Always a pleasure to watch your videos! You've got a really good video structure: Present a concrete example of a problem, abstract it and explain a general solution, then come back to your original example to show the solution in action. It's a great way to teach and I don't get tired of it.
And that's really what games are about. People often get too hung up in the technical details, but games are there for our enjoyment. Enjoyment is an emotion, so that's what you need to target, regardless of which form of enjoyment you're targeting.
@@F2t0ny I've watched a few of those. Sometimes I agree, sometimes really not. And a bit hit-or-miss when it comes to topics, but certainly worth a shot if something seems interesting.
Great video, very well structured and presented. Honoured to be the main example here. The team worked so hard on that game and I am glad to see that it is still referenced today. Keep up the amazing work. Educational and inspiring.
Amazing to see you here! Only right with how much effort and passion yall poured into it! If anything, it isn't referenced enough, in my very biased opinion ofc heh.
Small quibble with something: you say that things like story, music, and graphic design can all create aesthetic experiences in the player, “just without the dynamics bit.” The thing is, those things can all ABSOLUTELY influence and alter player behaviour, sometimes radically. The first thing that comes to mind is Portal. They had a level full of box puzzles that required you to use a crate to block lasers and weigh down buttons. But, play testers kept forgetting the crate, putting it down, leaving it behind, and having to backtrack to retrieve it when they realized they needed it again. So what did the devs do? They put a heart on the crate, renamed it, and gave Glados new narration. The Weighted Companion Cube was born. And now players were interacting with the box the way the developers intended, refusing to let their new friend out of their sight. Nothing was changed about the puzzles or the way the box worked to make this change happen. It was all dialogue and graphic design. And there’s lots of ways story, music, and imagery can change the way players interact with a game. Would spooky music make them slow down and be cautious? How do they treat enemies with different character designs? Sometimes aesthetic leads to dynamic and not the other way around. And if you’re using this MDA model, your music, artwork, and narrative all count as “mechanics” too.
I saw a study once whose conclusion was that the speed of music in a game can influence the speed at which players play. Okay, it wasn't a "study" per se, it was ... my 7th grade science fair project. But maybe I should try to replicate it on a larger scale!
Totally agree! I couldn't stop thinking about this while watching the video, I'm glad I found this comment cause it worded what I was thinking perfectly.
Sometimes, clear signals also change behavior. A player is more likely to jump on a Goomba from Mario than a Tiktik from Hollow Knight, because one of them is round and soft and the other is spikey and boney. A player would rush to let go of a red glowing item way more than a purple glowing item. A player would never touch bubbling liquid, but they would try to swim if it was clear blue. These examples aren't the exact same, but a problem I have with some video games is that sometimes I can't figure out what the mechanic is, and a better dynamic would easily fix that
this actually kind of changed my view on game making. Thinking deeper into what i want my players to feel, and then designing mechanics to compliment those feelings
I would argue that Video game's core distinction as an art form is this process. The games that get praised as "art" usually have the story, art direction and various mechanics all working towards one key emotion in a unique way.
This is one of the reasons I prefer to work on indie games as opposed to working for a AAA studio. It gets harder and harder to keep everything working together to create that core player experience the more people that get involved. Obviously some teams are much better at this than others.
Both movies and videogames in this sense are trying to make their audience feel something and thus both are art forms. After all, what is Art but creating emotion?
I love the way pokemon mystery dungeon red rescue team does saving. You can only save at the end of a dungeon crawl, so you spend your time in each dungeon juggling resources, deciding whether or not to engage in combat, and even weighing the risk and reward of leaving with the 'mon you just rescued, or staying in the dungeon to complete more missions and collect more resources. But, since it's a Gameboy game, and you might need to turn it off at any time, it has a quicksave feature. You could save at any point, get booted back to the menu, and when you opened the file again, the quicksave would be deleted. So, you can't save scum, but you aren't forced to keep playing through a dungeon if you have something else you need to do. If I ever make a game long enough to need saves, I'll heavily consider stealing that one.
I actually found hi-fi rush to be genius as someone who has no rhythm, everything ends up on rhythm if you like it or not if you want to play it like a normal action game, and even the running between areas rewards you for learning the beat since dashes can be linked. By end you feel like a rock star.
agreed, and I think that Tango doesn't punish you for being off-beat, rather you just become stronger for being on beat. so it becomes something you can learn and improve on just like performing combos
yeah, you can even just ignore the music and use visual cues to attack on beat. when I was playing, I'd have difficulty getting the first hit in a combo on beat, but since they always hit on beat, you just need to hit the button again right when your last attack connects.
The way Matt Colville puts it: Identify the fantasy -> find the behaviors that reinforce that fantasy -> design mechanics that encourage those behaviors.
Feels awesome seeing someone mention Colville, I thought of him too during the video but haven’t seen anyone else mentioning him under videos about video game design yet.
I am SO happy that you address visual aesthetics in this video as part of MDA. A big issue I have with MDA is that it ignores any part of game making that isn't mechanics to its great detriment - I've worked with folks who have internalized this so much that they actually believe art or audio have no impact on your experience in a game. Your exploration adds some much-needed additions. I may start assigning your video for my undergrad students instead of the paper itself. Thank you thank you!
The save example is a fun one because practical the source of your anxiety - losing progress - and the intended focus of that anxiety - the Alien - are separate. But your brain doesn’t notice! It absolutely attributes all that fear to the monster. I didn’t understand this about horror game saving until I’d been dealing with an anxiety disorder for several years and learning how those emotions work.
Awesome stuff, Mark. We've previously used MDA (and some other frameworks) on our Games Design course for a Studies module, but I'll admit, I've never really considered MDA as a tool for designing new games. I reckon this will come in handy for my future modules. Thank you so much!
This is a better explanation of MDA than anything I heard majoring in game design. Great work! (By the way, Mechanics->Actions->Feelings is a much better way of remembering the MDA framework than Mechanics->Dynamics->Aesthetics. The latter words are there so the writers can sound important, not so game designers can actually remember and use their helpful ideas.)
And you should promptly forget it, because it's an _awful_ framework that will practically guarantee that you don't understand anything meaningful about game design.
Just the other day I was thinking about an amazing example of MDA (though I didn't know about that framework at the time) that shows in in the game Lobotomy Corporation. It's a management game but it has a "boss fight" with one of the main character, Malkuth, who's depicted as a slightly disorganised young woman always with her notepad in hand. Mechanically she randomises all work done every so often, choosing insight might prompt attachment work for example, dynamically this makes the player test on safer work which type is which and write down the result in real life before committing to more dangerous work, and aesthetically this makes you feel a little overwhelmed and busy, and when you realise that you're acting just like Malkuth, writing everything down in a notepad to make sure you don't mess up, it makes you feel sympathetic.
I'm a recent fan and just wanted to say your content is fantastically useful. Not just for video game design, but ttrgp and board game design too. It's been quite insightful for me to sift through your videos.
I think this is the first time i truly understand the MDA framework. Before i always associated "Aesthethics" with how the game visually expresses the idea, so thank you for setting that straight for me! Also, hope to meet you at GDC! Im also attending
I love that trickle down effect regarding how the foundational elements directly influence that player emotional experience. It’s quite beautiful to remember that so much methodology exists within the creation of a video game like any other artistic medium.
Considering the impact of art direction and narrative on the player experience, I think it would make sense to rename "mechanics" in MDA to simply "elements". As in, elements exist in the game (such as a specific song that plays during combat), such that each element reinforces a dynamic (like attacking relentlessly), which in turn reinforces an aesthetic (feeling powerful). Another example: one element in strategy games is having a top-down game camera, which encourages the player to stay aware of all enemy positions, and this reinforces the feeling of being in control (like a general commanding troops).
I'm an Data Analyst, and tbh this video help me as much as my working experience. I can imagine how MDA can be used in our product to gain more profit or customer recognition or how MDA be used in the Analysis process! Also, 4 months ago, your video on 'How Game Designers Solved These 11 Problems' help me to solve problems given by BU in very unique ways. Truly appreciate. Can't believe all the book i 've read about DA and all i needed was some gaming videos
I work in conservation, and GMTK's principles have put me leaps and bounds above my peers in terms of creative problem solving! I've recommended that 11 Problems video to so many people, regardless of their profession, bc of how beautifully it can be applied to any situation
Another great video. :) This is why it's good to listen to players of various videogames. You'll start to notice what most players do in given situations, such as (I've noticed, at least) RPG players being very thorough before advancing in a game, checking every inch of each dungeon/town.
From the title, I was not expecting this to be an introduction to the core of artistic expression in interactive media! Like, this "Feelings arise from mechanical interactions" is core to expression in games the same way that Cinematography is to movies. (Well, I guess Cinematography tries to include every element of a movie, and MDA just talks about the interactions components, but... you know what I mean?) When I was a game design student in 2010 and the "Are games art" debate was still hot, I remember having fantasies of writing a book about this subject. I remember at one point Jonathan Blow essentially called this "Dynamical Meaning". He was approaching it less from a less analytical standpoint. At the time, I really wish I'd known about this MDA paper. It would have helped clarify my arguments about the subject with my fellow students. Also, Mark, I think you're well poised to put together video game's version of "Understanding Comics." I guess, in a way, that's sort of what this series is.
I've been watching your videos for upwards of 2 years, but today was the first time I actually got inspired enough to think of a really nice mechanic to base a game off. I'll be checking out the Unity tutorials again and see if I'll be able to pull this off! Good stuff as always
Ah. This brings back memories from the game design programme I attended at university. Nice to see such a clear and concise explanation of the framework.
Oh dear god I'm just now realizing Alien: Isolation is 10 years old this year... Existential crisis aside, I really do adore the save mechanic in Isolation. It both is the most stress-inducing terrifying 3 seconds while you wait for it to finish, and it fits the 70's retro futurism of the Alien franchise, and I adore it for that.
And they are additionally influencing the work ethics for designers like me :D Often I notice that other designers follow the same guidelines when making a game.
It's always fun to look at a specific mechanic and ask "why?" Like why in Prey (2016) can you recycle any object into crafting materials or why does Disco Elysium offer vague "thought" unlocks or why is Project Zomboid in an isometric view? Or in your example, why are you forced to stand around to save while at the mercy of potentially getting slaughtered in Alien: Isolation? Really puts you in the devs' creative shoes
I'm learning Psychology right now, and your videos has been helping me understanding just how much consideration went into designing game for the player's mentality. Keep up the great work!
This right here. I always am annoyed by people who think variable tweaks can't absolutely change how a game feels. A lot of people I've spoken to seem to believe that 'changing numbers around' won't affect how the game makes them feel or how fun the game is. And this MDA concept helps puts my feelings into words
In TTRPG there is an old theory that split what TTRPG can try and make you feel in 3 : Gamism (the most number-goblin aspect, having a +1 weapon...) Narrativism (the story produced is cool or interesting) Simulationism (the world is coherent with one's expectation) Examples : Gamism : Dungeon and Dragon let you do better or worst characters, like a Ranger being often mocked for being less able than a Warrior with a bow, and some archetypes being stronger/weaker than others. Narrativism : Dungeon World is about the Lord of the Ring Movies-esque aspects of the game, like surfing on a shield and shooting 3 orcs in the head in a single sequence. Simulationism : Avatar Legends, the Avatar : The Last Airbender and Legends of Korra game, is meant to make you feel like a character worthy of this series. There's a mecanic where you are split between two ideals or ways of lifes, like Zuko is split between his honor/father and his morale/uncle to reflect that. Most game are not full on one aspect and none of the other. The idea was just to have a framework to talk about the feelings games would produce, notably to find players with the same interest. Hard to do a coherent story with deep characters when there's a loot goblin ready to kill your favorite NPC for a +1.42% of damage per round, right ? (not to say being a loot goblin is bad, it's just an example on why G N and S players tend to not mix the best) I'd be glad to see more framework to talk about feeling like this. Music kinda does that, but it becomes hard to follow when you add too many subgenra into the mix.
Analyzing and stealing ideas from other games is such a valuable part of development. But I think it's easy to accidently just "play" a game, instead of analyze it, and not really get much out of it besides "This game I like has [feature], so mine should have [feature]". Which could lead a designer to start building the foundation of their game without actually understanding what it is that they're trying to build to (Which I have done many times). Using something like MDA as a tool for greater analysis is very helpful in that way. Though it sounds like MDA itself may be an over-simplification of the analysis process, and designers may want to consider more than just the relationship between mechanics, action, and feeling. I'd say that the relationship between a mechanic, it's visuals and sounds, for example, is incredibly important in determining how the player acts and feels. But I digress. I'm really glad you brought this topic up. I've been analyzing games for quite awhile, but It has been a slow process just figuring out what "analyze" should mean in the game dev context.
This is such an invaluable analysis and exploration of what makes games feel so alive-- not that that's different from any of your other content :) This one really stuck out to me and helped me look at the games I play and why I enjoy them specifically.
I'm never been so happy and jumpy seeing mark mentioning Pizza Tower since personally, I love the game design and how the game develop is actually being use ins MDA.
I can't believe they didn't teach us this at my career. Now I see why my classmates struggle so much with game design. I had been applying this principle the whole time but I struggled to put it into words, this video says it so much more clearly. This is also a BIG reason why ubisoft games feel so copy pasted as of late. They treat their mechanics like a checklist instead of stopping and thinking if they will actually benefit the experience.
what a great video, man. i've been gaming my entire life so a lot of time, i can get lost in the "theory" of it all, and so much of my mind runs to the storyline and the writing portion of it as opposed to the decision making in its core creation. This video (and this channel as a whole) has done a great deal in terms of opening my mind up in ways that lets me think behind the scenes a little bit, and allows me to listen for the gears a little bit. I appreciate that you broke down the MDA approach as well. This is such great insight!
One important thing to keep in mind is that the MDA analysis could vary between individuals, in my experience BOTW weapon breaking system made me avoid battles completely (except for the completely neccesary) and thus gave me the feeling that my character didn't care much for the world around him.
Yeah he did mention it with an example like a timer might excite people while others(my case) stress them the fuck out. I've missed out on so many games cuz the had a timer.
@@Anima-bribe yeah I just wanted to give an alternative reading of the system. Btw I have the same problem but with turn-based RPG combat. I haven't finish a lot of good games just because that kind of combat makes me feel so defenseless and powerless almost all of the time I try it out.
@@Anima-bribe Did we really miss out on them though? We like to wander and explore games without feeling rushed. We didn't necessarily MISS any games, we simply dodged a bullet to our wallet. 🥰 I know what you mean though...there have been more than a few games that would have been PERFECT, but for that little timer which ends the game before i want it to end, ya know?
Something about this video felt familiar. Then at the end it was mentioned "this was originally given as a lecture at universities in... Breda..." and I was like oh! That's why! Still following the channel years after graduation.
"But: it's essential to understand why those mechanics work in one game, before copying and pasting them into yours. How do you do that? Well, I'm Mark Brown, and this is Game Maker's Toolkit." Me: Ok first step, become Mark Brown. Second step, find the Game Maker's Toolkit. Jokes aside, fantastic video as always.
Oh dear! I was at GDC and didn't know to look for you! I'm just watching this video now. We were taught MDA at the game design workshop at GDC. They made us practice by designing table top games with paper and then having playtesters play our game and describe how it made them feel.
euh, wow, the quality of the research work you performed Mark is astonishing. I think I've never seen this many games showcased in one of you videos (I've seen them alll!). Brilliant work, as always. Thanks you and bravo !
Like the Alien example, one game that really enforced a sense of tension with the save points was LISA: The Painful. There's a hard mode that makes save points single-use so it really creates a feel of having to pushing forward in your adventure and not look back. You can't backtrack and resave before difficult parts, and combined with permanent party member death it felt reall thrilling!
You can see the extreme of some of these decisions in a game like Pathologic 2. There are a lot of important NPCs relying on the main character to survive. Balancing their well being with your own is difficult. But you have some control - but only... Some. Every day is a dice roll, with a 1/6 chance that - even with the best treatment and care - someone will get sick, and their death is often inevitable. You have nowhere near enough resources to treat them all, and sometimes your best efforts result in someone dying anyway. That's your lot - the game is not about overcoming the threat, it's largely about feeling lost and helpless and that never truly changes. Also, guns suck, their ammo is valuable, and reloading takes an absolute eternity. You're a doctor, not a soldier - but people will try to mug your ass. That's an anxiety inducing game right there.
I remember when I was making this game about magic, at first I added a mana bar for all your spells because, well, that’s just how magic works. As I messed around with it, though, I realized the mana bar encouraged players to spam the same spell over and over again, and as I thought about it, I realized players would be more likely to use a variety of spells if they could cast them freely, and that’d make them feel more like a cool mage to boot! That did still leave me with some other problems to work out, but it was a huge step towards capturing that feeling of being an awesome mage.
Ultima Pagan had the player to mix the spells ahead of time, so the kind of spell was limited by the ingredients as well as the preparation. I can't remember whether the game did do much with that idea, as it otherwise felt a bit flawed. But I liked the idea of choosing preferred tactics on the one hand but also having to change them because of missing resources. With a limited inventory and specific resources in each area, this could be a good way of forcing people to try out things.
Wanna give a thumbs up on that pronunciation of Skellefteå. Prosodically correct, nailed the å, and went with an h sound for the shows effort. (sk in front of soft vowels - e, i, y, ä, ö - becomes a sound in Swedish that's best described as the hiss of an angry cat and can be hard to even comprehend if you're not a native speaker. An h sound is not far off and is perfectly passable to use until you figure it out.)
This is quite possibly the most useful GMTK video I've watched. I always struggle with which ideas to keep and which to disregard. This MDA framework was just what I needed.
Very nice video! I remember people talking about this subject before, and all of them (including the paper), falls in the trap of trying to encapsulate the aesthetics in just a small set of categories. This video avoid that pitfall and also provides clear examples of the aesthetics used by different games.
It must be such an honour to give lectures to students. Congrats! I'm glad I learnt about the Mechanic/Dynamic/Aesthetic, it's an awesome thing to keep in the back of your mind
I have an entire playlist of your videos, for study cases and game balancing hoping to make my dream game one day lol. Something i would LOVE to see is a video about stamina systems for open world games or something of the sorts. I have what i think is an interesting stamina system. Sort of complicated but lowkey.
Another banger of a video. It's impressive how well you put into words some of the things that cross my mind when playing games, and you always come up with the answer before I could even ask the question. Great stuff, Mark!
I rate this video as a must watch! I just like everyone else, want to create games some day, and this video is the one I will make sure to re-watch, you really did an amazing job presenting it and getting more in depth than just "make the player feel emotion". It would be great to have more game dev fundamentals or theory like this video. I also love the series about your game, which makes it a great theory-practice combination.
I would like to have you in my university, unfortunately I'm in Argentina....however, every video you make is a dream come true for us teachers. I can't thank you enough Mark!!
I'm looking forward to using this approach! My process right now feels like I am forcing things to work by sticking stuff together with stickytape & hope.
This video is both accurate and great. I would however point out a caveat: following this advice will get you a better game, but some choices will lead to a game having less universality. Which is completely fine, but you need to find a publisher that respect this, or you'll end up getting pushback and may have to compromise your vision.
This was another brilliant essay and I’ll definitely be thinking about this approach going forward. I’m also enjoying how many of these videos can be applied to tabletop roleplaying games. Have you ever considered looking at that design? That’s a lot of interesting ways video game design and tabletop RPG design intersect and diverge.
I know what you mean about how the same mechanic hits people differently. Like in Shadow of Mordor a lot of people were loving the system where boss orcs would show up with random backgrounds and persist between encounters to create unique narratives. I was trying to get used to how the game worked though, so when I would mess up and get spotted, or just when I was trying to fight, those bosses would suddenly show up and then beeline for me, causing my experience to be ruined and for me to eventually drop the game because of the frustration of being unable to get anything done.
Great video as always! It's really interesting to think about designing a game for feeling instead of constant fun. I think I've got some things to think about when it comes to my own games.
Thanks for the video Mark, it's always lovely to hear gameplay design by other developers. Hmm... MDA, I believe Extra Credits have mentioned that also in one of their videos.
I actually gave lecture of the same name last summer, though the contents were vastly different. Mine I read to CS students to try to convince them that they shouldn't be afraid of design and that as beginners it's okay to "steal" design elements as long as they fit in your vision. I also prompted them to look for inspiration from their technical limitations (like fog in Silent Hill and enemy AI in Space Invaders) and generally treat design as a technical problem that requires solution just as a programming problem does. That being said, I really enjoyed your video and would've certainly linked it to my students if it was around back then. You delved much more into hidden problems of "steal best practices" approach than I've considered.
I'm a game designer and it is easy to steal the best parts of other games, but the trick is combining them so they work. And to fill in the gaps, which often requires inventing entirely new things. And that's when it gets really tricky. Alien Isolation has an achievement for winning without dying. That's what really made me try to play it without dying, but then I died near the end once and it really took me out of it. MDA is a decent basic framework, but I think it is a bit limiting and I usually don't focus on it much when teaching game design.
@@Orange_Swirl : It deals too much with aesthetics and subjective experiences than focusing on the core of Mechanisms themselves. Just like Schell's The Art of Game Design / Book of Lenses, it falls apart when looking at more games outside of the traditional AAA stuff. When analyzing things like abstract strategy board games and modern designer board games to ARG, Mega games, hybrid tabletop, and other non-traditional things it deals too much with non-concrete topics to feel useful to me. The feel and looks and aesthetics are important, but it put it on the same field as others really does a disservice to them. I much prefer design topics on game mechanisms and the analysis behind them. But I'm also more of a board game player who likes dissecting games into quanta. Which largely removes much of the MDA framework. The Ludology podcast talked a lot about this stuff in the past. There are other good resources out there too but I tend to focus on board game design as I have seen video game design feel so stagnant over the years in comparison.
This is very relevant to me, as recently I was wondering about bloodbornes health mechanics. They added in a "Rally" mechanic, where you can regain your lost health if you stay aggressive and retaliate immediately- but if you miss your window or play too defensively you're punished by having to use a blood vial. I say "punished" because if you use too many and run out, you will have to go actively collect them from early enemies before you can make further progress in the game. It made me wonder why blood vials were implemented this way, instead of how estus flasks refresh themselves at the bonfire with no collection necessary. It felt very disempowering to be punished for underperforming further than just dying and having to do the section/boss again.
That example about Alien Isolation shows what so many devs forget about: It's not about what features you have; it's about how and why you use them. You so often see some game mechanic become popular and thrown into any game even remotely capable of including it, with no regard for how it fits and what it does to the gameplay. For instance, most games with a cover mechanic that use it well are not FPS games, but tactical games (Shadowrun Returns trilogy, Wasteland 2 + 3, XCOM, etc.), and maybe some odder titles like Time Crisis. It's something that slows down the action, which is often bad in FPS games, but doesn't affect the pacing nearly as much in tactical games. Instead, it adds a layer of consideration, which is what you want in a thinking game.
Really informative video! Its always really interesting to see how the quality of a game experience shoots up with a design that prioritizes feeding its mechanics towards a core vision and engagement type, and how easily it is to lose that when the design team is not firm about it.
Found your channel sometime last month, and I think what you're doing is absolutely awesome. I subbed halfway through your game jam videos, and I'm steadily working through the rest of the channel's videos. In case you happen to read this or take video suggestions, I'd be interested in some of the legality of game developing pertaining to intellectual and creative property, copyrighting, and the do's and don'ts of "stealing" ideas or mechanics like a game designer and developer. I often concern myself with daydreams of someday being sued for something I put in my game, and I'd be really curious how it "actually works".
4:58 oh there's this one kind of obscure game, its in a set of games, called journeys VR, there's this one title called "Jest to impress" and that makes you feel like a comedic genius, who defies death. its mechanically simple and easy to understand, what you do at any given point should be fairly obvious, but its the result of those actions that makes it fun. I cant help but feel there's a lot to learn in that short experience.
Great video! I'd really like to see this expanded. One thing is to analyze and evaluate games, and set a vision as anchor point for your own development; another thing is to successfully communicate this on a development team through strong vision statement, example prototypes, or clear project goals, among others. I don't think it's possible to do a single video essay, but it might be interesting to do an interview. For example, how do game designers get from an initial idea/prototype to a vertical slice involving a team? What are their tools and preferences for enabling communication?
Not a dev, I just watch video game essays. I remember MDA from the OG Extra Credits days. I think about it a lot while playing. It's a really useful tool for understanding a game.
Thinking about Zombi U's real-time inventory system while listening to this video's through line about Alien Isolation. I don't think the former's design choice could exist as impactfully without a second screen. But it was really smart.
If this mentioned the Elemental Tetrad to consider those non-mechanical elements and the game loop, this would have been a pretty all encompassing summative review of the first half of my game design course! Great stuff as always, excitedly adding this to my readings catalogue for future years.
I love video games and have loved watching your channel for. 4? Years now. I work as a game tester but we focus on bug finding. It is important but I hope to experience moulding a game soneday.
using Tomb Raider 2013 as an example of 'weak and powerless to later being strong and capable' might be a bit abstracted; where the observer that was playing the game that did happen, and for those that were watching the movie portrayed by the cinematics also got that feeling, but for those that were paying attention to both were having a ping pong effect: where she is distressed, and injured gets an ability and then strong in the gameplay because of it, but then right before she gets the next ability it is almost as if all of the emotional progress took steps backwards just to be pushed forward. as a full experience it just felt like "we just killed 5 guys with a bow, now you are feeling distraught because you shot 1 guy.... and now we are going to be shooting 30 more guys"
What a spicy title! Who hasn't wasted a bunch of energy thinking about how amazing it would be to combine parts from other experiences we already enjoyed. True unique ideas are hard to come by and I feel most innovation comes from derivative experimentation.
Gamedesigner here, I usually just steal from the office kitchen actually
💀
Programmer here, I do the same.
Sounds yummy to me 😋
LOL
I steal from the thesaurus
Always a pleasure to watch your videos! You've got a really good video structure: Present a concrete example of a problem, abstract it and explain a general solution, then come back to your original example to show the solution in action. It's a great way to teach and I don't get tired of it.
Thanks for that!
Yeah it's a good approach
Agreed. These videos are well-paced and well-structured with wells of information.
its literally a well-structured essay.
Or should I say video essay~
sounds like the way games teach mechanics too
I love these “psychology of games” type videos. This is such an easy framework to think about how players interact with games.
And that's really what games are about. People often get too hung up in the technical details, but games are there for our enjoyment. Enjoyment is an emotion, so that's what you need to target, regardless of which form of enjoyment you're targeting.
You should watch Daryl Talks Games. He has a lot of videos about games and psychology.
@@F2t0ny I've watched a few of those. Sometimes I agree, sometimes really not. And a bit hit-or-miss when it comes to topics, but certainly worth a shot if something seems interesting.
Here in Finland our game dev teachers used the word 'parastaa', a portmanteau of our words for steal and make better.
You have a game dev teachers?
@@hododod246 Why wouldn't they?
@@Sinistar123 cus finland isnt real
Yeah when people complain about stealing, it's never that something was improved, always that you copied something but made it worse.
@Hoovy Simulator 2 liar. You're finished.
Great video, very well structured and presented. Honoured to be the main example here. The team worked so hard on that game and I am glad to see that it is still referenced today. Keep up the amazing work. Educational and inspiring.
Thanks Gary, means a lot!
Amazing to see you here! Only right with how much effort and passion yall poured into it! If anything, it isn't referenced enough, in my very biased opinion ofc heh.
❤
Small quibble with something: you say that things like story, music, and graphic design can all create aesthetic experiences in the player, “just without the dynamics bit.” The thing is, those things can all ABSOLUTELY influence and alter player behaviour, sometimes radically.
The first thing that comes to mind is Portal. They had a level full of box puzzles that required you to use a crate to block lasers and weigh down buttons. But, play testers kept forgetting the crate, putting it down, leaving it behind, and having to backtrack to retrieve it when they realized they needed it again.
So what did the devs do? They put a heart on the crate, renamed it, and gave Glados new narration. The Weighted Companion Cube was born.
And now players were interacting with the box the way the developers intended, refusing to let their new friend out of their sight. Nothing was changed about the puzzles or the way the box worked to make this change happen. It was all dialogue and graphic design.
And there’s lots of ways story, music, and imagery can change the way players interact with a game. Would spooky music make them slow down and be cautious? How do they treat enemies with different character designs? Sometimes aesthetic leads to dynamic and not the other way around. And if you’re using this MDA model, your music, artwork, and narrative all count as “mechanics” too.
I saw a study once whose conclusion was that the speed of music in a game can influence the speed at which players play.
Okay, it wasn't a "study" per se, it was ... my 7th grade science fair project. But maybe I should try to replicate it on a larger scale!
Fully agree. He also contradicts his own statement later in the video at 8:18.
This sounds similar to how some Neural Networks have "differentiable pipelines" which can be used to produce inputs from outputs. Awesome!
Totally agree! I couldn't stop thinking about this while watching the video, I'm glad I found this comment cause it worded what I was thinking perfectly.
Sometimes, clear signals also change behavior. A player is more likely to jump on a Goomba from Mario than a Tiktik from Hollow Knight, because one of them is round and soft and the other is spikey and boney. A player would rush to let go of a red glowing item way more than a purple glowing item. A player would never touch bubbling liquid, but they would try to swim if it was clear blue.
These examples aren't the exact same, but a problem I have with some video games is that sometimes I can't figure out what the mechanic is, and a better dynamic would easily fix that
Mark's voice always makes me happy. The exciting game dev stuff is just a bonus.
can't agree more 🤷
@Bob H Fair enough I suppose 😂
He's pretty cute too, when he decides to show his face
@Bob H it's the vocal fry that gets me, its an affectation, but I put up with it as like the vids too.
Rewatch his stuff to lull me to sleep 👌
this actually kind of changed my view on game making. Thinking deeper into what i want my players to feel, and then designing mechanics to compliment those feelings
I would argue that Video game's core distinction as an art form is this process. The games that get praised as "art" usually have the story, art direction and various mechanics all working towards one key emotion in a unique way.
This is one of the reasons I prefer to work on indie games as opposed to working for a AAA studio. It gets harder and harder to keep everything working together to create that core player experience the more people that get involved.
Obviously some teams are much better at this than others.
Both movies and videogames in this sense are trying to make their audience feel something and thus both are art forms. After all, what is Art but creating emotion?
I love the way pokemon mystery dungeon red rescue team does saving.
You can only save at the end of a dungeon crawl, so you spend your time in each dungeon juggling resources, deciding whether or not to engage in combat, and even weighing the risk and reward of leaving with the 'mon you just rescued, or staying in the dungeon to complete more missions and collect more resources.
But, since it's a Gameboy game, and you might need to turn it off at any time, it has a quicksave feature. You could save at any point, get booted back to the menu, and when you opened the file again, the quicksave would be deleted.
So, you can't save scum, but you aren't forced to keep playing through a dungeon if you have something else you need to do. If I ever make a game long enough to need saves, I'll heavily consider stealing that one.
I actually found hi-fi rush to be genius as someone who has no rhythm, everything ends up on rhythm if you like it or not if you want to play it like a normal action game, and even the running between areas rewards you for learning the beat since dashes can be linked. By end you feel like a rock star.
agreed, and I think that Tango doesn't punish you for being off-beat, rather you just become stronger for being on beat. so it becomes something you can learn and improve on just like performing combos
yeah, you can even just ignore the music and use visual cues to attack on beat. when I was playing, I'd have difficulty getting the first hit in a combo on beat, but since they always hit on beat, you just need to hit the button again right when your last attack connects.
though that does serve to highlight how subjective the aesthetic part is
I struggled with Space Channel 5
The way Matt Colville puts it: Identify the fantasy -> find the behaviors that reinforce that fantasy -> design mechanics that encourage those behaviors.
Feels awesome seeing someone mention Colville, I thought of him too during the video but haven’t seen anyone else mentioning him under videos about video game design yet.
I am SO happy that you address visual aesthetics in this video as part of MDA. A big issue I have with MDA is that it ignores any part of game making that isn't mechanics to its great detriment - I've worked with folks who have internalized this so much that they actually believe art or audio have no impact on your experience in a game. Your exploration adds some much-needed additions. I may start assigning your video for my undergrad students instead of the paper itself. Thank you thank you!
The save example is a fun one because practical the source of your anxiety - losing progress - and the intended focus of that anxiety - the Alien - are separate. But your brain doesn’t notice! It absolutely attributes all that fear to the monster. I didn’t understand this about horror game saving until I’d been dealing with an anxiety disorder for several years and learning how those emotions work.
Awesome stuff, Mark. We've previously used MDA (and some other frameworks) on our Games Design course for a Studies module, but I'll admit, I've never really considered MDA as a tool for designing new games. I reckon this will come in handy for my future modules. Thank you so much!
This is a better explanation of MDA than anything I heard majoring in game design. Great work!
(By the way, Mechanics->Actions->Feelings is a much better way of remembering the MDA framework than Mechanics->Dynamics->Aesthetics. The latter words are there so the writers can sound important, not so game designers can actually remember and use their helpful ideas.)
And you should promptly forget it, because it's an _awful_ framework that will practically guarantee that you don't understand anything meaningful about game design.
@@alondite215 So how do we actually understand anything meaningful about game design?
@@Cyliandre441 By understanding that Aesthetics = Feelings????
@@alondite215 uhh...how? I've used it just fine and it is a framework that is literally used by big budget professionals.
@@Cyliandre441 Well, knowing correct and useful definitions for concepts like "mechanic" and "dynamic" is a good start.
Vision is so powerful. In interviews with famous creatives, a strong vision that is followed through makes their work really special.
Just the other day I was thinking about an amazing example of MDA (though I didn't know about that framework at the time) that shows in in the game Lobotomy Corporation. It's a management game but it has a "boss fight" with one of the main character, Malkuth, who's depicted as a slightly disorganised young woman always with her notepad in hand. Mechanically she randomises all work done every so often, choosing insight might prompt attachment work for example, dynamically this makes the player test on safer work which type is which and write down the result in real life before committing to more dangerous work, and aesthetically this makes you feel a little overwhelmed and busy, and when you realise that you're acting just like Malkuth, writing everything down in a notepad to make sure you don't mess up, it makes you feel sympathetic.
I'm a recent fan and just wanted to say your content is fantastically useful. Not just for video game design, but ttrgp and board game design too. It's been quite insightful for me to sift through your videos.
I think this is the first time i truly understand the MDA framework. Before i always associated "Aesthethics" with how the game visually expresses the idea, so thank you for setting that straight for me!
Also, hope to meet you at GDC! Im also attending
I love that trickle down effect regarding how the foundational elements directly influence that player emotional experience. It’s quite beautiful to remember that so much methodology exists within the creation of a video game like any other artistic medium.
Considering the impact of art direction and narrative on the player experience, I think it would make sense to rename "mechanics" in MDA to simply "elements". As in, elements exist in the game (such as a specific song that plays during combat), such that each element reinforces a dynamic (like attacking relentlessly), which in turn reinforces an aesthetic (feeling powerful).
Another example: one element in strategy games is having a top-down game camera, which encourages the player to stay aware of all enemy positions, and this reinforces the feeling of being in control (like a general commanding troops).
I'm an Data Analyst, and tbh this video help me as much as my working experience. I can imagine how MDA can be used in our product to gain more profit or customer recognition or how MDA be used in the Analysis process! Also, 4 months ago, your video on 'How Game Designers Solved These 11 Problems' help me to solve problems given by BU in very unique ways. Truly appreciate. Can't believe all the book i 've read about DA and all i needed was some gaming videos
I work in conservation, and GMTK's principles have put me leaps and bounds above my peers in terms of creative problem solving! I've recommended that 11 Problems video to so many people, regardless of their profession, bc of how beautifully it can be applied to any situation
Another great video. :)
This is why it's good to listen to players of various videogames. You'll start to notice what most players do in given situations, such as (I've noticed, at least) RPG players being very thorough before advancing in a game, checking every inch of each dungeon/town.
From the title, I was not expecting this to be an introduction to the core of artistic expression in interactive media! Like, this "Feelings arise from mechanical interactions" is core to expression in games the same way that Cinematography is to movies. (Well, I guess Cinematography tries to include every element of a movie, and MDA just talks about the interactions components, but... you know what I mean?)
When I was a game design student in 2010 and the "Are games art" debate was still hot, I remember having fantasies of writing a book about this subject. I remember at one point Jonathan Blow essentially called this "Dynamical Meaning". He was approaching it less from a less analytical standpoint. At the time, I really wish I'd known about this MDA paper. It would have helped clarify my arguments about the subject with my fellow students.
Also, Mark, I think you're well poised to put together video game's version of "Understanding Comics." I guess, in a way, that's sort of what this series is.
I am very grateful to have been able to be at your lecture in Boden about this subject. =D
Wow that was really cool! 👍
I've been watching your videos for upwards of 2 years, but today was the first time I actually got inspired enough to think of a really nice mechanic to base a game off. I'll be checking out the Unity tutorials again and see if I'll be able to pull this off! Good stuff as always
The title didn't make it seem like it, but this I one of the most complete videos i've seen from you! Really learned a lot
Ah. This brings back memories from the game design programme I attended at university. Nice to see such a clear and concise explanation of the framework.
Oh dear god I'm just now realizing Alien: Isolation is 10 years old this year...
Existential crisis aside, I really do adore the save mechanic in Isolation. It both is the most stress-inducing terrifying 3 seconds while you wait for it to finish, and it fits the 70's retro futurism of the Alien franchise, and I adore it for that.
I love how mark does tutorials right, the're fun to watch and still very educational
And they are additionally influencing the work ethics for designers like me :D Often I notice that other designers follow the same guidelines when making a game.
This is super well-organized. I could understand everything in this video even I'm totally new to the game development. Thanks.
First time I experienced that feeling of longing for a save point was Turok 2 on N64... A study in creating atmosphere.
It's always fun to look at a specific mechanic and ask "why?" Like why in Prey (2016) can you recycle any object into crafting materials or why does Disco Elysium offer vague "thought" unlocks or why is Project Zomboid in an isometric view? Or in your example, why are you forced to stand around to save while at the mercy of potentially getting slaughtered in Alien: Isolation? Really puts you in the devs' creative shoes
I'm learning Psychology right now, and your videos has been helping me understanding just how much consideration went into designing game for the player's mentality.
Keep up the great work!
This right here.
I always am annoyed by people who think variable tweaks can't absolutely change how a game feels.
A lot of people I've spoken to seem to believe that 'changing numbers around' won't affect how the game makes them feel or how fun the game is. And this MDA concept helps puts my feelings into words
In TTRPG there is an old theory that split what TTRPG can try and make you feel in 3 :
Gamism (the most number-goblin aspect, having a +1 weapon...)
Narrativism (the story produced is cool or interesting)
Simulationism (the world is coherent with one's expectation)
Examples :
Gamism : Dungeon and Dragon let you do better or worst characters, like a Ranger being often mocked for being less able than a Warrior with a bow, and some archetypes being stronger/weaker than others.
Narrativism : Dungeon World is about the Lord of the Ring Movies-esque aspects of the game, like surfing on a shield and shooting 3 orcs in the head in a single sequence.
Simulationism : Avatar Legends, the Avatar : The Last Airbender and Legends of Korra game, is meant to make you feel like a character worthy of this series. There's a mecanic where you are split between two ideals or ways of lifes, like Zuko is split between his honor/father and his morale/uncle to reflect that.
Most game are not full on one aspect and none of the other. The idea was just to have a framework to talk about the feelings games would produce, notably to find players with the same interest. Hard to do a coherent story with deep characters when there's a loot goblin ready to kill your favorite NPC for a +1.42% of damage per round, right ? (not to say being a loot goblin is bad, it's just an example on why G N and S players tend to not mix the best)
I'd be glad to see more framework to talk about feeling like this. Music kinda does that, but it becomes hard to follow when you add too many subgenra into the mix.
Analyzing and stealing ideas from other games is such a valuable part of development. But I think it's easy to accidently just "play" a game, instead of analyze it, and not really get much out of it besides "This game I like has [feature], so mine should have [feature]". Which could lead a designer to start building the foundation of their game without actually understanding what it is that they're trying to build to (Which I have done many times).
Using something like MDA as a tool for greater analysis is very helpful in that way. Though it sounds like MDA itself may be an over-simplification of the analysis process, and designers may want to consider more than just the relationship between mechanics, action, and feeling. I'd say that the relationship between a mechanic, it's visuals and sounds, for example, is incredibly important in determining how the player acts and feels. But I digress.
I'm really glad you brought this topic up. I've been analyzing games for quite awhile, but It has been a slow process just figuring out what "analyze" should mean in the game dev context.
This is such an invaluable analysis and exploration of what makes games feel so alive-- not that that's different from any of your other content :) This one really stuck out to me and helped me look at the games I play and why I enjoy them specifically.
I'm never been so happy and jumpy seeing mark mentioning Pizza Tower since personally, I love the game design and how the game develop is actually being use ins MDA.
pizza tower really makes you feel like a paranoid italian juggernaut
thx for explaining game design: MDA in easy understanding way.
I can't believe they didn't teach us this at my career. Now I see why my classmates struggle so much with game design. I had been applying this principle the whole time but I struggled to put it into words, this video says it so much more clearly.
This is also a BIG reason why ubisoft games feel so copy pasted as of late. They treat their mechanics like a checklist instead of stopping and thinking if they will actually benefit the experience.
what a great video, man. i've been gaming my entire life so a lot of time, i can get lost in the "theory" of it all, and so much of my mind runs to the storyline and the writing portion of it as opposed to the decision making in its core creation. This video (and this channel as a whole) has done a great deal in terms of opening my mind up in ways that lets me think behind the scenes a little bit, and allows me to listen for the gears a little bit. I appreciate that you broke down the MDA approach as well. This is such great insight!
One important thing to keep in mind is that the MDA analysis could vary between individuals, in my experience BOTW weapon breaking system made me avoid battles completely (except for the completely neccesary) and thus gave me the feeling that my character didn't care much for the world around him.
Yeah he did mention it with an example like a timer might excite people while others(my case) stress them the fuck out. I've missed out on so many games cuz the had a timer.
@@Anima-bribe yeah I just wanted to give an alternative reading of the system. Btw I have the same problem but with turn-based RPG combat. I haven't finish a lot of good games just because that kind of combat makes me feel so defenseless and powerless almost all of the time I try it out.
@@Anima-bribe Did we really miss out on them though? We like to wander and explore games without feeling rushed.
We didn't necessarily MISS any games, we simply dodged a bullet to our wallet. 🥰
I know what you mean though...there have been more than a few games that would have been PERFECT, but for that little timer which ends the game before i want it to end, ya know?
@Hector Hurtado nice pfp
Something about this video felt familiar. Then at the end it was mentioned "this was originally given as a lecture at universities in... Breda..." and I was like oh! That's why!
Still following the channel years after graduation.
Awesome!
"But: it's essential to understand why those mechanics work in one game, before copying and pasting them into yours. How do you do that? Well, I'm Mark Brown, and this is Game Maker's Toolkit."
Me: Ok first step, become Mark Brown. Second step, find the Game Maker's Toolkit.
Jokes aside, fantastic video as always.
This is probably the best video on MDA that I've seen. Great job!
every video just gets better and better, the freeze frame for the side-note at 4:20 (nice) was absolutely sublime!
totally, and the eagle vision when he says "vision". neat
Oh dear! I was at GDC and didn't know to look for you! I'm just watching this video now. We were taught MDA at the game design workshop at GDC. They made us practice by designing table top games with paper and then having playtesters play our game and describe how it made them feel.
euh, wow, the quality of the research work you performed Mark is astonishing. I think I've never seen this many games showcased in one of you videos (I've seen them alll!). Brilliant work, as always. Thanks you and bravo !
Was required to watch this video for my video game design class and I enjoyed it thoroughly. Thank you fr
Like the Alien example, one game that really enforced a sense of tension with the save points was LISA: The Painful. There's a hard mode that makes save points single-use so it really creates a feel of having to pushing forward in your adventure and not look back. You can't backtrack and resave before difficult parts, and combined with permanent party member death it felt reall thrilling!
You can see the extreme of some of these decisions in a game like Pathologic 2.
There are a lot of important NPCs relying on the main character to survive. Balancing their well being with your own is difficult. But you have some control - but only... Some. Every day is a dice roll, with a 1/6 chance that - even with the best treatment and care - someone will get sick, and their death is often inevitable. You have nowhere near enough resources to treat them all, and sometimes your best efforts result in someone dying anyway.
That's your lot - the game is not about overcoming the threat, it's largely about feeling lost and helpless and that never truly changes.
Also, guns suck, their ammo is valuable, and reloading takes an absolute eternity. You're a doctor, not a soldier - but people will try to mug your ass. That's an anxiety inducing game right there.
Mark Brown covering the MDA framework makes me unreasonably happy
I remember when I was making this game about magic, at first I added a mana bar for all your spells because, well, that’s just how magic works. As I messed around with it, though, I realized the mana bar encouraged players to spam the same spell over and over again, and as I thought about it, I realized players would be more likely to use a variety of spells if they could cast them freely, and that’d make them feel more like a cool mage to boot!
That did still leave me with some other problems to work out, but it was a huge step towards capturing that feeling of being an awesome mage.
Ultima Pagan had the player to mix the spells ahead of time, so the kind of spell was limited by the ingredients as well as the preparation. I can't remember whether the game did do much with that idea, as it otherwise felt a bit flawed. But I liked the idea of choosing preferred tactics on the one hand but also having to change them because of missing resources. With a limited inventory and specific resources in each area, this could be a good way of forcing people to try out things.
Loving that GMTK came back! Like your video structure!
Great video, great lessons! MDA can definitely be good, but I don't think people should feel limited to that framework either
Wanna give a thumbs up on that pronunciation of Skellefteå. Prosodically correct, nailed the å, and went with an h sound for the shows effort.
(sk in front of soft vowels - e, i, y, ä, ö - becomes a sound in Swedish that's best described as the hiss of an angry cat and can be hard to even comprehend if you're not a native speaker. An h sound is not far off and is perfectly passable to use until you figure it out.)
This is quite possibly the most useful GMTK video I've watched. I always struggle with which ideas to keep and which to disregard. This MDA framework was just what I needed.
Very nice video! I remember people talking about this subject before, and all of them (including the paper), falls in the trap of trying to encapsulate the aesthetics in just a small set of categories. This video avoid that pitfall and also provides clear examples of the aesthetics used by different games.
What a charm of an explanaition how any design at core really works.
It must be such an honour to give lectures to students. Congrats!
I'm glad I learnt about the Mechanic/Dynamic/Aesthetic, it's an awesome thing to keep in the back of your mind
This video was really cool, and I enjoyed the MDA paper you referenced!!
I have an entire playlist of your videos, for study cases and game balancing hoping to make my dream game one day lol. Something i would LOVE to see is a video about stamina systems for open world games or something of the sorts. I have what i think is an interesting stamina system. Sort of complicated but lowkey.
Another banger of a video. It's impressive how well you put into words some of the things that cross my mind when playing games, and you always come up with the answer before I could even ask the question. Great stuff, Mark!
I love this channel so much. Always gives me so many cool aspects of games to ponder
MDA is like the first thing you learn in game design. I love these!
I rate this video as a must watch!
I just like everyone else, want to create games some day, and this video is the one I will make sure to re-watch, you really did an amazing job presenting it and getting more in depth than just "make the player feel emotion".
It would be great to have more game dev fundamentals or theory like this video.
I also love the series about your game, which makes it a great theory-practice combination.
I would like to have you in my university, unfortunately I'm in Argentina....however, every video you make is a dream come true for us teachers. I can't thank you enough Mark!!
I'm looking forward to using this approach! My process right now feels like I am forcing things to work by sticking stuff together with stickytape & hope.
This video is both accurate and great.
I would however point out a caveat: following this advice will get you a better game, but some choices will lead to a game having less universality. Which is completely fine, but you need to find a publisher that respect this, or you'll end up getting pushback and may have to compromise your vision.
This was another brilliant essay and I’ll definitely be thinking about this approach going forward. I’m also enjoying how many of these videos can be applied to tabletop roleplaying games.
Have you ever considered looking at that design? That’s a lot of interesting ways video game design and tabletop RPG design intersect and diverge.
Was on the 2 day game design workshop on GDC this year and I must say that these two days only were worth coming there and learning from the best 🎉
I know what you mean about how the same mechanic hits people differently. Like in Shadow of Mordor a lot of people were loving the system where boss orcs would show up with random backgrounds and persist between encounters to create unique narratives. I was trying to get used to how the game worked though, so when I would mess up and get spotted, or just when I was trying to fight, those bosses would suddenly show up and then beeline for me, causing my experience to be ruined and for me to eventually drop the game because of the frustration of being unable to get anything done.
Great video as always! It's really interesting to think about designing a game for feeling instead of constant fun. I think I've got some things to think about when it comes to my own games.
Thanks for the video Mark, it's always lovely to hear gameplay design by other developers.
Hmm... MDA, I believe Extra Credits have mentioned that also in one of their videos.
I actually gave lecture of the same name last summer, though the contents were vastly different. Mine I read to CS students to try to convince them that they shouldn't be afraid of design and that as beginners it's okay to "steal" design elements as long as they fit in your vision. I also prompted them to look for inspiration from their technical limitations (like fog in Silent Hill and enemy AI in Space Invaders) and generally treat design as a technical problem that requires solution just as a programming problem does.
That being said, I really enjoyed your video and would've certainly linked it to my students if it was around back then. You delved much more into hidden problems of "steal best practices" approach than I've considered.
I'm a game designer and it is easy to steal the best parts of other games, but the trick is combining them so they work. And to fill in the gaps, which often requires inventing entirely new things. And that's when it gets really tricky.
Alien Isolation has an achievement for winning without dying. That's what really made me try to play it without dying, but then I died near the end once and it really took me out of it.
MDA is a decent basic framework, but I think it is a bit limiting and I usually don't focus on it much when teaching game design.
Why is the MDA game design framework limiting in your point of view?
@@Orange_Swirl : It deals too much with aesthetics and subjective experiences than focusing on the core of Mechanisms themselves. Just like Schell's The Art of Game Design / Book of Lenses, it falls apart when looking at more games outside of the traditional AAA stuff. When analyzing things like abstract strategy board games and modern designer board games to ARG, Mega games, hybrid tabletop, and other non-traditional things it deals too much with non-concrete topics to feel useful to me. The feel and looks and aesthetics are important, but it put it on the same field as others really does a disservice to them.
I much prefer design topics on game mechanisms and the analysis behind them. But I'm also more of a board game player who likes dissecting games into quanta. Which largely removes much of the MDA framework.
The Ludology podcast talked a lot about this stuff in the past. There are other good resources out there too but I tend to focus on board game design as I have seen video game design feel so stagnant over the years in comparison.
This is very relevant to me, as recently I was wondering about bloodbornes health mechanics. They added in a "Rally" mechanic, where you can regain your lost health if you stay aggressive and retaliate immediately- but if you miss your window or play too defensively you're punished by having to use a blood vial. I say "punished" because if you use too many and run out, you will have to go actively collect them from early enemies before you can make further progress in the game.
It made me wonder why blood vials were implemented this way, instead of how estus flasks refresh themselves at the bonfire with no collection necessary. It felt very disempowering to be punished for underperforming further than just dying and having to do the section/boss again.
That example about Alien Isolation shows what so many devs forget about: It's not about what features you have; it's about how and why you use them. You so often see some game mechanic become popular and thrown into any game even remotely capable of including it, with no regard for how it fits and what it does to the gameplay.
For instance, most games with a cover mechanic that use it well are not FPS games, but tactical games (Shadowrun Returns trilogy, Wasteland 2 + 3, XCOM, etc.), and maybe some odder titles like Time Crisis. It's something that slows down the action, which is often bad in FPS games, but doesn't affect the pacing nearly as much in tactical games. Instead, it adds a layer of consideration, which is what you want in a thinking game.
Really informative video! Its always really interesting to see how the quality of a game experience shoots up with a design that prioritizes feeding its mechanics towards a core vision and engagement type, and how easily it is to lose that when the design team is not firm about it.
Suspicious how often Game Maker's Toolkit, Design Doc, and sometimes Daryl Talks Games upload videos on the same topics at the same-ish time
I'm very excited to watch your GDC talk! Good luck!
Not a talk, just visiting!
Found your channel sometime last month, and I think what you're doing is absolutely awesome. I subbed halfway through your game jam videos, and I'm steadily working through the rest of the channel's videos. In case you happen to read this or take video suggestions, I'd be interested in some of the legality of game developing pertaining to intellectual and creative property, copyrighting, and the do's and don'ts of "stealing" ideas or mechanics like a game designer and developer. I often concern myself with daydreams of someday being sued for something I put in my game, and I'd be really curious how it "actually works".
Thanks for watching - will keep that idea in mind!
4:58 oh there's this one kind of obscure game, its in a set of games, called journeys VR, there's this one title called "Jest to impress" and that makes you feel like a comedic genius, who defies death. its mechanically simple and easy to understand, what you do at any given point should be fairly obvious, but its the result of those actions that makes it fun. I cant help but feel there's a lot to learn in that short experience.
It's so cool how we read that exact paper in class, and now I'm seeing it here on this channel. Shows just how important those design principles are.
Great video! I'd really like to see this expanded. One thing is to analyze and evaluate games, and set a vision as anchor point for your own development; another thing is to successfully communicate this on a development team through strong vision statement, example prototypes, or clear project goals, among others. I don't think it's possible to do a single video essay, but it might be interesting to do an interview. For example, how do game designers get from an initial idea/prototype to a vertical slice involving a team? What are their tools and preferences for enabling communication?
...For some reason, I went estatic seeing the thumbnail. GMTK IS THE BEST CHANNEL I'VE EVER SEEN
Not a dev, I just watch video game essays. I remember MDA from the OG Extra Credits days. I think about it a lot while playing. It's a really useful tool for understanding a game.
Thinking about Zombi U's real-time inventory system while listening to this video's through line about Alien Isolation. I don't think the former's design choice could exist as impactfully without a second screen. But it was really smart.
Opus Magmum is an AWESOME game.
Sorry you reminded me of it and now I have to tell everyone.
A helpful breakdown to keep the core of what I'm after trying to rise to the surface.
Speaking of MDA, it reminds me of The Games Overanalyser's video about 3 matching types of emergence(strategic, systemic, narrative)
Your video has a strange pull to keep me watching, so many video today are shorts now, keep up the great work!
Watched your presentation in Boden and it was nice complementing my notes with this!
Very insightful and well articulated. Thank you.
If this mentioned the Elemental Tetrad to consider those non-mechanical elements and the game loop, this would have been a pretty all encompassing summative review of the first half of my game design course! Great stuff as always, excitedly adding this to my readings catalogue for future years.
I love video games and have loved watching your channel for. 4? Years now. I work as a game tester but we focus on bug finding. It is important but I hope to experience moulding a game soneday.
using Tomb Raider 2013 as an example of 'weak and powerless to later being strong and capable' might be a bit abstracted; where the observer that was playing the game that did happen, and for those that were watching the movie portrayed by the cinematics also got that feeling, but for those that were paying attention to both were having a ping pong effect:
where she is distressed, and injured gets an ability and then strong in the gameplay because of it, but then right before she gets the next ability it is almost as if all of the emotional progress took steps backwards just to be pushed forward.
as a full experience it just felt like "we just killed 5 guys with a bow, now you are feeling distraught because you shot 1 guy.... and now we are going to be shooting 30 more guys"
What a spicy title! Who hasn't wasted a bunch of energy thinking about how amazing it would be to combine parts from other experiences we already enjoyed. True unique ideas are hard to come by and I feel most innovation comes from derivative experimentation.