Conquering Kickback
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ม.ค. 2018
- Table saw expert Kelly Mehler takes us to the source to explain why kickbacks occur on table saws and shares multiple ways to avoid them. For more, visit: www.popularwoodworking.com/te...
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Many people don't know about kickback until it happens. Brilliant information Kelly, the best I have seen so far. Straight to the point :) Thank you ॐ
Kick back kills 😱 and don't forget Joe Bidem is evil
The video is four years old, yet still valid today as when it was made. Great educational video and one that should be viewed by all table saw users.
That was THE most educational vid regarding kickback. I currently use a zero plate without additionally safety parts. I will do as you suggested. That huge “safety device” is intimidating to newbies as myself. Thanks
Best table saw safety video for beginners and experts. Thank you.
Thank you Kelly! I’ve been nervous around my table saw since I got it, after hearing horror stories of the accidents involved. This video explained so much!
Thank you very much for such an indepth explanation. Just bought my first table saw so making sure that my first cut is as safe as possible.
Great Video, I liked that he used foam. Got the point across and safe. I also just ordered myself a Sawstop job site model to replace a super old Craftsman model table Saw but was talking to a friend at work about ordering a Sawstop and how painful the cost is. I told them about 5 years ago I tore the hell out of my fingers due to kickback. I decided to cut a small notch in a hard rubber/plastic block I was using to smack the new floorboards in on my house. Kickback occurred and you could see the exact same arc on the block as in the video. It smashed/crushed two of the tips of my fingers on my left hand. A trip to urgent care and stitches. My pointer finger is still pretty marred and my other finger has a clear scar and I consider myself lucky. My curiosity got to me and I googled how fast of speed is the object kickbacked is moving. I found this video. To this day it reminds me of how careful and that you better respect that tablesaw. Sawstop or no Sawstop.
What a great tutorial. Very instructional and I will most certainly put back the riving knife or make a zero tolerance with a riving insert. Many thanks
Been thinking about getting tablesaw and would want to use it correctly. This is by far the best video about kickback I've yet seen. Thank you.
Great explanation and solution. Having felt the effect of 'Kick-back" - friggin sore and fortunately no missing digits! - I really like the solution offered at the end. Thanks Kelly!
Best video on 'kickback' that I have found yet. Very in depth, thank you!
Fellows, take multiple rests during big repetitive jobs. Sit a moment and reflect on what your doing, then back to work. I hope none of us ever get to complacent. It seems every time I get relaxed and sure of what I am doing is when I forget some small thing. Thank you for being safe.
Bought a SawStop after a kickback incident the other day. All the woodworking people I trust have one. I also came close to losing a finger about 12 years ago and the SawStop is the only solution out there today. Costs more but cheaper than body parts. Excellent video!!
Still won't stop you from dying to internal bleeding after the saw decides to smack your guts with a block of wood coming at you at 100 km/h.
One of the best vids regarding the cause of table saw kickback. It was easy to understand and very informative. Thank you.
I use the blade guard, anti-kickback pawls and riving knife every time.
This was the best safety video I have seen regarding the table saw.
Oh crap, I'm glad I saw this. I bought a used table saw with no guard on it and I can't get one for it, it's discontinued. That's $50 I'm happy to throw to the garbage. I will only buy a new one for now on fully loaded. A very well done video, scared the bajesus out of me. I just put my brand new Bosch router and router table together. I hope they are safer to use. I have watched many safety videos for the router and tables.
I guess it's kind of like when I was a journeyman printer. I ran massive litho printing presses, I feared them and respected them every day for 26 years. I have all my fingers, many guys do not. Fear and respect your tools, when you lose that fear and respect you lose your appendages.
you can make a splitter that mimics most of the functionality of a riving knife with a insert and a couple tabs of wood
Smart move brother, the $50 is worth any of your 10 digits..
Karsten, Love your comment. Fear and respect are what I learned 40 years ago. Trimmed a thumb on a dado blade when the wood kicked back. Still do woodworking to this day and fear and respect go a long way to keeping me safe. By the way. I was trimming a curved piece of plywood on the router table several year ago. The wood was attached to a template. The router bit caught the wood and pulled the wood around 8”. If I was holding on the edge, it would not have been pretty. Right after that, I put two large handles on the template which greatly increased my control and kept my hands away from the bit. Live and learn; never to late to learn, but don’t like relying on luck. Every tool needs to be respected. Wish you well.
Very useful video, to have an understanding of how this happens. Thanks for posting.
Thank you for your time AND exposure to hurting yourself for a super demo and emphasis for safety in the shop.
best explanation I've seen so far. thank you 🙏🏽
Thank you for this excellent video.
I'm starting to get interested in wood working as a hobby. I will probably be getting my first table saw in the next year, and I'd never heard about kick back. This will hopefully help me avoid it!
I have an old 1970's Unisaw that I purchased and restored.
It did not come with a blade guard, nor a riving knife.
I've only encountered a kick back once and that event work me up and made me very safety consciousness. I like standing to the right behind the Fence and using push sticks and I think kick backs will be to the left of the table saw.
Just this afternoon I did a relook at my Unisaw and noted that there is a mounting bracket for a splitter. Found a scrape metal bracket and mounted it and aligned it with washers. Still thinking of more safety modifications for my antique Unisaw. Wish there were more options for those of us who use a decades old table saw.
BTW, I really like the idea you showed with the Zero Insert where you just inserted a wedge in the slot. I think that will be one tip I'll start using.
Thanks again for the great video. I found it very informative.
Really good demonstration! Cheers! Chris.
Kickback is one of my biggest problems, thank you for the information.
and one of mine - is wife
I just bought a table saw, and I will follow all your safety tips when using the saw thank you
Outstanding. This has troubled me as a new tablesaw (budget) DIYer. Best explanation of the physics that I’ve seen. Feel much happier. Thank you.
The best video regarding the topic. Thank you mate.
Time to dig out the cover/anti-kick/riving knife that came with my saw and apply this new information and understanding. Very well presented. Very convincing. And, no hysterics required, at all. Just useful and rationally explained facts. Thank you! Also, time to make that zero clearance throat plate I only think about when I see another piece disappears down the hole.
The best explanation I've seen, thanx!
This is the clearest video that I've seen
I am a very lucky guy. ... Time to upgrade my thought process and my table saw. Good stuff.
Great explanation. Also love the Felder.
Brilliant and very clear video.Thank you
That is the best video I have ever (30+ years woodworking) seen with excellent instruction and demonstration! Thank you!
I lost parts of two fingers on my table saw but it was complacency and overconfidence that caused it. The piece of wood flipped instantaneously and pushed my fingers into the blade. I could have prevented it by making the cut safer, but I didn’t.
Microjig makes those little splitters that you demonstrated with the small piece of wood. Perhaps I should buy them but I need different thicknesses for different thickness blades. Unfortunately I would have to drill into my table saw top because there is little distance from blade at full height to its opening at the rear.
Anyway, thank you for the superb video!
Great explanation. I took a woodworking course and though we where told to use the guards and a riving knife, the reason for kickback was not explained. We were told the riving knife was more for the release of wood tension and twisting, not the wood being pushed back into the blade causing kickback. This is a must watch.
Great video and information, thank you!
Thank you sincerely for this video. I have watched quite a few of them but your's explained several things I still did not understand.
Thank you for this very helpful video. May many fingers be spared from your tutorial.
On my old Delta Unisaw, it had no capacity to retrofit a riving knife, but after watching Kelly's DVD and reading his book on mastering the table saw, I got (and still have) the "disappearing splitter" in conjunction with the Biesemeyer over-arm guard. The current crop of Deltas come with an official riving knife, which tilts and goes up and down with the blade and an easy-to-remove blade guard. I do like that very much.
Thank you, great skills at teaching in the shop.
I’m going to buy a shield and use it while using the table saw. This is the only tool that makes me somewhat nervous. But I’m confident enough to follow all the safety advice from all the videos I’ve seen including reading the owners manual.
This is an excellent video. it's helpful to see how things work. I always use these devices whenever possible. The question I have is about riving knives and the thickness of the blade. I changed to a thicker blade and followed DeWalt's instructions to buy a thicker riving knife. But I couldn't figure out why. It was not the kerf, but the body of the blade that was too thick according to their specs. I did it anyway, but it would help to see why it was needed.
Thanks for the detailed explanation!
Good information! Thank you for sharing.
Great video! Thanks for sharing!
I have a contractor (portable) table saw. The plastic cover is designed (?) so it won't stay upright. With it installed measuring to the blade is very difficult. It also has pawls but their tension is so high it leaves groves in any wood passing under them. Luckily the riving knife is a separate part that can (and is) used all of the time. I'm not saying the cover is a bad idea but it has to be made in a way that allows setup for cuts to be accomplished easily.
Agree, the best explanation I’ve seen. 👍👍
I'm not a wood worker, but love watching creative people make things. So allow me to ask what will most likely seem like a stupid question.
Since the wood entering the saw cut receives downward pressure as demonstrated at 1:10 and the kickback occurs from the back upward rotation of the saw teeth biting into the wood due to being pushed or twisted into the back of the blade at 4:00 - Why not stand behind the blade and pull the wood through the saw? That way you could stand anywhere that would allow control of the feed, and if kickback occurred, it would throw it away from you. So now, to all you wood workers out there, let me have it. but please be gentle LOL
Thank You Sir!!! Great Info!!! Much Appreciated!!! 👍😎
Very informative. Thanks.
Very good video, thank you!
Thank you for sharing.
Very succinct. Thank you it will help.
Very. Nice explain. thank u
Excellent video. Great breakdown on why it happens, the logic, the truth about the table saw culture. Riving knife is the Living knife😁
great video thank you
Very good safety video, it does works :)
I think one contributing factor to people not using safety equipment is woodworking TH-cam channels. This will be especially apparent in future generations that have grown up watching TH-cam. Most of them are amateurs at best and seem to thrive on going against any safety features and demonise any commenters that pull them up on it. Almost all of them won't use a guard or riving knife and some don't even use a push stick.
Theres one guy called Jamie Mantzel that made his own table saw out of a circular saw and had a wonky fence on it. He made out like anyone saying it was dangerous were idiots and ended up totally disabling the comments after a while. There should be rules put into place about what you can publish on TH-cam imo. This guy is free to do super dangerous stuff, but he shouldn't be able to film it and influence all the young kids that watch his videos.
Right, I almost get deceived just by watching some youtube videos, because it looks easy while it's actually very dangerous and can be fatal if not done properly. Glad I search more information about the safety before buy the tool or even try to make it by myself.
Very useful. Thanks
Thank you very much
What about using table saw just for sawing and for non through cuts other machines like router or other type of saw?
Blade cover simple to install and remove.
I had one, spring loaded pin put it on the saw turned the saw on ate the guard comming off the blade at 100 miles an hour, never stand in the firing line when turning on your saw, also some of the blade covers are a poor design at best. I use board buddies on my big saw and was thinking of buying Jessems tablesaw stock guides. This design makes you fell a little safer on a tablesaw it hold your wood to the table and fence and has anti kickback rollers
Microjig has a add on safety pin.
system
I like the saw your using, sliding table, jointer , planer, shaper router table almost every power tool you would want in one small footprint.
And it's very accurate.
For ripping, I had coup!e feather boards attached to my fence at two points to prevent kickback, one before and one after the blade and still resulted in an accident. What happened was my pushstick touched the top of the blade (I think) which was only exposed 1/4" above the wood. Next thing i noticed was a bloody pushstick imprint on my arm. It came at me so fast, really no time to react. That was my lucky day, could have been much worse.
you NEVER should apply pressure after the blade. so the feather board after the blade is the culprit. you only need one feather board before the blade.
@@oaplosnikos I think real culprit was sticking the push stick into the blade
I heard someone argue that americans tend to use their table saws for many types of creative cuts they just weren't made for. Over here in euroupe we often use the included riving knives but are left to figure out what other tools could perform the task at hand. Great video!
Very good words for security for all
Thank you.
I have a Grizzly G1023 table saw. Is there a riving knife that fits it that will have the removable blade guard? I do not find one in my search. Thanks
This guy is Awesome!!!!!
I can use the riving knive on my tablesaw while making grooves, so I do. I own a Metabo TS254.
Great safety and informational video.
I kept noticing the cover on the drill press behind you. Is that a shop mod or was that factory implemented in a time with fewer safety regulated?
It's a factory cover from a few decades ago
As a right hander, would it work if I moved the fence over and stood on the left behind the fence, that way id still have control of my cut?
How close to the back of the blade should my spliter sit? Mine sits about 2 inches behind. Should it be closer to the blade?
Thanks I have had a kickback recently. I just got a scratch on my hand. But why is your blade so high above the work?
Are there any links to the products you mentioned?
I got my new tablesaw and bought a second riving knife. The original with the guard I use as often as I can because it aids dust collection, the second knife I cut down to be in line with the top of the blade so I can do all the other cuts. Add to that a gripper and a good sized push block.
Hi Kelly and Thank you very much for the explanation. It was very helpful to understand "kickback" in depth. But I still have a question if you don not mind.
Nevertheless I use a riving knife an a guard I get kickback quite often and the only reason I did not have serious injuries yet is the fact that the guard stops the kickbacking piece form lifting, which instead shoots with a lot of energy backwards. If I did not stand on the left side of the blade it was a problem. I used tape on the fence up to the level where the teeth start, but it is sometimes not enough clearance to prevent kickback. First I thought it was a problem with the setup of my table saw but it does not seems to be one. What do you think about it? Thanks!
Sorry to hear of your issues. You mention that it doesn't seem to be a setup problem, but the two places I would check first would be the blade (and trunnions) squareness to the table, and the fences' squareness to the blade. Check the blade-to-table relationship first by measuring the distance to the miter gauge slot at the front and rear of the blade. If they're not the same, then the table top is out of square with the blade assembly. Your owners manual should be able to help you adjust that. The fence can also be measured against the miter gauge slots, and while it has sometimes been recommended that the fence be slightly out of parallel (wider at the outfeed), I disagree and think that perfectly parallel is still the best. I hope this helps with your issue. - David Thiel PWM
HP41CY, we'd like to share your question (and a response) with our readers...can you contact me at david.thiel@fwmedia.com? Thanks!
Popular Woodworking Hi David,
Your Email adress did not work for which reason ever. Therefore I answer here: You can of course share my question and answer with your readers. The only thing I would like to ask you for is (because I am a German) to correct my English if it should be poor.
Kind Regards
Martin
P.S. I guess you are absolutely right and even a lot of Pros get that point wrong, which might be the reason for the tale of the opening fence on the outfeed side. I am for sure going to check my table saw again.
Very good presentation on a very important subject. Unfortunately the volume kept dropping. With my smart phone volume at max i finished the video with the spesker against my ear.
Actually, one of the other guys doing a cautionary video, who was deliberately attempting to create kickback had it throw to the left of the fence. There literally is no truly safe place within about 30-45 degrees either side of the blade angle.
So wait, since the blade throws material to the left when it kicks back are you supposed to be standing to the right of the blade? Or do the anti-kickback effects of holding the workpiece from the left justify standing to the left of the blade? I’m confused. I’m a beginner and I’ve been standing behind the fence when I cut and I will admit it does make it way more difficult to push the workpiece and keep it on the fence so if it’s not that dangerous and even helps to prevent kickback it would be great to stand to the left. I just can’t tell which Kelly is saying is the correct position haha. Someone please help
I hear a cat meowing at 5:03 very clearly! Ha
haha... went to check... ur right!
This was great info for a noob like me.
Riving knife and cover has been normal at my life in europe. In US, is using anti-kickback stuff unusual in work too or only a home saw problem?
It has become more normal now, but it wasn't that many years ago that it was unusual. We're all better off now. - David Thiel
When did Kelly become a slider-saw convert? I love that machine and have a terrible case of Felder envy. (Or Martin or Altendorf. Heck, even an SCMI or Robland would be nice.)
He initially went to sliders because of the safety features (not that they aren't great saws in their own right!).
I totally agree. With a "Friz + Franz" jig, even cutting small pieces can be made safely. And the slider can make quick, easy, and safe work of large panels and large piece cross-cuts. A slider is definitely on the list for my next big-ticket shop purchase. Other than the cost and huge footprint, I never understood why they are not more popular in the US. (Oh.., duh!)
Interesting. Does it matter what width a riving knife has? More or less thick than the blade?
Slightly thicker is recommended, otherwise is just binds the kerf. This becomes tricky if you switch to a thin-kerf blade for any operation...hence a more easily removed (and replaced) riving knife!
Actually it should be slightly thicker than the blade, but still thinner than the overall tooth (ripping) width.
Not many thumbs down on this video because most people watching this after an accident are missing fingers, and possibly the thumb.
I'm watching all the kickback videos before ordering a table saw.
I shall mend my ways.
Can kickback occur on the cut off piece?
Altought i knew this could happen i recently resawed my fingers, folks, use protections, i can assure you it hurts
Giacomo Battisti how old are you?
@@robohjhonson3711 18, my fingers healed pretty well tho
The riving knife is the best splitter design because it can be used for through cuts and dado cuts. Most people remove the stupid lawyer designed splitter guard because it only address a few safety issues but makes other types of cuts hazardous such as ripping narrow pieces under an inch that gets trapped between fence, guard, and blade when trying to push piece with a push stick. This may not cause a dangerous kickback but traps piece and destroys it.
How many times does he say "basically"?
I have a Porter Cable table saw. Not the best thing in the world, but it works. One NICE feature is that the "riving knife" is a separate item from the blade guard and hold-down fingers. This is good considering in order to use the blade guard and hold-down fingers you need to have the blade nearly all the way raised, and we know this is dangerous too. Next, if I am cutting a board thicker than say 3/4" Plywood, the fingers are too highly tensioned due to the poor design and you can't push the wood through...the blade guard also will not go up more than about 1" off the table. In my opinion (and I'm not an expert, I didn't stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night, and I'm a rank amateur) is that the Portercable Table Saw safety features were very poorly designed and were put in because "they had to"...
In the end, I just use my Riving Knife on my table saw..
Great video, but volume oh volume just could have been a lot louder
Has anyone heard from Kelly? I can't find anything from him in the last few years.
Everyone needs to read and understand exactly what is being communicated here.. I’m 82 and have a 1970’s Craftsman full size table saw, and like many of you I lost the attachment to the saw many years ago. This was my third Table Saw Kick Back TSKB. And after my last preventative TSKB accident and being rusher to the hospital for emergence surgery a week ago, having to have 5” of my severely damaged lower bowel removed and sectioned back together. Five of those days with a tube down my nose and into my stomach for drainage and 100% liquid diet. After a week in the hospital you can bet I’m taking that cast iron Buddy in the garage more seriously.
AND YOU NEED TO ALSO.
Mr.Chips
Like the others previously I have a new table saw in the UK. my table saw came with a riving knife, a guard, and according to the blurb a 10" blade with ANTI KICKBACK DESIGN. Have you heard of this before, and does it work ?. Must say the blade looks a bit weird. Many thanks for a thoroughly good video.
Why are you operating a saw without a riving knife n a crown guard
Most saws will allow you to install just a "splitter", which is the anti-kickback device. It is a metal plate just thinner than the kerf in the correct position. Instead of the whole guard, you use just this metal plate splitter. This is like a riving knife but not as close to the blade as a modern riving knife, which is merely a splitter positioned closer to the blade than in old-fashion saws.
The OEM guard does not work well. One suspended from the ceiling or from a wide inverted L frame beside the saw will work better. This will allow non-through cuts.
Ejection can be prevented by feather boards.
Vertical restraints will prevent kickbacks. These should be installed as an integral part of the fence. BTW, I tend to think that one virtue of any rip fence has to be the ease of installing shop-made vertical restraints. The fence show here is not the best in this regard. I prefer a fence with a solid rectangular profile so that an auxiliary fence with vertical restraints can be easily attached. one has to be sure that the whole fence will not be lifted, hence clamping at the far end is desirable, which I do with longer and thicker wood.
I also rip with the bandsaw and then joint with the TS.
Riving Knife should not be in line with saw blade though
+- 0.3 mm to the right slightly outside the saw blade. PS it is best to make a Riving Knife from spring material BV. aluminium. And the wood remains pressed against the guide and the rest of the wood remains clamped in place against the guide and cannot shoot away, no kickback saw wood ((I've had it like this for years and it works perfectly) ) win win situation
Blade is way too high,maybe for an exaggerated effect?
I had a price of wood kick back and hit me in the chest. It knocked the breath out of me. I felt all over my chest and didn't feel any damage I thought whew I'm ok. Then I look down and I'm covered in blood. The wood ripped my thumb open from the bottom all the way around to the top.
hank hill - I hope you faired well after it happened. Do you know the cause? Mis-aligned fence, push pressure point too close to the fence?
I had to get 7 stitches. It didn't damage any tendons or ligaments lucky. It been 1.5 years and most of the feeling came back in it. I can do everything with it completely normal except use scissors it hurts . It was a homemade table saw my cousin made. It was a circle saw mounted to the bottom of a plywood table. It had zero safety no fence just a blade. I was cutting probably 3 to 4 inch thick wood disc in half for the wood stove. I think I pushed it and it lifted or bound up Idk really. It happened so fast and hit so hard. I'm just glad my hand was Not pulled into the blade only the force of the wood peeled my thumb open basically.It was a cut more like a tear and rip. Very very stupid. I haven't used a table saw since. I'm terrified of them now.