Been doing this since I accidentally discovered it in the tutorial, but mostly just when I saw a melee was going to miss. It wasn't until quite a bit later that I discovered the kikaku booster, and that's when it became insane
Same, melee’d at the wrong time on the chopper and mashed shift to dodge as a missile burst came at me and “ohhhh?” Basho arms and Kikaku made it all come together, and most of my builds feature the pair.
@@meddlingmage23 that's only true if you boost kick at low EN. My build layers in kicks for damage and stagger as part of my direct hit punishes. I'm not just guessing, I've used the trick for multiple playthroughs.
Yeah been doing this for a while. It single handedly makes mobility worth investing in as it gives you a new approach option and melee weapons generally have great direct hit adjustment/impact
It's mechanics like this that make games fun for me. Coming from the FGC (well, many years ago by now), I love to cancel animations, that's the name of the game, man! Thanks for propping up the community with videos like this. More people in the know mean more people appreciating the nuance!
If im correct, this works best with the laser dagger as it has the lowest cooldown of all melee. Ive been using this with my redline AC with coral generator the mixup potential is insane. Cancel a melee charge with a QB, into another melee charge that can be canceled into an AB that will track and follow someone 180 if they try to dodge behind you, into a kick canccled by QB into another melee charge with the speed of AF4A Build with the two shoulder turrets that track and shoot to keep up the stagger and you can just 100 to 0 someone with the right combo
@saintsword23 a mix of human error and preference. If youre too late or rusty you cant cancel at the final moments of the lunge. Having a low cooldown just makes it so you don't wait as long in between. Low CD also keeps up the pressure. Mixup a feint with an actual slash, boost out, and you can usually mix up with a kick or a burst of whatever else your build has before you can use the dagger again
@@garitaevz Don't screw it up. I know this sounds simplistic, but if you're concerned about tech like this, you're probably aiming toward a high skill level and you should be aiming to not mess things up like that.
@saintsword23 yes, and once you nail it down I'm saying the laser dagger is one of the best do the movement tech with cause of its low CD and ability to keep up close pressure
Actually the dagger is not so great for this because it shockingly has a lot of startup. The default sword has the best melee dash because it has the least start up on the initial dash portion itself
Just fyi, when using the laser slicer sometimes if you dont cancel soon enough it will still need to cool down as if u actually attacked with it so be careful . I havent had a lot of time to play around with it cauee i just got it yesterday, but i THINK this is only a concern when using the charged attack. Idk for sure tho. Melee cancel also works great with punching to fake people out
Yep. Laser Slicer in particular has pretty early startup for it's attacks during the dash. So it's easy to miss the window where it doesn't go on cooldown. Making it a more difficult weapon to use lots of dash cancels on.
I think you can QB to cancel any move. I used it with the needle cannon for the ice worm fight, as it has alot of start frames so you can pre-fire and the qb to cancel if your gonna miss
You might already know this but you can cancel readying attacks by quick boosting before the weapon fires as well. For an example the back Plasma cannon when you shoot it it stops your ac and your locked into the animation but you can boost before it shoots which will cancel it. Not nearly as useful but still good to know.
Saw this in a different video and it was called Melee Cancel, MeC for short. Lot of theory crafting in the comment section. Be careful using this in pvp, songbirds or any other grenade launchers will fuck you up if you're going in a straight line towards the enemy.
Lmao, what comes around goes around. It was the reverse in armored core 4/FA you could do a extented blade lunge mid swing using any beam blade and accelerate faster using qb+blade swing and get to your targets faster.
I tried taking advantage of this by having an unequipped hand and a pulse sword and using the offhand to dash...but it made my movement predictable... Would love to see a viable all melee build
There's definetly a couple at least. Honestly just use the arms with the highest melee specialization, the kikaku booster, some beefy armor, and then get the weapon bay and weight reduction upgrades, start out with nothing in your right hand, anything in your left hand, and a pile bunker on your left shoulder. Then you can purge ur left hand weapon, and can switch between punching and using ur pile bunker with ur left hand. And u basically just punch the shit out of people to stun lock them and use the pile punker. It's really anoying but it works. So don't just use ur off hand to dash. Actually punch them. It has a ton of stagger build up
question: why did oro punch people 3 times in that other video? was it to charge up the chainsaw? (I need to rewatch that) and can you simply stunlock people to death with punches if they're already ACS-overloaded? or is there a limit?
I must be missing something. I tried this and my AC covers approx. the same distance as without the melee cancel. I boosted until energy depletion , I had covered same distance in both ways
This is so weird i was messing about with a build today and i literally just came to the channel to recommend basho arms combined with kikaku booster for ridiculous melee harassment and damage, i put double zimmers on it too because obviously i did
@Oroboro you do play with a controller right? Do you have any suggestions about custom controls? I read a guy who mapped the jump to L3 and the boost to R3, thought it sounded interesting and got me thinking if there was an optimal configuration to play.
I actually play with default controls! They work just fine, especially if you're using hard lock often. A controller with extra buttons on the back can definitely help you get a small edge on your opponent (being able to quick boost and use the right stick at the same time to soft lock aim)
Ok I’m not trying to be argumentative I’m actually trying to start a conversation. What are the advantages to melee canceling over just assault boosting?
Is it better to go for the melee range thrusters or one of the speed ones overall? not sure if the melee lunge range is worth it compared to a bit better stats overall
That's sort of the decision you have to make-none is strictly better than the other, but your melee cancels will be significantly less effective if you use anything other than the Kikaku.
The problem with this tech is that it’s not really useful. Most melee weapons do not proc a “mini stun” (not a full stagger, but a short stun similar to what happens after you get kicked) which doesn’t allow any real combo opportunity. The opponent can escape it quite easily unless they are staggered. Not only that, but as fast as it may be, it actually leaves you super vulnerable compared to an assault boost and you would probably be wasting useful EN on pointless cancels. But take this with a grain of salt honestly cause this is coming from a relatively new player with 100 hrs and constant struggling in PvP
I don't usually fight lightweight builds(you know the deal, its bulky zimmers and missile boats), but even when I do, this tech allows you to outpace generally any AC. Its faster at closing gaps than an AB, and you can also melee dash cancel into AB if you need it. I'm sure you saw chained dashes in the vid but weapons with low start up anim(like default green pulse blade) can INSTANTLY cancel their melee dashes left and right which screws up aim tracking as I've noticed most ACs run mid range focused FCS parts, not the close range ones. And of course, you don't really melee to always guarantee a stun, it hits hard and does a lot of stagger damage. Many melee players I fight only use their melee weapons when they've built up their enemies' ACS stagger meter a little bit so one successful attack from their melee weapon will guarantee a stagger, and it doesn't even need to be a lot because as mentioned, the better melee weapons do massive stagger damage already TLDR: This movement tech turns you into a really fast and agile AC even if you have a low speed build. it does have demanding EN costs and its not an insta-win strat, but it gives you so much mobility and gap closing potential and that consistently offers counterplay to the cons you mentioned
So the grid walkers also work for this all be it not with as much speed but they have the second highest melee thrust speed but if you want some more functionality for hit and run tactics because they’re vertical thrust are maxed out. So it makes it incredibly potent with missiles and swords if that’s your fancy. My favorite lately tho have been the stun guns and needle launchers.
My girlfriend is the one playing AC6 (AC1 was actually her first game) but I'm the one with much more soulsy experience so I helped her beat the sea spider last night and did this accidentally several times. Now that I know how to do it, I'm going to show her what I did so it'll be much easier for her.
@@Oroboro I did, actually, it's cancled by Qb in any dirrection before the animation is finished. My problem is that you are able to do that while using the coral generator, which when depleted, takes 2 seconds before filling the energy bar 75% full instantly, which means you can melee dash cancle away forever, forcing any opponent who can do the same to do the same exact thing, so essentially it's the Favor and Protection ring glitch situation from dark souls 3.
@@Hong656 you technically can, it's called looking away from the opponent so you break lock-on easy to do in a 1v1, and slightly tricky in a 3v3, but not impossible. Just don't use auto lock. there is also that one OS upgrade that allows you to toggle manuel aim.
@@crescentwolf7072 So you melee boost toward them and then QB away from them? That...just seems like you went precisely nowhere or maybe are now a little closer to the opponent. Your overall displacement is melee distance - QB distance, and melee distance is probably larger.
Been doing this since I accidentally discovered it in the tutorial, but mostly just when I saw a melee was going to miss. It wasn't until quite a bit later that I discovered the kikaku booster, and that's when it became insane
Same, melee’d at the wrong time on the chopper and mashed shift to dodge as a missile burst came at me and “ohhhh?”
Basho arms and Kikaku made it all come together, and most of my builds feature the pair.
When I accidentally learned I could do this I felt like the fastest Raven alive. Great video on explaining it more in depth!
its worth mentioning that QB right after a boost kick will cancel the end-lag, allowing you to pull off similar high mobility shenanigans.
Mobility is cool, but the real reason to do it is to spam kick like a kickboxer on meth
that's if ur not completely dry of energy. Most of the time, after a kick, it's gonna be assault armor.
"End lag", smash player I presume?
@@meddlingmage23 that's only true if you boost kick at low EN. My build layers in kicks for damage and stagger as part of my direct hit punishes. I'm not just guessing, I've used the trick for multiple playthroughs.
@@blodiaaa6990or any person who has a marginal understanding of time? End lag exists in basically every action in basically every video game
This looks the fucking coolest with the laser slicer. Big Gundam energy naginata vibes.
Another tip related to Assault Boosting: If you have the "Quick Turn" OS Tuning, you can use it while Assault Boosting to snap your direction quickly.
What!? Ttying this out!
Ah yes, Armored Core Extreme VS
It's either someone at Fromsoft loves Extreme VS or someone from VSTG Project snuck into ACVI development team 😆
Yeah been doing this for a while. It single handedly makes mobility worth investing in as it gives you a new approach option and melee weapons generally have great direct hit adjustment/impact
It's mechanics like this that make games fun for me. Coming from the FGC (well, many years ago by now), I love to cancel animations, that's the name of the game, man! Thanks for propping up the community with videos like this. More people in the know mean more people appreciating the nuance!
If im correct, this works best with the laser dagger as it has the lowest cooldown of all melee. Ive been using this with my redline AC with coral generator the mixup potential is insane.
Cancel a melee charge with a QB, into another melee charge that can be canceled into an AB that will track and follow someone 180 if they try to dodge behind you, into a kick canccled by QB into another melee charge with the speed of AF4A
Build with the two shoulder turrets that track and shoot to keep up the stagger and you can just 100 to 0 someone with the right combo
Why would the cooldown matter? You're canceling the animation and therefore your melee weapon never goes on cooldown.
@saintsword23 a mix of human error and preference. If youre too late or rusty you cant cancel at the final moments of the lunge. Having a low cooldown just makes it so you don't wait as long in between.
Low CD also keeps up the pressure.
Mixup a feint with an actual slash, boost out, and you can usually mix up with a kick or a burst of whatever else your build has before you can use the dagger again
@@garitaevz Don't screw it up. I know this sounds simplistic, but if you're concerned about tech like this, you're probably aiming toward a high skill level and you should be aiming to not mess things up like that.
@saintsword23 yes, and once you nail it down I'm saying the laser dagger is one of the best do the movement tech with cause of its low CD and ability to keep up close pressure
Actually the dagger is not so great for this because it shockingly has a lot of startup. The default sword has the best melee dash because it has the least start up on the initial dash portion itself
I love using melee cancel, but sometimes during a PVP match it failed horribly and I whiffed in front of the enemy.
That's embarassing lmfao
Gotta practice more
You can't just do it and throw it out expecting it to connect. Timing and positioning is essential to its functionality.
@@apexzora4423 Yeah it is.
@@arthurhsu9111keep doin it until you embarrass your opponent
Yup, anyone that's want to play melee need to learn this. I caught a lot of people off guard with it.
Gundam maxi boosts you gotta live by this
I did this by accident a few times but now I know how to do it consistently. Thanks, Oro.
Just fyi, when using the laser slicer sometimes if you dont cancel soon enough it will still need to cool down as if u actually attacked with it so be careful . I havent had a lot of time to play around with it cauee i just got it yesterday, but i THINK this is only a concern when using the charged attack. Idk for sure tho. Melee cancel also works great with punching to fake people out
Yep. Laser Slicer in particular has pretty early startup for it's attacks during the dash. So it's easy to miss the window where it doesn't go on cooldown. Making it a more difficult weapon to use lots of dash cancels on.
I think you can QB to cancel any move. I used it with the needle cannon for the ice worm fight, as it has alot of start frames so you can pre-fire and the qb to cancel if your gonna miss
You cans see the trainer AC cancel its curtis charged shot quite often.
You might already know this but you can cancel readying attacks by quick boosting before the weapon fires as well.
For an example the back Plasma cannon when you shoot it it stops your ac and your locked into the animation but you can boost before it shoots which will cancel it.
Not nearly as useful but still good to know.
Fastest 298 boost speed I've ever seen
I was waiting for this vid to come out haha, I noticed it 1st day and was like WHAT
Saw this in a different video and it was called Melee Cancel, MeC for short. Lot of theory crafting in the comment section.
Be careful using this in pvp, songbirds or any other grenade launchers will fuck you up if you're going in a straight line towards the enemy.
1:38 u going to be punished by another shotgun ngl , 😂
Good lord Oro.
THIS IS NOT TECH.
THIS IS JUST AN INTENTIONAL GAME MECHANIC
jesuschrist
So that's what happened to me, I noticed my sword swing never really happened because, as I learned in video, I interrupted my attack with a boost!
Dope. the kikaku is like one of the base thrusters too huh.
That’s actually good tech
Lmao, what comes around goes around. It was the reverse in armored core 4/FA you could do a extented blade lunge mid swing using any beam blade and accelerate faster using qb+blade swing and get to your targets faster.
Naraka players are about to have a bit more fun in AC, this is very cool!
Ive been doing this since the beginning, but i didnt realize they can chain together. Thats crazy
I DID LEARN SOMETHING THANK YOU ORO
You can also dash cancel the end lag of melee attacks as long as you don't finish the whole string
putting that gen 4 pedigree to work
I'm guessing you can do this without the Kikaku but there's not as much lunge?
Exactly
Yes and that also gives you a little less time to do the cancel, since the attack will happen sooner
Yeah you can but it's really not great without it-you'll have much less lunge
it reminds me Gundam versus's melee then dash to cancel animation attack
Honestly this whole game gives me Gundam vs vibes and I love it
i really wanna make a pistol and sword build outta this tech
Well, this changes things
hopefully this game turns into gunz the duel
Yay tech tutorials have arrived!
Maybe this tech will help me make my Guren cosplay remotely viable.
I tried taking advantage of this by having an unequipped hand and a pulse sword and using the offhand to dash...but it made my movement predictable...
Would love to see a viable all melee build
There's definetly a couple at least. Honestly just use the arms with the highest melee specialization, the kikaku booster, some beefy armor, and then get the weapon bay and weight reduction upgrades, start out with nothing in your right hand, anything in your left hand, and a pile bunker on your left shoulder. Then you can purge ur left hand weapon, and can switch between punching and using ur pile bunker with ur left hand. And u basically just punch the shit out of people to stun lock them and use the pile punker. It's really anoying but it works. So don't just use ur off hand to dash. Actually punch them. It has a ton of stagger build up
question: why did oro punch people 3 times in that other video? was it to charge up the chainsaw? (I need to rewatch that)
and can you simply stunlock people to death with punches if they're already ACS-overloaded? or is there a limit?
I must be missing something. I tried this and my AC covers approx. the same distance as without the melee cancel. I boosted until energy depletion , I had covered same distance in both ways
You can do this with letting go of charged weapons as well. It just doesnt do anything useful lol. You can float for a bit without using fuel I guess
Great video as always, thanks for the tips!
This is so weird i was messing about with a build today and i literally just came to the channel to recommend basho arms combined with kikaku booster for ridiculous melee harassment and damage, i put double zimmers on it too because obviously i did
awesome!
Yeah melee just got way more interesting lol
1 vs 1 Cowboy with this 😂
@Oroboro you do play with a controller right?
Do you have any suggestions about custom controls? I read a guy who mapped the jump to L3 and the boost to R3, thought it sounded interesting and got me thinking if there was an optimal configuration to play.
I actually play with default controls! They work just fine, especially if you're using hard lock often. A controller with extra buttons on the back can definitely help you get a small edge on your opponent (being able to quick boost and use the right stick at the same time to soft lock aim)
Ok I’m not trying to be argumentative I’m actually trying to start a conversation. What are the advantages to melee canceling over just assault boosting?
It's much faster-both in speed and during combat
Is it better to go for the melee range thrusters or one of the speed ones overall? not sure if the melee lunge range is worth it compared to a bit better stats overall
That's sort of the decision you have to make-none is strictly better than the other, but your melee cancels will be significantly less effective if you use anything other than the Kikaku.
Oroboro what controller settings do you use? I'm still trying to figure out which are the best for armored core
Default-works perfect for me 😁
@@Oroboro I’ll try it out then! Thank you, and I’ve been watching you since dark souls 1 pvp days, your content is still amazing as always 🙏🏼
all according to KIKAKU
So it's like Extreme VS.... 😂🤣👍
Uhhhhh sexy mechanic thanks!
that is so sick
Whats the item list
Oh sh!t. Kikaku gives u wave dash
mec goes hard
Does this still work in New patch? Was messing about today and couldn't do et...:(
It still works!
why rush down with this over assault boost?
It's much faster-both in speed and during combat
The problem with this tech is that it’s not really useful. Most melee weapons do not proc a “mini stun” (not a full stagger, but a short stun similar to what happens after you get kicked) which doesn’t allow any real combo opportunity. The opponent can escape it quite easily unless they are staggered. Not only that, but as fast as it may be, it actually leaves you super vulnerable compared to an assault boost and you would probably be wasting useful EN on pointless cancels. But take this with a grain of salt honestly cause this is coming from a relatively new player with 100 hrs and constant struggling in PvP
I don't usually fight lightweight builds(you know the deal, its bulky zimmers and missile boats), but even when I do, this tech allows you to outpace generally any AC. Its faster at closing gaps than an AB, and you can also melee dash cancel into AB if you need it. I'm sure you saw chained dashes in the vid but weapons with low start up anim(like default green pulse blade) can INSTANTLY cancel their melee dashes left and right which screws up aim tracking as I've noticed most ACs run mid range focused FCS parts, not the close range ones. And of course, you don't really melee to always guarantee a stun, it hits hard and does a lot of stagger damage. Many melee players I fight only use their melee weapons when they've built up their enemies' ACS stagger meter a little bit so one successful attack from their melee weapon will guarantee a stagger, and it doesn't even need to be a lot because as mentioned, the better melee weapons do massive stagger damage already
TLDR: This movement tech turns you into a really fast and agile AC even if you have a low speed build. it does have demanding EN costs and its not an insta-win strat, but it gives you so much mobility and gap closing potential and that consistently offers counterplay to the cons you mentioned
@@battousaix4263 I mean I’ll try to give it another chance. After all melee build is what I wanted to specialize in.
So the grid walkers also work for this all be it not with as much speed but they have the second highest melee thrust speed but if you want some more functionality for hit and run tactics because they’re vertical thrust are maxed out. So it makes it incredibly potent with missiles and swords if that’s your fancy. My favorite lately tho have been the stun guns and needle launchers.
My girlfriend is the one playing AC6 (AC1 was actually her first game) but I'm the one with much more soulsy experience so I helped her beat the sea spider last night and did this accidentally several times. Now that I know how to do it, I'm going to show her what I did so it'll be much easier for her.
omg
Try using it in a match though, its cool and you can zip around but auto lock zimmers win
nice job, you just armed missle spammers with something they can run away forever with Oro.
Nice job, you didn't watch the video
u can’t melee cancel away from opponents
@@Oroboro I did, actually, it's cancled by Qb in any dirrection before the animation is finished.
My problem is that you are able to do that while using the coral generator, which when depleted, takes 2 seconds before filling the energy bar 75% full instantly, which means you can melee dash cancle away forever, forcing any opponent who can do the same to do the same exact thing, so essentially it's the Favor and Protection ring glitch situation from dark souls 3.
@@Hong656 you technically can, it's called looking away from the opponent so you break lock-on easy to do in a 1v1, and slightly tricky in a 3v3, but not impossible. Just don't use auto lock. there is also that one OS upgrade that allows you to toggle manuel aim.
@@crescentwolf7072 So you melee boost toward them and then QB away from them? That...just seems like you went precisely nowhere or maybe are now a little closer to the opponent. Your overall displacement is melee distance - QB distance, and melee distance is probably larger.
can you cancel with assault armor instead of quickboost?