Good tips on sleeping bag selection. Of course, it is also possible to add a larger sleeping bag over your 3-iseason sleeping bag to gain the warmth needed in cooker conditions or, winter.
in my experience the temperature ratings on sleeping bags are extremely conservative. At comfort I have to open the side up to air out the sweat. At limit it's a good nights sleep and at extreme it's cold enough that I need to think about additional assistance. Like drinking warm tea before bed, putting on a hat and/or socks and making sure to eat properly before going to sleep. But if I do those things even nights at "extreme" temperatures are pretty nice
Thanks for the comment, Tim! I think it depends a lot on the person - I used to sleep super cold but that seems to be changing for whatever reason. Maybe my body is just getting used to it haha.
If I were recommending one temp rating for three-season, it would be 30 F. Most backpackers also carry a puffy, and sleep clothes. Given these, that 30 F bag should be comfortable below 30 F for most backpackers. Conversely, when July and August hit, a 20 F bag might be cast to the side until 3 AM, or even left at home with some other makeshift solution or quilt/bag taken for the much warmer tents. I find that Summer months below 8000 feet just tend to be too warm for a 20 F bag. When thinking about nightly lows, don’t just focus on the forecast if bringing a tent. That’s because a tent will block wind and allow your body heat to impact the temperature inside - a tent can be counted on for being 5 F warmer than conditions outside. This video didn’t mention the sleeping pad. The pad is just as important as the quilt/bag at keeping you warm. If you have an R value below 3.5 in your pad, then in conditions below say 38 F you’re going to feel the difference over say a sleeping pad with a 4+ R value. A bag works in tandem with a pad in keeping you warm. Nowadays, the choice of shelter plays into the bag versus quilt decision. Those planning on hammock camping will be better served with a quilt, IMO. In terms of fill, I agree that 800 is fine and more economical. I think the line in economy is 800/850, versus 900/950/1000. Some companies offer 850 and 900+ at different price points, but many do not offer anything lower than 850 (e.g. Western Mountaineering, Enlightened Equipment, Sea to Summit). I vouch for WM. I have a WM Apache MF bag that I bought almost 25 years ago. It still performs as if it was new. Lofts up quickly and keeps me really warm. It’s rated to 15 F but, at that temp, I can use it unzipped as a quilt just fine. But I’m also on a 5.7 R insulated pad. A lot of a bag’s weight is found in the zipper. If you don’t find yourself using the zipper on trips, consider cutting the zipper off the material that holds it and installing snaps in strategic locations, if necessary, to make a footbox. Many bags have zippers that only go down to mid-calf so these already have a closed footbox defined, even without a zipper. Getting rid of the zipper can save ten ounces on some bags.
Thanks a lot man, excellent video & incredibly helpful. If you'd like any constructive criticism, the only way I'd improve this video is by adding markers to each section of the video (e.g a Marker at 00:23 'Style' / 03:53 'Material' / 07:24 'Temp' - these are incredible useful as a viewer. Keep up the good work bro, subbed.
Thanks so much for the feedback! I've added chapters to my newer videos, just haven't gotten around to updating the old ones yet. I appreciate you watching!
Question: What sleeping pads are you using for your three sleeping bags? Do you use your winter pad all year round? A warm sleeping bag is useless if the pad below you is not warm enough, since the sleeping bag is compressed by body weight. I tried to find out what sleeping pad R-value is used for the ISO 23537 ... no real answer so far. [Edit]: I had to remove the links because yt would not post my comment. A user on reddit /r/Ultralight claims a R-Value of 4 is assumed (at REI). So if your pad is below that you already have to remove some degrees from your bag. mountain-equipment says: "The manikin lies in an air-conditioned room on a standardized sleeping mat. It wears standard pajamas and a cold protection mask" which is pretty useless (what sleeping mat? What is a standard pajama?) Montbell (e.g. Seamless Down Hugger 800 #0) says: "A full length mannequin covered “head to toe” with heaters and temperature sensors is outfitted with base layer top, bottom, hat and socks. The mannequin is place in the sleeping bag and both are put into a climate chamber. The mannequin is heated to simulate body warmth. The air temperature is measured in the chamber and on the surface of the mannequin. [....]" Not even mentioning a sleeping pad is required. I think it is ridiculous that brands are not clearly saying these details. Without saying otherwise you'd have to assume a COMF temp of 4°C means "naked in the bag" without a sleeping pad on the ground, which is obviously BS. Feels a bit like a SCAM.
It’s always the smaller creators that have the best insight and give the most understanding analysis
Thanks so much for the kind words!
My mom bought one kislux and she loves it. It had been there for over 10 years when she went out with it.
Good tips on sleeping bag selection. Of course, it is also possible to add a larger sleeping bag over your 3-iseason sleeping bag to gain the warmth needed in cooker conditions or, winter.
Thanks for the comment! Very true! Only so much I can put in one video haha.
I love kislux that on the butterfly bag it says auguri / tanti auguri which means happy birthday
I don’t miss a day a week kislux This show..
I have a Hammock Gear 20 degree wide and it’s 25 oz. True there are lighter options but for comfort it’s the best for me.
Thanks for the comment! Glad to hear you like it! I'll check them out a bit more - I'm looking for an underquilt
Great video. Thanks for the info.
Thank you so much for watching!
Really good information 😊
Thanks so much! I'm glad you enjoyed it!
I’m looking into building a proper sleep system and your video was incredibly helpful in understanding what the hell is going on. Thank you!
Glad you found it useful!
in my experience the temperature ratings on sleeping bags are extremely conservative. At comfort I have to open the side up to air out the sweat. At limit it's a good nights sleep and at extreme it's cold enough that I need to think about additional assistance. Like drinking warm tea before bed, putting on a hat and/or socks and making sure to eat properly before going to sleep. But if I do those things even nights at "extreme" temperatures are pretty nice
Thanks for the comment, Tim! I think it depends a lot on the person - I used to sleep super cold but that seems to be changing for whatever reason. Maybe my body is just getting used to it haha.
An amazing video, thank you! Have you heard of a company Cumulus? They make pretty sweet down gear.
Thanks so much for the kind words! I have heard of them, but I haven't used any of their gear myself. I'll need to check them out!
If I were recommending one temp rating for three-season, it would be 30 F. Most backpackers also carry a puffy, and sleep clothes. Given these, that 30 F bag should be comfortable below 30 F for most backpackers. Conversely, when July and August hit, a 20 F bag might be cast to the side until 3 AM, or even left at home with some other makeshift solution or quilt/bag taken for the much warmer tents. I find that Summer months below 8000 feet just tend to be too warm for a 20 F bag.
When thinking about nightly lows, don’t just focus on the forecast if bringing a tent. That’s because a tent will block wind and allow your body heat to impact the temperature inside - a tent can be counted on for being 5 F warmer than conditions outside.
This video didn’t mention the sleeping pad. The pad is just as important as the quilt/bag at keeping you warm. If you have an R value below 3.5 in your pad, then in conditions below say 38 F you’re going to feel the difference over say a sleeping pad with a 4+ R value. A bag works in tandem with a pad in keeping you warm.
Nowadays, the choice of shelter plays into the bag versus quilt decision. Those planning on hammock camping will be better served with a quilt, IMO.
In terms of fill, I agree that 800 is fine and more economical. I think the line in economy is 800/850, versus 900/950/1000. Some companies offer 850 and 900+ at different price points, but many do not offer anything lower than 850 (e.g. Western Mountaineering, Enlightened Equipment, Sea to Summit).
I vouch for WM. I have a WM Apache MF bag that I bought almost 25 years ago. It still performs as if it was new. Lofts up quickly and keeps me really warm. It’s rated to 15 F but, at that temp, I can use it unzipped as a quilt just fine. But I’m also on a 5.7 R insulated pad.
A lot of a bag’s weight is found in the zipper. If you don’t find yourself using the zipper on trips, consider cutting the zipper off the material that holds it and installing snaps in strategic locations, if necessary, to make a footbox. Many bags have zippers that only go down to mid-calf so these already have a closed footbox defined, even without a zipper. Getting rid of the zipper can save ten ounces on some bags.
Thanks a lot man, excellent video & incredibly helpful. If you'd like any constructive criticism, the only way I'd improve this video is by adding markers to each section of the video (e.g a Marker at 00:23 'Style' / 03:53 'Material' / 07:24 'Temp' - these are incredible useful as a viewer. Keep up the good work bro, subbed.
Thanks so much for the feedback! I've added chapters to my newer videos, just haven't gotten around to updating the old ones yet. I appreciate you watching!
@@timbschwartz yeah I noticed that after watch some of your recent vids! Top work man keep them coming 🙌🏽👊🏽
Whhhait 😅
Ha! You caught that, eh?
Question: What sleeping pads are you using for your three sleeping bags? Do you use your winter pad all year round?
A warm sleeping bag is useless if the pad below you is not warm enough, since the sleeping bag is compressed by body weight.
I tried to find out what sleeping pad R-value is used for the ISO 23537 ... no real answer so far.
[Edit]: I had to remove the links because yt would not post my comment.
A user on reddit /r/Ultralight claims a R-Value of 4 is assumed (at REI).
So if your pad is below that you already have to remove some degrees from your bag.
mountain-equipment says: "The manikin lies in an air-conditioned room on a standardized sleeping mat. It wears standard pajamas and a cold protection mask"
which is pretty useless (what sleeping mat? What is a standard pajama?)
Montbell (e.g. Seamless Down Hugger 800 #0) says: "A full length mannequin covered “head to toe” with heaters and temperature sensors is outfitted with base layer top, bottom, hat and socks. The mannequin is place in the sleeping bag and both are put into a climate chamber. The mannequin is heated to simulate body warmth. The air temperature is measured in the chamber and on the surface of the mannequin. [....]"
Not even mentioning a sleeping pad is required.
I think it is ridiculous that brands are not clearly saying these details. Without saying otherwise you'd have to assume a COMF temp of 4°C means "naked in the bag" without a sleeping pad on the ground, which is obviously BS.
Feels a bit like a SCAM.
Hey! I use my xtherm or a montbell foam pad depending on conditions. Just picked up a torso length zlite sol for summer but haven’t tried it yet.