We Cracked the Code of Gears on Ice
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 เม.ย. 2023
- This video presents a new theory of ice gearing, based on the concept of upper and lower "safe zones" along with a "danger wedge" in the middle. If you've ever randomly slid out while driving ice, this video can explain precisely what happened.
I worked on this project with UnprovenRuben, who helped with a lot of the discovery, refinement, data collection, the danger wedge theory, analysis...basically everything.
If you have questions, feel free to reach out on Discord.
As discussed in the video, this plugin will only be public following the release of learning mode - a feature that will allow users to use plugins like this without impacting the competitive environment. Stay tuned for more information.
sergeant-bigbird#5050
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Here's the values GCP is using to render the lines. (not exact - if you want the real values, leave a comment and I'll add them.)
Lower safe zone:
82 at 167
86 at 202
87 at 224
Danger wedge bottom:
93.6 at 126
92.8 at 165
91.3 at 273
Danger wedge top:
97 at 106
94 at 156
93 at 190
92 at 270
Top safe zone:
123 at 135
120 at 164
115 at 187
110 at 232
107 at 280 - เกม
Can't wait for OpenPlanet to release learning mode so weird jank like this can be practiced with a helper that makes the opaque physics of trackmania visible.
To be honest, I'm torn on my opinion of these things. Feel based physics things are super annoying to deal with. Being able to practice these with visual aid is great. Not being able to use them while going for records and such.. not so sure. We'll probably have people practicing with the tool for hours and hours, getting quite an advantage, locked behind that. Then again, it could be even worse if those tools were available while going for records!
All in all, it's cool these things are being found and developed. Just not sure about my opinion on the learner mode. We'll see what the community says in the future, for now, let the interesting plugins commence!
@@void_snw I am incredibly annoyed by the decision because streamers had access to these plugins and used them in freaking COTDs for months before OpenPlanet said anything. I guarantee those streamers are using those plugins still, when they're not on stream. "Rules for thee, not for me." Ridiculous in my opinion.
some guy made a video of a pluging that shows you the optimal angle and openplanet is working on it but they are concerned it is too close to cheating if you use it in competitive
Is learning mode still not released? When you can’t rely on realistic physics, it’s only fair that there should be a training mode
Still no training mode. It was a bs excuse to calm the backlash after the veterans of the game bullied Openplanet out of releasing visual aid support for new players to learn with. @@DVous
The things you explain here are really the things that I got a feeling for after more than 1k hours on ice. Really cool it's explained here. In that case people don't have to get to a long learning curve haha.
^ this
It really makes you wonder why they changed ice physics in a way that's almost universally disliked but left in this 'danger wedge' with completely incomprehensible mechanics. Even with your thorough analysis it's a bit wishy washy and has loose ends...
There's also frustrating things like your car getting stuck at a certain angle, even if you release to try and lower your angle. There also seems to be a bug happening completely randomly where one of your wheels just bumps into the air a little in the middle of your slide (this may have to do with custom block collision, but idk)
To be honest, I enjoy ice. It's a really cool (no pun intended) and unique surface. It's such a shame how unpolished it is, causing it to feel random and unfair.
I can't agree more. Of all the weird mechanics that make the game harder to play and enjoy, it's really frustrating that they just "fixed" something else entirely instead.
Because this is surely not intended, just a side effect of how they programmed the physics. Nadeo might not even be aware of this
Bold of you to assume that Nadeo knows exactly how ice works lol
You know, I didn't think I could be convinced that ice gears were even more stupid than I thought they were, guess I was wrong.
actually banger video wtf, thanks for the tips
I'm only a casual player, but this kind of analysis is still so valuable. I think ice is a really interesting and cool surface, and it feels great to play when everything lines up, but "randomly" sliding out has always felt absolutely horrible. Hats off to you for taking such a rigorous approach to such mechanics in Trackmania and making them much more understandable to laymen like me!
Awesome video as always, I simply love your content and the scientific approach that you have towards these problems
Thank you so much!
excellent in-depth look at ice mechanics. analysis like this is invaluable to the community (and perhaps even secretly Nadeo-who knows if they even know their mechanics this well lol). very cool to see.
see you on the IL leaderboards ;)
So basically, random slideouts are real, they just arent random, and they are incredibly stupid... thanks NANDO
Very interesting insight, thank you very much! As a mediocre Ice player I rate icemaps highly where even on a not so perfect run the car enters an iceslide at low rpm so there is no risk of an accidental danger-wedge-slideout. So for example a turn that will always be in low gear 4 and not just on a perfect run (unless I hard crash ofc). Basically avoiding this weird NadeoPhysicsMoment(tm) entirely. Something to keep in mind when building ice that makes the map much less frustrating for the average joe like myself.
Incredible work! Your graphs look very pretty
What an amazing video, thanks for making it clear for us
Finally someone can explain gears in ice sliding properly. Most ice pro players just learned how to play but could never explain what's actually happening xD
These Tools in a learning mode plugin is a good way to address all the issues people have with it. I think It's a very good move that will benefit the community in the long run. And mad props for researching all of this and creating the plugins!
i needed this video, well done :)
Great guide, thank you!
THIS NEEDS TO BEA PLUGIN
Didn't know about the learning mode. That's nice
this game went from having skill and reaction time to having a PHD in physics
Bro's the astrophysicist of trackmania
How have less than 10K people watched this? This is huge!
Here from Wirt. Great video!
Just giving some love, was watching from wirtual video
great work, dude! Wirtual says hi
W Wirtual
i want tm og no gear racing back
this is the best for open planet. the mod becomes a training mod without having to worry about this tools are used in online lobbys or leaderboard ranks. like bakkes mod in rocket league. its just there to get better at the game
Finally more info about the learning mode! Im pretty excited by these, as it can reallh help to see how much you can push any map whatsoever
Wirtual reacted to your video btw. Unfortunately not a lot of people came to visit the original
I came :)
could you make an OpenPlanet extension to display the lines from the video (or link one if it already exists)? (temporarily, until learning mode releases)
280 km/h in gear 0 OMEGALUL
If only nadeo released an update to fix ice... again
Great video!
Interesting to see how exactly it works, the only conclusion out of this is that ice physics are horrible though 😂
Just replace it with no-grip and everything is fine 🫠
I love data backed science! Awesome work!
Can i get the real values for the lines pls? You offered in description (:
I’m pretty new to ice but I’m confused at what happens when I slide out from releasing the throttle?
The overcomplicated mess that is the ice physics is some of what makes it so fun for me :) Also always being cautious to not slide out while also trying to drive good lines on such a weird surface is what makes good ice players so mesmerizing
Wait so is the 'gearbug' actually holding it in in the upper safe zone and not gearing until you come out of the turn? What's happening with gear bugs?
Gearbugs are the shifts inside the danger wedge, but where the car shifts quickly and smoothly rather than sliding out. We haven’t figured out what makes it good vs bad, though :/
@@sergeantbigbird holy shit! That's why they are so hard to get. There have been tracks where I've driven for like 20 mins and got like top 200 ish, watched the wr and there is an insane gear bug. Eventually get one and instantly get like top 50. So powerful! Good to know if I'm sliding out trying gear bugs I'm actually on the right track. Hahaha 😅
The no grip effect has no such problems right
Nicely explained why I hate Ice to death, old ice physics was fine
That explains why I'm so bad at Ice! Thank you for doing this video. I have experienced the weird accel zones and I was quite puzzled as to what was going on under the hood of the game. This explains it. Thank you!
subscribed. technical information like this very good for new players like me that wants to understand what the fuck is going on. why will you not allow for online mode with the plug in. its just giving visual feedback. similar to most other tools in trackmania.
I am amazed and impressed but at the same time not so surprised at how stupid this is and how long it took the community to crack the code. Man nadeoooo xD
bump
averaged MIT student playing trackmania
I feel like paying intense attention to engine sound on ice is one of the most effective ways to learn when you’re about to screw up, of course it isn’t 100% effective but it really helps finding ideal sd angles and slide out angles.
I’d prefer this to be explained slower with more examples and more words. The get the main points but not all details.
hello
HAAAAHHAAAAHAAAA
What annoys me us that no-where in Trackmania does it explain anything about ice sliding. You're suppose to magically figure out it's better to slide.
You can just watch wrs on the leaderboard
did you say nudio? lol
Still no training mode. Bunch of bs 🤷