and Malenia. It’s just that she’s not a twin and may have been much more recent, compared to the demigods.
i mean if she was bodiless as a curse from birth like the twins it would be possible there triplets, after all only two bodies would come out, noone, not even the midwife, or radagahns would no, the only one who could know was there mother who could feel them
@@seelcudoom1 I really like this theory, she might have been a more recent edition, especially with the fact that she says she has a mother but also hints at the fact that she doesn't know what a mother's love feels like during Boc's questline, and the bodiless curse could be a side effect of being born from one demigod just like Malenia's rot and Miquella's Eternal youth
@@seelcudoom1 I saw a video by masked nintendo bandit on her being born from the great rune of death to assist us in bring it back into the world, great video that honestly makes sense and could be right. Idt I could really explain it here but i think you should really check it out
I think the relation to the death of Ranni's followers is Melina. I'm convinced she's a demigod related to Ranni, and also the Gloam Eyed Queen. That makes Melina related to the black flame, and we already knew that she has relations to the Black Knife Assasins as well because of the way she fights. Maybe Melina is secretly trying to hinder you from getting Ranni's ending by killing Ranni's followers? Kinda like she turns on you during the frenzied flame ending.
What I found weird is that we have an example of her trying to stop you from getting an ending and, if she is the gloam eyed queen, why is a godskin protecting ranni's body? Doesn't seem all that bothered by you joining ranni at all
Did you save Melina then quell the frenzied flame? Did the little jar tell you his intentions to go on a quest? And did you get the letter from Rya telling you of her intentions to go on a quest? It may be wishful thinking but I’m hoping that there actually is something planned for these particular fates.
Personally I think that with Ranni's two fingers it was hiding underneath the earth. And a meteorite leading Ranni's fate crashed into the church revealing the way to the fingers. Similar to how the giant meteorite opens the way for us to visit Nokron. I think the many starlight shards are evident of that.
I remember talking to Gideon how he always saids the two fingers have long lost their purpose. That compounded with how everyone else's two fingers are dead as well and that Ranni and her two fingers were at odds ends. More like a game of hide and kill each other.
I think Rannis two fingers was suspended in space by Radahn. All kinds of stuff comes crashing down to the ground when he is defeated, not just the void monster we fight on the way to the moonlight alter. It’s even mentioned that her fate is held in place along with the stars. Radahn likely was aware of her plans and stopped her at some point from going through with it. Whether or not it was an antagonist or a protective action against her I suppose we can’t know. Seeing how Radahn was pretty into the golden order though I’d say he was probably not on her side.
About the Wolves ashes, Ranni mentioned it was owned by the previous owner of Torrent.
This is interesting since through Torrent, there is a link between Ranni and Melina before they met the Tarnished.
In the Maliketh boss room I believe there is a statue of a girl surrounded by wolves at the back of the room. Possible connection?
I was thinking that Melina could be a black knife assassin, because her battle moveset is the same as the black knife assassins, and she says that she is going to deliver destined death in the frenzied ending, like the black knife assassins do. but the thing is that she is using the opposite of the black knife, she doesn't wear the armor and she's helping the Tarnished.
also, aren't the godskins related to the destined death in some way? the black fire is similar to the black-red destined death fire and life sapping
I think AgtJake had the right answer to the first one. He talks about it in his recent Tarnished video. Although we physically enter the Erdtree at the end of the game, the Erdtree is usually connected to memories and spirits, and the roundtable hold might actually be inside the Erdtree. He said the reason we are seemingly able to teleport to the chapel of anticipation is that our physical body was already in the chapel; it was our spirit that had to move from the Erdtree back to our bodies. So the opening scene is a remembrance of the inside of the Erdtree, similar to how the roundtable hold we visit throughout the game is a remembrance of the physical location.
I tend to agree since when you burn the tree the round table hold Melina takes us too also appears to burn. But that solution also creates a logical fallacy, since Melina wants to go to the foot of the Erdtree, but can also already go there?
After watching this I had a thought about our Fingermaiden and realized a connection with other dead Fingermaidens we see. Out of all the possibilities of who killed our FM, only one person is *very near* the scene who already knows what/who you are: Melina, and she’d know your FM was waiting for you. Melina wants to find her purpose. She can’t do that if a Fingermaiden (or Frenzy Flame) usurps that. She threatens to deliver you Destined Death for thwarting her - a FM would certainly be a disposable threat in her way. We personally see 4 definitively dead bodies of FMs: Ours, Vyke’s, Irina, and the Shack of the Lofty burned Maiden - all potential threats to fulfilling her destiny found dead along the Path. She and Shabriri are like counters to each other with the same need to manipulate the Tarnished through FM’s. As for bloody hands mercy-deather Varré - perhaps he just dipped into our FM’s blood rather than doing the deed. How else would he have known ‘any Maiden’s blood’ would work for the Favor? He just needs blood - Melina needs them gone.
From what I understand destined death is connected to both the black and white godslaying flame and the black and red flame of destined death. They are in different forms. I can't remember what lore video breakdown i watched that talked about it though. But the black and white flame pre-dates the red and black flame. The black and white flame was *designed* with the purpose to kill gods while perhaps the red and black flame is a more pure expression of destined death. Doesn't explain what happened to Iji but at the very least the two flames I believe are related.
Zio: I have no idea what the cosmos is
Smoughtown: hold my beer
Ranni tells you she's the one who stole part of the Rune of Death. She was the mastermind behind The Night of The Black Knives. She created the black knives. She had them kill Godwyn, and at the same time she killed herself, half the rune of death in each of them, she killed her body, Godwyn's soul was killed. She then betrayed them, as we have the leader of the black knife assassins locked in an Evergoal. They refuse to give her the Fingerslayer blade (it's in Nokron, and The Black Knife Assassins were all Numen Women, aka the Nox of Nokron & Nokstella) so she has you go steal it. When they learn it's gone, they go to kill Ranni, but she already left, so they killed Iji instead.
about the girl with the wolves: it’s highly likely that it’s marika.
smith master hewg has very close ties to marika, and seems to know her personally. we learn from him that roderika has the same eyes as someone he knows; and he teaches roderika what that someone else told him about her ability to interact with spirits. it stands to reason that the original spirit tuner would be marika.
Iji, seeing his end fast approaching, called in a favor from his boy Miriel who, having been given the heretical godskin prayer book (by us), nuked the area with black flame, killing the assassins. Unlikely? Unfathomably so. Entertaining to think about? Absolutely.
Possible
I just think the Black Knife assassins killed him and the color the flame is just wrong. Hell it wasn't even present until the 1st patch so it was definitely a hastily made addition.
@@Terminalsanity That's a bit odd though as they've been quietly going through and correcting things like maps and other visual lore indicators, yet Iji's "wrong" flame color has survived to this day.
I’m guessing Radahn must have known about his sister Rannis plan and using gravity magic sealed Rannis fate among the stars by casting her fingers into space so she cannot kill them 🤷♂️
Imagine a dlc about Melina where the final boss of it changes depending on the ending you got on that play through. Melina herself being one of them
Imagine a marika boss fight if we go back in time, I mean honestly she is also one of the characters we know the least about even though she’s the one who set the whole game in motion, we also already fought radagon in the normal game so it makes perfect sense that we’d someday be able to face her
I think the statue in Maliketh’s boss room tells us who Melina is. It’s a statue of a young girl resembling Melina surrounded by three wolves, which matches with Ranni’s first voice lines to us when she gives us the spirit calling bell as a gift from Torrent’s former master (i.e. Melina). In Farum Azula, we see statues of a king, a queen, and a young child. We know the dragons were able to take on human form. With Placidusax being an Elden Lord, this would imply his queen was the previous vessel for the Elden Ring during the age of the Crucible. Their child may have been an empyrean. When Marika’s armies fought and defeated Placidusax, Placidusax’s wife would have died, and Marika could then claim the Elden Ring. If Melina was the daughter of Placidusax, she may have hid, then taken her mother’s body and (in a fashion similar to Radagon) turned her into the Godslaying Greatsword. Think of it. Melina sends us to Farum Azula. Her statue is in Farum Azula. The godskins are in Farum Azula (which is essentially a giant mausoleum). That is why the Gloam-Eyed Queen wanted to kill the demigods. She wanted revenge on Marika, but Marika sent Maliketh who defeated her and sealed Destined Death away. Then Melina was forced through Erdtree burial, and was “born at the foot of the Erdtree” where she says “my purpose was given to me by my mother.” Marika had her reborn in the Erdtree, and used her affinity to flame-based powers to burn the Erdtree and free herself from the Elden Beast’s control.
That’s my two cents on the matter, anyway.
Holy shit, that makes alot of sense!
Altough I am on the fence about the Elden Lord having to have a human form. Placidusax might have had a dragon god, as it was an all together different, and ancient, time period. But it would make sense that Placidusax took a human form to become Elden Lord, much like how Hoarah Loux took on Serosh and became Godfrey.
I think Melina is to Ranni what Radagon is to Marika. Except Ranni separated her other self from her. Maybe even as an unintentional consequence of The Night of Black Knives plot. We know Ranni is an Empyrean , which means she was a candidate to replace Marika/Radagon as a vessel for the power of The Greater Will. We also know that the current vessel is in fact two people, Marika and Radagon. We also know that Ranni is Radagon's/Marika's daughter so it stands to reason that she'd inherit this dual-personhood from her parent(s).
But then Ranni killed her body, effectively severing her connection to Radagon/Marika and therefore The Greater Will. I think Melina is the spirit of Ranni's other self. That explains why the glowing spirit attached to Ranni's current body looks like Melina. It also explains why they both have a connection with Torrent.
Their goals also seem to align. Ranni wants to effectively usurp The Greater Will. However, her ending dialogue implies she instead plans to simply find a new world. Burning the Erd Tree may have been an earlier plan that has since been abandoned, hence Melina's own apprehension towards her own purpose earlier in the game.
There's also a lot of aesthetic parallels between them. Melina has off-red hair which implies a tenuous connection to Radagon, who is Ranni's estranged father. Melina notably first introduces herself to our Tarnished during a clear night where the moon is visible, the same as Ranni, even using the same sort of effect when appearing before us. Melina and Ranni's eyes are mirrored and it's at the point where they're mirrored that they are bound as seen on Ranni's current body, implying that they are two sides of the same person.
For why Godwyn was killed:
During a mixture of Ranni and Fia’s questline, its made clear that in order for Ranni to escape her two fingers she needed to shed her physical form. Godwyn was used as a scapegoat for Ranni. Godwyn’s soul was killed but his body remained and festered, which allowed Ranni to turn around and kill her body but save her soul.
As for why exactly why Godwyn was picked? Theres a couple theories littered around, but I’m not entirely sure. I would think it has something to do with his presence being a direct conflict to the order she (Ranni) wishes to bring onto the lands between.
Something i know is that at the frenzy ending if you first burn the tree in the normal way( so she dies) she wouldn't appear as the glome eye Quinn
Have you ever noticed in the demi-human forest ruins (in weeping pennisnsula) that when you defeat the the demi human queen all the monkey men start to cower in fear. Almost as if that was their god and they were just trying to defend it😢 and then we come in and just ruin their whole universe lol. If u read the demi queen staffs bio it says “it can be wielded by those with little intelligence”. Maybe the monkey men finally found a god/mentor that could teach them even with their low int, and we just unknowingly destroyed it on our quest:(
Maybe the fingers were built as wooden anchors that a sort of 'old god' latched onto and replace with flesh.
Maybe the fingers take that form only as a limitation of the construction of these anchors?
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Perhaps Melina was once combined with Ranni and when they split their new identities changed the timeline in some way? Because of the identical overlaying symmetrical eye seals they both have.
What pisses me off in ER storytelling is that I feel like it's trying so hard to hide information from you even if it doesn't make sense. In DS1 not knowing much felt much more natural. It made more sense there. In ER it feels like every npc is like "do what I tell you to and don't ask questions" when they can easily provide information you would certainly be curious about.
Isn't The Blind swordsman Malenia? I thought we have already established this. The fairy taught her how to wield the flowing sword and she sealed her Rot with sheer determination of a swordsman while her Brother miquella desperately looked for ways to completely seperate the influence of the rot god from her through unalloyed gold. The only question is who the fairy actually is.
The ending of millicents questline where she refused to bow down to anyone trying to control her and would rather die and how she asks you to return something back to malenia to remind her what she has sacrificed of her determination as a swordsman when she used the scarlet rot to double suicide with Radahn, nicely ties in malenias state as a swordsman that gave up her pride or her will power to let gods decide her battles for her.
The blind swordsman is seen on the Curved Sword Talisman and in the Prothesis-Wearer Heirloom description it says the following:
"Though born into the accursed rot, when the young girl encountered her mentor and his flowing blade, she gained wings of unparalleled strength"
Meaning obviously that Malenia had a mentor. On the talisman there is Malenia with another person (the blind sowrdsman). Malenia is blind and he trained her as her mentor.
@@EldenLord. you can actually get that mentors gear as well but I forget where.
@RedEye yes, malenia is with the blue dancing fairy, her mentor.
Fact 1: Blue fairy taught a blind swordsman, blind swordsman sealed the rot god.
Fact 2: young girl encountered her mentor and his flowing blade and gained wings of unparalleled strength.
This is simply not two separate events. Its two accounts of the same event.
There is one person that gives power to someone to accomplish something. One account calls him a fairy and the other calls him mentor. The fact that she gained 'wings' of strength from her mentor should signify why he was called a fairy in that account. Subtle yet amazing way to separate points of view.
@@mattfromtinder9803 i know what you are talking about. That's not his set more as the clothes of his nomadic people.
The missing God of the Dragons is not another Outer God but similar God-Queen like Marika since Placidusax is a Lord
My internal gut thought that the Roundtable Hold in Leyndell is the same as the one we fast travel too. However the version that we travel to is in a different point in time in the past. I mean the pick ups seem to be the dead drops of the NPCs in the same positions of those NPCs, and the structure is identical. When you get there and find the NPC's stuff it seemed like they had died in the past and you showed up in the present to pick it up.
But, if it's in the past, why does it burns at the same time the in-world one does?
All of these are definitely unsolved, but I'd like to add another one to the list: The Age of the Duskborn, and specifically what it entails outside of including life within death into the order.
Most notably, the item description for the death prince mending rune says that the new order under this rune will be one of "Death restored", given back; however, this Death really can't be anything other than Destined Death as it was the only Death that was removed/taken away in the first place, and yet we had to release it in order to even reach the elden ring and place in said rune.
Could that then mean that the death prince rune is instead the only one that keeps Destined Death unbound in the coming Age? That all the other endings barring the frenzied flame one rebind Destined Death? According to Blaidd, shadows can't truly die so long as their respective two fingers exist, and since Blaidd's at Manus Celes is the only one that was truly killed, it means Maliketh never really died after our fight in Farum Azula, so it wouldn't be impossible for him to come back and thus reseal Destined Death again.
there's a solid case to be made that the fairy that taught the blind swordsman was the Siofra river, which shares its name with a fairy from a scottish folk story. The legend in game would then be a mythologized story about the swordsman developing his flowing style and signature waterfowl dance in imitation of the flowing waters of the river, rather than there being a literal fairy.
Destined Death infused weaponry like the Gargoyle Greatsword use red flame attacks that leave black flames when they hit the target. This may be a mechanical limitation, but the black flame and the red flame of death are both Death's Flame.
My reason for Godwyn being chosen is that he was also an Empyrean. Malenia and Miquela are both under the influence of outer gods (formless mother and the god of rot), so that left Marika without any viable candidate. It would be pointless for Ranni to slay herself only for Marika to pick another (that and the half-death thingy)
I think Melina is both the Gloam-eyed queen and Marika's daughter. She's an empyrean that failed to be a lord or a god.... "But should ye fail to become aught at all, ye will be forsaken. Amounting only to sacrifices..." (capital outskirts dialog). She rebeled against Marika and lost, so amounting to nothing. She was than submited to some dark rituals that put her into that burnt and bodyless state, like the Official's Attire description suggests (It's found right beside the Blade of Calling).
Unless I'm missing something, nothing prevents the Elden Beast of being Placidusax's consort. Clearly a god, dragonlike, and the way that it uses Radagon's body as a sword seems more spiteful than anything.
My theory is that those balck knives are not real black knives. The Baleful shadow is a fake Blaidd that uses black flame. The black knives helped Ranni in her plot, so Ranni's foes impersonate them in order to try to fool Iji. The black flame points to Godskin people, the reasoning would be that they are simply anti-god, Marika or otherwise.
Godwyn was only a demi-god not an Empyrean. Remember of the Demi-gods only Ranni, Miquella and Malenia had that title. Ranni literally tells us this and nowhere in the game is Godwyn referred to as an Empyrean the only other Empyreans mentioned aside from Ranni, Miquella and Malenia are Marika and the Gloam-Eyed Queen.
Interestingly enough given Ranni's goal I think she entered into the Night of black knives conspiracy planning that Radahn was to be slain not Godwyn as Radahn kept Ranni fate suspended for an age so targeting Radahn would have been a 2 for 1 death but as things turned out Ranni's ultimate ambitions were stalled out indefinitely since Godwyn was slain in his place. I suspect the Black Knife assassins did this intentionally specifically to sabotage Ranni's and that's why plan that that's why Ranni has their Leader Alecto Locked up in the Evergoal in the immediate aftermath of the Night of Black Knives. I suspect this was done at the behest of Miquella and the Black Knife Assassins had been persuaded into him serving as their long awaited lord of Night(I mean he did try to eclipse the sun) and were then by him to enter into conspiracy with Ranni and Rykard's using their ambitions to further his own and had Godwyn killed instead of Radahn orchestrating the fall of the Golden Order to make way for his own Order of unalloyed Gold while sidelining the only known Empyrean that could and would rival his own order Ranni which would then also explain why the Black knife assassins attack Iji and Blaidd once Ranni has slayed her two fingers and is in position to establish her order. (the Black flames on Iji being nothing more than a coloring error the flames were actually part of the 1st patch and the Gargoyles Blackblade which attacks with the red tinted flame of the death rune has a similar coloring error as in inflicts a black flame on enemies)I suspect Miquella controlling the Black Knife Assassins because you 4 living Black Knife assassins guarding the seal to the haligtree in Ordinia along with Albanaurics you even find the Black Armor set there.
In regards to Placidusax I assume his God was an Empyrean in dragon form that the Greater Will eventually abandoned as the age of the Crucible gave to the ae of the Erd tree and its for that reason Marika having seen the Greater will and the Elden Beast/ring abandon its one time vessel and God not wanting to be one day replaced or discarded herself, that once The greater will through the two finger appointed her Daughter Melina to be the weilder of destined Death and became the Gloam Eye-ed Queen Marika then took it upon herself to remove the Rune of death from the Elden ring and had Maliketh defeat The Gloam-Eyed queen so she could then seal destined death so the greater will could not similarly discard her or her Golden Order but left Melina burned and bodiless to like the tarnished act as a failsafe to burn the erd tree should Marika decide to end things which she did when she resolved to shatter the Elden Ring.
Last time I was playing I was just spending some time in Limgrave taking it all in when I realized that I didn’t see a sun anywhere and then it hit me that I don’t think I ever had in all the lands between. It seems like the erdtree is the main source of light. Has anyone else noticed this? It’s not a huge lore discovery or anything but it has interesting implications.
Cuz Goldwyn died and he was the “sun” just like Ranni is the “moon”
Merry Christmas, bud. And thanks for posting more mysteries!
9:40
"Ashen remains in which spirits yet dwell.
Use to summon the spirits of three lone wolves.
Spirits of wolves chased from their pack. They later encountered a nameless Tarnished, who welcomed them as hunting companions. The wolf spirits overwhelm enemies with their agility, aiding the summoner in combat."
Who is this Tarnished in the description? Could it be the Tarnished Of No Renown? Or perhaps someone else entirely?
just got the elden ring artbooks volume 1 and volume 2 for christmas and im nerding out hard
My take is that the Black knife assassins were there to take out Ranni, but instead Jiji and Blaid got in the crossfire. That's all I can think of.
I heard a theory once that Ranni killed them and right before you grab her hand in her ending it’s cuts away but you get stabbed in the back by the assassins.
@@mattfromtinder9803 I don't think Ranni controls the assassins, it makes no sense, they are with Queen Marika, Ranni's goal conflicts with the will of the Elden Ring.
@@Cybershroom well personally I don’t think that theory is correct as well, however I’m not so sure that the assassins are with Marika. I think it’s more likely it’s someone else. I get that they are Numen women like Marika but that would imply that Marika had Godwyn killed, which doesn’t make sense if the prevailing theory of why the elden ring was shattered was because Marika was distraught by the death of Godwyn. Also, Ranni admits to stealing a fragment of the rune of death to forge the black knives. It’s just a thought but perhaps Ranni tricked the assassins in some way and they seek revenge. Or, and like I said not likely, she’s straight up evil and had everyone she cared about killed.
I think beast mark on Melina`s face and the fact that there is 'gloamy' eye beneath it pretty much confirms that she is the Gloam-eyed queen defeated by the Maliketh, who is a beast after all. Also she says that she will 'deliver you destined death'.
I believe Godwyn was killed because he was the only logical Demigod for Ranni to use when the rune of death was craved upon the two of them. And also because Ranni needed another Demigod in order for the rune of death to function properly. When it comes to the well known Demigods, Ranni probably never knew about Morgott and Mohg because they were imprisoned under Leyndell. Godrick wouldn’t work because he isn’t a true Demi god. Miquella and Malenia’s location were probably unknown to Ranni. And Ranni couldn’t use Rykard or Radahn because they were her brothers.
The Hand is what crashed onto the Lands Between. Two Fingers (pinky and ring) represent stability. Three Fingers (thumb, index, and middle) represent chaos.
This game is extremely meta and can’t be fully understood without the meta concept.
When we hold our controllers, our pinky and ring fingers stabilize (Order) our controller. Our thumbs, index, and middle fingers control the buttons, which brings destruction (Chaos).
Also, the Chapel of Anticipation is where we start because we were placed there as soon as we started to hype (anticipate) the game years before release.
I think the idea of all these God-like beings coming from space is cool because it opens up the possibility of there being more Elden Ring games or DLC taking place somewhere else in the galaxy.
The black flame is from Godskin Apostles, children of Goddess of Death, Gloam eyed Queen, the girl which always talks about Destined Death, and Black Knife Assassins also got that with them, Destined Death.
If you look super closely, while standing in Leyndell, you can just barely make out the "Great Cosmic Cheese" up in the sky. It's a sight to behold. It shines it cheesy light upon the lands between, and empowers us all.
On why was Godwyn chosen to die - I honestly think this is just GRRM being inspired by Nordic mytjology and Godwyn being a stand-in for Baldur. He had to die exactly because he was beloved champion, because his death put the things in motion and it led to change. His role is purely to be the catalyst. Even his fate as the Prince of Death- to be forever dead and soulless- is similar to Baldur's fate.
On what fingers are: As I figured it out: I think fingers fell/Great Old One cut it from itself and threw it where Ranni slayed hers and other fingers acting as antennas we see in the game are just minor manifestations, similar to Erdtree and minor trees. And yes, they are both flesh and wood because they have the same creator and you have to have special items to destroy them. Cutting the fingers/burning the tree literally means cutting the GW off, so that's how I chose to interpret it. Until DLC comes out and lore hunters provide, I will roll with it.
And one question I want to know is were Marika and Radagon always one which would require further explanation on how that actually worked, or were they separate beings joined later in some freak fertility experiment that resulted in twins.
Thanks for video, Zio!
Rani could maybe be dead already and Melina is her flesh body and rani is the spirit. We know this is how spirits and bodies work in the Elden ring universe generally. And we know dead bodies can be inhabited by other forces or beings with sentience. And the spirits of the dead bodies have goals or aspirations like the dung eater. I’m kind of typing this as it’s coming to mind but don’t either also supports the idea that a body and spirit can make separate decisions and have separate memories. So I believe Ronnie and Melanie are two forces that originate from the same place, that being her death by three wolves, and that is why Ronnie has three wolves to give you.
I used voice to text for this and there’s no way I’m going to edit this long of a comment so who cares about spelling if anything makes no sense go ahead and ask I’ll be mulling over this and would love to get a rebuttal and some thoughts on this idea
Hey Zio, got some good input on your speculation about Melina.
I think Melinas identity is related to Ranni, here's why. Melina has a tattoo on her eye of a crows foot. But if you'll notice it's actually missing one of the toes. If you line up Melina with Rannis spirit face, you see they're actually extremely similar and a marking on the spirit face looks like the missing toe off the crows foot.
The fact that this marking is the foot of a crow makes me think about the Twinbirds and death, and it made me realize both Melina and Ranni are heavily associated with death and Spirits. There are many dualities that exist in Elden Ring, notably an extremely old one between Fire and Ice. However, when you start looking into Ice you find everything associated with the cold is associated with spirits as well, even down to the Cold Ghostflame and Frozen Lightning Wisps in Siofra, it's consistent and unique from Glintstone magic. All of this is associated of course with Ranni, the Snow Witch herself. Melina on the other hand is associated with fire, she calls herself the one who walks alongside flame.
So taking all of this into account, and the fact that the Twinbirds primarily utilize Ghostflame (literally a cold flame made of angry spirits) I think Ranni and Melina are actually reincarnations of the Twinbirds themselves. (Now thinking about it, they could be literal Twin Birds, like twin girls born as the aspect of death for two different faiths, twins because of Dadagon.)
Ranni isn't the Snow Witch though .. She introduces herself as *Renna* the Snow Witch, which is a lie. According to item descriptions her doll is made to resemble her mentor, the Snowy Crone. But the duality and connection between Melina and Ranni is undeniable
@holding on only to let go thanks gamer, I'll give you some more too.
The Flame of Ruin is inside the faith of the Erdtree. It was always meant to burn it, Marika threw out everyone who was pointing this out. So the Flame of Ruin is like the aspect of death for the Erdtree, it represents the end.
Rannis Cold magic doesn't have a strong connection like this to death necessarily, but it is associated with Spirits and thus Death by association.
Melinas closed eye is the same closed eye on Rannis spirit face, and its the same eye that holds Destined Death. Again reinforcing that they share one parent who passed this "embodiment of Death" on to them, good old Dadagon, a Fire Giant himself. Further, many (and by that I mean most) Erdtree Burial sites use Ghostflame torches to light the room, and some are guarded by Zamor. Also, Rennala was an Astrologer who studied the Primeval Current in the Mountaintops. The Primeval Current is weirdly associated with Cold Sorcery, as Rannis discovery of the Dark Moon (potentially the Black Moon of Noxstella) is reminiscent of the Astrologers discovery of the Primeval Current, which the Nox are associated with as well as Cold Magic. It's a lot gamer.
Could the blind swordsman possibly be a small legend of Zelda reference? A fairy, a warrior, and a special sword specifically used to defeat a powerful enemy?
Varre and Melina... I believe he killed our maiden as we were being resurrected. Her body is against the wall when we wake up, and he instantly knows we are maidenless when we first emerge, and has blood on his gloves. The point to which our Maiden would be speaking to us Melina shows up on Torrent and assumes the role, seemingly having picked us in particular. While even he doesn't mention or acknowledge her existence, he clearly has something to do with her. He is also the character that introduces us to invading other people's worlds, where maybe he met her or communicated with her.
The scarlet bloom outside of melania’s boss fight who actually was it or why is it there?
Melina is the GEQ in the sense that Marika was the GEQ.
Melina being a sort of daughter clone of Marika and Radagon which Marika devised as a way of escaping the Erdtree (and Radagon and a whole bunch of things tbh). She's the soul of Marika rebirthed through the Erdtree.
This is why nobody knows about her. She is relatively new to the Lands Between while also being the prime mover and shaker of said lands.
I just hope the DLC focuses on one of three things, 1. where exactly tarnished come from/places beyond the Lands Between. 2. How things were before the Elden Ring was shattered. 3. More information on the other Outer Gods.
Ranni was behind the black knives business. Iji gets killed by black knife assassins once she achieves her goals and her associates all outlive their usefulness.
I think what happened there is SHE sent them to wrap things up for her. Even though her dialogue points out she feels she owes to them, I guess she also felt this was something that had to be done. A bit of grey morality for the top waifu that she got rid of her teammates, and we'd probably been another one she'd sent assassins after if we hadn't ended up her consort.
Wait the roundtable hold is in Leyndell. There is a building next to some dogs and 2 Knights with the exact same layout as the Roundtable hold.
Iji's situation has confounded me! So glad you mentioned it
I think Godwyn was chosen to be assassinated simply because he was the first demigod destined to die. It’s stated by the finger crone reader before entering the correlating underground city.
Now I believe hawksaw implied that Marika had a hand in Godwyn’s death but regardless, the crone stated(paraphrasing) “godwyn was supposed to be the first of the demigods to die and become a true prince of death but, not like this” or something like that. It might’ve been Ranni or Marika’s plan due to “well he’s gonna die anyway”.
Black Knife, black flame, Iji.
There is a huge connection. In the time of the Gloam Eyed Queen, she channeled Destined Death through her sword to create the god-killing black flame and distribute the power to kill among her Godskins.
When Destined Death was claimed by Maliketh, the black flame lost the potency required to cause death.
The black flame is muted destined death.
I think it is reasonable to connect the two groups, Godskins and Black Knives, either as parts of the same general organization or an “anticipation of” sort of thing.
Where would Ranni have learned how to bind a fragment of Destined Death to a weapon if not from the Gloam Eyed Queen? There are suggestions enough to make the connection between Godskins and Ranni, if not the whole Carian family. And it is very clear that Ranni uses the Black Knives.
As far as how the Tarnished gets to the chapel, my theory is that there are waygates linking the other lands to the Lands Between, and the destination location just happens to be in the chapel.
Anyone else find it off that the dragon god used to be elden lord. But when you see it, it has 2 heads standing straight up just like the 2 fingers waiting for the greater will to speak to it. Also when you look at the dragon is has 5 heads, but 3 are cut off. It's skin around the necks look similar to the 2 fingers and 3 fingers flesh.
The statue might be Rani's human demi-god form. With her 3 protectors. Iji, Blaide, and you represented as her wolves. And it goes with the symbolism of the 3 spirit wolves she give you. And wolves howl (serve) at the moon. Plus she was next inline to take Marika's place but she rejected it.
I have a theory, even though it’s a bit far fetched but what if the black knife assassins were there to help protect blaidd and iji. Cause if you look at iji his corpse had black flame and the black knife assassins are dead but they can’t/ don’t use the black flame. Now with blaidd, we know he was going insane and iji had him locked up so what if he killed those black knife assassins in a fit of rage. The reason we do not see the black knife assassins earlier is because they can be invisible. So what if the godskin or some other magic user came to eliminate ranni, and found her guarded by iji and the black knifes and killed them but didnt go further cause ranni was missing and the other black knifes showed up and that person ran. Then when blaidd shows up he thinks the black knifes killed iji or he was simply unaware that he was being guarded by them and he didn’t know why they were there so he killed them in a fit of rage and confusion.
I honestly think they legit just third party-ed, pointed down and did the L dance, went to knock on Rannie's door to see if she was home, shrugged it off and left lmao.
I found something the other day when u go back to rannis chambers after finishing her quest, u can talk to her ranni doll again and she asks you to join her, can't remember exact dialogue but something to do with helping her remake the world in the stars or something.
Ngl I love the fact that we can pick Warrior and BE the person that taught Melania,not a forced thing,but a choice to immerse yourself IF you want it....or some person that looted him....
My interpretation of the Blaidd/Iji/Black Knife Assassins was based on something Iji himself said. He mentioned that since Ranni was starting to stray from her purpose, as given by the Greater Will and Two Fingers, that Blaidd, her shadow, would eventually go insane and try to kill her. It's why Iji locks Blaidd in the evergaol that housed Darriwil; he knew Blaidd was starting to lose his mind. If you release Blaidd, Iji will say something that he understands what's about to go down, and accepts fate. I believe the Black Knife assassins were there to protect Ranni (remember, they served under her and helped her with the Night of Black Knives, and they desire to see her Order come about, so there's no reason they would attack her,) and they, with Iji, fought against Blaidd. I believe Blaidd is responsible for Iji's death. I'm just not sure how the black flame is connected.
I wonder if Ranni and the Black Knives weren't fully at odds like some hypothesize, and they were helping Iji fight off the godskin nobles and perhaps were "helping" in a "merciful" sense Blaidd.
2:48 the gargoyles black blade weapon also uses the red flames of destined death but whenever it hits an enemy the flames are black so it might just be an inconsistency with designers or these black knives DIDNT have access to pieces of the rune of death so their flames came out black without any hints of destined death being similar or the same as the godskin’s black flame
The fingers on top of the towers are burnt. I think these towers were used for some kind of punishment, where the "neer-do-wellers" were scorshed by the magic fire stones you can see lining the rim of the towers.
Ranni never asks how you got torrent which is interesting just that she knew his previous owner
As far as a technical explanation for the black flames on Iji goes, it could be that the black flames and destined death flames looked the the same before the devs differentiated their color, and Iji's corpse was just something that got overlooked.
Lore wise they are heavily linked to each other so its definitely likely they were originally intended so be very similar appearance wise
My take on the roundtable hold is complete conjecture, but I think it is... A remembrance. The original hold is a wreck in lyndell, it's been destroyed, 'killed' - But it was important, and so its memory is "hewn into the Erdtree" like the others. It's not physically located inside, but the erdtree anchors that memory, so whatever metaphysical 'place' it exists within burns up along with the tree.
Godwyn was killed because Marika was attempting to find the Finger Slayer Blade (A weapon to slay a God. See also, the band of the inverted hawk) but could not. So, she endeavored to do what the Nox had done all those years ago and, by killing Godwyn but allowing his body to continue living, would have attempted to create a new Finger Slayer Blade from him. That she didn't expect what would happen would happen does not change the fact that this is the only series of events that makes even the remotest bit of sense given what we are told in game.
Interesting that Melinas closed eye turns out to be how I would describe a gloam eye looking. In general though I think I really enough that this question is never definitely answered. The speculation is more fun then having an answer.
I have seen Blade of Death have black flame after effect on me when hit by it so it likely WAS them. It likely was an oversight on their part(of which there are others particularly the "Flightless Bird" and "Prophecy" paintings as well as Oleg and Engvall ashes being in switched spots).
As for why Iji died, you loot his helmet off of his anvil implying he took it off(his model is modified hence why it still has it on) with the flavor text being that it guarded against tracking from the Two Fingers and their vassals implying a connection of some kind between the Black Knives and the Two Fingers. Ironically, a lot of Two Finger incantations(particularly those associated with Crespus a Roundtable Hold assassin) involve stealth and assassinations.
I don't think I can agree with the speculation on Manus celest as pretty much all the churches of Marika have their roofevs caved in and I think this tracks further into ruins in the real world. Rooves tend to be held up with wood which rots while walls are stone and last a while longer. Furthermore I think it's unlikely that a impact that could bury rannis two fingers 20? Meters underground would be more then capable of knocking down the walls of the church. It's still possible though that the church was built after the two fingers impacted the area.
How the fuck do you spell roofs
I think the statue of the girl with wolves is Melina, she’s the key to accessing farum, she wanted us to get the wolves summon
When it comes to igji, it was his own princess, she killed him off to cut all ties before becoming queen to the elden lord, Merikas curse also activates and drives blaidd insane, why he screams “NO I CANT BETREY HER” when you go back to the tower after achieving most of her quest