Grumman's Ambitious Twin-Engine Carrier Fighter | Grumman XF5F-1 Skyrocket
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 มิ.ย. 2024
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Today we're taking a look at the Grumman XF5F-1 Skyrocket, a prototype interceptor with a big legacy.
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Recommended Reading:
United States Navy Aircraft Since 1911 - amzn.to/3vffUzj
Grumman Aircraft since 1929 - amzn.to/4aDlz1h
Grumman XF5F-1 & XP-50 Skyrocket (Naval Fighters Number Thirty-One) - amzn.to/4alk0oa
0:00 Intro
2:08 Design Origins
6:13 Development of the Design
10:23 Issues Facing Production
14:15 Operational life and Legacy - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
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F.A.Q Section - Ask your questions here :)
Q: Do you take aircraft requests?
A: I have a list of aircraft I plan to cover, but feel free to add to it with suggestions:)
Q: How do you decide what aircraft gets covered next?
A: Supporters over on Patreon now get to vote on upcoming topics such as overviews, special videos, and deep dives.
Q: Why do you use imperial measurements for some videos, and metric for others?
A: I do this based on country of manufacture. Imperial measurements for Britain and the U.S, metric for the rest of the world, but I include text in my videos that convert it for both.
As someone who has learned about airplane design and construction through your channel, I have to ask: would you ever consider making a video going through the design terms that you often use, with visual examples?
I think I've learned most of the terms correctly (dihedral is the positive angle offset from horizontal for wing surfaces, right? and anhedral is the negative offset?), but I'd love to have a single primer with your attention to details and clear examples. Or, if you know of another good source, I'd appreciate that too!
I'm now greatly looking forward to a Tigercat video. It's such a sexy aircraft
On video suggestions, I may be the last one to find out about this, but I heard that Junkers are going to start making Ju 52's again, sounds interesting.
The Tiger Cat is a really pretty plane.
😅😅😅APLL
⁹P
Ah the XF5F. The ye olde Naboo Starfighter.
"Now this is where the fun begins."
It kind of is a proto podracer.
This would be a neat plane to see someone re-create (unarmed) for civilian/stunt/racing use.
hey yah, never even thought of that. good catch!
@@MonkeyJedi99 maybe even with turbopros instead
This plane looks so strange it should have been designed by Blohm and Voss.
A'ight, it ain't _that_ strange lookin'!
No, WAY too symmetrical.
Or the Brits. They had a thing for really pug-nosed twin fighters.
@@sim.frischh9781 In fact its perfectly symmetrical.
It is almost odd enough looking to consider whether it might have escaped from a Blackburn factory
that plane looks like what happens when you full throttle into a overtightened arresting cable too often
Looks like the fuselage is clinging onto its wings for dear life
Engines so powerful they pulled away from the rest of the plane.
Quite an interesting design. I was surprised to see that you knew it had featured in "Blackhawk" comic books.
Was going to say it looked like something straight out of Crimson Skies
The Black Hawk comic book series lasted for over 50 years. This aircraft was the most used in the series. Blue Rider decals did 2 sets of aircraft decals for the series in both 1/72 and 1/48 scales.
This comic book series shouldn’t be compared to the later superhero series of the same. The name Black Hawk was based upon the hero was a Polish pilot who initially stole a PZL P.50 prototype fighter nicknamed the “Jastrzab” (Hawk), painted it black and used it against the invading Germans before it was lost and he escaped to the west. Thus called by the enemy “Blackhawk” and kept that name.
Rex hates XP-50 in WT? BASED
I hate it too. I play 109 f 4 and it’s better in every way
@@mrcat5508Of course it's the whinewaffe.Sorry bro,you want Climbthunder,you get Climbthundered.
@@naamadossantossilva4736 Nah. It’s just broken as all hell and annoying as hell to come up against. Move it to 4.3 or 4.7 and it’ll actually be more or less balanced.
@@naamadossantossilva4736 Found the XP50 player
@@jamesharding3459 Just remove the airspawn.
When I saw the thumbnail, I had a strong nostalgia bump and thought "I wonder why that plane makes me feel so happy?" The Blackhawk appearance is the answer! My uncle collected those comics back in the day, and as a kid in the 80s I read a lot of them whilst visiting my grandmother. Fascinating to learn it was based on a real plane and not pure fiction. :)
F7F Tigercat is one of the best looking twin engine prop plane
Agreed - if it had inline engines it would be very Mossie-like.
@@kumasenlac5504 thin mossie
@@faatihh1130 The UK had the DH 103 Hornet as its twin prop long-haul fighter. Just too late for WW2, it served with distinction in the early bush wars as the Empire unravelled.
BTW Where was the Mosquito chubby ? (o:
@@kumasenlac5504 the side by side seat configuration just made it looks a tad wide
@@faatihh1130 When you have a navigator who doubles as a bomb aimer there has to be a bit of wiggle room...
It wasn't a 'plane for chubbies.
Rex, Thank you, sir, for taking a little time for the other side of the Atlantic. Like the British and the French, we have had 'strange' stuff, too! As an amateur aviation historian myself, I've always championed the less 'bandwagon'ny designer types like Republic, Grumman, etc. Having worked the F-105 and the F-111 for a 20 year career, I'm used to being part of the "we don't talk about them' group. Anyways, have always had a soft spot for the Long Island 'Mafia', and very versed in the Grumman Navy fighter lines from the FF-1 through F-14D. The F5F was, unfortunately a 'stepchild' in that line.
It's ironic how the U.S. Navy could be so silly with Grumman when at the end of the day, before Northrop sucked them up, they pretty much have had a Grumman aircraft on every carrier from the dawn of the fleet carrier force, 1932, until now with the E-2, which I still consider a Grumman legacy aircraft.
What's also ironic is the fact that the F5F-1 was 'logically' marginalized by the Navy's with their darling F4U Corsair design when that aircraft ended up as a much better Marine, land-based aircraft due to its horrible forward vision in landing on carriers, something both the F5F and the F7F were exceptional with. The only reason the F7F, (and the Bearcat) didn't go on to greatness, was the dawn of the F9F. Thank you again Sir!!!!
The thing I like about the channel is the chance to learn about planes I didn't know about like at all. So I just want to continue doing just that! :)
I was just watching a recent Drachinifel video and he mentioned you. And how I'm watching this, and you mention him. Y'all are overdue for another set of crossover videos, they're always fun.
TH-camrs can combine subs with other channels. The subscriber numbers are always inflated.
@@nathanworthington4451 I'm pretty sure that's false though inflated subscriber counts are possible though generally due to bots rather than 'combining scubscrptions'. Secondly who the fuck asked?
@@purplefood1 Though you are entitled to your own opinion, this is a public forum though. Though you may have a potty mouth, try to be cognizant that children may view these comments. Maybe work through those anger issues on your own time though.
@@nathanworthington4451 I'm sorry you can't handle a single instance of bad language. You still failed to answer the question or even attempt to rebut my point and actually dodged it in a manner far closer to that of an attempted troll.
@@purplefood1 Sorry. What was your question? And what does rebut mean?
I see a Rex video, I click the video. I don't make the rules.
Same.
YOU LIKE THE VIDEO!!
A friend of mine once said this thing looks like it's trying to eat a banana horizontally instead of vertically. I think that's a very sound description of this things appearance. And now I know a lot more about it, thank you Rex!
Kind of looks like a Bristol Beaufighter assembled from a kit without instructions. Also those super powerful Wright Cyclones are pulling the wing out the front of the aircraft!
Looks a lot more like Bristol's Type 153A, a slightly earlier design which never made it off the drawing board.
It is impressive how far back the fuselage sits on the wing. The more I see or play with it, the more to me it looks like a German ME-162 holding into it's wings by it's teeth.
This looks like something out of crimson skies.
Sky Rockets in Flight, Afternoon Delight
Rubbing sticks and stones together....
@@NV..V That's it
Starland Vocal Band...one-hit wonder! Nice harmonies, and pre-autotune, too.
This is what Blackhawk flew in the comics. I had no idea it was based on a real plane.
Navy: Why is it over weight
Grumman: Because you made it be overweight
Navy: Ok but why is it over weight
Grumman: "Hey, can I copy your homework."
Bristol: "Okay, just change it a little."
This is one of my favorite military aircraft. Thank you for this amazing history video 👏 😊
I have always been intrigued by that design. Nice to have a breakdown of its developmental teething years. Thank you!
Amazing video, lovely delivery and a great history on a wonderful prototype
The Good 'Ole Grumman Iron Works P.s.- while the space saving reason is sound and most carrier craft then carried only single engine types, but the Navy has always been open to dual engine aircraft due to it's redundancy over open water.
Back to basics. Great job! Love the historical references!
Home dog in the picture 17:53 is absolutely ghouling in the cockpit💀
Your vids paired with great 3d models is such a good combo
Another excellent deep dive into experimental and prototype aircraft. I'm a huge fan of odd prototypes and experimental designs of any transportation machines
Another Great historical video by Rex. Thank you!
I love that Drachinifel referenced you in a video i just watched so I came to watch some of your stuff and you reference him, it's great.
Im liking the mutual shoutouts between you and Drach
PLEEEASE keep up the longer videos! I live for these
I love these videos about planes and prototypes with the deep dives into why they were designed such a way and why they failed.
During the Vietnam war, we would occasionally have US and Australian aircraft carriers drop int to Garden Island Naval Dockyard in Sydney and I met the Grumman Tracker there as a teen. I recall thinking how clever Grumman were to have shrunk a twin engine aircraft down to such a size.
Great video, thanks Rex!
That plane might as well be the A-10,s long lost cousin… (they look somewhat similar just different engine types and arrangement of them) or maybe a smaller scale ground attack aircraft that could operate in spots where the A-10 is not able to reach.🤔
Can't wait for the Tigercat episode. Ever since I was a kid playing Aces over the Pacific the late war Navy fighters have always been some of my favorites, the Bearcat and Tigercat being my top picks.
Impressive airplane. Thank you for bringing this story.
I love the fact you don’t use music bed. Very refreshing!
I have a actually photo of this aircraft. my moms bowling friends dad was an air force photographer from 34’ - 46’ and she gave me most of his photos after his passing
As always, excellent content.
Great Job Rex!
I built a few model kits of this plane years ago, both the short and long nose versions. Awesome looking plane.
The long-nosed machine was the Army's XP-50. Looking at that you can see where the Tigercat came from...
A useful learning exercise for the superior F7F.
FWIW, I have heard just a bit about Kelly Johnson's _reluctance_ to deal with the US Navy from other sources.
Great video. Got yourself a new subscriber
*The Skyrocket's boxy twin tail is highly reminiscent of Grumman's later Hawkeye and Greyhound aircraft that are still being used today. You can definitely see the family resemblance. I wonder if the **_Skyhawks_** comics mentioned at the **18:28** mark had anything directly or indirectly to do with the naming of the Hawkeye?...* 🤔
At 18:21, the similarity to the future A-10 Warthog comes to mind.
I love this goober of a plane so much.
Thanks for your in-depth look at this aircraft. I have seen other reviews, but none explained the aircraft's failings as well as yours. Overheating and gear failure for a carrier based aircraft? No wonder the Navy looked elsewhere.
The story of the Tigercat is one I'm looking forward to. Been a fan of it since seeing it at air shows as a little kid.
I have already watched this on Patreon. I will watch it again.
Bragging flex. 💪 Go you! 🤣
@@CathodeRayNipplez???
@@ALCO-C855-fan "Lexie the autistic Diesel" is the best YT name ever! 🤣
@@CathodeRayNipplez Thx.^^
Hope, ya sub.
Awesome thanks rex
Thanks Rex
Not to be confused with the Vought XF5U "Flying Flapjack".
That's why they have different designations for manufacturer. F for Grumman and U for Chance-Vought.
Love this plane! I have a plastic scale model of it.
Another plane I'd never heard of. Very interesting.
The XF5F is one of my favorite plane designs of all time. It's just so funky and unique. Sadly, models of the plane are very hard to come by these days, and the ones that were manufactured weren't exactly impressive.
I was also surprised to see that the F7F was originally an Army concept!
What a fascinating aircraft. Thank you! AON: has anyone ever mentioned that you have a very similar accent and cadence to Mike Brady over at Oceanliner Designs?
There is quite a similarity
Has anyone ever seen them in the same room together? 🤔
Now thats pod racing!
I don’t know why you get so few likes, I always love your content and the dedication to the history and production thereof
I swear the 40s through 70s had to be the only time periods were aircrafts looked completely alien. And I couldn't be happier.
The twin engine configuration is what killed it: engine procurement was the bottleneck.
It looks like something that would be flown by one of Don Karnage's lackeys in TaleSpin. I love it.
That mockup was interesting. First fuselage design definitely presages the Hellcat...
This is the plane flown by the international squadron in one of the justice league episodes, the one where the league is thrown into the past during an alternate ww2 won by Vandal Savage on behalf of Germany.
I know many don’t like the looks of this plane, but personally, I’m a big fan, with the lot looking like a rather odd Pod Racer. Maybe a nose, like the XP-50 that goes beyond the wing, but stops before the propellers could also be interesting
Me as a player of Crimson Skies: High Road to Revenge back in high school:
"Does it come with magnetic rockets?"
Now I'm waiting for the Tigercat episode.
this plane literary looks like the designers accidentally moved the fuselage back
A prelude to the F7F
Saying a specific aircraft design was something never seen before in the 1930s early 1940s does not narrow the field by much. When aircraft were going obsolete in a matter of months, everything was new all the time.
19:10
“…Recent reappearance in various video games and flight simulators, sometimes displaying questionably excessive performance figures…”
* cough *
*Warthunder*
* cough *
This bad boy is goated in WarThunder
Good subject. But what struck me was the aerodynamic efficiency of the thing. In the opening shots it is generating so much lift even at rest that it can't keep its wheels on the ground!
love how u took the thumb
nal staight out of wt
The Skyrocket typified the popular 30's design philosophy of "put the biggest engine into the smallest airframe". The F4F was the culmination of that philosophy.
A couple of things:
-Well, you can hardly blame the USN for strictly adhering to the weight limits after the Buffalo fiasco.
-Weak landing gear is a recipe for disaster in a carrier fighter.
-Temperamental, overheating engines are a huge problem for any aircraft, let alone a carrier fighter...in the Pacific.
-Just looking at the XF5F it's pretty clear that it would be much more expensive and time consuming to build compared to the Hellcat. Production matters.
-Two engines means double the maintenance over a single-engine plane. That's a big problem on a carrier, with limited facilities and mechanics.
-Mixed armaments also slows down the rearming process.
-Bigger planes are going to slow down the tempo of arming and refueling in the hanger, and slow down getting the planes spotted on the carrier deck by taking up more room on the elevators.
-Bigger planes usually also mean fewer planes embarked. The first twin-engine carrier plane tested for the USN (Douglas XT2D-1 torpedo-bomber) was not accepted mostly because it took up so much room in the hanger.
-By the time the prototype was ready, its competitors already outpaced it in every department except climb rate (especially in speed). Climb rate was less important, especially in the advent of radar.
-The XF5Fs competitors, the Hellcat and later Corsair, were just better aircraft.
Good points. Please explain / elaborate how climb rate is less important? Its super important to be above your enemy is it not?
@@kleinerprinz99detection radius - when using the radar, detection radius (especially for high flying airplanes) was much higher than Mk 1 eyeballs with binoculars, giving more time to intercept than previously estimated 5 minutes window
Vision over the nose would have been great but off axis in the lower front would be abysmal. Even so, I always liked this little Grumman try.
The rapid development of radar put another nail in the Skyrocket's coffin. Extreme climb rates became far less important when you can see the enemy coming long before they arrive.
Have you done a video on the XP-67 Moonbat yet? It's one of my favorite aircraft that never served and it's story is tragic!
This became the air mount of the Blackhawks. A WW 2 comic book that fought the Nazis.
Yes, he mentions that in the video. A WW2 comic book fighting the Nazis seems a bit of a stretch, though 😆
This aircraft, the McDonnell "Moonbat", and the XF5U "Flapjack" are to me the most captivating US what-if's of the WWII era. All of them just too ahead of their time, with the Skyrocket redeemed in the form of the Tigercat. The Moonbat was new engine/airframe and suffered accordingly. With Allison engines it most likely would've been able to prove its performance merits without catching fire repeatedly. The XF5U most likely would have been snapped up by the Royal Navy, winning out to the Sea Fury and later Wyverns and receiving some brittish turbo-prop conversion A-la Merlin Mustang style.
Always a great day watching this channel
tiger cat is such a good looking plane
The unwritten (15th) Skunk Works rule: "Starve before doing business with the damned Navy. They don't know what in hell they want and will drive you up a wall before they break either your heart of a more exposed part of your anatomy." (Skunk Works, page 272, "The Ship That Never Was")
I thought you were going to say A-10, since it resembles one of those with the engines on backwards. Cool plane either way.
The Grumman XF5F Housecat.
Looks like something straight out of the Crimson Skies universe
One of the planes the Blackhawks flew.
This is one of my favorite airplanes,
When I saw the non-side view of the tailplane I instantly thought of the Miles Student.
I wish someone would restore the Miles Student, or build a replica.
I have seen this plane in the animated series Justice League during the altered past double episode introducing the Black Hawk squadron and Vandal Savage
I was just watching an episode of the animated Justice league where they had one of these planes show up was wondering what it was
I just saw a plane video with a very familiar looking tumbnail and i just "ah, press"
What is name of video made by Drachinifel that is mentioned on 03:40?
Ah yes, the XP-50 with ''extra chromosomes'' as dubbed by a certain Dutch Warthunder pilot.
Ah, the first podracer.