Why Were There So Many Crashes at Itzulia Basque Country? | THEMOVE
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ย. 2024
- JB Hager, Johan Bruyneel, and Spencer Martin from the Beyond the Peloton Newsletter break down the six-day Itzulia Basque Country (Tour of the Basque Country), starting with the reasons, and implications of the high-speed crash on Stage 4 that injured three of the four top contenders for the much-anticipated Tour de France, before getting into how Juan Ayuso and his UAE went to win the overall by leveraging their incredible team-wide strength on today’s final Stage 6. Before they go, Johan discusses who he thinks will win tomorrow’s Paris-Roubaix and gives a first-hand account of the current condition of the infamous cobblestones.
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let’s go Rim bake back on, new design and that’s it 😎
Yes and less Aerostuff...
Remco will take longer than you think. The scapula is the hardest bone in the body. It will cause spasms in the shoulder and neck area as healing progresses.
Agree
This race will go down on the calendar as the one that affected so many of the GC riders later season plans
You mean to say the biggest winner of this race is Pogacar and his 2 GT titles this year, IF he does not crash himself.
@@zigazdovc6175 right now, depending on how riders recover, these crashes certainly benefit the GC riders not in attendance!
10:10 Johan nailed it. The brakes are too powerful for the tires to handle that causes skidding.
yup, totally agree. You can 'feather' you rim brake modulation and actually feel the wheel-to-road traction in your hands via the rim brake levers / very hard to do with disc brakes because it's typically an all-or-none grab on the disc. Johan also nailed the narrow bars issue - there is a reason why mountain bike racers use wide bars for better leverage control of the steering. I doubt Pidcock would want to use a 38 flat bar on his next MTB race.
@@cicliolmo7152 I guess the manufacturers were late in realizing that the power of disc brakes on road bikes needs to be paired with wide tires so that traction is not compromised during braking.
The problem is that the tires needs to be as wide as those for MTBs with the current disc brake set-up which is why they introduced gravel bikes.
Super wide tires for road bike is not ideal because of weight and aerodynamics so Shimano filed a patent for an ABS system that once fully developed would surely raise the prices of road bikes to car territory.
Then the bike industry will collapse in its entirety because they all forgot that the bicycle is meant to be simple, robust and affordable.
I've heard that using rear brakes is better for cornering. Thanks to the panel for their insightful analysis on how braking culture has changed with the adoption of disc brakes in the peloton. All the best. 10:08
Jonas had: broken ribs, collarbone, collapsed lung, perforated lung. Rib injuries are the worst probably. He needs surgery but they cannot operate yet due to the lung injury
“Jay will remain in hospital for the next few days to be observed and recover further. He will wear a neck brace for up to six weeks, but will be able to begin full-body rehabilitation from next week,” the UAE team announced
Johan wins Trivia Question of the Day, that was a good one. And interesting, the narrow bars could be adversely affecting handling.
Great in-depth analysis, and refreshing departure from the whole you can't pad every corner/entire course and that's the end of any coherent discussion-type mentality.
Why so many awful crashes lately!? This is getting out of hand. Loved hearing Johanns insight.
I completely agree with you guys...... It are the riders and the DS who should think twice..... I also hate to see those GC men in the front in sprint stages.
3:05 Jay Vine drives for UAE .. not Visma ;)
Great point about the brakes. When you know you have to brake earlier you take more care and more time to react. Maybe if manufacturers think more about safety that speed probably would have less accidents.
That corner was marked only at the apex which would be meaningless given the speeds - It should have been protected (hindsight.) I agree with Johan about not being on the drops on fast downhills - also being on the drops brings your cg down for better balance & control. First rider down (Lidl-Trek) tucked the front probably from grabbing a handful of front brake in a panic.
Another great show guys 👍
Primoz will finaly get his Tour win this year ❣
lol
Why are the crashes happening:
The get to the front culture.
Teams racing from kilometer 0
The bike positions
Sponsor pressure is growing
Really bad crash. It opens the door wide for Pogacar. He will probably in LBL, Giro and the Tour.
Does this setup Pogacar for the Tour? Erhhm yes!!! (strange that Johan was reluctant to say that the Tour is now pretty much decided, barring accidents)
Where I live in Southern Spain, every descent has rock walls, huge drops, and boulders the size of cars...you would be paddling 90kms every day...impossible!
The other major change in the last few years is TV coverage. The races a re televised start to finish, not just the last 25% of the stage - thus the pressure is always on.
Not all races and certainly not basque country. I don't see that being a bigger factor than anything else discussed hrte
Stage 6 was amazing
I think the issue was the tubeless tyres blowing out of the rim before the crash that caused the carnage
The Tyre issue has happened before in different teams , but downhill on a corner makes it worst 😮
Pogi is using the giro to be even better in the tour
As the stages/races get shorter it will always be full gas. The ultra stiff bikes also tend to skip on rough roads, bumps, etc. But the wider, lower-pressure tires and better brakes make it safer. Who knows....
I think the big riders should not be riding gc for every race. There's a whole team who can do that. Keep your best riders back. If they want to pull or do a stage win then fair enough but going eyeballs out on tricky roads should be a no no. The Basque race is not any big rider's main goal.
how do pro teams practice descending high mountain ? Are there closed road areas that they can use , or are you always hoping there are no cars coming up around a bend?
What is the thought about riders ages & crashes? Riders are no longer waiting to be big tour winners. Important years for development
About risks, shouldn't we look also at the huge gearing cyclists use, especially in descent? I mean, with a 555 or 56 x 10 or 9, you make easily 80 kph or more, where you were not able to do that on a 54x12 back then; with the false confidence of having better brakes, so getting used to braking very late... It used to be that the peloton would descent as a long row of individual cyclists, because nobody would get away anyway when you get to the valley. Now everybody is eager to be at the front.
The answer is a mix of bad luck and too many guys fighting for position with no need
Overcooking corners and twitching on the brakes is the key cause of crashes at every road race I ever participated in. And I race M3 . To se e this "level" of ridership at the pro level is just bonkers. Riders need to really chill out in the peloton. The ever-higher speeds half wheeling on fast descents benefits nobody. A race is won by the person to finish first, not the fastest person in the race.
The race layout is way too easy, the climbs weren't hard enough to separate the peleton
If Remco is in front (which he was, he was in the second place before the crash) you want to be close behind him... Remco has an affection to clear out from the bunch and that is sth you cannot let him do it. That is why Primož and Jonas were right there behind him...
Bigger tyres with lower rolling resistance have less grip. Add in higher speeds, more riders at higher speeds, disc brakes and you have a recipe. 28mm should be widest tyre on the road
I’m a big fan of Johan but that comment re being in the hoods vs drops is just plain wrong. If you hit a bump while being on the hoods does NOT mean your hands will fly off. Go to your bike and grab the hoods. Three to four fingers wrap around the hoods for perfect grip while one or two fingers rest on the brake levers. There is no compromise in the grip strength. To reinforce my position please note that 100% of the elite cross field races on the hoods. No one’s hands are flying off the bars there.
I do think it's less stable for big bumps. It's not that your hands come off. You're just not able to control the bike as well. The centre of gravity is higher too in the hoods.
But riders don't expect big bumps on descent like the one on that corner.
Most roadies know nothing about bike handling . Sorry. Unless they came from MTB and then for sure they know. Descending on tight corners at high speed in the drops is just plain wrong. Hands on the hoods and ass way back is the way to go. Ass off the saddle, behind it is the way to go. I see way too many roadies glued to the saddle, rigid body and that simply means they follow the bike. Your body is the fulcrum - use your body weight to swing left, right and change your trajectory. Phew.
Oh hell yeah, 100% agree with this, you can totally see the difference in handling skills between the MTB/Cx guys like mvdp, wva, Tom Pidc and the other riders of the peloton.
You're right if you're holding on. But most people on the hoods just have their hands relaxed until it gets bumpy - sudden bump and your off. In the drops you automatically hold on.
The problem is just insufficient tecnical skills with bike. New generation riders with very limited peloton experience...
Real 💩 week… greetings from 🇩🇰 😪
I do not like the sound of Richard Plugge.. Jonas will be 💯 ..next year for sure..
Glad to hear Vine doesn’t need surgery…looked really bad …
I agree!
I hope Jonas and all the other guys will be back soon!As a fan of Roglic I can understand the "feeling: TDF 2021! TDF 2022 and the list with Roglic goes on and on,but he always bounces back.So will Jonas 🍀
Disc brakes never made sense to me. I have only wanted better grip in my tyres never thought about more braking power its not a factor to me. Jonas is going to be lucky to ride tdf.
Does JB's microphone say "Heil"?
We always think about Johan as the incredible DS but we cannot forget he was a bad @ss racer. Took 7th in the Tour, podiumed the Vuelta and 2nd Tour of the Basque Country....
After watching the various video clips of the crash the question that is the elephant in the room is which rider was the trigger of all the braking? To me the culprit was the Lidl Trek rider carrying way too much speed for his skill level into the corner.
Giro will be nothing but training for POGI and he doesn’t have to drop it to be 💯 for TDF
We will see, let's hope that he's not the next one who can make a trip to the hospital.... And Roglic will kick Pogi's ass in the Tour by the way. 😉✌
What a cursed race
Are the injuries worse because the riders are skinnier?
I think so
@@DDai-qd8ukI don’t think they’re skinner. I’m friends with a former pro and he told me stories of how the top riders would fuel back in the day. They’d eat as little food as possible off the bike and barely eat on the bike. They basically starved themselves year round. Nowadays they have dietitians working with them to make sure that they’re eating enough. Crashing at 80+ kph will cause fractures regardless of how much/little you eat.
ABS?
Ah, Spencer's Pogacar disdain has reached stratospheric levels! He's absolutely convinced that Jonas wouldn't even break a bead of sweat without his injury. For a solid two years, he's conveniently overlooked any rational explanation behind Jonas' victories - probably too busy concocting plans to sip champagne from Jonas' cycling shoes post-race! Oh, Spencer, what a revelation: Pogi's preordained to sweep the Giro and Tour de France, Jonas having injury or no injury. Clearly, it's high time Spencer set aside the Kool-Aid and started dissecting races with a pristine, unbiased intellect. And please, spare me the accusations of bias just because I happen to root for Team Pogi - my insights are just as golden as yours. Here's to that, with or without that delightful shoe-themed bubbly! 🚴♂🍾😄
i ride 44cm Steerer
what is the new proposed yellow and red card system?
Jonas Win The Tour again 😂
No way.
In 2025 💯 👍
What caused the crash?
Road disc. Road tubeless. Road hookless
4 wide peloton @50mph into an almost 90 degree turn. On a bumpy root filled tarmac. Just not being careful enough.
Roots
u ppl always blaming disc brakes while with rim they might be dead now
@@LarsRyeJeppesen Or 50mph in a 4 wide peloton into a sharp corner.
@@Lion-wd1px You people? You mean Johan? The most knowledgeable cyclist analyst and former pro rider? Who has seen the entire timeline of the past 30 years up close and personal? Those people?
This studio is Pogacar 😂.he will NOT win against vingegaard.its Like Lance against the rest
really?😂
Pogi can win a TDF without Jonas on a penny farthing
yeah?
@@NosyNorseman Naaah Roglic will kick Pogi's ass this Tour..
@@swissbiggy optimistic… but he is the strongest contender if Jonas not there…