Thanks for watching, y'all, we hope you enjoyed the video! If you enjoyed this one, you should check out our video on Alexandria and the ongoing debate of where it came from, and how: th-cam.com/video/aLb0W1Kr5q0/w-d-xo.html (The LL Team does not agree on one specific theory for this one, either.) If you want to discuss or debate any of our points more, feel free to join our Discord and poke us there. discord.gg/hKCmswD5Mn We love chatting with you all and encourage healthy debate. - LL Team
This is a great theory! If it’s true, I wonder if Ultima will be the main baddie or if there will be something else too. The Allagans have always been in the backgroud with no real payoff to this point. Will this be the arc that delivers?
So! I have a theory that Azem made this key, that's why their seal is on it and it reacted to our presence and use of Azem's magic. We know from Elpis that Venat was Azem's friend, mentor and teacher, as well as the previous Azem. We know from ShB that Venat attempted to recruit Azem to her side when her faction was planning to create a Primal to rival Zodiark, and that Azem turned her down just as flat as they did the Convocation, striking out on their own. My theory is that before Azem made that decision, Venat took them into her confidence and told them what WE told HER in Elpis. Azem could not sign off on what the Convocation planned to do, but neither could they fathom or agree to Venat's horrific plan. So they set out in hopes to create a way to undo what Venat would cause, without the catastrophic loss of life that the Ascian's plans would bring. And sometime before the Sundering, they created a working prototype. The question for me is how it SURVIVED, and how the Millala got a hold of it. Krile's parents mentioned that Preservation had done some work on it, which is where I expect the augmentation came from, but as to what the actual components are, I honestly agree with the auracite theory. It was created to hold a specific spell, that of dimensional fusion-- Azem's answer to the Rejoinings performed through Calamities. I NEED more Azem lore, dammit. I desperately want us to *remember something*. We are 9/14 after all.
@@saralovelace7219it clearly was a tool of Azem as it bears Azems icon on it and its easy to explain its creation as Azem knew of the plans to sunder the world it was likely Azem position as the traveler to create a device to Azems fragments could visit these new reflections and explore them and the key was likely left where Azem was sundered.
Thank you for the information. I've been wondering for a long while if Ultima was going to come back and I feel she is. To me it felt like there was so much more to Shadowbringers and "The Source" that was yet to be discovered. I have a strong feeling that if she is coming back, she coming back from that place. The events of edenverse and reintroducing the other types of aether along with new incarnations of the primal's from another star...
1:39 Actually, the first type of auracite we're introduced to is BLACK Auracite, which is what the Heart of Sabik is. Its name in Japanese is Black Auracite Sabik.
@@UltaFlame Actually, false. 黒聖石サビク is not translated as white stone black. 黒 is black, 聖石 is a holy stone, サビク literally is katakana for Sabik (sabiku), which has no meaning in Japanese. It literally just means "black stone Sabik" or "black holy stone, Sabik". Which is much closer to Black Auracite Sabik, than white stone black.
Something that's missed in this synopsis is the Key's resonation with Azem's crystal(denoted by Azem's symbol appearing on top of the Key when the WoL summons their companion shades). This is poignant because MY theory is that the Key was created by Azem and recognizes the residual aetherial signature left by the crystal. MY belief is that there will be more Azem origin lore and that, potentially a grave threat sealed by Azem's use of the Key will become the main antagonist of this story arc.
this is what i have been thinking to an extent. I also believe that we may find that the former Azem had figured out how to leap between shards. I really would not be surprised if we find out they knew about the sundering before it happened. which would make the pre sundered version making the key something that would make sense. I think the key will also be used to allow us to "leap" to other shards.
@@0019khudsonit never occurred to me that Azem could've survived the sundering. Since the WoL and Ardbert were shards of Azem I thought they were confirmed to have been sundered. Unless I completely misunderstood that part of shadowbringers.
So! I have a theory that Azem made this key, that's why their seal is on it and it reacted to our presence and use of Azem's magic. We know from Elpis that Venat was Azem's friend, mentor and teacher, as well as the previous Azem. We know from ShB that Venat attempted to recruit Azem to her side when her faction was planning to create a Primal to rival Zodiark, and that Azem turned her down just as flat as they did the Convocation, striking out on their own. My theory is that before Azem made that decision, Venat took them into her confidence and told them what WE told HER in Elpis. Azem could not sign off on what the Convocation planned to do, but neither could they fathom or agree to Venat's horrific plan. So they set out in hopes to create a way to undo what Venat would cause, without the catastrophic loss of life that the Ascian's plans would bring. And sometime before the Sundering, they created a working prototype. The question for me is how it SURVIVED, and how the Millala got a hold of it. Krile's parents mentioned that Preservation had done some work on it, which is where I expect the augmentation came from, but as to what the actual components are, I honestly agree with the auracite theory. It was created to hold a specific spell, that of dimensional fusion-- Azem's answer to the Rejoinings performed through Calamities. I NEED more Azem lore, dammit. I desperately want us to *remember something*. We are 9/14 after all.
@@katrinascarlet5637They are sundered, but given that we’ve been slowly seeing more shards like Ardbert as you’ve mentioned and Golbez, perhaps they’re setting up for more of them to appear.
In the last Tales of the Dawn short story entry: "Oh my, how careless of our Azem." Thus spoke Hythlodaeus, having ambled into his office at the Bureau of the Architect to find a crystal sitting rather conspicuously on a chair reserved for guests. Slipped from a singularly adventurous pocket, no doubt. He marveled at the way the light played on its facets, like the surface of a tranquil lake, and recalled the first visitor he had received that morning. Azem had sought the chief's assistance with the refinement of the fourteenth in his series of concepts to help ease the burdens of travel, which was contained within the palm-sized crystal. But as was so often the case, the conversation concerning the escapades that inspired said concept's creation had spiraled into a full-blown recounting, leaving Hythlodaeus insufficient time to evaluate it before Azem had to hasten to a meeting with the Convocation. Hythlodaeus was not without his own pressing obligations─the formal evaluation of a massive living-being concept, for one─and had only just returned to the bureau a moment before. "And absent such comforts, how unbearable your wanderings will surely be," he mused aloud as he collected his friend's crystal." Azem had been creating crystals to enable travel. There's no real indication of where this crystal ended up. Also the story is called: Days Gone By, and Days Yet to Come.
Given the complete glossing over of the resonance with Azem's soul crystal, I'm going to say this seems pretty unlikely. If we hone in on that resonance with the soul crystal in particular, we come to the much more common fan theory that ties The Key to the crystal creation of Azem noted in "Tales from the Dawn - Days Gone By, Days Yet to Come." Given Emet-Selch's teasing of the "Golden Cities of the New World," which we now know to in fact be Living Memory (presumably in one of the shards previously being prepared for a calamity yet to come) preceding his remark suggesting we visit the other shards, I find it much more likely that The Key will be more of a plot device to get us to said shards for further story expansion beyond the conflicts that have the potential to still exist on the Source at this point (beyond Meracydia, at least).
The problem I have with the tales from the dawn theory is that, that crystal is described as faceted, which doesn't line up with the helix shape of the crystal on the interior of the key we see. Right now several theories seem moderately plausible, but they all seem to have holes to me. We need more data! When is patch 7.1? November? It can't come soon enough!
Correction: The Crystal is not Azem's, it was made by Emet-Selch in secret in memorial of Azem-their dearest friend. It is not imbued with any of Azem's memories as Azem's seat was left vacant and they were branded a traitor, thus Hades created the crystal in secret without approval of his peers in the Convocation. The crystal is imbued with an incantation of Azem's make, but was made, exclusively, by Hades. This heavily implies that Azem's crystal, which we know is nothing associated to Azem themself as their were, was likely made to mimic something that Azem used or had created. Seeing as how G'raha outright states that the Key and Azem's crystal employ the selfsame magic, we can pretty much assume, with confidence, that the Key is what Hades based the crystal's magicks upon. It's not a soul crystal, far from it.
I am curious if at some point in this post-endwalker saga, the writers will eventually go down the line of making a major villain a reflection of Azem that's evil or some other twisted take on WoL. Zenos had a *little* bit of that going on but we could probably find a more in depth take on the idea. Maybe a version of WoL that shines a light on the negative side of *constantly* leaving those you connect with behind for the sake of new sights and experiences. Never getting properly attached to who or what you find. Maybe that's a bit of an amateurish "fan fiction" idea but I'd at least be curious to see where that idea could go.
I'm going to be highly surprised if they don't. I know that Ardbert and his band of merry companions were kinda sorta that, but I wanna see a true reflection of the WoL facing off their ultimate antagonist self.
@@sopranophantomista Yeah I wanna see a non-manipulated version of that. Make an evil WoL reflection that essentially has the vibe of the Dad that went out for milk and never came back but like...on a more existential scale lol. Someone who forsakes those around them for a straight up insatiable thirst for seeing new things.
They have been teasing us with this idea a lot. First Ardbert, Zenos, then Golbez. Atleast one could have thought of the correlation at the time of playing through their respective stories. I would be surprised as well if we dont meet a literal screwed up villain Azem later down the line at this point. Make the idea go somewhere and go full ham with it, I'd say!!
Fray Miste. The villain is going to be Fray Miste. They will finally finally have had enough of everyone's bullshit, oh and the DRK questline will be made mandatory too.
iirc, during the last media tour right before DT, one of the FF14 content creators asked Yoshi P for clues regarding DT and, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Yoshi P said to pay attention to one of the Alliance Raids and to the names of the seats of the Convocation and the only possible relevant Alliance Raids are either Ivalice or the Myths of the Realm, but then some people forget that one of the names of the Convocation is Altima, the patron of the arts, some people speculating that they're meant to be same word as Ultima but "Altima" was just an old mistranslation, so maybe Yoshi P's clue was indeed related to Ultima? On the other hand, it's undeniable that Ultima and the Auracite are key in FF14 lore. To this day, I'm convinced that the reason Venat was present in Elpis that day "at the request of a friend", was because she was there at the request of Elidibus and she was meant to be the one helping him investigate what was going on in Pandaemonium, but because of the whole thing with the Final Days, it's possible that the whole deal with Ultima flew under her radar until way later. Finally, on the last 7.0 trial, the Auracite in the Key reacted to us when we invoked Azem's power to summon our allies, and Azem's symbol shined on top of the key, something they showed at the start of the trial and then proceeded to never speak of it again, which is extremely suspicious, while at the same time, they showed to us other instances of the key being used but Azem's symbol didn't appeared, which makes the reaction the key made to Azem's power very specific and for a reason. Some people might say that Ultima is just a side character meant to be side content stuff, but lets not forget that Ultima and the Auracite have been key figures not only in a raid and an alliance raid, but also the MSQ itself, so I want to see what CBU3 is cooking here, but you can be sure that there is a link between the key, Azem and the WoL, otherwise the key wouldn't have reacted in such a specific and particular way to Azem's magic.
Unfortunately even if they do make it related to Ivalice the raids are not canon to the story until it becomes a requirement for MSQ, we see that with normal raids and all nd tthe crystal tower raids only became story canon due Shadowbringers
I think you are correct about Ultima showing up in the next few expansions though the "yet" posessed by Sphene displayed the Azem symbol on it as a reaction to us using the summoning crystal. The key had been in the hands of the Lalafel for an unknown amount of time, passed down. The recreation/museum of the ancestral home of the Lalafel was a volcano and inside were walls lined with interesting looking masks. A volcano that Hythlodaeus told an interesting anecdote about that is spelled out even more in a short story. I think that is an item created by, and belonging to, Azem that was left there and found ages later. The real problem is, it would appear that Emet Selch knew about it. He specifically suggested learning about the "forrgotten people of the south sea isles" and the ascians clearly had influence on Alexandria. He basically guided us directly to the thing. Why would they have left an artifact that was capable, theoretically, of merging reflections without a calamity laying around?
I think two things: Whatever capabilities of the Key is tied to Azem and Azem was ejected from the Convocation post-Zodiark, such that Emet had to make his Constellation Crystal in secret. If the Key of Azem did have the power of Interdimensional Fusion, it wasn’t known at the time because…there was no need for fusing dimensions that didn’t exist pre-Sundering. Post-Sundering, Azem’s power was also Sundered. It’s a theme in modern Japanese storytelling that only the victor gets to dictate history. The only way Azem’s power could’ve been guaranteed to have is if “Azem” could defeat Emet-Selch. And if he did, then the Constellation Crystal should resonate with “Azem”, unlocking whatever secret powers/tech Azem was working on in their own time.
Ultima got a will of her own via prayer, the Ultima we got in Ivalice was the Ultima that invaded from space, but the lore makes it seem she was an unthinking husk before the aether from prayer interacted with her We have another calamity from the sky that has her will mixed up with the will of her son. I expect Jenova to show up any moment now
I've been screaming "JENOVA!!!" and "LAVOS!!!" since ARR lmao and SHB just made it worse with that one Amaurotine Shade who is like "It begins with a deep keening from beneath the earth..."
@@ranos87 Oh yeah I know; I'm referencing a really old gaming/Square Enix/Square Soft theory that Jenova and Lavos were the same "type" (or species) of creature. I think the site it was originally posted on is down since I can't find it now, but you can still see results for the theory elsewhere. Some people say the similarities are only because some of the same developers worked on both games, but it's a fun brainworm to explore. :)
Glad I found this video. I recall not too long ago, I believe it was a reddit post where someone had drawn a pretty great fanart of The High Seraph and it sparked some few converstions in the comments. I had just beaten the Pandæmonium raids and I remember how at that moment it clicked for me that the version of Ultima we fought was a severly weakened shard of Ultima. Not only that, but with the callback to the heart of Sabik, which in that raid was revealed to be auracite, it was basically stated that a pre-sundered High Seraph and its pretty pebbles was a complete enigma to even the, by all rights, (in comparison to now) already nigh god-like Ancients. Not even mentioning the assumingly full use of the heart enabled Athena to create her constructs and ascend into godhood, which in turn was likely just a fragment of Ultima's powers. Scary stuff. Although obviously I can't be sure whether that hits the nail on the head, I'm not as versed in the lore as I'd like to be and I'm not even sure what half the comment section is referencing, all I know is that it would probably be really awsome to fight that thing.
Also, now that I had a moment to think, I noticed a really interesting visual detail about the High Seraph that could potentially elude to to its nature. For the better part of the Ivalice raid, we never see a glimpse of Ultima and when we finally encounter it, even then it is still partially trapped in its auracite prison. We see an otherworldly, but still somewhat ethereal and angelic being, possessed of an eerie beauty, alluding to some divine origin. It is only when the High Seraph shatters its shackles we see the truth. The prison breaks away, revealing what was previously hidden, a twisted and grotesque underbelly of disjoined flesh, limbs and faces, a visage entirely unthinkable to be native to Etheris. The High Seraph is the visage that it present to act as a God to mortals, to lure and corrupt, but the truth that lies beneath, the truth that is Ultima, is something far, far more eldritch and horryfying.
@@nephilima3956 Your comment/reply reminded me of Anima from the Endwalker dungeon. I had to go check the wikis to see if there was any connection because I was starting to cook lol.
Really great video. There was a post about a month ago from U/Kaellian on ff14 reddit which speculates the same. I'll add a few things from the discussion which I think support your theory. "Although we know not the precise timing of the High Seraph's visit to this star, we do know that Athena somehow came into possession of a mysterious crystal said to be the source of the destructive magic known as Ultima. According to Lahabrea, it was Athena who gave this crystal the name of “auracite,” and from her tireless research was born the Heart of Sabik." That comes from the Pandaemonium raid series, explaining the origin of Auracite. Claudien speculates the same thing. The Tomestones of Aesthetics fit with the convocation seat of Altima, whose glyph resembles the High Seraph. I'm reminded of Jessie Cox's interview with Yoshi P, where Yoshi says something like: "Be familiar with your convocation names." Altima's constellation crystal reads: "I feel my soul turning. Slowly but irrevocably. And the power I wield begins to seem terrible...But this is right. It is right." Totally different vibe to the rest of the crystals which refer to their parts in the final days. Because of the way convocation seats are inherited, I get the feeling that Ultima might have played a much larger role in the formation of Ancient society than originally thought. There's the reference to Academia Anynder we get in the Ok'hanu zone. Specifically referring to Quetzalcoatl, which was a being made by Lahabrea. I forget where it's mentioned, but there's text about "Lahabrea's one, true god," which is def not Zodiark. When we fight him in ARR, he does the Ultima spiel: "And from the deepest pit of the seven hells to the very pinnacle of the heavens, the world shall tremble," which Athena/High Seraph says. (edit, forgot to mention that Anynder was a facility maintained by Lahabrea) The last (admittedly loose) piece of support I have would be that two of the writers working on DT worked on Ivalice and Pandaemonium.
This is an extremely great video!!! I'm so glad this came onto my recommended. I have truly been thinking as well that It's pretty much time for a FF7-themed expansion, with sephiroth and JENOVA as key villains for an expansion with alien and body horror themed villains, which can hopefully lead onto ultima thereafter. Thanks again!
I can't see them pulling out Sephiroth on us, ever. He's too ingrained as the Most Powerful and Only Cloud Can Defeat him. Jenova or something similar to her would be interesting though. Part of her race that's also travelling the stars maybe.
@@kooriicolada I could see Ultima maybe being a member of the same race, who is stronger than Jenova but shares many of her characteristics/serves a similar plot role
If the original Ultima can create Auracite that can open portals between shards, wouldn't it be easier to assume that she wants to rejoin her counterparts directly instead of rejoining the worlds?
From what I know is that Ultima is not from the source or any of the shards effident to what went down in pandemonium, Ultima is a Alien being from beyond any of the worlds
As much as I like Ultima and the lore surrounding her, I'm like 90% sure she's been relegated to mostly side content unfortunately. But, should she ever make an appearance in the msq, I will be very pleasantly surprised!
All side story is main story. It's just if you want to know what the builder in the back of the house is doing while you're working on the front of the house.
I think so too, but at the same time it'd be so much wasted potential. Honestly I hope they'll just FORCE players to do Alliance Raids and Normal Raids at this point. It was a horrible idea to bind Ryne to Gaia, as much as I love her, but at this point it means that Ryne can never ever go to the Source and become a new established member of our friend group. EVERYONE loves her and it'd be such a big win for the writing and development of all Scion friends to have her join for good. But can't, because Gaia would be alone and she's optional. Same with Ultima, they now have to write around her being in the raid. Why not just make them not optional?! It doesn't take long to unlock this stuff, you can breeze through both in a day. Jesus Square Enix
An interestin theory. While I remain unconviced that we have not defeated Ultima, I say this only because I believe Ultima to be a creation of the Heart of Sabik. Whatever the Heart of Sabik actualy is, it VERY clearly allows anyone who understands it well enough (or possibly is corrupted by it) the ability to cast Ultima. As far as I remember, every instance of the spell Ultima is connected to the Heart of Sabik in some manner and I have a suspicion (though I cannot prove this in any meaningful way) that the Heart of Sabik is a tool of "something or someone" to facilitate the corruption and destruction of highly advanced civilizations. Possibly for the reason of neutralizing potential threats to itself. When cast as the straight up original spell, as far as I can recall, it is always accompanied by the same string of words: "From the deepest pit of the seven hells to the very pinnacle of the heavens, the world shall tremble!". While there is slight variation this appears to be the "core incantation". The Heart of Sabik has its own "theme song", it has multiple variations on said theme song and every single time the heart comes up, it is always accompanied by a theme of corruption, power and excess, and the ways in which said corruption destroys whatever is being built upon its power. If Meteion had not caused the final days, it was very likely that Athena would have caused an entirely different (but equaly destructive) disaster by attempting to reach godhood with the aid of the Heart, arquably having been driven mad by it. Lahabrea was supposed to be an original unsundered, but had been, again, driven mad by the Heart of Sabik. The entire Ivalice raid questline includes multiple people who are driven mad by auracite connected to the Heart of Sabik. The "Weapon" questline sees a group of promising young students and former wards of Gaius Baelsar again, go mad and sacrifice themselves and their very beings fighting a cause for the very man trying to stop them. One going so far as to fuse INTO Gaius and STILL not recognize the madness they have wrought. Whatever the Heart of Sabik is, it has the power to corrupt, twist and bend peoples minds to utter powerhungry madness, and I am firmly of the belief that leaving it in Claudiens hands is a mistake that will come to bite us later. But the POINT I am trying to make here is that Ultima is not the problem. Ultima is not the big bad. The Heart of Sabik is. The Heart of Sabik is not a creation of Ultima, Ultima is a creation or manifestation OF the Heart of Sabik. While I have no solid proof to offer as I believe the writing team has not settled on what exactly they want to do with the heart (and it is possibly their "in case of massive writing block OR fuckup, pull lever" option), it is one of those major overarching plotpoints that will come up later, and is very probably the next "big bad" and quite possibly a continuing big bad as there is very much an... eldritch vibe to it. It may very well be that the Heart has no "will" in the traditional sense and is moreso a manifestation of something eldritch and unknowable. It does not seek to corrupt everything it touches, it simply does so because it is the very essence and nature of The Heart of Sabik. And if you need a writing prompt, a mcguffin that promises power and corrupts those that listen to its sweet sweet swansong is about as solid a foundation as you can get. And the writing team is very much familiar with this trope, looking at you Eyes of Nidhogg. Athena was not the last time we will hear the words: From the deepest pit of the seven hells to the very pinnacle of the heavens, the world shall TREMBLE!!!
"I believe the writing team has still not settled on what they want to do" Totally how I feel. No idea if this is true, but for 90% of all lore & theorycraft discussions, this **feels** like the most true thing on the planet. Especially after the reveal that they are really only writing content an expansion or two out at any one moment. Pretty much means that they didn't know where they were going with this back when we were fighting Ultima. A cynical part of me just imagines the writers getting video links or synopsis info on what the fans are thinking and every-now-and-then they are just like "oh that one is a good idea, put it on the idea board." I'm not knocking it either, I think it would be pretty funny. Definitely a benefit to writing such a slow-burn story when you are allowed to be vague about so much.
Interesting, but there's a couple potential snags. First, the implication is that the "primal" Ultima IS the true Ultima. In the encyclopedia text you show, it mentions how the reference and fear of the people turned her into a "living Primal." That is, similar to Elidibus' Warrior of Light or Louisoix as the Phoenix, she became an entity like a primal, instead of giving rise to a separate entity. In that case, there's nothing left to act as the big bad, since we slew her already. Second, this still doesn't explain the connection to Azem - but something else does. In one of the Tales of the Dawn shorts, Hythlodaeus sees Azem off, only to discover a concept crystal they left behind - one of a "series of fourteen" concepts they developed to aid in travel. This seems like a throwaway concept to allow Hythlodaeus to go after Azem and interact with other characters (including a post-Pandaemonium Elidibus, Hermes/Fandaniel, Mitron, Logrif, and Emet-Selch, and witnessing the aftermath of a discussion between Lahabrea and Igeyorhm), but the short stories have been used to hint at plot points later on. And, the crystal itself resembles an aetheryte more than auracite - it looks like the same silhouette that an Ancient Aetheryte might have. This also would explain how prayer and wishes could trigger it - the Ondo we fight on the way to Anyder used shards of concept crystals from that place to cast spells in much the same way.
But Ultima isn't a primal. She was described as an otherwordly entity, just like Omega. Ultima's will or concious is sealed in the heart of Sabik, aka Ultima's Auracite. The way the Auracite works is that basically it needs a living vessel to physically manifest themselves. This is why the Bangaa warrior we see in Ridorana, transform into Yiazmat. A primal is a being that especifically comes out of nowhwere by absorbing a huge amount of aether from the surroundings and given form by prayers.
@@Yokai_Yuri Shiva? Ga Bu Titan? Tsukuyomi? Hyadelyn and Zodiark? Many instances of Primals coming into being from living people too, with them being the primary catalysts, fueled either by crystals or prayers or emotions or sacred objects, whatever it needs to
Yes! I’m very interested in how The Key and Azem are related, the fact that their symbol lit up when we summoned our party in the Interphos raises a lot of questions. Functionally, they operate similarly through prayer, our Crystal uses prayers to summon other champions beyond the rift and this key somehow uses those prayers for inter-dimensional travel. I’m curious if this an Azem relic or actually auracite.
I could see Ultima getting around this. Even if the one we defeated in the Ivalice raid was actually Ultima, it could have been as what was mentioned in the video and it was only one shard of her that we fought. We don't know from where the key Sphene used actually comes from for sure. We know it came to be in the possession of the Aloalo island natives but given its ability for Rift travel it could have originated in any of the Reflections or perhaps it even predates the sundering. In any case I'm hoping that's a focus in Dawntrail's patch content considering the Key is the last thing we see after everything is resolved in the MSQ.
The only problem with Ultima being the next villain is that they might need to make Ivalice Raids and Pandemonium required? Like what they did with Crystal Tower. Otherwise, its a lot to explain for people who stuck with the MSQ only.
They probably going to have to make SHB role quests, warring triad questline and Eden questline obligatory with what they have shown in the 6.X storyline. if you had those quests, you get lots of special dialogue and references that those 3 questlines will collide with the MSQ, specially because one of those characters appear in the MSq if you cleared a certain questline and other will have dialogue about that. So whats ivalice to add to the pile? hahahaha
Ivalice wouldn't be too big of an ask as you already need that to unlock bozja. Which if you havent unlocked bozja...go do that. It's basically season of discovery and is a great xp farm 70-90 and will help prepare folks for shades triangle in 7.2? I think
@@martimlopes9944 They should have made every thing connected to Unulkalhai and the elezen women I am forgetting the name of mandatory after we went to the void honestly.
God I hope they will at some point. The Alliance Raids and Normal raids being optional and potentially causing story issues is absolutely horrible. Like, they can never let Ryne go to the Source and join us as a companion even though EVERYONE and their mom loves Ryne. She'd bring some fresh wind into your friend group and give most of the Scions someone new to interact and develop with. But she literally can't do anything besides appearing for a minute as a side character because of Gaia and the optional raids. that just sucks. Same with other raids, like, the god thing is so damn important, yet treated like an optional side piece as irrelevant as the fisher job quest What would be a bad reason to do this? "Oh no, now they force me to play this amazing god tier raid and have fun for 20 minutes"? Crystal Tower being a requirement was much worse because it's boring and bad nowadays. That way they could even fix the "Crystal Tower daily" thing because then everyone would unlock Ivalice. Let Ryne and Gaia live in the Source and join us for good ffs, give us some beloved characters that stay instead of more Wuk Lamat snoozefest
In FFTactics, Alma possessed by the High Seraph was named Altima in the english version. There was an Ascien named Altima that remains unused as far as I can recall. She appeared during the 13 Asciens' meeting in ARR cutscene but not again since. She certainly didn't appear during the Ivalice raid series like I was expecting.
There's a lot to unpack here, and a really good listen! It brings forward so many potential directions we can go in from here on in, and there's a lot riding on the fact that Ultima could very well be linked into it; be it via the patches or in an upcoming expansion. I guess my main gripe is that if it is for an expansion's MSQ, that would mean we'd likely need Ivalice and Pandaemonium to become required, given the importance of it all. Whatever capacity Ultima re-appears in, it'll be a blast to see what happens next. Keep up the fantastic work XD
We can't be definitive about that, the description is breif, but doesn't really line up with a helix shape like we see in game. Lots of possible hints, not enough information to be sure of any one theory.
Interesting theory, but this probably isn't it. Putting aside the fact that Ultima is more than likely relegated to side content and raid series with how the game lore has been written, you have to keep a simple fact in mind. None of the other games have or will have happened in FFXIV. Just like the shards are reflections of the source, different yet familiar, so too is XIV content referencing other games simply reflections of the other games. Different, yet familiar. Also heavily glossing over the history of the key and what it suggests in how it's tied to Azem. The key is likely an artifact carried by Azem as they were off saving that volcanic island the convocation was unwilling to help. Whether it was part of their solution or a byproduct of it, only the power of Azem has been shown to be able to easily open clean rifts as the relic does, as we do every time we use our Duty Finder power. The island that was saved became the South Sea Isles after the sundering and the people there the precursors to the Lalafel tribe that inhabited those islands, who escaped the Source to flee the calamity of ice using the key. That's why we see the volcano in living memory when even the people who supplied the lore for that section could hardly remember why there was a volcano in the first place. I believe the upcoming threats are hinted to us by both the key and by Emet-Selch's parting words to us. Likely, the places pointed out are one of two types, a place where the machinations of the remaining or fallen asciens are still at work, providing the groundwork for yet another calamity, or irons Azem left in the fire that are too dangerous to be left alone.
I wouldn't discount the possibility. Graha for the longest was "side content" and look what happened. They aren't afraid to use raid series as a plot point. I personally don't think Ultima will be involved but I do think it's highly likely we will see Pandemonium and to a lesser extent Edenverse wound into the story. Pandemonium dropped a lot of implications and we repeatedly go back to the first now and again so the writers obviously want us to not forget Ryne and Gaia. Specially since they brought them back to voice their lines. I think cross shards will be a focus going forward. Reality is all thats left of Eitherys that is a big land mass is Merycidia (which Emet mentioned). Given what we know about it and what happened there it doesn't seem like its a very hospitable place but it would be a great stage for shard travel I would imagine due to what went down there, the "veil" is probably very thin there due to what went down.
I hope this isn't the case as cleaning up old ascian cults and stuff would just be so boring. Also, on top of the obvious answer of the Crystal Tower later becoming very important, the Omega raid series also plays a big role in the MSQ in EW. Big quest lines like raid series stuff just doesn't seem to ever be relegated to side content imo.
I don't think she'll be the next big baddie but she's a coming. I wouldn't doubt we see Necron going along with the FF9 theme just pop up out of nowhere without explanation. Maybe even some more lore around Mach and Nym through Ozma.
Remember, Meteion was introduced during the middle of EW. The reinterpretation of the Mothercrystal was also done around the same time. So yeah, for your arguement probably. But I think it's gonna be something new. Related, but new. Also, we haven't met all the sundered Ascians yet. And with Gaia and Fandaniel existing , prolly something gonna happen along those lines.
I hated the introduction of Meteion and her being the source of the end of days. I really thought it'd be a power somewhere from the cosmos but no it's a creation that got all emotional
fandango is dead. and Gaia is on the first. others remaing halmarut, deudaplon, altima and pashtarot. and maybe emmeroloth considering she could be easily re-arised to the seat.
@@LemonedIScream13 i hope so actually or the story teller! The story teller definitely has Altima vibes since he is the "creative" one. Could be an ascian reincarnated like Gaia.
This is an interesting theory, but there is a minor issue as you hit your Speculation at the end. As we know about Zodiark from the EW patch story, the body of Zodiark dispersed into aether on each of the reflections' moons (allowing Golbez to use it for his master plan). Granted, one major difference here is that Ultima, primal or otherwise, does not rely on an ancient like Elidibus to be their heart, but the point remains. If Ultima's main body on the Source is gone, then all that remains of Ultima in the shards would be their aether. Now, if some new villain came along from a reflection and took that aether, the question would then remain as to whether or not this new villain might seek a means, such as the otherworldly auricite, to cross into other reflections to devour the remains of Ultima's aether. That could be interesting in the right hands, in terms of writing ability. But only time will tell.
I agree with you. Auracite has been positioned too perfectly not to play a massive role in the future (especially after the events of Pandaemonium). We even have 2 factions of it. Black Auracite which incites obsession (Athena and the contramemoria and personally I believe it influenced the ancients, ascians and even Metion as well) and White Auracite capable of holding gigantic amounts of aether and using it to transform reality (Weapon Series, Ascian deaths, and Ivalice). I think Azem is involved in the creation of the key and his use of white Auracite tells us what faction we will be joining in the multiversal war. However, before we are ready to do that I suspect we will encounter another rejoined Azem (the leader of Preservation, whose pursuit of fusion was a means to rejoin himself with others to gain power) and we will have some sort of final showdown with them. We will win and be sad because the other rejoined Azem was sympathetic in some way but in the end on being defeated he will rejoin with us, making us, and Aetherys, finally whole and ready to confront the multidimensional threat beyond our universe. The fact Cosmic Exploration is some easy going side content tells me there’s nothing more of concern in our universe. People were mad their Wols weren’t more active in DT but to me it just didn’t make sense to use me more because the stakes were so low, you know? We are universe saving heroes now, planet saving is what our little Scion buddies do now when we aren’t around. So the only next step that makes sense is to prep us for a greater war. Down the line they can depower us and start again (maybe winning the multiversal war changes everything) but for now it seems we are still headed higher before we come back down.
This is EXCELLENT lore and a video. I've said it before, but the conversation about the DT MSQ is vastly more interesting than the MSQ itself. Hopefully FF14 DOES NOT rely heavily are references to other Final Fantasies, and finds a voice of its own. It should be the case that FF14 story stands alone and on its own merits for those that don't get the references (I maintain that the problem with the 2nd half of DT MSQ is that they didnt bother making an effort for players to have an emotional connection to the story because FF9 nostalgia reference will do it for them, so only the overly emotional (e.g. 'this part broke me!', we meet that NPC... 77 minutes ago! Oh the pain!) felt anything.
I think so as well! The mention of auracite-like stone in the 13th was the point where I became convinced that they ultimately still want to tell a big story about auracite and probably Ultima as well
this was a really cool video and i really liked hearing all the lore surrounding ultima but i think its more likely that we will be going up again Preservation, discovering their motivations and goals, as well as the connections between the Key and Azem.
Some speculation but I think those that formed Preservation are worshippers of Ultima. Their primary goal was researching inter dimensional fusion. Unlike the Ascians who wanted to rejoin the worlds they we're just looking for away to bring a piece of their shard to the source. They programmed Sphene in a way that eventually lead to Alexandria (and maybe a shard of Ultima) to the source. If the really cared about preserving Alexandrian's memories I find it odd that they didn't try to stop us at all from shutting down LM. You would think some Preservation members would of been present to prevent that very thing, but they are not there. Their primary goal was achieved and they may have found a way to another shard to do the same. One other note on Ulitma's influence on another shard. I may be mistaken, but I could of sworn I remember one of the Warriors of Darkness state "from the deepest pit of hell to the very pinnacle of the heavens" (they did not actually say Unleash Ultima) I watched some post HW cutscenes but couldn't find it so I may be misremembering. If someone could help jog my memory on characters (besides laha and athena) that say it
Preservation definitely has huge main villain syndicate vibes for the new saga, along with Ultima. I also think they are connected to the high Seraph Ultima. Their missing presence in DT (so far as of this post) is quite striking indeed. Perhaps they will appear in the patches or down the road on another shard even where they mainly operate. So far "Azems Key" and the impact of the stones (Auracite) still remain a large mystery, especially the later still to this day. I am suspecting they share a huge connection.
I was kinda thinking about the potential future MSQ prior to this video because somebody mentioned somewhere (probably Reddit) that they feel like there is going to be something really catastrophic happening soon. So I've been kinda thinking about this whilst not knowing much past 6.0 (yeah I kinda spoiled myself but it'll take forever to get back to 6.0 because I restarted on an alt). My general thought was that were going to get separated from the Scions somehow whether that is getting sent to another shard or possibly even dying and getting "isekai'd" to another shard somehow. (the other shards might have their own Aetherial Sea but idk if there is proof of that, plus something like Ultima coming out and killing us would be one hell of a way to show how dangerous they are) Then at some point Y'shtola would figure out how to travel between worlds and we'd get re-united. It's entirely possible that is what the key is for since Azem's magic "summons" people and G'raha kinda does this also. Although he required the Crystal Tower and alt-hist Biggs and Wedge to travel between shards but didnt need it to summon "Champions from Beyond the Rift". This kinda implies that a great deal of stored power or really efficient magic usage is needed to travel yourself between worlds and would kinda explain why we can do it but no one else can. They simply dont have efficient enough magic like Azem's magic. I wouldnt be surprised if we get a scene of Y'shtola inspecting the key or something in 7.2 if we havent already gotten that.
Azem inserted a piece of auracite to empower it...or to store enough aether to power it. The symbol appears because it's reacting to the summoning incantation. I don't believe it is auracite, myself. Mostly because we've been told over and over everything related to that plotline has been solved and this is a new story. But....DT story was pretty bad so maybe they'll draw from something more familiar for the patches.
I think Emet marked it. Firstly the mark shows up on the casing of the artifact, which is Electrope and would have been added by Preservation to help harness it (big shook Preservation was probably an Ascian plot), and secondly the mark only showed up as if reacting to our Azem crystal, which we know Emet made. It's not unheard of either; players found an Azem symbol in Alzadaal's Legacy, so my guess is Emet simply marked a bunch of stuff as a sign we're following the path he out right told us to follow. The alternative is "Azem knew the future and planned everything", which granted has some basis from the start of the Pandemonium raids, but still seems really farfetched IMHO. Personally I'm of the opinion that the Unsundered World had a some mysteries (like Ultima which is outright confirmed at this point) that Azem was investigating, and Emet tried picking up the breadcrumbs and has now passed that torch onto us. I don't think Ultima will be next big bad though, personally I'm throwing my hat in with Enuo given Dawntrail actually ended up giving a fair few Final Fantasy V vibes, and I'd like to see such an obsucre character get some love.
I agree with the thesis of this video. The reality is leaving the Heart of Sabik with Claudien is effectively a bookmark in the ongoing story that will be addressed in the future. Ultima will come back maybe when they let us go to Dalmasca.
Yes, I have been thinking of this ever since I stepped foot in Tural. There is one curious substance there that acts extremely similar to auracite - electrope. And here's the curious thing about electrope. It clearly exists on the Source AND the shard of Living Memory and Alexandria. And in Tural, it is said that it was the giants who mined the cenotes dry of it - the cenotes formed by the great meteor shower of ages past. Therefore, electrope was in the land's soil before the Sundering, which in turn would make it a very likely source for the Heart of Sabik that Athena found in a "faraway land", if I'm not mistaken of the turn of phrase used. The area, of course, is inspired by the Yucatan peninsula and the underlying meteor crater, believed to be the one that ended the reign of dinosaurs 65 million years ago. Hence, it would be no reach to believe that they will lean into that inspiration even further - as Final Fantasy is ever about even more ancient evils awakening, who may or may not be called "Ultima". We already see what electrope allows a regular person to do, evidenced with Wicked Thunder and especially in her Savage version, where she surrenders herself to the electrope entirely. While Savage versions are not necessarily canon, they still take the concept and just explore it further - like with Savage Athena full on gaining Ultima's theme and twisted tentacles, the Savage version of Gaia pushing into her as the Oracle of Darkness with the might of an Ascian, Savage Omega leaning further into trying to comprehend the true potential form of the Warrior of Light and so on. This would also explain why the Yok Huy so mysteriously ended as a dominant civilization. They spread across the continent and mined out all of its electrope, being guided by visions, only to then just suddenly get struck by a malady that stunted them forevermore? And the Alexandrians just so happen to create a completely flawed system, relying entirely on electrope, that, despite the metaphysics of the world, try to preserve artificial aetheric images of their people as an idea of immortality, rather their actual immortal souls, which are instead just used as fuel? No, I really do think we'll be seeing an incarnation of Ultima in the future. Whether emerging from Etheirys, or from the "Planetary exploration" content, whatever that is even going to be and what it will reveal.
Very bad take from me, but seeing that version of Ultima at 7:57 somehow rewired my brain and made me think "Huh, the thing she's fused with looks so mechanical it kinda reminds me of Alexander". One big thing I'm hoping for with the 3 trial story bosses is a remade, modernised fight with Alexandria's Alexander in one way or another. So. Idk. Lots of silly potential ideas to combine Ultima and Alexander. Just because it'd be cool.
Amazing analysis! If this theory about Ultima holds true, then I think the story can even draw inspiration from Ultimacia in FF8, as the theme of time compression can be correlated to the story in Dawntrail as well.
people are so mad about this expac. but this is literally a "let them cook" moment! people were so mad about the little things that they ignored the story! I'm hoping the patch content leans into more of the later half stuff!
yep, it opened so much possibilities lore wise, also it's the beggening of a new Arc in the story and we should wait to see were they will lead us. We are about to have a raid series with FFXI as theme! they could do so much with it!
As someone who does actually pay attention to the story, you can let them “cook” that’s fine but it’s also fine to not accept mediocrity and rushed plotlines. Dawntrail has good pieces to it, mostly what it sets up later and that SHOULDNT be the only bright spot. It is not a good thing that your main character learns the same exact lesson almost 5 times until resorting to just murder and violence. They did fuck up with this story, it sells itself on this new main character and the people around them without actually developing any of those people properly. Instead opting to give wayyyy too much attention to Wuk Lamat instead of actually giving zoraal ja development until the actual fucking final seconds of his life. I have legitimately zero faith that Wuk will change further from who she is now. Because where the fuck is she gonna go from here? All of the other interesting pieces of her character is who koana is! There is a pacing issue with dawntrail, I’m not just gonna sit here and clap my hands because I liked the setup with the chalice or the milala plot that CAN be elaborated on further. All of that happened within the last 2 hours of the msq that subjected me to the least engaging first 75% of any expansion in ff14 INCLUDING ARR. It’s not just people throwing a fit over little things, because those little things add up to majority of what dawntrail is in the end.
Maybe the key is an ancient memoria, the twinning crystal included two magic, one to travel between shades and one is some kind of locking mechanism to ensure only shades of Azem can wield to power (hence the crystal shines during the final fight.
In 5-10 years the song we memed so hard on is going to hit different when this comes to a head. "Big fat tacos!"...I mean "Beat, the Heart of Sabik, the Heart of Sabik!"
Very interesting lore commentary with some interesting arguments presented. I hope your channel grows. I do buy into your argument that the Ultima faced in the Ivalice Raid is just a primal version simply because Athena suggested Ultima to be stronger than her. Even weakened to do years of imprisonment, I don't think she'd be as weak as she was. If she was stronger than Athena in the recollection of herself in the unsundered world, it would be hard to image heroes of ages past being able to seal Ultima like that. At the very least is suggests Athena wasn't the only one with dealings with Ultima. Many other Ascians and Aumoratines might have as well. Perhaps even Azem.
Would this mean that Ultima was the cry heard from within the star itself when the Song of Annihilation began? Further I think it's odd that some vestigial information was ignored. Such as the other manifestations of Ultima, which would particularly Ultimecia or Cloud of Darkness and its relative versions. We also see that stories of The Cloud of Darkness exist elsewhere in space as Omega had encountered them and created a simulacrum of Ultimecia. I think it's important to note that in ff8 Ultimecia is actually an entity possessing another, in their case Edea of Eden. Which our own Eden does present a 'god of the the world' (and Eulogia imo ironically enough for a parallel in The Source, possibly including the new 'prayer answering' machine they leave behind) in both its Prime and Promise forms. And for the sake of argument, the parallel that the 13th's Eden device has with The Source's own Alexander machina. Which incidentally enough uses the Enigma Codex as a critical function. It itself is a pitch black mass, from which Alexander derived time-space and the Rejoined Timeline Ironworks deconstructs to ultimately also make time-space magic for shard travel to get G'Raha to the 13th. And the Enigma Codex has ironically also already been fan theory'd to the technological material of Living Memory and the Key. Though personally I think the Key particularly is more reminiscent of omicron aesthetic, but the two are pretty similar any how.
"I see it now. In you... his blood, my vanquisher in times... long past. But not so soon... shall I accept defeat..." I've been locked in on this theory ever since Orbonne Monastery dropped.
The problem I have with this theory is at the start: in the relic of the Milala I don't see auracite. Rather, I see an artefact of power akin to Tupsimati or the horn of Seal Rock which would become the heart of Alexander.
So I was also wondering if the Key could also have something to do with the horn stolen from Y'shtola in 1.0 that later was given to Mide to summon Alexander, and the staff Tupsimati. All three are known to draw in the aether and prayers of those of the surrounding area.
This theory is pretty good. Much better than the Alexandria video which seemed far too dismissive of other theories. The one thing it doesn't entirely account for is the seeming appearance of Azem's symbol above the key before the final Trial. But I don't think it can be entirely ruled out since Ultima has been lurking around long enough that Azem could have found and repurposed some, found some and tried to replicate it, or theoretically the key could simply have responded to and amplifed our summoning spell. What it really boils down too IMO is that we have enough hints for wild theorizing, but without another patch or two of hints it is hard to solidify any of the theories. Some people have also suggested the key is the concept crystal from the Hythlo story in Tales of the Dawn. I'm not sure, I wouldn't describe the helix shape of the interior of the key as faceted, but a lot of people see different shapes in the key. The key also doesn't look much like the concept crystals in Anyder, but then Azem would make a concept crystal into a weird shape just for funsies, or to make Emet sigh in exasperation, wouldn't they?
Wild crack theory: a shard of Azem will have been taken over by the Ultima shard on the Unlost World. They're the driving force behind Preservation and have been launching "keys" to all the other shards and the Source as a backup plan if the Ascians failed.
We could have a proper Azem vs Azem match too. The final trial was already screaming the whole Azem vs Azem with the parallels between our crystal and the Azem relic.
Oh when we gave the black auracite to Claudien i was very much like RED FLAG!@!! NOPE! DOes anyoen else think this is a horrible idea?! I knew we'd see Ultima again the moment that happened. ALTHOUGH, i missed some of the stuff you mentioned, and skipped the bit with 16 cuz i havent played it, but the idea that Ultima could start moving now that the Ascians are dealt with....perhaps rejoining shards....oh my. im very excited to see where things go!
11:08 Minor correction, but Ultima had created EIGHT mothercrystals in FFXVI - one for each Eikon. Before the events of the game, three had already been destroyed, with the giant crater on the coast being the site of one.
Considering the link between Auracite and space horrors like Ultima floating around the cosmos, it wouldn't surprise me if we found out that Ultima was a fairly small fish in a massive pond. And that there's creatures out there way more terrifying than her.
one of my biggest hopes for the XIV story in the near future is for the WoL and Scions to suffer a brutal and complete loss (or two), and this line of story would definitely facilitate that we’ve developed so much hubris and confidence, both as characters and players, that an astronomical reality check is (in my mind) the only way to keep the story interesting
So the thing is that while Ultima was summoned by a Zodiac Brave she's not actually a primal. She's actually an alien that was summoned from across the rift and a chunk of auracite came with her. Which is how auracite became the problem it did within the Ivalice raids. The first auracite we also were exposed to actually was the heart of sabik. We just didn't know it was auracite at the time.
It is, in fact, referred to as "auracite" in the original Japanese early on! Several of us on the LL team get really frustrated with things like this not making it to the English localization. - Arden
Acording to all sources of player feed back, the next villain will definitly be wil lamet, and it will be about her mind controling the DEVS (and the main character) into thinking she was a good character concept
That would be because the FFXIV story with Golbez and the First is not literally FFIV but a reflection of broad concepts from FFIV. FFXIV makes it explicitly clear through Omega that the 'real' worlds of games like FFIV exist far away across space and time. So you're right, that was Not-Golbez and Not-Zeromus.
Interesting theory. I think 2 other places to look for theories are ff5 and ff8. Both games have us going into the diminsional rift inbetween worlds to stop the villain of the game. With us now having a way between worlds with the key something could happen with that. We already know that the interdimensional rift exists in ff14 as thats where the Crystal Exarc planned on going after absorbing the holt either from the WoL. Ultima and Ultimicia do sound very similar too 🤔
I believe you are in the right track but with the wrong premises (The Key). Ultima is a being that has been mentioned from the Ivalice raid, the Pandæmonium trials, and that final trial connects Ultima to ARR events. They did the same with Omega since ARR and ended up being extremely important in the future, by using Omega in a raid, as part of Ultima Thule, and as a way to explain how G'raha traveled (the crystal tower + the ability of omega to travel the rift + the ability of alexander to travel through time) to The First, as explained during the Twinning dungeon. Obviously they are using Ultima in a similar way (the heart of Sabik, being older than the ancients, and its presence or influence in raids). We need to remember that the Lucavi can only exists if their auracite is in posession of someone who is a fitting vessel. All Lucavi need a vessel to exists, not only Ultima, as shown during some events in the Ivalice raids. All Lucavi need a vessel because during the times of the gods (which we fought and beat already in EW raids) they were condemned to that kind of existence, for betraying and rebeling the gods; and the vessel cannot be just annyone, but someone who's zodiak sign matches the one of such Lucavi. Maybe a similar story will be used here, in which the Lucavi were all enclosed in their respective auracites. We have seen Lucavi, but never understood exactly how they were summoned (or transformed). Also, we do not fight all the Lucavi in FFXIV, so I am sure Ultima will be shown and mentioned in the future, but probably not in this expansion, but has a 10 years story (or less years, or more, who knows) that we will see developed in the future. Finally, for the way in which Ultima and the Lucavi exists, they cannot be truly destroyed, to my understanding, just sealed and kept away so they cannot resonate with a nice vessel. Come to think of it, Zodiark is the name of Ophiucus sign's Lucavi. Maybe Ultima led to the creation of Zodiark by infecting the mind and soul of Athena and subsequently, Lahabrea as we know.
I'm currently playing through a long overdue game that I have never finished before that takes place in Ivalice(and predates FFXII and Tactics games) Vagrant Story... I have not yet determined if there's a link between this "Blood Angel" and the "Blood Sin" in Vagrant Story, but I'm currently investigating it.
I do wonder what other Ancient was tinkering with space rocks prior to the Sundering. As the stone looks processed and has some Ancient motifs on it. This is most likely how Alexandria found it. You could say it's Azem, since their sigil show on the key. But Azems weren't really known for their research. For all we know the Auracite holds way more than just Azem's magic, it's just that the key the Alexandrians built only taps into that spell. It feels like we wouldn't really need another copy of Azem's signature magic, as our sigil, granted by Emet, already has dimensional powers. It always felt like we'd eventually use that to traverse dimensions. Why give us another fragment of Azem to serve that purpose?
My little fan theory is that Ultima or what ever race Ultima is from manipulated Meition and her sisters in seeing only the darkest side of the universe. Potentially for dynamis to be used to consume enough aether so Ultima and her kind can either take over of reshape the whole universe as they like. Now that plan failed they will want to finish the job themselves.
pretty much what me and my circle like to theorize from time to time. my only point of contention is stating a time period ivalice stuff takes place in. because the story has made it very clear its ambiguous when ivalice happens. it could happen in 2 separate time periods due to hydaelyn sealing Ultima away. it could be within the same time period. We know the allagans obtained High Seraph Auracite and is how they began the trigger weapon project. until they ran out of her auracite and swapped to Eureka to create the weapons for them. Given how the story also acts she may be extra dimensional entity. As she is said to hail from a higher plane of existence. In Ogre Battle the Summon Darkness incantation "Denizens of the Abyss, from ink of blackest night I summon you! Darkness to me!" the Abyss in question is a very real thing. Necromancers perform the incantation to summon forth the undead and demons from this plane of existence. The Abyss/Underworld is the domain of Ashmedai the god of darkness. the Abyss can be physically accessed via Chaos Gates which were spread throughout the world of ogre battle, but can only be opened with the holy sword brynhildr via a ritual. mortals who travel there can obtain a Fruit from a tree that will transform them into a Ogre (Demon). To loop this back to 14, perhaps the Abyss will end up being a thing here too. The dimension of which the high seraph hails from. Out of the lucavi from tactics we are missing Zalera the Death Seraph. Its been sort of my wish that perhaps the next time we encounter a Seraph it will be Zalera who will be equally powerful to Ultima. while not part of this train of thought but connected. Another idea separate from my own speculation is that what if Ultima the High Seraph coming to this world did so in a similar manner to voidsent, where she only sent her soul and it took on a vessel. Thus after defeating her, her soul returned to her dimension to her body.
As cool as this alĺ is we can not ignore the fact that upon the keys acrivation appeared Azems symbol. I believe firmly that this item belonged to our complete form (azem) and was used as a device for long distance travel.
Throughout the game they have called Azem the traveler. What if Azem is not just the traveler of space but also of time. Time travel usually makes the story confusing but at the same time there would be almost no creative limit to where they could take the story if that was true.
I like this theory. It doesnt even have to be ultima herself though. It could be a being of the same rzce as whatever ultima is coming in... Like jenova!
It may still explicitly be Azem spellcraft that defines the key, even if Ultima's auracite is one of the primary components. Maybe the "glass" even restrains the negative influences of the Auracite. I'd think that if Azem, as someone who was sundered, found a material that could allow them to bridge the worlds, they would try to make something useful and good out of it, despite of its questionable origins. Granted, the theories around the key mostly hint at the relic having been made before the Sundering, not after, so this doesn't hold up too well.
Interesting theories we shall see. I don't know if Ultima will be involved... Seems the creator of the whole Ivalice/Bozja series left on not great terms. I agree though that the future of the story will involve other shards. Sphene's shard I highly believe is not the shard Emet was saying we'd be fascinated by. I think somehow Alexandria slipped out of their hands unnoticed because I can't believe the ascians would want or allow all souls from a rejoined shard to not get back to the source, it totally undermines what they were trying to do. In fact I think they'd be really unhappy how they use souls as a fossil fuel. -- I think the next crisis will involve cross shard travel. They've already set the stage in motion for a restoration of the 13th. Even with Hydealyn and Zodiark gone I think the need for balance is still going to somehow be a factor and right now the source is on the edge of losing balance.(Which obviously will be devastating to the source going by the possible 8th calamity in ShadBring.) Emet implied something is going on in Merycidia and that could be a catalyst for another rejoining which then would make restoring the 13th a lot more important. Going by what went on in Merycidia its guaranteed the barrier between the source and the great expanse is probably very thin. The fact they brought Rayne and especially Gaia back for voice lines says they dont want us forgetting about them.
Crystal Tower wasn't mandatory for a long time! :) So, there is a chance for things to become mandatory later. Hell, they almost made Eden mandatory during SHB but they decided against it. - Arden
I feel like the reason Auracite is in Ivalice is because…that’s where Auracite is most prominent in FF history. FF12 and Tactics have Auracite playing a big part in their stories. Of course, that’s not to say it can’t be more important, like other reference pieces in the game.
Let me cook: Ivalice would NOT need to be mandatory, IF the devs explicitly spell out that the Ultima we encounter in the Orbonne Monastery was purely a Primal manifested through prayer, and that the True Ultima is still out there. "So why didn't Ultima-?" Think about it from Ultima's perspective. You're probably powerful enough to solo the entire Convocation, Zodiark AND Hydaelyn. Their goals align with your insofar as Rejoinings also make you stronger. You'd absolutely keep your head down and let the Ascians cook. Now, if some little upstart was able to obliterate a Primal version of you, then start kicking the crap out of the Ascians one by one, travel back in time purely for some tips to permanently avert the Second Final Days (the thing that forced the Sundering which shattered your power), then travel back in time AGAIN to pick fights with the Ancients' menagerie of "Creatures we should probably obliterate", THEN go back to the present and personally Take Care of the very Ancient you originally corrupted. Yeah, at this point, you'd probably be like "Okay, the Ascians are either dead because of, or besties with this upstart, that Ancient I corrupted is also turbo-dead despite having a chunk of my auracite from the peak of my power, this upstart is a clear problem, I should get to work on my plans now".
Interesting theory, I do like how it draws from hanging threads we already have. So by your prediction, in terms of scale, would you guess ultima is the post DT villain, the next expansion villain, or the multi expansion story arc villain?
Ultima in her original form as the lore knows her is an embodiment of Ruin that is a bit Eldritch in the sense that I don't believe it really has motivations that are relatable to mortals. I could see them rewriting her/it in whatever direction they like, as the Ultima we already fought was based on the fears and prayers of people who tried to make sense of something they didn't understand. But if she stays an incomprehensible Eldritch being, while making for a compelling threat, she does not make for a good multi expansion story arc villain, to be fair. She'd be an unfitting center of coalescing events. It'd have to be someone else - maybe a worshipper of hers, or someone who wants to stop her but is willing to pay a terrible price for stopping her that we as the WoL do not agree with.
Thanks for watching, y'all, we hope you enjoyed the video!
If you enjoyed this one, you should check out our video on Alexandria and the ongoing debate of where it came from, and how: th-cam.com/video/aLb0W1Kr5q0/w-d-xo.html
(The LL Team does not agree on one specific theory for this one, either.)
If you want to discuss or debate any of our points more, feel free to join our Discord and poke us there.
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We love chatting with you all and encourage healthy debate.
- LL Team
This is a great theory! If it’s true, I wonder if Ultima will be the main baddie or if there will be something else too. The Allagans have always been in the backgroud with no real payoff to this point. Will this be the arc that delivers?
So! I have a theory that Azem made this key, that's why their seal is on it and it reacted to our presence and use of Azem's magic. We know from Elpis that Venat was Azem's friend, mentor and teacher, as well as the previous Azem. We know from ShB that Venat attempted to recruit Azem to her side when her faction was planning to create a Primal to rival Zodiark, and that Azem turned her down just as flat as they did the Convocation, striking out on their own. My theory is that before Azem made that decision, Venat took them into her confidence and told them what WE told HER in Elpis. Azem could not sign off on what the Convocation planned to do, but neither could they fathom or agree to Venat's horrific plan. So they set out in hopes to create a way to undo what Venat would cause, without the catastrophic loss of life that the Ascian's plans would bring. And sometime before the Sundering, they created a working prototype.
The question for me is how it SURVIVED, and how the Millala got a hold of it. Krile's parents mentioned that Preservation had done some work on it, which is where I expect the augmentation came from, but as to what the actual components are, I honestly agree with the auracite theory. It was created to hold a specific spell, that of dimensional fusion-- Azem's answer to the Rejoinings performed through Calamities. I NEED more Azem lore, dammit. I desperately want us to *remember something*. We are 9/14 after all.
@@saralovelace7219it clearly was a tool of Azem as it bears Azems icon on it and its easy to explain its creation as Azem knew of the plans to sunder the world it was likely Azem position as the traveler to create a device to Azems fragments could visit these new reflections and explore them and the key was likely left where Azem was sundered.
Thank you for the information. I've been wondering for a long while if Ultima was going to come back and I feel she is. To me it felt like there was so much more to Shadowbringers and "The Source" that was yet to be discovered. I have a strong feeling that if she is coming back, she coming back from that place. The events of edenverse and reintroducing the other types of aether along with new incarnations of the primal's from another star...
1:39 Actually, the first type of auracite we're introduced to is BLACK Auracite, which is what the Heart of Sabik is. Its name in Japanese is Black Auracite Sabik.
Its actually literally translated as "white stone black" hence the name of the p8s phase 2 song
Noir Auracite in French?
ah yes the big fat taco
@@coretinker I tend to hear, Sabik wants taco
@@UltaFlame Actually, false. 黒聖石サビク is not translated as white stone black. 黒 is black, 聖石 is a holy stone, サビク literally is katakana for Sabik (sabiku), which has no meaning in Japanese. It literally just means "black stone Sabik" or "black holy stone, Sabik". Which is much closer to Black Auracite Sabik, than white stone black.
XIV Playerbase: It's... It's Ultima?
XIV Devteam: Always has been...
Something that's missed in this synopsis is the Key's resonation with Azem's crystal(denoted by Azem's symbol appearing on top of the Key when the WoL summons their companion shades). This is poignant because MY theory is that the Key was created by Azem and recognizes the residual aetherial signature left by the crystal. MY belief is that there will be more Azem origin lore and that, potentially a grave threat sealed by Azem's use of the Key will become the main antagonist of this story arc.
this is what i have been thinking to an extent. I also believe that we may find that the former Azem had figured out how to leap between shards. I really would not be surprised if we find out they knew about the sundering before it happened. which would make the pre sundered version making the key something that would make sense. I think the key will also be used to allow us to "leap" to other shards.
@@0019khudsonit never occurred to me that Azem could've survived the sundering. Since the WoL and Ardbert were shards of Azem I thought they were confirmed to have been sundered. Unless I completely misunderstood that part of shadowbringers.
So! I have a theory that Azem made this key, that's why their seal is on it and it reacted to our presence and use of Azem's magic. We know from Elpis that Venat was Azem's friend, mentor and teacher, as well as the previous Azem. We know from ShB that Venat attempted to recruit Azem to her side when her faction was planning to create a Primal to rival Zodiark, and that Azem turned her down just as flat as they did the Convocation, striking out on their own. My theory is that before Azem made that decision, Venat took them into her confidence and told them what WE told HER in Elpis. Azem could not sign off on what the Convocation planned to do, but neither could they fathom or agree to Venat's horrific plan. So they set out in hopes to create a way to undo what Venat would cause, without the catastrophic loss of life that the Ascian's plans would bring. And sometime before the Sundering, they created a working prototype.
The question for me is how it SURVIVED, and how the Millala got a hold of it. Krile's parents mentioned that Preservation had done some work on it, which is where I expect the augmentation came from, but as to what the actual components are, I honestly agree with the auracite theory. It was created to hold a specific spell, that of dimensional fusion-- Azem's answer to the Rejoinings performed through Calamities. I NEED more Azem lore, dammit. I desperately want us to *remember something*. We are 9/14 after all.
@@katrinascarlet5637They are sundered, but given that we’ve been slowly seeing more shards like Ardbert as you’ve mentioned and Golbez, perhaps they’re setting up for more of them to appear.
@@katrinascarlet5637 maybe I didn’t say it well I think the key was made PRESUNDERING . Azem is split. She had to die in the sundering.
In the last Tales of the Dawn short story entry:
"Oh my, how careless of our Azem."
Thus spoke Hythlodaeus, having ambled into his office at the Bureau of the Architect to find a crystal sitting rather conspicuously on a chair reserved for guests. Slipped from a singularly adventurous pocket, no doubt. He marveled at the way the light played on its facets, like the surface of a tranquil lake, and recalled the first visitor he had received that morning.
Azem had sought the chief's assistance with the refinement of the fourteenth in his series of concepts to help ease the burdens of travel, which was contained within the palm-sized crystal. But as was so often the case, the conversation concerning the escapades that inspired said concept's creation had spiraled into a full-blown recounting, leaving Hythlodaeus insufficient time to evaluate it before Azem had to hasten to a meeting with the Convocation. Hythlodaeus was not without his own pressing obligations─the formal evaluation of a massive living-being concept, for one─and had only just returned to the bureau a moment before.
"And absent such comforts, how unbearable your wanderings will surely be," he mused aloud as he collected his friend's crystal."
Azem had been creating crystals to enable travel. There's no real indication of where this crystal ended up. Also the story is called: Days Gone By, and Days Yet to Come.
Given the complete glossing over of the resonance with Azem's soul crystal, I'm going to say this seems pretty unlikely. If we hone in on that resonance with the soul crystal in particular, we come to the much more common fan theory that ties The Key to the crystal creation of Azem noted in "Tales from the Dawn - Days Gone By, Days Yet to Come." Given Emet-Selch's teasing of the "Golden Cities of the New World," which we now know to in fact be Living Memory (presumably in one of the shards previously being prepared for a calamity yet to come) preceding his remark suggesting we visit the other shards, I find it much more likely that The Key will be more of a plot device to get us to said shards for further story expansion beyond the conflicts that have the potential to still exist on the Source at this point (beyond Meracydia, at least).
The problem I have with the tales from the dawn theory is that, that crystal is described as faceted, which doesn't line up with the helix shape of the crystal on the interior of the key we see. Right now several theories seem moderately plausible, but they all seem to have holes to me. We need more data! When is patch 7.1? November? It can't come soon enough!
Correction: The Crystal is not Azem's, it was made by Emet-Selch in secret in memorial of Azem-their dearest friend. It is not imbued with any of Azem's memories as Azem's seat was left vacant and they were branded a traitor, thus Hades created the crystal in secret without approval of his peers in the Convocation.
The crystal is imbued with an incantation of Azem's make, but was made, exclusively, by Hades. This heavily implies that Azem's crystal, which we know is nothing associated to Azem themself as their were, was likely made to mimic something that Azem used or had created. Seeing as how G'raha outright states that the Key and Azem's crystal employ the selfsame magic, we can pretty much assume, with confidence, that the Key is what Hades based the crystal's magicks upon.
It's not a soul crystal, far from it.
I am curious if at some point in this post-endwalker saga, the writers will eventually go down the line of making a major villain a reflection of Azem that's evil or some other twisted take on WoL. Zenos had a *little* bit of that going on but we could probably find a more in depth take on the idea. Maybe a version of WoL that shines a light on the negative side of *constantly* leaving those you connect with behind for the sake of new sights and experiences. Never getting properly attached to who or what you find. Maybe that's a bit of an amateurish "fan fiction" idea but I'd at least be curious to see where that idea could go.
I'm going to be highly surprised if they don't. I know that Ardbert and his band of merry companions were kinda sorta that, but I wanna see a true reflection of the WoL facing off their ultimate antagonist self.
@@sopranophantomista Yeah I wanna see a non-manipulated version of that. Make an evil WoL reflection that essentially has the vibe of the Dad that went out for milk and never came back but like...on a more existential scale lol. Someone who forsakes those around them for a straight up insatiable thirst for seeing new things.
They have been teasing us with this idea a lot. First Ardbert, Zenos, then Golbez. Atleast one could have thought of the correlation at the time of playing through their respective stories. I would be surprised as well if we dont meet a literal screwed up villain Azem later down the line at this point. Make the idea go somewhere and go full ham with it, I'd say!!
Fray Miste. The villain is going to be Fray Miste. They will finally finally have had enough of everyone's bullshit, oh and the DRK questline will be made mandatory too.
@@sopranophantomistaA Kuja to our Zidane, perhaps, coupled with an uncanny ability to summon exactly 7 other equally cynical and malicious allies
iirc, during the last media tour right before DT, one of the FF14 content creators asked Yoshi P for clues regarding DT and, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Yoshi P said to pay attention to one of the Alliance Raids and to the names of the seats of the Convocation and the only possible relevant Alliance Raids are either Ivalice or the Myths of the Realm, but then some people forget that one of the names of the Convocation is Altima, the patron of the arts, some people speculating that they're meant to be same word as Ultima but "Altima" was just an old mistranslation, so maybe Yoshi P's clue was indeed related to Ultima?
On the other hand, it's undeniable that Ultima and the Auracite are key in FF14 lore. To this day, I'm convinced that the reason Venat was present in Elpis that day "at the request of a friend", was because she was there at the request of Elidibus and she was meant to be the one helping him investigate what was going on in Pandaemonium, but because of the whole thing with the Final Days, it's possible that the whole deal with Ultima flew under her radar until way later.
Finally, on the last 7.0 trial, the Auracite in the Key reacted to us when we invoked Azem's power to summon our allies, and Azem's symbol shined on top of the key, something they showed at the start of the trial and then proceeded to never speak of it again, which is extremely suspicious, while at the same time, they showed to us other instances of the key being used but Azem's symbol didn't appeared, which makes the reaction the key made to Azem's power very specific and for a reason.
Some people might say that Ultima is just a side character meant to be side content stuff, but lets not forget that Ultima and the Auracite have been key figures not only in a raid and an alliance raid, but also the MSQ itself, so I want to see what CBU3 is cooking here, but you can be sure that there is a link between the key, Azem and the WoL, otherwise the key wouldn't have reacted in such a specific and particular way to Azem's magic.
Didn't they mention deep dungeons too as being relevant? Don't think they said which, but the theory fits with Palace of the Dead being relevant
@@kokiburiwallas1261 Also the later floors of Eureka Orthos... Those look right out of FF16. lol
@@kokiburiwallas1261 Just gonna point out that Nybeth Obdilord, the main villain of Palace of the Dead, is originally from Tactics Ogre.
upvote this, he did mention about paying attention to alliance raid going through DT
Unfortunately even if they do make it related to Ivalice the raids are not canon to the story until it becomes a requirement for MSQ, we see that with normal raids and all nd tthe crystal tower raids only became story canon due Shadowbringers
I think you are correct about Ultima showing up in the next few expansions though the "yet" posessed by Sphene displayed the Azem symbol on it as a reaction to us using the summoning crystal.
The key had been in the hands of the Lalafel for an unknown amount of time, passed down. The recreation/museum of the ancestral home of the Lalafel was a volcano and inside were walls lined with interesting looking masks.
A volcano that Hythlodaeus told an interesting anecdote about that is spelled out even more in a short story. I think that is an item created by, and belonging to, Azem that was left there and found ages later.
The real problem is, it would appear that Emet Selch knew about it. He specifically suggested learning about the "forrgotten people of the south sea isles" and the ascians clearly had influence on Alexandria. He basically guided us directly to the thing. Why would they have left an artifact that was capable, theoretically, of merging reflections without a calamity laying around?
I think two things:
Whatever capabilities of the Key is tied to Azem and Azem was ejected from the Convocation post-Zodiark, such that Emet had to make his Constellation Crystal in secret.
If the Key of Azem did have the power of Interdimensional Fusion, it wasn’t known at the time because…there was no need for fusing dimensions that didn’t exist pre-Sundering.
Post-Sundering, Azem’s power was also Sundered.
It’s a theme in modern Japanese storytelling that only the victor gets to dictate history. The only way Azem’s power could’ve been guaranteed to have is if “Azem” could defeat Emet-Selch. And if he did, then the Constellation Crystal should resonate with “Azem”, unlocking whatever secret powers/tech Azem was working on in their own time.
Ultima got a will of her own via prayer, the Ultima we got in Ivalice was the Ultima that invaded from space, but the lore makes it seem she was an unthinking husk before the aether from prayer interacted with her
We have another calamity from the sky that has her will mixed up with the will of her son. I expect Jenova to show up any moment now
I've been screaming "JENOVA!!!" and "LAVOS!!!" since ARR lmao and SHB just made it worse with that one Amaurotine Shade who is like
"It begins with a deep keening from beneath the earth..."
@@ArdenVT Lavos is Chrono Trigger...
@@ranos87 Oh yeah I know; I'm referencing a really old gaming/Square Enix/Square Soft theory that Jenova and Lavos were the same "type" (or species) of creature. I think the site it was originally posted on is down since I can't find it now, but you can still see results for the theory elsewhere.
Some people say the similarities are only because some of the same developers worked on both games, but it's a fun brainworm to explore. :)
@@ranos87 that does not mean it can't happen, its still a square enix IP
it's not death, it's a homecoming.
I've been trying to tell people this for years. I like how you put together a timeline of all of the events at the end, that was nicely done.
Glad I found this video. I recall not too long ago, I believe it was a reddit post where someone had drawn a pretty great fanart of The High Seraph and it sparked some few converstions in the comments. I had just beaten the Pandæmonium raids and I remember how at that moment it clicked for me that the version of Ultima we fought was a severly weakened shard of Ultima. Not only that, but with the callback to the heart of Sabik, which in that raid was revealed to be auracite, it was basically stated that a pre-sundered High Seraph and its pretty pebbles was a complete enigma to even the, by all rights, (in comparison to now) already nigh god-like Ancients. Not even mentioning the assumingly full use of the heart enabled Athena to create her constructs and ascend into godhood, which in turn was likely just a fragment of Ultima's powers. Scary stuff.
Although obviously I can't be sure whether that hits the nail on the head, I'm not as versed in the lore as I'd like to be and I'm not even sure what half the comment section is referencing, all I know is that it would probably be really awsome to fight that thing.
Also, now that I had a moment to think, I noticed a really interesting visual detail about the High Seraph that could potentially elude to to its nature. For the better part of the Ivalice raid, we never see a glimpse of Ultima and when we finally encounter it, even then it is still partially trapped in its auracite prison. We see an otherworldly, but still somewhat ethereal and angelic being, possessed of an eerie beauty, alluding to some divine origin. It is only when the High Seraph shatters its shackles we see the truth.
The prison breaks away, revealing what was previously hidden, a twisted and grotesque underbelly of disjoined flesh, limbs and faces, a visage entirely unthinkable to be native to Etheris.
The High Seraph is the visage that it present to act as a God to mortals, to lure and corrupt, but the truth that lies beneath, the truth that is Ultima, is something far, far more eldritch and horryfying.
@@nephilima3956 Your comment/reply reminded me of Anima from the Endwalker dungeon. I had to go check the wikis to see if there was any connection because I was starting to cook lol.
Really great video. There was a post about a month ago from U/Kaellian on ff14 reddit which speculates the same. I'll add a few things from the discussion which I think support your theory.
"Although we know not the precise timing of the High Seraph's visit to this star, we do know that Athena somehow came into possession of a mysterious crystal said to be the source of the destructive magic known as Ultima. According to Lahabrea, it was Athena who gave this crystal the name of “auracite,” and from her tireless research was born the Heart of Sabik." That comes from the Pandaemonium raid series, explaining the origin of Auracite. Claudien speculates the same thing.
The Tomestones of Aesthetics fit with the convocation seat of Altima, whose glyph resembles the High Seraph. I'm reminded of Jessie Cox's interview with Yoshi P, where Yoshi says something like: "Be familiar with your convocation names."
Altima's constellation crystal reads: "I feel my soul turning. Slowly but irrevocably. And the power I wield begins to seem terrible...But this is right. It is right." Totally different vibe to the rest of the crystals which refer to their parts in the final days. Because of the way convocation seats are inherited, I get the feeling that Ultima might have played a much larger role in the formation of Ancient society than originally thought.
There's the reference to Academia Anynder we get in the Ok'hanu zone. Specifically referring to Quetzalcoatl, which was a being made by Lahabrea. I forget where it's mentioned, but there's text about "Lahabrea's one, true god," which is def not Zodiark. When we fight him in ARR, he does the Ultima spiel: "And from the deepest pit of the seven hells to the very pinnacle of the heavens, the world shall tremble," which Athena/High Seraph says. (edit, forgot to mention that Anynder was a facility maintained by Lahabrea)
The last (admittedly loose) piece of support I have would be that two of the writers working on DT worked on Ivalice and Pandaemonium.
This is an extremely great video!!! I'm so glad this came onto my recommended. I have truly been thinking as well that It's pretty much time for a FF7-themed expansion, with sephiroth and JENOVA as key villains for an expansion with alien and body horror themed villains, which can hopefully lead onto ultima thereafter. Thanks again!
I can't see them pulling out Sephiroth on us, ever. He's too ingrained as the Most Powerful and Only Cloud Can Defeat him. Jenova or something similar to her would be interesting though. Part of her race that's also travelling the stars maybe.
Jenova would be a great boss for Meracydia, what with Sephirot(no h!) being from there...
please, that would be such an amazing concept
One could dream I thought the tropical expansion would of been FFx related but naw shoehorn ff9 into it instead
@@kooriicolada I could see Ultima maybe being a member of the same race, who is stronger than Jenova but shares many of her characteristics/serves a similar plot role
If the original Ultima can create Auracite that can open portals between shards, wouldn't it be easier to assume that she wants to rejoin her counterparts directly instead of rejoining the worlds?
From what I know is that Ultima is not from the source or any of the shards effident to what went down in pandemonium, Ultima is a Alien being from beyond any of the worlds
As much as I like Ultima and the lore surrounding her, I'm like 90% sure she's been relegated to mostly side content unfortunately. But, should she ever make an appearance in the msq, I will be very pleasantly surprised!
She's been mentioned far too many times at this point, she's absolutely going to become a problem, it's just a matter of when.
Crystal Tower Raids was considered side content for a while until ShB made it main.
Gaia appears in the MSQ if you did the Eden Raids
All side story is main story. It's just if you want to know what the builder in the back of the house is doing while you're working on the front of the house.
I think so too, but at the same time it'd be so much wasted potential.
Honestly I hope they'll just FORCE players to do Alliance Raids and Normal Raids at this point. It was a horrible idea to bind Ryne to Gaia, as much as I love her, but at this point it means that Ryne can never ever go to the Source and become a new established member of our friend group. EVERYONE loves her and it'd be such a big win for the writing and development of all Scion friends to have her join for good. But can't, because Gaia would be alone and she's optional.
Same with Ultima, they now have to write around her being in the raid.
Why not just make them not optional?! It doesn't take long to unlock this stuff, you can breeze through both in a day. Jesus Square Enix
An interestin theory. While I remain unconviced that we have not defeated Ultima, I say this only because I believe Ultima to be a creation of the Heart of Sabik. Whatever the Heart of Sabik actualy is, it VERY clearly allows anyone who understands it well enough (or possibly is corrupted by it) the ability to cast Ultima. As far as I remember, every instance of the spell Ultima is connected to the Heart of Sabik in some manner and I have a suspicion (though I cannot prove this in any meaningful way) that the Heart of Sabik is a tool of "something or someone" to facilitate the corruption and destruction of highly advanced civilizations. Possibly for the reason of neutralizing potential threats to itself. When cast as the straight up original spell, as far as I can recall, it is always accompanied by the same string of words: "From the deepest pit of the seven hells to the very pinnacle of the heavens, the world shall tremble!". While there is slight variation this appears to be the "core incantation".
The Heart of Sabik has its own "theme song", it has multiple variations on said theme song and every single time the heart comes up, it is always accompanied by a theme of corruption, power and excess, and the ways in which said corruption destroys whatever is being built upon its power. If Meteion had not caused the final days, it was very likely that Athena would have caused an entirely different (but equaly destructive) disaster by attempting to reach godhood with the aid of the Heart, arquably having been driven mad by it. Lahabrea was supposed to be an original unsundered, but had been, again, driven mad by the Heart of Sabik. The entire Ivalice raid questline includes multiple people who are driven mad by auracite connected to the Heart of Sabik. The "Weapon" questline sees a group of promising young students and former wards of Gaius Baelsar again, go mad and sacrifice themselves and their very beings fighting a cause for the very man trying to stop them. One going so far as to fuse INTO Gaius and STILL not recognize the madness they have wrought.
Whatever the Heart of Sabik is, it has the power to corrupt, twist and bend peoples minds to utter powerhungry madness, and I am firmly of the belief that leaving it in Claudiens hands is a mistake that will come to bite us later.
But the POINT I am trying to make here is that Ultima is not the problem. Ultima is not the big bad. The Heart of Sabik is. The Heart of Sabik is not a creation of Ultima, Ultima is a creation or manifestation OF the Heart of Sabik.
While I have no solid proof to offer as I believe the writing team has not settled on what exactly they want to do with the heart (and it is possibly their "in case of massive writing block OR fuckup, pull lever" option), it is one of those major overarching plotpoints that will come up later, and is very probably the next "big bad" and quite possibly a continuing big bad as there is very much an... eldritch vibe to it. It may very well be that the Heart has no "will" in the traditional sense and is moreso a manifestation of something eldritch and unknowable. It does not seek to corrupt everything it touches, it simply does so because it is the very essence and nature of The Heart of Sabik. And if you need a writing prompt, a mcguffin that promises power and corrupts those that listen to its sweet sweet swansong is about as solid a foundation as you can get. And the writing team is very much familiar with this trope, looking at you Eyes of Nidhogg.
Athena was not the last time we will hear the words: From the deepest pit of the seven hells to the very pinnacle of the heavens, the world shall TREMBLE!!!
Excuse you. The proper spelling is...
TREMBOOOOOOOOOOOOL 😂
"I believe the writing team has still not settled on what they want to do"
Totally how I feel. No idea if this is true, but for 90% of all lore & theorycraft discussions, this **feels** like the most true thing on the planet. Especially after the reveal that they are really only writing content an expansion or two out at any one moment. Pretty much means that they didn't know where they were going with this back when we were fighting Ultima.
A cynical part of me just imagines the writers getting video links or synopsis info on what the fans are thinking and every-now-and-then they are just like "oh that one is a good idea, put it on the idea board." I'm not knocking it either, I think it would be pretty funny. Definitely a benefit to writing such a slow-burn story when you are allowed to be vague about so much.
Interesting, but there's a couple potential snags. First, the implication is that the "primal" Ultima IS the true Ultima. In the encyclopedia text you show, it mentions how the reference and fear of the people turned her into a "living Primal." That is, similar to Elidibus' Warrior of Light or Louisoix as the Phoenix, she became an entity like a primal, instead of giving rise to a separate entity. In that case, there's nothing left to act as the big bad, since we slew her already.
Second, this still doesn't explain the connection to Azem - but something else does. In one of the Tales of the Dawn shorts, Hythlodaeus sees Azem off, only to discover a concept crystal they left behind - one of a "series of fourteen" concepts they developed to aid in travel. This seems like a throwaway concept to allow Hythlodaeus to go after Azem and interact with other characters (including a post-Pandaemonium Elidibus, Hermes/Fandaniel, Mitron, Logrif, and Emet-Selch, and witnessing the aftermath of a discussion between Lahabrea and Igeyorhm), but the short stories have been used to hint at plot points later on. And, the crystal itself resembles an aetheryte more than auracite - it looks like the same silhouette that an Ancient Aetheryte might have. This also would explain how prayer and wishes could trigger it - the Ondo we fight on the way to Anyder used shards of concept crystals from that place to cast spells in much the same way.
But Ultima isn't a primal. She was described as an otherwordly entity, just like Omega. Ultima's will or concious is sealed in the heart of Sabik, aka Ultima's Auracite. The way the Auracite works is that basically it needs a living vessel to physically manifest themselves. This is why the Bangaa warrior we see in Ridorana, transform into Yiazmat.
A primal is a being that especifically comes out of nowhwere by absorbing a huge amount of aether from the surroundings and given form by prayers.
@@Yokai_Yuri Shiva? Ga Bu Titan? Tsukuyomi? Hyadelyn and Zodiark? Many instances of Primals coming into being from living people too, with them being the primary catalysts, fueled either by crystals or prayers or emotions or sacred objects, whatever it needs to
@@Koopser but all of those remained when the primal was defeated and dissipated
Yes! I’m very interested in how The Key and Azem are related, the fact that their symbol lit up when we summoned our party in the Interphos raises a lot of questions. Functionally, they operate similarly through prayer, our Crystal uses prayers to summon other champions beyond the rift and this key somehow uses those prayers for inter-dimensional travel. I’m curious if this an Azem relic or actually auracite.
I could see Ultima getting around this. Even if the one we defeated in the Ivalice raid was actually Ultima, it could have been as what was mentioned in the video and it was only one shard of her that we fought. We don't know from where the key Sphene used actually comes from for sure. We know it came to be in the possession of the Aloalo island natives but given its ability for Rift travel it could have originated in any of the Reflections or perhaps it even predates the sundering. In any case I'm hoping that's a focus in Dawntrail's patch content considering the Key is the last thing we see after everything is resolved in the MSQ.
The only problem with Ultima being the next villain is that they might need to make Ivalice Raids and Pandemonium required? Like what they did with Crystal Tower. Otherwise, its a lot to explain for people who stuck with the MSQ only.
They probably going to have to make SHB role quests, warring triad questline and Eden questline obligatory with what they have shown in the 6.X storyline. if you had those quests, you get lots of special dialogue and references that those 3 questlines will collide with the MSQ, specially because one of those characters appear in the MSq if you cleared a certain questline and other will have dialogue about that. So whats ivalice to add to the pile? hahahaha
Ivalice wouldn't be too big of an ask as you already need that to unlock bozja. Which if you havent unlocked bozja...go do that. It's basically season of discovery and is a great xp farm 70-90 and will help prepare folks for shades triangle in 7.2? I think
That doesn't seem like a problem at all, really. They did it with the Crystal Tower, I don't see why they couldn't do it again.
@@martimlopes9944 They should have made every thing connected to Unulkalhai and the elezen women I am forgetting the name of mandatory after we went to the void honestly.
God I hope they will at some point. The Alliance Raids and Normal raids being optional and potentially causing story issues is absolutely horrible. Like, they can never let Ryne go to the Source and join us as a companion even though EVERYONE and their mom loves Ryne. She'd bring some fresh wind into your friend group and give most of the Scions someone new to interact and develop with. But she literally can't do anything besides appearing for a minute as a side character because of Gaia and the optional raids. that just sucks.
Same with other raids, like, the god thing is so damn important, yet treated like an optional side piece as irrelevant as the fisher job quest
What would be a bad reason to do this? "Oh no, now they force me to play this amazing god tier raid and have fun for 20 minutes"? Crystal Tower being a requirement was much worse because it's boring and bad nowadays. That way they could even fix the "Crystal Tower daily" thing because then everyone would unlock Ivalice.
Let Ryne and Gaia live in the Source and join us for good ffs, give us some beloved characters that stay instead of more Wuk Lamat snoozefest
In FFTactics, Alma possessed by the High Seraph was named Altima in the english version. There was an Ascien named Altima that remains unused as far as I can recall. She appeared during the 13 Asciens' meeting in ARR cutscene but not again since. She certainly didn't appear during the Ivalice raid series like I was expecting.
There's a lot to unpack here, and a really good listen! It brings forward so many potential directions we can go in from here on in, and there's a lot riding on the fact that Ultima could very well be linked into it; be it via the patches or in an upcoming expansion. I guess my main gripe is that if it is for an expansion's MSQ, that would mean we'd likely need Ivalice and Pandaemonium to become required, given the importance of it all. Whatever capacity Ultima re-appears in, it'll be a blast to see what happens next. Keep up the fantastic work XD
It was a key that Azem was working on for interdimensional travel. if you read the stories on the website.
We can't be definitive about that, the description is breif, but doesn't really line up with a helix shape like we see in game. Lots of possible hints, not enough information to be sure of any one theory.
Interesting theory, but this probably isn't it. Putting aside the fact that Ultima is more than likely relegated to side content and raid series with how the game lore has been written, you have to keep a simple fact in mind. None of the other games have or will have happened in FFXIV. Just like the shards are reflections of the source, different yet familiar, so too is XIV content referencing other games simply reflections of the other games. Different, yet familiar. Also heavily glossing over the history of the key and what it suggests in how it's tied to Azem.
The key is likely an artifact carried by Azem as they were off saving that volcanic island the convocation was unwilling to help. Whether it was part of their solution or a byproduct of it, only the power of Azem has been shown to be able to easily open clean rifts as the relic does, as we do every time we use our Duty Finder power. The island that was saved became the South Sea Isles after the sundering and the people there the precursors to the Lalafel tribe that inhabited those islands, who escaped the Source to flee the calamity of ice using the key. That's why we see the volcano in living memory when even the people who supplied the lore for that section could hardly remember why there was a volcano in the first place.
I believe the upcoming threats are hinted to us by both the key and by Emet-Selch's parting words to us. Likely, the places pointed out are one of two types, a place where the machinations of the remaining or fallen asciens are still at work, providing the groundwork for yet another calamity, or irons Azem left in the fire that are too dangerous to be left alone.
I wouldn't discount the possibility. Graha for the longest was "side content" and look what happened. They aren't afraid to use raid series as a plot point. I personally don't think Ultima will be involved but I do think it's highly likely we will see Pandemonium and to a lesser extent Edenverse wound into the story. Pandemonium dropped a lot of implications and we repeatedly go back to the first now and again so the writers obviously want us to not forget Ryne and Gaia. Specially since they brought them back to voice their lines.
I think cross shards will be a focus going forward. Reality is all thats left of Eitherys that is a big land mass is Merycidia (which Emet mentioned). Given what we know about it and what happened there it doesn't seem like its a very hospitable place but it would be a great stage for shard travel I would imagine due to what went down there, the "veil" is probably very thin there due to what went down.
I hope this isn't the case as cleaning up old ascian cults and stuff would just be so boring. Also, on top of the obvious answer of the Crystal Tower later becoming very important, the Omega raid series also plays a big role in the MSQ in EW. Big quest lines like raid series stuff just doesn't seem to ever be relegated to side content imo.
@@aSmolGothwhat about that ascian that Ystola was chasing (she mentioned him during the Alexander raids)
I really like the background music. It really sets the mood well
I don't think she'll be the next big baddie but she's a coming. I wouldn't doubt we see Necron going along with the FF9 theme just pop up out of nowhere without explanation. Maybe even some more lore around Mach and Nym through Ozma.
Considering the Unlost World has it's own Moon, there is a fragment of Zodiark's power lying Dormant there, and Necron may manifest from that.
Remember, Meteion was introduced during the middle of EW. The reinterpretation of the Mothercrystal was also done around the same time.
So yeah, for your arguement probably. But I think it's gonna be something new. Related, but new.
Also, we haven't met all the sundered Ascians yet. And with Gaia and Fandaniel existing , prolly something gonna happen along those lines.
I hated the introduction of Meteion and her being the source of the end of days.
I really thought it'd be a power somewhere from the cosmos but no it's a creation that got all emotional
fandango is dead. and Gaia is on the first. others remaing halmarut, deudaplon, altima and pashtarot. and maybe emmeroloth considering she could be easily re-arised to the seat.
what if the unemployed ascian is the mysterious president of the newest raid?
@@LemonedIScream13 i hope so actually or the story teller! The story teller definitely has Altima vibes since he is the "creative" one. Could be an ascian reincarnated like Gaia.
dope video, and I love the ominous lurking music setting up the threat below us
This is an interesting theory, but there is a minor issue as you hit your Speculation at the end. As we know about Zodiark from the EW patch story, the body of Zodiark dispersed into aether on each of the reflections' moons (allowing Golbez to use it for his master plan). Granted, one major difference here is that Ultima, primal or otherwise, does not rely on an ancient like Elidibus to be their heart, but the point remains. If Ultima's main body on the Source is gone, then all that remains of Ultima in the shards would be their aether.
Now, if some new villain came along from a reflection and took that aether, the question would then remain as to whether or not this new villain might seek a means, such as the otherworldly auricite, to cross into other reflections to devour the remains of Ultima's aether. That could be interesting in the right hands, in terms of writing ability. But only time will tell.
I think we need a villain arc, that would be cool and I know it doesn't really make sense but it could be like a fragment of Azem like you.
I agree with you. Auracite has been positioned too perfectly not to play a massive role in the future (especially after the events of Pandaemonium). We even have 2 factions of it. Black Auracite which incites obsession (Athena and the contramemoria and personally I believe it influenced the ancients, ascians and even Metion as well) and White Auracite capable of holding gigantic amounts of aether and using it to transform reality (Weapon Series, Ascian deaths, and Ivalice).
I think Azem is involved in the creation of the key and his use of white Auracite tells us what faction we will be joining in the multiversal war. However, before we are ready to do that I suspect we will encounter another rejoined Azem (the leader of Preservation, whose pursuit of fusion was a means to rejoin himself with others to gain power) and we will have some sort of final showdown with them. We will win and be sad because the other rejoined Azem was sympathetic in some way but in the end on being defeated he will rejoin with us, making us, and Aetherys, finally whole and ready to confront the multidimensional threat beyond our universe.
The fact Cosmic Exploration is some easy going side content tells me there’s nothing more of concern in our universe. People were mad their Wols weren’t more active in DT but to me it just didn’t make sense to use me more because the stakes were so low, you know? We are universe saving heroes now, planet saving is what our little Scion buddies do now when we aren’t around. So the only next step that makes sense is to prep us for a greater war. Down the line they can depower us and start again (maybe winning the multiversal war changes everything) but for now it seems we are still headed higher before we come back down.
My dude you must be Yoshi P. That's a nice cooked theory 👩🍳
This is EXCELLENT lore and a video. I've said it before, but the conversation about the DT MSQ is vastly more interesting than the MSQ itself. Hopefully FF14 DOES NOT rely heavily are references to other Final Fantasies, and finds a voice of its own. It should be the case that FF14 story stands alone and on its own merits for those that don't get the references (I maintain that the problem with the 2nd half of DT MSQ is that they didnt bother making an effort for players to have an emotional connection to the story because FF9 nostalgia reference will do it for them, so only the overly emotional (e.g. 'this part broke me!', we meet that NPC... 77 minutes ago! Oh the pain!) felt anything.
I'm convinced the 13th's Auracite is the same as Ultima's - the original Ultima predates the Sundering, after all.
I think so as well! The mention of auracite-like stone in the 13th was the point where I became convinced that they ultimately still want to tell a big story about auracite and probably Ultima as well
this was a really cool video and i really liked hearing all the lore surrounding ultima but i think its more likely that we will be going up again Preservation, discovering their motivations and goals, as well as the connections between the Key and Azem.
Some speculation but I think those that formed Preservation are worshippers of Ultima. Their primary goal was researching inter dimensional fusion. Unlike the Ascians who wanted to rejoin the worlds they we're just looking for away to bring a piece of their shard to the source. They programmed Sphene in a way that eventually lead to Alexandria (and maybe a shard of Ultima) to the source. If the really cared about preserving Alexandrian's memories I find it odd that they didn't try to stop us at all from shutting down LM. You would think some Preservation members would of been present to prevent that very thing, but they are not there. Their primary goal was achieved and they may have found a way to another shard to do the same. One other note on Ulitma's influence on another shard. I may be mistaken, but I could of sworn I remember one of the Warriors of Darkness state "from the deepest pit of hell to the very pinnacle of the heavens" (they did not actually say Unleash Ultima) I watched some post HW cutscenes but couldn't find it so I may be misremembering. If someone could help jog my memory on characters (besides laha and athena) that say it
Preservation definitely has huge main villain syndicate vibes for the new saga, along with Ultima. I also think they are connected to the high Seraph Ultima. Their missing presence in DT (so far as of this post) is quite striking indeed. Perhaps they will appear in the patches or down the road on another shard even where they mainly operate. So far "Azems Key" and the impact of the stones (Auracite) still remain a large mystery, especially the later still to this day. I am suspecting they share a huge connection.
I was kinda thinking about the potential future MSQ prior to this video because somebody mentioned somewhere (probably Reddit) that they feel like there is going to be something really catastrophic happening soon. So I've been kinda thinking about this whilst not knowing much past 6.0 (yeah I kinda spoiled myself but it'll take forever to get back to 6.0 because I restarted on an alt).
My general thought was that were going to get separated from the Scions somehow whether that is getting sent to another shard or possibly even dying and getting "isekai'd" to another shard somehow. (the other shards might have their own Aetherial Sea but idk if there is proof of that, plus something like Ultima coming out and killing us would be one hell of a way to show how dangerous they are)
Then at some point Y'shtola would figure out how to travel between worlds and we'd get re-united. It's entirely possible that is what the key is for since Azem's magic "summons" people and G'raha kinda does this also. Although he required the Crystal Tower and alt-hist Biggs and Wedge to travel between shards but didnt need it to summon "Champions from Beyond the Rift". This kinda implies that a great deal of stored power or really efficient magic usage is needed to travel yourself between worlds and would kinda explain why we can do it but no one else can. They simply dont have efficient enough magic like Azem's magic. I wouldnt be surprised if we get a scene of Y'shtola inspecting the key or something in 7.2 if we havent already gotten that.
Yeah, it’s the shareholders
But if the key is auracite, why was the symbol of azam appeared on the key during the fight with Enernal Queen?
Plot twist : Azem *is* Ultima *tadadaaaam*
Azem inserted a piece of auracite to empower it...or to store enough aether to power it. The symbol appears because it's reacting to the summoning incantation.
I don't believe it is auracite, myself. Mostly because we've been told over and over everything related to that plotline has been solved and this is a new story. But....DT story was pretty bad so maybe they'll draw from something more familiar for the patches.
I think Emet marked it. Firstly the mark shows up on the casing of the artifact, which is Electrope and would have been added by Preservation to help harness it (big shook Preservation was probably an Ascian plot), and secondly the mark only showed up as if reacting to our Azem crystal, which we know Emet made. It's not unheard of either; players found an Azem symbol in Alzadaal's Legacy, so my guess is Emet simply marked a bunch of stuff as a sign we're following the path he out right told us to follow.
The alternative is "Azem knew the future and planned everything", which granted has some basis from the start of the Pandemonium raids, but still seems really farfetched IMHO. Personally I'm of the opinion that the Unsundered World had a some mysteries (like Ultima which is outright confirmed at this point) that Azem was investigating, and Emet tried picking up the breadcrumbs and has now passed that torch onto us. I don't think Ultima will be next big bad though, personally I'm throwing my hat in with Enuo given Dawntrail actually ended up giving a fair few Final Fantasy V vibes, and I'd like to see such an obsucre character get some love.
I agree with the thesis of this video. The reality is leaving the Heart of Sabik with Claudien is effectively a bookmark in the ongoing story that will be addressed in the future. Ultima will come back maybe when they let us go to Dalmasca.
As a big fan of FF12 and Tactics i'm eating very good with this video :D
I’m glad others are taking up the lore lord mantle
Been weird without ethysasher
Yes, I have been thinking of this ever since I stepped foot in Tural. There is one curious substance there that acts extremely similar to auracite - electrope.
And here's the curious thing about electrope. It clearly exists on the Source AND the shard of Living Memory and Alexandria. And in Tural, it is said that it was the giants who mined the cenotes dry of it - the cenotes formed by the great meteor shower of ages past. Therefore, electrope was in the land's soil before the Sundering, which in turn would make it a very likely source for the Heart of Sabik that Athena found in a "faraway land", if I'm not mistaken of the turn of phrase used. The area, of course, is inspired by the Yucatan peninsula and the underlying meteor crater, believed to be the one that ended the reign of dinosaurs 65 million years ago. Hence, it would be no reach to believe that they will lean into that inspiration even further - as Final Fantasy is ever about even more ancient evils awakening, who may or may not be called "Ultima".
We already see what electrope allows a regular person to do, evidenced with Wicked Thunder and especially in her Savage version, where she surrenders herself to the electrope entirely. While Savage versions are not necessarily canon, they still take the concept and just explore it further - like with Savage Athena full on gaining Ultima's theme and twisted tentacles, the Savage version of Gaia pushing into her as the Oracle of Darkness with the might of an Ascian, Savage Omega leaning further into trying to comprehend the true potential form of the Warrior of Light and so on.
This would also explain why the Yok Huy so mysteriously ended as a dominant civilization. They spread across the continent and mined out all of its electrope, being guided by visions, only to then just suddenly get struck by a malady that stunted them forevermore? And the Alexandrians just so happen to create a completely flawed system, relying entirely on electrope, that, despite the metaphysics of the world, try to preserve artificial aetheric images of their people as an idea of immortality, rather their actual immortal souls, which are instead just used as fuel?
No, I really do think we'll be seeing an incarnation of Ultima in the future. Whether emerging from Etheirys, or from the "Planetary exploration" content, whatever that is even going to be and what it will reveal.
Very bad take from me, but seeing that version of Ultima at 7:57 somehow rewired my brain and made me think "Huh, the thing she's fused with looks so mechanical it kinda reminds me of Alexander". One big thing I'm hoping for with the 3 trial story bosses is a remade, modernised fight with Alexandria's Alexander in one way or another. So. Idk. Lots of silly potential ideas to combine Ultima and Alexander. Just because it'd be cool.
Amazing analysis! If this theory about Ultima holds true, then I think the story can even draw inspiration from Ultimacia in FF8, as the theme of time compression can be correlated to the story in Dawntrail as well.
Great theory video! I never really made any of these connects with Ultima and I’m excited to see if this is where they go.
people are so mad about this expac. but this is literally a "let them cook" moment! people were so mad about the little things that they ignored the story! I'm hoping the patch content leans into more of the later half stuff!
yep, it opened so much possibilities lore wise, also it's the beggening of a new Arc in the story and we should wait to see were they will lead us.
We are about to have a raid series with FFXI as theme! they could do so much with it!
The next villains are Lalafells.
@@kos-mos1127 They've always been the villians just behind the scenes like puppeteers
Meh the story was mediocre, but the dungeons were fun. Will see how things go in the 7.x patches, that is where they will redeem themselves
As someone who does actually pay attention to the story, you can let them “cook” that’s fine but it’s also fine to not accept mediocrity and rushed plotlines. Dawntrail has good pieces to it, mostly what it sets up later and that SHOULDNT be the only bright spot. It is not a good thing that your main character learns the same exact lesson almost 5 times until resorting to just murder and violence. They did fuck up with this story, it sells itself on this new main character and the people around them without actually developing any of those people properly. Instead opting to give wayyyy too much attention to Wuk Lamat instead of actually giving zoraal ja development until the actual fucking final seconds of his life. I have legitimately zero faith that Wuk will change further from who she is now. Because where the fuck is she gonna go from here? All of the other interesting pieces of her character is who koana is! There is a pacing issue with dawntrail, I’m not just gonna sit here and clap my hands because I liked the setup with the chalice or the milala plot that CAN be elaborated on further. All of that happened within the last 2 hours of the msq that subjected me to the least engaging first 75% of any expansion in ff14 INCLUDING ARR. It’s not just people throwing a fit over little things, because those little things add up to majority of what dawntrail is in the end.
Maybe the key is an ancient memoria, the twinning crystal included two magic, one to travel between shades and one is some kind of locking mechanism to ensure only shades of Azem can wield to power (hence the crystal shines during the final fight.
In 5-10 years the song we memed so hard on is going to hit different when this comes to a head. "Big fat tacos!"...I mean "Beat, the Heart of Sabik, the Heart of Sabik!"
If it does come true the quality of the meme will be even better since Wuk never did get her tacos...
I'd wondered if auracite would play a major role in the future, but this would be way cooler than it just being a plot piece
Recently found this channel and I love all the content.
Thank you! We're glad you're enjoying it. :)
Very interesting lore commentary with some interesting arguments presented. I hope your channel grows. I do buy into your argument that the Ultima faced in the Ivalice Raid is just a primal version simply because Athena suggested Ultima to be stronger than her. Even weakened to do years of imprisonment, I don't think she'd be as weak as she was. If she was stronger than Athena in the recollection of herself in the unsundered world, it would be hard to image heroes of ages past being able to seal Ultima like that.
At the very least is suggests Athena wasn't the only one with dealings with Ultima. Many other Ascians and Aumoratines might have as well. Perhaps even Azem.
Would this mean that Ultima was the cry heard from within the star itself when the Song of Annihilation began?
Further I think it's odd that some vestigial information was ignored. Such as the other manifestations of Ultima, which would particularly Ultimecia or Cloud of Darkness and its relative versions. We also see that stories of The Cloud of Darkness exist elsewhere in space as Omega had encountered them and created a simulacrum of Ultimecia. I think it's important to note that in ff8 Ultimecia is actually an entity possessing another, in their case Edea of Eden. Which our own Eden does present a 'god of the the world' (and Eulogia imo ironically enough for a parallel in The Source, possibly including the new 'prayer answering' machine they leave behind) in both its Prime and Promise forms. And for the sake of argument, the parallel that the 13th's Eden device has with The Source's own Alexander machina. Which incidentally enough uses the Enigma Codex as a critical function. It itself is a pitch black mass, from which Alexander derived time-space and the Rejoined Timeline Ironworks deconstructs to ultimately also make time-space magic for shard travel to get G'Raha to the 13th. And the Enigma Codex has ironically also already been fan theory'd to the technological material of Living Memory and the Key. Though personally I think the Key particularly is more reminiscent of omicron aesthetic, but the two are pretty similar any how.
It's literally been there the whole time 🤣🤣🤣
Great video. Thanks for your work!
Gah I was hoping for a Vagrant Storyline sigh riskbreaker would've been cool. I wonder if Azem used ultima to sunder his soul to ensure his rebirths
"I see it now. In you... his blood, my vanquisher in times... long past. But not so soon... shall I accept defeat..."
I've been locked in on this theory ever since Orbonne Monastery dropped.
The problem I have with this theory is at the start: in the relic of the Milala I don't see auracite. Rather, I see an artefact of power akin to Tupsimati or the horn of Seal Rock which would become the heart of Alexander.
So I was also wondering if the Key could also have something to do with the horn stolen from Y'shtola in 1.0 that later was given to Mide to summon Alexander, and the staff Tupsimati. All three are known to draw in the aether and prayers of those of the surrounding area.
Great video! I'm curious to see how this will be executed.
Also, does anyone know what the music used through most of the video is?
This theory is pretty good. Much better than the Alexandria video which seemed far too dismissive of other theories. The one thing it doesn't entirely account for is the seeming appearance of Azem's symbol above the key before the final Trial. But I don't think it can be entirely ruled out since Ultima has been lurking around long enough that Azem could have found and repurposed some, found some and tried to replicate it, or theoretically the key could simply have responded to and amplifed our summoning spell. What it really boils down too IMO is that we have enough hints for wild theorizing, but without another patch or two of hints it is hard to solidify any of the theories.
Some people have also suggested the key is the concept crystal from the Hythlo story in Tales of the Dawn. I'm not sure, I wouldn't describe the helix shape of the interior of the key as faceted, but a lot of people see different shapes in the key. The key also doesn't look much like the concept crystals in Anyder, but then Azem would make a concept crystal into a weird shape just for funsies, or to make Emet sigh in exasperation, wouldn't they?
Wild crack theory: a shard of Azem will have been taken over by the Ultima shard on the Unlost World. They're the driving force behind Preservation and have been launching "keys" to all the other shards and the Source as a backup plan if the Ascians failed.
Honestly I'd love this. lol
I love the "Eldritch Azem" take a lot, and Ultima shenanigans would fit so well with that~
We could have a proper Azem vs Azem match too. The final trial was already screaming the whole Azem vs Azem with the parallels between our crystal and the Azem relic.
this would be so good, we have to defeat them and ultimately absorb the shard into ourselves similar to ardbert
Thank you for this. I was wondering how this was all connected and what the importance of the key was
Oh when we gave the black auracite to Claudien i was very much like RED FLAG!@!! NOPE! DOes anyoen else think this is a horrible idea?! I knew we'd see Ultima again the moment that happened. ALTHOUGH, i missed some of the stuff you mentioned, and skipped the bit with 16 cuz i havent played it, but the idea that Ultima could start moving now that the Ascians are dealt with....perhaps rejoining shards....oh my. im very excited to see where things go!
This was great!
11:08 Minor correction, but Ultima had created EIGHT mothercrystals in FFXVI - one for each Eikon. Before the events of the game, three had already been destroyed, with the giant crater on the coast being the site of one.
o i shouldn't have watched without playing ff16, oops.
Oh no. lol We did give a warning! 😅
Yeah, i used the view thing to find where the 16 stuff ended and skipped over it :P Oopsie
Considering the link between Auracite and space horrors like Ultima floating around the cosmos, it wouldn't surprise me if we found out that Ultima was a fairly small fish in a massive pond. And that there's creatures out there way more terrifying than her.
one of my biggest hopes for the XIV story in the near future is for the WoL and Scions to suffer a brutal and complete loss (or two), and this line of story would definitely facilitate that
we’ve developed so much hubris and confidence, both as characters and players, that an astronomical reality check is (in my mind) the only way to keep the story interesting
So the thing is that while Ultima was summoned by a Zodiac Brave she's not actually a primal. She's actually an alien that was summoned from across the rift and a chunk of auracite came with her. Which is how auracite became the problem it did within the Ivalice raids. The first auracite we also were exposed to actually was the heart of sabik. We just didn't know it was auracite at the time.
It is, in fact, referred to as "auracite" in the original Japanese early on! Several of us on the LL team get really frustrated with things like this not making it to the English localization.
- Arden
God i hope the next villain is wuk lamat so we can be done with her
Got me thinking this, thanks. Just discovered this channel look forward to browsing your other videos.
Acording to all sources of player feed back, the next villain will definitly be wil lamet, and it will be about her mind controling the DEVS (and the main character) into thinking she was a good character concept
Ah yes I remember in FFIV when Golbez was revealed to not be Golbez and creating Zeromus.......
That would be because the FFXIV story with Golbez and the First is not literally FFIV but a reflection of broad concepts from FFIV. FFXIV makes it explicitly clear through Omega that the 'real' worlds of games like FFIV exist far away across space and time. So you're right, that was Not-Golbez and Not-Zeromus.
@@cnkclark I was being sarcastic in fact
@@neobahumuth6 It's so hard to tell which way the sarcasm leans on the internet.
@@cnkclark However the Alexandria of FFIX is explicitly the same kingdom in DT, just much farther along in the future
A really exciting video. Great job!
If we ever get an expansion about FF7, it might actually happen. Great video, keep it up!
Interesting theory. I think 2 other places to look for theories are ff5 and ff8. Both games have us going into the diminsional rift inbetween worlds to stop the villain of the game. With us now having a way between worlds with the key something could happen with that. We already know that the interdimensional rift exists in ff14 as thats where the Crystal Exarc planned on going after absorbing the holt either from the WoL. Ultima and Ultimicia do sound very similar too 🤔
This was a bit scarier than I anticipated. I think need to lie down and cherish my time with my character
I believe you are in the right track but with the wrong premises (The Key). Ultima is a being that has been mentioned from the Ivalice raid, the Pandæmonium trials, and that final trial connects Ultima to ARR events. They did the same with Omega since ARR and ended up being extremely important in the future, by using Omega in a raid, as part of Ultima Thule, and as a way to explain how G'raha traveled (the crystal tower + the ability of omega to travel the rift + the ability of alexander to travel through time) to The First, as explained during the Twinning dungeon. Obviously they are using Ultima in a similar way (the heart of Sabik, being older than the ancients, and its presence or influence in raids). We need to remember that the Lucavi can only exists if their auracite is in posession of someone who is a fitting vessel. All Lucavi need a vessel to exists, not only Ultima, as shown during some events in the Ivalice raids. All Lucavi need a vessel because during the times of the gods (which we fought and beat already in EW raids) they were condemned to that kind of existence, for betraying and rebeling the gods; and the vessel cannot be just annyone, but someone who's zodiak sign matches the one of such Lucavi. Maybe a similar story will be used here, in which the Lucavi were all enclosed in their respective auracites. We have seen Lucavi, but never understood exactly how they were summoned (or transformed). Also, we do not fight all the Lucavi in FFXIV, so I am sure Ultima will be shown and mentioned in the future, but probably not in this expansion, but has a 10 years story (or less years, or more, who knows) that we will see developed in the future. Finally, for the way in which Ultima and the Lucavi exists, they cannot be truly destroyed, to my understanding, just sealed and kept away so they cannot resonate with a nice vessel. Come to think of it, Zodiark is the name of Ophiucus sign's Lucavi. Maybe Ultima led to the creation of Zodiark by infecting the mind and soul of Athena and subsequently, Lahabrea as we know.
I'm currently playing through a long overdue game that I have never finished before that takes place in Ivalice(and predates FFXII and Tactics games) Vagrant Story...
I have not yet determined if there's a link between this "Blood Angel" and the "Blood Sin" in Vagrant Story, but I'm currently investigating it.
... That's why there are tacos everywhere... It's all a warning of the BIG FAT TACOS TO COME!!! OHHHHH MYYYY GGOOOOOOOOOOD!
from where did you draw the evidance, that the aciants are coroupted by auracites?
Go back to endwalker and play the raid series (normal). It’s explained there.
I do wonder what other Ancient was tinkering with space rocks prior to the Sundering. As the stone looks processed and has some Ancient motifs on it. This is most likely how Alexandria found it. You could say it's Azem, since their sigil show on the key. But Azems weren't really known for their research. For all we know the Auracite holds way more than just Azem's magic, it's just that the key the Alexandrians built only taps into that spell. It feels like we wouldn't really need another copy of Azem's signature magic, as our sigil, granted by Emet, already has dimensional powers. It always felt like we'd eventually use that to traverse dimensions. Why give us another fragment of Azem to serve that purpose?
Not through the video but it does make sense and I also it’s linked to the disruption of aether that we saw in ShadowBringers and post endwalker
My little fan theory is that Ultima or what ever race Ultima is from manipulated Meition and her sisters in seeing only the darkest side of the universe. Potentially for dynamis to be used to consume enough aether so Ultima and her kind can either take over of reshape the whole universe as they like. Now that plan failed they will want to finish the job themselves.
pretty much what me and my circle like to theorize from time to time. my only point of contention is stating a time period ivalice stuff takes place in. because the story has made it very clear its ambiguous when ivalice happens. it could happen in 2 separate time periods due to hydaelyn sealing Ultima away. it could be within the same time period. We know the allagans obtained High Seraph Auracite and is how they began the trigger weapon project. until they ran out of her auracite and swapped to Eureka to create the weapons for them.
Given how the story also acts she may be extra dimensional entity. As she is said to hail from a higher plane of existence. In Ogre Battle the Summon Darkness incantation "Denizens of the Abyss, from ink of blackest night I summon you! Darkness to me!" the Abyss in question is a very real thing. Necromancers perform the incantation to summon forth the undead and demons from this plane of existence. The Abyss/Underworld is the domain of Ashmedai the god of darkness. the Abyss can be physically accessed via Chaos Gates which were spread throughout the world of ogre battle, but can only be opened with the holy sword brynhildr via a ritual. mortals who travel there can obtain a Fruit from a tree that will transform them into a Ogre (Demon).
To loop this back to 14, perhaps the Abyss will end up being a thing here too. The dimension of which the high seraph hails from. Out of the lucavi from tactics we are missing Zalera the Death Seraph. Its been sort of my wish that perhaps the next time we encounter a Seraph it will be Zalera who will be equally powerful to Ultima.
while not part of this train of thought but connected. Another idea separate from my own speculation is that what if Ultima the High Seraph coming to this world did so in a similar manner to voidsent, where she only sent her soul and it took on a vessel. Thus after defeating her, her soul returned to her dimension to her body.
IMO dawntrail should have as many dungeons and trails as ARR with how massive the new world is
As cool as this alĺ is we can not ignore the fact that upon the keys acrivation appeared Azems symbol.
I believe firmly that this item belonged to our complete form (azem) and was used as a device for long distance travel.
I’m waiting for the appropriate Ascian to pop up and say “boo!”
Throughout the game they have called Azem the traveler. What if Azem is not just the traveler of space but also of time.
Time travel usually makes the story confusing but at the same time there would be almost no creative limit to where they could take the story if that was true.
I like this theory. It doesnt even have to be ultima herself though. It could be a being of the same rzce as whatever ultima is coming in... Like jenova!
Why did the key show Azem’s symbol in the final battle though?
It may still explicitly be Azem spellcraft that defines the key, even if Ultima's auracite is one of the primary components. Maybe the "glass" even restrains the negative influences of the Auracite. I'd think that if Azem, as someone who was sundered, found a material that could allow them to bridge the worlds, they would try to make something useful and good out of it, despite of its questionable origins. Granted, the theories around the key mostly hint at the relic having been made before the Sundering, not after, so this doesn't hold up too well.
I really hope this is the case. It's what I've wanted since Abyssos.
Interesting theories we shall see. I don't know if Ultima will be involved... Seems the creator of the whole Ivalice/Bozja series left on not great terms. I agree though that the future of the story will involve other shards. Sphene's shard I highly believe is not the shard Emet was saying we'd be fascinated by. I think somehow Alexandria slipped out of their hands unnoticed because I can't believe the ascians would want or allow all souls from a rejoined shard to not get back to the source, it totally undermines what they were trying to do. In fact I think they'd be really unhappy how they use souls as a fossil fuel.
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I think the next crisis will involve cross shard travel. They've already set the stage in motion for a restoration of the 13th. Even with Hydealyn and Zodiark gone I think the need for balance is still going to somehow be a factor and right now the source is on the edge of losing balance.(Which obviously will be devastating to the source going by the possible 8th calamity in ShadBring.) Emet implied something is going on in Merycidia and that could be a catalyst for another rejoining which then would make restoring the 13th a lot more important. Going by what went on in Merycidia its guaranteed the barrier between the source and the great expanse is probably very thin. The fact they brought Rayne and especially Gaia back for voice lines says they dont want us forgetting about them.
I think the reason this won't be the main plot yet, is that Ivalice isn't mandatory content yet, like Crystal Tower was for Shadowbringers.
Crystal Tower wasn't mandatory for a long time! :)
So, there is a chance for things to become mandatory later.
Hell, they almost made Eden mandatory during SHB but they decided against it.
- Arden
I feel like the reason Auracite is in Ivalice is because…that’s where Auracite is most prominent in FF history. FF12 and Tactics have Auracite playing a big part in their stories.
Of course, that’s not to say it can’t be more important, like other reference pieces in the game.
I had a feeling that it was something extraterrestrial like Jenova, but I've never played any other ff game!
Let me cook:
Ivalice would NOT need to be mandatory, IF the devs explicitly spell out that the Ultima we encounter in the Orbonne Monastery was purely a Primal manifested through prayer, and that the True Ultima is still out there.
"So why didn't Ultima-?"
Think about it from Ultima's perspective. You're probably powerful enough to solo the entire Convocation, Zodiark AND Hydaelyn. Their goals align with your insofar as Rejoinings also make you stronger. You'd absolutely keep your head down and let the Ascians cook.
Now, if some little upstart was able to obliterate a Primal version of you, then start kicking the crap out of the Ascians one by one, travel back in time purely for some tips to permanently avert the Second Final Days (the thing that forced the Sundering which shattered your power), then travel back in time AGAIN to pick fights with the Ancients' menagerie of "Creatures we should probably obliterate", THEN go back to the present and personally Take Care of the very Ancient you originally corrupted.
Yeah, at this point, you'd probably be like "Okay, the Ascians are either dead because of, or besties with this upstart, that Ancient I corrupted is also turbo-dead despite having a chunk of my auracite from the peak of my power, this upstart is a clear problem, I should get to work on my plans now".
FUCK YEAH! OUR BATTLE WILL BE LEGENDARY!
the doubletake i had when I saw Sarah Corehealer in the credits, haha.
Sarah is one of our founders, in fact! :)
- Arden
Interesting theory, I do like how it draws from hanging threads we already have. So by your prediction, in terms of scale, would you guess ultima is the post DT villain, the next expansion villain, or the multi expansion story arc villain?
Ultima in her original form as the lore knows her is an embodiment of Ruin that is a bit Eldritch in the sense that I don't believe it really has motivations that are relatable to mortals. I could see them rewriting her/it in whatever direction they like, as the Ultima we already fought was based on the fears and prayers of people who tried to make sense of something they didn't understand. But if she stays an incomprehensible Eldritch being, while making for a compelling threat, she does not make for a good multi expansion story arc villain, to be fair. She'd be an unfitting center of coalescing events. It'd have to be someone else - maybe a worshipper of hers, or someone who wants to stop her but is willing to pay a terrible price for stopping her that we as the WoL do not agree with.
@@lordmawkish1286 so, do you think “next expansion” or “Post DT” then?
@@edwardnowakowski5990 Post DT. Next expansion is too narrow
I'm going to differ, and say multi-expansion story arc villain, IF written as a Jenova allegory.
I wonder if all of this is going to lead to a ffvii inspired expansion. The talks of Ultima reminds me so much of Jenova.
14:48 To be clear, such devastation was not Gaius's intention. 😉
Truth I was there when he said it
Honestly surprised it took so long for someone to say it. XD
- Arden