Why Winter Cities Need to Reconsider Car Dependence
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ย. 2024
- We’re used to hearing “bikes aren’t practical here, we have winter” all the time. In this video we flip this on its head and ask whether it’s actually cars that are a dangerous headache in winter.
References:
“Snow has a greater effect than rain does on crash occurrence: snow can increase the crash rate by 84% and the injury rate by 75%.” journals.sagep...
“Even with the changes in rainfall-related risk to approximately 1.5 today, values are similar to the estimated risk of being responsible for a traffic crash as a function of alcohol-impairment with blood alcohol level equal to 0.08 relative to sober condition”: www.sciencedir...
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I like that you talk about the importance of having options. That's what car zealots don't get: it's not hate for cars, it's the want of options, and actually considering what is practical.
@@tristanridley1601 you might, but most people don't. Almost all the cyclists I know also drive, and many of them are car enthusiasts, or low-key car enthusiasts as well.
It's like the channel says, that *cars do have their place.* The place for cars simply isn't *everywhere.*
@@AlexandarHullRichter another car enthusiast cyclist here to back up your point.
@@peterwallis4288 I'm an amateur car enthusiast and I absolutely hate car dependancy. I love cars and driving, but having it be the de-facto for literally every facet of life is just absurd. Being forced to drive 15-20 minutes to get to literally anywhere that I need/want to go to makes driving so much less enjoyable. Also, more people on the road makes driving more dangerous and tedious as well as causing an unaffordable level of road damage. The nearest restaurant to me is a 30 minute walk away, or a 10 minute bike ride on roads with no bike infrastructure and aggressive drivers.
I would love to live somewhere where everything was within a comfortable and safe 5-10 minute walk or 10-15 minute bike ride, and I could occasionally go driving for fun.
@@adinrichter6034 yes, I completely agree. It's stupid the amount of time we use our cars. Recently, I've had a period where I had to use a bike because I couldn't pay for petrol. My financial situation is better now, but I hope I never go back to relying on my car for every little trip. It's so silly. It's a waste of fuel and money, it's wearing out the car and it cuts out so much opportunity for excercise. Fortunately, where I live is getting better for cycling. It's currently much better than it was 5 years ago.
@@tristanridley1601 As a pedestrian mostly living in Korea, I also hate fast cyclists, a.k.a. "rolling assassins", who don't hesitate to fly by me with a few centimeters to spare.
Redundancy that's the key word. In any other line of tech and infrastructure, having redundancies to account for catastrophic failures or shutdowns is a golden standard. A cities transportation system needs to be treated the same way as well. Also f... shoveling snow.
Vancouver has had a couple of bad days this year and the road system basically collapsed from the snow. Thing is, the Skytrain was running just fine through it all.
Grade-separated rail is a secondary transportation network.
Redundancies are an mportant part of resiliency.
Saying that "people only cycle in the summer" is like saying that "people only walk in the summer".
I think sadly some people would say this
I do all of my skiing in the summer. No way anyone can enjoy themselves with all of that snow around. Give me a nice asphalt road to ski down.
american culture covers both 👍💔
Sadly that is true though. very few people walk outside in the winter unless they have a dog or a car/ bus to get to.
@@planepower8523 but why is that? Because no one walks or that there aren't actual pedestrian infrastructure?
This is the first Montreal winter I've spent without a car in a decade, and it's been incredibly relaxing. Turns out that winter driving and managing a car parked on the street during snow clearing operations were a huge source of stress that I didn't even realize was weighing on me until it no longer was. I am blessed to live in one of the last pockets of affordability in a major Canadian city, such that walking, biking and taking the metro covers 99% of my transportation needs.
White knuckle winter driving in my hometown of Winnipeg over Christmas break was enough to remind me how distasteful the whole thing is. Good riddance 😅
I realized how much anxiety I'm missing out on by not having a car here when my aunt was talking about the jolt of stress the tow truck alarm gives her every time it goes by and I realized I've completed tuned it out and never notice.
I loved waking up in the morning, drinking my coffee, and watching everyone else try to dig their cars out of the snow.
I've always lived car-free, and I've often wondered why people hated winter so much. Part of it personal taste (I don't like being cold, but I like being hot and sweaty way less, I enjoy going to the winter cabin, etc.), but I think being car-free for my whole life has been a big part of it. Switching from sneakers to boots is a relatively minor change, compared to having to dig your car out every winter. I've dug my mom's car out of the snow enough times to know that it's not fun.
Agreed. I live in a central neighbourhood and recently purchased a building with garages. My car is in one of those garages. It gets used once a week to reach the uncivilized regions called suburbia to visit family. Rest of the time? It sleeps OFF the public road (my personal car shouldn't be dependant on public land for storage).
One thing too is that if cities are planned better you wouldn’t even need to drive somewhere in the winter unnecessarily. There was a day in Ottawa where it was super white and snowy and I still just walked for lunch and was almost as fast as the vehicles.
That name, are you actually a real person, or a bot?
@@grantmccoy6739 Why not both? 😂
Canadians like to posture as tough to the cold and the elements, but the moment you suggest building bike infrastructure, suddenly the winter is an insurmountable force that we have no choice but to hide in fear from lol.
and then the Finnish guys turn out to be those which are able to tackle the winter ... even on bikes
The worst thing I have experienced in riding my bike during winter so far is drivers not giving enough space when snowbanks make the roads narrower.
Drivers routinely do this when no snowbanks are present as well, regardless the season.
Unfortunately you just need to take the space for yourself. You stop feeling uncomfortable about it eventually.
I don't own a car and I get around just fine in my neighborhood (villeray). I hear car owners complain about the hassle of snow removal, finding parking when the plows come, etc. Sometimes the process of removing snow in the morning makes people late. It's so much better to take the metro in winter.
Love your videos fellow montrealers. There isn't enough attention on how great montreal is for urban design. Thank you for shining a light
Not all of Montreal unfortunately. My area is very car dependent and we have a mayor who is stuck in the 1970s. Ville St-Laurent...
🤣 I think you angered this car owner ☝️
@@WillmobilePlus maybe if you got outside and got some exercise you would clear your head and be less angry. You have no arguments, just insults
What always drove (heh) me nuts was how if my coworkers ever showed up late due to snow driving, snow clearing, or even just regular summer traffic it was never considered their fault and everyone all the way up management would let them off or maybe complain some themselves as if it was totally unavoidable.
But if I showed up ON TIME instead of my usual 5-15 minutes early because I got a flat tire, I'd have to hear for hours to days from every person in the company how I need to switch to a more "reliable" form of transport, even though I was on time more often than any other worker in the whole company.
I no longer work there, but it still irks me how even supposed smart and data-focused people only care about incorrect perceptions and emotions and can't see past their nose
The thing about shoveling snow is that it's something you have to do for free for something that you're constantly paying for (the car) 😂
I'm glad you mentioned winter transit, and didn't _just_ focus on winter biking. Trains are incredibly resilient to cold weather.
And even a well packed shitbox for a bus can be surprisingly warm! (And most buses aren't shitboxes!)
That's why Russians love the trains and hate driving.
In Seattle I learned really quick that the last place you wanted to be if it snowed was on a Metro bus. They would lose traction and get stuck, and the articulated buses would jackknife. You'd get stranded every time.
We should start recognizing that our society's insistence that we maintain the same productivity as is possible in summer is the cause of so much of our stress related to winter. The whole of the wintry world around us is resting but we are not afforded that option. And in order to get it we need to take it from elsewhere.
I agree. It's not only a problem in difficult times, it's stressful when times are good.
I basically just hibernate in the winter compared to the summer. It's much healthier to know when there are low productivity times and high productivity times. I'm more social in the summer too but love just staying in and catching up on books when it's cold out there.
as someone who has no winter I will say it's not fair if u get an off season. I want an off season
@@maYTeus you can have summer off
@@maYTeus Tropical Singapore might be like: _& that's how I get more economically competitive_
In the winter storm in metro Portland, Oregon 2 weeks ago, I felt much safer on my 30 min. walk to the grocery store--even on often-icy sidewalks--than I did on my 45 min. drive home from work in the morning. I could've slipped and broken an arm while walking, but I could've been hurt much worse by the giant pickups doing 65mph on the highway like it was any other sunny day. Driving is inherently dangerous, no matter how good the weather; I try to remind people of that whenever it makes sense to. We're all much too used to it in North America.
That storm also showed how badly Portland needs new MAX lines that are underground and extend across the entire metropolitan area so that we don't have to drive for any reason
@@frafraplanner9277 A major problem is lack of redevelopment around stations outside of Portland. WAY too many here on the west side are surrounded by basically nothing (central Beaverton's two stations have multiple parking garages, surface level lots, car dealers, or are literally empty).
I generally prefer riding in February than July... You can always put more clothes on when its cold out, but when it's hot and humid you can only take off so much before the neighbours start to talk
Totally agree!!! I'm less fond of the extremely cold or snowy days, but 95% of the winter is awesome and I prefer it to summer riding. It the winter, I can ride in my wool sport coat being all fancy and not get overheated 🙃
Agreed. I prefer winter riding because the multi-use recreational path I use to commute is overrun with families and strollers and dogs and other cyclists during the summer. Come colder months, I have entire rides where I do not come across another soul for 90 minutes; it's bliss.
Take it from someone that face 40C on the summers... not even getting naked will help You with this. In the cold one can always put another layer of clothes. Above 27C... nothing really helps.
Except biking. Going slow, on a 40C day, is WAY better than walking - I'm making my own breeze!
And bike, usually, are point to point! I don't have to walk 5 minutes from the parking lot to the building. On the summer this is enough to get me dripping from sweat.
Could it be another reason why so many people bike in colder places like northern Europe?
In the 1 year that I owned a car in Montreal, I accumulated 1085$ of tickets. Not because of speeding, or because of the many accidents I had (old Sunfire, the breaks did not work in the snow, rear-ended a few cars), but because when I went to school early, pulled all-nighters to finish labs, I came back many times to my car having disappeared, towed away for snow removal. Every time it cost 152$ to get it back.
As soon as I did not needed a car anymore, I sold it. It's a nightmare in Montreal, and in the winter in general. I slid off-road 2 times because the road was icy (a slight turn becomes an increasing wobble until I did a 360 and found myself in the ditch).
Oh, and one accident was during a storm, my windows completely fogged up, no visibility, ran into the driver's door of someone turning. I was never hurt, nor did I hurt anyone in any accidents, but that's more a miracle than anything.
One was after a looooong day at work (I was a painting contractor, needed the car for business), I was so tired, and fell asleep at a red light. I was rear-ended, for once it was not 100% my fault.
Once there was no accidents, but barely. I was trying to find my exit, looking at google maps on my phone, and realized that I was driving past it, so I swerved, too hard, and the car did a 360 in the middle of the highway. Thankfully, I was able to just continue down the exit, no damages, but it was a very close one.
Ok, since I'm saying all this, here's more.
I said my brakes did not work when there's snow... I was pinned between a ramp wall and a big truck that did not saw me (the horn did not worked), and I could not brake in time, but thankfully I was just barely able to squeeze away.
Once I was in the snow, on the Pont Champlain, and the car in front of me braked suddenly, I swerved in the middle lane, thankfully no one was coming in this direction at the time.
In contrast, I biked often in the winter, and the only times I hurt myself was when the road was right after verglas and I slid on ice.
Anyway.
If all that did not convinced you that cars in cities are a stupid idea, consider that young guys with their first car are also on the road in those conditions.
So much this. I am currently a student and many of the local coffee shops are in areas with time restricted parking, yet too far and uncomfortable to walk or bike. If I want to study there, its laughably short 2 hour increments or risk getting towed.
Riding a bike in the winter is 90% of the time the same experience as riding in the summer, just with extra clothing
Absolutely! If you gear up for winter, you can use your bike all year and leave the car at home for more trips.
Is that assuming cleared bike paths?
@@leandrog2785 not even. Just clear streets
@@leandrog2785 if the bike paths were clear all the time it would be 100% like riding in the summer
Except for those days when a heavy gust of wind turns you coat into a kite... that's always so fun... lol. Do you ever use safety glasses or a face mask? I started using safety glasses cause my eyes would dry out or snowfall getting in my face.
Great video! I'm so sick of hearing the bikes dont make sense in winter argument it's absolutely doable city's just need to have a moticum of forethought and planning as Montreal has demonstrated!
Thank you!
You too angered a car owner 🤣 buttercup cant suck it up
@@theepimountainbiker6551 😂 100%
@@aarons3008 yeah, making people upset is really funny.
@@WillmobilePlus True. Typically we know what's best for our specific situation.
Car dependency is so internalized that people can't imagine any other reality.
Also the value placed on personal comfort is extremely high. People are willing to shovel snow for 20 minutes and risk their lives on a snowy highway because it's warm and comfortable inside the car.
@@WillmobilePlus I don't hate people that drive. I drive too.
What I hate is that our cities are built exclusively for cars. Every other mode is given a lower priority. Making them slower and less convenient. This is why most people decide to drive. Many people wish they didn't have to drive but are forced to.
Also driving is extremely dangerous. Especially in the winter. And all the parking and wide roads make cities soulless and boring.
I MUCH prefer the personal comfort a few hundred dollars a month in my pocket and good health biking everywhere brings. Car owners dont know what theyre missing out on
I think we evolved towards personal comfort on all aspects of life, not just when it comes to cars. It's just a human trait. Some value that more (and on different things) than others but it's always there.
E bike with winter tires 😂 I was riding up the hill in Toronto passing cars stuck and people pushing each other and raging. It was the best day of my life.
I moved into a house that's right across the street from a Communauto car-share station. I've sworn that once our current car gives up the ghost, we'll go car-free and just use the car-share when we need a car.
It'll be a relief not paying for insurance, gas and maintenance. And no more shoveling the driveway either.
I live in Pointe Claire, a city that actively blocks bike paths for winter. yet, because streets are cleared efficiently, the amount of time that roads can't be ridden on a bike is likely measuired in hours per year, at least for the destinations I goto (supermarket, pool, post office, patisserie). But it does require skill to ride when street is not clear because potholes or large crachs can be hidden under snow. And some stretches, you lose lateral control so need to ride carefully. But because roads aren,t cleared to full width, it also requires longer trip times because at stop signs or street lights, you need to get on side and let traffic behind you pass and then get back on road and ride. (which is quite different from your video that shows bare bike paths).
Live in Edmonton, the city may brag it is a winter city. But not very well run one.
I've seen people argue that since we are a car centric city. It is useless to build bike lanes or make a walkable city.
That we need more parking in Downtown and better snowplowing efficiency
Shortening the distances between destinations is just obvious when inhabiting a cold environment.
The more low density suburbs that are built, the bigger a city becomes and the farther destinations will be.
or really when inhabiting any environment. The key word here isn't "cold", it's "inhabiting". As in: it's a place for people, not for cars.
@@alex2143 Agreed
would be difficult in rural areas. Just went onto a North Cape road trip in February last year. That municipality up there has a population density of 9 inhabitants / square mile. However 2500 of the 3000 inhabitants all live in the same 0.41 sq mi large village which is the administrative center; THe next such village is rather far down the road, like all the "larger" places up there
@@EnjoyFirefighting that's exactly how you do it. Make it so you can go to the store or visit your neighbors on foot or bike, and kids have a safe neighborhood to play in. Then all you really need is a bike path alongside the road to the next village and you've succesfully made the town bikeable.
Also worth mentioning how much road salt degrades expensive car infrastructure, too, just further reinforcing how cost-inefficient car-centric development is.
All the biking capitols of the world have winters. Not sure why this is rarely mentioned.
used to ride my bike in montreal winter all the time until (get this) I got hit by a car that just sped off
When I get stuck in snow on my bike, I get off and push my way out of trouble. When I get stuck in the snow in my car, I lock the doors and pray the polar bears aren't too hungry that day.
We just had our “once in a lifetime” (now once a year lol) winter storm here in north Texas a few weeks ago, and wow it just emphasizes how people really can’t drive here in just about any weather. I can’t believe so many people were forced to go to work, we’re not built for this and neither are our roads. I almost crashed into another car on the ice and there was nothing I could do about to. Really goes to show how any other option would’ve been way better.
Great video as always. I do wish you had spent more time on talking about the biggest benefit to riding a bike over a car in the winter, which is that you can pick it up and walk when it's stuck instead of having to get help to push it or call for a tow.
I've stopped a few times during winter commutes to park my bike and help push cars stuck in the show.
i'm from outside montreal and i sold my car when i moved to the city. Best decision ever
I appreciate the note of realism on how car infrastructure is valuable, and that its often over-demonized by urbanists online. We all spend a bit too much time in our internet echo chambers, so if us urbanism-minded folk can relate to and sympathize with our neighbors a bit more we can better get our message across and show them that we all have the same goal in mind: building safer, more enjoyable, and more effective neighborhoods. Some degree of mutual understanding is necessary in order to actually get anything done.
Nice comment.
Echo chambers absolutely. That idiot NJB's bans everyone who show just a little dissent with his opinions. If there's anyone who can be called "bike cultist" with a great degree of accuracy it's him.
Yeah, but we are running out of time. Cars represent around 60% of greenhouse gases of the ways of transport (not including manufactoring) plus air pollution that are killing people.
I truly believe that there are good reasons to demonize car infrastructure.
You cannot "over-demonize" a mode of transportation that is the single-minded focus of North American city design + municipal management. Motorists are not victims, they are the overwhelming majority and receive EVERY possible accommodation imaginable. For or all intents and purposes, they are the perpetrators of countless societal ills yet they receive every perk and accommodation imaginable from municipal governments while shouldering absolutely none of the responsibility. Ottawa, for instance, has +12,000km of active roadways meanwhile only has ~900km "cycling infrastructure", a vast majority of which being multi-use pathways (not even dedicated cycling infrastructure).
The pervasiveness of personal car infrastructure/use SHOULD BE DEMONIZED because personal vehicles and the infrastructure required to accommodate them are objectively bad in EVERY quantifiable metric. They cause severe environmental degradation (unquantifiable cost on the healthcare system + quantifiable costs on the local environment), they are a massive source of noise pollution (which has its own widespread health effects), they are a drain on personal finances (US drivers spent roughly $10,000 a year on vehicle ownership + maintenance in 2021), the infrastructure to support them is the largest financial line item on municipal budgets (see Ottawa's 12k km's of roads to maintain), and just to top it all off they consistently kill people on a regular basis.
I agree that there has to be mutual understanding to accomplish positive urbanist goals. Yet that understanding has to come EXCLUSIVELY from motorists and no one else. Motorists are the group that causes, and has the potential to cause, the most direct/indirect harm and as a result, it is their responsibility to shoulder this "mutual understanding". It is not the responsibility of cyclists or of pedestrians to coddle motorists because of their infantile desire for individualism & "convenience" (quotes as I would argue car ownership in not convenient). It is not up to the vulnerable road/transportation users to accommodate or "come to a mutual understanding' with the people/mode of transportation that are literally maiming and killing them.
All of this comes from a car owner and a huge enthusiast. But as a piece of the transportation network pie, it MUST come dead last.
@@tanneryoung619 Dude, nothing you're saying is news to, or would be refuted by, anyone in this comment section (aside from several hyperboles and your excessively idealistic slant).
That said, good luck encouraging positive policy change if your strategy is simply to demonize the car-loving majority.
A huge population of North Americans will always hate urbanists and pro-urban initiatives as long as there are enough people online being as haughty, opinionated, and alienating as you are right now.
@Goapy Beleive your little fantasy if you want. The US EPA says that total ghg emissions for transportation is 28%. Industrial and electric emissions are 22% and 25%. Do you demonize them equitably? Or do you think your hatred of carbrains is holy? There are those who hate bicycles the same way.
It's 6 March and I am getting out on my bicycle today -- in Ottawa, with snow in the forecast. If I can do that at the age of 66, there are lots of other slugs like me in Ottawa who could.
@@WillmobilePlus, "slugs like me" don't have better things to do, we're retired. I still arrive at my destinations warm, dry, and sometimes faster than those who drive, and a lot faster than "No See Transpo."
@@WillmobilePlus In Montreal we absolutely encounter trips where cycling (or taking the metro) is as fast as or faster than driving, especially when you take into account the challenge of finding a parking spot at each end. It's not every trip by any means, but it's pretty common. That's because the city wasn't designed solely around the speed and convenience of cars. (Of course, it does vary by neighbourhood. Newer areas are more car-centric.)
@@WillmobilePlus Because a common argument again cycling is that it's only viable when you're young as that's when you're the fittest. It has got some basis in reality but fitness also depends on whether you're active in general and cycling is an activity where driving a car all the time will make you feel like you can barely lift your arm when you get old (exaggerating with the latter, of course, but still not to be dismissed).
@@WillmobilePlus, I have better coffee at home. No, I am talking about 10km away where my favourite pubs are. (If a destination is a block away, I walk.) Also, if you're not retired, then you're not "a slug like me," you're probably a working stiff, which might explain your antipathy to cycling, but I think you have your priorities bass-ackward. You should cycle to work and be accommodated for your effort. I was at NDHQ and at the House of Commons. For me, my vehicle is my third choice when it comes to transport.
@@WillmobilePlus, I gather you do not know Ottawa.
This is pretty timely for me. Just a couple of weeks ago Portland was inundated with a record snowfall, far exceeding our forecast of one or two inches (5 to 10 centimeters for our sane friends across the border). The entire city was effectively shut down unexpectedly, with many people getting stuck for hours in slowly crawling traffic. Meanwhile, I used our light rail system to make my commute into downtown that morning, and was able to get back home in the afternoon with relatively little inconvenience--just some woes about being underdressed and having to trudge through shin-high snow from the station to my house. The whole event really highlighted how fragile automobile networks are when faced with just a bit of inclement weather.
The most annoying thing is when it snows the municipality will devote massive resources to plowing the streets asap. Piling the snow up in bike lanes and sidewalks. Making everything other than driving infinitely less plausible. Even still the cars still struggle in the snow and the total number of cars is much lower. So we spend massive resources and inhibit walking all for the sake of a few cars that still barely make better time than simply walking.
In virtually every municipality, there are more drivers than non-drivers. Even the most transit- friendly ones.
I can always tell the people in my area that have actually tried using their bike in the winter from those that haven't; those that haven't always say something like "it's too cold for me" while those that have know your real problem is being too warm and wearing to many layers :-)
And that's in addition to the other point you made, which is that most of the weather in winter isn't the extreme weather. In fact, sometimes it can be quite mild!
There's a reason you see a lot more well-preserved classic cars from decades ago in places like Arizona, and it's not just because of all the old people there -- warm/dry climate + no road salt to combat snow and ice = cars don't rust away after 15-20 years.
I live in Portland Oregon (US), and it's typical to get only 4ish days of ice and/or snow. This year, we actually had 2 multi-day snow and ice storms, and I really wanted to ride during the first one (online challenge that happened to coincide with the Christmas Eve Eve storm), so I bought a set of studded winter tires (Schwalbes), and I actually really liked it, during both storms, and there were a bunch of things I noticed.
The first is that I wasn't the only one riding. In fact, the snow took impressions of a lot of tires really well. There weren't nearly as many people riding as on sunny days or in the rain, but there were still a bunch of people that had ridden over most of the streets I used before I got there. I could even tell what tires there were using, and in some cases, what type of bike and what direction they had been riding, based on the model of their tire and the tread pattern. As a bike nerd, that was exciting to me.
The second thing I noticed was how quiet it was. This was both because the vast majority of Portlanders don't drive in the snow, and will stay home from work and school instead. It was also because snow absorbs sound. I found it to be rather peaceful to be riding around in the really quiet environment with not as many people out.
The last (and most important thing) is that I felt infinitely safer on the bike than I would have in my car. If (/when, because I'm not perfect and it happened a few times) I mess up on my bike, I'm falling on my butt, with many layers of padding because of being dressed up for the cold. If I had taken my car out instead and messed up, it would cost thousands of dollars in damage, and I might not get where I was going at all, and I could have killed someone, or I could have died. My car is one of my hobbies too and I really like it, and the idea of risking damage or destruction of my car doesn't sit well with me either. I feel it's way safer to take neighborhood streets on a bike if there's any question of being able to handle a car safely.
I rode BIKETOWN during the first storm (because MAX wasn't running) and I experienced all the things you said here too
I LOVE the muffled sounds and that distinctive crunch sound of the bike tires on snow and ice ❤️
*Laughs maniacally in Alaskan*
Okay but seriously, snow clearing is a serious problem for urbanism here. The car heavy infrastructure cripples the budget to the point where roads are never cleared in a timely manner, meaning that icy and snowy roads are just a fact of life here, even in the middle of the city. As a result, sidewalks are often used as snow storage in the winter, and bike lanes are forgotten altogether, further encouraging car travel, especially in larger, more powerful vehicles.
Look, if you are cold on your bicycle JUST SPEED UP A BIT :D
That increases the windchill and my face freezes. ;)
Great video as always. Even here in Vancouver I hear this argument. There is hope though. Public opinion is slowly changing!
I'm in Victoria, and similar murmurs haunt us. No one here has any right to gripe about winter, yet they do.
Yup, can't possibly bike in the 6 month long constant downpour of Vancouver winters 🙄
“But it’s windy” Best feedback I got from my neighbour here in Edmonton after biking home in the winter.
In my experience of both biking and driving, bikes are worse on an individual level because you are on two wheels instead of three or four. Makes it really easy to have one end of the bike slide out from under you like happened to me last Christmas. That being said, yeah, it is nerve racking to not know where the edge of the road is and whether you'll be able to stop in a car. I drive slower in the icy, snowy weather, but that makes it nerve racking when everyone else tries to drive faster and gets pist when I'm not going fast enough for them.
We hear the same statements in Seattle. We have shit weather where if you choose to walk / bike to work, you might as well take a second shower when you get there since you’ll be soaked with rain. If we had more rail coverage, I think we’d be able to cut down on the heavy car reliance here.
Great call out on this argument. What's your take on people using disabled people as a shield for car centric infrastructure? They always say "but not everyone can walk or bike!!". But to me, a) it's rarely coming from someone with disabilities themselves and b) it's not like disabled people didn't exist before the age of cars or in more walkable urban spaces today
Cars are the reason disabled people can’t get around. If cars were removed from our streets, there would be no risk of people in wheelchairs getting hit by a car, and they could easily get around on electric wheelchairs throughout the city. They can’t do so now because cars take up all the space on our roads. That’s my argument.
Ive been biking in Montreal winters for 7+ years now and every year it gets easier and more common. The amount of bikers I've seen this year compared to when I started is crazy! All you really need are good face/hand protection and some decent winter tires. For anyone thinking about giving it a try, I highly recommend it!
I totally agree, this winter I’ve seen a huge increase on the roads, now, if everyone would just do three things,,,,
Buy a headlight
Buy a taillight
Buy a f@#$Ing bell!
Cheers from Ontario!
Cycling in the suburbs of Toronto this year was so nice. I cycled more than once most weeks in December, January, and February. If there was a snow storm, I just waited 1-2 days for pathways to get cleared. Snow is better than rain, and cold is better than a hot summer day, so cycling in the winter is great when paths are clear!
Been biking year round in Edmonton for 2 years now! Very doable, but dedicated infrastructure is the game changer! Bike, clothing, lights, maintenance take a bit of time to trial & error, but after that it's awesome. Only time biking sucks or is almost impossible is also when the cars are struggling in deep "snirt", the brown, soft snow that's like sand. But cars can't handle that either. So let's invest in separated bike lanes & paths, and fast/quality clearing. Simple as that!
This year I biked through winter for the first time. Tbh, the hardest thing to get used to is the high winds. But I started using my snowboarding goggles and now I feel toasty 🤩
In France, the bliss of going on a weekend to La Rochelle (a really cool city on the Atlantic coastline) in less than 3 hours by train cannot be beaten. It basically takes double the time by car. the TGV makes France (which is just a bit bigger than Texas apparently) feel like a small country sometimes.
I've found most skeptics have never used anything *but* a car to get around. At least where I am, it's that complete lack of knowledge, and a lot of fear mongering about crime.
I was just in Montreal a few days ago, and I enjoyed walking around it, even when it was snowing. Driving in Montreal would have sucked, but Montreal has an amazing public transit system, so I didn’t have to drive at all.
Canadian cities shouldn’t use winter as an excuse for car infrastructure, if anything it should be an excuse for making compact walkable cities.
Had to cycle to work on the past Saturday with the 15cm dump.
Lots of lights wearing reflective and took my time, added a extra 25 min to my commute and had to get off the bike and push though unplowed roads to get to any major pathway that was plowed but did it and don't really regret it .
On the topic of Ottawa and it's bike network near the trains I find it a great resource but it does not get the love in the winter it needs most of the time and will some times not be a viable alternate when the LRT goes down, but then again it is Ottawa and the people in power want nothing more than to have everyone in a car
I cycled in Ottawa to work for 30 years from April to November, where occasionally the temperature went to minus 20 C. I stopped in winter not because it was cold but because the sun would set at 4: 30 and I would have to cycle in the dark. Cycling in cold weather is much preferred over waiting at a bus stop for a late crowded bus .
And not even bike lights would help?
Your Yellowknife call out is hilarious - I have a classmate who is down here in Edmonton for a couple years from Yellowknife. She uses her bicycle to commute all winter back home in Yellowknife. She claims it's easier there actually, because snow pack on the side roads stay consistent all winter there, and don't turn into rutted ice like they do here in balmy Edmonton.
Damn. I wonder what it’s like driving in Yellowknife.
My wife and I have spent all winter ebike commuting in far northern Vermont. With bar mitts, studded tires, and a balaclava it's quite pleasant -- far better than digging out a car or waiting for it to warm up. The worst thing about it is being judged harshly or dismissed as a lunatic.
Waiting for a car to warm up takes forever. I have saved so much time on the bike just from that! And plus I feel so much more comfortable temperature wise on my bike in winter than in the car.
I really like your sympathetic manner of communication, it sets you apart from more antagonistic urban channels like NJB. I encourage you to keep it up! Some feedback: Your setup seems to be capturing substantial vocal sibilance & plosives, and in a couple places the non-voice audio gets loud enough to cloud the narration (for example at 4:23). But these are surmountable with experience!
I know this is an urbanism channel but I just gotta talk about it somewhere. Man, do the suburbs suck... every time it snows I have to go and do precipitation maintenance??? I can't stand shoveling the snow lol... where I live, just outside of Toronto, we all have nice big driveways that we all have to maintain... seems so stupid when you consider winter. There has to be a better way.
@@WillmobilePlus who said I hate cars? I didn't
I did say that unironically. I currently do not own my home, I live where I can, but I have to take care of the snow. Front yards and driveways are a waste of space. You're telling me we couldn't all have either alleyways and garages out back or have our homes built closer to the road, and have underground parking garages for everyone? Expensive yes but would be preferable in my eyes... would much rather just shovel sidewalk
A snowblower is a great idea... still gotta go out there and maintain your patch of asphalt
In Toronto we had a snowfall on Friday of about 25cm, it was pretty heavy stuff. It’s now Tuesday, and even by the weekends, most roads were clear and in fact dry. Today, while getting a coffee on a street where the roads have bike lanes (de marked by a painted line), and I saw a completely dry road, with the entirety of the snow pushed onto the bike lanes. At this point, you think that could be cleaned.
Most people always point to heavy snowfalls as a deterrent to cycle infrastructure in cities with colder climate. This is only a few times in the year at this point, and as you both pointed out… not even cars, buses, even some trucks can do the snow. Car lovers’ argument, such a moot point
What I mean to say - part of the reason why we have notions of bikes being redundant in snowy cities is the maintenance performance prioritizing certain modes of transportation in the first place.. in most places, it’s even cars before pedestrians
@@tristanridley1601 but the roads are fine, who cares!
@@tristanridley1601 sounds like you’re a prime candidate for a job at city hall with that attitude shahsh
After getting studded tires for my bike (which are illegal for cars because with that much weight they'd tear up the roads too much), I once got stuck in my car after freezing rain iced everything up, got out my bike and kept going with no issues (other than having to go back to get the car later).
Also if there is just a super short section that's impassable (say a section that didn't get plowed, got a big roof-slide, or some other winter blockage perhaps from other stuck vehicles), you have to wait for a higher power or work yourself for hours to get through a few feet with a car, whereas it is trivial to trudge through it with a bike and keep going once past the issue. This has happened to me in both forms of transport many times with extremely different results.
"The wrath of an ancient evil : the tow truck siren gods"
Omg you guys made my day hahhaha these are such a plague!
I just finished grad school and started a job full-time here in Montreal in January. I got myself an electric scooter, and I've been riding that to and from work most days, even through January and February here. The reason I've been able to do that is because I have a route to work that is ENTIRELY on separated bike lanes, door to door, and those bike lanes are maintained pretty well by the city in the winter. Even on blustery, -14 degree days I've seen a bunch of fellow cycle commuters in the bike lanes heading to and from work.
Turns out, so long as you have the right infrastructure, winter cycling is completely viable. Even the cold is solved by simply knowing how to layer, something anyone who lives in such a climate already knows how to do. The only difference I had to really make was adding a balaclava and ski goggles for the coldest days, and that makes it just downright enjoyable in even quite cold weather.
one of the entrances to the gas station i work at is a 12 foot hill thats about a 45 degree angle and its funny to see cars slide down it. especially overconfident truck drivers.
so much for needing to drive in the winter
I used to deliver the morning paper in my hilly neighborhood by bike year round, and there was only a few times where there was too much snow overnight and I had to walk it instead. By the next day, plows would have cleared the main road, and cars compacting snow on the smaller roads would make it so I could bike again.
My best winter biking memory is going out in the middle of a snow storm. As I placed my bike in the middle of the road my neighbours were trying to shovel put their car which was stuck in their own driveway. They wished me good luck, expecting I wouldn't make it far. However I rode away with ease as I had studded tires on my bike.
I generally agree that all infrastructure for micro-mobility needs to be expanded and maintained.
But I strongly feel that neither of these are real solutions for winters in major northern cities. The answer is subways. Get me out of the snow/cold as much as possible.
honestly yeah ,
but also you can't deny that skiis and sleds were litterally built for it ...
Skiing honestly doesn't sound like the worst idea for getting around. It's pretty much like cycling, only problem being that you have to cross salted roads on foot.
Sadly the winters aren't harsh enough where I live to make that a viable option, but weather in Canada should be good enough.
It's very bad if you have knee problems, also if you are not used to skiing, it's very easy to break some bone. Ski holiday accidents are the most likely cause for a broken hip in under 30 year olds - in Germany, which does not have a lot of winter!
@@steemlenn8797 Skiing for transportation (cross country skiing) is probably safer than a ski holiday (mostly downhill skiing). I believe the higher speeds of downhill skiing result in more frequent and more serious injuries than cross country skiing.
@@stuartwithers8755 good point. But on the other side you don't have guys trying to manouver their 2 ton city tank around you.
Most of those winter car annoyances, changing to winter tires, shovelling, scraping your window, having to drive more slowly due to the conditions, just don't exist for most people. Look at that footage again. Most cars are still running the rims and summer tires they were sold with and the drivers scrape only a tiny patch on the windshield while they speed along, if anything going faster than normal due to the lower amount of traffic. Accidents doubling doesn't take into account all the drivers that stayed home. Accidents per km driven have to be at least 5 to 10 times as bad during winter storms.
At least in Quebec, winter tires are mandated by law
Yesterday, I rode my bike to school and planned to ride to work on it after. It started snowing in the middle of the day and we got around 15 cm by the time I had to ride to work. The snow was too deep and I couldn't ride my bike through it, so I just put my bike on the bike rack on the bus and took that to work. This only happens a few times a year though, and I'm able to ride my bike all year long. There really isn't an excuse against bike lanes, and coupled with multi-modal transportation makes it perfect for me - even in the car-centric Toronto suburb I live in.
I definetly don't agree with many aspects you mentioned. I'm from southern Germany and our winters are typically very mild by now, so I'm definetly not a well experienced driver concerning winter conditions. But still I went onto a winter roadtrip to the North Cape at the very top of Europe in February last year. It was rather easy to drive even in the worst of conditions with snow drifts, heavy snowfalls, low temperatures and ice covering the entire road.
What I think might be different: they don't spread salt to clear the ice and snow on the road, all they do is to plow the snow. At some point you'll get a solid layer of ice, no problem for good winter tires or even studded winter tires. They might make some scratches into the ice that the studded tires have more grip. But I basically was able to get close to or actually drive the posted speed limit (the speed you drive in perfect nice summer conditions) in the winter as well. Just to get this straight: the North Cape in Norway is as far north as Barrow and the very northern tip of Alaska, which is further up north than Tuktoyaktuk in Canada
th-cam.com/video/-ppLY-mGniI/w-d-xo.html
I bike commuted all winter in VT this year and found it way easier than I was expecting! Thanks for making this!
Thank you for talking about this. I recently moved to a cold northern state and am now experiencing living with snow for the first time in my life. Car-dependency on the winter FUCKING SUCKS! I literally had to shovel my driveway just to be able to LEAVE my house! That's when the absurdity of the situation really kicked in. And of course, driving in icy, snow filled roads is terrifying!
U ve gotta buy one of them engine powered snowploughs, my parents are quite old and they live in the suburbs in a cottage so they have to clean their own driveway too, my father had a real hard time doing that on his own, often he called me for a hand. But a couple years ago he got himself a motorised snowplough and now he even enjoys cleaning the snow after heavy snowfalls because its so easy and fun to do
They can use Quattro velo. It is a four wheel velomobil (bike) and very usefully in winter even when there is snow.
Even here in Victoria where winter is fairly mild for the most part, hardly a day goes by that letter writers to the local newspaper (usually from disgruntled drivers in the nearby suburbs) don't bitterly complain about the growing number of bike lanes. Seems there's a perpetually angry constituency of automobile fans here that simply hate anything to do with bikes and those who ride them.
I’m at small city Alberta Canada. Good luck convincing people here to not drive
No! In Montreal, there was a grand total of, drum roll, 1 bike bath was plowed all season. The rest were either ski trails, off season car parking, a place to dump snow. Or just unmaintained paths. Bicycle riders are an afterthought in Montreal not because it's winter but it's considered city wate to tend to bike paths in the winter so we don't bike, we don't bike thus the city is justified in doing nothing.
Where are you? The protected bike lanes in the Plateau (St-Denis, Rachel, etc.) are plowed pretty well. It's the painted bike lanes that are really an issue.
@@OhTheUrbanity I have yet to have a reason to go to the Plateau, Living around Atwater Metro there are some stretches of the Lachine Canal that would be handy to use for where I need to go. But I gotta wait till around April to use it because it's completely ignored and unusable till the ice melts.
@@dragonskunkstudio7582 Unfortunately the Lachine Canal is run by the feds (Parks Canada) and not the city, which explains the lack of snow clearing (montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/lachine-canal-path-wont-be-cleared-for-cyclists-this-winter). We encountered the same problem with some (but not all) of the multi-use pathways when we lived in Ottawa.
@@OhTheUrbanity Maisonneuve goes through different municipalities is that why it's not maintained either? But either way cyclist get roadblocks in winter that's a fact that cannot be denied. It doesn't matter how inconvenient cars are do not blame cyclist for not having a fair safe chance to use the roads in winter.
@@dragonskunkstudio7582 yes. Westmount and Montréal-Ouest aren't part of the city of Montréal proper and they don't clear the path.
This video is also great for desert cities as both cars and bikes have arguments against the harsh summer heat.
The options bikes have are greatly expanded. Yes cars have air conditioning, but driving in the extreme heat increases carbon emissions which makes the heat worse for everyone. The road infrastructure is wider and increases heat island effects and also degrade very quick in the heat. Storage is naturally very large as well, and the only time you can get any form of shade for your vehicle is a parking garage or the lot with such an abysmal amount of trees it’s insane we think that’s even acceptable, especially considering we have native desert trees literally evolved by nature to use less water yet still provide tons of shade.
Bikes on the other hand can be stored in easy to make shade shacks or under desert trees, paths and bike lanes are also very good at supporting trees along roads, and greatly decrease the urban heat and provide shade for them, and the cars and pedestrians they may be sharing the street with.
All in all, biking in the heat, even with how extreme it may seem. Is something that happens here with some people, especially those closer to the urban cores where I live. And this added option not only gives people more accessibility to where they live. It also helps the city have easier maintenance with less wide roads that degrade quickly after a month of triple digit weather, and a better overall climate for residents, regardless of their choice of transportation under the sun.
In the UK context, we rarely (in the south of the country, at least) have heavy snowfall. Things often grind to a halt with very little snow, but heightened preparedness above and beyond existing use of gritters would be uneconomical.
Much more hazardous to cycling in winter weather here is black ice. We often have temperatures fluctuating above and below freezing in winter, and relatively few people have winter tyres for bikes (or any of their vehicles), so I rarely enjoy cycling in freezing conditions as I'm constantly aware of the high risk of falling.
For such a northern nation, I would expect Canada to have somewhat of a handle on snow plowing for blizzards but yeah I guess not
I had one winter in the city with a car and the hassle of moving it twice a week or when there was snow removal operations ( even when I only used it like once a week ) was a pain in the ass.
I would bike in the winter but I don't want to get killed by a soccer mom in a rwd grand caravan
Need better infrastructure!
@@IHateStroads it's things like this that make me wish I didn't live on the east coast 🙃
Fortunately, I live in a northern city that clears bike paths quite well. Madison, WI. Cold can be managed, but it does take good gear and planning.
I live in a Northern city (on par with Montreal and Ottawa) and I bike during the winter. On blizzard or snow days, it takes me less time to get home from work by bike than it does by car. The problem with biking in winter is dealing with motorists who do not change their driving behavior on narrower lanes or icy or snowy roads. As usual, it comes back the same problem: bad drivers.
Wow! This video really make me crave owning and driving a car. Cause for every nasty weather your car faces the nasty weather is not in your face. Sure it cost more but the little luxuries in life sometimes are nice. I'd be fun to ride a quadricycle to help with stability on icy roads with electric assist but no it's illegal! Yay. Not even sure we can bring our bikes on the light rail as the site says zero about, the afterthought, what is that again oh yeah bikes.
You can always get a full-face helmet with goggles! 😀
@@AlexandarHullRichter Or cover your face with a scarf like the kids do in cartoons.
Most logical pro-car point in this comment section.
When I first moved to Montreal 12 years ago, they didn’t even clear the bike lanes in winter. It’s great to see how far this city has come in the last decade.
Canadian Cyclists: "We can't bike here, it's too cold and snowy for biking!"
Finnish Commuters: "Pyörillämme kestämme talvella kylmyyden erinomaisesti, mikset sinä?"
How long is the average commute in finland? 5-8km?
European cities are really small and everything is close to you making cycling a real good way to get around.
But what would you do if your commute in Finland was 20-30kms just one way?
Would you still ride a bike in winter for 1,5 hours in cold and snow just to get to work? And then its a 1,5 hour ride back to home.
Or would you rather make it a 30-40 minutes ride in a warm and cozy car?
I've really come to love my e-bike in the winter, actually. The weight of the bike, which is annoying in summer, lets you cut through smaller piles of snow and the throttle makes it much easier to get moving from a stop when it's slippery. It's harder to carry it over larger snowbanks, but not impossible.
The funny thing is that (at least in Germany but I guess everywhere) driving a car in such conditions would technically illegal. I mean, you are only allowed to drive if your car is safe and you drive a speed according to conditions. If the conditions are that bad, the only safe speed is 0.
i love biking in the winter. its safer because cars slow down and give space. the drifting is fun, slipping isn't a problem(but avoid black ice as if you were walking or driving), and biking on compacted snow is awesome too.
auto industry has everyone else believing it's an impossible feat for daredevils
I cycle all year and ride in every type of weather, and admittedly we don't get Canadian levels of snow here in England, but when we do get a significant snowfall, the advantage of riding a bike - as opposed to driving a car - is that when you do encounter snow which is too deep to ride through, you can usually just lift your bike over it and carry-on riding again as soon as you are past the worst part.
I used to bike in Ottawa year around.
Now moves to Southern Ontario and it's a lot worse.
Wind is horrible, and the warmer weather means constant puddles and slush which freezer over night and turns into black ice.
Also morning commute might be fine but a warm afternoon one is very uncomfortable, the sun is blasting so it's hot but you can't layer down cause wind is very cold.
Did I mention that stronger winds cause snow drifts that can't be cleared cause they build up very quickly.
I really don't see how winter cycling is viable in places like Guelph, Kitchener or London. Toronto might be better in that sense, buildings block some of the wind, but I imagine frequent thawing causes the similar issues.
Btw, I used cycle in Ottawa all year round and it much much better, because of the climate.
Temps are more even day to day, once a snow is plowed there is at least a week of good cycling, cold helps keep roads dry; the snow doesn't melt much and there are no snow drift.
The afternoon sun is also a problem, but less so.
South Ontario (up till Kingston)is not viable, too windy, Ottawa is the sweet spot, not too cold not too windy.
Montreal and QC are colder, steep hills a sketchy but still viable.
Meanwhile in Moscow I don't feel much difference between winter and summer. I use PT: subway/tram/bus. Although during winter I don't use scooter as much as during summer.
I LOVE this! It's so true. Since 2018, I've been frostbiking and since 2020, my fiancée has taken it up, too!
It's crazy how few days are "actually too hardcore snowy" to bike. We're barely driven except for intercity trips (London to Toronto trains aren't as affordable if you already own a car, unfortunately).
Common, Canada, subsidize VIA Rail as much as you do highways, please!!
Finland makes it work. There are no excuses !!
In Texas winter is more like a rainy season, but even so, when there's ice or sleet my workplace coordinates everyone staying home. Its just too dangerous to drive.
Here in florida they say we need more cars because it’s too hot to bike here for 6 months of summer.
Turns out it’s no big deal. Bring lots of hydration and a wide brim hat/helmet
I usually like the videos on this channel but the arguments made in this one are pretty poor. Bad weather is bad for every type of transportation. Risks are multiplied especially for older people. If an elderly slips on ice and breaks their hip because of icy sidewalks or if they have a need to being driven to a hospital for a major treatment, cars are a more safe option that is less stressful. And people drive all year long. Ski resorts and cottage living are a regular weekly destination for many people so it's not just a summer thing. People are not going to start biking in winter. Developing countries have all switched from a majority bike medium to cars for a reason. It saves time and energy and procure safety in crime infested neighborhoods.
It just wasn't our experience at all that cars are "safer and less stressful" in bad winter conditions. Driving in a snowstorm was terrifying. I actually used to work at a job where I talked to a lot of seniors about their transportation challenges and probably the most common issue that came up was that they felt isolated in the winter because they didn't feel safe driving and didn't have good public transportation options where they lived.
"Bad weather is bad for every type of transportation." ... yes, that is the whole point of the video ... Grandma's hip will also break when her car slips on an icy road and she slams into a barrier. You don't take the very real increase in risk that occurs when driving in snow and then say "Well we should never drive in the winter". The point of the video is saying that logic doesn't belong in argument around alternative modes of transit either, it is not stating that alternative modes of transportation are all around superior in poor weather. Though I feel that Grandma's hip is probably the safest in that nice underground Metro they show off in this video!
Let's assume that we live in backwards land so when it snows, the plows FIRST plow, salt and clear all of the walking paths. Then when there is time THEN they do the roads. Now what's safer for Grandma to use? Walking on the clear, salted, maintained walking path? Or driving on the icy, snowy, slippery unmaintained roadways? This should show that the safety you get from driving is not a factor of the mode of transportation but is a factor from the priority we give to driving over any other mode of transportation.
There are enough videos which talk about winter cycling, both by them as well as other people like Shifter and Pekka Tahkola but videos about the challenges of winter driving from an urbanist's perspective are less common.
@@OhTheUrbanity But neither walking nor biking in a snow storm is sensible. So you have to compare the experiences with the same extreme conditions, that is why the argument is not super solid. Also car roads are prioritized not simply because of car culture but because of supply chain logistic. It's why we have an industrial wasteland in the middle of the island to ship goods from trucks, train, and airplanes to warehouse to big box stores to eventually mom and pop stores or small homes. If you want to encourage a bike culture then there should be a focus more on the municipal rules that are biased towards car rather than bikes or walking. In the suburbs you can find rules that mandate a minimum amount of parking for cars for commercial zone, but no equivalent for bike racks for example.
Glad you guys are back in MTL! All hail the screaming truck siren! May they show mercy!
1:22 I have the exact same Tern e-bike here in Rochester, MN!! I even have the clubhouse mini accessory to haul my kiddo or groceries. AND, I use the bike year-round, even in wintery Minnesota.
Good stuff guys!
I live in Minneapolis and I love videos like this. I was shocked how nice winter cycling was when I first tried it. Unfortunately only certain parts of the city have adequate infrastructure for it and I don’t feel comfortable doing it from my current location
The tweet at 0:47 is really funny. Love the hyperbole. I love acting like Toronto of all places has this harsh freezing climate for 9 months.
Literally switched to carefree after nearly hitting a kid crossing in front of me in snowy conditions. Winter is the reason I *avoid* driving.
Damn. Must of been a scary situation. Sorry man. Glad you are out of the car and making the streets safer.