The Questionable Engineering of the 737 Max

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ธ.ค. 2024

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  • @RealEngineering
    @RealEngineering  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2893

    TH-cam has decided to limit this videos monetization because of "sensitive events". Bit ridiculous for an incident where no-one died. I can't afford to make videos if TH-cam does this kind of thing. More reasons to sign up to Nebula go.nebula.tv/realengineering

    • @feuby8480
      @feuby8480 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +166

      This is ridiculous. Totally. I'm not a conspirationist, but I have hard time believing that youtube would have do something like that for any other company if that wasn't an american one. I'm pretty sure they'd not do this onto videos covering any of the airbus problems.
      Even though I'm too lazy to check that. So please don't quote me on that.

    • @waldolemmer
      @waldolemmer 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +47

      You should appeal

    • @aut0turret
      @aut0turret 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      We don't believe for one second that one can't afford to make YT videos without YT ad revenue. Go get a real job. We don't NEED your videos, we don't NEED so damn many of them.

    • @wta1518
      @wta1518 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      let those seals go

    • @pan2aja
      @pan2aja 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +26

      Welcome to post Russo Ukraine "free press"

  • @chriscampbell3417
    @chriscampbell3417 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3910

    I worked as a QA inspector for 13 years at Boeing. I was one of the first laid off and I knew it was because I was very vocal about the lack of quality because of increased demand.
    I specifically said in a town hall meeting that “Planes will start dropping if we don’t stop sacrificing quality to increase production”. Later that day I was written up for that comment.
    When I heard of the layoffs I started to prepare because I knew I was going and sure enough on the first day I was called in given my severance and escorted out of the building.

    • @Praisethesunson
      @Praisethesunson 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Your capitalist overlords would appreciate your sacrifice if they cared about you at all

    • @zqxzqxzqx1
      @zqxzqxzqx1 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +515

      I'm sorry for your experience, and appreciate that you tried. Respect.

    • @lodiped
      @lodiped 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +204

      It's a horrible situation to raise this smugness card here but I gotta say: vindicated.

    • @thewhitefalcon8539
      @thewhitefalcon8539 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +424

      Hope you have a copy of that writeup and sent it to the FAA.

    • @c0ltz450
      @c0ltz450 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +146

      @@thewhitefalcon8539 yeah save that shit and give boeing what they deserve.

  • @ramonbalster502
    @ramonbalster502 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12796

    Multiple crashes is bad for reputation... But RE calling your engineering 'questionable' instead of 'insane' is brutal

    • @RalphEllis
      @RalphEllis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1301

      The bottom line is that the Max should never have been produced. It is an ancient dog of an aircraft, but it was pushed down the line because S.outhwest and R.yan wanted a cheap aircraft with lineal commonality with the 1967-certified B737. But in truth a 21st century aircraft should never have:
      a. Only one sensor controlling a safety system - because that is simply criminaI. Nobody except Boeing has had simplex systems in the last 70 years.
      b. A MCAS system that is able to stab-trim fully forwards - when it is known that the stab-trim is more powerful than the elevator. Thus the system has sufficient authority to overpower the pilot, and fly the aircraft into the ground. And if this authority was so easily reduced in the revised Max, then why was this not specified for the original Max? Were there occasional conditions where the system needed full trim authority (for a high-speed stall perhaps), and they are not telling us about it?
      c. A manual stab-trimmer that becomes mechanically locked if the pilots are pulling back on the control column - so that no manual re-trimming is possible. (The recommended roller-coaster recovery not being advisable at 2,000 ft, and never taught in the simulator.)
      d. An anti-stall device (MCAS) that operates on the stab-trimmer, rather than the control column. Look, dear Boeing, the design and mechanics of an anti-stall device are well-known, ever since the Bae Trident got into trouble. The solution is to push the control column forward, because once the nose is lowered and speed increases, the pressure can be released instantly.
      However, if you push forward on the stab-trim, you cannot easily pull out of the ensuing dive because you are still trimmed (fully) forward. (As several pilots have discovered, much to their dismay). So why did the FAA not recommend the complete scrapping of the MCAS system, and the installation of a stick-pusher? Cost? Time? Certification? Has the FAA skimped in their recommended MCAS fix?
      e. A master warning system that can be cancelled, so the warnings are extinguished and forgotten. Dimmed perhaps, but never extinguished. This must be the most stupid system ever invented for a commercial aircraft.
      f. Important warnings, like low engine oil pressure, that simply don’t appear on the master warning system. It does not take too much in the way of distractions or inattention to miss the fact that the engine is about to seize.
      g. Flight controls that cannot be separated if one side is jammed, because the two elevators are joined by a large torque tube. That would not be allowed on a modern aircraft.
      h. Engine overheat and fire warning lights that are not in the pilot’s line of sight, with no repeater lights on the thrust levers. Back in 1960 the handles and lights were on the coaming, where they should be, but they were relegated to the center console to make way for the MCP. That was a retrograde fix that should never have been allowed, at least not without repeater lights on the thrust levers. But what do the FAA care, as long as profits are still being made?
      i. Switches that are all identical, without even an attempt at colour coding. And the evidence for correct actioning is a light that goes bright and dim. Now between day and night, just what is bright and what is dim? Never in the history of aviation has there been such a stupid advisory/warning system.
      j. Switches which are all down for on - unless they are on the forward and center instrument panels, where they are up for on. Note that the all-important electric trim cutoff switches are down for off - the complete opposite to the majority of switches on a 737. There is so much room for confusion here, you could drive a semi-trailer through it.
      k. Paper checklists and emergency checklists. Now come on guys and gals, computer checklists were common back in the 80s, so why the hell are we still operating with bits of crumpled and torn paper?
      l. Mainwheels that retract into the hydraulics and flight-controls bay, where shredded tyres can inflict severe damage on a multitude of systems. Some airlines placed cages in the wheel-bay to protect the systems, but they did make routine maintenance difficult. And the hydraulic release fuses were hardly an adequate solution to a failed 1960s design.
      m. Center fuel pumps in the center tank, which can overheat and explode - and no auto-switching system was devised to prevent this. Has this been solved on the Max, because it was a butcher’s bin on the NG?
      n. Passenger doors that have to be armed by grovelling on the floor. This is rather like having a starter-handle on a modern car.
      o. Flight-deck windows that are smaller than an old-fashioned cruise-liner port-hole, because that was all they could make in 1950. Trouble is, we are in 2021 now.
      I could go on, but that is sufficient for now.
      See ‘Death Plane’ on the Russel Scott channel.
      I made these videos under the ‘Paul Spencer’ name, for employment reasons.
      These two videos have never been challenged.
      Ralph

    • @sublimedrone
      @sublimedrone 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +145

      Making it 'insane' could imply that it's either so great or extremely bad. Questionable directly implies that there's something wrong with it.

    • @huwzebediahthomas9193
      @huwzebediahthomas9193 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +69

      Them changing the centre of gravity by replacing the engines with new high bypass modern larger ones, and their flight control system fix for that, was utterly daft. Nuts. Etc..

    • @captainwin6333
      @captainwin6333 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +164

      @@RalphEllis American Airlines were about to buy the Airbus which had the high bypass engines so Boeing with the help of some high ranking politicians put pressure on AA to buy US made aircraft but they would only do so if they used high bypass engines. Rather than take the time and expense of designing a plane from scratch, Boeing took the cheap option all the way from rejigging an ancient design to taking shortcuts using software to mitigate the effect these bigger engines had on the old airframe design. Add to that the cutting of corners not requiring pilots to retrain or re-certification of aircraft along with getting rid of almost 1000 quality control staff, this was insanity from Boeing born out of greed.
      People should be in jail over a series of crashes and false statements of safety from Boeing executives to FAA hierarchy to politicians but it'll never happen.

    • @SandFl0h
      @SandFl0h 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +102

      @@RalphEllis I studied Aviation and the first thing we learned about aircraft certification was: No single points of failure for critical failure conditions.
      Having a system that nobody knows about and which may completely override pilot input depending on only 1!! sensor is the absolute opposite of that rule. I am still completely baffled how it was possible to even certify this.
      I know, the FAA 'outsources' certification work to engineers employed by Boing. I feel like this is ok, but if something happens, it is still the FAA's responsibility. Honestly, I think there should roll more heads...
      Why do we even have it if it is not held accountable for not doing its job?

  • @SteveGouldinSpain
    @SteveGouldinSpain 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1025

    I had dinner with an accountant years ago (yeah, my one night off..). It turned out to be one of the most gripping nights of my life. He worked for an airline. Companies like Boeing would issue frequent advisory maintenance fixes for each model of plane. His job was as an actuary, to calculate the cost of carrying out the fix for the fleet, against the possible cost should an accident occur as a result of not applying the fix. It was quite complex because time is a factor - how much downtime would there be etc, and which routes would be least or worst affected. Anyway the guy had us on the edges of our seats all night as he regaled us with stories of seats falling out of the backs of aeroplanes and engines catching fire. It was quite a night. My takeaway is that airlines have the value of our lives worked out to the nearest penny in an Excel spreadsheet.

    • @randyandtheretreads3144
      @randyandtheretreads3144 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +110

      They did that with the Ford Pinto, would cost $15 per car to fix it so Ford chose not to, knowing people would be burned alive. GM had similar car situations. Did not know that the airlines had these type of cost accountants on staff.

    • @seemlesslies
      @seemlesslies 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +118

      ​@@randyandtheretreads3144"A new car built by my company leaves somewhere traveling at 60 mph. The rear differential locks up. The car crashes and burns with everyone trapped inside. Now, should we initiate a recall? Take the number of vehicles in the field, A, multiply by the probable rate of failure, B, multiply by the average out-of-court settlement, C. A times B times C equals X. If X is less than the cost of a recall, we don't do one."
      One of my favorite quotes from Fight Club.
      People do not understand they are just a dollar sign to corporations.
      The world has no soul anymore. Mindless profits are destroying us because there is no moral foundation in which to actually maintain and uphold value and fair play.

    • @FuncleChuck
      @FuncleChuck 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +44

      Won’t anyone think of the shareholders?

    • @rnayabed
      @rnayabed 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@seemlesslies the world never had any soul. we thinking of "good old days" is just massive copium. it was far harder to get access to information before. if this was in 1960 you would not even know about this as most media was controlled by few giants. now its still the same but a small part of the population can still talk and still share information freely, ones who are tech literate enough.

    • @StormTheSquid
      @StormTheSquid 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +66

      ​@@seemlessliesI've been saying this for years and generally people agree. But then I point out that this is literally how capitalism is designed to work and suddenly *I'm* the bad one and not the soulless corporations calculating the value of human life down to a fraction of a cent.

  • @jeffsprague96
    @jeffsprague96 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1834

    I work in nuclear power, and what's crazy is my industry derived a lot of its safety culture, corrective action programs, issue identification & resolution policies, and regulatory oversight management from the aviation industry, but they've loosened the reigns while we've stayed the course. The new push for 'innovate fast and get it to market' is a dumb way to run a business with this much at stake, and we've been seeing more and more examples of that recently

    • @Loanshark753
      @Loanshark753 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +20

      I agree, speed, bad quality assurance and innovation should not compromise safety. To me it seems that aviation is inherently so dangerous that serious steps have been taken to make it safe too the point becoming the safest way of travel. This has also happened with nuclear energy however it seems that ALARA is not the best safety target as radiation hormesis might be the actual mechanism for repair of damage by ionizing radiation. If this is true the radiation limits should be raised and the safety will still be the same. The other issue is how to deliver the maximum safety as it requires a certain ability to actually build which the us nuclear industry is lacking. Either way it is important to always think of safety first and not third.

    • @cancan-wq9un
      @cancan-wq9un 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      And this is the reason why nuclear power is never completely safe, especially if it gets too common. People will loosen up, and no amount of tech can save you as long as humans are around.

    • @beagle7622
      @beagle7622 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      @@cancan-wq9un Excellent comment. I don’t know what the solution is . Maybe Boeing should rip a finished aeroplane out of pre delivery & tear it apart piece by piece & see what other issues are hiding . If I travel in Australia it’s going to be on an 800 NG. Unless I want my knees up around my chin in an A320.

    • @MikeGrotting-ot4hd
      @MikeGrotting-ot4hd 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Bye bye
      B ad
      O ver
      E ngineering
      I nitiates
      N essasary
      G roundings

    • @polla2256
      @polla2256 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

      ​@@cancan-wq9un you clearly aren't an engineer.

  • @jenweatherwax7113
    @jenweatherwax7113 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2673

    Used to work at Boeing. It’s all penny pinching management. Mechanics concerns are ignored and we’re worked to the bone to go faster so they can lay us off faster. Also, production was spread out far and wide to save money and caused quality to go to hell - the story of all companies, but terrifying when it happens to airplanes.

    • @Killerpixel11
      @Killerpixel11 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +235

      Production being spread is no issue when done right. See Airbus, they're made all over Europe and assembled in France.
      This is just the US' turbo-capitalism at work.

    • @willpugh8865
      @willpugh8865 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +83

      For a company that does such important things and has 18 billion in annual revenue it should be illegal for that type of behaviour to exist

    • @lyndamonchak4072
      @lyndamonchak4072 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      Oh my God! Unfortunately qualify control is being ignored in favor of insane profits!

    • @abdc2990
      @abdc2990 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@willpugh8865 You can thank Dodge v. Ford Motors co. For that.
      That's the lawsuit that in 1919 established that for companies, the interests of the shareholders came first, yes, before even that of the people, country (let alone employees lol).
      US companies have a legal duty to fuck everyone over if it increases quarterly profits.

    • @PjPjPaul
      @PjPjPaul 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      All companies devolve to this due to capitalism in it's current form. Which I would argue, isn't capitalism at all. Hardworking engineers and technicians build a brand up through dedication and hard work. Businessmen move into to milk the company dry of all reputation by riding on the reputation of the past. All companies do this because the people that do it are massively reward with unfathomable amounts of money. They don't care that they are killing an American icon. These people are domestic economic series killers.

  • @stellargravitywell1828
    @stellargravitywell1828 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1641

    8:11 I was slightly hopeful you were going to say "$62 million fine". The fact that man got off with that kind of money in his pocket after 300+ killed is nothing short of infuriating.

    • @Jonathan_Doe_
      @Jonathan_Doe_ 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +166

      Company I used to work for had an apprentice die (pretty gruesome way)… They got fined £1 million, and order to pay the family £1 million. Which sounds decent, until you realise it’s only 2% of their annual net profits. So, £62 million for that many deaths is piss poor.

    • @robf228
      @robf228 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

      Previous executives are mostly to blame.

    • @voxelfusion9894
      @voxelfusion9894 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +95

      It's hush money so he doesn't tell regulators about all the other corners they were cutting.

    • @Bird_Dog00
      @Bird_Dog00 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +118

      That's management-culture for you. It is self-serving to the nines.
      Managers often try to justify their ridiculously high saleries by claiming that they "bear all the responsibility".
      But cases like that simply act to prove the obvious lie: If you suffer no negative consequences if things go wrong on your watch, then you DON'T bear the responsibility.

    • @TheRip72
      @TheRip72 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +78

      @@Jonathan_Doe_ I think you mis-understood. The $62m was what they paid their CEO when they fired him.

  • @mikoaj1321
    @mikoaj1321 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +658

    I think the fact that a Boeing not only didn't punish the executive responsible for bad management decisions but gave him a multimillion parting bonus says everything there is to be said about this company.

    • @prone1548
      @prone1548 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +30

      They are contractually bound to pay him the severance.

    • @Sataka23clips
      @Sataka23clips 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +38

      All companies do this now. Look at 2008 economic crash. All CEOs got bonuses to fix housing market😂

    • @satunnainenkatselija4478
      @satunnainenkatselija4478 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Bad management has never been a crime.

    • @Tankrat6
      @Tankrat6 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      I'm no exec, just a wrench turner in my company, but if I'm fired for cause they have to pay severance per the contract they wrote. In the country I work, companies are responsible to pay the bank loans of the fired person for which they can use the severance to pay for.

    • @frankgrabasse4642
      @frankgrabasse4642 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      In America you punish the little guy and reaard the fat cat.
      Elect me, I will jail the bigshots to keep them In line.

  • @elliottre5019
    @elliottre5019 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1218

    I worked over thirty years in Maintenace. Most inspection routes were just signed off and never completed because management told us not to worry about doing routes. Just sign them off as completed. The more routes signed off as completed, the larger the management's bonus. Grunts didn't get bonuses. When people would ask why I was doing the routes, I would tell that if we were an airline our planes would be falling out of the skies. It was a good thing we were a processing center. I have talked to airline mechanics over the years, and they have had similar stories. I don't fly anymore. Maintenace problems are usually traced back to bad management.

    • @Triple_J.1
      @Triple_J.1 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Managers are almost by default incompetent.

    • @ooberholzer
      @ooberholzer 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Geneva Airport Maintenance guys said the very same thing... Same goes with trains of the national company here... These people are criminals... Probably part of the natural 2% of psychopath ratio in the population. I personally saw 500'000 CHF of citizen taxes be stolen by the army with just two signatures, one was mine, on fake helicopter instruments change reports that actually never happend in reality... We were forced to sign by "some manager". This is all a great world we get from the past generation, so lovely to exist on this planet in 2024...

    • @_PatrickO
      @_PatrickO 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +83

      The video sladerously called out Muilenburg as the CEO for boeing during this. The CEO of boeing from 2005 to 2015 was a business moron named James McNerney. This guy outsourced everything at boeing. Spirit aerosystems was spun off as a separate company the first year he was CEO.
      The video completely ruined itself by not calling out the guy who did this to boeing. It took 10 years to screw boeing up. Muilenburg was used as a fall guy and then replaced by another crappy businessman. The current CEO is the one cutting inspectors.
      James McNerney stepped down as CEO 7 months before the first test flight of the 737 max. He knew it was crap and ran just before it started flying.

    • @senselessinductor7921
      @senselessinductor7921 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@_PatrickO I'm glad somebody said it...
      It felt as dumb as apologetics.
      The neoliberal era of neoclassical economics made these business types, and they are ruining the world. And possibly killing any future for the human race. (It was afterall the neoclassical economists who were the ones doing the most egregious climate denialism in the 90's. That all the politicians then listened to as experts. The same economics that gets low level taught to these business morons)

    • @Erevos85
      @Erevos85 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +45

      @@_PatrickO if McNerney knew it was crap and ran just before it started flying, then Muilenburg let it fly while knowing it was crap.

  • @kaliss7192
    @kaliss7192 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1645

    People trying to fix an engineering issue with software is basically the new standard in every industry.

    • @mariuszmoraw3571
      @mariuszmoraw3571 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +100

      ☝️
      This. I got enough of this.
      Like there's physical fault, FIX IT. And it isn't just matter of "removing" error code.

    • @DWS-123
      @DWS-123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

      When a physical device sometimes response with error when software requests call to it, the fix is very easy by updating the software into the way that will just retry request indefinitely until the device response with success signal. Now problem fixed.😋😋😋

    • @softwarerevolutions
      @softwarerevolutions 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      I just commented the same thing...lol

    • @awwtergirl7040
      @awwtergirl7040 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

      Silicon Valley disease.

    • @nilmerg
      @nilmerg 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      ​@@awwtergirl7040 this is a wall street problem

  • @Brownyman
    @Brownyman 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +77

    "The Questionable Death of John Barnett"

    • @AdmiralBison
      @AdmiralBison 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      He was a threat to the shareholders.

  • @michaelgoetze2103
    @michaelgoetze2103 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5707

    I think Boeing has more of a management problem that an engineering problem.

    • @marcm.
      @marcm. 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +383

      Absolutely. It was obvious this was the case the moment they decided to move their headquarters away from the production facilities. The whole culture involved in making that type of decision was an indicator of systemic issue with how they're handling their business

    • @3nertia
      @3nertia 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +163

      Nah, this is just another symptom of the capitalism problem heh

    • @AviatorFox
      @AviatorFox 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +33

      Oh you have no idea. It's so bad.

    • @TheDivino21
      @TheDivino21 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +84

      DEI is the Definitive Culprit

    • @TrungNguyen-uf8cv
      @TrungNguyen-uf8cv 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Why DEI when it comes to terrible, greedy and penny pinching top down management?​@@TomikCsvk

  • @teahousezenmaster
    @teahousezenmaster 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +833

    My dad worked for boeing (as an EE) until he retired 6ish years ago. He worked on the 787, and your video literally brought back memories of my childhood as it was loosely linked to that project. I also worked a short stint at boeing as a computer engineer. And that was the most miserable experience of my professional career. That entire company is completely mismanaged from the top down. When I told him this, he was like, "yeah that company has really changed".

    • @RENO_K
      @RENO_K 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +65

      😂😂 yk it's shit when the Computer Engineers complain

    • @JonMartinYXD
      @JonMartinYXD 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

      When McDonnell Douglas bought Boeing with Boeing's money. Even after that, I wonder how many of Boeing's issues could have been avoided by not moving their corporate headquarters to Chicago. It is all fine and good to have senior executives with engineering backgrounds, but when they become isolated away from the factory floor they are just suits.

    • @Blex_040
      @Blex_040 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      As a Software Engineer (altough nowadays working as a Site Reliability Engineer) I'm curious if your job title really was Computer Engineer or if you just simplified a usually complicated IT job title for the sake of a YT comment and if so, what you were working on? I would assume some kind of embedded software development and circuit board planning?

    • @Toobzilla
      @Toobzilla 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      it seems more to me like an integrity/workmanship issue.. if a door plug cracks under pressure because the wall thickness of the plug is insufficient, or the door plug guide pin lock-out bolts shear because their diameter is questionable etc, those would be engineering's cross to bear. by loading pitch angle correction (MCAS) program into the airplane & being deceitful about it or leaving structure/safety integral hardware in all sorts of places loose, etc has NOTHING to do with engineers. engineers dont assemble airplanes.

    • @oliveiraluis3540
      @oliveiraluis3540 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Dam, got my curiosity. Why is it mismanaged? Is it that people there dont care about what theyr doing? Is it woke or both? What is it?

  • @jacob_90s
    @jacob_90s 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +727

    Boeing's managements needs to remember that they're not selling transportation; they're selling SAFE transportation.
    Air planes fall into the same category as elevators, in that people like the idea but are terrified of it in practice, and the only way it has found wide spread acceptance is by being so damn safe that people just had to get over their fears, but the backlash from this does have the possibility of affecting the entire airline industry.

    • @_PatrickO
      @_PatrickO 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +43

      They cannot hear you over the sound of their money.

    • @ralphmarx7554
      @ralphmarx7554 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      You mean McDonnel Douglas?

    • @segue2ant395
      @segue2ant395 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      If the market works the way it's supposed to, this means fewer flights taking off, airlines taking less profit, and eventually lower fees to try and lure people back. Win-win, really.

    • @thomaschui2141
      @thomaschui2141 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      ​@@_PatrickOmore like over the sound of inclusion and diversity

    • @j.f.fisher5318
      @j.f.fisher5318 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      ​@@ralphmarx7554 the problem is a transition in eras. Before confiscatory double-taxation of corporate profits forced companies to invest in long term growth while effective regulation ensured maintenance of basic quality standards. Now deregulation and self-regulation are all too common while greed-is-good is the rule unleashed by tax cuts on corporations and the top income of the wealthy, so companies have to strip mine their operations for every bit of profit they can or corporate raiders will buy them out and break them up.

  • @loso9043
    @loso9043 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +52

    lives are risked so a small group of people can just have bigger yachts, more expensive cars & vacation homes. all of these issues are symptoms of greed.

    • @125brat
      @125brat 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      When you get our country's leaders announcing on national TV that "Greed is good", what do you expect? The world is run by bean-counters who work for big businesses and they know the price of everything but the value of nothing!

    • @loso9043
      @loso9043 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@125brat well said. can’t say 1 should expect anything different from corporations other than cutting corners, cheating the system & being greedy. end of the day, they need to turn a profit to the shareholders as well as bonuses for themselves.

  • @Livlifetaistdeth
    @Livlifetaistdeth 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +822

    My wife grew up in Seattle during a time when everyone who lived there took pride in their city and Boeing...those days are long gone.

    • @mastershooter64
      @mastershooter64 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +50

      I wish I had a wife

    • @MattyEngland
      @MattyEngland 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Now they take pride in perversion.

    • @ethanwagner
      @ethanwagner 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +24

      Costco is more fun to root for tbh

    • @fnoigy
      @fnoigy 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      Yay unregulated big business! The free market definitely works!!

    • @teslatech2143
      @teslatech2143 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      That's kinda how the rest of the USA seems to be heading, Detroit and the auto industry is the same story

  • @BottleOfCoke
    @BottleOfCoke 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1129

    I used to be a flight attendant. I heard a story from a flight mechanic:
    They noticed a gap where there wasn't supposed to be a gap between the wing and the wing-box (where the wing is attached to the fuselage). On inspection, they found an assembly tool, stuck between the wing and the body.
    That airline is now in the process of switching from Boeing to Airbus.

    • @mikoto7693
      @mikoto7693 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +227

      Then you’d love to hear the other dubious things found in Boeing aircraft like that. Besides tales like that-tools wedged between the fuselage and the panels, there have been reports of rags in the fuel tanks. Rags that could end up clogging the fuel intakes to the engines… But my personal favourite is how a flight mechanic once found an entire stepladder and lighting in the tail section of a flying, in-service 787.

    • @BottleOfCoke
      @BottleOfCoke 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +59

      ​@@mikoto7693Not surprised, and that is the scary part.

    • @nhall00195
      @nhall00195 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      Fake story…

    • @donadams8345
      @donadams8345 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +103

      @@nhall00195No, you're the fake. Anything man produces, man will foul up. I once had a 70 year old musical instrument. The case for it was worn out. The case rattled though so I took it apart. I found a case production tool sealed inside it that had been there all those years.

    • @vitsalava1251
      @vitsalava1251 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +38

      ​@@nhall00195Completely possible though, especially with the pressure on on time delivery.

  • @hedgeearthridge6807
    @hedgeearthridge6807 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +501

    Dr. W. Edwards Deming, "The Father of Quality", wrote extensively about how you can't buy quality with fancy technology; it helps, but quality is always ultimately made in the board room. Top management bears the ultimate responsibility, nobody under them can do quality work if their choices are being overridden or if they're not getting any support. Bank crashes aren't caused by tellers giving people the wrong change, they're caused by the choices of top management. Top management wants to only receive credit for things going right, blame everyone under them when something goes wrong, and have no accountability or consequences for any of their greedy and shortsighted decisions. It's immaturity of the highest order; "I want power without leadership, authority without responsibility, to not serve but be served."

    • @ivveG
      @ivveG 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      PREACH! This should be higher up!

    • @skierpage
      @skierpage 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Jail time!!

    • @BrianHoff04
      @BrianHoff04 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      I too, am a giant Deming fan. He basically wrote two books that describe how bad our business models have become & what they should actually look like. Very few companies know of Deming. It is sad to watch the world almost ignore his genius. Boeing (and many, many others) are trapped by the shareholders demanding instant gratification for their short term gain without a commitment to long term quality.

    • @VoidHalo
      @VoidHalo 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      You can say things like this all you want. The simple fact is, they don't even understand what quality is in the first place. So, you're just talking gobbldiguk to them.

    • @kaitlyn__L
      @kaitlyn__L 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Hear hear

  • @millenniumf1138
    @millenniumf1138 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +52

    As someone living in Wichita and working on aircraft cables for Spirit, its usually their management responsible for cost saving corner cutting. They demand we work with older, photocopied form boards (the blueprints for the cable, essentially) until we pressure them for months to send us vector graphic form boards, and these old photocopies are honestly some of the hardest documents I've ever had to interpret with fuzzy text and illegible dimensions. In addition, they give us documentation that you can't easily decipher without help when other companies, like Sundstrand, are capable of giving us easily discernable documentation. Its a miracle anything gets built to any kind of spec at my job with what they give us.

    • @kafka9627
      @kafka9627 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Daaamn

  • @Gazmar10
    @Gazmar10 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +648

    As a Boeing employee who got laid off too, you did a FANTASTIC job with this video! I know alot about those details.
    I took great pride in the work I did, but it's sad to see these events happen. I hope this issue at hand can be resolved.

    • @ReflectedMiles
      @ReflectedMiles 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Funny how everyone who works there at McDonnell Douglas says that.

    • @CaesarBro
      @CaesarBro 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Spill the beans! Give us all the juicy details of all the shortcuts.

    • @mister_snoogles9031
      @mister_snoogles9031 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Pretty sure man has an NDA in place 😅

    • @Gazmar10
      @Gazmar10 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      @@mister_snoogles9031 Nope. I wasn't even compensated. Yall always assume the worst. Its Commercial aircraft too, not defense.

    • @lol8463
      @lol8463 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      boeing is dead

  • @ZxZ239
    @ZxZ239 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +286

    I like Boeing planes, when I buy a window seats, there is a chance I can get free upgrade Balcony seats with a much better view.

    • @ankittripathi4385
      @ankittripathi4385 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +32

      or one free skydiving if you are not strapped, choice is yours boeing provides all the option

    • @playerzking
      @playerzking 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      free reincarnation into anime world

    • @Already100
      @Already100 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      At least you get fresh air😂

    • @nautilusshell4969
      @nautilusshell4969 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I love the SVF (Spontaneous Ventilation Facility) too.....

  • @kiga10di
    @kiga10di 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +292

    Former Boeing employee - worked 8 years as an engineer in BDS from 2014-2022.
    You make excellent points and explanations, but the one thing that I strongly disagree with was that the 737 Max program issues had anything to do with Dennis Muilenburg.
    When Muilenburg took over as CEO, he pushed for changes in quality and safety which, had they been adopted decades ago, would have avoided these fiascos.
    He was not CEO during a majority of the development of the 737 Max. He was handed this flaming pile of garbage, by the previous CEO James McNerney, who the 737 Max program was developed under. Muilenberg did his best to clean it up, but the damage was already long done and shareholders wanted to see someone fall to take the blame.
    My personal theory is that James McNerney knew about all this, and intentionally left before disaster struck.
    Side note, I can also confirm most of the comments about poor management, ridiculous bureaucracy, and focus on schedule over safety that happens there.

    • @Draichnyr
      @Draichnyr 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      You are spot on, sir.

    • @MrTweetyhack
      @MrTweetyhack 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Doesn't matter. Dennis took the reigns, he should have identified and fix the problems before killing hundreds of people.

    • @777XGang
      @777XGang 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      @@MrTweetyhack I don’t think you understand how development and engineering works. A single man can’t cause or fix every problem that exists, and unfortunately some problems will always make their way through. These projects were being run poorly before he ever got there.
      He was making much needed changes, unfortunately they came too late. You make it sound like he knew there would be crashes, but didn’t care enough to put in the effort to prevent them.

    • @mikaeljensen4399
      @mikaeljensen4399 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@777XGangYou are either saying he didn't know about the issues, but it was his responsibility to know. Or you are saying he knew but was unable to fix them, in which case he should have scrapped the design. Either way, he carries a lot of the responsibility for the deaths.

    • @777XGang
      @777XGang 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@mikaeljensen4399 It just isn’t that simple. These issues often come with a lack of communication and transparency, among other things. I understand it’s his job to know, but no one person can know about everything, especially when issues are numerous and people aren’t being honest about the work they’re doing.
      I get that people want someone to blame, but you have to actually blame the right people in order to solve the problems. Are there things he could have done better? Yes, but he inherited a huge mess of issues. By the time he was in a position to make positive changes, the seeds of disaster had already been sewn.
      I say it all the time: if you aren’t involved in the industry, you just won’t get it.

  • @aliabdallah102
    @aliabdallah102 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    Next video: the insane engineering of Boeing whistleblowrs' deaths

    • @aliabdallah102
      @aliabdallah102 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I'm sorry, I don't mean to make light of a good man falling.

  • @robertb6889
    @robertb6889 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +382

    Having read through the emails leaked about the crash issue, the corporate response to quality and safety issues is terrible. It's all about "how do we convince regulators it's okay to minimize costs" rather than actually addressing the root issues. The door thing is a symptom of underlying quality control issues, and just because those were inspected doesn't mean they won't have more major problems that have gone unnoticed.

    • @Praisethesunson
      @Praisethesunson 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +37

      Yeah but think of the short term bonuses for those execs if they cared about something as trivial as functioning planes. The bonus might be lower. Can't have that. Sure some of the filthy rabble will be hurt and inconvenienced. But that's a price worth paying.

    • @robertb6889
      @robertb6889 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

      @@Praisethesunson - yup, rotten-to-the-core corporate culture with executives more concerned about short-term cost savings than "not killing people."

    • @Thicc_Boyo
      @Thicc_Boyo 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      That's what happens when sociopaths run society.

    • @paniclogic5109
      @paniclogic5109 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Profit over peoples lives.

  • @VTdarkangel
    @VTdarkangel 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +350

    What happened is McDonnell-Douglas bought Boeing with Boeing's own money. Everything that's happening now is very similar to what happened to MD before they merged with Boeing. Prior to the merger, Boeing's company culture was one of engineering first. After the merger, when MD executives got into the company, it became overly cost conscious to the point of taking shortcuts in engineering.

    • @janmelantu7490
      @janmelantu7490 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +61

      The McDonnell-Douglas-Boeing merger and its ramifications have been disastrous for humanity

    • @markfryer9880
      @markfryer9880 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +50

      That explains how the MD execs ended up in charge of Boeing! How they managed to use Boeing's own money to buy MD and then end up in charge is quite a little feat and is a modern wonder. Not necessarily a good wonder mind you.

    • @enigmaticcruz2483
      @enigmaticcruz2483 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +47

      Boeing should have never allowed MD's managers and senior engineers to infiltrate the newly merged company. Boeing should have just cut all of them a check and let them go. MD ruined Boeing.

    • @erics7219
      @erics7219 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      underrated comment!

    • @tonyhawk123
      @tonyhawk123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Capitalism is great, up to a point. Then it turns into a dystopian cesspit of greed. McDonnell Douglas crossed that threshold and infected Boeing. It's a pity because Boeing was once a pride of USA. Sucking the life out of a company to line the pockets of executives is also in effect elsewhere at Boeing and its why SpaceX is making great strides while Boeing has little to show, other than lobbyists funnelling money from NASA.

  • @HEDGE1011
    @HEDGE1011 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Thank you for this report on the 737 Max. As more is learned it will interesting to see what is uncovered.
    I’m annoyed that your monetization was impacted for such a dubious reason, hence the donation.
    Have a great day.

  • @hashtagPoundsign
    @hashtagPoundsign 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2018

    An overly simplistic explanation: This is what happens when Boeing is in charge of inspection oversight of Boeing.

    • @commiebobo
      @commiebobo 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      tHe FrEe MaRkEt Is SeLf-ReGuLaTiNg

    • @motan7864
      @motan7864 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      ask Nikki Haley about it

    • @tonyhawk123
      @tonyhawk123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +45

      I know Boeing lobbied to regulate themselves. After previous catastrophes at Boeing I'd assumed executives were told to get their act together though.

    • @nathan1sixteen
      @nathan1sixteen 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      It’s not just Boeing that has that “advantage”, though.

    • @789know
      @789know 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

      That's "free market" "Beacon of democracy" and "fairness" for u

  • @tangydiesel1886
    @tangydiesel1886 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +394

    I have a family member who started work with Boeing as an inspector before the MD merger and just recently retired from Spirit. They talked about right at the MD merger, they cut inspection staff in half, and it was always continually be reduced right until they retired. Upper management would always push for stuff to go out the door with nothing more than a quick once over and a rubber stamp. If you held things up for inspection or correction, you weren't treated very well. On occasion, stuff was even sent out between shift changes before eyes could get on it. Near the end of their career, they were letting inspectors go just to bring them back as "independent contractors." At first they thought they were trying to get by the union or save some tax money, but later figured they just wanted to pass the blame if things went wrong.

    • @doujinflip
      @doujinflip 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +43

      "Independent contractor" is the corporate tactic to separate themselves from liability. Every gig economy "own boss" knows this.

    • @antoy384
      @antoy384 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      You crack me up: “Upper management would always push for stuff to go out the door” THERE’S YOUR PROBLEM.
      I’m crying of laughter. I thought you made the joke on purpose when passengers went literally out of the door in flight, but it doesn’t look like. You still added “Stuff was even sent out between…” hahaha man stop it.

    • @orangejjay
      @orangejjay 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      ​@@doujinflipWhat grinds my gears is how well companies in California were able to manipulate people into voting against themselves and basically creating a new law to weasel their way around being the slightest sense of a decent employer.
      What's worse is that despite their knowingly and open shady practices, few care enough to not give them their money or access to their data.

    • @xcofcd
      @xcofcd 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      ​@@doujinflipI wonder if they split off Spirit AeroSystems because of this, too. They have control over the company, but if things go wrong, you can blame them first...the independent contractors is another layer isolating Boeing further from trouble...

    • @AgriVideos1
      @AgriVideos1 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      The Max is the DC10 repeating itself in every single regard.

  • @corymorrison4488
    @corymorrison4488 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +625

    Worked with a guy a few years ago that quit Boeing. He gave notice and told multiple managers, then did an exit interview. Then 3 months later he got a call asking him why he didn’t meet his production quotas. Not sure if this has happened before or since, that was late 2019…

    • @danieldjz
      @danieldjz 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Hly sht

    • @Shadowboost
      @Shadowboost 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      looool

    • @MonkeyJedi99
      @MonkeyJedi99 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +45

      At this point, I would be hesitant to sit in a lawn chair built by Boeing.

    • @davidrenton
      @davidrenton 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +29

      i bet they did'nt forgot to stop paying him

    • @the_undead
      @the_undead 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Seeing how bad the management is at that company, it wouldn't surprise me if this was not the first or the last incident

  • @stephengrimmer35
    @stephengrimmer35 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

    the problem is actually trying to cram 230 people into a 59 year old design for 124 people, the 737-100 which used a section of 707 fuselage (vintage 1954).
    Boeing, cutting corners for 70 years.

    • @bosstowndynamics5488
      @bosstowndynamics5488 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Not really, all of the deaths due to MAX incidents so far were caused by a multitude of design, implementation and training issues around MCAS, a shortcut to skip type certification for existing 737 NG pilots (which does relate to the age of the 737 but *not* to changes in passenger capacity), and the door plug incident and engine overheating issues would both be equally applicable even if it were a clean slate design.

  • @phlix1
    @phlix1 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +934

    This goes down in history as the best iPhone drop test so far!

    • @CollectionLearning.
      @CollectionLearning. 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

      Or the case of the iphone drop test😅

    • @trailfork7815
      @trailfork7815 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +40

      @@CollectionLearning. pretty sure 90% of the impact was absorbed by the case

    • @texr4
      @texr4 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +28

      @@CollectionLearning. They mostly all fell in grass so eh

    • @Danda_vibes
      @Danda_vibes 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +32

      MAX DROP TEST

    • @chiagozienjoku7198
      @chiagozienjoku7198 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      😂😂😂😂 bruh

  • @shotelco
    @shotelco 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +369

    My ex wife just retired from Boeing after 42 years. She Originally was an engineer with McDonnell Douglas, and was "merged" into Boeing during what she termed "the reverse acquisition" (Where MD capital management wound up controlling Boeing). Her experience was that Boeing _Was_ an Engineering-First driven company, and MD was always a Profit-First company. Some remember that the MD DC-10 had been involved in 55 accidents and incidents, including *32 hull-loss accidents,* with 1,261 occupant fatalities. All because of the MD management culture of shareholder value, which they brought into Boeing.

    • @mikoto7693
      @mikoto7693 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +26

      Then the saying that McDonnell bought Boeing with Boeing’s own money is true.

    • @blendpinexus1416
      @blendpinexus1416 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      damn, well now i know what happened to the wonderful boeing we all remember.

    • @DisposableSupervillainHenchman
      @DisposableSupervillainHenchman 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

      @@cuda010 He said nothing of the sort, so don’t put words in his mouth. Also,don’t pay lip service to poor company management.

    • @Praisethesunson
      @Praisethesunson 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      @@mikoto7693 That's called a leveraged buyout and it's how every major corporate merger has happened this century

    • @PaulGuy
      @PaulGuy 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@cuda010 Keep lickin' that boot. ​

  • @albal156
    @albal156 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1036

    Im gonna propose a new law/theory.
    Anytime a company subcontracts out anything the chance of something going wrong doubles.
    It would be called Boeings Law.

    • @TheHeroBeats
      @TheHeroBeats 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +88

      I actually work on the 737 line, and you're correct, and works in an extended way as well, since our suppliers (The sub contracted companies making our parts) have also started subcontracting, and one of those sub-sub-contractors messed up something on the plane so badly that we were only able to build maybe 5-6 planes in month, compared to producing 2 a day.

    • @cefb8923
      @cefb8923 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      Airbus (and everyone else) does the same thing from what I understand.

    • @wta1518
      @wta1518 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +63

      @@cefb8923 Yeah, but Airbus has this weird thing called "basic competence".

    • @arthurmoore9488
      @arthurmoore9488 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@Liberty2358 On the other hand, Boeing spun off their fuselage manufacturing division to a separate company. That's who provides the 737 Max fuselages.

    • @TheHeroBeats
      @TheHeroBeats 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Liberty2358 Well that particular mistake still haunts us here at the factory, a lot of the problems stem from the parts we get from spirit, misdrilled holes, upside down brackets, missing rivets, things being installed a little bit off of where they are supposed to be located.
      Then when we go to assemble the plane issues crop up from these things, some of which aren't noticed until a ton of work is already done, then there's alot of responsibility juggling, pressure from management to just "Get it done".
      Management will then take these issues and push the plane down the line and some of these problems get buried under even more components, causing workers to disassemble an entire plane to fix (and I shit you not) a single bolt that was 1/4" too long and was riding on the flight control cables, that was known about, and even documented (which is why they knew to go fix it).
      Of course some of it is the mechanics fault, since Boeings training course only includes a 3-4 week period of poorly delivered training before being expected to actively work on these planes, which leads to alot of mistakes until more senior mechanics can train them, but there's less senior mechanics, and not given time to really train the newer mechanics.
      Sorry that got abit long,
      TL;DR Spirit messes things up, then it butterflys into a huge mess at Boeing that Management pushes under the rug, while undertrained and overworked mechanics are running all over to put out fires.

  • @no_step_on_snek9796
    @no_step_on_snek9796 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +51

    I work in automotive as an engineer for drivetrain systems dealing with new product launches and established drivetrain systems. This problem is not specific to Boeing or Aerospace. Over the past 3 years there has been massive layoffs of support functions like Quality, Engineering, and even Maintenance in my facility. Everyone has 3 jobs, and many have quit because of it. Theres a huge push to get critical parts as cheap as possible, and nothing gets done to improve the design or integrity of the parts without a cost savings. It all started with the financial and logistical turmoil during 2020 and 2021, and has just continued afterwards.

    • @SaraMorgan-ym6ue
      @SaraMorgan-ym6ue 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      hmm lack of proper training sounds like improperly installed not good not good at all.

    • @codyrap95
      @codyrap95 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      It's the same in software. I am a dev and they fired all test engineers and now they only rely on us to write automated tests. Needless to say we had a lot of PROD incidents due to "edge cases" which at this point mean everything besides the basic success cases.

    • @mkhspartan1936
      @mkhspartan1936 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@codyrap95 Tell me about it lol, I work in QA and the amount of corners management expect cut or put on devs by not having enough QA and say "it'll be fine" is just silly

    • @davidr.wilson8194
      @davidr.wilson8194 9 หลายเดือนก่อน

      That must be why Windows Updates sucks anymore and causes more problems that good. When Satya Nadella took over they laid off all the people that knew what they were doing,hired cheap foreigners and we get a less stellar product. I’ve had to do about a dozen system restores in the past three years to fix problems caused by Windows Updates. Never happened under Bill Gates,updates used to be exciting and beneficial.

  • @buttersPbutters
    @buttersPbutters 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +343

    The engineering of the door plug on the 737 MAX 9 is exactly the same as the door plug on the 737-900ER. Unlike the MCAS fiasco, in this case, the problem isn't about engineering, it's about manufacturing and quality assurance going downhill. United and Delta have found 737-900ERs with loose door plug fasteners now, too. These quality lapses have been mounting for some time, before the MAX, and it's finally resulted in a high-profile incident.

    • @JimBronson
      @JimBronson 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Correct, and they've been an issue on the 787 also.

    • @srpacific
      @srpacific 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      The plug was made in Malaysia with the serial number and part number written on the frame in Sharpie. Nuff said.

    • @jakemenard2593
      @jakemenard2593 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      It just so happens that the failed door plug is manufactured by Spirit Aerosystems based in Wichita, KS, which proudly states that their main focus is on DEI rather than hiring competent workers that produce quality parts.

    • @callumjohnston858
      @callumjohnston858 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      Cue flashbacks to DC10 and obligatory 'McDonnell-Douglas bought Boeing with Boeing's money' joke.

    • @TravisPrybylski
      @TravisPrybylski 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      and the downhill trend in quality coincides with companies pushing ridiculous hiring requirements, focused entirely around diversity and equality, instead of intelligence and skill. 🤷‍♂

  • @__-fm5qv
    @__-fm5qv 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +126

    As someone who works for one of Boeings suppliers its crazy to me that they've reduced quality inspection staff. Whereas where I work every component is inspected by a person at every stage of production, people are vital to the role.

    • @richardnixon8795
      @richardnixon8795 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Spirit personnel are spending much time at Boeing doing warranty rework.

  • @miche1df
    @miche1df 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +165

    Strong DC-10 vibes from this, both in terms of the dodgy engineering and the even dodgier management/regulatory structures that enabled it.

    • @wta1518
      @wta1518 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      It's almost like when McDonnell Douglas took over Boeing, they continued their shitty management practices.

    • @stargazer7644
      @stargazer7644 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Exactly what "dodgy engineering" was involved here?

    • @DangerB0ne
      @DangerB0ne 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

      ​@@stargazer7644Designing an inherently unstable passenger plane to barely conform to type for the sake of profit and to circumvent regulations at the risk of passenger lives.

    • @hexerade.e6142
      @hexerade.e6142 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@DangerB0neSounds like an american company

    • @stargazer7644
      @stargazer7644 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@DangerB0neNo commercial aircraft is "inherently unstable". You sound like a raving lunatic and you obviously have no idea what you're talking about.

  • @Grapejuuccc
    @Grapejuuccc 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +46

    I know that its a very small chance of it happening. But from a passenger/customer's POV. I am now more comfortable and enjoyed flying airbus a lot more, especially the A380.

    • @alastairbarkley6572
      @alastairbarkley6572 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

      The A380's a dream of an experience. I love it. The plane isn't a "failure" - it's flagship proof that Airbus can trusted build the world's largest, most modern, most advanced passenger airliner ever. Airbus never made any profit (in fact, in relative terms, a small loss) but that didn't really harm the company - nor the operational reputation of this great, great airplane. If Boeing had made the A380, we'd be hearing about it for decades.

  • @TheDoritoBoi
    @TheDoritoBoi 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +259

    When i heard about this event. It hardly surprised me. The brutal truth is that since airlines dont really make money off ticket sales anymore, it is a race to the bottom for the airline industry.
    I worked in a manufacturing facility that produced parts for all the major engine producers (sorry, i cant be specific). The corners that were cut for the sake of a 1% increase in that quarter’s profit was shocking and scary. Luckily, we were far enough ahead in the manufacturing line that our customers caught our shenanigans for the most part. I always was trying to focus on quality, but it was an uphill battle. I am brutally honest with my friends and family about my experience there and how it has affected me. I get very nervous on airplanes now that I know what kind of corner cutting goes on in the industry. I used to not be afraid of flying. I trusted the engineers behind the curtain. I then i got a peak behind that curtain, and now i am scared of flying.

    • @MrBrukmann
      @MrBrukmann 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +22

      Bro I watched a few dozen mentour pilot accident breakdowns and i'll never fly again. It is always something stupid, everything i feared of not having control if something goes wrong. My car is much more dangerous, but the piloting is on me at least.

    • @cefb8923
      @cefb8923 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      Coming from someone who is in aviation, I think it's a shit industry to work in (all things considered) personally unless you're a pilot or an engineer.

    • @BoyeeSmudger
      @BoyeeSmudger 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@cefb8923shit if you're an engineer also

    • @savannah115
      @savannah115 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

      This why I'm so excited to see all this new investment in Amtrak and other rail projects. Bring on the train travel! If we could get trains to be the normal for travel between relatively close cities and save the planes for long haul travel, it'd give airlines something to think about.

    • @matiastoatv
      @matiastoatv 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      The state of rail infrastructure and the corporate greed surrounding its operation wouldn't leave me more relaxed. Remember East Palestine? Just a symptom. Unchecked capitalism is the biggest threat for safety in any industry at this time@@savannah115

  • @calvinwright5040
    @calvinwright5040 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +242

    This is just like driving your car slowly because it shakes over 45. And turning your radio up because the noise. 😂

    • @MrPrajitura
      @MrPrajitura 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      haha, this comment made me giggle, and you're completely right. then I realized this is actually horrible considering the potential implications.

    • @MrPoornakumar
      @MrPoornakumar 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @calvinwright5040
      Such guys shan't be in management (in the first place).

    • @mikestein1024
      @mikestein1024 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      More like driving down mountains with only 1 brake working!!!

  • @jonshellmusic
    @jonshellmusic 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +125

    0:20 Excellent usage of the Wilhelm scream. Perfection!

    • @michaelotoole1807
      @michaelotoole1807 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      nice catch! i missed it.
      1951 movie first use of wihelm scream.
      th-cam.com/video/z8bIe5Y0O1M/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=CrazyNate

    • @mangamaster03
      @mangamaster03 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Yes, I love to hear it!

    • @MonkeyJedi99
      @MonkeyJedi99 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Wait. the seats right by the hole in the plane were empty?
      I think I saw this in a movie...

  • @AnotherCG
    @AnotherCG 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    737 Max. Now you know what the true meaning of Max is for Max killings

  • @SpyGeorgilis
    @SpyGeorgilis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +93

    The door (or door plug) moves UP to unlock, not down. That's because the guide tracks are on the door/plug, and the guide pins are on the door frame.
    Also, Boeing does NOT remove the plugs to install interiors. This was initially reported but has since been corrected.

    • @stephenwagener349
      @stephenwagener349 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      The only good info on all this comes from Juan Brown ( blancoLirio channel)

  • @ninehundreddollarluxuryyac5958
    @ninehundreddollarluxuryyac5958 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +84

    Spirit Aerosystems, the company that makes the fuselages now, used to be Boeing. Exactly the same building, tools and bosses. Boeing corporate closed it down, laid off all the union employees, did some paperwork and re-opened under a new name. The same jobs pay half as much with zero benefits and they have fewer people making the same planes

    • @mrcool7140
      @mrcool7140 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Capitalism ❤

  • @cuteshadow
    @cuteshadow 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +182

    When the CEO is responsible for hundreds of deaths: Gets a multi milion dollar golden handshake. When a fastfood employee salts fries not to company standard: Instantly fired, probably sued for the damage on 50Cents of fries.

    • @arth0heen
      @arth0heen 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      That's US by design

    • @Kepe
      @Kepe 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Rich people don't go to jail. There's some picture floating around the internet which shows two news articles from the US.. Some homeless guy stole 100 USD and got 15 years in prison. Some banker scammed people out of 1.3 billion USD and got a few months of suspended prison sentence, didn't even have to pay any money back to anyone.
      If you're wealthy enough (in the US), you can do pretty much whatever you want and you'll get away with it with maybe a little slap on your wrist. The poorer you are, the more you're punished by the law.
      You'd think that the law is the same for everyone, but it isn't.

    • @spindash64
      @spindash64 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      ​@@arth0heennot just US, my guy.

    • @blendpinexus1416
      @blendpinexus1416 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      ​@@arth0heenunfortunately, that's everywhere now.

    • @person8064
      @person8064 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      That's late-stage capitalism for ya. Slowling turning into feudalism

  • @CycloneCyd
    @CycloneCyd 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    "Hey guys, we've got a fundamental Engineering problem with the stability of our plane". Management: "No worries, we'll fix it with some software". 🤷
    As a professional Automotive Engineer, I can tell you it just doesn't work like that. It will nearly always end in tears.
    Software should only be used to augment fundamental Physics, where the fundamental physics is already correct, NOT fight with the Physics.

  • @Unb3arablePain
    @Unb3arablePain 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +399

    My worse experiences as an egnineer in my profession have come from management, not from bad engineering. We can fix bad engineering through reviews and letting stakeholders review. We can't accomplish anything when management treats the project as some budget sink per month and when they also don't even understand what they're looking at.

    • @h0rriphic
      @h0rriphic 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Perfectly said.

    • @MrPoornakumar
      @MrPoornakumar 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @Unb3arablePain
      True. But who'll bell that fat cat?

    • @truenoae8689
      @truenoae8689 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      ​@@h0rriphicAgree. Very frustrating when upper management makes engineering related decisions while having no idea what they're talking about.

    • @hellojams
      @hellojams 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Boeing's leadership roles that could potentially endanger lives should require years of aerospace engineering experience and deep technical understanding, not MBAs. I wont be buying airplane tickets anytime soon.

  • @callenclarke371
    @callenclarke371 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +588

    “When people say I changed the culture of Boeing, that was the intent, so it's run like a business rather than a great engineering firm.”
    - Harry Stonecipher, former CEO of Boeing, widely credited with changing the entire culture of Boeing, from that of a great engineering firm, to that of a business.

    • @ReflectedMiles
      @ReflectedMiles 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +65

      You mean the CEO of the company formerly known as McDonnell Douglas. Boeing retired after being bought out with their own money.

    • @_PatrickO
      @_PatrickO 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +53

      Do not forget James McNerney who was ceo from 2005 to 2015. During his first year, spirit was spun off as a separate company. McNerney outsourced it all and was in charge while the MAX was being designed and constructed. He stepped down as CEO seven months before the first max test flight. Muilenburg was nothing but a fall guy to take the blame for everything McNerney sabotaged.
      Calhoun took over when they successfully blamed Muilenburg. Calhoun is the guy cutting inspectors today.
      Muilenburg is least responsible here, the people who architected this were CEOs before and after Muilenburg. Muilenburg also should not be called an engineer because he was one 20 years prior. 20 years in management means he is not an engineer anymore. They don't let real engineers be CEOs because they won't cut the corners the board wants cut.

    • @callenclarke371
      @callenclarke371 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      I think Alan Mulally was the last great CEO of Boeing.

    • @makei89
      @makei89 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Put back on those management office, no where to go when you are at 30000ft

    • @zackakai5173
      @zackakai5173 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

      Something *only* an MBA could say and think was a good thing. Literally anyone else with a brain (not even just engineers) would hear that and go "wow, that's fucking stupid."

  • @crewdawg16
    @crewdawg16 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +155

    That “wire tie” is called a “cotter key” or “cotter pin”. They are typically used on castellated nuts as shown and these are fasteners that are torqued to spec and then the nut is either loosened or tightened to the next alignment of the hole to allow for installation. If properly installed it is impossible for the fasteners to come loose.

    • @jamesturner2126
      @jamesturner2126 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      He shouldn't have said wire tie. It made it sound like lock wire, and that is definitely NOT lock wire.

    • @roscozone8092
      @roscozone8092 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      Or “split pin”

    • @jamesturner2126
      @jamesturner2126 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @roscozone8092 either way, if the pin is in the bolt, the nut will not come loose. Even if the bolt jiggles around, it will still hold the door closed. I think the pin is the failure point.

    • @JamesAnderson-mr2sg
      @JamesAnderson-mr2sg 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      The loose bolts holding the hinges are not lock wired so they could come out. which would allow the hinges to disconnect from the fuselage.

    • @mrdrummer2564
      @mrdrummer2564 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @crewdawg16 ​ The only possible failure point is then the bolt shearing.

  • @AugmentedGravity
    @AugmentedGravity 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

    I have lost ALOT of respect for Boeing over the past few years.

    • @wotizit
      @wotizit 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Same

  • @manwiththeredface7821
    @manwiththeredface7821 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +138

    I used to fly budget airlines and it was interesting (as well as reassuring) to see them all switch from Boeing planes to Airbuses after the very first wave of 737 Max crashes.

    • @AnontheGOAT
      @AnontheGOAT 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      Yup. A321’s are taking Boeings lunch.

    • @RENO_K
      @RENO_K 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Boeing has noone to blame but themselves, they did a rush job with the 737 Max and now is suffering bc of it, noone believes in the newer boeings anymore, lot's of airlines are switching to Airbus,
      Boeing made the 737max to combat Airbus now because of their negligence, Airbus is taking more and more market share

    • @mi6agent813
      @mi6agent813 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

      @@AnontheGOAT the day of this accident I had a flight. My relief when an Airbus showed up was unreal.

    • @psychic_beth
      @psychic_beth 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Luckily here in Australia, they still use the 737-800 and not the MAX variants yet.

    • @osasunaitor
      @osasunaitor 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Which airlines did that? I haven't heard of any

  • @Bob_Smith19
    @Bob_Smith19 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +67

    Reset the warning and keep running. This happens in every production environment, regardless of the machine, if you don’t have proper people in charge of the mechanics. Upper management doesn’t want any down time so it takes someone w/ knowledge and power to keep it offline until the root cause of the problem is identified and fixed.

    • @minerscale
      @minerscale 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      The more software I write the more amazing it is that people ignore warnings and errors. I cannot believe the number of projects just littered with warnings. The complacency it causes is unbelievable. Every single warning or error should be explicitly silenced with good reason, or better, actually fixed.

  • @TheBigBenji890
    @TheBigBenji890 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +77

    Thank you for calling out that greed isn't limited to business majors. Anyone can get into an executive role, and greed can easily take over. When all you see are numbers on a spreadsheet, it's easy to take the human element out of play.

    • @spinecho609
      @spinecho609 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Or, you know, the shareholders insisting on infinite profit and growth, even an angel can be moral in the C-suite

    • @mitsuki1388
      @mitsuki1388 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Yeah but the end of the video is honestly pretty much excuses to shift the blame from greedy corporate executives and shareholders

  • @anarchosnowflakist786
    @anarchosnowflakist786 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    thanks a lot for your video ! I love the very engineering focus of your channel but it's a thing I see too often in the field (and in the people who gravitate around it) where people refuse to talk about systemic problems or just blame it on individuals or on engineers not being in charge enough, so you mentioning the fact that it's a much broader problem with the prioritization of revenue (whether we call that corporate greed or market forces) over listening to workers and regulations is a really important thing that I wish more people would talk about

  • @the7observer
    @the7observer 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +151

    7:44 AFAIK the MCAS was not only a software, it was a system that had a computer and a sensor. 1 sensor. The crashes were caused by the 1 sensor failling (a massive sin for aviation that has reduntant systems everywhere) and the pilots WERE NOT INFORMED of the MCAS system during training and manuals

    • @rahul38474
      @rahul38474 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      Additionally, airlines had to pay extra for the second redundant sensor. But like you said, the lack of clear training and communication about MCAS with the pilots was the real issue, and is caused by the fact that Boeing was allowed to self-regulate.

    • @mecharoo
      @mecharoo 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

      they didn't want additional training as that is the selling point of the 737 MAX, to match airbus' A320neo which didn't require additional training.

    • @gpaull2
      @gpaull2 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      @@rahul38474- the sensor is already on the plane for other reasons. There is also a 2nd sensor already installed that they were too cheap to tie into.

    • @AirForceOne_prod.
      @AirForceOne_prod. 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      A system that doesn't allow the pilot to take over, I find it horrifying! Is like having a car that won't let you brake.

    • @jeffhurckes190
      @jeffhurckes190 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      In a way, you can blame SouthWest Airlines for that one. They stipulated that for them to purchase MAX aircraft, the aircraft needed to be similar enough to keep the same type rating as an NG. If it didnt and their pilots needed to recertify on a new type, they were going to fine Boeing 1mil per aircraft purchased.

  • @itsyaboikirbo
    @itsyaboikirbo 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +258

    not the wilhelm scream at 0:20 💀

    • @nuggetsww
      @nuggetsww 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

      lol not the only one to notice.

    • @sprucemaroose
      @sprucemaroose 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Came here for this 😂

    • @stephencaudle1766
      @stephencaudle1766 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      Can we officially add this video to the list of movie classics?

  • @AnonymousFreakYT
    @AnonymousFreakYT 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +162

    The phones that fell out of Alaska 1282 landed less than a mile from my son's house. When I heard about the flight, and saw early reports showing where the depressurization happened, I joked "hey, that's near the hospital. I wonder if the door plug landed on the heliport?" It didn't; but one of the phones was found on the side of the road immediately next to the hospital. When it was shown on the local news, I did the "Leo DiCaprio pointing at the screen" thing "THAT'S THE HOSPITAL!" (The reporter just said "by the side of the road in " but when the camera pointed up, the hospital building was clearly visible a block away.)

    • @Dimsum256
      @Dimsum256 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Aptly named "Providence" St Vincent is it ?

    • @AnonymousFreakYT
      @AnonymousFreakYT 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@Dimsum256 That’s the one.

    • @hydrolifetech7911
      @hydrolifetech7911 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      I appreciate the DiCaprio meme you did 😂

  • @mrdgenerate
    @mrdgenerate 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    They literally used the first crashes to say "well ironically these planes are probably the safest there are now with all the new scrutiny on them."
    Wild.

  • @cell5066
    @cell5066 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +62

    Another lucky fact is that the door plug blew out only at just under 16,000 ft at 30,000+ ft the aircraft would likely have had severe damage and even likely even lead to a hull loss, killing everyone on board. We just don't know how many more latent issues/defects lie within the 737 Max and any new aircraft Boeing puts out.

    • @MrPoornakumar
      @MrPoornakumar 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @cell5066
      Yeah. That speaks of the soundness of design of "737". But other things should follow.

    • @LHSNottingham
      @LHSNottingham 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      It looks like the door plug or debris could possibly strike the horizontal stabilizer which I'd think could have led to a crash as well.

    • @teguh.hofstee
      @teguh.hofstee 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Just a small nitpick, these door plugs are not unique to the 737 MAX 9. The older 737-900 uses the exact same door plugs.

    • @MrPoornakumar
      @MrPoornakumar 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @cell5066
      It is their (fare-paying passengers') luck.

  • @lucas_k23
    @lucas_k23 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +42

    I know you dismissed it at the end of the video and yes, the last CEO was an engineer by training, but I still think Boeing's focus has shifted greatly from engineering to profits.
    - when then bought McDonnell-Douglas, Boeing basically bought their management into Boeing, even though they were running a failing company. It was so absurd even then and not just in hindsight, that the newspapers were joking about McDonnell-Douglas having bought Boeing.
    - Boeing's HQ moved from Seattle to Chicago and now to Virginia. Boeing doesn't do engineering there or anywhere nearby, as far as I know. Many (former) Boeing employees and especially engineers, mechanics, quality assurance personnel etc. have mentioned that that move has made it very difficult to have a dialog with their management about important safety-related aspects.
    - there's a lawsuit going on between Boeing and Spirit AeroSystems, which reveals very similar shifts going on at Boeing's suppliers.
    In the end, the distance to communicate between engineering and management has both literally and metaphorically been increased over the past 25 years or so. I'm biased, but I don't think the engineers wanted that.

  • @cirelancaster
    @cirelancaster 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +80

    We always put my son in the window seat so he can look out and play more freely. This absolutely terrified me.

    • @AVdE10000
      @AVdE10000 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

      I try to remind myself that this is one accident happening to one plane out of a million out there. The fact it's such big news goes to show how rare these accidents are. That doesn't mean we shouldn't take these seriously, we absolutely should, but airplane travel is still immensely safe regardless.

    • @tonyhawk123
      @tonyhawk123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      @@AVdE10000except for the fact Boeing is in the process of laying off quality inspectors in huge numbers (in the thousands) and this same aircraft model is responsible for multiple incidents totalling hundreds of deaths due to gross mismanagement, and the fines reflect that. Risk analysis needs to factor in trends, and Boeing is imploding.

    • @anonvideo738
      @anonvideo738 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      dont worry, if this happened to a window you were sitting next to all of you wouldve been sucked out of the plane

    • @reed510
      @reed510 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@tonyhawk123correct… I’m pretty sure they don’t have a choice at this point. That’s a lot of money lost due to their own negligence.

    • @JoshuaTootell
      @JoshuaTootell 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      The car ride to the airport is more dangerous than sitting next to the window.

  • @mrwjs
    @mrwjs 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    The fact that TH-cam is partially demonetizing a video like this provides clear evidence that they are looking for any reason not to pay their creators. A video production of exceptional quality (like this one) is the key to obtaining Premium memberships. When I see Alphabet/TH-cam doing this to creators, I question the purpose of my Premium membership. I have been a proud Nebula subscriber for a couple of years, and I hope more quality creators like Real Engineering make the switch to that platform, so I can cancel TH-cam Premium.

  • @RSGTomcat
    @RSGTomcat 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +71

    As an industry insider, everyone I know throughout the industry seems to point to the event known colloquially as: "The day McDonnel Douglas bought Boeing with Boeing's money," as the inflection point where Boeing's culture went from that of engineering, manufacturing, and quality excellence to cost cutting, profit maximization. MCD was apparently very good at "making money" in the industry but Boeing was not. They leaned heavily on MCD executives AFTER the merger, to help realign the business direction Boeing would go in order to improve profits and become a more desirable company to invest in. This included divestitures of low profit business enterprises, like their Wichita manufacturing plant, which would later be named Spirit Aerosystems.

    • @cefb8923
      @cefb8923 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Wow, interesting. Thanks for sharing.. I am definitely looking more into this. What's odd though is MCD seemed to make a lot of great planes though too. I have worked on a few including the DC-10 which I feel like sometimes gets a little bit more hate than it deserved. I think in the context of its own time (mid 60s to early 70s) its really not much worse than many other planes, someone could chime in on this more I am sure.

    • @BlahLab
      @BlahLab 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      It's so strange to me that they divested the Wichita factory, only to need to pump cash into it 15 years late so they could keep their production line running. It reads very much as a short sighted business decision to boost profits over long term stability.

  • @canowyrms
    @canowyrms 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +120

    'the questionable engineering of ...' is a great title. Hope this can become a new series. Would love to see more like this.

    • @tonyhawk123
      @tonyhawk123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      The title shows some restraint. “Boeing management cut more corners…” might have been more accurate.

    • @playerzking
      @playerzking 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Currently there is another one in this series about the titanic submersible.

    • @jeffbenton6183
      @jeffbenton6183 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      It'd be nice to see more videos in the series about past incidents (like the DC-10). I don't want there to be more videos about recent events, because I don't want those recent events to happen at all in the near-future (but if they do happen, I was to see RE cover it!)

    • @atatterson6992
      @atatterson6992 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Except this issue appears to have nothing to do with engineering....

    • @dbclass4075
      @dbclass4075 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@jeffbenton6183Maybe a different field of engineering. Say, Sampoong Superstore collapse or Eschede derailment.

  • @alaskadrifter
    @alaskadrifter 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +83

    The reason Alaska allowed the Max in question to keep flying is because they thought it was a pressurization controller, which has redundant control systems, including a back up manual control. No mechanic would suspect that a plug door was the culprit on a two month old airframe.

    • @skolarii
      @skolarii 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      i'm sorry but they still should have investigated. if there is a redundant controller, could they not compare the readings from both controllers and if they both have the same reading then its not a faulty controller.

    • @sweetcheels
      @sweetcheels 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

      The controllers don’t work like that per se. They don’t compare readings and control pressurization based on the difference. One is active until it fails or until power is switched, then the other comes on line.
      And yes, in theory one would inspect the door but its an honest and obvious oversight. The aircraft is 2 months old AND the door assembly is essentially the exact same as the 737-900NG. Those models have never had a door plug issue like this, so why inspect that when it’s not a door for one. Meaning it doesn’t open and it’s bolted shut.
      Sorta like buying a brand new car that needs an alignment, the mechanic will check all 4 wheels except the frame itself. Because its the least likely culprit. On a brand new car.

    • @mrteeve
      @mrteeve 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      ​@@skolariinot normally no as data at that level of fidelity is often proprietary and not available to the tooling the operator has

    • @jakemenard2593
      @jakemenard2593 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      The door plug in question has a bit of a history of failures, all manufactured by Spirit.

    • @JPMonteith
      @JPMonteith 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      But they didn't even try to find out what was causing it? Sounds like whomever made that decision has a piece of black tape hiding the check engine light flashing in their car.

  • @Shattereddemon300
    @Shattereddemon300 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    That scream when the door plug blew off in the video, what the heck, bro are you kidding me right now.😂😂😂

    • @noComment243
      @noComment243 5 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      It's called a Wilhelm Scream if you're interested to learn more!

  • @thesqueeeps
    @thesqueeeps 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +52

    It’s insane that it took this much to have them put out any sort of written material on this. I’m a Maintenace tech for a regional airline and we get info and our manuals updated on problems even when nothing happens (an example is we’ve had an issue with people leaving tools and oil cans in the aft equipment bay. Within like 3 incidents the company changed the job cards to include a step to check the bay and sent out a read and sign about the issue) how the hell does a massive company not catch stuff like this

    • @Spiker985Studios
      @Spiker985Studios 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      You have to care to catch it. And your employees have to be incentivized, not dissuaded

    • @deathtdow
      @deathtdow 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Been a massive company. The larger the firm the harder the management task and the more likely that things start falling apart do to that management problem not being fully over come.

  • @ludovicbon5903
    @ludovicbon5903 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +31

    Airbus also works with Spirit aerosystem who have a unit at St Nazaire . The difference with Boeing is that Airbus double checks the work of sub contractors. Shorting the quality process is never a good idea, it cheaper at short terms but you-ll always pay a bigger price sooner or later .

  • @FlyntofRWBY
    @FlyntofRWBY 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +51

    Love your use of the Wilhelm Scream at 0:20 lmao

    • @pappaslivery
      @pappaslivery 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Came looking for this comment. Horribly underappreciated comment.

    • @MrRedalertcc
      @MrRedalertcc 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@pappaslivery same here!!

  • @nikolausbautista8925
    @nikolausbautista8925 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    I remember seeing on local (Seattle & Portland-area TV) news stations, that the door was found in a teacher's yard in Suburban Portland. So they have found the door, as of roughly a week to week-and-a-half ago. Very informative video.

  • @vioseven3799
    @vioseven3799 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +69

    Today corporate companies prioritize revenue, stockholders, and CEO checks over anything, employees, customers, you name it.

    • @Dave_the_Dave
      @Dave_the_Dave 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      They always used to, but they still do, too.

    • @cdjwmusic
      @cdjwmusic 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Thats usually not a problem. For normal companies to make money for stockholders they have to at least bring something to the table (good workplace environment so employees work well, good quality of products or service, etc), if they don't do it then some other company will, and will take away all the clients and talented employees, and profits from them.
      The problem here is Boeing is massive and doesn't have many competitors (just Airbus?), so if they mess up there aren't really any consequences, they won't lose clients because there really isn't anyone else (other than airbus) where airlines could go and buy their planes from, and so they won't lose profits and will keep doing the same shady shit over and over again

    • @eliastalks7411
      @eliastalks7411 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​​@@cdjwmusic except there are more and more monopolies where 3-5 companies control an entire sector, and more frankly garbage 'industry revolutionising' ideas that amount to data harvesting, or some other shady but legal actions. The idea that the company has to make something valuable or provide a good service is really only true for small businesses and some not-BS startups pre acquisition.

    • @vioseven3799
      @vioseven3799 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@cdjwmusic yes indeed, but currently many corporations treat their employees as expandable tools and not as valuable assets.

  • @Davethreshold
    @Davethreshold 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +59

    EXCELLENT dissection of the unfortunate decisions created by Boeing. You do this WITHOUT the attention-grabbing, screaming headlines. Your work on this channel speaks for itself.
    Thank you once again.

  • @iwfur25
    @iwfur25 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +78

    Like others have said the door plug is not an engineering/design problem, it's an assembly/QA problem. The 737-900 ER has been flying since 2007 with (very likely) the exact same door plugs... pretty sure it'd be pointless to have changed that design for the Max. Engineering or no it's still a huge problem obviously, but details matter.

    • @stringpicker5468
      @stringpicker5468 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      FAA has just ordered inspections of the -900 ER

  • @paullanyi516
    @paullanyi516 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Thanks!

  • @shindoushuichi0287
    @shindoushuichi0287 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +108

    Haven talked to a few guys in the civilian maintenance community, it’s pretty clear to me as a military veteran who worked on aircraft, civilian planes are DANGEROUSLY under scheduled for maintenance and a lot of the maintenance standards are not reviewed once created so a plane could be flown for so many hours and what was considered a safe tightness for a brand New bolt doesn’t match up to the air frames stretch and give.
    You can’t just do the “good and tight” excuse. Torque Wrenches exist for a reason.

    • @Ali-e5h1b
      @Ali-e5h1b 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      I turned a few wrenches for the military. I also did some composites work as a civilian. I shit you not, I worked at as a QA inspector for two retired Marine officers. They tried to coerce me into signing off parts for Kiawa helicopters; which were drilled incorrectly. They had phony inspection documents they wanted me to sign. But, as a crew chief with integrity, I actually checked the hole alignments. They were off by 0.1 inches or more. The parts didn't match at all. After telling them that, an owner assaulted me as I was quitting. She was such a valuable taxpayer to that community that the lawyers in the area set me up. A grand jury indicted me for assaulting her! Her optometrist claimed her bad eyes were because of me!
      Small town with a lot of "loyalty."
      Color me jaded. Now I don't trust business owners, police, lawyers, judges... Basically the system that can be abused by "trusted members of society." I know there are good people in all of those categories. We are a minority that tries to keep the wheels on this thing... Literally sometimes.

    • @alastairbarkley6572
      @alastairbarkley6572 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      +
      The military doesn't have to turn a profit.

    • @alastairbarkley6572
      @alastairbarkley6572 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Hey, as a US military veteran, can you explain to me your understanding about how NATO 'funding' works?

    • @georgewashington2782
      @georgewashington2782 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Hilarious that you think the military has higher standards than the civilian side. They undergo constant maintenance

    • @shindoushuichi0287
      @shindoushuichi0287 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@georgewashington2782 I don’t think. I KNOW they do because I was in the freaking Air Force for six years. I have seen the hundreds and thousands of pages of technical manuals that outline every nut and screws fucking torque levels. The military has constant maintenance BECAUSE they demand the safest aircraft ALL the time.

  • @lmpeters
    @lmpeters 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +61

    The merger of Boeing and McDonnel-Douglas led to a drastic change in Boeing's corporate culture. While Boeing used to pride itself on quality and safety, they became a company focused on profit above all else, to the point where managers threatened to fire engineers who brought up safety issues.
    Jonathan Smart talked about this in much more detail in his book "Sooner Safer Happier: Antipatterns and Patterns for Business Agility", which I would highly recommend to anyone who finds themselves in a leadership position at a high-tech organization.

  • @FastPaull
    @FastPaull 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +80

    I work for Boeing Defense. One of my QA guys had a talking to by management for "Over inspecting". Rules are, managers aren't allowed to rush assemblers, but they do. They say "First time quality" rush assemblers, then wonder why there's issues.

    • @baccadaa
      @baccadaa 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      That’s just scary. First time quality or quality at the source is a goal not a mandate.

    • @immersion9880
      @immersion9880 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Yup. Quality is overhead, so program managers love to look for ways to “reduce inspection hours”.

    • @baccadaa
      @baccadaa 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@immersion9880 I graduated as a ME and I always taught to look for what can go wrong and to verify when a part would fail soonest in worst conditions and factors of safety. I can’t believe people risk other peoples lives like that

    • @FastPaull
      @FastPaull 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @immersion9880 EXACTLY. Overhead charge code is literally Satan to managers.

    • @DWS-123
      @DWS-123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Minimum Viable Product and Agile Engineering. 😋😋😋 Is this what Boeing applies to its R&D and factory and engineering team ?

  • @BluganoStudio
    @BluganoStudio 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Reminds me of another aviation story, someone was replacing a windshield and some of the bolts were bought third party, so they were lesser quality. Sheered the window out mid flight if I remember correctly.

  • @RedRouge-j4j
    @RedRouge-j4j 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +37

    I worked on a prototype instrument for the 787. One time I was asked verbally if a certain update had been installed, and it hadn't. We had to call the courier personnel at the airport where it was ready to fly to Seattle, and re-call it. A procedure that must have been done before. And this was just a Mk1 prototype. Everything had to be signed off, don't ask how it didn't get done, but I do remember a lot of overtime.

  • @WestTown97
    @WestTown97 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +52

    you hit the nail on the head when you talked about how corporate greed corrupts (even if the managers have technical backgrounds). the koch brothers were chemical engineers by trade and the sacklers had medical degrees

    • @denisekorhonen1247
      @denisekorhonen1247 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Absolutely

    • @oofballz4328
      @oofballz4328 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I’m more worried about greedy and corrupt politicians trying to have excess control over citizens & their businesses than corporate greed or corporate corruption

  • @Saberdudy
    @Saberdudy 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +66

    I interned for a summer at GE aviation, in the same office as the engineers responsible for the parts that went on the MAX 8, though I was not on the same team as them. I was there when 30% of the staff was let go due to the issues at Boeing and the impact on aviation in 2020. It was crazy to walk into an empty and quiet office the next morning. So many people affected by decisions they didn't make, it was awful.

  • @jukkiivi4282
    @jukkiivi4282 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    @RealEngineering The Alaska Airliners didn't do anything wrong. The pressurisation warnings almost certainly didn't have anything to do with the door plug. The pressurisation system of an aircraft is made of several components: the pressure vessel aka the hull, air conditioning pacs, an outflow valve, and a pressure control system. The pressure control system has two independent automatic systems and a redundant manual system.
    The pressure warning light went out when swithching the pressure control to the other automatic system. If the door plug was leaking before, the pressurisation alarm would have stayed on regardless of the pressure control system used. Also an air leak makes a loud squaling noise.

    • @davidlewis6728
      @davidlewis6728 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      that goes against the "rich powerful company bad, more regulations needed" narrative, but to be fair, there had to be some way to prevent what happened, else it would have been the issue of the engineers, and therefore alaska airliner's fault for picking them.

    • @namechange9367
      @namechange9367 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Look up Alaska Flight 261, the company has a history of shady maintenance

    • @125brat
      @125brat 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I don't know the cabin pressurisation systems on the 737 but expect it's just a modern version of the old cabin pressurisation system on the Victors I used to work on.
      Checks would involve blanking the sensing lines on the control valves and pressurising the cabin to a given differential. If the flow-rate into the cabin was too high or the required differential couldn't be achieved, there was a leak somewhere which you had to find and fix to get it within spec. Usually it was the cabin door or the seals around hatches that was leaking - places that were moved frequently or had been disturbed during maintenance. It was all basic stuff BUT the principles still apply no matter if you've got fancy electronic control systems or old steam-powered ones.
      The pressurisation problems on this aircraft are quite likely to have been due to the leak around the door-plug as I've seen more detailed photos showing the way the plug probably gradually over time moved upwards in the mounts thereby creating a gap which through vibration and other forces gradually increased until the door jettisoned the aircraft. Tolerances between the 2 automatic systems may account for the fact that one system kept failing whilst the other didn't, but either way this is one heck of a failure at many levels of management, production and maintenance.

  • @Aisheth
    @Aisheth 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +67

    Ok, I was not expecting to hear the Wilhelm scream at 21 seconds in. Well done sir. Hats off to you.

    • @PaleoWithFries
      @PaleoWithFries 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      RIP Wilhelm the Plug Door.

  • @pixselious
    @pixselious 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +203

    Me and the boys at 3 am hyping up Airbus:

    • @alex-q8-q9
      @alex-q8-q9 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Team Airbus or Team Boeing wich one u on

    • @RalphEllis
      @RalphEllis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      See my other post at the top of the comments list.

    • @jamesturner2126
      @jamesturner2126 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Airbus recently had an open door alert. Yay, for Airbus!

    • @T1Oracle
      @T1Oracle 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@RalphEllis I just flew Southwest. No assigned seating. I've never had so much room on a plane in my life. Very comfy.

    • @heidirabenau511
      @heidirabenau511 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      That looks to be a sensor issue, it was on an A319 which does not feature plug doors.​@@jamesturner2126

  • @namenamename390
    @namenamename390 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +110

    0:27 in the event of sudden depressurisation, the cockpit door unlocks itself. I only know this because this was weirdly not mentioned in the flight manual, so none of the crew knew it at the time of the incident, which made Boeing say they'll update the manual.

    • @RealEngineering
      @RealEngineering  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +56

      Why would they design it to do that?

    • @yusinwu
      @yusinwu 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +99

      @@RealEngineering So the passengers can listen to pilots screaming.

    • @implodingbaby
      @implodingbaby 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +28

      @@RealEngineering for the banter

    • @volvo09
      @volvo09 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

      Sounds like it's not working as designed so they will update the manual so they don't have to fix it.
      Why put the little pressure equalization doors on there if the main door will just blow open anyways?
      Sounds like they're covering it up with a "revision" to the manual.

    • @MyCrazywhiteguy
      @MyCrazywhiteguy 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      This has been a requirement for all FAA certified commercial planes since 9/11. The cockpit door must open within milliseconds in the event of rapid decompression.

  • @alex_zetsu
    @alex_zetsu 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I'm glad that in the anime adaptation of Doctor Elise they changed the plane from an older 737 to what appears to be a 737 MAX. In the source material the pilot is somehow unable to handle a single engine failure. Well in the anime, it's still the same, but now fans can say "well, the computer probably messed up the single engine failure response somehow" since it's an acceptable target.

  • @kentslocum
    @kentslocum 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +72

    It is so important to have a workplace culture that encourages speaking up about safety and quality. I recently told my management that safety issues were being ignored, and they recommended I find a different job! 😢

    • @martijnb5887
      @martijnb5887 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I guess they did not offer the job of sr safety officer?

    • @BarackLesnar
      @BarackLesnar 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      That's disappointing. I reported a safety issue to management and they just conveniently fired me themselves.

    • @sleinadb
      @sleinadb 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      I did work for a guy once that was HUGE on safety and training. His company has doubled in size...and he still prioritizes this. It's part of an overall culture, though, of doing the right thing always...so it's bigger than just the safety piece, but you can still be safe and successful. He doesn't have shareholders though per se.

    • @alisonwilson9749
      @alisonwilson9749 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Any well-run company knows that the employees who point out problems (and of course help solve them too) are the most valuable people they have. Only companies run by spivs think otherwise.

    • @kentslocum
      @kentslocum 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@alisonwilson9749 When I was growing up, my father's motto was, "Don't come with problems; come with solutions."

  • @clarencewest6418
    @clarencewest6418 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

    Until this type of criminal negligence receives prison time instead of fines, it will continue. Another factor is talking quality, paying quantity.

  • @diytwoincollege7079
    @diytwoincollege7079 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    The door issue wasn’t bad engineering, it was bad following of procedures. 4 bolts, 4 pins, and 6 plugs should easily hold a door on. Easily

  • @modularinspiration
    @modularinspiration 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    I vowed never to ever get on one of these death traps after the first incident, let alone the new stuff. No way, ever!

  • @a11aaa11a
    @a11aaa11a 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +30

    Until executive bonuses have long term incentives required (I'd suggest 50% of compensation vesting after 20 years), this will continue and get more widespread. Incentives have to be aligned between executives and society; that's just not the case now. PE is a huge problem for the same reason

    • @willi1978
      @willi1978 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Make a mistake and get millions for doing it. As a normal worker they would come after you legally

  • @PeterLindstrom-x4w
    @PeterLindstrom-x4w 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

    Just a quick correction (Mentour Pilot covered this): "deactivating" the door leaves the emergency door in place but it is no longer able to open and (I assume) does not have the slide installed. A deactivated door can later be reactivated. That's different than having a plug installed. A plug cannot be reactivated, but must instead be replaced with a door if the airline elects to increase the number of passengers.

  • @elijahharrison4164
    @elijahharrison4164 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +20

    0:15 The Wilhelm Scream gutted me. Truly an artist's touch. 🧐

  • @DerAlteMann1974
    @DerAlteMann1974 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    This plane is a good example that increasing profit at all cost will kill humans at the end

  • @MikkoRantalainen
    @MikkoRantalainen 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +56

    As far as I know, MCAS wasn't needed because engine cowling were higher. It was needed because the engines needed to be moved forward which caused engine power to forcefully push the nose of the plane upwards whenever the engine power was increased. Similarly, the nose of the plane would drop rapidly in case of engine failure or rapid throttle movement.

    • @mikoto7693
      @mikoto7693 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      Basically yeah. The repositioning of the engines had that effect. MCAS was introduced to make the max “feel” like flying an earlier model of 737 by the pilots so they didn’t need to be retrained to fly the max variants.

    • @baronvonlimbourgh1716
      @baronvonlimbourgh1716 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      It messed with the center of gravety and center of lift. Destabalising the airplanes design.

    • @MikeDCWeld
      @MikeDCWeld 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I didn't get the idea that they were trying to claim or insinuate that the _height of the cowling_ was what caused the MCAS system to be added, but rather the increased height was a side effect of repositioning the engine and that it was the repositioning that introduced the instability that necessitated the introduction of MCAS.

    • @stringpicker5468
      @stringpicker5468 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@MikeDCWeld Bigger engines would not fit safely in the desired position and had to be moved forward, causing poor trim.

    • @stringpicker5468
      @stringpicker5468 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      The problem with the MCAS was that 1. It needed two sensors to be safe but only one was installed standard. Also Boeing bluffed the FAA into not requiring simulator training for MCAS. They played down the level of change and there is basically collusion between FAA and Boeing because there are a lot of ex Boeing guys at the FAA. SOme FAA people should have been sacked as well.

  • @MartinCHorowitz
    @MartinCHorowitz 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +31

    When I was working at Boeing on a Military Aircraft, we had a Continuous improvement program in place to look at opportunities to improve diagnostics reduce repair time.For something like the Door plug we would have added pressure sensors on the bolts, or a way to examine the panel installation with less disassembly of the aircraft.

  • @dmacpher
    @dmacpher 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +37

    *McDonell Douglas enters the boardroom*

    • @msromike123
      @msromike123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      My Dad was an aerospace stress analysis engineer at Douglas for decades. He must be rolling over in his grave.

    • @connormclernon26
      @connormclernon26 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Gotta love it when beancounters take over from engineers

    • @dmacpher
      @dmacpher 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@connormclernon26 it’s more that a culture of safety starts at the top, without buy in at the board and c suite, it’s a safety system not a culture (at best)

    • @connormclernon26
      @connormclernon26 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@dmacpherwhich is why in order to fix this you’d have to purge the whole Board and replace them with safety conscious engineers

    • @Bob_Smith19
      @Bob_Smith19 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@connormclernon26Accountants need to stay in the accounting department and never have power over a company. They ruin everything they touch. I’ve watched it happen to countless companies I’ve dealt w/ over the years. The larger the company the more problems it causes.

  • @DanRichardson
    @DanRichardson 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    @4:17
    "DO NOT HUMP THIS CAR"
    Homer: "Hm! Good advice!"

  • @RalphEllis
    @RalphEllis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +38

    The bottom line is that the Max should never have been produced. It is an ancient dog of an aircraft, but it was pushed down the line because S.outhwest and R.yan wanted a cheap aircraft with lineal commonality with the 1967-certified B737. But in truth a 21st century aircraft should never have:
    a. Only one sensor controlling a safety system - because that is simply criminaI. Nobody except Boeing has had simplex systems in the last 70 years.
    b. A MCAS system that is able to stab-trim fully forwards - when it is known that the stab-trim is more powerful than the elevator. Thus the system has sufficient authority to overpower the pilot, and fly the aircraft into the ground. And if this authority was so easily reduced in the revised Max, then why was this not specified for the original Max? Were there occasional conditions where the system needed full trim authority (for a high-speed stall perhaps), and they are not telling us about it?
    c. A manual stab-trimmer that becomes mechanically locked if the pilots are pulling back on the control column - so that no manual re-trimming is possible. (The recommended roller-coaster recovery not being advisable at 2,000 ft, and never taught in the simulator.)
    d. An anti-stall device (MCAS) that operates on the stab-trimmer, rather than the control column. Look, dear Boeing, the design and mechanics of an anti-stall device are well-known, ever since the Bae Trident got into trouble. The solution is to push the control column forward, because once the nose is lowered and speed increases, the pressure can be released instantly.
    However, if you push forward on the stab-trim, you cannot easily pull out of the ensuing dive because you are still trimmed (fully) forward. (As several pilots have discovered, much to their dismay). So why did the FAA not recommend the complete scrapping of the MCAS system, and the installation of a stick-pusher? Cost? Time? Certification? Has the FAA skimped in their recommended MCAS fix?
    e. A master warning system that can be cancelled, so the warnings are extinguished and forgotten. Dimmed perhaps, but never extinguished. This must be the most stupid system ever invented for a commercial aircraft.
    f. Important warnings, like low engine oil pressure, that simply don’t appear on the master warning system. It does not take too much in the way of distractions or inattention to miss the fact that the engine is about to seize.
    g. Flight controls that cannot be separated if one side is jammed, because the two elevators are joined by a large torque tube. That would not be allowed on a modern aircraft.
    h. Engine overheat and fire warning lights that are not in the pilot’s line of sight, with no repeater lights on the thrust levers. Back in 1960 the handles and lights were on the coaming, where they should be, but they were relegated to the center console to make way for the MCP. That was a retrograde fix that should never have been allowed, at least not without repeater lights on the thrust levers. But what do the FAA care, as long as profits are still being made?
    i. Switches that are all identical, without even an attempt at colour coding. And the evidence for correct actioning is a light that goes bright and dim. Now between day and night, just what is bright and what is dim? Never in the history of aviation has there been such a stupid advisory/warning system.
    j. Switches which are all down for on - unless they are on the forward and center instrument panels, where they are up for on. Note that the all-important electric trim cutoff switches are down for off - the complete opposite to the majority of switches on a 737. There is so much room for confusion here, you could drive a semi-trailer through it.
    k. Paper checklists and emergency checklists. Now come on guys and gals, computer checklists were common back in the 80s, so why the hell are we still operating with bits of crumpled and torn paper?
    l. Mainwheels that retract into the hydraulics and flight-controls bay, where shredded tyres can inflict severe damage on a multitude of systems. Some airlines placed cages in the wheel-bay to protect the systems, but they did make routine maintenance difficult. And the hydraulic release fuses were hardly an adequate solution to a failed 1960s design.
    m. Center fuel pumps in the center tank, which can overheat and explode - and no auto-switching system was devised to prevent this. Has this been solved on the Max, because it was a butcher’s bin on the NG?
    n. Passenger doors that have to be armed by grovelling on the floor. This is rather like having a starter-handle on a modern car.
    o. Flight-deck windows that are smaller than an old-fashioned cruise-liner port-hole, because that was all they could make in 1950. Trouble is, we are in 2021 now.
    I could go on, but that is sufficient for now.
    See ‘Death Plane’ on the Russel Scott channel.
    I made these videos under the ‘Paul Spencer’ name, for employment reasons.
    These two videos have never been challenged.
    Ralph

    • @eragonfreedman9228
      @eragonfreedman9228 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      How many times are you going to type this exact same comment?

    • @phillies4eva
      @phillies4eva 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Well thought out and thorough answer.

    • @ShadowSlayer1441
      @ShadowSlayer1441 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I think having a paper copy of checklists and manuals on every plane is a good idea, but there should definitely be a computer based one as well.

    • @jiaan100
      @jiaan100 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Based

    • @RalphEllis
      @RalphEllis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@eragonfreedman9228. As many times as it takes to get the message through.
      The 737 Max is endangering the public.
      The same as storing 80% ethanol on the flight-deck is endangering passengers.
      (In the form of hand cleansers for covid and perfumes for narcissists.)
      Three aircraft have burned out, costing 76 lives, but nobody gives a damn.
      Should I stop posting these messages too?
      Do you want people to die?
      R

  • @kanagawakenji7
    @kanagawakenji7 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +84

    Just for note, the cockpit door is designed to blow open in the case of rapid cabin depressurization; but for whatever reason, very few crew members or even pilots are aware of it.

    • @tonyhawk123
      @tonyhawk123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Whats with the copy pasting of other users comments?

    • @kanagawakenji7
      @kanagawakenji7 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      @@tonyhawk123 Oh, I didn't scan the comments before posting, didn't realize it had already been said. I was just relaying information from a press conference held by Boeing (correction: NTSB chair Jennifer Homendy) where they talked about the issue and subsequent changes to training (ex. Actually telling crew that it's supposed to happen).

    • @kanagawakenji7
      @kanagawakenji7 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I just scrolled through the comments and did find similar comments that were posted before mine, but I had to scroll quite a bit before finding them.

    • @tonyhawk123
      @tonyhawk123 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@kanagawakenji7 fair enough

    • @KeyserSoze5421
      @KeyserSoze5421 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      I thought it was discussed by NTSB that the pilots were not aware of this at all? Or the cabin crew.