I honestly cannot understand why people dare debate Glenn Greenwald. It is a massacre - every - single - time. The guy is always super well prepared, knows the facts and argues using logic!
He is one of my heroes. And love that he and his husband have started a shelter in South America, employing homeless to live and work there. Fantastic concept.
Winston, THe big question is what have we (USA) been doing to other countries cyber wise, and to Russia how far did we go cyber screwing with them? One thing I hate about media daily, they have to spew words and waste a lot of time, and years later books get written that have the answers, finally. Media is time sucking, I'm getting old, 66, I have had enough of the daily arguing, and rather read books once history's been properly listed out by smart minds, at least as smart as the likes of Greenwald, people who write all the relevant details, when the info is finally let public. It's such a losing proposition being a daily media piece by piece trickler learner of history. Books here I come.
Glenn Greenwald is the most articulate, educated, composed, candid journalist and debater I admire. He never misses the mark on making the most potently sound argument for his stance. I appreciate how respectful this debate was so that both views could be heard. Their willingness to agree on some points and call each other out at the same time we a good model of healthy debate without ego taking over.
If Russian press were freer, and if Russia legal system or internal "justice" would do their own "Mueller" investigation into USA's cyber hacking of Russia, that'd be a kind of good source to see really, are we overblowning this Russia election meddling that I'll agree did give us Trump. If we were screwing with Russia just prior to when Putin gave the green light to his GRU (per Mueller's indictments, I presume the info is true) to screw with our election and push against Hillary, as a longer range strategic plan to keep local pressue on Hillary who I also presume Putin thought she'd win, and he was just screwing with us, and that's likely MORE than we were even screwing with Russia. So we should get Russia to stop cyber screwing with us. But they in Russia ought to be mature enough as a country (they seem not to be) to believably and credibly lay out how our cyber tactics did exactly what to them? The big missing, is laying out what cyber screwing we did and still do to them, and compare it to what cyber screwing they did and do still to us. And get this knocked off. It's wasteful nonsense. Both sides.
+kapa1611 _"on Russian issues he is super naive"_ Oh please, Russia doesn't exert even a fraction of the influence regimes like Israel or Saudi Arabia do. Just because Rachel Maddow waves her hands in the air and screams 'RUSSIA!' every night is not proof of anything. What is different about Russia between now and 10 years ago when the Democrats loved them?
Anyone else noticed how Joe never responds to Glenn's takedowns of his arguments? Joe never reacts when Glenn points out where he is factually wrong. He only resorts to repeating "Putin is bad" over and over again.
Just keep lying and restating misrepresentations. A man who is a leftist and anti war but buys into the red scare/Russophobia over a century have not learnt very many lessons.
Glenn is the MAN! He always has his facts down and if you put your foot in your mouth, he's going to spotlight it, as he should. Bravo! The voice not only of reason, but objective and focusing on what it is we should be talking about and not evading.
Free Julian Assange. A man of upmost integrity that has sacrificed so much to inform the people of what is in their interest and of wrong doings committed in their name by those that profit from death
Andrea Aldrich makes it easy to understand how the masses are fooled by propaganda and how reasonably intelligent people have lost their critical thinking skills because of Trump’s election. Easier to kill the messenger rather than looking at the message exposed in the emails.
You mean to say that he didn't sanction Russia, bomb their allies, and arm rebels in Ukraine? Or that he's Putin's bitch in spite of that? Also Paul, in case you don't know, when you write in caps it means you're shouting.
Ok Paul, for the sake of argument, let me agree that Trump is just doing this to pretend he's not a puppet. What do you suggest we do? Also, no need to shout, I'm right here and I'm interested in hearing your opinion.
Yolanda Verdin Greenwald seems to have respect for his opponents whenever he debates. He seems to have respect for Joe and vice versa. Glenn knows that this is the only way to move the ball forward as does Amy.
One nitpick: The US has been interfering with Russia since the 1917 Russian Revolution when the US sent troops to fight for the counter-revolution. WWII necessitated a brief thaw in relations, but let's remember that the first red scare in the US was before WWII and it was more of the same afterward.
I was astounded to learn that American troops had joined a British expeditionary force to help the Csar defeat the Russian revolution. Imagine if Russia had joined Hessian mercenaries to help King George defeat the American revolution. History matters but unfortunately it's America's least favorite subject because its where myth meets fact and Americans prefer a good story.
Logic and reasoning is deadly against propaganda. One needs not to get prepared with snappy comebacks when they're armed with factual proof. The exceptional mindset is exposed and the claim that "we can but you can't " is immediately flushed down the drain. Excellent job again Glen!
Thank you DN! for hosting this discussion. More like this. And as many others have said, GG is solid gold. I am so thankful for his work and insights. Keep getting him on!
Glenn Greenwald is a blessing to journalism everywhere. This clip underlines how to approach difficult subjects. Reasoning is factbased and logic, simply excellent. This discussion should be aired at every major network, they may learn something and those watching see what true journalism look like.
It's like Joe isn't even listening to Glenn. He's not even really responding to Glenn. He beats the war drum despite all the pearls Glenn is giving him. I'm almost embarrassed for him.
Amy's protecting of Joe is positively motherly. She almost never asks Joe to reply to Glenn's points, but instead quickly shifts gears and throws widdle Joe a softball. Pathetic.
For a start, the only reason that the Start Treaty was made, to bring the amount of nuclear weapons down from over 60,000 to around 6,000 was because the escalation was financially unviable. It was going to be impossible for both the US and Russia to maintain those levels of spending. So in order to keep nuclear was possible they had to make it manageable. Otherwise the entire system is untenable. The treaty is portrayed as something that reduced the amount of nuclear weapons to deescalate hostilities. In fact the opposite was true, it allowed both countries to continue their hostility, though in a financially manageable way.
Glen is right - Trump is nothing more then a symptom of our inability to think critically of how to govern a country and how to provide oversight on how government operates
Reagan and Gorbachev did meet alone at one point, only with their interpreters. Do a fact check. Steve Cohen tells an amusing story of the results of the meeting.
Bernie Sanders is a sane political figure and has come out against Trump's performance with Putin, so this is not aimed at Sanders, but people always ask how it was possible for many Sanders supporters to align themselves with Trump and vote for Trump even though his policies are totally antithetical to those of Sanders. The answer is that there is no difference between the extreme political right and the extreme political left, and it is easy for the left to morph into the right. They both are fanatics, and I dislike and distrust fanaticism whether it be right wing or left wing. As George Orwell pointed out long ago, either direction (far left or far right) can lead to a totalitarian state.
Sad to see Joe Cirincione, who seems well-intentioned, repeatedly fall back to his original claim that Trump simply can't be trusted without ever demonstrating its validity. He seems to be absentmindedly conceding to Glenn without subsequently adjusting his viewpoint. Really sad.
Joe Cirincinone, right on some things like of the corporate democratic party, but stop fucking blaming Russia. We hated Clinton & did not vote for her because she did not represent us. Thanks for having Glenn.
Thank you Amy and Glenn for some sanity in this gathering storm of 'Manchurian Candidate' craziness. Let it go, folks. She lost (electoral college, anyway). It's been two years now. Move on. There are real problems that deserve the kind attention that's wasted on this bullshit.
Fantastic intelligent commentary I do think without credentials that Glenn Greenwald, as hip as he might think he is has a limited understanding of what is happening in this Cyber is if nothing fast evolving and as dangerous as nuclear threat. Certainly history speaks but anticipating response is always been the bailiwick of government. Reacting after the fac will not cut it historically never did and now is true on a logarithmic scale not linear.
in this interview, we have some schmuck nobody has ever heard of versus arguably the most reputable and one of the more logical journalists in recent memory. Who wins? Take a wild guess!
It sounded like they were willing to work toward further disarmament which assumes at the least they will extend the agreement (in 3 years). Of course the summit is a good thing. also like the joint initiative to assist Mueller. While we can assist with investigation of the oligarch, William Browder (former us citizen) who Putin mentioned in his response. Did he say Trump is dismantling the 'liberal international order?' That first clown is only parroting talking points of fear mongering.. Great job Glenn!!
Joe, you say you don't know if Putin has something on Trump? Joe, it's obvious you don't know anything about Vladimir Putin, or Trump. IT's plain to see you don't do much (if any) research, or, maybe your one of them. IT sure sounds like you are.
sorry, but come one. if anyone is at the very most inane, which means: Silly, Stupid, Foolish, Idiotic, Fatuous, Ridiculous, Absurd, Senseless, Asinine
stepping out of this before my blood pressure rises. Greenwald to me has the face of a nge-nge-nge-nge-nge - nge kid's party pinata just begging to be busted open to end the party with a BANG! next to Trump, this prize-winning journalist i am finding so easy to dislike. so, i'll go!
It's amazing how a reporter can be bought. Glenn Greenwald is following in the footsteps of the late Ed Schultz. The Russian money must spend the same as Trump money.
Greenwald, you are doing one common thing, if there is a position-you are against it. Is that the blue print for a 📚 book. Well, good for you. Don’t antagonize , go to the beach,get some 🌞 color.
Sal ty ..yes, the 1950's are calling saying "give us back our propaganda"....Russia was seen as evil by the USA, back then, because Russia had a different economic system than the USA.....and, as is well-documented, Americans find anything evil unless it is completely the same as situation stateside...Now,,however the USA and Russia have the exact same crony-capitalism system, so why is there such us anger towards Russia?
I love Glen Greenwald. One of the few people I trust still.
I honestly cannot understand why people dare debate Glenn Greenwald. It is a massacre - every - single - time. The guy is always super well prepared, knows the facts and argues using logic!
Facts and logic will always beat innuendo.
I was about to comment the exact same thing.
Winston Smith in Oceania yeah, he’s fierce! But he should open them damn eyes and lay off Gilbert Godfrey impersonation.
He is one of my heroes. And love that he and his husband have started a shelter in South America, employing homeless to live and work there. Fantastic concept.
Winston, THe big question is what have we (USA) been doing to other countries cyber wise, and to Russia how far did we go cyber screwing with them? One thing I hate about media daily, they have to spew words and waste a lot of time, and years later books get written that have the answers, finally. Media is time sucking, I'm getting old, 66, I have had enough of the daily arguing, and rather read books once history's been properly listed out by smart minds, at least as smart as the likes of Greenwald, people who write all the relevant details, when the info is finally let public.
It's such a losing proposition being a daily media piece by piece trickler learner of history. Books here I come.
Glenn Greenwald is the most articulate, educated, composed, candid journalist and debater I admire. He never misses the mark on making the most potently sound argument for his stance. I appreciate how respectful this debate was so that both views could be heard. Their willingness to agree on some points and call each other out at the same time we a good model of healthy debate without ego taking over.
Kay Paden I wholeheartedly agree with you on this. You just said what I had in mind.
Glenn Greenwald is the best
To me, he's just another Trump fixer ala Cohen only more eloquent.
If Russian press were freer, and if Russia legal system or internal "justice" would do their own "Mueller" investigation into USA's cyber hacking of Russia, that'd be a kind of good source to see really, are we overblowning this Russia election meddling that I'll agree did give us Trump. If we were screwing with Russia just prior to when Putin gave the green light to his GRU (per Mueller's indictments, I presume the info is true) to screw with our election and push against Hillary, as a longer range strategic plan to keep local pressue on Hillary who I also presume Putin thought she'd win, and he was just screwing with us, and that's likely MORE than we were even screwing with Russia.
So we should get Russia to stop cyber screwing with us. But they in Russia ought to be mature enough as a country (they seem not to be) to believably and credibly lay out how our cyber tactics did exactly what to them?
The big missing, is laying out what cyber screwing we did and still do to them, and compare it to what cyber screwing they did and do still to us.
And get this knocked off. It's wasteful nonsense. Both sides.
+kapa1611 _"on Russian issues he is super naive"_
Oh please, Russia doesn't exert even a fraction of the influence regimes like Israel or Saudi Arabia do. Just because Rachel Maddow waves her hands in the air and screams 'RUSSIA!' every night is not proof of anything. What is different about Russia between now and 10 years ago when the Democrats loved them?
Anyone else noticed how Joe never responds to Glenn's takedowns of his arguments? Joe never reacts when Glenn points out where he is factually wrong. He only resorts to repeating "Putin is bad" over and over again.
Just keep lying and restating misrepresentations. A man who is a leftist and anti war but buys into the red scare/Russophobia over a century have not learnt very many lessons.
Glenn is the MAN! He always has his facts down and if you put your foot in your mouth, he's going to spotlight it, as he should. Bravo! The voice not only of reason, but objective and focusing on what it is we should be talking about and not evading.
Free Julian Assange. A man of upmost integrity that has sacrificed so much to inform the people of what is in their interest and of wrong doings committed in their name by those that profit from death
YES. Glen just said everything Ive been telling people. Nobody is seeing this clearly.
What part of what Glenn said do you disagree with? Ps. Your Caps-lock key must be jammed.
Andrea Aldrich makes it easy to understand how the masses are fooled by propaganda and how reasonably intelligent people have lost their critical thinking skills because of Trump’s election. Easier to kill the messenger rather than looking at the message exposed in the emails.
You mean to say that he didn't sanction Russia, bomb their allies, and arm rebels in Ukraine? Or that he's Putin's bitch in spite of that? Also Paul, in case you don't know, when you write in caps it means you're shouting.
Ok Paul, for the sake of argument, let me agree that Trump is just doing this to pretend he's not a puppet. What do you suggest we do? Also, no need to shout, I'm right here and I'm interested in hearing your opinion.
Oh man!! Glenn Greenwald kills it every time!
Guest like Joe are the reason I have been watching democracy Now less n less. Get the hook & drag him off! Glenn is right on!
Yolanda Verdin Greenwald seems to have respect for his opponents whenever he debates. He seems to have respect for Joe and vice versa. Glenn knows that this is the only way to move the ball forward as does Amy.
You don't seem to understand what is a debate.
You want to be well prepared when you debate Glen Greenwald.
Thank you Mr. Greenwald, keep up the great work.
One nitpick:
The US has been interfering with Russia since the 1917 Russian Revolution when the US sent troops to fight for the counter-revolution. WWII necessitated a brief thaw in relations, but let's remember that the first red scare in the US was before WWII and it was more of the same afterward.
I was astounded to learn that American troops had joined a British expeditionary force to help the Csar defeat the Russian revolution. Imagine if Russia had joined Hessian mercenaries to help King George defeat the American revolution. History matters but unfortunately it's America's least favorite subject because its where myth meets fact and Americans prefer a good story.
Logic and reasoning is deadly against propaganda. One needs not to get prepared with snappy comebacks when they're armed with factual proof. The exceptional mindset is exposed and the claim that "we can but you can't " is immediately flushed down the drain. Excellent job again Glen!
Damn, Glenn is kicking a dead horse with part 2!
Clouds just disappear when Glenn speaks. Thank you so much for always having him on your program!
Wonderful points made Glen . Thank you for your level headed insights .
Greenwald was on point! 👏👏👏
macnett3 what about Bill Clinton, of the thirty years war?
Get em Glenn
It's refreshing to see a debate on DemocracyNow!
Excellent debate. Glen shines. Thank you Amy.
I for one am sick and tired of the 2016 election. Personally I got more out of the video on The Real News: Paul Jay, Trump-Putin and the Real Threat
Good God..Glenn is a beast. He makes so much sense with his facts.
By far the best 2 part interview that it has been my pleasure to see on Democracy Now. Kudos!
Thank you DN! for hosting this discussion. More like this. And as many others have said, GG is solid gold. I am so thankful for his work and insights. Keep getting him on!
Glen is not caught up in the political "empire's" corruption, mayhem, and lies- so he can see and analyze clearly and bring forth the truth...
And Joe is neck-deep in it.
Sorry Mr. Cirincione, our politicians are picked for us and I'm not talking about Russia. Democracy, ha!
Glenn Greenwald is a blessing to journalism everywhere. This clip underlines how to approach difficult subjects. Reasoning is factbased and logic, simply excellent. This discussion should be aired at every major network, they may learn something and those watching see what true journalism look like.
As always, Glenn Greenwald is a blast!
Thank you "Democracy Now!" for bringing him on the show!
The electoral college thwarted the political will of the American people not Russia Trump lost by 3 million votes.
Brilliant, Glen Greenwald! Thank you!
THANK YOU GLENN GREENWALD!!!!!!
Three bright people. I subscribed!
Glenn should do his own radio show
Not disturbing. Completely transparent. As transparent as it is secret. OK Dems ... TIME TO IMPEACH NOW ? ? ?
It's like Joe isn't even listening to Glenn. He's not even really responding to Glenn. He beats the war drum despite all the pearls Glenn is giving him. I'm almost embarrassed for him.
They both have good argument and are both right.
I JUST WANT TO SAY, I FEEL COMPROMISED,
The relations between the president and security agencies has been contentious since JFK.
The worst thing to happen to a whistleblower Grenwald did to Reality Winner, with years to think twice about being used by the Intercept
Glenn FTW again
Amy's protecting of Joe is positively motherly. She almost never asks Joe to reply to Glenn's points, but instead quickly shifts gears and throws widdle Joe a softball. Pathetic.
For a start, the only reason that the Start Treaty was made, to bring the amount of nuclear weapons down from over 60,000 to around 6,000 was because the escalation was financially unviable. It was going to be impossible for both the US and Russia to maintain those levels of spending. So in order to keep nuclear was possible they had to make it manageable. Otherwise the entire system is untenable.
The treaty is portrayed as something that reduced the amount of nuclear weapons to deescalate hostilities. In fact the opposite was true, it allowed both countries to continue their hostility, though in a financially manageable way.
Bang! Greenwald killin' it.
Glenn must be having a great time in Rio. he can't keep his eyes open.
Yes, he lives there, his husband is Brazilian and Glenn speaks fluent Portuguese
Well I'm glad he didn't have trouble keeping his mouth open. He makes a lot of sense and is saying things that need to be said over and over again.
Wow. Greenwald really ripped Cirincione a new one! And that's someone he claims to like!
Greenwald is so fucking brilliant.
Dammit Joe, you were so close.
very nice discussion WE AGREE TO DISAGREE ;-')
There were State Department translators present when Trump and Putin met "in private."
That look at 7:53... Priceless.
Complete. Annihilation.
SORRY ABOUT THE CAPITALS
audio issues anyone else?
can watch a bunch of other videos no problem. watching this one okay now after d/ling it.
Let's call it will rolled the dice,
landed on Orwellin Kollektive Oligarchy,
call it jazzy.
And got home ?
Glen is right - Trump is nothing more then a symptom of our inability to think critically of how to govern a country and how to provide oversight on how government operates
It's great Trump went to the summit in the sense he has shown just how brazen is his duplicity. Over confidence is likely his undoing.
Can you do a piece on Kevin De Leon being enforced over Feinstein
Reagan and Gorbachev did meet alone at one point, only with their interpreters. Do a fact check. Steve Cohen tells an amusing story of the results of the meeting.
Bernie Sanders is a sane political figure and has come out against Trump's performance with Putin, so this is not aimed at Sanders, but people always ask how it was possible for many Sanders supporters to align themselves with Trump and vote for Trump even though his policies are totally antithetical to those of Sanders. The answer is that there is no difference between the extreme political right and the extreme political left, and it is easy for the left to morph into the right. They both are fanatics, and I dislike and distrust fanaticism whether it be right wing or left wing. As George Orwell pointed out long ago, either direction (far left or far right) can lead to a totalitarian state.
Hahah Cirincione is LEARNING from Glenn
Sad to see Joe Cirincione, who seems well-intentioned, repeatedly fall back to his original claim that Trump simply can't be trusted without ever demonstrating its validity. He seems to be absentmindedly conceding to Glenn without subsequently adjusting his viewpoint.
Really sad.
Joe Cirincinone, right on some things like of the corporate democratic party, but stop fucking blaming Russia. We hated Clinton & did not vote for her because she did not represent us. Thanks for having Glenn.
Thank you Amy and Glenn for some sanity in this gathering storm of 'Manchurian Candidate' craziness.
Let it go, folks. She lost (electoral college, anyway). It's been two years now. Move on. There are real problems that deserve the kind attention that's wasted on this bullshit.
Hillary would have been bright enough to put identification wrist bands on the separated babies and would have sold them at prices more reasonable.
Trump keeps his prick on the nuclear button and whenever he gets a stiffy the world quakes.
Fantastic intelligent commentary I do think without credentials that Glenn Greenwald, as hip as he might think he is has a limited understanding of what is happening in this Cyber is if nothing fast evolving and as dangerous as nuclear threat. Certainly history speaks but anticipating response is always been the bailiwick of government. Reacting after the fac will not cut it historically never did and now is true on a logarithmic scale not linear.
America is a Republic!
Putin seems pretty good on the international scene compared to America's attacks all over the place.
in this interview, we have some schmuck nobody has ever heard of versus arguably the most reputable and one of the more logical journalists in recent memory. Who wins? Take a wild guess!
Glenn Greenwald has take the Trump pill.
This Joe is so full of contradictions.
Liberal values vs Big Picture Efficacy
Cirincione brought a butter knife to a gun fight.
Glenn is incredible, destroyed Joe
Too bad Joe Cirincione got the last word, which is very likely not true, in this otherwise excellent debate.
Joe you got Slammed!
Cirriciones face is classicK!
He asked Putin to deny pee tape
Glem
It sounded like they were willing to work toward further disarmament which assumes at the least they will extend the agreement (in 3 years). Of course the summit is a good thing. also like the joint initiative to assist Mueller. While we can assist with investigation of the oligarch, William Browder (former us citizen) who Putin mentioned in his response.
Did he say Trump is dismantling the 'liberal international order?' That first clown is only parroting talking points of fear mongering..
Great job Glenn!!
That bloke Cirincione looks as if he almost believes his own BS I was gonna list it but there was so much why bother.
Glen, you took the lame side of the issue and you took it too personally, as oft you do.
Joe, you say you don't know if Putin has something on Trump? Joe, it's obvious you don't know anything about Vladimir Putin, or Trump. IT's plain to see you don't do much (if any) research, or, maybe your one of them. IT sure sounds like you are.
sorry, but come one. if anyone is at the very most inane, which means: Silly, Stupid, Foolish, Idiotic, Fatuous, Ridiculous, Absurd, Senseless, Asinine
Amy usually wears black and blue
stepping out of this before my blood pressure rises. Greenwald to me has the face of a nge-nge-nge-nge-nge - nge kid's party pinata just begging to be busted open to end the party with a BANG! next to Trump, this prize-winning journalist i am finding so easy to dislike. so, i'll go!
Why would Glenn Greenwald be defending Putin and Wikileaks so much?
He's not. Name one way that increasing tensions with another nuclear superpower makes the world a safer place?
It's called being honest.
Try to wake up from your confirmation bias. Don’t be frightened your paradigm is challenged, embrace it, educate yourself, and grow. Seriously.
He pissed his pants and Putin threatened to post the pics on Snapchat.
hello- You've obviously never herd of him. And he wasn'i 'Defending" Putin. Too funny.
Joe "Pee Pee Tape" Cicerone
Fake news
PICK A SIDE GREENWALD!
Sal ty when both sides are wrong? Dumb idealogy
Sal ty ...uhm, go back to sleep, Billy Ray.
He is in side of justice bitch...
Welcome back to reality Glen, you still have some black minus points for your treatment of Sam, but thanks anyway.
treatment of Sam?
Glen was pretty harsh on Sam Harris
glenn greenwald is just not listenable his awful
It's amazing how a reporter can be bought. Glenn Greenwald is following in the footsteps of the late Ed Schultz. The Russian money must spend the same as Trump money.
Greenwald, you are doing one common thing, if there is a position-you are against it. Is that the blue print for a 📚 book. Well, good for you. Don’t antagonize , go to the beach,get some 🌞 color.
L Cardoso ...yeah, ignore the evil all around you, and go to the beach....great advice, ace!
Greenwald's not old enough to remember why we are not friendly with Putin
Sal ty ..yes, the 1950's are calling saying "give us back our propaganda"....Russia was seen as evil by the USA, back then, because Russia had a different economic system than the USA.....and, as is well-documented, Americans find anything evil unless it is completely the same as situation stateside...Now,,however the USA and Russia have the exact same crony-capitalism system, so why is there such us anger towards Russia?