Everything RIGHT & WRONG with the Vinyl Record Industry in 2024 | Talking About Records
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ส.ค. 2024
- The vinyl industry is in the midst of a complete rebirth over the last 5+ years. A lot has been done to recapture the magic of the past, while marrying the physical format with today's streaming dominated world. Plenty is going RIGHT, but there are also things that are still going quite WRONG. In this episode of Talking About Records we discuss the highlights and fails.
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I agree about price of new vinyl being too high. I would like deflation
I feel your pain on the paper sleeve penny pinch.
Reckon you called that one bang on. Certainly the price of new LP's is getting ridiculous and out of my pocket a lot of the times now.
Ugh, the paper sleeves....I'm grateful to whoever it was who gave me the idea early on to just buy a pack of poly sleeves for my new records.
I know some people rip the paper sleeve right off so they don't damage the record sliding it off
lol
I agree with all of these points, especially the inner sleeves, I can’t stand that
Back in 1989 I got back into buying records after I jumped onto the CD bandwagon in 1985. The price I paid locally for a clean used record was $3 sealed records went for $8
When I was buying LP's in the early 1980's the normal price was about $7 to $8. In 2024 dollars that would be $24.05. I am okay in that price range for a single LP. Anything over that is a bit ridiculous. For the most part I purchase used records. I purchased four used records just the other day and it was $26.30. Nothing great and probably LPs others would pass on but it was music I like and listened to back in the 70's and 80's so I am happy with it. 😁
And I agree with you on your paper sleeve frustrations! That is why I clean even new records before playing them and use the poly-lined sleeve.
Seems to me that if nearly everyone is complaining about prices, it might be in the record stores own best interests to push back on the suppliers/ companies a bit more rather than rolling out the "oh its not us, its them' line. I accept you (the stores) don't control the MSRP but if grossly elevated prices kill the growth of new music, then the end result is the same - you close. Perhaps *telling* the suppliers - nope, this is too expensive, I'm not taking it - might work if the RSD groups of stores all did it together. I'd expect self-preservation's a pretty good motivator.
Agreed. Easier said than done of course. And RSD....well, who knows if they'd risk their relationships with all the majors. The reality is the labels will squeeze it to death until everyone stops paying it...but that's not any time soon IMO.
Agree 100% with everything you mentioned, especially with regards to the pricing.
I agree with pretty much everything you said. As far a quality control goes I haven't had any issues with warped records but I am finding more new records with scratches straight out of the jacket.
That sucks. And a lotta times scratches (or scuffing) is a result of the damn paper sleeves
Hello, you are quite right warped records and paper inner sleeves are extremely irritating, but on the whole I find the quality of today's pressings good, often better than say 30 years ago, that is my experience. Best regards from the Netherlands
Yes! 5 new records yesterday and 2 were warped, 1 really badly.
My main complaint is way too many record pressed off-center. I bought a lot of records in high-school and as a young adult in the 1980s and getting a record with a side pressed off-center was foreign to me. I never had that issue until the vinyl resurgence over the last 15 years or so. Now it just seems expected.
We’ve encountered that a bit, but not near as much as warping.
@@NTXVinyl I agree but most of the warping I encounter is minor and does not affect play. But, yeah, sometimes it can be bad.
I really wanted Tesla "real 2 reel" on RSD, but when I got there it was $60! $60? WTF it's a double LP of cover songs!
Yup
You hit the nail on the head when it comes to the lack of quality control and the dreadful paper innersleeves.
In 1968 I was buying my first records. The price was about five dollars. When adjusting for inflation that works out to 35 or 40 dollars in todays dollars.
That's fine. Do the math from just 3-4 years ago. Comparing to 30-40-50 years ago is a different topic. This isn't primarily inflation. This is corporate greed.
I can't count on two hands the number of emails I've gotten since the start of COVID from all of the major distributors notifying independent record stores that Sony/Warner/Universal are "Increasing Prices Again on X,XXX titles"
Since I have a large collection I usually limit new record purchases to 20-25$ each, so 40 -50$ for a double. If it gets higher I pass.
Everything is more expensive now
I've been resleeving since my teens starting with the VRP sleeves then on to Mofi. No regrets but agreed it should be done by the industry.
It is a glorious time for old school collectors due to the high quality of recordings.
I love RSD because getting out of print recordings and new releases from vaults ex. FZ and GD.
"It is a glorious time for old school collectors due to the high quality of recordings."
Yes it sure is!!! I've been at it 30 years and even before I started NTX it was the best of times, seeing this all come back again. It ain't perfect, but it at times it can be beautiful.
This seemed like a pep talk at some factory. I expected him to call out specific people and commend them while telling them they will have a little something extra in this weeks paycheck.
Ok 👌🏼
agreed brother! I wish they would repress Robert Plant. but I'm sure that's an artist decision as of now. Enjoy the videos!
Cheers!
Great video. There are two things I have:
1) Regarding reissues; as a newer collector, its helping me out, but I really need some labels or bands (not sure who's at fault) to start doing more reissues. For me its Rush. I desperately want a copy of Counterparts and Test for Echo but neither have had a reissue in many years and I'm not dropping $400 on a record.
2) Paper sleeves in 2024 is criminal. For example, I've purchased some Taylor Swift records for my wife. Everything about her releases screams high quality,: the artwork, lyrics, amount of songs, etc. But she uses paper sleeves. The records are scuffed and have paper residue on them right out of packaging. It drives me nuts! Who do we complain to? The label? The artist? For the higher cost they are charging for new records, a poly inner should be a given.
(1) In most cases it’s just a waiting game. But in others it can be a lost cost depending on contractual issues. With a hugely popular band like Rush you gotta think their entire catalog will become readily available…..eventually
(2) AMEN TO THAT. It is 100% the record label making to minute decisions on pressings, like the style of inner sleeve. Completely defeating as you said.
Paper sleeves are ridiculous for new expensive vinyl. My take on RSD is that "Live" albums are very gimmicky, especially for hip hop. Half the time the soundboards aren't even good to begin with.
I get the argument of $30-40 per LP is in line with inflation from the 80's. However, when general merchandise, groceries, utilities, and necessities have doubled or tripled in price, while many make $15 an hour or less, it becomes unaffordable to many. In this economy buying a CD for $12 vs $30-50 for the LP is a much more feasible solution. Plus used CDs for $1-5 each, it's a no brainer.
The reality is for a large majority of popular/mainstream artists/albums, the labels press a decent amount, which means they’re paying anywhere from $5-15 per album pressed (for a single LP).
They could easily charge $20-25 for single LPs and still have a good margin l. But they don’t. They’ve pushed it up to $30-40 in many cases
I think performers like Lana Del Rey and Taylor Swift need to limit 1 album per customer for special variants. Alice in Chains did it with 'Jar of Fly" release on their website for special variants. This should go for RSD at each store. There should be a max of 5 albums per customer, nothing more until the following day. This will allow more people to be able to purchase specialty albums and really make the industry grow. I understand why they do it but I also feel that the person who went into the store to purchase that one album and was told it is sold out, leaves empty handed and possibly a lost customer to the vinyl community.
I absolutely agree I was at my small independent record store this am and there was a woman who had a list and she bought like 25 albums I think as you say you should be limited to FIVE on the first day then if you want to go back the next day cool
Limit to one variant period! By putting multiple versions of a single album out is done for one reason, cash grab!
@@user-zq1px9yb7g
Nobody is forcing you to buy anything if you don’t want it don’t buy it
I used to support record store day but not anymore! With many of us, they have passed their expiration date! Limited edition is great & all but when you only have an 8,000 limit for the entire country, that’s just a cash grab! Not everyone that wants to participate in RSD can get there that day! Many have to work that day! Also, claiming to have an RSD exclusive that costs $50-$60 only to have that same exact album be released in mass less than a month later of later in the year at a lower price! An example is Nat King Cole live from RSD 2024! The same exact version of that RSD album is up for pre-sale on his website at a lower price! All RSD is is a cash grab!
Biggest thing for me is probably the price of new records. My main want from RSD 2024 was Tesla’s Real to Reel covers album. I got a copy, but I was not prepared for the $58 price tag!! It’s a double album, but still… That’s nearly $30 per disc, and this is music that was originally recorded in, like, 2007! No new content on here; it’s just the first time it was pressed on wax. I think $40 would’ve felt much more appropriate.
Yup. That sucks. Unfortunately I don't see it changing anytime soon. The labels have essentially doubled down on the idea that this hobby is a "collectors" thing now. Like sneakers or sports cards. That's what they want, for obvious reasons. It's defeating for those of us that just want to enjoy the music on the format we love.
I agree completely about paper sleeves; chaps my ass for the same reason it chaps yours and everyone else's. But the biggest complaint I have, and have had for a few years, is putting 10-12 songs on two pieces of vinyl and charging me, the consumer, an extra 10-15 bucks for extra wax and cardboard which isn't necessary. I'm afraid the days are long gone where we get a new album with 10 songs on it; 5 songs per side. And recording at 45 RPM over 33 1/3, half-mastered this, and remastered that...just make a fucking normal album!
I understand that you being a record store owner you have more skin in the game as far as pricing goes but pricing is out of control for new stuff. If the record store all banded together and talked to the labels maybe it would change a little ?
The pricing is what is driving more people to online places like Amazon where you can save some significant money
Yes I know. We (record stores) have very little control over it.
How evident has it become from the store owner perspective if there are certain pressing plants that are doing a much worse job on quality control vs. others?
Nearly impossible. Most labels/artists use different pressing plants constantly, based on availability, price, minimum quantity, etc. And the location of WHERE an album pressed is unknown on most releases until it's opened, and even then it's sometimes a mystery. Too much variance and inconsistency.
Audiophile labels like Blue Note, AP, Craft are the main exception.
I don't know how often you handle the old RCA Victor and Living Stereo discs, but it always amazes me how flat they are after seventy years (and probably bad storage). But while a good turntable will track a warped disc, it can't correct pressing defects, and that's my main gripe about new pressings. I've had to return two albums recently (Heavy Weather and Wish You Were Here) due to poor sound and a skip. How is this in particular still happening?
And speaking of RSD, a "vinyl debut" edition pressing from a few years ago had a full six seconds of a song cut out in the middle. For no apparent reason and with no explanation. Does anyone actually QA these things with their ears?
I handle thousands of LPs per month from the late 50s-80s. And I completely agree. Unless treated horribly most hold up great and are perfectly flat
Agree on the quality control and warpage issues of current vs 80’s quality. I have owned record stores since 1976. I thought the quality of domestic vinyl dropped steadily throughout the 70’s and 80’s. A big portion of returns were warped. Another defect problem was from the increased amount of music being squeezed into each side. My understanding is that was done by making the grooves smaller and tighter. That caused a lot of skating issues to many vinyl customers with lower quality equipment or slightly worn needles.
Currently, my defective returns are much lower for a few reasons, IMO. One is the movement towards double disc sets vs cramming too much onto one disc. Second is the heavier vinyl used on a lot of today’s pressings. Third, the use of more protective shipping cartons. Which begs the question, why not spend the extra nickel on premium quality inner sleeves?
Note: a much higher percentage of vinyl I am selling is now pressed in Europe. European pressing in the 70’s and 80’s were generally better quality than domestic pressings. So, it’s should be no surprise that the current European pressings are better quality than our domestic pressings of the past.
i try to avoid 180 gram now....8/10 of the 180g records i've bought over the last 5 years have some degree of warp/wobble
Also love the art releases; I mentioned eins.zwei.acht label before with the Friendship editions. Also recently got an art piece from objet trouvé label. -- Haven't had much warping issues. Maybe 2 out of about 5-600 in the last 2-3 years. Agree on paper sleeves, just received another 200 inner polys from vinyl storage solutions. -- Biggest pet peeve is no lyrics sheet with vocal music. If an artist bothers to put words to music, maybe it is worth writing them down for the listener. Otherwise, I have to assume that the words are meaningless. But then frequently lyrics are unintelligible, it's word salad. Classical music typically provides context about the particular piece in the booklet, which really helps. There's an idea for "pop" music. Prices: seems more or less in line with inflation over the past 40 years, IME.
I think the reason used vynl is coming down is because of the quality of the reissues.
Not sure I follow.
@@NTXVinyl
The quality of some of the reissues is dropping the cost of the original issues because they don’t sound nearly as good. An example is the Steeky Dan QRs effect on the vintage albums
As long as a product sells, Any company in any industry will always creep up prices, because they can because people keep buying
As much as I hate the lack of quality control on many new records, I shudder whenever I open a new record and see the sandpaper-like paper sleeves. Purchased a long out of press record with only 100 records pressed (small indie artist) a couple of years back for around $120. It was still in the original shrinkwrap and the cover looked fantastic. I opened it up and lo and behold it has scuff-marks on pretty much 25% of the record, likely from sitting in a box getting flipped through over and over again. Felt like a punch in the gut at first, but luckily the scuffs were very superficial so there is no obvious surface noise from the record.
If you buy records from known labels you can usually avoid this but there is always a chance you get someone who skimped on quality.
Yeah it’s frustrating as hell to spend good money on an LP and then see the records aren’t perfect
Interesting you focused on warped. I've been into records for 4 or 5 years and haven't had that issue once. I have had multiple records with manufacturer defect scratches to the point of being more like gouges. Usually a zig zag sort of pattern. And of course virtually every record is filthy with tiny debris.
What’s your take on digital vs analog? Not that I know a ton but are a lot of 2024 presses just digital cuts? And with the reissue 90s there is that gray area of is this original a digital record in the first place? I’m looking forward to the new Atlantic 75 STP Purple release, haven’t heard Core yet
Love the shirt, where can I get one?
Still waiting for some reissues of classic albums because the artist / labels can’t figure things out is annoying! I will say we have seen some good ones in the past 2-3 years which is promising.
Yeah....trust me. That stuff can be real sticky. And the reality is, unless the particular album is a big seller, the artist has to seriously want it, and be ready to REALLY FIGHT for it. It can take years even once the process begins. The case anytime lawyers and paperwork get involved.
@@NTXVinyl I hear ya. Just sucks for fans who want the music in this format! But I’ve seen a lot of good albums repressed in recent years. Hopefully they get to some other albums I’ve been waiting for 🤞
Correct on the paper sleeves. Pure greed.
Lots of things going for sure.
What I don't like is "older" records, I mean those released in the past few years, still new that get the price bump just because that the new price of vinyl right now. Dude, those records were in stock way before the price hike.
Ah, I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news... those new prices are here to stay. as for everything, once it's gone up, it seldomly goes down.
The other thing I noticed is some releases especially special/limited etc that come in both records and CDs, you don't get the same number of tracks between the 2 mediums. I'm sorry I'm here for the music most importantly so if you're going to release 48 tracks on CDs and only 12-20 on records, then I'll get the CDs (and probably save a bit of money as well)
It bothers me even more than when they do bonus track for this or that (Japanese releases or iTunes or Spotify or for a specific retailer etc). Not everyone can shop at those outlets so even if you're a fan of the artist there's no way to get it, plus sometimes the bonus are different so that would mean you would have to buy multiple copies... nope
Fortunately it's not common. I don't mind if they do a specific color variant of a record for a specific outlet. As long as it's the same music.
I have to say, RSD this year was not bad. I have been skipping it entirely the past few years but this year seems a step in the right direction. Yes, still a bunch on unnecessary releases, picture discs and gimmicks but it was much better I thought. I actually had a good time at my local store. It was not crowded, busy but a constant flow in and out so everything was pretty smooth.
It's been several time G.I. you mentioned your label, care to do a presentation video about it? I'm sure the audience would be interested. Just a suggestion.
Cheers.
Here ya go!
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@@NTXVinyl Thank you. Sorry for not having checked the backlog of videos.
I should have before I asked
Cheers.
you're lucky if you can find new vinyl for less than 40 bux in canada.
Yeah that blows
Wouldn’t spend 300-500 bucks on a record but would buy thousands of dollars worth of records. …….wink😊
About 80% of the new records I buy are warped, playable, but visibly warped and it's super annoying, like get your shit together!
Heya! In the 1960's, mono records cost $4.00 at the store and stereo ones cost $5.00. Taking over 50 years of inflation into account, is $25 or $30 really that outrageous? People get paid a whole lot more today than they did in the 1960's; that's how it works!
That’s all fine and good. I’m not referring to the increase in price over 50 years. If you look at just the last 3-4 yrs the costs have significantly increased. But, the actual pressing costs have not gone up - at least not at the handful of plants I work with. So, who’s padding the price? The labels, that’s who. They’re milking consumers. Which is fine in the short term. But it’s just that, a short term win. Because there’s a breaking point. And that’s when people simply stop buying. And exit the hobby.
Dude, we do not get paid more when you take the cost of living. Not trying to debate economics, but you are soo of base...... lol 😂 had to say something. 😅😅
Some people are getting paid a lot more; others not really
@@TomTester-ey1rt it is called a Mean.
I prefer tp buy a good clean second hand copy over an over-priced 180g vinyl re-issue... prices are still damn stupid! I know the material is expensive but it does not excuse for price gouging
That's fine, for music that predates 1990. But that's 30+ years that consists of a ton of music, that is virtually only avail "new" at this point, to a large portion of buyers (that aren't chasing rare/originals that are OOP)