57:00 explanation of Matthew 24 & Luke 21 is great. It’s always interesting when ppl use these passages to predict what’s gonna happen right now in our world lol I’ll also add that making a distinction between the Jewish people and the political state of Israel is a very tough thing to do. The entire history of the land and the entire history of the people is intertwined. I hear his heart on this and agree with him on the main focus not being Israel, but the distinction between the two is not practical. Although the Bible is not necessarily speaking about our current political landscape or the future of America or the current wars, God is definitely involved in the dealings of nations and peoples and politics, in Israel, and in every nation/ppl/land of the world, all unto reconciling ppl to him through his Son. Great interview overall - really enjoyed it !
I just have a question that came to me as I was about halfway through this. As Christians, if we die, before, Jesus comes back, do we go to heaven once we die? Or do we stay in the grave until Jesus comes back? Just wondering your thoughts on this Joel and David’s. I always thought we go right to heaven once we die.
Jesus says to the thief on the cross, "Today you will be with me in paradise." There is a "waiting place" or place of paradise with Jesus for all those who die. Paul says in Corinthians that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Yet he also says at His return "The dead in christ will rise." The difficult part about this is that we are in a finite place and time. Whereas God is outside of time. So while we are on a timeline here on the earth, as soon as depart into eternity, we are not restrained by time. Something that I think plays a factor in this.
Thanks for doing this Joel and David. I know I felt a bit shell shocked the first time I heard David talk on this. I definitely need to read his book, I have a copy just haven’t read it yet. 🤪
What I do not understand is where does the temple described in Ezekial fit into this view? If it's just symbolic, why is it so detailed? And I also did not quite understand how to understand the 7 year (3.5 year / 3.5 year) period according to this view. Especially because it already kinda happened for the Jews when they were conquered and occupied by the Greeks.
I can't speak to the Ezekiel passage here. Regarding Revelation's symbolic numbers, John writes in verse 1 that God "Signified" it to his servant John. (The word show, is symbolized, or signified. Basically describing that this prophetic picture is meant to be symbolic. Not that it doesn't have literal meaning, but that it is to be interpreted through the symbols used throughout the Old Testament.) We didn't get to the 7 year interpretation here. But you are right, it did happen to the Jews, which is what it was prophesying to. If you read through Daniel 9 literally, it makes no sense, because then you would have no way to account for the 2000 years between the first set of 7"s and the arbitrary "final 7" of tribulation. That instead signifies a jubilee period, a period of grace, that Jesus inaugurated through the Cross.
the seven year period is based on a twisted interpretation of Dan 9:24-27. What Ezekiel sees is interpreted by John as a portrayal of the eternal garden temple of the new Jerusalem. A fundamental truth of Biblical interpretation is that we interpret the OT by the greater revelation of the NT
@david and @joelbomb Thank you guys for your detailed answers. I guess that makes sense. I'm still a bit confused though 😂 but I'm currently rereading Revelation so it's a good food for thought and your view on it definitely makes sense.
I still am confused. I grew up believing in the rapture but also that speaking in tongues was normal. So if we believe in both of those, they conflict? 🤔Maybe I’m not understanding.
Jesus returning is true! Us meeting Him in the air is true! but it's visable for all to see and follows by an immediate judgement and new heaven and new earth. It's not a "secret rapture" where the believers disappear and leave the unbelievers here on the earth. Believing in that has nothing to do with the spiritual gift of tongues. That is completely unrelated. I also believe in the gift of tongues and the return of Christ.
@@joelbomb I probably got confused but I understand what you are saying. I absolutely know that you believe in tongues. :) Thanks for taking the time to clear that up!
If you don't believe God can speak, you don't believe the New Testament. If you're referring to David, this is one of the most scholarly approaches to interpreting the text instead of going with a surface level interpretation that many Charismatics approach it with.
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Very informative.
57:00 explanation of Matthew 24 & Luke 21 is great. It’s always interesting when ppl use these passages to predict what’s gonna happen right now in our world lol
I’ll also add that making a distinction between the Jewish people and the political state of Israel is a very tough thing to do. The entire history of the land and the entire history of the people is intertwined. I hear his heart on this and agree with him on the main focus not being Israel, but the distinction between the two is not practical.
Although the Bible is not necessarily speaking about our current political landscape or the future of America or the current wars, God is definitely involved in the dealings of nations and peoples and politics, in Israel, and in every nation/ppl/land of the world, all unto reconciling ppl to him through his Son.
Great interview overall - really enjoyed it !
Thanks for your thoughts!.
the distinction is totally Biblical and if it's blurred you get false doctrine. And having false doctrine is definitely not practical
I just have a question that came to me as I was about halfway through this. As Christians, if we die, before, Jesus comes back, do we go to heaven once we die? Or do we stay in the grave until Jesus comes back? Just wondering your thoughts on this Joel and David’s. I always thought we go right to heaven once we die.
Jesus says to the thief on the cross, "Today you will be with me in paradise." There is a "waiting place" or place of paradise with Jesus for all those who die. Paul says in Corinthians that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
Yet he also says at His return "The dead in christ will rise."
The difficult part about this is that we are in a finite place and time. Whereas God is outside of time. So while we are on a timeline here on the earth, as soon as depart into eternity, we are not restrained by time. Something that I think plays a factor in this.
@@joelbomb yup agreed - John sees all the deceased saints in Rev 5 and 14 awaiting the Lord's return and the resurrection of the dead
Thanks for doing this Joel and David. I know I felt a bit shell shocked the first time I heard David talk on this. I definitely need to read his book, I have a copy just haven’t read it yet. 🤪
Glad you enjoyed it! :) Yes, its quite shocking at first!
hope it blesses you
What I do not understand is where does the temple described in Ezekial fit into this view? If it's just symbolic, why is it so detailed?
And I also did not quite understand how to understand the 7 year (3.5 year / 3.5 year) period according to this view. Especially because it already kinda happened for the Jews when they were conquered and occupied by the Greeks.
I can't speak to the Ezekiel passage here. Regarding Revelation's symbolic numbers, John writes in verse 1 that God "Signified" it to his servant John. (The word show, is symbolized, or signified. Basically describing that this prophetic picture is meant to be symbolic. Not that it doesn't have literal meaning, but that it is to be interpreted through the symbols used throughout the Old Testament.)
We didn't get to the 7 year interpretation here. But you are right, it did happen to the Jews, which is what it was prophesying to.
If you read through Daniel 9 literally, it makes no sense, because then you would have no way to account for the 2000 years between the first set of 7"s and the arbitrary "final 7" of tribulation.
That instead signifies a jubilee period, a period of grace, that Jesus inaugurated through the Cross.
the seven year period is based on a twisted interpretation of Dan 9:24-27. What Ezekiel sees is interpreted by John as a portrayal of the eternal garden temple of the new Jerusalem. A fundamental truth of Biblical interpretation is that we interpret the OT by the greater revelation of the NT
@david and @joelbomb
Thank you guys for your detailed answers. I guess that makes sense. I'm still a bit confused though 😂 but I'm currently rereading Revelation so it's a good food for thought and your view on it definitely makes sense.
I still am confused. I grew up believing in the rapture but also that speaking in tongues was normal. So if we believe in both of those, they conflict? 🤔Maybe I’m not understanding.
Jesus returning is true! Us meeting Him in the air is true! but it's visable for all to see and follows by an immediate judgement and new heaven and new earth. It's not a "secret rapture" where the believers disappear and leave the unbelievers here on the earth.
Believing in that has nothing to do with the spiritual gift of tongues. That is completely unrelated. I also believe in the gift of tongues and the return of Christ.
@@joelbomb I probably got confused but I understand what you are saying. I absolutely know that you believe in tongues. :) Thanks for taking the time to clear that up!
the rapture teaches actually includes within it a denial of the gifts of the Spirit
This guy actually claims the voices in his head are god. Extorting people because they fear death is the most despicable thing a person can do.
If you don't believe God can speak, you don't believe the New Testament. If you're referring to David, this is one of the most scholarly approaches to interpreting the text instead of going with a surface level interpretation that many Charismatics approach it with.