It's what we musicians would call a "player-grade instrument." Tastefully modified long ago, enjoyed as the functional art ever since, without obsessive concern over keeping it pristine.
I have a Selmer BA Alto which was relacquered 40 years ago. A beautiful job, and that's what people (not me) did back then. Still plays beautifully, but valued way down now.
I don't know that you can say there's much tasteful in gutting a figured mahogany slab like that. I can only hope the wood that came off that table was used for something else because there aren't too many mahogany trees of that size left
@@icturner23 Are you referring to the modifications made decades ago? Before advances in materials science there wouldn't have been any functional alternatives to leather. Animal skins have been, and still are in some cultures, essential in clothing people. Had this desk not been salvaged by recovering it, it's only function would be firewood. Hardly a fitting end for the beautiful wood that constructed it. I'm sure he said it had been lovingly cared for for decades. That would imply it was reconfigured long before the advent of PVC or similar.
Furniture was made to be used and to have wear and tear on it, the fact it has survived this long makes it invaluable for someone’s collection at home or office to be continually useful still.
What is overlooked too is, the guy claims 1820, but for all anyone knows it was a very good table made in 1890 in that STYLE, the same as we do to-day with replicating old styles but in crappier materials unfortunately.
Veneer has a short lifespan, it tends to flake, crack and warp within 100 years. I’m sure a piece of mahogany veneer large enough for that table top would be very expensive to replace before paying a professional furniture restorer to set it in. :)
My grandparents had the exact table, along with matching coffee table and end tables... the big table had the original wood top and that table alone was insured for $30,000... 25 years ago. After my grandfather died, my grandmother whom had never had anything to do with the house finances, apparently sold the whole set for $2000 and was quite pleased about it. She sold hundreds of thousands of dollars of antiques for pennies on the dollar... before she moved to a retirement home. The family had no idea what she had done until afterwards, her last few tears could have been much more comfortable if only she hadn't been bamboozled so badly.
"Him and that bloody furniture, don't know what he's always banging on about it for, I think it's dreadful old fusty stuff, can't wait to be rid of it"
My wife threatened to sell my golf club collection when I went and I had to bring her to my office at home and show her the value of some of the stuff. I have several first-edition, signed books, including Ben Hogan, Sneed, Bobby Jones, Nicklaus, Watson, Norman, and Woods. I was fortunate enough to live at Augusta for over 15 years and I had access yearly to some of the best players in the world. One of my books signed by Ben Hogan and authenticated was appraised at a show for over $6,800.00 due to excellent condition and clear signature. I also have a picture of it being signed at the time. Wives don't know what they don't know.
He had a good result for he brought the table in 1969 for £600 and the expert values it at £12,000.00 in 1999 - It was loved and highly used so that's the whole point of enjoying furniture.
I attend estate auctions and it's quite common to see beautiful pieces of solid oak, mahogany, and chestnut furniture going for a few hundred dollars each. The problem is a 19th century piece of furniture does not fit modern house decor or the uses for furniture that we have today.
As an antiquarian I must admit this is true, a lot of 19 century furniture pieces are gigantic and some are hard to sweep around, some need to be reupholstered and other repairs and care that new furniture doesn’t need. I read somewhere(I believe it was out of one of Alice Winchester’s books) that the 1920s were a golden age of antique collecting where pieces could be feached for much cheaper prices than the 1950s(where it became fashionable again). :)
Almost certainly. There is no doubt that it would have been in a dire state and any restoration would have devalued it. The only question is if the leather devalued it more.
I have the same issue with Craftsman/Mission antiques. I bought many 30 years ago because I enjoyed it, and not then as investment. The latter certainly never worked out.
@@seanduncan1284 simply the Britain I was born in and grew up in, you seriously can't believe that this country is better in 2023 than it was 25 or 30 years ago 🤔
@@seanduncan1284you don't see it? The lack of Karen's the happiness in everyone face without the emotional drag of bad times. The people's character display a lack of conflict and frustration. You can tell everyone in that room had the capacity to agree to disagree on controversial topics.
In response to some of the comments regarding price and value, I think some of us are in denial about antique lovers and how things are valued. I might not give you a nickel, personally, for a particular piece, but the evaluation by an "expert" sets a price that a person who IS in the market for it, will have to work from. It doesnt matter if 99% of the world's population isnt in the market, for the 1% who is, that expert has given them the appraised value they were looking for. It doesnt matter what you might get for it at a flea market on any given weekend. Its all about what you would get for it at a sale where a room full of people who ARE looking for it, would pay. Ultimately, its value is what the owner says its worth is.
I would say additionally that (if youre a collector) you could maybe find that piece of furniture at a garage sale for far cheaper, but you would be taking a much larger gamble on authenticity and wear. Whereas an appraised piece, though much more expensive, has been officially vetted for authenticity and wear. And that is worth something to the 1% like you are talking about.
In a market economy, the value of something is what a prospective buyer with proven funds is actually offering. That may or may not be what the current owner thinks it is worth.
Much like Ebay selling, there's no "blue book" valuation on such things, people dont "collect" desks like they collect antique inkwell, or Wedgewood china or coins, you put a value on an item and hope for best,if someone buys it that doesnt mean its WORTH that amount, it only means that one person wanted it enough to pay that amount. Theres sites on the web that cite Ebay selling prices as what that item is "worth" and it's silly
One of the few people I've seen say "that's to much". Normally they think the thing is made of solid gold. Either this guy is the most level headed person ever or he just really wanted to be on tv.
I think it (35k) might have been a valuation for insurance purposes by an agent of the insurance company, the higher the value the more you pay on the insurance. It's in your interest to have as low a valuation as possible. A bit like when you get an estate valued after the person has died, the lower the value of everything the less inheritance tax you pay... Try to get an independent valuer who knows the deal, go low on valuations for insurance and tax, high for valuations for sale.
Whether something is evaluated at £35,000 or £10,000 or £700; if no one wants it at that price, it’s not worth that price. An evaluation is only useful for insurance purposes before your house burns down.
Don't know about the UK but in practical REAL life, it would be hard to give this table away in the US. Seriously, can you imagine younger (or even middle aged) people buying this for a normally furnished (regardless of price level) modern household? The spectacular drop in values for "Grandma Stuff" shown on the US Antiques Roadshow then and now price comparisons are staggering for only 15-25 years.
You're missing my point. What I'm saying is that items like this table (had it not been defaced) which at one time , not that long ago,were considered very valuable antiques are now considered "old people junk". Clocks, metal toys, fancy dinnerware, New England Brown furniture, art glass, dolls, radios and ceramics, etc. There is a whole generation out there that has NEVER owned a wrist watch and sure as Hell have NO interest in fine gold Waltham Pocket watches. @@420_24seven
@@ajchovanec The fact that the owner (Northerner) describes it as a "working table", and doubted the previous valuation, viewing it as excessive. A practical man with priorities around functionality, only seeing true worth in something that serves a purpose, and not wanting to be overly compensated for something if he chooses to sell it. The expert (Southerner), is more concerned about the table as an object of beauty, and describes the table in terms of how much value it has lost due to the alterations made and the fact that someone was silly enough to actually use the table as a table, instead of just placing it in a room somewhere and carefully maintaining its condition. It's a very sweeping generalisation, and by no means applies to all English people across the board; But for the most part, the richer Southerners care more about monetary value and preserving something in its original form, whereas poorer Northerners care more for the value an item brings through its usefulness and the pleasure you get from using it.
What a load of rubbish ..do you think the majority of southern people are rich toffs? Northerners love to bleet on about how hard done by they are ..but I would not have known anyone being able to afford £600 on a working table that sat in a bay window getting damaged..most southerners at that time were happy if they could pay the rent and put food on a table ..Northerners love the smell of their own backside Gas.
@@boopdoop2251 Well generally speaking the north of England is considerably poorer than the south of England, so that bleeds into to difference in culture. Even when Northerners have money/come into wealth, they have a more practical attitude towards things, as that is how they have been raised and how everyone around them behaves. Besides, I did preface my explanation with "it's a very sweeping generalisation". Cut me a little slack, will ya.
@@timhinchcliffe5372 now we need to go 30 years in the future and guess the value. I wonder what the table is valued at today because we've come at least 25 years since this airing.
timeless engineered art. one only need to drive any town in florida to see the massive amount of particle board junk on the curb every weekend to know any thing in real wood is a treasure.
That's what I always say whenever older people in my life say something made from solid wood isn't worth much! Sure, it may have been the equivalent of Ikea when they were children, but the Ikea now is LITERAL paper and cardboard!! They're completely broken and just trash after a few years of continuous use- You only have to spill a cup of water on them for the particle board to expand and start falling to pieces! Solid wood can last centuries and you can almost always repair it with some basic skills! What's worthless to them is invaluable today.
I actually quite like the green accent on the top, it looks smart and gives it a phenomenal contrast with that natural mahogany. Personal preference, of course this is separate from original value
An episode of Frasier has "ruined" me for Antiques Roadshow. Frasier & Niles are headed out the door and their dad says they should watch this game show with him, which they immediately turn up their noses at. He turns AR on, which the boys are very surprised to see their father watching, and says that he enjoys guessing the actual valuation that the owners are given. 😁
Ka-ching!! One of the funniest episodes and that's saying something. My favorite scenes are Frasier and Niles slowly sliding into the camera frame when they overhear the bear clock belonged to a royal family, and then Martin acting all stiff when he's put on the air to be interviewed. 😂
@@TheSaturnVYou know what season and episode number it was? I have the entire series but picking one episode out of like, what was it, 14 seasons is a bit tricky!
No mistake - it's a beautiful table that has been kept relevant and useful, and modified appropriately. Not everything is about money (except on Antiques Roadshow).
You still can if you are willing to pay thousands to tens of thousands for custom craftman. Tables like these were originally for wealthier people anyways.
@@whdbnrm3023 Up to the individual whether they want something quickly made that will serve it's function for a few weeks or months before it needs replacing or something that took time and effort and will last a lifetime and more. I know which one I'd prefer out of the two personally.
The problem with this evaluation, is that the estimater "assumes" that the leather was installed on the top by replacing a pristine wood veneer, when most likely, the condition of the top wood veneer was in such poor conition that it made the table's appearance and useability completely unsuitable, and severly detracted from it's value. Hence, by removing the damaged top wood veneer, and replacing it with leather (a very common feature 50-100 years ago), a good portion of the piece's value was restored, albeit not fully restored. In other word's if no one had touched it, and the top surface was water statined, excessively worn/deeply scratched, or even warped/peeling, the item might only be worth £2000.
Less than 30,000, based on the way they were talking about the inflated valuation. However, This episode was 24 years ago. So any price is possible now!
I think the antiques experts have only broke one thing since they started filming. The handle fell off a vase. They X-ray it and found it was due to a manufacturing fault.
@@oftin_wong Now I'm confused, surely you're not thinking they're Australian? Or have your amazing powers deduced that I'm Australian? 🤔 It just seemed like a silly thing to say, as if the only exposure to English people has been via Little Britain. Apart from the fact that they're English, and the people in Little Britain are mostly English, I don't see how they're like characters from Little Britain. They seem pretty average to me.
@@Dave-Rough-Diamond-Dunn your comment could be interpreted in a number of ways I guess, I thought you were asking me if I was english because of the question mark.. I'm Australian, it's ok you don't have to agree with what I think ...I'm not fussed
Actually, 'cleaning' things is the number one way of ruining their value. Why? Because people _want_ things more, if they're in original condition, with patina, etc. They don't WANT things that have been cleaned. Supply and demand. Cleaning really does RUIN the value of a lot of things.
@@sirdigbyminge1639 Maybe 10-15 years ago, but not now. I expect he upgraded to a Jag when he retired. Definite lifelong Rover driver before that though.....
Just what I was thinking, surely know one would have looked at a beautiful solid timber top and thought I’ll chisel that out and inlay a leather one in its place.
People have weird ideas and weird tastes. Some people will have something remarkable and think, "Hey, I want to engrave pink elephants into it." You never know so never underestimate people's thinking, especially if they are ignorant to the true value of something.
@@tomstamford6837 some just don't care, I picked up a early 1900's Singer treadle sewing machine cabinet with it's original machine in it, these were made out of beautiful oak, someone decided to "antique" the 100+ year old cabinet with a white antiquing glaze. Thankfully they didn't touch the leg irons.
@@wesbrown5601 If they knew about those items they wouldn't defile them as they sometimes do. Not really related, but I remember an episode where a family, not a bright family, had a painting, whether they found it or liberated it) not sure, but I remember they rolled it up and stuffed it somewhere... behind the water heater or something ridiculous. The appraiser told them it was by a well known and well respected painter and would have been worth many tens of thousands of pounds and the looks on their faces was priceless, but not as priceless as when he added, that since they stored it so badly and the condition it was in, it was only worth a few hundred. Then again, if I was a restorer and knew what I was doing, and someone brought me something special, would I not advise them as to the proper value, historical and financial of the piece or just say, "So you want me to carve a dragon into the top and take the carving off the legs... okay."
Ok, so here is what you do; always buy two. One to store in pristine condition in hopes that someday it may be worth at least what you paid for it, and the other to actually use or use for parts. Or something like that. Morale of the story: never use what you have
Brown is down. Way down. I saw one of the "revisited" shows last night where a piece of furniture dropped to about 1/10th of what it had been a decade ago!
600 pounds in 1969 would be about 4.5k in 1999 when this was filmed. So a value a little higher than double what he paid for after three decades of everyday use. Not too shabby!
Well, the man made some profit. Paid 600 pounds in about 1965 or so, which in 1999 would be about 5000 pounds. And the evaluation is 10k-12k. So he made 5k-7k on it, which in today's money is 9k-13k. Not a bad profit.
"What a lovely priceless artifact that you have here. Let me rub my ungloved hands all over it and allow the acid from my skin to eat away at the centuries-old varnish."
Nonsense, it's 1836 if it's a day, Either made by Fontesque Baggariddim or Mick 'The Chisel' Bradbury of the South Shields school. Likely retailled by Dunphy & Sons of Pall Mall.
A blind, senseless fool would know it is a 1970s retro piece made in Korea for the Spanish market but sold in Nairobi at Alf of Africa's boutique. It's worth a hundred quid if you nickel-plate the sides and bore holes through the legs to hold your umbrella.@@thesunreport
The problem with old brown wooden furniture, just like with porcelain tea sets is that young(er) generations often absolutely HATE this "old people furniture" and like more modern nihilistic designs. So the value of these items will DECREASE in future years.
@VinMar-m6w There might be "some" resurgence but I doubt it'll be enough to push prices up again. Realistically speaking the economy in the UK will downgrade even more in coming years, so there will be less money around. People might return using this old furniture again when it gets cheap because of the build quality. Here in the Netherlands recycle shops often don't want to pick up old brown wooden furniture anymore because they can't sell it.
we lived next door to this couple and i remember them trying to get it on the bus to get to this show !, my dad was pissing himself at the time, because the man kept calling his wife a "silly cow" because she let the end she had hold of go, as they were trying to get it up to the top deck, my dad, crying with laughter said "shes just knocked another tenner off their mancy ald table" !
It's only "damaged" if one judges it by the monetary value of it being "original". These snob valuers only think in those terms. A leather top is a beautuful thing -- original or not.
@@paulthomson2288 Exactly like most antique furniture. No one wants that stuff in their homes in the 21st century. It's just not practical and looks so out of place now.
It's what we musicians would call a "player-grade instrument." Tastefully modified long ago, enjoyed as the functional art ever since, without obsessive concern over keeping it pristine.
I have a Selmer BA Alto which was relacquered 40 years ago. A beautiful job, and that's what people (not me) did back then. Still plays beautifully, but valued way down now.
I don't know that you can say there's much tasteful in gutting a figured mahogany slab like that. I can only hope the wood that came off that table was used for something else because there aren't too many mahogany trees of that size left
@@leadpoisoning717 It would have gone through a planer. That wood is shavings on the floor.
You think animal skin is tasteful?!
@@icturner23
Are you referring to the modifications made decades ago?
Before advances in materials science there wouldn't have been any functional alternatives to leather.
Animal skins have been, and still are in some cultures, essential in clothing people.
Had this desk not been salvaged by recovering it, it's only function would be firewood. Hardly a fitting end for the beautiful wood that constructed it.
I'm sure he said it had been lovingly cared for for decades. That would imply it was reconfigured long before the advent of PVC or similar.
I like the green top truth be told.
Something must have damaged the original surface if they've had to resurface it with leather! imho
@TeddyBear-ii4yc How honest of you
@TeddyBear-ii4yc thank you for your humble take :)
@@knexplayer Am just applying a bit of 'outside the box' thinkin'... just coming at the issue from a different angle! 👍
@TeddyBear-ii4yc that's what we love to see keep up the great work and happy new year my man
Furniture was made to be used and to have wear and tear on it, the fact it has survived this long makes it invaluable for someone’s collection at home or office to be continually useful still.
Exactly.
Agreed. The bottle is half full.
What is overlooked too is, the guy claims 1820, but for all anyone knows it was a very good table made in 1890 in that STYLE, the same as we do to-day with replicating old styles but in crappier materials unfortunately.
Yeah but it wasn’t made for some knucklehead to chisel out the top and glue leather on it.
They are getting it appraised...
This is by far the best Python skit. Underrated.
It's up there for sure but by far the best seems generous
😂😂😂
My bet is the top "pre leather" was ruined and the leather was a best solution to keep the table alive.
My thoughts too. No one would voluntarily replace a top in good condition.
I was thinking that to. Ink spill or something.
Veneer has a short lifespan, it tends to flake, crack and warp within 100 years. I’m sure a piece of mahogany veneer large enough for that table top would be very expensive to replace before paying a professional furniture restorer to set it in. :)
I doubt it. There are many foolish people out there who dont understand how bad their decision making is.
@@TheNightshadePrince veneer is dirt cheap
"It's a working table" - that's what tables are meant for. Man is a hero.
A hero? JeeeeZ
A hero for using a table ? You don't know the definition of hero do you ?
So when you use a table for eating or playing video games... you are working then too...
What level of esteem do you have for the toilet user? 😂
Huh? I use tables to eat from and set things on.
These filming scenes are better than today’s Antique Roadshow.
Conservatives destroy everything they touch.
My grandparents had the exact table, along with matching coffee table and end tables... the big table had the original wood top and that table alone was insured for $30,000... 25 years ago. After my grandfather died, my grandmother whom had never had anything to do with the house finances, apparently sold the whole set for $2000 and was quite pleased about it. She sold hundreds of thousands of dollars of antiques for pennies on the dollar... before she moved to a retirement home. The family had no idea what she had done until afterwards, her last few tears could have been much more comfortable if only she hadn't been bamboozled so badly.
did u get it back
@@randomrazr of course not
"Him and that bloody furniture, don't know what he's always banging on about it for, I think it's dreadful old fusty stuff, can't wait to be rid of it"
My wife threatened to sell my golf club collection when I went and I had to bring her to my office at home and show her the value of some of the stuff. I have several first-edition, signed books, including Ben Hogan, Sneed, Bobby Jones, Nicklaus, Watson, Norman, and Woods. I was fortunate enough to live at Augusta for over 15 years and I had access yearly to some of the best players in the world. One of my books signed by Ben Hogan and authenticated was appraised at a show for over $6,800.00 due to excellent condition and clear signature. I also have a picture of it being signed at the time. Wives don't know what they don't know.
Somebody walked out laughing
I like the green leather top. Looks like a perfect game table.
It does not improve the table in any way . The original wood top was far superior
@@AlasdairMorrison-z8m Purely opinion. Most antiques are a scam for rich people anyway.
@@LyleBialkNo, that's modern art you're thinking of.
@@PaladinKonrad No, you just watch too much Fox News
@@PaladinKonrad It's all of art, and jewelry even more so.
He had a good result for he brought the table in 1969 for £600 and the expert values it at £12,000.00 in 1999 - It was loved and highly used so that's the whole point of enjoying furniture.
Could get a house for 3k in 69.
According to in2013dollars website, inflation makes his purchase of £600 be roughly equal to £12,178.82 today - so he’s dead flat or underwater now.
This was after George Soros crashed the pound. He bought it before. So maybe a loss, I am not sure about the exact inflation rate.
I have some Sam Maloof...he'd roll over in his grave if i did something like this to it.
Only select wealthy would waste that much money on that table. Greedy uncaring wealthy.
I would take that table in a heartbeat!!! Its absolutely gorgeous!!!
I attend estate auctions and it's quite common to see beautiful pieces of solid oak, mahogany, and chestnut furniture going for a few hundred dollars each. The problem is a 19th century piece of furniture does not fit modern house decor or the uses for furniture that we have today.
As an antiquarian I must admit this is true, a lot of 19 century furniture pieces are gigantic and some are hard to sweep around, some need to be reupholstered and other repairs and care that new furniture doesn’t need. I read somewhere(I believe it was out of one of Alice Winchester’s books) that the 1920s were a golden age of antique collecting where pieces could be feached for much cheaper prices than the 1950s(where it became fashionable again). :)
Almost certainly. There is no doubt that it would have been in a dire state and any restoration would have devalued it. The only question is if the leather devalued it more.
And it's heavy and can't be repaired and was made when people were 6 inches shorter! LOL.
We're all fat compared to regency era countryfolk.
I have the same issue with Craftsman/Mission antiques. I bought many 30 years ago because I enjoyed it, and not then as investment. The latter certainly never worked out.
What shocks me most is that this was only filmed in 1999. Looking at the people and background it looks like a completely different country.
Same. Thought it was late ‘80s at first glance 😅
Yes true!
Shows just how far we have fallen in 25 year's, immensely sad 😮
@@seanduncan1284 simply the Britain I was born in and grew up in, you seriously can't believe that this country is better in 2023 than it was 25 or 30 years ago 🤔
@@seanduncan1284you don't see it? The lack of Karen's the happiness in everyone face without the emotional drag of bad times. The people's character display a lack of conflict and frustration. You can tell everyone in that room had the capacity to agree to disagree on controversial topics.
I hope my grandchildren won't be cursing me in the future for changing the pine draw knobs to chrome on my chipboard coffee table .
You already know then that it isn't museum quality. So, you have no problem using it.
What a philistine! 🙂
😂
Watch chipboard get banned in the future and that table end up being worth 10 billion Skibidis.
@@cocobutter3175hahaha OHMYGOSH that’s was great
In response to some of the comments regarding price and value, I think some of us are in denial about antique lovers and how things are valued.
I might not give you a nickel, personally, for a particular piece, but the evaluation by an "expert" sets a price that a person who IS in
the market for it, will have to work from.
It doesnt matter if 99%
of the world's population isnt in the market, for the 1% who is, that expert has given
them the appraised value they were looking for. It doesnt matter what you might get for it at a flea market on any given weekend.
Its all about what you would get for it at a sale where a room full of people who ARE looking for it, would pay.
Ultimately, its value is what the owner says its worth is.
That's true. Also, if "Antiques Roadshow" says something's worth 10K, there's a bunch of people who will now pay 10k for it regaardless...
I would say additionally that (if youre a collector) you could maybe find that piece of furniture at a garage sale for far cheaper, but you would be taking a much larger gamble on authenticity and wear. Whereas an appraised piece, though much more expensive, has been officially vetted for authenticity and wear. And that is worth something to the 1% like you are talking about.
Not sure I follow, surely a piece's is a value is only what anyone's prepared to pay for it at any given time. Appraisal value for insurance purposes
In a market economy, the value of something is what a prospective buyer with proven funds is actually offering.
That may or may not be what the current owner thinks it is worth.
Much like Ebay selling, there's no "blue book" valuation on such things, people dont "collect" desks like they collect antique inkwell, or Wedgewood china or coins, you put a value on an item and hope for best,if someone buys it that doesnt mean its WORTH that amount, it only means that one person wanted it enough to pay that amount.
Theres sites on the web that cite Ebay selling prices as what that item is "worth" and it's silly
One of the few people I've seen say "that's to much". Normally they think the thing is made of solid gold. Either this guy is the most level headed person ever or he just really wanted to be on tv.
I think it (35k) might have been a valuation for insurance purposes by an agent of the insurance company, the higher the value the more you pay on the insurance. It's in your interest to have as low a valuation as possible. A bit like when you get an estate valued after the person has died, the lower the value of everything the less inheritance tax you pay... Try to get an independent valuer who knows the deal, go low on valuations for insurance and tax, high for valuations for sale.
He's from the north. He has his head screwed on properly.
@@dontaskme7004Except, of course, if you need the insurance to pay out.
I don't care, the green leather top looks great!
not compared to the solid wood
Whether something is evaluated at £35,000 or £10,000 or £700; if no one wants it at that price, it’s not worth that price. An evaluation is only useful for insurance purposes before your house burns down.
Particularly if you're PLANNING on burning your house down 😁
What it's worth and what's its worth to someone is subjective
Don't know about the UK but in practical REAL life, it would be hard to give this table away in the US. Seriously, can you imagine younger (or even middle aged) people buying this for a normally furnished (regardless of price level) modern household? The spectacular drop in values for "Grandma Stuff" shown on the US Antiques Roadshow then and now price comparisons are staggering for only 15-25 years.
@trimule chill out son, this footage is from the 90s
You're missing my point. What I'm saying is that items like this table (had it not been defaced) which at one time , not that long ago,were considered very valuable antiques are now considered "old people junk". Clocks, metal toys, fancy dinnerware, New England Brown furniture, art glass, dolls, radios and ceramics, etc. There is a whole generation out there that has NEVER owned a wrist watch and sure as Hell have NO interest in fine gold Waltham Pocket watches. @@420_24seven
This whole exchange illustrates the north/south divide in England perfectly.
Elaborate?
@@ajchovanec The fact that the owner (Northerner) describes it as a "working table", and doubted the previous valuation, viewing it as excessive.
A practical man with priorities around functionality, only seeing true worth in something that serves a purpose, and not wanting to be overly compensated for something if he chooses to sell it.
The expert (Southerner), is more concerned about the table as an object of beauty, and describes the table in terms of how much value it has lost due to the alterations made and the fact that someone was silly enough to actually use the table as a table, instead of just placing it in a room somewhere and carefully maintaining its condition.
It's a very sweeping generalisation, and by no means applies to all English people across the board; But for the most part, the richer Southerners care more about monetary value and preserving something in its original form, whereas poorer Northerners care more for the value an item brings through its usefulness and the pleasure you get from using it.
What a load of rubbish ..do you think the majority of southern people are rich toffs?
Northerners love to bleet on about how hard done by they are ..but I would not have known anyone being able to afford £600 on a working table that sat in a bay window getting damaged..most southerners at that time were happy if they could pay the rent and put food on a table ..Northerners love the smell of their own backside Gas.
Explained that way, it sounds far more like the divide between the rich and the everyday people.
@@boopdoop2251 Well generally speaking the north of England is considerably poorer than the south of England, so that bleeds into to difference in culture. Even when Northerners have money/come into wealth, they have a more practical attitude towards things, as that is how they have been raised and how everyone around them behaves.
Besides, I did preface my explanation with "it's a very sweeping generalisation".
Cut me a little slack, will ya.
£600 (in 1965) was the equivalent of about £7000 in 1999
Thanks, I was wondering that. I thought someone in the comments would work it out... lo and behold, the third one down.
@@timhinchcliffe5372 now we need to go 30 years in the future and guess the value. I wonder what the table is valued at today because we've come at least 25 years since this airing.
@@SlickArmor it's now 35k lol
According to an online calculator 600 pounds in 1965 is 14,326.80 pounds today. oof
6,500 - 15,000 . So he could have lost money.
The expert's knowledge always blows my mind it makes me interested in items that I thought I had no interest in
I never really looked At furniture like that, crazy how many hobbies there is in our world
While you were out partying, I studied the table...
Well enjoyed for 30 to 35 years and a good investment piece too, I'd call that a win.
timeless engineered art. one only need to drive any town in florida to see the massive amount of particle board junk on the curb every weekend to know any thing in real wood is a treasure.
That's what I always say whenever older people in my life say something made from solid wood isn't worth much! Sure, it may have been the equivalent of Ikea when they were children, but the Ikea now is LITERAL paper and cardboard!! They're completely broken and just trash after a few years of continuous use- You only have to spill a cup of water on them for the particle board to expand and start falling to pieces! Solid wood can last centuries and you can almost always repair it with some basic skills! What's worthless to them is invaluable today.
Chances are the table top was already damaged horrifically and the leather was best option for restoration at the time.
exactly my thought. that's the only thing that makes any sense.
The caption made me think the appraiser spilled coffee on it or something to ruin it. 😂
I actually quite like the green accent on the top, it looks smart and gives it a phenomenal contrast with that natural mahogany. Personal preference, of course this is separate from original value
So do I, but I still wouldn't pay £12k or £30k for it. Those prices are determined by what the collectors with big pockets want
An episode of Frasier has "ruined" me for Antiques Roadshow. Frasier & Niles are headed out the door and their dad says they should watch this game show with him, which they immediately turn up their noses at. He turns AR on, which the boys are very surprised to see their father watching, and says that he enjoys guessing the actual valuation that the owners are given. 😁
th-cam.com/video/z17sFsTOMYY/w-d-xo.html
Ka-ching!! One of the funniest episodes and that's saying something. My favorite scenes are Frasier and Niles slowly sliding into the camera frame when they overhear the bear clock belonged to a royal family, and then Martin acting all stiff when he's put on the air to be interviewed. 😂
@@TheSaturnVYou know what season and episode number it was?
I have the entire series but picking one episode out of like, what was it, 14 seasons is a bit tricky!
"VENEER!"
"Dad, did we miss anything?"
"Nah, just some bozo with a credenza who doesn't know a Biedermeier from an Oscar Meyer"
I thought he was going to fall on the table as he was wobbling around and break it 🤣
Love the gentle and classy way of speaking with a slight british accent. I could fall asleep to this. These people knew how to talk back then.
Listen to the two men speak and you can hear that there are British accents that are very different from each other.
Damn, my grandmother watched this when I was a kid and I hated it, now it's smashing out millions of views on TH-cam
On a scale of 1-10 on things I would rest my family jewels on, this is a 9. It looks smooth, comfortable, cooling, and most of all, green.
Nice image.
its a beautiful desk regardless of what its worth
No mistake - it's a beautiful table that has been kept relevant and useful, and modified appropriately. Not everything is about money (except on Antiques Roadshow).
I wish we made furniture like this again. Beautiful, sturdy and lasting for decades
Centuries, even!
You still can if you are willing to pay thousands to tens of thousands for custom craftman. Tables like these were originally for wealthier people anyways.
why ? tastes and styles change
@@whdbnrm3023 Up to the individual whether they want something quickly made that will serve it's function for a few weeks or months before it needs replacing or something that took time and effort and will last a lifetime and more. I know which one I'd prefer out of the two personally.
Amish make good stuff. People still make furniture like this but not cheap of course.
I love how the lady dobbed her husband in for the fading of the table!
Yeah she threw him under the fully loaded double decker.
Exactly. Who wouldn't want the heavy velvet curtains opened in the morning!
Shit! - I've done the same thing to my ikea 'bjork' coffee table 😢
You may actually have raised its value.
Don't tell me you "bjorked" the bjork?!
What's a buh-jork? It sounds like Chinese garbage.
It is amazing to me that such people exist.
Well, I don't know much about this kind of thing, but I reckon a good wood finisher/restorer could refinish the faded side of this table.
You can apply new finish but fading will stay still, wood changes color because UV radiation from sun.
Stunning piece. I love the leather top
I think the leather top is pretty nice looking
The appraiser handled that very professionally. Thankfully the owner didn’t go ‘ballistic’.
The person who sold it knew that there was damage and sold it appropriately.
Looks good with the green top in my opinion, but what do I know?
Hey BBC. Please don’t crop into square footage. Display it how it was filmed
The problem with this evaluation, is that the estimater "assumes" that the leather was installed on the top by replacing a pristine wood veneer, when most likely, the condition of the top wood veneer was in such poor conition that it made the table's appearance and useability completely unsuitable, and severly detracted from it's value. Hence, by removing the damaged top wood veneer, and replacing it with leather (a very common feature 50-100 years ago), a good portion of the piece's value was restored, albeit not fully restored. In other word's if no one had touched it, and the top surface was water statined, excessively worn/deeply scratched, or even warped/peeling, the item might only be worth £2000.
30, 35 years ago? They would have been, what, 30? 35? Yes I suppose 30, 35. 30, 35 years ago would make them 30, 35... 30... 35... yes.
Sold!!
Lmao god love harry and paul
Lovely couple!
But what would it have been worth without the leather insert?
Less than 30,000, based on the way they were talking about the inflated valuation. However, This episode was 24 years ago. So any price is possible now!
He said 10 to 12 thousand
@@catdavis9328 The 10-12k is in its current condition and with the green leather top. He never said what the value would be without the leather.
@@southerncharity7928 today's value would be 26000pounds
Lovely table
Very good tips
1:37 Sir your eyebrows are incredible.
Ugh, that's all i could see when looking at him! Wife is to blame.
Buy a piece of furniture for your home and spend a lifetime walking around it or avoiding it!
I was expecting the 'big mistake' to be something that caused damage during the filming. Very disappointed.
Yeah, kinda click bait. If they do it again I will block the channel. I don't like that.
So you wanted some one to suffer a catastrophic incident costing the thousands, live on camera? What a Scrooge!
That's your own fault tbh
I think the antiques experts have only broke one thing since they started filming. The handle fell off a vase. They X-ray it and found it was due to a manufacturing fault.
The table maker would be happy to see it in daily use all these years later. That’s more valuable than a museum grade piece.
They are like characters from little britain
English? Your powers of observation are amazing! 😁
@@Dave-Rough-Diamond-Dunn Australian ...almost the same
@@oftin_wong Now I'm confused, surely you're not thinking they're Australian? Or have your amazing powers deduced that I'm Australian? 🤔
It just seemed like a silly thing to say, as if the only exposure to English people has been via Little Britain. Apart from the fact that they're English, and the people in Little Britain are mostly English, I don't see how they're like characters from Little Britain. They seem pretty average to me.
@@Dave-Rough-Diamond-Dunn your comment could be interpreted in a number of ways I guess, I thought you were asking me if I was english because of the question mark..
I'm Australian, it's ok you don't have to agree with what I think ...I'm not fussed
@@Dave-Rough-Diamond-Dunn why does the name Dave Dunn seem so familiar to me ..I know it from the music scene perhaps
Seen wear and tear. No problem!
Imagine the value had he not ever cleaned it .
Did you not watch the video? It has sun damage and someone modified it.
@@utubebad Was a joke. Common to the show.
Actually, 'cleaning' things is the number one way of ruining their value.
Why? Because people _want_ things more, if they're in original condition, with patina, etc. They don't WANT things that have been cleaned. Supply and demand. Cleaning really does RUIN the value of a lot of things.
It's a lovely table.
Willing to place a rather large wager that the fella in the white shirt drives a Jaguar......
Rover.
it’s got leather seats
@@sirdigbyminge1639 Maybe 10-15 years ago, but not now. I expect he upgraded to a Jag when he retired. Definite lifelong Rover driver before that though.....
@@nickmaclachlan5178 Rover were oretty good in the 20th century. Good enough for the Queen to drive as her personal car.
@dcarbs2979 If you enjoyed replacing head gaskets at every service......
I would've kept it. It's beautiful.
It was veneered most likely and the veneer was failing
"As much as that?, I thought it would be worth MORE!"
Just what I was thinking, surely know one would have looked at a beautiful solid timber top and thought I’ll chisel
that out and inlay a leather one in its place.
People have weird ideas and weird tastes.
Some people will have something remarkable and think, "Hey, I want to engrave pink elephants into it."
You never know so never underestimate people's thinking, especially if they are ignorant to the true value of something.
It also could have been irreparably damaged somehow and they saw refinishing with leather as the best remaining option.
@@tomstamford6837 some just don't care, I picked up a early 1900's Singer treadle sewing machine cabinet with it's original machine in it, these were made out of beautiful oak, someone decided to "antique" the 100+ year old cabinet with a white antiquing glaze. Thankfully they didn't touch the leg irons.
@@wesbrown5601 If they knew about those items they wouldn't defile them as they sometimes do.
Not really related, but I remember an episode where a family, not a bright family, had a painting, whether they found it or liberated it) not sure, but I remember they rolled it up and stuffed it somewhere... behind the water heater or something ridiculous.
The appraiser told them it was by a well known and well respected painter and would have been worth many tens of thousands of pounds and the looks on their faces was priceless, but not as priceless as when he added, that since they stored it so badly and the condition it was in, it was only worth a few hundred.
Then again, if I was a restorer and knew what I was doing, and someone brought me something special, would I not advise them as to the proper value, historical and financial of the piece or just say, "So you want me to carve a dragon into the top and take the carving off the legs... okay."
i been wating for a priceless vase to get knocked off a table 😂
Ok, so here is what you do; always buy two. One to store in pristine condition in hopes that someday it may be worth at least what you paid for it, and the other to actually use or use for parts.
Or something like that.
Morale of the story: never use what you have
That's only for rich people who have no idea about the value of things. Things are meant to be used, clothes are meant to be worn, etc.
@@kiirosoleil that is such a wild concept . But once something is used, then how can I show it off and brag to the lowly plebs? I cannot.
The seller reminds me of Sydney from The Pretender back in the early 2000s. Anyone else you're with me?😂
It’s only worth what someone will give you !
Same thing my father said.
Leather top table just unlocked a deep childhood memory for me, and I’m not even sure who owned it 😂
Looks nice. A working table
Looks fantastic, and thats patina.
Brown is down. Way down. I saw one of the "revisited" shows last night where a piece of furniture dropped to about 1/10th of what it had been a decade ago!
We have seen the peak in values for furnitures like that.
600 pounds in 1969 would be about 4.5k in 1999 when this was filmed. So a value a little higher than double what he paid for after three decades of everyday use. Not too shabby!
6,500 - 15,000 it would have been in 1999
£10,000 table in 1999 is a solid flex!
What if it turned out that the leather top was added by Louis Tiffany or Gustov Faberge or Salvador Dali? Then it would worth far more than £35,000!
nah
I have the exact table. I wonder if painting it was wise?
To be used and enjoyed…
I definitely prefer this look over the original.
😂😂 her face was tripping her up
He actually brought a lot to the table.
Even though this was not valued at 35,000, it was still a good investment if you paid 600 pounds for it and now it's worth 10-12,000.
Yep. Because the value of money is consisent and unwavering over time.
Well, the man made some profit. Paid 600 pounds in about 1965 or so, which in 1999 would be about 5000 pounds. And the evaluation is 10k-12k. So he made 5k-7k on it, which in today's money is 9k-13k. Not a bad profit.
"What a lovely priceless artifact that you have here. Let me rub my ungloved hands all over it and allow the acid from my skin to eat away at the centuries-old varnish."
It's not the dead sea scrolls.
When he said he paid 600 pounds for it, I let out a sigh of relief for them. 10 to 12k is an amazing appraisal despite it being chopped up
"Do you know what date it is?"
"2023."
"The table..."
"if only we could go back in time" while watching a video uploaded 2 years ago of a clip filmed in 1999.
It's about 1835, in the manner of James Winter or George Smith. So not Regency or Scottish.
Nonsense, it's 1836 if it's a day, Either made by Fontesque Baggariddim or Mick 'The Chisel' Bradbury of the South Shields school. Likely retailled by Dunphy & Sons of Pall Mall.
@@thesunreport Certainly possible!
@@jakecavendish3470 haha..Thanks for humouring me, as you can tell I have no idea about it!! 😁
A blind, senseless fool would know it is a 1970s retro piece made in Korea for the Spanish market but sold in Nairobi at Alf of Africa's boutique. It's worth a hundred quid if you nickel-plate the sides and bore holes through the legs to hold your umbrella.@@thesunreport
Your profile picture and your comment are creating cognitive dissonance. Strapping lad, though. Quite handsome.
600 pounds in 1969 was a lot of money
It would now be worth £4-6,000 at auction, I would think. It's a bit stolid for the period.
The problem with old brown wooden furniture, just like with porcelain tea sets is that young(er) generations often absolutely HATE this "old people furniture" and like more modern nihilistic designs. So the value of these items will DECREASE in future years.
You're assuming that things will remain the same forever, but tastes change over time or have a resurgence.
@VinMar-m6w There might be "some" resurgence but I doubt it'll be enough to push prices up again. Realistically speaking the economy in the UK will downgrade even more in coming years, so there will be less money around. People might return using this old furniture again when it gets cheap because of the build quality. Here in the Netherlands recycle shops often don't want to pick up old brown wooden furniture anymore because they can't sell it.
I would cross veneer around the top and then it would be worth £35K
If you like the piece, and you don't intend to sell it, then all is well.
we lived next door to this couple and i remember them trying to get it on the bus to get to this show !, my dad was pissing himself at the time, because the man kept calling his wife a "silly cow" because she let the end she had hold of go, as they were trying to get it up to the top deck, my dad, crying with laughter said "shes just knocked another tenner off their mancy ald table" !
It would have been nice if you dad had lent a hand.
they took a high priced LARGE item on a BUS???!! to get to a Roads show. Uh, ok, UK, I guess you really ARE bankrupt.
The top deck 😂😂😂😂
That table wouldn't fit on a bus.....
Do you often make up stories like this?
Those eyebrows deserve a valuation.
I know right, absolutely disgusting
It's only "damaged" if one judges it by the monetary value of it being "original". These snob valuers only think in those terms. A leather top is a beautuful thing -- original or not.
Probably not as beautiful as a mahogany veneer.
@@dcan911
Bah, nor as practical. A "beautiful veneer" with traditional varnish is a pain to live with unless epoxy coated.
British Antiques Roadshow: This table was designed by a famous Stegosaurus.
American Antiques Roadshow: This is a beer keg from 1992.
Yes go back in time and invest the £600 in either stocks, shares or property! Get a grip man!
Not everyone is a rocket scientist regarding antiques.
It's still ugly no matter the price
It is to you but not to somebody who appreciates workmanship
@@russellprout723 oh yes quality craftsmanship not denying it...just not something I would ever want in my house
@@paulthomson2288 ........youve got to have taste to appreciate something of this quality...just stick with IKEA
Not as ugly as your IKEA crap in your home.
@@paulthomson2288 Exactly like most antique furniture. No one wants that stuff in their homes in the 21st century. It's just not practical and looks so out of place now.
I have a genuine elephant leg end table from the 1800's....any idea what it would be worth?
An arm and a leg.