Hegel H190 Integrated Amp vs. Schiit Ragnarok and Yggdrasil Comparison
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- Looking for an amp? If you've USD 4000/GBP 3200 budget, make sure to take a listen at the Hegel H190 Integrated Amp. Lots of power at 150w at 8 ohms and claims it can drive any speaker, but how does it sound? The Audiofool puts it up to the test against the Schiit Ragnarok/Schiit Yggdrasil combo in this review using the KEF LS50 and Tekton Impact Monitors.
Nice review! Your comparison has really helped solidify the decision to go with the Hegel 190. I’ve always wanted a Hegel and with the November sale for only 3200.00 dollars makes it an amazing deal.
Bluetooth you expect in a $4000 amp? It's the worst method of transmitting music. I'm glad Hegel didn't include wifi or bluetooth. That's why I have a Bluesound Node. I also don't use the Hegel DAC, so it actually had more than I need.
If you pay a lot, you might as well get everything including the kitchen sink. lol aside, 2 things: 1. it seems a lot of the pure analog guys look for bluetooth for convenience sake in case they dont have it in their collection, 2. it has a DAC already, a chip to include bluetooth isnt too hard for those who would like it. why not wifi btw? i couldve used the hegel in a secondary room if it had one.
@@TheAudiofool I guess I think of DACs and streamers as rapidly changing technologies - streaming being dependent on the services they support (which could go out of business tomorrow). If Hegel makes a nice amp, and one I'd like to keep for years, buying external DACs as they improve and streamers as they improve seems like the better option for an integrated amp not becoming obsolete. I do appreciate bluetooth on my Audiolab 6000a which is a much less expensive amplifier. And I have a bluetooth receiver plugged into my Marantz. But in a higher priced amp, the less tricks in one box is probably better. I would have appreciated a good phono preamp over the bluetooth. And to answer your question, I have an external streamer so I wouldn't find the wifi so useful. And that streamer I also connect with a VPN.
@@eximusic True, but in that case, I would've prefered it to do without the DAC and ethernet or do like gryphon/schiit and do modular.
I am running the same system as you. I totally agree with your thoughts. i’m running a pair of B&W 705s and it sounds great.
Love your video mate! Keep up with a good work :)
You got your jester get up at Desert Factory here in Mandaue.
Not sure why you say "you can't show it off" ? The only thing I care about showing off is the sound quality. If people care about the looks then they are not a serious audiophile. Not sure why people don't review integrated to integrated. If you want a DAC, buy a DAC and not an integrated with a DAC. Not a good way of reviewing.
Hegel H190 all the way!
I am about to try Hegel h190 for b&w 683 s2, should be more than good enough for even more expensive speakers the price is $2800 in sweden and i don’t think thats to expensive campared to rivals
You can’t go wrong with the Hegel . I have the 705 B&W it’s a great combo.
One thing I notice with my Hegel is it absolutely sounds like garbage until it is broken in. If that unit doesn't have a minimum of 10 hours on it, it just doesn't sound good. Have over 100 hours on mine now and I am surprised how good it sounds every time I listen.
Thanks for watching! My friends and I were the ones who unboxed the H190 and H90; both of them sound good off out of the box, and we didn't return both back to the dealer. At the time though, we were coming from a Rega Elex R powering the KEF Reference 1s and LS50s, so perhaps our point of reference was different at the time. But yeah, Hegel sounds amazing and I'm tempted to get one for myself once I'm done experimenting.
@@TheAudiofool Guess I should clarify my experience. Not that is sounded bad per se, it's just the sound stage was very compressed sounding. As it burned in, it seemed to become more and more 3 dimensional. The instruments really started to separate. It just totally changed for the better. Now I'm left with great imaging, transparency, and unbelievable dynamics for a 60 wpc amp.
Great video, thank you. I'm eyeing up the H90 .. I like it as a one box solution. I am shortlisting alternative bookshelf speakers to the LS50 (which I have felt are a little too bright/forward for liking). Which other speakers around £1k would you suggest I demo to complement the Hegel sound? I mainly listen to rock and electronic music. Any thoughts appreciated.
Thanks! The Hegel can pretty much give anything bass, so you have a lot of options. For your budget, try listening to Dynaudio Excite x14, and the Monitor Audio Silver 100s. If it's okay to go 2nd hand, try PMC Twenty 22s, Tannoy DC8 and Neat IOTA alpha (if you can still accomodate the size).
Thanks a lot for the suggestions. Very much appreciated.
@@andrewpadgett2332 No worries. Let me know how it goes.
Hey man, just got a Hegel H90, if you get it you are in for a treat. Be patient though, it doesn't sound that good until it burns in a bit.
Would suggest upping the budget and going for the H190 instead of the h90. The h90, while good, lacks the necessary power to make it an all-in-one solution. The h190 hits the sweet spot in performance since it can drive most things well, at a reasonable price point.
Love your choice of videos. I am thinking about a better amp. I use Emotiva XPA 2 gen 3. Which is a Stereophile A mention. And I like Hegel's sound. Have never heard Ragnarok. But read about Rag/ LS50 combo was best combo in a millenium by stereophile. Should I move?
What do you want to improve? Hegel sounds very clean and you want to improve in that direction, an H190 is a good choice. The Rag 1 would take you to a less neutral but a little bit more fun direction, and I do agree that the Rag 1/LS50 is a fantastic combo, but I haven't heard the Rag 2 which they say sounds further warmer/fuller.
@@TheAudiofool But I use a KEF LS50. YOu said within its limitations Hegel and Rag will sound the same yeah?
@@sriloyYes you are right, with some differences, but still mostly the same. If you do not plan on changing anything else in your system, then I would probably go with a 2nd hand Rag 1.
your ears are not very good man!
Did you have any listening experience with Yamaha A-S1100 or 2100. I wonder how do they compare to Hegel 190. Any ideas?
I have Rubicon2s and wanna upgrade from Yamaha A-S801. Letting all the dac game aside how would they match to yamaha 1100- 2100 and hegel 190, I wonder.
What I got right now is nice, detailed, bright with good imaging. I am after a bit more body and deepen my soundstage 3D. Thank you. Keep up the good work.
I haven't heard those Yamahas yet. The Hegel is very precise but a bit lean though and probably not the way to go if you are looking for body and 3D. Have you tried using a tube buffer/pre-amp instead? Those give what you're after and you need not replace your amp. This will lose some precision most notably in the bass, but will make it sound airier and holographic.
Was the review with a Ragnarok or Ragnarok 2? Next time you need to show pictures and features of the competition....
Rag 1. Yes sir!
Hi, nice video! since you already tried Aegir, what you recommend, schiit freya+ and 2 Aegirs or Hegel H190? thank you!
Thanks. If you're looking for the super clean, neutral type amp, then Hegel would be the better choice; but if you want a more midcentric, more natural sounding amp, I would go for Schiit. Also, the H190 pretty much has everything on it including a decent DAC and spotify/upnp streamer (except for a phono input) so it is also the less messy, cool running solution.
how would you describe the basic sound characteristics of Hegel (only Amp section, particularly of the H90) ? i get that they have exceptional bass control and dark silent background...but are they laidback-slow or fast-punchy or fast-lean etc?
If for me, laidback-slow = EL34 tube amps, and Fast Punchy = Naim, then the Hegel family would fall somewhere in between, probably about neutral with a bit of warmth and smooth highs.
Using the Hegel 190 to power what he is driving is not even beginning to use the power potential of the Hegel. It would be like taking a Ford Taurus and an Austin Martin and saying you can both get these cars to 60 mph without much effort. The fact he is missing is the Hegel and the AM can do 160 just as easily. The Taurus cannot. Additionally at Hegels price point regardless of the specific unit I have the 300 you would have to spend another 25K to get Hegels build quality!!!!
What do you mean? I just said the the amplification of the Hegel is better, and I also said the KEF LS50 is not a good speaker to use for evaluating them because the the Hegel pretty much drived them to the limit.
I have the Hegel H190 it’s a beast with enough power to push pretty much any speaker out there. I am run a pair of B&W 705 s with the Hegel .
I'm going to demo the Schiit Ragnarok 2 with my new Harbeth Monitor 30.2s. I use them in the near field.
Let me know how it turns out
Have you compared the H120 with the H95?
Not yet, but should be similar to the difference between the Rost and H90, where the rost was slightly more refined, and if you dont need the extra wattage maybe save the extra and go for the 95.
You are suffocating hegel, it's for totl speakers and not mid tier
It's certainly pricey and can drive higher tier speakers, but it should still drive lower end speakers to their maximum potential. But you are right, I'd prefer to spend more on the speakers rather than the Amp.
The H190 has the same muted look as every integrated amplifier they have also the top model that costs more than twice as much.
Thanks for the informative review! I happen to have the Hegel 190 and based on your review, I’m thinking of getting the Schiit Yggdrasil as you say that it sounds really good. The thing is I also have the Hugo 2 and based on another review by you, it seems the Hugo 2 is similar to the Yggdrasil so I’m wondering if you think it’s worth getting the Yggdrasil in this case. Thanks so much!
Thanks! You will be doing a sidegrade so unless you don't like the sound of the Hugo, I suggest you stay with it. I consider both of these to be the saturation point of DACs, at least for me right now, and I don't find anything else significantly better worth more than double the cost. I borrowed the H190 and Hugo2 from the same friend and while he does find the Yggy to be slightly better particularly for the bass (using a Kef Ref 1), he's not exactly itching to change to the Yggy although perhaps it's also because he borrows mine every once in a while.
Hi, that’s immensely helpful... million thx for your advice!
“It isn’t something you can show off” made me Laugh
@the audiofool, Hegel H190 more heft and refinement than H95? Can it pair well with Totem in your option? Thanks for your videos!
Thanks for watching. Yes, the H190 is a little bit better, though I can't tell for you if it will be worth it... For me, I think I can live with the H95 IF I can use the money for better speakers. If you like the sound of Totem, it will mostly keep that sound signature with the Hegel amps.
The amp is 4.72 inches tall, not 7.72 inches.
When are you reviewing the Yamaha as-XXXX
i wonder why you only have 3.5k subs
Can you bi pass through my arcam avr850 for hometheat. Is this powerful and better than parasound. I have dynaudio emit M30
Thank you for sharing your impression between two rigs. Is it big difference between Hegel and Ragnarok purely amp side when pairing with LS50?
Hi John Kim, thanks for watching. You won't feel the bass control as much if you're only using the LS50s, but you'll still hear (not hear) the silence of the H190. It's definitely very noticeable, especially with instrumentals. For songs with vocals, it's still there but the forwardness of vocals in the LS50 dilutes the advantage a little bit. I do consider the difference to be big, but if you are asking if the difference is worth $2000+, I would have to say no, unless you are planning to upgrade from the LS50 soon. H190 is overkill for the LS50.
You might want to consider the H90. I haven't compared it directly in my room, but I have heard with with an LS50, and I am expecting the H90 to sound a little bit cleaner than the Rag and worth the extra cost if you don't have a decent DAC yet.
@@TheAudiofool Super helpful. Thank you so much and keep up the great work :)
Great review. I have had the LS50s with a crappy NAD D7050 amp for several years (I bought the 40w/ch NAD to power the LS50s in a near-field/desktop setup...it sounded like crap even then). I have really struggled with the sound and had completely shelved that system for a few years. I brought it out again, I want to put together a really nice system using the LS50s (for now, until I move to a bigger place with a dedicated listening room). I AM going to get the Freya+ and Yggdrasil but I'm cannot settle on the power amp at all. I want a straight (non-integrated) power amp that has at least 100W/ch (or 2 monoblocks) for when I replace the LS50s with higher-end tower speakers in my new place. The tone you describe from the H190 w/the Yggdrasil sounds perfect...but I know there's a lot of money wasted in redundant DACs, etc from the integrated portions. I'm not liking the measured power outputs of the Aegir in mono as they've been shown to be WAY less than the claimed 80w@8. I'm looking for a power amp that is close to on par with that H190, but hopefully around $2-3k. FYI, thinking of getting Wharfdale Elysian 4 when I get the new place to complete the system. Also, I'm still looking for the best streamer to interface with the Freya+ too. I've spent about a week on this and feel like I'm getting further from a decision each day. Any recommendations would be awesome!
Check out Odyssey amps. Hope you found something you enjoy
Very pleasant review 👌
why don´t you try the H90+Yggdrasil , ...H90 also has the Soundengine 2 like the H190 but a lower tier DAC and different power output level... if you dont need the power then H90 + Yggdrasil should get you the same "sonic bliss" :) I would really love you to try out this combo and comment on it...
I've heard it the H90 + Yggy, and it's definitely a good combo. Compared to the H190, there's still a bit more improvement in terms of solidity and refinement, but it is quite good already and one should only get the H190 if you have a similarly priced speaker already.
Very enjoyable review and comparison video. I actually like the utalitarian Hegel look, to me it looks and feels very classy whereas many expensive hifi brands come across as gaudy and cheap in their attempts to seem luxurious.
What I don't understand is how you end up giving such a great verdict to the Hegel despite being beaten by the much cheaper Schiit Ragnarok in your comparison. Do you consider the Schiit Ragnarok the benchmark of consumer audio? :-)
Make no mistake, I'm a Hegel user myself and I love it but I just didn't see it coming after having watched the rest of the video.
Thanks for watching! To clarify, I was initially comparing the Hegel with the Schiit Ragnarok AND Schiit Yggdrasil, and for my ears, the Schiit combo sounded better. Next comparison, I was just comparing the amp sections (used Yggdrasil in the Hegel) and the Rag was no match. And I pretty much liked the house sound of the Hegel and so the high marks, but the DAC for me is not up to snuff at least with the Yggdrasil.
@@TheAudiofool ah, then I understand. I got confused since I’m not familiar with Schiit products. They seem very nice but why in the world such a horrible name?! :-D
Why do you wear that hat?
Hi.
Great video and great acoustics treatment. What size is your listening room?
Thanks. Cheers
Thanks Daysofwild1! My listening room is about 10ft x 10ft x 8ft with a small alcove 7ft x 6ft. Not really ideal, but we do with what we have.
@@TheAudiofool
Thanks, my room is also the same size. Im looking at acoustic treatment similar to what you have done. Did you notice a difference?
@@Daysofwild1 Oh yes! Echoes and reverb was all over the place pre, and I actually couldn't bear using it as a listening room at all. Post treatment, everything was much better, treble was tamed and mids weren't too thick any more and I could finally hear microdynamics that I only hear with headphones. Bass was no longer single note as well (though this was more from the 2 seater fabric recliner), I still need to add maybe a bass trap or two, but I'm quite happy if I don't play bass intensive songs. Pardon the advert, but I actually have a video on it hahah th-cam.com/video/8WBIocEhBrM/w-d-xo.html and I have a sound demo of the pre and post treatment.
Hi.
Had a look at your before and after vid. Massive difference, even listening via my phone. The level of detail, clarity and bass sounds so much better. Before it was muddy with no definition and after you can hear all the detail.
Great job.
Cheers
What stands are you using for your large speakers?
Hi! Maybe Yggdrasil + Ragnarok will sound better if you add a preamp like Freya. I don´t know but I´d like to have your opinion. Thanks.
That would depend if you like tubes, and what tubes you use. In passive mode, it's more or less the same, and not worth bothering with, unless you really need the remote.
Hello Audiofool, I am looking for endgame amplifier for my LS50, my room is about 4x6m. Do you think Rag 2 or H190 will drive them to the full potential? what do you think is the best amplifier for LS50?
Both will drive the LS50s to the max. But depends on what kind of sound you want; if you want the super clean, more neutral and transparent sound, the H190 would probably suit you better, and more relaxed, liquid, "natural" sound for the Ragnarok. That said, I think the H190 is overkill for the LS50 and you could probably settle for the H120 which would sound very similar with the H190. For me, I'm okay to settle on the Rag or Aegir+saga (though the single aegir might be not enough for your room).
@@TheAudiofool Thank you so much for your help. so the thing people say about LS50s need at least 100-200W to shine isn't true because Rag is only 60W and you also suggests H120 (75W) is enough for the speakers.
@@veerasakbenjadol6957 That's right. I even like the sound of 30w pioneer m22 better than both of these, but you should make sure that there's enough wattage to sound loud enough in your room.
You can connect the Ethernet to your router, then you can wirelessly cast music to the Hegel.
Yep, I do keep hoping they'd put in Wifi eventually.
Have you heard the Cambridge Audio Azur 851N? It’s a preamp/ streamer & I am wondering how it compares to those 2, & if you want something that looks expensive, check out the Edge series products from Cambridge Audio as well. I am currently using a Marantz preamp/streamer with the Vidar, sounds great, but I am looking to upgrade my preamp/streamer cuz my Marantz keeps dropping connections...😖 thanks for the video
Thanks for watching. I haven't heard the 851N for a long time, but at the time, I didn't really hear a lot of significant differences between that and the CXN at the showroom; I do remember it sounding slightly more natural and lot cleaner but my main concern with it was that it had no analog inputs, so if I got it, I would just get it as a streamer, and as a streamer only option, it didn't make a lot of sense if I can just use a chromecast audio or raspberry pi. If we're talking about the DAC part only, the Yggy is miles away from the 851N, but the Hegel DAC would probably be in the same league. If you are looking for a preamp/streamer option, my recommendation would be to start with a Bluesound Node, and eventually get a Gumby or Yggy, or Chord Qutest.
But before even doing so, you need to find out why you have dropped connections. I have a Marantz SR5012 and it hasn't dropped any connections whether I'm streaming or using local files. Check if you still have dropped connections if you use your phone as a streamer.
simplicity my friend.
hi.. Great video comparison. I have a Hegel H80 so nice to have a perspective for future.. I am however curious if the Yggdrasil in your comparison the most recent multibit version? Finally how would you describe the the Tekton compared to the LS50? Will you do a review /comparison video for the two?
Hi Hooman, thanks for the comments. The Yggy I'm using is the gen 1 analogue; I'm tempted to upgrade but I am currently happy with the performance, and I think I would have more of an impact upgrading something else at this time.
Regarding the Tekton impacts vs. the LS50, yes I will make a future video, probably coming out next year due to the holidays. I haven't done a direct comparison yet, but my first impression is very positive, better deeper bass as expected for a speaker twice the size, and vocals are just as fabulous, if not moreso.
Has anybody experienced a Hegel H80 with Kef Ls50s ?
Not the H80, but the H90. Lovely combination, very clean and tidy sound, and I'm pretty sure the H80 would sound great as well if you lean towards that type of sound signature.
The Audiofool thank you! I actually have the h80 with the ls50 ( and modi 3 DAC) it is a really good amp. But I feel like the ls50 can do more. Do you think the Shiit Aegir will be an upgrade from h80? (Small room - 10x11 feet). I also have the Little Dot mkIII tube headphone amp( tried as a preamp for H80, not much difference). So I’m considering the Freya preamp for the future. What are your thoughts about this? Thanks a lot for your answer an detailed videos!
@@alexandrupopovschi4628 I also tried the H190 on the KEF LS50 and while it did improve a little bit from the H90, I do not feel it is worth. The Schiit Aegir will also change the sound a little bit depending on your listening preference but I think you are already using majority of the potential of the LS50. No need to look for better amps for the LS50, congratulations!
With regard to the tube pre-amps, what are you looking for? I'm not really into tubes, and I experimented with it a little bit but now I just go back to buffered mode in the Freya+. You don't really need the balanced out of the Freya so maybe save a few bucks and go with the Saga and spend the extra on a rich sounding tube like RCA or Brimar.
The Audiofool thanks, this helps a lot! You are right, maybe I just have to upgrade the speakers if I want more full sound, better soundstage and imaging. I like Ls50 but they don’t sound great with all tipe of music and I can’t listen for longer time, it gets fatiguing. I’m thinking about Hartbeth P3ESR or Buchardts s400, s300. What do you think?
Have you listened to Elac Andante’s? I didn’t see any reviews on these, but they seems to be a great speaker.
Thanks a lot again for your advices!!
@@alexandrupopovschi4628 Ah I see now why you want to get a tube pre-amp. I have not heard the Adantes or Buchardts but the Adantes are currently on close out sale so these are very tempting, although if you want a sweeter warmer sound, it might be better to get the P3ESR. I dont think these will still be great with all types of music but it will not be as harsh as the LS50.
Thank you, very helpful review. Had the H160 and have H300 now. Good quality but high prices.
Thanks for watching. They are a bit expensive, but if you have the budget, they are definitely worth it; this should be in everyone's to hear list.
Good comparison! But since you said the Hegel doesn't look that expensive, I'd rather have the manufacturer pour more R&D money into the sound than the looks. McIntosh says that the manufacturing of their chassis alone makes for 1/3 of the price.
Thanks for watching! Regarding the chassis being 1/3 the price, that is not just for the looks, and more on how it handles heat dissipation and RF shielding or separating internal components and other stuff. Schiit itself said that they save on the cost by making the chassis function as a heatsink, and as a result, its gets really hot. That said, I think they could still make something pretty without costing too much, don't you think? But i guess plain and boring is the safe bet.
cost cutting, quality suffers all around any product. Some companies does a better job making this less obvious than others.
Thanks for this vid...I’m an eyeing Hegel, but i am also considering a parasound HINT6 or separate s23+/P6. They will be mated to a b&w 702s. Hmm, Pinoy?
Yes! I'm more keen to go with the Hegel H190 but I think you will be okay with the HINT. Try them out and see which sounds best for you.
The Audiofool luckily my dealer carries both. I’m demoing an A52 for now but will request a Hegel if he has them for in home demo. Salamat for your vids!
@@labalo5 what did you go with? I’m between the Hegel and Parasound
@@frankfleischman7285 at the time, I liked the sound and and flexibility of the Hegel. So went with a h390
@@labalo5 are you loving it? Would you change anything? Thank you!
Please no more hat. Sound is subjective to the listener and I understand this. But your reviews drive me nuts. Please try to review food of somethings different maybe.
Please check out my newer vids, I ditched the jester hat, so should be easier to digest.
Did you notice the hegel to have a transformer hum noise ?
Hmmm... have to say I didn't notice anything and silent passages were quite silent.
@@TheAudiofool thats interesting because my H120 makes a continuous hum, the H90 I had previously was completely silent, perhaps i have a faulty unit?
@@hclandscapes Yes, you should have it checked.
Great comparison video.I currently have a Chord Mojo DAC, plugged into my CXA60 integrated amplifier.And I want to try a Schiit DAC.I am debating between the Modi Multibit and the Bitfrost Multibit.But the Jotunheim multibit is the same price as the Bitfrost Multibit but it also has a balanced headphone amp and preamp(which i dont need because i use an integrated).So is the Bitfrost multibit worth the extra cost over the Modi Multibit?Or is the Jotunheim Multibit the best choice as a DAC option,considering its the same price as the Bitfrost and has extra features.
Thanks. The mojo is already a great dac and you're not really upgrading if you choose to get a modi or bitfrost. I actually have a comparison vid between modi and mojo, but a lot of people can't bear to watch my old vids as I was still young and didn't know what I was doing hehe. Modi will give you a bit more neutral presentation compared to the Mojo, but reward you with more detail and transients while the Mojo is the more musical one. Interestingly, these reverse as you go up the chain.
Going to your question on bimby or jotun, if you're not going to use the headphone output, go with the bimby as it will be a bit better in terms of cleanliness and clarity. Soundstage is slightly deeper as well. I would say that the dac in the jotun is roughly the same level as the mimby. That said, if you already have a chord mojo, I'd recommend you just hold on to that and wait until you can spring for a gumby.
@@TheAudiofool Thanks
I own Schiit's Modi Multibit, Jotunheim w/ Multibit, and Gungir Multibit. Given my many hours of listening to each, I'd place them in this order: 1) Gungir Multibit, 2) Modi Multibit, and distant 3) Jotunheim Multibit. The Modi Multibit is very amazing, especially for the $$, and I'd say much closer to the Gungir in performance than the Jotunheim's multibit card.
@@cuckoohead454 How wide is the soundstage of the Modi Multibit?My Chord Mojo has a natural sound with great imaging but not as wide in sound stage compared to my Grace M9xx.But the Mojo has a more natural sound with better bass.
@@ca77721 I find the Modi Multibit to have a moderately wide soundstage -- with good depth. I find the more striking qualities of the Modi Multibit to be its euphony and bass power. Between the multibit card add-in for the Jotunheim and the Modi Multibit, I would pick the Modi Multibit. Of course then, you also need a preamp/headphone amp.