The 14 was originally built for one purpose - to deny the enemy a chance to get anywhere near the carrier. It was later adapted for air to ground missions and proved itself to be quite decent in ACM. The 15 proved it could still fly with one wing shot off. You gotta love 'em both.
Yes of course. He probably won a BFM against an F-14 (hence the patch), but I am sure the F-14 guys got some wins as well. Like he said it was a very difficult fight with lots of scissors, verticals etc. for them because F-14 could turn so tight and accelerate so well with the wings swept back even with the TF-030s.
@@2ZZGE100 Hate to disappoint but while I never got the chance to g h2h vs 14 myself I had many others I trained with that did including several of my IPs and the overall consensus was it avg 6+ to 1 for 15 vs 14 wvr However that said it is massively dependent on the pilot.. as I also leaned from my IPs and then got revenge for such late on lol
@@kindanyume I have researched and read book first hand. AIMEVAL/ACEVAL had F-14A with TF-030 with 2:1 over the F-15 in 1980 (Paul Gilchrist's book). Training was a big factor. Chuck Hunter said, in 100+ engagements, my record was roughly 50/50 with the Eagle. I won some and lost some. However, F-14 has advantages in maneuverability/lift/AoA and turning. That is why Eagle drives tried to take the fight at 20,000+ feet in thin air. The A version with TF-030 had TW disadvantage compared to the F-15 and taking it into high atmosphere to 35k feet gave an advantage to the F-15. However, once the F-14 got the nearly 60,000 lbsf thrust GE-F110 engines, it all changed. Tomcat pilots said, the thrust to weight was essentially the same and taking the fight into a vertical scissors fight, the F-14 B/D would match the Eagle in the climb while retaining the turn-rate advantage.
In 1979 and 1980 I was attached to VF-213 (Black Lions). In between deployments VF-213 was stationed at NAS Miramar and during this time we ended up going to a couple of F15 bases for fighter training operations. The first thing that the F15 squadrons demanded was that there could be no simulated Phoenix (AIM-54) launches. This of course was our best weapon and one that the F15 pilots did not want us to have. However, it did not matter, the Black Lions ruled the skies at that time. Oh, and in regards to knowing what the F-14 was going to do by looking at the sweep of the wings. Our pilots would use manual sweep override to throw the F15 pilots a knuckle ball. Both the F14 and F15 are great planes and it is sad that the F14s are gone, I wish it had received the upgrade it deserved. AQ1 Andrew T. Clemmer US Navy 1970 - 1980
NICE! I was with VF-213 from 1993-96 and our pilots were perfect with the Phoenix missile every qual while I was with them, my first command in the Navy.
@@indragunawan1078 The Israeli, could make a Wright Flyer, BI-Plane a serious contender. Bottom Line: Garry Goff was great and funny. I knew a Helicopter Pilot who was just as great, CDR Quick, even his real name was perfect. That guy could drink too. He share his Vietnam stories and was fun.
On DCS, Growling Sidewinder has these fights between the F-14 vs the F-15 and regardless if the F-14's flaps are down or not, it will not out turn and F-15 which has a lower wing loading. The F-14 was meant for long distance fleet defense with some air to air capability, but the F-15 was designed, and built as a pure dog fighter.
@@higfny5410 Rate vs Radius, the F-15 has a better turn (Rate) = w, the F-14 has a better turn (Radius) =R Its simple to compare the both using an algebraic equation to find out who actually has a better rate over radius. Another way to look at it would be G (lift divided by aircraft weight) and velocity squared which is turn radius.
Umm Nooo not a chance that hands down belongs to the F-5/F-20 Such amazing pristine smooth lines and didnt need any of the heavy fugly flappy wings to try to make it perform stunningly. But while the 14 dosnt win that contest it is far from the looser either.. that "honor" is greatly debatable with many hating the pos 35.. but for looks alone on any modern fighter the fugliest has to be the fugly guppy from hell aka the X-32
@@kingjames1308 Yep and its also one of the deadliest since its sooo damn good at not being seen til you find yourself chewing on some 20mm rounds... its a sweet sexy supermodel and one of the 1st to have the equiv of the hourglass figure only in its case Northrop referred to that as coke bottle Trust me its a insanely sweeeeet babe to strap into and despite being in bigger newer and far more powerful fighters it is bt far still hands down my absolute fav.. only thing better than looking at it is climbing in and firin it up! and no its not a miata,,, it would be the equiv of a S13 or S15 silvia though,,,
Kindanyume .Kindanyume design is subjective. But on all the “best looking fighters” lists i have seen never even a mention of the f-5 but the TC always on the list. With its high shoulders and swept wings it looks like a muscle car and its mean as hell looking
@@kingjames1308 Design aesthetics is subjective performance is a diff matter so in as much as looks sure u r spot on re subjective as for lists wow you must be in a tc fanboi forum only then since the 5 is extremely well kown and adored for looks as well as by those that fly it. as for muscle car etc and mean looking Id take the 15 over 14 hands down for looks as well and intimidation factor as well Then again to be fair I have never had a chance to even get into the cockpit of a 14 (Not exactly many 14s in the USAF/RCAF lol) and I loved strapping my ass into both the 5 and 15
Read that a lot of F-15 pilots said the F-18 was their biggest challenge, then the F-16, Rafale, then the F-14 in DACT. Some great stories out there. Both great aircraft for their time.
The F-14 Tomcat was a carrier fleet interceptor while the F-15 Eagle is an air superiority fighter. Both were replacements for the F-4 Phantom II, but the F-14 was built as an alternative to the F-111 Aardvark, which the US Navy felt was useless, while the F-15 was created specifically as a US Air Force response to the Soviet MiG-25 Foxbat.
When F-14's were deployed aboard an aircraft carrier, that is deployed in the Arabian Sea/Persian Gulf, had escort MIGs, TU- Bears and TU-Badgers out of the carrier's airspace daily. The Soviets (Russians) ignored the rules, which forced the Navy and Marine F-14 pilots to bend the rules, but not break the rules. The Russian pilots have changed. I served in the Navy from 1980 to 1984 and I served aboard aircraft carriers.
I remember hearing in an another interview with a Top Gun pilot, i don't remember his name, anyway, they would merge with adversaries with fully sweep wings flying at their minimums, to trick their adversaries into a high speed high energy merge while the Tomcat would turn the tables on them immediately changing wing configuration as they passed.
No way could I pick my favourite between these two beautiful birds! The Eagles record speaks for itself, but the Tomcat just looks soo fu##ing cool & was definitely no slouch.
Gauging the energy state of the Tomcat by its wing sweep was the name of the game in BFM. But a F-15 with semi active Sparrows couldn’t do the job of fleet defence that a F-14 & Phoenix could against incoming squadrons of TU-16 Badgers and AS-6 supersonic cruise missiles.
The 15 could have been given the aim54 easily but inter group politics as usual screw things up even when it could have benefited everyone That said even with the 54 the 15 is superior as a rule esp in the right hands. Then again my fav to strap in has taken both out routinely lol
@@kindanyume its not as easy as you think. They tried to make a naval variant of the f15 with the 54 and there was no advantage. It ended up being just as big and heavy as the Tomcat. You need to read up on the Aimval/Aceval fly off in the 1970's between the tomcat and eagle. Long story short the Tomcat came out on top. After the fly off they decided the eagle needed multi shot ability like the 54. Development was started on the Aim-120 using the guidance system of the 54.
@@dannyboyemt Ive already read up on the 15 naval idea but the 15E ended up built to be capable of such in theory and still w/o bloat the 14 suffered. The bloat of course largely being necessity of course dont get me wrong Im not saying its the 14s fault per se for eating a tug full of ice cream.. its a ton of weight from the swing wing alone and other parts, whereas the 15Es structure is more than strong enough w/o anywhere near the weight gain that was thought back when the 15N was an idea.. (also remember the 15N was a paper idea only the idea being tossed around was extremely early 70s.. vs later return ideas by some that were far more viable due to more knowledge gained and changes in design) Bloat is a massive issue for naval designs and can be amazingly harmful in the big picture.. and is why smart designs do NOT try to build a one for all stupidity like the 35 farce. The FA18 is a perfect example of the bloat being a massive detriment as well and the alt was sadly killed by very dirty internal politics by McD to Northrops detriment when they sadly made the mistake of trusting McD (also thhe alt F18L was sadly not picked up by canuckistan instead of the moron move of the off the shelf FA18 whch is so bad for the job its not funny. Not that the FA18 is bad for Navy use either but it was a shit pic for the job in Canuckistan.. since it couldn't go from Montreal to Toronto on internal fuel alone.. /facepalm. The F18L however would have been far far more capable in almost every way over the FA18 due to the massive weight diff.. and as is well known the fA18 (despite being Northrop brilliance continuing the N158 line per se with improvements) is under-powered and has a very hard time regaining energy as a direct effect. But that said the end result if they had taken the N version with the E later in time it could have worked and been far better than the 18SH Its funny at times how certain things work out at one point and not at another. The same trials (which I already know about but only rep one point in time and are quite limited in scope vs the big pic) helped shape some developments that in turn ended up on the 5 and the 5s "kids" and they in turn helped continue on with other developments that far exceeded the 14s multi-shot. The 54 ended up in the long run as a pricy dud that was barely used and despite the USN foolishly guarding it like a dog with a bone that same behaviour in part helped spell the end of their own toy due to extremely limited use. The rivalry between USN and USAF and other branchs can be a good thing at times. Make no mistake I loved torturing the "Navy pukes' and my dad was a "grunt" (Highly skilled and deadly GB but a grunt as he put it). but that usually stops when there is a mutual enemy and its most often a detriment IMO more with the leaves than with the common men, I like I said make fun of the navy pukes etc and they poke fun back But make no mistake there is also a very healthy respect there and while I still say half of them cant take off w/o a sling shot due to ineptitude (jk) they have GIANT fucking balls landing on a carrier I was trained for simulated emergency landing with cables,, on LAND and that was fun.. and got to go out to a carrier for a tour once and the landing/to was quite fun despite my not being at the controls. But believe me it would give anyone a new perspective on the shit the navy guys go through.. and even more so.. the same as I always thanked the GC that looked after whatever I was strapping into the Navy boys deserve that and more given just how dangerous the deck is to be on.
@@kindanyume admittedly I am a little biased towards the Tomcat but only because I see it as an underdog in comparison to the 15. I tend to always root for the underdogs. I agree with your view on the F35 100%. Good lord what a blunder.
@@kindanyume It isn’t every day you hear someone mention the F-18L. I remember that proposal by Northrop back in the late 1970s/early 1980s. It gave you most of the hot rod performance benefits of the YF-17, with all the modern avionics and cockpit of the F/A-18 evolution, without any of the detriments of the carrier weight penalties. I have to agree with you that it would have been a better pick for Canada, Finland, Switzerland, and other FMS customers. It had 2 additional weapons stations as well once they changed the design to include the intake chin points. 9g capability too.
Just remember Nellis ‘ and LCDR Joe Hoser Satrapa ‘ through the Gun sight cross hair on the canopy of not one by two F-15 Eagles ‘ -!o-o!- Anytime Baby !!!
The machine gives the edge. give a great pilot an F14 or F15 and an average pilot an F22 the F22 is going to win. He can just do things the other aircraft are not capable of with ease.
Wonder how he’d enjoy a BVR engagement with a few AIM-54s coming at him. ;) A lot of the weight in the F-14 was due to it being carrier-based (gear, wing sweep, etc). That it could even keep up with an all-out air superiority fighter is pretty amazing.
Good point. I know the Phoenix can see an Eagle, but anyone in the know here tell me if the Phoenix would be effective against the current state of the art Chinese aircraft?
@@bendeleted9155 But chances are the Eagle pilot would have appropriate counter-measures for the AIM-54. I believe Israeli Eagle pilots knew how to deal with Iranian Tomcats armed with Phoenix missiles.
AIM-54 missiles were really designed to protect the Fleet from Soviet bombers and non-maneuvering Anti-Ship Missiles while it was effective against fighters it would have been a lot easier for a fighter to evade the Phoenix... Also, the weight difference was even more a problem with earlier versions of the Tomcat that had under-powered engines the F-14D really made a difference with its F110 engines!
@@robertseiple9340 The newer versions of AIM-54 especially charlies were highly effective against maneuvering targets. Iran even with the old version of AIM-54 scored a lot of kills against maneuvering targets. Even though he fought the F-14A, F-14 had a lot of advantages over the F-15 in BFM as he says the fight was very hard (and someone else in an F-14 won "The Tomcat guys ate him for lunch") and there are many stories on the other side as well.
@@bendeleted9155 Sure. So, first off, the Phoenix was pretty advanced (it was fox 3-capable) and it had truly incredible range. However, it was fairly easy to notch (IN REAL LIFE) if you could terrain mask yourself. The AIM-54C Phoenix was primarily intended for use over open stretches of water, after all. The AIM-120 AMRAAM incorporates many features that the Phoenix had back in the day but the AMRAAM is more difficult to notch over terrain than the Phoenix. Due to its lighter weight, the AMRAAM is also _far_ more maneuverable than the Phoenix. As for modern enemy stealth aircraft, the Phoenix's radar can probably still keep them in sight at close range, but the latest AMRAAMs are a far better choice for shooting down modern stealth fighters. The Phoenix also suffered some reliability issues, so when it comes right down to it, the only real advantage the Phoenix had over the modern AMRAAM was range. I don't know _ANYTHING_ about the new Meteor missile. I hope this helps.
I was USN and Loved Garry's conversation 3:00 - LOL (EXACTLY!!!) the hell with mission. The end was even better. TOTAL RESPECT and no trash talk. The Marines (which are Naval Aviators) was his best. THERE ARE NO RULES, they just want to kill you. I SALUTE YOU GARRY GOFF. The 2 F14s were probably rookies. A real F14 driver would of manually adjusted the wings and all kinds of stupid stuff, e.g. ferris wheel, had the backseater we called (GUY IN BACK) simulate another fighter, while the other fighter was somewhere else, etc. before the MERGE. You know what I mean ;-) BOTTOM LINE: WE ARE AMERICANS, thank you Garry for the humor. You have a new profession, Stand up, DO IT, PLEASE :-) Bobby
These debates are fun, but the best props I’ve ever heard about the Air Force have been from Navy pilots. And a former boss that flew with the Navy for a while (he was a F-15C driver) said that landing on a aircraft carrier was among the most difficult things he had to learn. The USAF has the Air Superiority mission, so it will have the toys necessary to achieve that. But the Navy and the USMC have cool toys. So does the Army with it’s aviation.
USAF / US Navy F-14 , VF 213 ALSS, NSAWC TOPGUN 95 to 97 Civilian! Totally enjoyed your story !!!! I always call the Tomcat coming in for a landing looks like a big Turkey, But I love my Tomcats and well as the All Bad Ass 107 Victories and Zero Losses F-15 EAGLES !
I remember this exercise out of PI on the Vinson, the pilots had a blast drilling w AF, To their advantage we just came back from deployment, Plus most were hang over after th port!
A lot of you have superior knowledge than me, but from my cursory knowledge - In the late 80's these Tomcats would be the A models and still had the TF-30 engines. The B variant came out just in time for desert storm with the upgraded F110 engines giving it an additional 7K lbs. of thrust per engine. So it would be interesting to hear of an F-15 and F-14B fight. But The F-14 is bigger and heavier than the F-15. I'd like to see what 100 carrier traps would do to the F-15's airframe. But all in all, it sounds like the F-14 was up to the challenge of engaging the F-15 which is a credit to the design of the airplane and training of the Navy pilots. Good thing they were both on the same side.
Fun to listen to. Even though, he fought the F-14A with the TF-030s (1987 - 1988), they were still highly effective in BFM as he alludes to in the video. Also, surprised to hear the F-14A with the wings swept back could accelerate so fast ("you knew it was leaving town when the wings swept back [with afterburners]").
So in BVR yes as the RIO can lock up targets and fox 3 them one after the other. The F14 also has great 360 visibility and not losing site is import WVR. Also it allows you to pursue one target right up to the point another unit starts to point there nose on you.
Love the thumbnail pick with the ET tail flash F-15. I have fond memories of that unit, the 40th Flight Test Squadron from Eglin AFB, Florida. Brings back some great memories!
I would think it's a matter of range. The Tomcat had a lot longer range of kill with the Phoenix AIM 54 missiles but I'm no expert. I cant believe were still making the F-15X, personally I think we are paying a dear price for cancelling the #1 plane in the world by far, the F-22.
Garry is great! His dad Henry got me 20 hours of my private pilots license in a Pitts S2B! Garry never told me this story !!! I knew he was an F15 jock but he was always pretty humble about it.
You know, as much as I love the F-14 and as cool as the F-14/15 rivalry is...(And yes I loved it long before the movie top gun...lol...) They were both designed and built for entirely different missions.. The F-14 first flew in 1970 after a long design period that suffered from bouts of schizophrenia, as it was the Navy version of the Navy/Air Force joint Tactical Fighter Experimental (TFX) program of 1961. The Air Force's half of that program ended up as the F-111 Aardvark strike bomber. The F-15 on the other hand was a 1967 design and the F-15's first flight was 1972. So while they were technically contemporaries, and the F-14 benefited from NASA assistance with the variable sweep wing design, they were not even in the same ball park in reality. Because in essence you had: An older Fighter Bomber turned interceptor fighter whose main goal in life was to carry 6 very large and heavy missiles along with the fire control system necessary to use them in one platform. And a pure bred and designed air superiority/tactical fighter in the other platform. The fact that there is even a debate attests to the quality and capability of the Grumman design👍.
@@michaelamos4651 Yes. Pretty much every air to air missile kill the Iranians have with their F-14's has been with the AIM-54. And not only that, they used em in all 3 modes, close range full active, mid range semi-active & long range full active. According to them, who has the most combat experience in the Tomcat, the Phoenix is an excellent air to air missile. So much so that they started a program to build their own version because they love it's capabilities.
@@michaelamos4651 no problem. I mean they didn't really have a choice because they got no AIM-9 or AIM-7's from us, only 54's. And they had the cannon of course.
Regardless of service....the US is blessed with the best equiped fighting force & best pilots...and ATTITUDE!!!! And to listen to these aging warriors and just hearing they flew legendary fighter jets....yep...I flew the F14, F15's ..jaw dropping to just listen to these cats!
Even Hoser admitted Tomcat pilots had to do some tricks to do a fair fight against Eagle. That does not mean the F-14 is not the sexiest, on the contrary.
Good on the Eagle drivers driving the fight into the vertical. The higher the fight goes the Tomcat loses its turning advantage. On the deck the Tomcat would out rate anything but a Viper. I'm surprised some of the Tomcat drivers took the bait.
@@californiahighwaypatrol577 I believe it. But to my knowledge it would have to be a "B" or "D" model. They had something like 2 degrees per second on rate compared to the "A" model. The engagement on the video occurred before the GE engines.
Even F-110 powered Tomcats were in some t/w disadvantage. In fact, F-14 never had any maneuverability advantage above F-15, except for very low speeds and altitudes. Sure, it can turn tight, but this happens because, with the unfavorable t/w ratio, it bleeds energy and speed very fast during turns, while the F-15 can gain energy in the process.
@@andreabindolini7452 And your source and proof of this. What you said is true for any aircraft if you pull to hard in any aircraft and load up the AOA your gunna bleed energy i dont care if your an F-15 or an F-22. Also both aircraft had a greater than 1.0 T/W at 50% internal fuel with a weapons load difference is the 14 at 50% fuel has 8,100lbs of fuel where as the 15 has 6,727lbs of fuel. The point is you can argue semantics all day both planes have their strengths and weaknesses.
I had an instructor once who was a Tomcat pilot for 8 years who went by the rules only in training. No attack on forward quarter, stick to the soft deck and the hard deck, but when you are fighting for your life all bets and rules are off. Not a CYA it's a SYA.
AUG-9 / AIM-54 was designed for all threats and the Manufacturer Grumman made a bold statement that everyone heeded, something like this. "The AUG-9 and AIM-54 weapon system when engaged, the enemy would be dead before they realized they were under attack". Questions: 1) What is the fastest Air-2-Air Missile? STILL THE AIM-54 5+ MACH, Range over 130 Miles. 2) What was the range of the AUG-9? 300 Miles. 3) How many missiles could you fire at various targets? 6 All these facts are UNCLASSIFIED BTW. What were the real numbers. If you wanted someone dead, prior to today's technologies was this system PERIOD. The past systems, was fire, wait until you had a hit and then fire again. The F14 was a PLATFORM that could provide many capabilities, not a couple.
Great interview. I've loved aircraft since a boy. I built models of F14 & F15 while a teenager. Both are great aircraft. Bring back the Cat 😺 upgraded. ☠️ I've seen F14 twice go vertical like a hot knife through butter not even after burner then level off & both go full afterburner disappeared.
It's sad that is impossible to do, the only left are in museums and Iran, the rest was scrapped T-T the F 14 is my favorite Jet fighter and funny enough the Panavia Tornado, a aircraft that also has the variable wing geometry
Aardvark as air superiority fighter... An option no one ever mentions. Garry talks about removing the BVR option. Well the original plan for the Vark was to give it the AIM-54 Phoenix. That got cancelled. But the FB-111 was given SRAMs. You could WIPE the entire sky with one SRAM missile. Ace in a day, many times over. Of course Fezzik would be the first to object.
My mom was a member of tge 318th and was also a Hughes trophy award winner also as a kid of the 70s 80s 90s and a air force vet I've attended many air games and the two are not compatible the f15 is a ufc fighter and the f14 is a prize boxer two different needs and both great planes bit f15 far superior
F-14 fanboys crack me up. The mental gymnastics they go though in their minds to cling on to their belief that the Tomcat is the superior fighter. Snodgrass who most F-14 fanboys know has stated the F-15 is the higher performing aircraft and that he'd need to configure the Tomcat in a prohibited configuration to best an F-15. On his final flight he went up against an F-15, now he didn't say who won the engagement but he did say his plane suffered damage due to all the hard maneuvering. He also said that up high the Eagle was superior and his best chance was to get the Eagle low and slow. The F-15 has a better T/W ratio and that includes the GE F110 Turkeys The F-15 has a better climb rate and roll rate The max g load for the Eagle is 9 vs 6.5 for the Tomcat The F-15 maneuverability is superior They say the best ability is availability and the Tomcat was far less reliable than the Eagle, the Turkey was a hanger queen. The avionics on the Eagle were superior especially compared to the A models The APG63 on the Eagle was better than the much hyped AWG9 104-0 kill ratio for the Eagle From what I've heard, Operation Desert Storm and the F-14's performance in it all but signed its death warrant. For all the hype and talk of the Turkey and AWG-9/Phoenix weapons system could do, it was useless in the war. The Tomcats radar lacked the crucial IFF capability the Eagles radar had which was needed to operate and employ their weapons in the airspace over Iraq which had dozens of coalition aircraft in the air. The Tomcat was relegated to mainly CAPs over the Gulf to defend the carriers. It was the beginning of the end, the Hornet mafia was taking over. The one area that the Tomcat initially had the edge on the Eagle was its ability to engage multiple targets at the same time as it had the Phoenix and it was a fire and forget weapon. Whether it was suitable for fighter targets is a different matter. The ACEVAL/AiMVAL evaluation highlighted the Eagles need of a fire and forget weapon. That was achieved when the AIM-120 AMRAAM came online. In fact just recently the Eagle just set the record for longest known missile kill, the distance is classified. Probably the best reason why the F-15 is better, it's still being built. It's been in continuous production for almost 50 years! The USAF has bought the latest iteration, the EX and has received its first 2 planes of planned purchase of at least 144 units with potential for more. The Tomcat ended production in 1991. The Eagle has been more successful in the export market as well. The Turkey only had one export customer, Iran. The Eagle has 6, with potential for more.
Getting your info from Mad magazine? First, the last Tomcat was produced in 1996. Second, the Tomcat was soooooo bad that they used it as a FAC/A in Afghanistan, which I don't recall the Eagles having the capability of. Third, the only reason that the Cat is dead is because Cheney killed it by making sure Grumman could neither make any more nor upgrade what they had. Grumman has gotten the shaft since the late 70s while Lockheed and Boeing are cashing in. Only reason the E-2 hasn't been replaced is because there's no replacement available. They killed the B-2, and refused the F-23. Not because of performance but because of money. Same reason why the Eagle keeps getting upgraded, the F-35 even exists, and the Stink Bug took over the Tomcat's spot. Which the Navy is going to regret when a couple carriers are lost to long range missiles that the Bug can't handle.
Question from a civilian, with only admiration for these legendary aircraft...I've always wanted to understand; Did the wings on the Tomcat sweep back automatically depending on airspeed/maneuver or were they manually swept back and forth by the pilot?
Yeah, speaking of the wingsweep trick. Dale "Snort" Snodgrass won a bet that way fighting a brand new F18C. There was another story about a Tomcat crew who pretended to be 2 aircraft by using their RIO to pretend he was the other Tomcat. It was supposed to be a flight of 2 but one had to return for maintenance, so the RIO pretended to be the other aircraft and they duped a couple of Eagles. The Eagles were convinced there was another Tomcat sneaking around when they got into a dogfight. The Tomcat "killed" both Eagles. I believe "Shoes" Mullen was talking about that on Mover's podcast
Haha, the Fox3 didn´t even manage to shoot down a static helicopter over Iraq, all the Phoenixes ever launched in REAL combat by the Navy failed their target and those targets were far from being air superiority fighters. Btw, against the new F-15EX even the F-14D would not have a bit of a chance.
@@lulujrlaulom7905 The only reported (not validated) Phoenix hits were during the Iran-Iraq war, where some Iranian pilots claimed to have shot down Iraqi MIG-21/23s and Mirage F1s, flying in close formation. Seems as if they did´nt try to escape the missile and those jet are also not very maneuverable and have limited air to air capability.
Back in the late 70's my old CO (Andy Bush), smoked two F-15's with "guns" in an F-4E. There were these two Eagle drivers who wouldn't shut up about how great their jets were compared to Rhinos. Andy said prove it. They agreed. Andy said let's make it interesting. 1v 2. Those guys were so cocky they didn't even try at first. They were going to teach this old man a lesson. Fight's on was called, and it wasn't log before "guns guns guns" on one F-15. The other tried a lot harder, but to no avail. What they didn't know Andy had also flown the Eagle, and he knew what they were going to do - and how they were going to do it. And was waiting. It wasn't about whose bird was better, and it wasn't even about humbling those two guys. It was a lesson to EVERYONE on how preparation, knowledge, patience and practice is more important than whose jet is better. The guys in the Lawn Darts were the worst though, just because they had an "electric jet" they thought they were unbeatable.
That's the difference between the Air Force and the Navy. In the Air Force, everything is prohibited unless the procedure specifically permitted it. In the Navy, everything is permitted unless the procedure specifically prohibits it.
As a navy pilot told me, the air force takes of from a long beautiful smooth runway and comes back to the same. The navy get blasted off a pitching rolling deck in the ocean and has to find the carrier in that large ocean and put that massive bird down on a pitching rolling deck and catch a wire on the tail hook. You tell me who is the Best......
Best at what? Maybe Navy guys are better but they may have spent so much time just to learn how to get to and from the carrier that it takes time away from other skills
At landing? Also landing AF planes can be just as hard to land. Some forwards airfields are very short and the F-15's don't have very good brakes and their landing gear is sensitive. You have to ease it onto the ground at 100-200 fpm not slam it at 750 like the navy guys. And the runway doesn't take care of stopping for you.
This guy's awesome! I never figured the Eagle guys can be this great. I always imagined them as that one guy that complained about the ROE LOL! I stand corrected!
I love this guy!! Fighter Pilots man...they are the best. Cause basically there job is roughly act like a moving target or turn others into targets ..boom💥
Great interview ‘ disappointed of no mention of Hoser at Nellis ‘ he tamed the eagles that day ‘ and gave credibility back to the Tomcat Community ‘ while the eagles were licking there wounds !!!
No mention of his having his ass handed to him as well by a 5 as well.. only the diff is the 5 didnt just have a lucky day or lucky meatsack,, its in the right hands capable of taking down damn near anything I know such all too well Ive been on both ends. (and loved harassin the navy pukes)
@@kindanyume the numbers don't lie. Kill ratio during AIMVAL/ACEVAL for the Tomcat was 2.5-1 vs 2-1 for the eagles and rules changed everytime the kill ratio was in the blue forces favor. "The combat was fierce. The 1000' gunshot bubble was violated countless times by both the blue and red force, in some instances, so that the pilot of the a/c being gunned had both a pipper on their head, and their name clearly visible in the gun footage. This matter of pride and competition was very unsafe, but surprisingly the only loss was a collision between a Blue Force F-15 and Red Force F-5 (no fatalities). Typically if the F-5's got into a gunfight, they were at a big disadvantage because both the F-14 and the F-15 have huge lift bodies, better wing loading and better T:W; Tomcat pilots would (if possible) get slow, drop flaps and drag the F-5's into rolling scissors to get on the Tiger's tail quickly. But getting into such engagements would only happen if the Tomcat or Eagle wasn't killed with Sidewinder shots by the F-5's, which was one of the key points of the exercise: the ability to VID at long range, and splash the enemy aircraft without getting killed " -Hoser
@@dannyboyemt You miss the point sadly Its not that u put X and Y in and X always wins Its that used correctly X will get its ass handed to it by Y if Y is used correctly Hence my exp and many others with the 5.. its older under-powered vs what the airframe can actually take However it is often very underestimated and hence why again used right 14s 15s 16s 18s etc they all have lost to that tiny lil gem knownm as the 5,, and very often not even seen before it was too late. (It even earned the nickname flying razor by a Thai general for it being so nasty to try to spot) I remember my 1st time in the 15 vs the 5.. I figured I had a brilliant plan I knew the 5 quite well and had just enough exp in the 15 to be aware of its immense power and how to use it.. Or so I thought that is.. I made a smartass comment to one of my IPs along the lines of "finally real power I can just run him over" he smirked at me and being an idiot at that time I didnt realize he was smirking at my being in for a shock. Well short end of it was yep I knew the 5 well.. but theres always someone better and one of those in the 5 that day was a long time vet with wayyyyy more time in the 5 than I had.. and well,, i got my ass handed to me on fire it was that bad a thrashing. I was not the only one either.. in our entire group not one of us managed to get a single kill 1v1 with those very "evil" tigers.. made me feel like i was tossed right back to grade school. But we learned from them and learned both how to use the 15 to very good advantage as well as the 5, I still prefer the 5 as my fav to strap into.. granted I dont have the multitude of various fighters that some have been lucky enough to get into.. (Only 3 here total and one was a specific checkout ride with a lunatic trying to make us all puke he "hates" me as I was the only one he failed to get in a looong time). Ive flown the 5 against quite a few diff designs and had "kills" against them all and again I was still a low man on the totem vs the majority, Never got to try vs the 14 in any of them sadly.. wrong place and time But others have, If you look at the overall stats however beyond just US only you can see the 5 had been exceptionally effective.. and remember the US barely used the 5 overall.. a very fooolish mistake in the big picture I remember as well others with far more exp than I had being trounced by the 5 when they were in the 15... and they were good enough to be stationed in Germany (its even in a documentary about the US forces there) UUUUUUtimately though it still goes to show you can have the best hardware possible and used right a lil ol low tech 5 can hand you your ass. Just ask the 22 drivers,, (whom also have been impressed ns scared by the Gripen.. speaking of which IFFFF things fo right for a change and our idiots in office dont screw the poooch yet again we might finally get the new Gripen to build much the same as we did with the 5 many many yrs ago... and avoid the disaster of both the 35 and the bloated bumble trying to pass itself off as a hornet) Oh and also to Hosers comments very true but that is where PS comes in the ones in a 5 and that have very high PS would now better than to fall for that. As proven by both Brazil, Swiss, Thai etc . Take stats world wide fore a more real world picture for the 5 and not just US only. To do less is disingenuous to say the least, Also I would like to know Hosers exp/bg re the 5 and others No doubt he has had far more time with other toys than I got and its all good in then end since we are on the same side (despite my not being a US citizen.. and yes its fubar confusing since I was a USAF officer as well lloooong story) I would love to see the F5EM vs some of the others now along with their new gripens .. Though its too bad they didn't do any possible upgrades for the 5's engines that still was its biggest weak point (and dirty politics killed the 20 which did a ton to address that issue)
@@kindanyume I actually agree you %100. It always comes down to the man driving the crate. I also agree the US should have invested more with the F5/20. I'm very familiar with the fly off with the 16 as well. The F20 is another plane I believe is another missed opportunity sadly.
@@kindanyume its crazy how much the AIMVAL/ACEVAL effected military aviation worldwide. Even the Soviet Union was watching and learning. It changed aircraft procurement and force makeup. It gave birth to their HMCS and archer which weirdly the US decided not to follow suit.
4:00 I guess he just confirmed the sweep back trick of the F-14 guys. Sweep back will not engage, sweep forward will turn and engage. He also didn't want to say if he few for that either :-)
I am alive, probably, today because of the F-15, call sign "EAGLE", over Ghazni province, performing CAS Eastern Afghanistan, 2008...Senior Chief Master at Arms USN (Ret)! Also, the F-14, I assume the F-15 is similar, are very large, far more than they appear on TV especially in the Delta configuration! I'm pretty sure it's personal for CAS pilots, when they can see who is they're supporting nothing so abstract then! Just a buzz, flares and waggling scares the hell out of you on the ground when they're (F-14/15's) close!
Aircraft Sizes: B17 Length 74'9" Wingspan 103'9" F14 L 63' W Advanced 64' Swept 38'3" F15 L 64' W 43' Garry is correct, F14/F15 are both large fighters. Now the real comparison would of been the F111 which was equivalent to a B17. F111 73' 5" W 63' JFK tried to force the F111 POS into the Navy and Admiral Connolly would have nothing to do with it. F111 was not a Fighter.
BOTTOM LINE: When you are a POW, the SERVICE DOESN'T MATTER. YOU ARE AN AMERICAN. Funny side: 3:03 - the hell with the mission 07:08 - Navy Sneaky and Gary, NO!!! NO!!! SO HILARIOUS.
I am going to guess it was a 50/50 sort of fight. The reality is that an F-14, as typically equipped would have an advantage in BVR to IVR combat, if only because it had a more powerful radar that could shoot an AIM-54 at those Eagles and then they would be defensive. Once the Phoenix seeker activated, the F-14 can move to TV tracking, whereas an F-15 would still have to radiate to target a Tomcat. In the phone booth it is probably as even as it gets.
Pretty obvious what their std. tactic against the F-14 was = going into a vertical scissors vs an F-14A in a F-15C is exactly the right thing to do. Flat horizontal turns would've doomed the F-15.
@@tensecondbuickgn Dogfights tend to happen below 0.8 mach so as to gain angles as quick as possible without pulling excessive G's, and then usually they slow down further from there. The Tomcat has the clear advantage from 0.7 mach and down.
F14 have Aim 54 Phoenix but couldn't use them and had to use 7's and 9's because AF didnt have 54's or anything even close back then otherwise Navy 50 - AF 0
Yeah, well, you can laugh all you want about violating peacetime rules, but as one who has personally seen a couple of fellow pilots lose their life in training due to rules violations (leading to mid-air collisions, with typically one guy not making it), I can tell you they are there for a reason. It's all fun breaking the rules until it's not.
bag rules schmulez my IPs were cowboys with spirit thankfully and skills to match but 99% of what we git away with back then flying or not would never get tolerated in todays stick up the ass enviro
@@KRGruner LMFAO yes sir mr armchair QB sir! And since I actually have exp in this and you have put forth absolutely nothing of any value and cant even be a troll very well Im sure we should all jusy bow yo your epic FAIL go home kid,, you are embarrassing yourself.
As a (I) lvl tech for equipment I hated that the Airforce guys knew the radar feq and destroyed 4 F/A-18 radar transmitters that we had to fix witch takes 13+ hrs to fix before the Airforce got in trouble .
Hum the F15 was like 300 - 400 MPH faster than the F14. The F 14 would top at Mach 2.1 - 2.3 and the F15 would hit 2.5 - 2.7. That’s quite a bit of difference. Then there is G Force. The turkey was built to handle 7.5 G was was restricted to 6.5 so that the jet would last longer. The F15 was designed to handle like 13-14 Gs but was not recommended to ever go past 9Gs. It was basically pilot restricted.
Love Both Planes they seem tp Play almost same roll for both Services and Think Baron Vonrichtoven has the answer its not the crate you need to worry about its the Pilot So cool reminiscing
All the positive stereotypes of a fighter pilot in one package: What a guy!
I got to fly both man that 14 I take it any over f15 except for newer f 15
I kept thinking "Cheer up, Garry!" :D
I wonder what his callsign was... "Smiley?"
@@KutWrite EXCELLENT COMMENT, what is his CALLSIGN?
The 14 was originally built for one purpose - to deny the enemy a chance to get anywhere near the carrier. It was later adapted for air to ground missions and proved itself to be quite decent in ACM. The 15 proved it could still fly with one wing shot off. You gotta love 'em both.
wrong, it was always from day 1 designed to be a multirole air superiority fighter and bomber
@@Scoobydcs I was in the Navy when we got the first F14's. They didn't carry bombs.
@@pi.actual they were designed to though, thats why the hud had a2g modes, it was built into the avionics from day 1
The F14 can & has flown with a wing broken off and one jammed shut.
What s the use of having a carrier then
Apparently the F-14 guys scored some kills, why else would 1 of the the F-15 pilots complained about a rules violation???
Yes of course. He probably won a BFM against an F-14 (hence the patch), but I am sure the F-14 guys got some wins as well. Like he said it was a very difficult fight with lots of scissors, verticals etc. for them because F-14 could turn so tight and accelerate so well with the wings swept back even with the TF-030s.
@@2ZZGE100 that's the way i figured. He won his fight. Somebody else lost his. It is usually how it went back then when they all did pure air to air.
@@ilejovcevski79 Very true.
@@2ZZGE100 Hate to disappoint but while I never got the chance to g h2h vs 14 myself I had many others I trained with that did including several of my IPs and the overall consensus was it avg 6+ to 1 for 15 vs 14 wvr
However that said it is massively dependent on the pilot.. as I also leaned from my IPs and then got revenge for such late on lol
@@kindanyume I have researched and read book first hand. AIMEVAL/ACEVAL had F-14A with TF-030 with 2:1 over the F-15 in 1980 (Paul Gilchrist's book). Training was a big factor. Chuck Hunter said, in 100+ engagements, my record was roughly 50/50 with the Eagle. I won some and lost some. However, F-14 has advantages in maneuverability/lift/AoA and turning. That is why Eagle drives tried to take the fight at 20,000+ feet in thin air. The A version with TF-030 had TW disadvantage compared to the F-15 and taking it into high atmosphere to 35k feet gave an advantage to the F-15. However, once the F-14 got the nearly 60,000 lbsf thrust GE-F110 engines, it all changed. Tomcat pilots said, the thrust to weight was essentially the same and taking the fight into a vertical scissors fight, the F-14 B/D would match the Eagle in the climb while retaining the turn-rate advantage.
One of the most candid, raw and insightful episodes of aircrew interview. Congrats to both participants. Cheers from Australia
In 1979 and 1980 I was attached to VF-213 (Black Lions). In between deployments VF-213 was stationed at NAS Miramar and during this time we ended up going to a couple of F15 bases for fighter training operations. The first thing that the F15 squadrons demanded was that there could be no simulated Phoenix (AIM-54) launches. This of course was our best weapon and one that the F15 pilots did not want us to have. However, it did not matter, the Black Lions ruled the skies at that time. Oh, and in regards to knowing what the F-14 was going to do by looking at the sweep of the wings. Our pilots would use manual sweep override to throw the F15 pilots a knuckle ball. Both the F14 and F15 are great planes and it is sad that the F14s are gone, I wish it had received the upgrade it deserved. AQ1 Andrew T. Clemmer US Navy 1970 - 1980
The F-14 was definitely a match for the early generation F-15's, especially that latest model.
NICE! I was with VF-213 from 1993-96 and our pilots were perfect with the Phoenix missile every qual while I was with them, my first command in the Navy.
oh yes, I just made the comment and others. Bobby Estey USN 1977-81 CV64
Well there is a reason why Israeli AF picked F-15 rather than F-14
@@indragunawan1078 The Israeli, could make a Wright Flyer, BI-Plane a serious contender. Bottom Line: Garry Goff was great and funny. I knew a Helicopter Pilot who was just as great, CDR Quick, even his real name was perfect. That guy could drink too. He share his Vietnam stories and was fun.
On DCS, Growling Sidewinder has these fights between the F-14 vs the F-15 and regardless if the F-14's flaps are down or not, it will not out turn and F-15 which has a lower wing loading. The F-14 was meant for long distance fleet defense with some air to air capability, but the F-15 was designed, and built as a pure dog fighter.
In DCS. And F-15c isn't even full fidelity.
@@higfny5410 Rate vs Radius, the F-15 has a better turn (Rate) = w, the F-14 has a better turn (Radius) =R Its simple to compare the both using an algebraic equation to find out who actually has a better rate over radius. Another way to look at it would be G (lift divided by aircraft weight) and velocity squared which is turn radius.
Ahh... F-14 looks like a Turkey? Its like the sexiest fighter ever made
Umm Nooo not a chance that hands down belongs to the F-5/F-20
Such amazing pristine smooth lines and didnt need any of the heavy fugly flappy wings to try to make it perform stunningly.
But while the 14 dosnt win that contest it is far from the looser either.. that "honor" is greatly debatable with many hating the pos 35.. but for looks alone on any modern fighter the fugliest has to be the fugly guppy from hell aka the X-32
Kindanyume .Kindanyume oh god no. F-5 is the blandest feminine looking jet fighter ever produced. Agree to disagree there. Serious its like a Miata
@@kingjames1308 Yep and its also one of the deadliest since its sooo damn good at not being seen til you find yourself chewing on some 20mm rounds...
its a sweet sexy supermodel and one of the 1st to have the equiv of the hourglass figure only in its case Northrop referred to that as coke bottle
Trust me its a insanely sweeeeet babe to strap into and despite being in bigger newer and far more powerful fighters it is bt far still hands down my absolute fav.. only thing better than looking at it is climbing in and firin it up!
and no its not a miata,,, it would be the equiv of a S13 or S15 silvia though,,,
Kindanyume .Kindanyume design is subjective. But on all the “best looking fighters” lists i have seen never even a mention of the f-5 but the TC always on the list. With its high shoulders and swept wings it looks like a muscle car and its mean as hell looking
@@kingjames1308 Design aesthetics is subjective performance is a diff matter
so in as much as looks sure u r spot on re subjective
as for lists wow you must be in a tc fanboi forum only then since the 5 is extremely well kown and adored for looks as well as by those that fly it.
as for muscle car etc and mean looking Id take the 15 over 14 hands down for looks as well and intimidation factor as well
Then again to be fair I have never had a chance to even get into the cockpit of a 14 (Not exactly many 14s in the USAF/RCAF lol) and I loved strapping my ass into both the 5 and 15
Read that a lot of F-15 pilots said the F-18 was their biggest challenge, then the F-16, Rafale, then the F-14 in DACT. Some great stories out there. Both great aircraft for their time.
The F-14 Tomcat was a carrier fleet interceptor while the F-15 Eagle is an air superiority fighter. Both were replacements for the F-4 Phantom II, but the F-14 was built as an alternative to the F-111 Aardvark, which the US Navy felt was useless, while the F-15 was created specifically as a US Air Force response to the Soviet MiG-25 Foxbat.
The Tomcat was multirole from the start as it too was an Air Superiority platform as well as Fleet Defense. Later on it was able to do Ground attack.
When F-14's were deployed aboard an aircraft carrier, that is deployed in the Arabian Sea/Persian Gulf, had escort MIGs, TU- Bears and TU-Badgers out of the carrier's airspace daily. The Soviets (Russians) ignored the rules, which forced the Navy and Marine F-14 pilots to bend the rules, but not break the rules. The Russian pilots have changed. I served in the Navy from 1980 to 1984 and I served aboard aircraft carriers.
Russian pilots have changed in what way?
Marine Corp F-14's?
@@j2times2006They crash more often.
I remember hearing in an another interview with a Top Gun pilot, i don't remember his name, anyway, they would merge with adversaries with fully sweep wings flying at their minimums, to trick their adversaries into a high speed high energy merge while the Tomcat would turn the tables on them immediately changing wing configuration as they passed.
Dale "Snort" Snodgrass
No way could I pick my favourite between these two beautiful birds! The Eagles record speaks for itself, but the Tomcat just looks soo fu##ing cool & was definitely no slouch.
Gauging the energy state of the Tomcat by its wing sweep was the name of the game in BFM. But a F-15 with semi active Sparrows couldn’t do the job of fleet defence that a F-14 & Phoenix could against incoming squadrons of TU-16 Badgers and AS-6 supersonic cruise missiles.
The 15 could have been given the aim54 easily but inter group politics as usual screw things up even when it could have benefited everyone That said even with the 54 the 15 is superior as a rule esp in the right hands. Then again my fav to strap in has taken both out routinely lol
@@kindanyume its not as easy as you think. They tried to make a naval variant of the f15 with the 54 and there was no advantage. It ended up being just as big and heavy as the Tomcat.
You need to read up on the Aimval/Aceval fly off in the 1970's between the tomcat and eagle. Long story short the Tomcat came out on top. After the fly off they decided the eagle needed multi shot ability like the 54. Development was started on the Aim-120 using the guidance system of the 54.
@@dannyboyemt Ive already read up on the 15 naval idea but the 15E ended up built to be capable of such in theory and still w/o bloat the 14 suffered. The bloat of course largely being necessity of course dont get me wrong Im not saying its the 14s fault per se for eating a tug full of ice cream.. its a ton of weight from the swing wing alone and other parts, whereas the 15Es structure is more than strong enough w/o anywhere near the weight gain that was thought back when the 15N was an idea..
(also remember the 15N was a paper idea only the idea being tossed around was extremely early 70s.. vs later return ideas by some that were far more viable due to more knowledge gained and changes in design)
Bloat is a massive issue for naval designs and can be amazingly harmful in the big picture.. and is why smart designs do NOT try to build a one for all stupidity like the 35 farce.
The FA18 is a perfect example of the bloat being a massive detriment as well and the alt was sadly killed by very dirty internal politics by McD to Northrops detriment when they sadly made the mistake of trusting McD
(also thhe alt F18L was sadly not picked up by canuckistan instead of the moron move of the off the shelf FA18 whch is so bad for the job its not funny. Not that the FA18 is bad for Navy use either but it was a shit pic for the job in Canuckistan.. since it couldn't go from Montreal to Toronto on internal fuel alone.. /facepalm. The F18L however would have been far far more capable in almost every way over the FA18 due to the massive weight diff.. and as is well known the fA18 (despite being Northrop brilliance continuing the N158 line per se with improvements) is under-powered and has a very hard time regaining energy as a direct effect.
But that said the end result if they had taken the N version with the E later in time it could have worked and been far better than the 18SH
Its funny at times how certain things work out at one point and not at another.
The same trials (which I already know about but only rep one point in time and are quite limited in scope vs the big pic) helped shape some developments that in turn ended up on the 5 and the 5s "kids" and they in turn helped continue on with other developments that far exceeded the 14s multi-shot.
The 54 ended up in the long run as a pricy dud that was barely used and despite the USN foolishly guarding it like a dog with a bone that same behaviour in part helped spell the end of their own toy due to extremely limited use.
The rivalry between USN and USAF and other branchs can be a good thing at times. Make no mistake I loved torturing the "Navy pukes' and my dad was a "grunt" (Highly skilled and deadly GB but a grunt as he put it).
but that usually stops when there is a mutual enemy and its most often a detriment IMO more with the leaves than with the common men,
I like I said make fun of the navy pukes etc and they poke fun back But make no mistake there is also a very healthy respect there and while I still say half of them cant take off w/o a sling shot due to ineptitude (jk) they have GIANT fucking balls landing on a carrier
I was trained for simulated emergency landing with cables,, on LAND and that was fun.. and got to go out to a carrier for a tour once and the landing/to was quite fun despite my not being at the controls. But believe me it would give anyone a new perspective on the shit the navy guys go through.. and even more so.. the same as I always thanked the GC that looked after whatever I was strapping into the Navy boys deserve that and more given just how dangerous the deck is to be on.
@@kindanyume admittedly I am a little biased towards the Tomcat but only because I see it as an underdog in comparison to the 15. I tend to always root for the underdogs.
I agree with your view on the F35 100%. Good lord what a blunder.
@@kindanyume It isn’t every day you hear someone mention the F-18L. I remember that proposal by Northrop back in the late 1970s/early 1980s. It gave you most of the hot rod performance benefits of the YF-17, with all the modern avionics and cockpit of the F/A-18 evolution, without any of the detriments of the carrier weight penalties. I have to agree with you that it would have been a better pick for Canada, Finland, Switzerland, and other FMS customers. It had 2 additional weapons stations as well once they changed the design to include the intake chin points. 9g capability too.
Funny that this was recommended, I was stationed at Clark AB from 1986-90.
Enjoyed every second of him talking, what a great man 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Just remember Nellis ‘ and LCDR Joe Hoser Satrapa ‘ through the Gun sight cross hair on the canopy of not one by two F-15 Eagles ‘ -!o-o!- Anytime Baby !!!
Garry Goff is one of the coolest guys to listen to ever! He must have been really fun to work with.
Gentleman,at the end of the day,it is all about the man,never the machine.Hat's off to the best 4th gen fighters in the world.
The machine gives the edge. give a great pilot an F14 or F15 and an average pilot an F22 the F22 is going to win. He can just do things the other aircraft are not capable of with ease.
Wonder how he’d enjoy a BVR engagement with a few AIM-54s coming at him. ;)
A lot of the weight in the F-14 was due to it being carrier-based (gear, wing sweep, etc). That it could even keep up with an all-out air superiority fighter is pretty amazing.
Good point. I know the Phoenix can see an Eagle, but anyone in the know here tell me if the Phoenix would be effective against the current state of the art Chinese aircraft?
@@bendeleted9155 But chances are the Eagle pilot would have appropriate counter-measures for the AIM-54. I believe Israeli Eagle pilots knew how to deal with Iranian Tomcats armed with Phoenix missiles.
AIM-54 missiles were really designed to protect the Fleet from Soviet bombers and non-maneuvering Anti-Ship Missiles while it was effective against fighters it would have been a lot easier for a fighter to evade the Phoenix... Also, the weight difference was even more a problem with earlier versions of the Tomcat that had under-powered engines the F-14D really made a difference with its F110 engines!
@@robertseiple9340 The newer versions of AIM-54 especially charlies were highly effective against maneuvering targets. Iran even with the old version of AIM-54 scored a lot of kills against maneuvering targets. Even though he fought the F-14A, F-14 had a lot of advantages over the F-15 in BFM as he says the fight was very hard (and someone else in an F-14 won "The Tomcat guys ate him for lunch") and there are many stories on the other side as well.
@@bendeleted9155 Sure. So, first off, the Phoenix was pretty advanced (it was fox 3-capable) and it had truly incredible range. However, it was fairly easy to notch (IN REAL LIFE) if you could terrain mask yourself. The AIM-54C Phoenix was primarily intended for use over open stretches of water, after all. The AIM-120 AMRAAM incorporates many features that the Phoenix had back in the day but the AMRAAM is more difficult to notch over terrain than the Phoenix. Due to its lighter weight, the AMRAAM is also _far_ more maneuverable than the Phoenix.
As for modern enemy stealth aircraft, the Phoenix's radar can probably still keep them in sight at close range, but the latest AMRAAMs are a far better choice for shooting down modern stealth fighters.
The Phoenix also suffered some reliability issues, so when it comes right down to it, the only real advantage the Phoenix had over the modern AMRAAM was range.
I don't know _ANYTHING_ about the new Meteor missile.
I hope this helps.
What I would give for a round two of this interview including one of the f14 crews. That’s would be a blast to watch!
F-14D would be a very close fight. The A model was not great.
The b would stand a better chance than both of em
I was USN and Loved Garry's conversation 3:00 - LOL (EXACTLY!!!) the hell with mission. The end was even better. TOTAL RESPECT and no trash talk. The Marines (which are Naval Aviators) was his best. THERE ARE NO RULES, they just want to kill you. I SALUTE YOU GARRY GOFF. The 2 F14s were probably rookies. A real F14 driver would of manually adjusted the wings and all kinds of stupid stuff, e.g. ferris wheel, had the backseater we called (GUY IN BACK) simulate another fighter, while the other fighter was somewhere else, etc. before the MERGE. You know what I mean ;-) BOTTOM LINE: WE ARE AMERICANS, thank you Garry for the humor. You have a new profession, Stand up, DO IT, PLEASE :-) Bobby
These debates are fun, but the best props I’ve ever heard about the Air Force have been from Navy pilots. And a former boss that flew with the Navy for a while (he was a F-15C driver) said that landing on a aircraft carrier was among the most difficult things he had to learn. The USAF has the Air Superiority mission, so it will have the toys necessary to achieve that. But the Navy and the USMC have cool toys. So does the Army with it’s aviation.
USAF / US Navy F-14 , VF 213 ALSS, NSAWC TOPGUN 95 to 97 Civilian! Totally enjoyed your story !!!! I always call the Tomcat coming in for a landing looks like a big Turkey, But I love my Tomcats and well as the All Bad Ass 107 Victories and Zero Losses F-15 EAGLES !
"Hey Jarhead. Here's a knife, go kill that T-72." "Aye-aye, sir. How many pieces, sir?"
Talk about being a fighter pilot character this guy takes the cake
Wow get his dong out your mouth
@@thirstybonsai1888 I'm sorry your jealous that I like him more than you...
@@thetreblerebel yes I'm jealous of some random guy lol
@@thirstybonsai1888 wtf lol
I remember this exercise out of PI on the Vinson, the pilots had a blast drilling w AF, To their advantage we just came back from deployment, Plus most were hang over after th port!
Man, I love this dude.
A lot of you have superior knowledge than me, but from my cursory knowledge - In the late 80's these Tomcats would be the A models and still had the TF-30 engines. The B variant came out just in time for desert storm with the upgraded F110 engines giving it an additional 7K lbs. of thrust per engine. So it would be interesting to hear of an F-15 and F-14B fight. But The F-14 is bigger and heavier than the F-15. I'd like to see what 100 carrier traps would do to the F-15's airframe. But all in all, it sounds like the F-14 was up to the challenge of engaging the F-15 which is a credit to the design of the airplane and training of the Navy pilots. Good thing they were both on the same side.
not just that but the f-14 is definitely more bound by its pilot due to not as advanced flight computers.
F-15 landing gear would not hold up. Carrier is to short to aero brake for 7000 feet 😀
Fun to listen to. Even though, he fought the F-14A with the TF-030s (1987 - 1988), they were still highly effective in BFM as he alludes to in the video. Also, surprised to hear the F-14A with the wings swept back could accelerate so fast ("you knew it was leaving town when the wings swept back [with afterburners]").
Yeah it was right on that threshold of the "Big Motor" Tomcats so wasn't sure if he was talking about As or Bs...
@@FromGamingwithLove0456 He said 1987 - 1988 so that must be the A. The F-14A+/B went into service in 1989.
@@2ZZGE100 Yeah okay I must have been thinking about production... pre-service. Thanks!
@@FromGamingwithLove0456 Yeah, there were some prototypes with the GE-F110 engines in testing after 1986, I believe.
Yep the f14 A's air frame an engines were a total mismatch prone to stalling from jetwash
A supremely competent individual, so good, he can afford an affable, laid back persona.
I would have guessed that having a crew of two in the Tomcat could have had some advantage over the Eagle.
So in BVR yes as the RIO can lock up targets and fox 3 them one after the other. The F14 also has great 360 visibility and not losing site is import WVR. Also it allows you to pursue one target right up to the point another unit starts to point there nose on you.
Love the thumbnail pick with the ET tail flash F-15. I have fond memories of that unit, the 40th Flight Test Squadron from Eglin AFB, Florida. Brings back some great memories!
What a character. I bet he was a blast to serve with.
I would think it's a matter of range. The Tomcat had a lot longer range of kill with the Phoenix AIM 54 missiles but I'm no expert. I cant believe were still making the F-15X, personally I think we are paying a dear price for cancelling the #1 plane in the world by far, the F-22.
Garry is great! His dad Henry got me 20 hours of my private pilots license in a Pitts S2B! Garry never told me this story !!! I knew he was an F15 jock but he was always pretty humble about it.
You know, as much as I love the F-14 and as cool as the F-14/15 rivalry is...(And yes I loved it long before the movie top gun...lol...)
They were both designed and built for entirely different missions..
The F-14 first flew in 1970 after a long design period that suffered from bouts of schizophrenia, as it was the Navy version of the Navy/Air Force joint Tactical Fighter Experimental (TFX) program of 1961.
The Air Force's half of that program ended up as the F-111 Aardvark strike bomber.
The F-15 on the other hand was a 1967 design and the F-15's first flight was 1972.
So while they were technically contemporaries, and the F-14 benefited from NASA assistance with the variable sweep wing design, they were not even in the same ball park in reality.
Because in essence you had:
An older Fighter Bomber turned interceptor fighter whose main goal in life was to carry 6 very large and heavy missiles along with the fire control system necessary to use them in one platform.
And a pure bred and designed air superiority/tactical fighter in the other platform.
The fact that there is even a debate attests to the quality and capability of the Grumman design👍.
Not to mention the F-14s could have deployed the AIM-54 Phoenix way further out than anything the F-15 can carry.
@@johnbrennan8611 True but did the Phoenix ever actually work?
@@michaelamos4651 Yes. Pretty much every air to air missile kill the Iranians have with their F-14's has been with the AIM-54. And not only that, they used em in all 3 modes, close range full active, mid range semi-active & long range full active. According to them, who has the most combat experience in the Tomcat, the Phoenix is an excellent air to air missile. So much so that they started a program to build their own version because they love it's capabilities.
@@johnbrennan8611 Fair point. Thanks for the info
@@michaelamos4651 no problem. I mean they didn't really have a choice because they got no AIM-9 or AIM-7's from us, only 54's. And they had the cannon of course.
Regardless of service....the US is blessed with the best equiped fighting force & best pilots...and ATTITUDE!!!! And to listen to these aging warriors and just hearing they flew legendary fighter jets....yep...I flew the F14, F15's ..jaw dropping to just listen to these cats!
I love this interview!
I am sure if those Tomcat guys were Hoser and Turk, things would have been different.
Even Hoser admitted Tomcat pilots had to do some tricks to do a fair fight against Eagle. That does not mean the F-14 is not the sexiest, on the contrary.
what has it been 10 seconds already one of my favorite people on the planet, I don't even know the guy!
What a great interview. Excellent!
Thank you.
Good on the Eagle drivers driving the fight into the vertical. The higher the fight goes the Tomcat loses its turning advantage. On the deck the Tomcat would out rate anything but a Viper. I'm surprised some of the Tomcat drivers took the bait.
it actually has out rated f16 there a video on it
@@californiahighwaypatrol577 I believe it. But to my knowledge it would have to be a "B" or "D" model. They had something like 2 degrees per second on rate compared to the "A" model. The engagement on the video occurred before the GE engines.
@@dannyboyemt yes your right not the A model but the A+,B and D model
TC can turn good but it has others that can out rate it besides the 16 some of which now would absolutely eat the 14 for a small snack assuming eps
@@kindanyume hardly fair to compare the latest and greatest aircraft to one that was designed in 1969.
The F-14A would be at a huge disadvantage to the F-15. The F-14 was twice as heavy as the F-15 and had about 7,000 pounds less thrust.
Even F-110 powered Tomcats were in some t/w disadvantage. In fact, F-14 never had any maneuverability advantage above F-15, except for very low speeds and altitudes. Sure, it can turn tight, but this happens because, with the unfavorable t/w ratio, it bleeds energy and speed very fast during turns, while the F-15 can gain energy in the process.
@@andreabindolini7452 And your source and proof of this. What you said is true for any aircraft if you pull to hard in any aircraft and load up the AOA your gunna bleed energy i dont care if your an F-15 or an F-22. Also both aircraft had a greater than 1.0 T/W at 50% internal fuel with a weapons load difference is the 14 at 50% fuel has 8,100lbs of fuel where as the 15 has 6,727lbs of fuel. The point is you can argue semantics all day both planes have their strengths and weaknesses.
Loved it! Great interview guys!
I had an instructor once who was a Tomcat pilot for 8 years who went by the rules only in training. No attack on forward quarter, stick to the soft deck and the hard deck, but when you are fighting for your life all bets and rules are off. Not a CYA it's a SYA.
AUG-9 / AIM-54 was designed for all threats and the Manufacturer Grumman made a bold statement that everyone heeded, something like this. "The AUG-9 and AIM-54 weapon system when engaged, the enemy would be dead before they realized they were under attack". Questions: 1) What is the fastest Air-2-Air Missile? STILL THE AIM-54 5+ MACH, Range over 130 Miles. 2) What was the range of the AUG-9? 300 Miles. 3) How many missiles could you fire at various targets? 6 All these facts are UNCLASSIFIED BTW. What were the real numbers. If you wanted someone dead, prior to today's technologies was this system PERIOD. The past systems, was fire, wait until you had a hit and then fire again. The F14 was a PLATFORM that could provide many capabilities, not a couple.
Great interview. I've loved aircraft since a boy. I built models of F14 & F15 while a teenager. Both are great aircraft. Bring back the Cat 😺 upgraded. ☠️ I've seen F14 twice go vertical like a hot knife through butter not even after burner then level off & both go full afterburner disappeared.
It's sad that is impossible to do, the only left are in museums and Iran, the rest was scrapped T-T the F 14 is my favorite Jet fighter and funny enough the Panavia Tornado, a aircraft that also has the variable wing geometry
@@ricardobeltranmonribot3182 As does the F111
Aardvark as air superiority fighter...
An option no one ever mentions.
Garry talks about removing the BVR option. Well the original plan for the Vark was to give it the AIM-54 Phoenix. That got cancelled.
But the FB-111 was given SRAMs. You could WIPE the entire sky with one SRAM missile. Ace in a day, many times over.
Of course Fezzik would be the first to object.
My mom was a member of tge 318th and was also a Hughes trophy award winner also as a kid of the 70s 80s 90s and a air force vet I've attended many air games and the two are not compatible the f15 is a ufc fighter and the f14 is a prize boxer two different needs and both great planes bit f15 far superior
F-14 fanboys crack me up. The mental gymnastics they go though in their minds to cling on to their belief that the Tomcat is the superior fighter.
Snodgrass who most F-14 fanboys know has stated the F-15 is the higher performing aircraft and that he'd need to configure the Tomcat in a prohibited configuration to best an F-15. On his final flight he went up against an F-15, now he didn't say who won the engagement but he did say his plane suffered damage due to all the hard maneuvering. He also said that up high the Eagle was superior and his best chance was to get the Eagle low and slow.
The F-15 has a better T/W ratio and that includes the GE F110 Turkeys
The F-15 has a better climb rate and roll rate
The max g load for the Eagle is 9 vs 6.5 for the Tomcat
The F-15 maneuverability is superior
They say the best ability is availability and the Tomcat was far less reliable than the Eagle, the Turkey was a hanger queen.
The avionics on the Eagle were superior especially compared to the A models
The APG63 on the Eagle was better than the much hyped AWG9
104-0 kill ratio for the Eagle
From what I've heard, Operation Desert Storm and the F-14's performance in it all but signed its death warrant. For all the hype and talk of the Turkey and AWG-9/Phoenix weapons system could do, it was useless in the war. The Tomcats radar lacked the crucial IFF capability the Eagles radar had which was needed to operate and employ their weapons in the airspace over Iraq which had dozens of coalition aircraft in the air. The Tomcat was relegated to mainly CAPs over the Gulf to defend the carriers. It was the beginning of the end, the Hornet mafia was taking over.
The one area that the Tomcat initially had the edge on the Eagle was its ability to engage multiple targets at the same time as it had the Phoenix and it was a fire and forget weapon. Whether it was suitable for fighter targets is a different matter. The ACEVAL/AiMVAL evaluation highlighted the Eagles need of a fire and forget weapon. That was achieved when the AIM-120 AMRAAM came online. In fact just recently the Eagle just set the record for longest known missile kill, the distance is classified.
Probably the best reason why the F-15 is better, it's still being built. It's been in continuous production for almost 50 years! The USAF has bought the latest iteration, the EX and has received its first 2 planes of planned purchase of at least 144 units with potential for more. The Tomcat ended production in 1991. The Eagle has been more successful in the export market as well. The Turkey only had one export customer, Iran. The Eagle has 6, with potential for more.
Getting your info from Mad magazine? First, the last Tomcat was produced in 1996. Second, the Tomcat was soooooo bad that they used it as a FAC/A in Afghanistan, which I don't recall the Eagles having the capability of. Third, the only reason that the Cat is dead is because Cheney killed it by making sure Grumman could neither make any more nor upgrade what they had. Grumman has gotten the shaft since the late 70s while Lockheed and Boeing are cashing in. Only reason the E-2 hasn't been replaced is because there's no replacement available. They killed the B-2, and refused the F-23. Not because of performance but because of money. Same reason why the Eagle keeps getting upgraded, the F-35 even exists, and the Stink Bug took over the Tomcat's spot. Which the Navy is going to regret when a couple carriers are lost to long range missiles that the Bug can't handle.
By the same logic, the Eagle is better than the Raptor, which has only one costumer and production has ended.
So basically the f-16 is the winner
I Thought It's Should Had Been a Sea Version of the F-15 for the Navy and Marine Corps. They Both Had the F-4 Phantom II.
They would’ve had to make some aerodynamic sacrifices in order to allow it to land on the carrier.
The Phantom II was for the Navy first. The Air Force just happen to like it and adopted it for service.
Question from a civilian, with only admiration for these legendary aircraft...I've always wanted to understand; Did the wings on the Tomcat sweep back automatically depending on airspeed/maneuver or were they manually swept back and forth by the pilot?
They were automatic but the pilot could also manually sweep them.
That was a great upload.
Yeah, speaking of the wingsweep trick. Dale "Snort" Snodgrass won a bet that way fighting a brand new F18C. There was another story about a Tomcat crew who pretended to be 2 aircraft by using their RIO to pretend he was the other Tomcat. It was supposed to be a flight of 2 but one had to return for maintenance, so the RIO pretended to be the other aircraft and they duped a couple of Eagles. The Eagles were convinced there was another Tomcat sneaking around when they got into a dogfight. The Tomcat "killed" both Eagles. I believe "Shoes" Mullen was talking about that on Mover's podcast
Dale Snodgrass also refer itself to the F14 as Turkey
"Fox 3, F-15 is dead in the turn in." Did it enough at Nellis. Tomcat RIO.
Haha, the Fox3 didn´t even manage to shoot down a static helicopter over Iraq, all the Phoenixes ever launched in REAL combat by the Navy failed their target and those targets were far from being air superiority fighters. Btw, against the new F-15EX even the F-14D would not have a bit of a chance.
@@NostalgieFreak better check your self. Your data is inaccurate .
Ah, the simulated kill. Paint that on your canopy!
@@lulujrlaulom7905 The only reported (not validated) Phoenix hits were during the Iran-Iraq war, where some Iranian pilots claimed to have shot down Iraqi MIG-21/23s and Mirage F1s, flying in close formation. Seems as if they did´nt try to escape the missile and those jet are also not very maneuverable and have limited air to air capability.
For an agile fighter, it´s easy to evade the Fox3, watch this tutorial: th-cam.com/video/EceMVJjVod4/w-d-xo.html
Great interview
Back in the late 70's my old CO (Andy Bush), smoked two F-15's with "guns" in an F-4E. There were these two Eagle drivers who wouldn't shut up about how great their jets were compared to Rhinos. Andy said prove it. They agreed. Andy said let's make it interesting. 1v 2. Those guys were so cocky they didn't even try at first. They were going to teach this old man a lesson. Fight's on was called, and it wasn't log before "guns guns guns" on one F-15. The other tried a lot harder, but to no avail. What they didn't know Andy had also flown the Eagle, and he knew what they were going to do - and how they were going to do it. And was waiting. It wasn't about whose bird was better, and it wasn't even about humbling those two guys. It was a lesson to EVERYONE on how preparation, knowledge, patience and practice is more important than whose jet is better.
The guys in the Lawn Darts were the worst though, just because they had an "electric jet" they thought they were unbeatable.
Tomcats are great for movies. Eagles are great for air to air kills.
Just out of curiosity, were these F14As with the Pratt and Whitney Engines or B or Ds that had the better GE engines?
Yes TF30 PnW. F111, early A7s also. It had issues
That's the difference between the Air Force and the Navy. In the Air Force, everything is prohibited unless the procedure specifically permitted it. In the Navy, everything is permitted unless the procedure specifically prohibits it.
As a navy pilot told me, the air force takes of from a long beautiful smooth runway and comes back to the same. The navy get blasted off a pitching rolling deck in the ocean and has to find the carrier in that large ocean and put that massive bird down on a pitching rolling deck and catch a wire on the tail hook. You tell me who is the Best......
The guy who splashes the other one.
Best at what? Maybe Navy guys are better but they may have spent so much time just to learn how to get to and from the carrier that it takes time away from other skills
@@Aaron-wq3jz Did you go off your meds again ?
At landing?
Also landing AF planes can be just as hard to land. Some forwards airfields are very short and the F-15's don't have very good brakes and their landing gear is sensitive. You have to ease it onto the ground at 100-200 fpm not slam it at 750 like the navy guys. And the runway doesn't take care of stopping for you.
@@vanillagorilla8236 nope, typo, but im sure you get my point
What a happy guy
This guy's awesome! I never figured the Eagle guys can be this great. I always imagined them as that one guy that complained about the ROE LOL! I stand corrected!
I love this guy!! Fighter Pilots man...they are the best.
Cause basically there job is roughly act like a moving target or turn others into targets ..boom💥
Both great birds, but only one is still flying. Only one is undefeated.
Was that the A model F-14 with week engine.
just .. excellent ! thx
Great interview ‘ disappointed of no mention of Hoser at Nellis ‘ he tamed the eagles that day ‘ and gave credibility back to the Tomcat Community ‘ while the eagles were licking there wounds !!!
No mention of his having his ass handed to him as well by a 5 as well.. only the diff is the 5 didnt just have a lucky day or lucky meatsack,, its in the right hands capable of taking down damn near anything I know such all too well Ive been on both ends. (and loved harassin the navy pukes)
@@kindanyume the numbers don't lie. Kill ratio during AIMVAL/ACEVAL for the Tomcat was 2.5-1 vs 2-1 for the eagles and rules changed everytime the kill ratio was in the blue forces favor.
"The combat was fierce. The 1000' gunshot bubble was violated countless
times by both the blue and red force, in some instances, so that the
pilot of the a/c being gunned had both a pipper on their head, and
their name clearly visible in the gun footage. This matter of pride
and competition was very unsafe, but surprisingly the only loss was a
collision between a Blue Force F-15 and Red Force F-5 (no fatalities).
Typically if the F-5's got into a gunfight, they were at a big
disadvantage because both the F-14 and the F-15 have huge lift bodies,
better wing loading and better T:W; Tomcat pilots would (if possible)
get slow, drop flaps and drag the F-5's into rolling scissors to get
on the Tiger's tail quickly.
But getting into such engagements would only happen if the Tomcat or
Eagle wasn't killed with Sidewinder shots by the F-5's, which was one
of the key points of the exercise: the ability to VID at long range,
and splash the enemy aircraft without getting killed " -Hoser
@@dannyboyemt You miss the point sadly Its not that u put X and Y in and X always wins Its that used correctly X will get its ass handed to it by Y if Y is used correctly
Hence my exp and many others with the 5.. its older under-powered vs what the airframe can actually take However it is often very underestimated and hence why again used right 14s 15s 16s 18s etc they all have lost to that tiny lil gem knownm as the 5,, and very often not even seen before it was too late. (It even earned the nickname flying razor by a Thai general for it being so nasty to try to spot)
I remember my 1st time in the 15 vs the 5.. I figured I had a brilliant plan I knew the 5 quite well and had just enough exp in the 15 to be aware of its immense power and how to use it.. Or so I thought that is.. I made a smartass comment to one of my IPs along the lines of "finally real power I can just run him over" he smirked at me and being an idiot at that time I didnt realize he was smirking at my being in for a shock.
Well short end of it was yep I knew the 5 well.. but theres always someone better and one of those in the 5 that day was a long time vet with wayyyyy more time in the 5 than I had.. and well,, i got my ass handed to me on fire it was that bad a thrashing. I was not the only one either.. in our entire group not one of us managed to get a single kill 1v1 with those very "evil" tigers.. made me feel like i was tossed right back to grade school.
But we learned from them and learned both how to use the 15 to very good advantage as well as the 5, I still prefer the 5 as my fav to strap into.. granted I dont have the multitude of various fighters that some have been lucky enough to get into.. (Only 3 here total and one was a specific checkout ride with a lunatic trying to make us all puke he "hates" me as I was the only one he failed to get in a looong time). Ive flown the 5 against quite a few diff designs and had "kills" against them all and again I was still a low man on the totem vs the majority, Never got to try vs the 14 in any of them sadly.. wrong place and time But others have,
If you look at the overall stats however beyond just US only you can see the 5 had been exceptionally effective.. and remember the US barely used the 5 overall.. a very fooolish mistake in the big picture
I remember as well others with far more exp than I had being trounced by the 5 when they were in the 15... and they were good enough to be stationed in Germany (its even in a documentary about the US forces there)
UUUUUUtimately though it still goes to show you can have the best hardware possible and used right a lil ol low tech 5 can hand you your ass. Just ask the 22 drivers,, (whom also have been impressed ns scared by the Gripen.. speaking of which IFFFF things fo right for a change and our idiots in office dont screw the poooch yet again we might finally get the new Gripen to build much the same as we did with the 5 many many yrs ago... and avoid the disaster of both the 35 and the bloated bumble trying to pass itself off as a hornet)
Oh and also to Hosers comments very true but that is where PS comes in the ones in a 5 and that have very high PS would now better than to fall for that. As proven by both Brazil, Swiss, Thai etc . Take stats world wide fore a more real world picture for the 5 and not just US only. To do less is disingenuous to say the least,
Also I would like to know Hosers exp/bg re the 5 and others No doubt he has had far more time with other toys than I got and its all good in then end since we are on the same side (despite my not being a US citizen.. and yes its fubar confusing since I was a USAF officer as well lloooong story)
I would love to see the F5EM vs some of the others now along with their new gripens .. Though its too bad they didn't do any possible upgrades for the 5's engines that still was its biggest weak point (and dirty politics killed the 20 which did a ton to address that issue)
@@kindanyume I actually agree you %100. It always comes down to the man driving the crate. I also agree the US should have invested more with the F5/20. I'm very familiar with the fly off with the 16 as well. The F20 is another plane I believe is another missed opportunity sadly.
@@kindanyume its crazy how much the AIMVAL/ACEVAL effected military aviation worldwide. Even the Soviet Union was watching and learning. It changed aircraft procurement and force makeup. It gave birth to their HMCS and archer which weirdly the US decided not to follow suit.
4:00 I guess he just confirmed the sweep back trick of the F-14 guys. Sweep back will not engage, sweep forward will turn and engage. He also didn't want to say if he few for that either :-)
Tomcat wins with Phoenix missiles it is what it is
I am alive, probably, today because of the F-15, call sign "EAGLE", over Ghazni province, performing CAS Eastern Afghanistan, 2008...Senior Chief Master at Arms USN (Ret)!
Also, the F-14, I assume the F-15 is similar, are very large, far more than they appear on TV especially in the Delta configuration! I'm pretty sure it's personal for CAS pilots, when they can see who is they're supporting nothing so abstract then! Just a buzz, flares and waggling scares the hell out of you on the ground when they're (F-14/15's) close!
Against the new F-15EX even the F-14D would not have a bit of a chance.
This has to be Chaz’s (will Ferrell - Wedding Crashers) dad, who left his mom and Chaz behind. He is totally like Ferrell.
AIR FORCE WINGS MADE OF LEAD NAVY MADE OF GOLD
I'm given to understand Air Force wings are made mostly of aluminium alloys
Are you still delivering t shirts during the upcoming lockdown as really want to order another one
Hi James. Do you mean from our Redbubble store?
@@Aircrewinterview yes mike
We are indeed. I appreciate the support. www.redbubble.com/people/acinterview/shop
I LOVE BOTH OF THEM
Aircraft Sizes: B17 Length 74'9" Wingspan 103'9" F14 L 63' W Advanced 64' Swept 38'3" F15 L 64' W 43' Garry is correct, F14/F15 are both large fighters. Now the real comparison would of been the F111 which was equivalent to a B17. F111 73' 5" W 63' JFK tried to force the F111 POS into the Navy and Admiral Connolly would have nothing to do with it. F111 was not a Fighter.
BOTTOM LINE: When you are a POW, the SERVICE DOESN'T MATTER. YOU ARE AN AMERICAN. Funny side: 3:03 - the hell with the mission 07:08 - Navy Sneaky and Gary, NO!!! NO!!! SO HILARIOUS.
I am going to guess it was a 50/50 sort of fight. The reality is that an F-14, as typically equipped would have an advantage in BVR to IVR combat, if only because it had a more powerful radar that could shoot an AIM-54 at those Eagles and then they would be defensive. Once the Phoenix seeker activated, the F-14 can move to TV tracking, whereas an F-15 would still have to radiate to target a Tomcat.
In the phone booth it is probably as even as it gets.
Pretty obvious what their std. tactic against the F-14 was = going into a vertical scissors vs an F-14A in a F-15C is exactly the right thing to do. Flat horizontal turns would've doomed the F-15.
It's my understanding that Tomcat may outmaneuver at slow speeds but dogfights are not at slow speeds.
@@tensecondbuickgn Dogfights tend to happen below 0.8 mach so as to gain angles as quick as possible without pulling excessive G's, and then usually they slow down further from there. The Tomcat has the clear advantage from 0.7 mach and down.
@@tensecondbuickgn We aimed for 6.5G's at 325 knots for max turn rate.
Which we could sustain indefinitely if we were pointed below the horizon.
This Guy was a pilot !!! : o
@Mike Smith : D
He said the F14 only did air to air… they actually spent half of their career doing laxer guided missions…
F14 have Aim 54 Phoenix but couldn't use them and had to use 7's and 9's because AF didnt have 54's or anything even close back then otherwise Navy 50 - AF 0
Truth is the phenebomb wasn’t all that good bvr against a maneuvering target. Great against a bear bomber
Yeah, well, you can laugh all you want about violating peacetime rules, but as one who has personally seen a couple of fellow pilots lose their life in training due to rules violations (leading to mid-air collisions, with typically one guy not making it), I can tell you they are there for a reason. It's all fun breaking the rules until it's not.
bag rules schmulez my IPs were cowboys with spirit thankfully and skills to match
but 99% of what we git away with back then flying or not would never get tolerated in todays stick up the ass enviro
@@kindanyume You have no idea what you are talking about. You ought to speak only about things you know about.
@@KRGruner LMFAO yes sir mr armchair QB sir!
And since I actually have exp in this and you have put forth absolutely nothing of any value and cant even be a troll very well Im sure we should all jusy bow yo your epic FAIL
go home kid,, you are embarrassing yourself.
@@kindanyume Well, at least, I was an actual fighter pilot, unlike you. So there is always that...
500 feet was the Navy rule. No violation.
What meds is that guy on?
Fairly interesting
Garry reminds me of Jack Nickolson in, I think, Terms of Endearment.
As a (I) lvl tech for equipment I hated that the Airforce guys knew the radar feq and destroyed 4 F/A-18 radar transmitters that we had to fix witch takes 13+ hrs to fix before the Airforce got in trouble .
I enjoy these type of chats, but I wonder… pre-bulbar affect?
Hum the F15 was like 300 - 400 MPH faster than the F14. The F 14 would top at Mach 2.1 - 2.3 and the F15 would hit 2.5 - 2.7. That’s quite a bit of difference. Then there is G Force. The turkey was built to handle 7.5 G was was restricted to 6.5 so that the jet would last longer. The F15 was designed to handle like 13-14 Gs but was not recommended to ever go past 9Gs. It was basically pilot restricted.
CVN69 VAW121 The 14 was at a disadvantage against the 15 !!! The 15 was the best thing in the air at the time!!!!
How can it be fair if the AIM 54 Phoenix is not in the equation??
Love Both Planes they seem tp Play almost same roll for both Services and Think Baron Vonrichtoven has the answer its not the crate you need to worry about its the Pilot So cool reminiscing
Hell yeah, 44th FS Vampires! I miss Kadena!
Crow Valley.... Philippines???
I'm thinking 100 feet is closer than he cares to admit.
The jet itself is 60 feet long.
Both great jets but head-to-head the 15 takes it; the Eagle will take anyone.
Never lost an Eagle in air to air combat. Can't say the same with the Tomcat.
Iranians only.
@Kevin H theyre the only ones who actually used the thing in the situation it was designed for: a real, peer-to-peer shooting war
Great teaser