A tour guide at Brewdog claimed Guiness also tastes different because of their water (hard water, so with more minerals, this can change the fermentation and therefore the esters). He claimed family is/was working there and brewdog has a better water source (soft water) (of course he'd say his brand has better resources) but to be honest I prefer Jet Black Hearth since it tastes fuller to me. I don't dislike Guiness but sometimes it can taste a little watery and metalic to me. Looks like the beer turned out great, thanks for the brewing tips!
Albert what are you on about, Brewdog has a better water source? It’s not a secret that Guinness is brewed with hard water, I went on a brewer tour and the guide explained the same thing. As I understand it, hard water is the best for brewing dry stouts with, hence why Guinness has been so successful. Jet black heart on the other hand is a milk stout so what it really looks like is that you prefer milk stouts to dry stouts, you can’t compare the two drinks like for like...
BrewDog technically has a water processing lab that allows them to basically build up the water profile. So depending on the style of beer they would want they can change the composition of water, which surprisingly has a very large effect on the taste
I am planning to make this clone for christmas, it looks very easy and tastey. But first, what is your water profile target? Cheers and thanks for sharing your video🍻
Asuming your brew was 20 litres? How much wort did you extract from the brew for souring? Im estimating you drew 10% of the wort as in 2 litres by the volume in the jug. Never done a sour before, please forgive my questions. Did you leave teh wort covered with tin foil on a work top or in a fridge for 3 days. How long did you boil the wort? Was teh reintroduced cooled wort added during or after fermentation had stopped? Many thanks
the beer looks quite delicious Martin.......Guinness makes a mixture of the dark grains(special malts), boils it to 134 degrees C, and then add it to the rest of the wort.......i guess that adds acidity to the wort.......but no one knows for sure how Guinness is brewed.......another great video.....cheers Marty
Just getting back into brewing after a 20 year break. Back then souring some of the wort is exactly how we made this beer and it always turned out very good. Interesting to see it is still being used. No one knows how guiness gets their flavor for sure and I am sure we never will.
Very interesting. I just brewed a stout using the grainfather app. I will see how it turns out and maybe use your idea for the next. Great video. Pierre
Hello, watched this vid. Found it very interesting because I love guiness. Gave this a try ,unfortunately it did,nt go as planned. I had a start sg of 1054, after adding the boiled and cooled extract after three days my fermentation stopped within 10 minutes. 1020sg .Smells a little like ammonia. The extract had a lovely head..so obviously wild yeasts had got in. Its now having a second fermentation, with 4grams per litre sugar. I am hoping that this will solve the problem. Otherwise its back to lactic acid. Greetings from the land of tulips...
Hi there I must say it looks good but I think I've seen you brewing a more authentic Guinness clone any chance of the recipe for the most authentic Guinness clone the one where you and your wife doing a tasting thanks Ps I've been doing algrain for about 14 years
Great vidoe! I will be brewing this Guinness clone on my Grainfather in a couple of weeks. I thought I might brew it on St Patrick’s Day! I am a bit hesitant about the hack, but I will give anything a go to make better tasting beer, Cheers!
How do you carb. beer and put it on nitro? Is it carb first and then beer gas or figure you % co2 in beer gas and adjust pressure from there? Thank you
Loving your videos! Smashed all of them in a day! You gonna have to do a segment on how to do a nitro tap setup, would love to try this Stout hack but would need the Nitro to do it justice!!
I regularly brew stout for nitro. It took a while to master it. Obviously you will need a nitro tap and a nitro regulator. I generally cold crash my stout to 2 degrees C after 10 days fermenting at 18 C for at least 2 days. I then hook it up to nitro gas (70% Nitrogen/30% CO2) or sometimes it's (75%/25%) depending on the supplier. I leave it in a kegerator at 36 PSI for 6 days, testing it for the last few days to see how the head is coming on. After that, I reduce the pressure back to around 30 PSI as a serving pressure and maintain the temperature at 5 -6 degrees. It works well for me. I hope this helps even if its 3 years late
I watched a Documentary on Guinness and they showed the brewing process from the barley arriving at the brewery to the malting, mashing then fermentation, then right at the end they were about to ferment the beer and they said something about souring a percentage of the beer and said this is where 'we can't show you the process on TV' they then showed them adding the so called soured wort back into the rest and they added the yeast, I'm wondering they they have a separate wild strain of yeast that they harvested that they then ferment a small percentage of wort which gets added back into the rest of the wort, the so called souring could be a fermentation of a small part of the beer that if you were to ferment 100% of the wort would taste pretty bad, this is one clone of sorts that I plan on brewing
Is the wort for souring partitioned off after the boil or after the mash? Do you know what's souring it? I would be interested in the pH before/after the three days on the sour portion. I'm no stranger to souring wort just never seen this method before (and never would have guessed that Guinness was soured!).
Legend! I love this Hack. Thank you so much for sharing it. Im knocking up this in the next couple weeks and will let you know how it turns out. Top work Mr K
Please could you kindly share a step by step tutorial for beginners? Unfortunately I can't understand how to do it from the video. I have always used Malt Extract Cans. It will be great to know time for each ingredients, temperature of the water, steps, etc.. Thanks Mr. K
What brewing equipment do you have? I used to brew with extracts. Full grain isn't too difficult. I initially did it on a large pot on the stove a mesh bag. Now I use a robobrewer.
I have used C02 and nitro C02 mix. The difference is that the nitro produces a creamy head that whilst not affecting the taste in theory, does affect taste in reality because of the way it clings to the tongue. The same thing happens with fatty food, the oil/fat in holds the food on taste buds longer thereby amplifying and changing the perceived taste.
Very interesting. I think if I were to try this I would split the batch and try one soured on purpose and one not and do a blind tasting. See if it’s very obvious or not. Maybe a video for another time?? 🙏🏻😬
I have an electric Blichmann BrewEasy setup which I've had for a couple of years and enjoy. If I was starting again now I'd look at one of the electric brew-in-a-bag systems. Those keep things really simple with only one vessel to deal with and make great beer. 🍺
There's not much to it. In my keezer I have a separate cannister of beer gas (mix of nitrogen and CO2) which connects to my keg gas post. And at the end of my keg liquid line I have a nitro tap which gives that nice foamy nitro pour. To serve on nitro I carbonate the beer about half the level I would for a regular CO2 beer then connect to the beer gas and serve at around 30psi.
I've got a mate who only drinks Guiness and Black so I might use this as a Base and then bung a kilo of blackberries / blackcurrants in at secondary. See what he makes of that.😉
As a newbie just a stupid question. When do you put in your hops and for how long to boil. is it after the 60 minute boil, or during the boil. And for how long should you boil it when the hops are in it. As i sad, im not a brewer. just gathering info.
It depends upon the beer. But typically you will boil for 60 mins adding the first addition hops in at the start of the boil. This primary contributes to the bittering of the beer. Hops added later (often 15 minutes from the end and at the end of the boil) contribute flavor and aroma.
I thought Guinness used a bit of sourered mash from the previous batch to achieve this (the same reason a jack daniels bottle mentioned sour mash). This does seem like a good solution.... but will the yeast still scrub the oxygen if you just open it three days in?? If fermentation has finished that would mean the oxygen would be bad.. Or will the yeast still scrub off oxygen in the maturation period after that? Or would another way be to get some wort, let it sour,, but not include it in this batch just yet... You just boil it, but then making sure you sanatize a vessel and freeze it for the next batch? I'm probably making it all too complicated but dang it I want some good stout!
@@TheHomebrewChallenge The BJCP guidelines I think mentioned that Guinness does sour it with your method., letting the bacteria on the barley to sour it over a few days, then they add it to the boil of a whole batch. The sour mash is something only used for american whiskey.. Not beer. I want to try it once, where you just mash a tiny bit, like three days before main brewday.. Mash it inside a small insulated lunch sized coolbox and then strain the mash inside a coffee filter holder thing (what are they called?). To see if I can get 3% of the main batch size with a similar gravity. I can let that sour and add it to the whole batch on brewday. But it probably isn't worth the whole effort. This type of beer is not that sensitive to oxidation plus Guinness even recommends to finish the kegs in two weeks anyways...
Can someone give me a carbonation tip? I have a CO2 cylinder and another cylinder with 30% CO2 and 70% N2! But I'm unsure whether to use just the blend cylinder, don't know the right pressure, or if I should use only CO2 and the blend cylinder for serving! Can anyone help me? Thanks!
Made a berliner weiss a few months back using the kettle sour method. Got my bacteria by incubating a couple kernels of raw malt. Came out good but VERY tart.
I tried this method a few days ago, even dropped a few kernels of acid malt in to try to inoculate it with lacto. It's been sitting out for 3 days now, there's literally a krausen on top from wild yeast, but the pH has only gone up. Post boil was 5.4 and now it's 5.7. should I still boil it and add it or did the wrong thing happen?
Edit : well I did inoculate it with a few kernels of acid malt, but it certainly didn't grow lactobacillus. Ended up smelling like a mix of green beans and enteric bacteria
Thank you for Sharing the recipe! It works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I use a different yeast, I use kveik yeast ( OYL091 Hornindal Kveik - Omega Yeast ) The beer was ready in 7 days! The beer is sooooo good! BTW 5 gallons is not enough!! I'll double batch next weekend!! Cheers everybody!!!!!!!
Nothing fancy. Literally just stolen a bit of wort, left it out at room temperature (covered) for a few days. Then added back to the beer. Leaving the wort exposed to air seemed to do the trick.
Really looking forwards to categories 15 and 16 in your series!
Well, I found out I've been drinking Guinness properly.
Nice job. I might try this on my next dry stout.
Great editing quality really enjoyed the work you put in to it!
A tour guide at Brewdog claimed Guiness also tastes different because of their water (hard water, so with more minerals, this can change the fermentation and therefore the esters). He claimed family is/was working there and brewdog has a better water source (soft water) (of course he'd say his brand has better resources) but to be honest I prefer Jet Black Hearth since it tastes fuller to me. I don't dislike Guiness but sometimes it can taste a little watery and metalic to me.
Looks like the beer turned out great, thanks for the brewing tips!
Albert what are you on about, Brewdog has a better water source? It’s not a secret that Guinness is brewed with hard water, I went on a brewer tour and the guide explained the same thing.
As I understand it, hard water is the best for brewing dry stouts with, hence why Guinness has been so successful. Jet black heart on the other hand is a milk stout so what it really looks like is that you prefer milk stouts to dry stouts, you can’t compare the two drinks like for like...
BrewDog technically has a water processing lab that allows them to basically build up the water profile. So depending on the style of beer they would want they can change the composition of water, which surprisingly has a very large effect on the taste
This looks sooo good, I can't wait to try it!
how did it went?
How long did you let the soured wort sit in the fermenter after you added it? Thanks. Love your channel.
the roasted barley you put at the beginning of the mash? it looks delicious, Guinness my favorite, cheers !! 🍻🍻🇧🇷
Nice job just put my first one in the fermentation pail I added a little more malt 1.068 not expecting that but will take it
Pretty interesting video! Im subscribed.
Greetings from Argentina !
I think I'm going to have to give this a go!
Keep up the good work sir.
I am planning to make this clone for christmas, it looks very easy and tastey. But first, what is your water profile target? Cheers and thanks for sharing your video🍻
Nice recipe.
How many litters of water did you need for these ingredients?
How many litters of beer did you get?
This recipe ended up great for me 👍 thank you
Cool, did you use his 3rd method to sour the beer? are you still brewing it or did you find one stout recipe even better?
Hi can you upload full video top to bottom not a short version
Asuming your brew was 20 litres? How much wort did you extract from the brew for souring? Im estimating you drew 10% of the wort as in 2 litres by the volume in the jug. Never done a sour before, please forgive my questions. Did you leave teh wort covered with tin foil on a work top or in a fridge for 3 days. How long did you boil the wort? Was teh reintroduced cooled wort added during or after fermentation had stopped? Many thanks
the beer looks quite delicious Martin.......Guinness makes a mixture of the dark grains(special malts), boils it to 134 degrees C, and then add it to the rest of the wort.......i guess that adds acidity to the wort.......but no one knows for sure how Guinness is brewed.......another great video.....cheers Marty
Just getting back into brewing after a 20 year break. Back then souring some of the wort is exactly how we made this beer and it always turned out very good. Interesting to see it is still being used. No one knows how guiness gets their flavor for sure and I am sure we never will.
Yeah seems to work really well. Love the results it gave. Welcome back to brewing!
Love these videos alot. But.. random question what music is playing @ 4:19
Very interesting. I just brewed a stout using the grainfather app. I will see how it turns out and maybe use your idea for the next. Great video. Pierre
Hi there I'm trying this one today will keep you posted cheers
Hello, watched this vid. Found it very interesting because I love guiness. Gave this a try ,unfortunately it did,nt go as planned. I had a start sg of 1054, after adding the boiled and cooled extract after three days my fermentation stopped within 10 minutes. 1020sg .Smells a little like ammonia. The extract had a lovely head..so obviously wild yeasts had got in. Its now having a second fermentation, with 4grams per litre sugar. I am hoping that this will solve the problem. Otherwise its back to lactic acid. Greetings from the land of tulips...
How about water profile? Which one do you use?
Hi there I must say it looks good but I think I've seen you brewing a more authentic Guinness clone any chance of the recipe for the most authentic Guinness clone the one where you and your wife doing a tasting thanks
Ps I've been doing algrain for about 14 years
Great vidoe! I will be brewing this Guinness clone on my Grainfather in a
couple of weeks. I thought I might brew it on St Patrick’s Day! I am a bit hesitant
about the hack, but I will give anything a go to make better tasting beer, Cheers!
Good luck with the brew day (and the souring!). I think you'll be pleased with how it turns out.
Did you try the souring hack and if so, how did your brew turn out?
How do you carb. beer and put it on nitro? Is it carb first and then beer gas or figure you % co2 in beer gas and adjust pressure from there? Thank you
Would love volumes of water preboil and post boil. Also, I would love mash temp/time. Please reply! 🙏
HI
How long did you force carbonate for and which mix was it 30 nitro and 70 co2 thanks
Ahh just seen my mistake,little to early with the soured wort. But its fermenting again and the ammonia smell has gone,so hoping for the best.
I thought sours were soured by using wild yeast? i.e. they left the beer out back in the day and wild yeast in the air settled on the Wort?
Loving your videos! Smashed all of them in a day! You gonna have to do a segment on how to do a nitro tap setup, would love to try this Stout hack but would need the Nitro to do it justice!!
Thanks. Yeah will show that off. Currently using the nitro tap to serve cold brew coffee.
I regularly brew stout for nitro. It took a while to master it. Obviously you will need a nitro tap and a nitro regulator. I generally cold crash my stout to 2 degrees C after 10 days fermenting at 18 C for at least 2 days. I then hook it up to nitro gas (70% Nitrogen/30% CO2) or sometimes it's (75%/25%) depending on the supplier. I leave it in a kegerator at 36 PSI for 6 days, testing it for the last few days to see how the head is coming on. After that, I reduce the pressure back to around 30 PSI as a serving pressure and maintain the temperature at 5 -6 degrees. It works well for me. I hope this helps even if its 3 years late
I watched a Documentary on Guinness and they showed the brewing process from the barley arriving at the brewery to the malting, mashing then fermentation, then right at the end they were about to ferment the beer and they said something about souring a percentage of the beer and said this is where 'we can't show you the process on TV' they then showed them adding the so called soured wort back into the rest and they added the yeast, I'm wondering they they have a separate wild strain of yeast that they harvested that they then ferment a small percentage of wort which gets added back into the rest of the wort, the so called souring could be a fermentation of a small part of the beer that if you were to ferment 100% of the wort would taste pretty bad, this is one clone of sorts that I plan on brewing
i remember reading that their fermenting vats are made from wood, which has brettanomyces living in it.
Awesome work. I brewed mine three days ago. I poured the sour today. Wish me luck.
Ooooh good, have been looking forward to hear how this would work out for somebody else. Let me know how it turns out
@@TheHomebrewChallenge Will do
How did it turn out?
Well, shiver me timbers. Ill have to give this a try next time I brew a Irish stout.
Are you a pirate? or do you think pirates drink guinness
@@ElaborateTrolling Neither, just like saying shiver me timbers in the most normal way.
@@Unsub-Me-Now good reply :)
As a sour enthusiast/mad man, I'd love to know what the P.H. readings were.
Sorry didn’t record that. Would like to know now myself 😃
What temperature did you ferment at?
Is the wort for souring partitioned off after the boil or after the mash? Do you know what's souring it? I would be interested in the pH before/after the three days on the sour portion.
I'm no stranger to souring wort just never seen this method before (and never would have guessed that Guinness was soured!).
I took the wort from after the boil. I believe the souring occurs from exposure to the air for 3 days.
Legend! I love this Hack. Thank you so much for sharing it.
Im knocking up this in the next couple weeks and will let you know how it turns out.
Top work Mr K
Excellent - let me know. Suspecting this batch will be but a mere memory by then
Martin what do you think about using some east kenting gold hops and making the recipe into something of a ESB/Guinness hybrid
You’re making me think I want an ESB served on nitro!
HI Martin great video. when you put your beer on Nitro, do you pre carbonate it? and do you use pure nitro or 30/70 mix? thanks
Yes, pre-carb with C02 first.. get it to something like 1.5 then use the beer gas to serve
Please could you kindly share a step by step tutorial for beginners? Unfortunately I can't understand how to do it from the video. I have always used Malt Extract Cans. It will be great to know time for each ingredients, temperature of the water, steps, etc.. Thanks Mr. K
What brewing equipment do you have? I used to brew with extracts. Full grain isn't too difficult. I initially did it on a large pot on the stove a mesh bag. Now I use a robobrewer.
Mash steps? Thank you!
Wow!
Great job! Gonna try this. Whats the size of the starter?
It's been a while so I'm not sure. Likely 1 liter.
Nice video man, how different would it taste using full Co2 in keg instead of nitros?
I have used C02 and nitro C02 mix. The difference is that the nitro produces a creamy head that whilst not affecting the taste in theory, does affect taste in reality because of the way it clings to the tongue.
The same thing happens with fatty food, the oil/fat in holds the food on taste buds longer thereby amplifying and changing the perceived taste.
Very interesting. I think if I were to try this I would split the batch and try one soured on purpose and one not and do a blind tasting. See if it’s very obvious or not. Maybe a video for another time?? 🙏🏻😬
Yeah that would be a good test. Next time.
Looking forward to that video
Tell me about your set-up! I've been doing single pot partial mashes for 5 gal and been looking to take the next step in to full grain brewing.
I have an electric Blichmann BrewEasy setup which I've had for a couple of years and enjoy. If I was starting again now I'd look at one of the electric brew-in-a-bag systems. Those keep things really simple with only one vessel to deal with and make great beer. 🍺
Look up robobrewer or brewzilla
What Nitro setup do you have? Are you able to do a video for pouring your stout with setup
There's not much to it. In my keezer I have a separate cannister of beer gas (mix of nitrogen and CO2) which connects to my keg gas post. And at the end of my keg liquid line I have a nitro tap which gives that nice foamy nitro pour. To serve on nitro I carbonate the beer about half the level I would for a regular CO2 beer then connect to the beer gas and serve at around 30psi.
hi, how much wort did take out % to sour?
After you added the sour wart what temperature did you have the wart at until you kegged it?
With the soured wort added I chilled the beer ready for carbonation and conditioning.
I've got a mate who only drinks Guiness and Black so I might use this as a Base and then bung a kilo of blackberries / blackcurrants in at secondary. See what he makes of that.😉
Stealthy!
The Homebrew Challenge how much water did you use for this recipe?
I didn't want to assume anything, what was your water volumes for this batch. Looking to scale this.
Yeah should probably start doing this.
Save some for June!
We'll have to make some more. No way this is lasting four months on tap :-)
Great video! I missed seeing your opinion on how close the clone was to Guiness. :)
i have just tried a Beamish, have you ever cloned one?
As a newbie just a stupid question. When do you put in your hops and for how long to boil. is it after the 60 minute boil, or during the boil. And for how long should you boil it when the hops are in it. As i sad, im not a brewer. just gathering info.
It depends upon the beer. But typically you will boil for 60 mins adding the first addition hops in at the start of the boil. This primary contributes to the bittering of the beer. Hops added later (often 15 minutes from the end and at the end of the boil) contribute flavor and aroma.
@@TheHomebrewChallenge Thank you for the explanation sir.
I thought Guinness used a bit of sourered mash from the previous batch to achieve this (the same reason a jack daniels bottle mentioned sour mash). This does seem like a good solution.... but will the yeast still scrub the oxygen if you just open it three days in?? If fermentation has finished that would mean the oxygen would be bad.. Or will the yeast still scrub off oxygen in the maturation period after that?
Or would another way be to get some wort, let it sour,, but not include it in this batch just yet... You just boil it, but then making sure you sanatize a vessel and freeze it for the next batch?
I'm probably making it all too complicated but dang it I want some good stout!
Lol you’ve given this some thought :-). I don’t think it would be a huge deal to grab some wort a couple days in.
@@TheHomebrewChallenge The BJCP guidelines I think mentioned that Guinness does sour it with your method., letting the bacteria on the barley to sour it over a few days, then they add it to the boil of a whole batch. The sour mash is something only used for american whiskey.. Not beer.
I want to try it once, where you just mash a tiny bit, like three days before main brewday.. Mash it inside a small insulated lunch sized coolbox and then strain the mash inside a coffee filter holder thing (what are they called?). To see if I can get 3% of the main batch size with a similar gravity. I can let that sour and add it to the whole batch on brewday.
But it probably isn't worth the whole effort. This type of beer is not that sensitive to oxidation plus Guinness even recommends to finish the kegs in two weeks anyways...
Can someone give me a carbonation tip? I have a CO2 cylinder and another cylinder with 30% CO2 and 70% N2! But I'm unsure whether to use just the blend cylinder, don't know the right pressure, or if I should use only CO2 and the blend cylinder for serving! Can anyone help me? Thanks!
Have you ever intentionally soured a beer?
Many
Made a berliner weiss a few months back using the kettle sour method. Got my bacteria by incubating a couple kernels of raw malt. Came out good but VERY tart.
Just had a little taste. its good. needs to age a little, but the panic is over. Have not got nitro unfortunately, but thats life.
"Безумству храбрых поем мы славу! Безумство храбрых - вот мудрость жизни!" - А.М. Горький... 😁
Ничесе Серега ты задвинул тут поэму)
Спасибо
I tried this method a few days ago, even dropped a few kernels of acid malt in to try to inoculate it with lacto. It's been sitting out for 3 days now, there's literally a krausen on top from wild yeast, but the pH has only gone up. Post boil was 5.4 and now it's 5.7. should I still boil it and add it or did the wrong thing happen?
One way to find out.... :)
@@TheHomebrewChallenge yeah I found out by tasting it after it was boiled. It didn't work. Next time I'll actually inoculate it with something
Edit : well I did inoculate it with a few kernels of acid malt, but it certainly didn't grow lactobacillus. Ended up smelling like a mix of green beans and enteric bacteria
guinness draught or stout?
Thank you for Sharing the recipe!
It works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I use a different yeast, I use kveik yeast ( OYL091 Hornindal Kveik - Omega
Yeast )
The beer was ready in 7 days!
The beer is sooooo good! BTW 5 gallons is not enough!! I'll double batch next weekend!!
Cheers everybody!!!!!!!
7 days. Wow. Would love to try this with a kviek yeast.
nice videos but please, write more details. It's impossible for us to replicate it with so little info
When you sour the wort how can you be sure that it will not turn to vinegar?
you must every day checking ph
Hi, how many pounds of beer can I produce with this recipe? Thanks a lot.
Did you just keep tin foil over the soured portion the whole time?
Yup
malt vinegar to sour the beer would have been a great since its fermented from barley beer using vinegar mother.
Hi, I'm wondering where do you stored this acid part od wort? In frige or on room temp?
I would imagine room temp. But that’s just a guess
Hi, your 70% should have been 7lbs surely? Maybe that extra pound is what made your OG higher? 🍻
Well. Yeah you do have a point. I bumped up the base malt to get the OG I was looking for. So more of a 73% ratio :-)
🇧🇷🤟🍻
Hi, i don't understand how you sour your wort...
Nothing fancy. Literally just stolen a bit of wort, left it out at room temperature (covered) for a few days. Then added back to the beer. Leaving the wort exposed to air seemed to do the trick.
The Homebrew Challenge oh that simple ! Thanks !
Nope never given it a go...I'm going too now though. Thanks!
If it's nicer than guiness it prob tastes like Murphy's 😉
Hard to listen to somebody waving his hands in your face....