The Return of Passenger Trains
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 มี.ค. 2024
- Passenger trains are important in US history. For a century, train stations were the primary entrances to our cities. Over the past several decades, trains have become less prominent for a variety of reasons. However, the time has come for trains to make a comeback. The Federal Rail Administration has recently rolled out its Corridor ID grants, providing new investment into passenger rail. Among the corridors selected to receive new funding is the Amtrak Heartland Flyer, which currently runs from Fort Worth to Oklahoma City. The new proposal would extend the route north to Edmond, Guthrie, Perry, Ponca City Arkansas City, Wichita, and Newton, connecting to the Amtrak Southwest Chief. In this video, we go on a road trip to all of these towns along the planned route, while simultaneously learning the history of Penn Station in New York City.
FURTHER READING
Ponca City Depot: abandonedok.com/ponca-city-de...
SPECIAL THANKS
Caylor Peterson, provided editing assistance
PATREON: patreon.com/user?u=77222920&u...
DISCORD: / discord
CONTACT: eryngo.urbanism@gmail.com
CLIPS USED
Old Penn Station: • The Original Penn Stat...
Acela: • Go inside Amtrak’s new...
California HSR: • Fall 2023 Construction...
Brightline: • 125mph Brightline flie...
Brightline West: • Visualizing Brightline...
Hawaii Skyline: • Hawaii's $10BN Railway...
Northeast Maglev: • The Northeast Maglev -...
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Bok Choy - Slynk
The Truth - Anno Domini Beats
Causmic - The High Line
Luge - Geographer
Costa Rica - Slynk
Fish Room - Verified Picasso
Colour Of Your Face - NoMBe
Blue Dream - Cheel
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What do you think the future is for US passenger rail?
It probably depends on whether the orange man gets re-elected?
@@TheBorrewhat do you mean?
@@sejjr79ifyBiden's the only reason AMTRAK is getting higher funding then ever, considering he's used the service.
Trump tried to cut all the Long-distance routes.
Political appetite for spending will wane severely from inflation and taxes. Convenient infrastructure will not be provided. Ironically, this is a good opportunity for rail service like Brightline.
It’s absolutely coming back. Both the Northeast corridor and Brightline are proof that Americans will happily ride trains as long as they’re good and the service is frequent. And they show that the infrastructure can be brought back with public money, private money, or both. Rail is just economically more efficient, and one way or another, it’s coming back.
It’s good to show people how our country was built around trains and train stations. It’s possible to bring them back; trains are our future and our past
No way, what's silly.
The irony of that dealership's location and utter cringe of that sign lol! Imagine getting off a train and seeing "Welcome to truck country"
I've stopped at a lot of the old rail stations around New Mexico. Even in wide, open New Mexico, people often say they wish they could catch the train. Several of the long distance routes that the FRA/Amtrak are studying now would restore service to many of these and really link much of the state. It is so silly when people say transit can't work in the US or in the West, when both, including New Mexico, largely developed around rail. Alas
That was before railroads had their competition subsidized and were smothered with economic regulation and taxes.
The transit has to be good and frequent
I'm from OKC, I appreciate there being an Oklahoma-based Urbanist TH-camr. It's so car dependent here.
"It was all too much. One used to enter the city like a god. Now, one scuttles in like a rat."
-famous quote about the destruction of the old Penn Station.
Why didn't you buy it?
I think rail travel would be a lot more popular than many people may think. Here in the Midwest, I’ve had to take the Amtrak from college to visit my parents a couple times. There are several reasons that make it not very convenient, and yet both times the actual ride itself was still really nice and really memorable. Plenty of leg room, you can get up and walk around, nice scenery, it’s relaxing, you don’t have to fight traffic on the Interstate, and two hours on the train seems to pass by quicker than two hours driving. If it was more convenient in any one of a number of ways, I’d be willing to take the train much more often
There are a lot of people in Salt Lake City trying to make this happen starting with something called the Rio Grande Plan. It is a proposal to move the trains underground and reconnect them to our historic depot in downtown. From there with a brand new heart we can build out passenger rail!!
Underground for what? And heart of what?
I have seen drawings of this plan. Looks good, but an additional track and platform for all tracks would improve capacity and flexibility for both Amtrak and Frontrunner.
Great video! I'm a huge fan of small historic stations and love how important they can be to a town. It's the dream of my wife and I to someday buy an old station like this and restore it to health, maybe if what you say comes to pass we'll get that chance!
Hey, we're big fans of your channel! Keep up the good work.
@@eryngo.urbanism hey, I'm a pretty big fan of what you've done so far... Keep it up!
I know a dude who works at a grocery store, he has somehow picked up custodianship of three depots essentially given to him minus the land. One, the smallest, is safe and was moved to a museum. I haven't checked in with his handling of the other two in a couple years.
A fun road-trip that made for a fun video
it’s stuff like this that gives me hope for a better future
Wow the Wichita union station looked gorge, it's a shame that there's no passenger rail there at all. Love the old timey downtowns!
I would have loved to have seen a map inserted into your road trip with the train route and the cities/towns marked. You could have even had an animated car chugging along the line.
oh no! its perry the oklahoma town!!
"We're not in Oklahoma anymore. We're actually in Arkansas... City, Kansas. But it's not pronounced like that, it's pronounced Ar-Kansas City. Not to be confused with Kansas City, Missou--you get the point" very nice
Passed Newton on the SW Chief late at night heading west. Now, I have a better understanding of this cutoff for the towns you had in the video. Thanks.
I love how all the things you have been interested in (obsessed by?) your whole life are coming together in your videos and in your chosen career! Thanks for this latest video. For many reasons, I hope your vision for more passenger trains does happen. Thanks for all the info!
First of all, train infrastructure has been neglected for 70 years so the investment required is enormous. Second of all, the airline companies oppose expansion of high speed rail or even standard rail service because American monopolistic capitalism opposes competition. This means there are reasons why rail transportation faces such enormous lobby opposition from airlines, the automobile and tire industries. Nothing would please me more to have the United States criscrossed by dedicated high speed rail even maglev trains but the well funded opposition is strong.
I love train stations ❤❤
We need a 21st century hsr act!!
No, defund everything.
Great video!
Kind of regretting choosing the Heartland Flyer as my first amtrak route to conplete...just gonna have to cone back one day.
Find the film “Dear Heart.” (1964) The opening credits and vignettes were filmed at the old Penn Station, showing all the dingy crap that filled it. It’s easy to imagine how it was thought to be worth demolishing in favor of new construction.
Nice to see some optimism here, although you will need to tackle the small problem of Mr "Welcome to Truck Country" with his pickup dealership in the way of the train station (hilarious). If there ever was a metaphor for why building rail will be an uphill battle in the U.S, that would be it! haha. It does seem like the tide is slowly turning though.
Your channel is a lovely find! My only big complaint is the volume, I have to turn it all the way up in the video and on speakers to hear you consistently well, which is not a problem I encounter with other videos
Good stuff!!!!!!!
Great video! Loving the concept and content. For next time, try to make sure no voices are only coming from the left. Feels very strange in headphones ❤
I love your videos.
Great stuff! Hopefully, we can get our act together vis-a-vis rail. Bring on the Tra(i)nsit-oriented Development
This is a pie in the sky. There were things that forced cuts to Amtrak that we don’t see as possible now but will happen under pressure from any number of factors that will be “more important” by then.
If you know you know. Most people aren't capable of thinking of everything together with higher order consequences. Just basic emotions about whatever sounds good to them.
Awesome P42, with *soot!*
First thing I would do it I had magical powers- reopen the CN&L. I live in central SC and we need our own keystone corridor desperately!
Good video with interesting historical information. Thanks.
I live in Los Angeles and our Union Station has never looked better or been more busy. It's been a working train station from day one and is only getting better.
The main station was completely restored several years ago. And, there is a project to expand its capacity that has already been approved. Part of that project will be the construction of run through tracks for the first time increasing train capacity by 60% and allowing CAHSR trains to better utilize the station.
Of course, Los Angeles Metro is continually expanding as well and Union Station has been at the center of that expansion.
We'll also finally get a Metro connection to LAX late this year or early next year. A lot of exciting rail projects happening in the City of Angels.
2:50 lol
I want the old penn station back the current penn station is a mess :(
Through running for Penn station!!
The Arkansas City station resembles those in Hutchinson and Lawrence, KS, both of which are still in service with Amtrak.
Battle of the Empty Prairie States LOL. OK vs KS vs NE vs SD vs ND Place your bets for best rail buildings😉
There was a excellent train overnight from Chicago and Kansas City cut years ago. The Lone Star which was the Texas Chief. Rode it a few times. It had to be shorted of cars to get the ridership down. And reservations put on it to keep people from standing in the aisles over night.
You can thank the Crter Administration for the cuts in service 1979, despite impressive ridership increases during the Iranian Oli Embargo.
The old democrat party! At one time it was both parties. Today it's mostly republicans. 99% republican's
I forget the exact numbers (on City Nerd), but trains have a sweet spot of filling the gap between a 90 minute car ride and a 90 minute commercial flight. We should first fill out train service in that gap.
A long drive is stressful for the driver, and exhausting for everyone in the car. Better to take a train where you can relax, walk a bit, grab a meal or snack.
By the time you add time spent at the airport to your flight, it takes almost as much time as a train between the same two cities. And in many places, the train station is closer to the center of town, but the airport is in Outer Suburbia, adding even more time. Coach in a train has more room than domestic First class in a plane.
We don't need coast to coast train service. We need OKC to Dallas, or OKC to Wichita, or Minneapolis to Chicago. Once these routes are built, you can throw a sleeper car or two on in one place, switch them to a different train, and you now have long distanct service.
17:16 LIRR trains actually do use the new train hall, but yeah NJT cannot
You’re absolutely right. Trains are going to come back because they have to. The US is slightly smaller than the EU in area, but will surpass the EU in population by 2050. There is no way to move people in corridors and serve rural communities except by rail. Tax dollars simply aren’t sufficient to support the highways and aviation to support this growth. The cost of auto ownership is growing. People have to choose currently between a car or housing. It’s just reality that rail is the only solution.
Interesting story. Nice to see coverage of Oklahoma. Distance train travel only works when embedded in a network with high-speed on one end, and last-mile public transit on the other end. I live in Switzerland with the best public transit in the world, Well, maybe tied with Japan. Within Europe I've travelled from London in the west, Amsterdam in the north, Vienna in the east, and Palermo in the south. Between the cities of Basel and Zürich there are 109 trains per day. Each way. I've tried train travel in the USA. Boston to Washington. Kansas to New York City. It is painful. (Ditch the political side-commentary. It does not improve your videos.)
The reason the new train hall doesn't have ample seating is to deter homeless people from sitting for long periods of time.
Main st in Arkansas City looks like it has room for light rail tracks
Judging by the thumbnail…One could only hope
Nice video. Just wondering: is this a dutch flag at 8:53. Is there any officicial connection to Oklahoma?
No connection, the flag actually says “OPEN” and seemingly is just the Country Corner Antique Store’s way of broadcasting to the world that they are, in fact, open 😆
My only hopes for this Heartland Flyer expansion is adding stops in Houston, TX, Salina, KS and Tulsa, OK (it’s unrealistic, but it’d be pretty nice)
The problem for passenger trains is the illegally long freight trains - too long for the sidings, so passenger trains can't pull past them - which legally they must do.
I’m a simple man. I see a pink safety vest, I give a 👍
Madison Square Garden is great. This is a venue without a massive parking lot in the city. Doesn't have the associated traffic snarl with every game. This is an ideal downtown venue. I have an architectural background so I appreciate the space that was lost but, I understand this is the perfect setup. Just want more attention to the station beyond it 's utility.
It could easily be moved to the new planned expansion of Hudson Yards. The current Penn Station is a cruel joke.
For DEN-DFW route, Institute a nonstop overnigjt Auto-Train operation between the two endpoints.
🎉
The route is identical in length to the present Auto Train along th east, coast. Relatively unpopulated along the line. Overnight service. Optional enroute stop at Amarillo (passengers only).
Revive the Texas Zephyr name with this train!
Ironicly enough Denver once was a though station.
Yup. I remember that. Of course, a "pull-pull" style operation would ameliorate the situation at Denver.
Should do an episode about Tulsa Transit's rebrand to MetroLink...
Did anyone else have sound issues? The host came in loud and clear. When it switched I could hardly hear it.
You should talk about the MBTA communities law in a future video
Ok really, trains are great but prices have to come down especially on sleepers.
You need to be thinking real TGV guys i.e. 320km/h or 200 mph with dedicated high speed lines linkes to the classic rail network to access city centres. No one flies between Paris and Lyon, or London - Paris these days.
Dedicated lines also free up classic infrastrucure for regional trains and freight.
But your domestic airlines lobby will fight tooth and nail …
Good luck!
Now that I realize that Boeing builds airplanes without adaquate safety inspections and parts from the lowest bidder I will be taking the train for trips too long to drive.
Sooo there's a HSR Bill ... Don't know if it's going to pass but they want to set aside 200 billion for High Speed Rail.
Call your reps! Tell them you support it!
Funny USA discovering that trains exist as if they’re not mundane things in India and in Luxembourg and in Australia and in China and in Ireland and in Morocco and in
USA is a 💩🕳 almost every former English colony is . And except India none have decent passenger rail and none have HSR
Through the 1950’s, the U.S. had the finest passenger rail system in the world, bar none. You could conveniently travel to every corner of the country, in comfort, and in many cases, luxury. People don’t realize that. It’s not the U.S. discovering rail; it’s rediscovering. And, Australia does not have a good rail system, and it isn’t better than the U.S.
When I start seeing states shift their DOT budgets from highway focus to rail & non-vehicle infrastructure, I’ll trust we’re FINALLY going into the right direction!
penstation sounds' only comes in the left channel, not ideal for headphones users :(
Great video otherwise!
👍🏼
All tickets taxed until 1962 to build airports and highways.
It was a big mistake to lobby to get rid of the railroad and divest from it, especially when the trains went through rural areas that became suburbs. We could still have cars, but there should of been a balance. And if they did it, high-speed rail would of been built when it was a bit affordable. The governments of the past is at fault the way trains became.
Two stations cause there were other companies that were not in the Union Station.
🤞🏼
Let's hope what you predict will come true!
Passenger train travel in your country is choked to near death by the stranglehold of the freight trains. Amtrak trains are hours late way too often, delayed by freight trains. And, for goodness sake, do something about the crazy practice of boarding trains from ground level.
Amtrak wasn't intended to be a legitimate railway. It was originally supposed to take the passenger service away from the major railroads (who used to run passenger and freight) so that it could quietly be killed off.
The problem is that it became successful. The problem is that it revitalized passenger rail-not anywhere close to the degree it had at its peak, but enough to keep it alive.
Can't wait to leave my "flyover country" city at 2:30 AM for train trips that take twice as long and cost twice as much as driving a car, on routes that cost half a billion dollars a mile to build. But hey, congratulations to the rich getting richer in the Northeast Corridor, who're getting upgrades over what they already have.
Very interesting topic. Unfortunately I switched off- too much political messaging.😞
The amount of money squandered on Ukraine could have gone a long way towards expanding and upgrading long distance passenger trains. Nice and informative video. Greetings from Port Saint Lucie, Florida.
11:41 Is that a Vending Machine Museum ? Looks like 5 different machines to me…
The law says that AMTRAK has priority over freight trains.
The private companies are fighting that with such long trains they can’t fit in existing sidings and stop the Amtrak trains at every siding possible !
Regulate the length of the trains OR the sidings ! Electrify the main corridors first and go on to smaller lines. Electrify all commuter networks too…
This can be done quickly in 20-30 years !!!
Lesser pollution and noise levels- higher speeds and acceleration is the result …!
We should build maglev
Gotta find a better power distribution and generation system first. China has greatly reduced the power and speed of their maglev.
Millions of dollars of investment - when it cost over $1 a mile to construct rail on average dos not a return to passenger rail make , nor will rails that is payed for by freight maintained for freight and designed for freight likely to result in comfortable , reliable or economic passenger rail ( yes there is a ridiculous law that states that rails maintained by privet company must give priority access to a company that dos not maintain the rails ). It is not about the stations , the stations are a way to access the rail and without rails that the company that maintains the rails controls for public transport thisis going no place slowly and with many delays !
Perhaps a review of the California dream of a "high speed passenger railroad" is a good reason to end the joyous rah-rah for the unsupportable cost of the project.
The Cal Trains will not serve anyone outside the central valley---ever!?!
We beg to differ. The cost is far less than buying everyone in California a new vehicle today ($128B / 39.2M pop = about $3.5k per person total) but it will benefit the state for generations to come. Additionally, it will be a far more comfortable, safe, and clean way to travel across the state than by car or plane. To your last point about it not ever leaving the central valley, as far as we're aware, the city connection on the SF end is already pretty far along in its development. While the LA end has a lot more challenges to overcome, the HSR authority has already begun tackling them as well. While the scope and impact of this project are hard to imagine, we think that the massive investment will be totally worth it in the end.
The loaded rhetorical choice of build train or buy everyone cars is not helpful.
The choice was build train or avoid more public debt and tertiary consequences.
Individuals adjust to what they can do for themselves, which could include avoiding the need for travel.
The Federal Reserve is buying a lot of state debt. Not good. It is sucking liquidity out of capital markets and interest rates and inflation will be high for a long time.
Railfan and urbanism TH-cam wonks never bring in realities like this, a powerful source of informed opposition.
@MilwaukeeF40C The federal government has the money to heavily support HSR across the country, including California. It's a matter of political will and bold leadership.
Just look at how much is WASTED on defense. The defense budget is obscene by any measure at almost $1 trillion a year. Cut that budget by $300 billion and dedicate it to national infrastructure that doesn't include roads and highways. Spend it on building new ROWs for HSR. Use it to support local transit metro rail systems. Use it to modernize the national electrical grid. Help fund fiber optic internet across the nation. Projects like CAHSR could be completely finished within a decade, and not just the Central Valley section.
All of this would better serve the American public than $300 billion more of military expenditures.
Technically the federal government has unlimited money to fund anything. How much inflation do you want?
Sure there might be room to cut defense spending, but that amount is negligible compared to the cost of welfare and it's near future unfunded liability (social security), and debt payments.
How far does 300 billion go for ONE rail project like California's? Nevermind all the other leftist pet wishes some of which you mentioned. The government is insolvent and YOU are on the hook for it. I know you don't know this by not addressing any of the technical nuance in my post you replied to. No, "tax the rich" will not get you what you want either.
If you want convenient sht like fiber optic, then live somewhere where it is economical for a business to offer it. Nobody is entitled to outcomes at the expense of others. You want good transit and then support policy that will make it less economical by encouraging decentralization of land settlement.
Sorry not through corrupt Amtrak but only if a private Co does it!
Private companies can be pretty corrupt too
Private companies are most corrupt when government does them favors.
Look for "non political" NGOs/nonprofits like the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation that are funded by both corporations and government, observe all of their connections to academia and sht like NPR, money paid to politicians for "books" and "speaking events", and all the unelected high level government officials who came out of the NGO sponsored ivy league training programs ("fellowships") who have more wealth than a government salary would seem to provide. It's a big club and you ain't in it.
Private companies are most corrupt when the government does things for them, instead of free markets.
The private companies are what killed passenger rail in the first place.
It was the private companies that lobbied for Amtrak to be created to kill off passenger rail for good, and it was only the fluke of Amtrak being just successful enough to keep passenger rail on life support that prevented this from happening. It's the private rail companies that hamstring passenger rail because unlike every other country, rail corridors are privately owned, instead of public infrastructure.
Oh, and the two publicly owned major rail corridors that I can think of? The NEC and the Penninsula Corridor? Both are maintained to passenger rail standards, and as of this month, both are electrified, which is far more then can be said for all the current private corridors.
Disinfecting, really. Try Divest.
Your pipe dreams are not reality.
But it won't be the passenger trains of the height of passenger trains of the 1930's. Nobody wants take three days to travel across the USA.
We may see by the 2040's to 2050's the arrival of practical _maglev_ trains that are capable of 500 km/h (310 mph) speeds. At those speeds, Chicago to Minneapolis, Chicago to Detroit, Chicago to Cincinnati via Indianpolis and even Chicago to Kansas City via St. Louis suddenly become very viable because the travel time will likely be well under 2 hours one way.
A rhobust traditional rail network can still be a very practical means to travel to nearby towns. You're right in that most people would not use them as the primary method of long-distance travel, but at short to medium distances, it's hard to beat a train.
@@eryngo.urbanism But at 310 mph speeds, it becomes a viable replacement for short range jet travel. Imagine by 2050 Los Angeles to Las Vegas in just 75 minutes!
The longest rail line in the US is the California Zephyr with 2,438 miles (3,924 km). A high speed train with the nirmal 186 mph (300 kph) can do it in 13h (even 14h is fine) which is perfect for a night train but it's will be even less as a high speed line will be shorter with a more direct route and with the current top speeds of almost 220 mph (350 kph).
That said. Most rides (like most flights and certainly car rides) will be shorter. No one thought in the 50's that the interstate highway should not be built because no one will drive accross the country (and most dont but there are that do) so why not a much faster transport mean.
BTW, the record for a regular HSR is 574.8 kph (357.2 mph) and was made in 2007. I don't expect to have such speed anyvtime soon but there are trains with a maximum speed of 400 kph (close to 250 mph).
@@AL5520 A reason why the Interstate Highway System was built was due to the need to move goods quickly around the country without complete dependence on rail service. That's why the system was originally called _National System of Interstate and Defense Highways_ , because of its secondary use to move military personnel and material around the country by road quickly.
@@Sacto1654The Second World War proves this to be not necessarily true. Railroads where pivotal to both our the Pacific and European Campaigns. Road transport over very long distances uses too much fuel, and is less efficient inherently.
The highway system wasn't built initially with defense in mind, our Auto companies lobbied heavily for an extreme expansion of our paved road system so they could sell more automobiles. Not to say highways aren't needed. Every modern country has to have a highway system of some sort to function. However we had the capability to move massive amounts of people and goods as it was, our railroad system had that covered and more. Highways in this country served only to replace the railroad in most of this country, which was an asinine thing to do. But its good for the car companies.
Road and Rail have to complement each other for things to be most efficient for most people.
Most of the US has no proper passenger rail, let alone cities designed for easy travel, (if your not in a car). That just leaves us at the behest of auto companies and their interest.
Good video. My generation, the Baby Boomers, will probably only live to see a few of the rail improvements and expansions happen. Gens X, Y and Z will see the most benefits. However there is a "but" and a very big BUT...politics in the USA. I guarantee you that if a certain orange haired fat guy gets reelected President, ALL rail expansions and improvements will stop. He and his party to not support passenger rail, period.
Good. I am a lifelong railfan and trains aren't on my public policy priorities.
My left ear did not enjoy this
Slow and goofy.
Ridiculous presentation
Not if capitalism has its way…
The best rail transportation came from free markets. Populism damaged it.
Yeah sure, take a train and save the environment. You people are delusional.
👎