Hello Jayne from Alberta, Canada. Made a batch of pre-compost a couple weeks ago as I'm switching to bin system from the 'worm bag' system which I can't keep evenly hydrated. Worms came out of bag system very sluggish, after a week in the pre-compost they are lively and are looking much better. Thanks for your videos the information is excellent!
@@albertabluesky Oh that’s excellent news Albert! I had the small bag in a bucket system when I started - for 9 months! It did work well but moisture management was a challenge at times 😩. I much prefer the bin system 🤩. My survivor worms perked right back up once they were placed into fresh pre-compost. It’s great stuff! I’m so glad it’s working for you too 😍🪱
Hello Jayne, I started my pre compost bins about 8 weeks ago, still working on how to get the temperature higher in my newer bins, i reach about 125 degrees for a few days and staying above 100 for another week eventually going to around 85. I let it stabilize to 85 for a couple weeks and turned over a few times. Used to feed my bins this last week, and I have not seen my worms to be as alive and active with in an hour or 2 of adding a 1 inch layer of pre compost. They have been as active for days now enjoying it. Thank you for sharing this process…
@@fsicil1 Welcome Francisco to the Castings Crew! You did fantastic with the pre-compost! I would not worry about getting the temperature any higher. I stay below 130F myself. The mid to high 120F range is plenty to get you the great biota feast the works love - as you’ve seen! Your temperature peak and then the longer slow cool down is perfect 👍. It’s so awesome your works are loving it! And once you get the hang of the ratios to make the pre-compost it couldn’t be easier and cheaper and you can’t beat the results! Thanks so much for sharing your results 😍😎🪱
Great news! I asked the café where I was having breakfast nearby for their coffee grounds today. It was still early for them to have a full load, but I still got some. Now, I'm just waiting for my wheel to come back. Three of my usual food scrap producers are back in Taiwan for the summer, lol (always good to have less dishes and laundry to do though, enjoying the vacation ha) 🎉 Happy summer, Jayne!
@@Soil4Soul Hi Cassie! That’s awesome about the coffee grounds! Do you think you’ll be able to get more? I’m afraid I don’t remember about the wheel…? Are the food scrap produces 3 of your kids? Or students? Less work is great when it comes to meal prep and laundry 🤩. More time for worms 🤣🪱
@@RockinWorms hahaha my husband, my usual driver (I don't have a camara man but I do have a driver lol -- as I'm not familiar with Canadian traffic and don't go out much, I don't drive here), and 2 of my 3 kids are back to Taiwan for summer. No much cooking, laundry, food scrapes and everything. Quiet vacation for newbie worm mama. 😆 I guess coffee ground can wait. Happy weekend, Jayne.
@@Soil4Soul While I’m sure you’ll miss the family hustle and bustle, it’ll be nice to slow down for a little while 😊. I’m actually the driver for Cameraman! I’m too Type A to be a good passenger 🤣. You have a good weekend too! 🪱🪱
Appreciate all your hard work and that of cameraman too in cranking out your videos. Your spotlighting the details of not only what to do, but also what not to do has been invaluable to me in my worming adventure. Just hit the subscribe button, so I guess i am officially one of your casting crew. Thanks a bunch, Phil H
@@Phil-Z-Mon Aww! Welcome to the Castings Crew Phil! Thanks for subscribing - that really helps me too 🥰. I’m glad you’re finding all the information helpful. 🪱🪱🪱
Jayne, it would be so helpful if you could reduce the amount of labour you have to do through the summer to do your pre-compost. As you know, every time you handle the material, it takes time. I wonder if a wedge type system assembly line would work where you take finished material off the end straight into a breeder bin and sit it for a day to acclimatize indoors. I know this is a seasonal problem, but I feel for you working in those temperatures! ~ Sandra
@@NanasWorms I totally agree with you that I need to address this! It’s too killer to be out in the heat for long and there’s not enough time to get work done as it is 😡. This is my first full summer operating these many bins. Frankly I wasn’t prepared! I definitely need to plan better for next year, perhaps by ‘stocking up’ on pre-compost in late spring. Of course that has issues too - storage space, keeping bugs out, keeping it from dry out, etc. I need to out my thinking cap on! 🧐. I appreciate your idea and will give it some serious thought! 😍🤩🪱
You are such a wonderful teacher! Texas heat is brutal as well and I hope to have many more bins going by next summer. I hope you figure out these make ahead issues too! Keep it up, Jayne. I look forward to all of your videos!
@@kellylables Hi Kelly! It’s brutal hot is so many places. We worm wranglers have to make changes to adjust to it 🥵. Texas! Woof! You guys are super hot already too 😳. This is my first summer in full swing so I’m learning as I go and really need to plan better for next year! I’ll be sharing what works and what doesn’t 🤩. Thanks so much for your support and watching 💕🪱🪱
Jayne, if you don't need the precompost so soon, is it better to let it cool by itself over many weeks ? I'm thinking of its quality for worm food. Thanks for your videos.
@@timmcilraith8762 Hi Tim! I don’t know that it would make much of a difference overall. The biota is the same. It’s more a case of the longer the compost sits, the more it breaks down. At cooler temps it’s still composting but just as a slower pace. If I don’t need the pre-compost I’d let it cool down naturally simply because it’s less work for me! 🪱🪱
@@davidhumphrey171 Hello! Welcome to the Castings Crew! Thanks for subbing 😍. It is indeed good for both bedding and food. They burrow under it as bedding and then feast on the biota. They also like any pieces of cardboard shred that on the pre-compost. They eat it all! 🤩👍🪱
@@kylewestrom7849 Hey Kyle! How have you been? I’ve done both. Lately it’s been more veggie water, pasta water, rice rinse water, corn boil water, etc. I don’t have the access to lots of yucky veggies right now. 😩. In the past when I had lots of ‘extra’ veggie I could purée them to use in the pre-compost mixture. Both methods work well. So whatever is easiest for you is what you should do! 👍😎🪱
@@cherylhowker1792 Yes. More mass in any composting system sets up a positive feedback loop which accelerates the composting process. The mass holds in heat better as well as moisture. The biota love this! So they’re happy and reproduce more. This makes even more heat and moisture so they make even more biota. It keeps going until the food lessens, the heat reduces, or the type of biota growing has reached its limit. The benefit of mass is why successfully scaling down pre- compost making to 18-20 gallon totes was such a breakthrough! It’s been generally held that anything less than 3 feet cubed won’t work fast. Well, we showed that up for false! Yippee! But it’s also why pre-composting in a 5 gallon bucket is really hard. Not enough mass to get the cycle kicked off. You’ve got the understanding perfectly! 😍🪱🤩
@@RockinWorms I’ve had my latest box going and the heat coming outta it warm to the touch on top. Today I went and checked and nope- it’s not really broken down much at all, I’ve had it all out and aired and put back in- didn’t add any, it’s sitting at 30c so not hot enough needs to be 40-50 to be in the green zone- would be about 100f . Think the 30=80f on the thermostat. What can I do? I wanna go get some yeast as mines been thrown out we think- outta date so carer chucks it- it’s for the worms not me to eat!!! So I will try get more but may be a week! What can I do in the mean time? It’s only my 2nd box so I’m really not sure what I’m doing tbh. And I’ve watched everything again. I don’t wanna add anything - like water incase I make it worse!
@@RockinWorms I’m also aware that I was hoping this lit would be done by now lol shows I have no idea. So will need to do another cycle of coir. As I do have lots of that. As got a great deal but I know the precompost is better for the worms.
@@cherylhowker1792 Ues the pre-compost is much better for the worms 😍. Each worm wrangler will have their own circumstances and we need time to learn teller and tweak as needed. You’re doing great! 👍 🤩🪱
@@cherylhowker1792 Oh no on the yeast being thrown out 😡. I keep mine in the freezer. Lasts years there. You can try sugar water to feed the biota that’s there. Molasses or corn syrup works too. Jam or jelly. Anything high in sugar. Thin it out a bit so it mixes in easier or can pour on top and let it seep down. People have reported fresh cut grass works if you want to up the nitrogen vs adding biota. You also have castings from your work bins - adding a generous amount will also increase the biota. The first time or two making pre/co post can be challenging. Sometimes it happens great and other times it’s a bit of a struggle. 😩. Just know that it’ll come right in the end and once you’ve got the first batch done and can use some of that as an add to the next batch, it gets so much easier. My first attempts were in the 105-107F range. So don’t despair. Quite moist is ok, soppy is not the best. 😊🪱
Hi Jane, I'm curious about your statement that your worms prefer mesophilic microbes over thermophilic populations. I use thermophilic compost methods in large batches to denature the seeds to prevent them from sprouting in finished vermicompost. Is your opinion based on anecdotal evidence or is there any science to back that up. I am looking to create the best environment for my worms, maybe I could innoculate my bedding with a vermicompost extract to reintroduce those beneficial microbes while still eliminating seeds through the thermophilic process. Thanks for your efforts, I appreciate it.
@@projectoldman3383 Hi! Welcome to the Castings Crew! I’d have to rewatch the video to refresh myself on my exact wording but what I mean to convey is that the worms are good with both mesophilic and thermophilic bacteria which are most present in pre-compost temperatures between 68F - 133F. It is temps above the 133F temps that seem to be mostly biota that the worms don’t like so much. My conclusion is indeed based on feedback from my own subscribers that have had negative worm reactions from compost heated into the 140F+ range. As in the worms died. There’s a lot of holes in official worm research! I hope that changes as worms are studied more due to real benefits that are being recognized they have. Until then anecdotal data is what we’ve got to work with. 😊 I have just read that thermophilic ranges up higher than I previously knew! I didn’t learn that from what I’d read before. I’ve learned something new! I apologize for my ignorance on this and for any confusion I’ve caused you and everyone else 🥲. I’ll start referencing it as the low to middle thermophilic temperature range as the heat range that seems to be best suited for making biota the worms like best 💕. Thank you for pointing me in the direction so I could learn this! As pre-compost cools down lower range thermophilic and mesophilic bacteria will eventually recolonize. That takes time. And also there’s less food for them in the tote as lots of it was consumed during the heat up phase. If you can reintroduce meso/lower thermophilic bacteria quickly thru an extract that would be fantastic! Do you have a process to do that?? For me, since I’m impatient and don’t have an extract to use, and I also often need/want my pre-compost in my worms bins sooner rather than later, waiting an additional extended timeframe for the desired biota to recolonize naturally doesn’t work for me. It’s more efficient to just keep the pre-compost in the desired temperature range to begin with. I also don’t have to contend with weed seeds as none of my pre-compost ingredients would have seeds in it. If you’re adding ingredients that would have seeds (like grass or weeds) then cooking/denaturing the seeds first can make sense. This is where the specifics of a worm wrangler’s situation comes into play. My hope is to set worm wranglers on a path that is better for their worms, easy to do, and cost effective as well. I am thrilled to expand my knowledge along the way too! Thanks for commenting!! 🤩🪱🪱
@@RockinWorms wow, thanks for your response. I’ve been using thermophilic compost that heats up to between 130-150 then cools to ambient and is mixed with shredded leaves and peat moss as bedding for a few years with no problems but I am now trying to optimize my breeder bins. I am expanding my 8’x 2’ CFT system to include a 4’x 8’ wedge system and need to populate quickly. I’ve got 7 mortar tray breeder bins on the 3rd 21 day cycle getting more cocoons each time and I just add the separated bedding/castings with the cocoons to my wedge system. I’m trying to get the wedge filled and ready by late spring 2025 , it’s about 15% full now. Fingers crossed.
It’s one cycle looking on the top layer. Then it gets progressively more broken down as I dig deeper. It kinda works out great! I have the chunky stuff for the grow out bins and the finished finer stuff for the breeder bins. I didn’t plan it that way but I’m happy that’s how it’s working out 👍🤩😎🪱
Jayne-- I asked before , IM interested in getting a larger bin than my factory 360. I can get a shoebox size , but Im looking the bigger size like you show in the racks . How large are they and where can I get one?
Humorous! I’m sorry if I previously missed your question 😩 My bins are the Sterilite brand that Walmart sells. 28 quart size. They are approximately 23.5”x17”x6”. The exact ones I bought are still out of stock on Walmart online. Sometimes they’re in the store. Walmart does have the same size with a different colored lid in a 20 pack. Price is several dollars more per bin than what I paid last year 😩. Check out hardware stores as well for similar sized bins. Good luck finding them for a good price! 🪱😊
@@RockinWorms Thanks for replying. I actually 1 sterlite 58 qt from walmart , but My walmart does not have the size you have so I will try and order of they are available. The shorter height is easier to work with for what Im wanting to do.
Hi, Jane. I would like to have european nightcrawlers but I'm not finding them for sale in Europe. Do you or anyone here know if there is any place where I can buy them?
Definitely a newbie question... So please forgive me. Precompost 2 cycle. What does that mean? I've seen your videos on precompost.. and how to make sure it gets hot enough. I have a bin of precompost that has been heated and then cooled, but I'm guessing a (2 cycle precompost) means I have to reheat and recool? If that's the case, do I just add more coffee, cardboard, and veg slurry? If thats the case, isn't the new material technically a 1 cycle and the old stuff a 2 cycle? Sorry.. again. I'm probably over thinking things again, but I cannot find a definitive answer online. 😩
@@ericaboss1835 Hi Erica! Welcome! I’m afraid definitive answers are in short supply in the current worm world. More research is being done as the amazing help worms can give humans becomes more known and appreciated. But it’s going to take decades to fill in the blanks of worm abilities, best practices, etc. Until then we’ve all got opinions and experience and knowledge to share! You’re right! A 2 cycle pre-compost means what you thought. We heat and cool the mix and then heat and cool it again. Technically the end result will indeed have both 1 cycle and 2 cycle pre-compost. But if we broaden out the definition of 2 cycle to include the 2nd cycle added material that is as broken down as much as the double cycled first batch then we find that the amount of 1 cycle pre-compost is not as much as we’d expect. Why is this? It’s mostly because the second batch of materials is going onto an already actively hot composting bin with so much more biota in it than what we started off with. And this existing biota is hungry and looking for more food in the form of the newly added carbon and nitrogen or old carbon that is better able to be processed. They jump right on it and work much faster than the starting biota could that had to grow and establish the pre-compost ecosystem from zero. It’s akin to having a running start in a race 😎. That said, in this system where we totally push the boundaries of what can be accomplished in breaking down organic material in a fast and easy way, with the express goal of making awesome worm food and bedding, not every piece of cardboard will be decomposed in a matter of days or even a few weeks. But most if not all will be well on its way, the biota grown will be fantastic and our worms will be thrilled 👍❤️😎. Ok? Now circling back to your other question… yes, the 2nd cycling means adding fresh ‘something’ to rejuvenate the biota and make it shift back into high decomposing gear. That ‘something’ can be adding more carbon and nitrogen (I wouldn’t add carbon without more nitrogen, unless you have a nitrogen issue already happening aka smells bad, as higher carbon ratios slow down composting), more liquid, more biota (aka yeast or similar), and/or more air in common with any of the foregoing ingredients. It’s probably easiest if I give you a few real examples from my pre-composting 😊. My top few inches get really dry and aren’t broken down much at all despite the biota bloom often seen. So adding in more liquid and mixing, which also adds air, will awaken the biota and get it working at a higher level, breaking down that cardboard more. 👍 In past batches I’ve had smelly bottom layers due to too much liquid. So in that case I added more carbon to soak it up and mixed it up, which adds air. That got the tote cooking again. If I saw that there was more unbroken down cardboard than expected or maybe the tote didn’t heat up all that much, I added yeast which added more biota, more liquid and also air as I mixed the yeast in. Pre-composting is a living ecosystem and it’ll be different every darn time. So we need to do our best to analyze what’s happening, where we need to go and how best to get there. I hope to provide the tools and general knowledge to help get you to a happy end result! I know this isn’t the definitive answer you were hoping for - wouldn’t it be great to have an exact recipe to follow?! - but it’s the best I can do. I hope it helps you! And always, always come ask questions and we’ll figure it out together! 😍🤩🪱
Thank you! My over analytical brain wants to make sure I do everything within my control correctly so that when other stuff comes up, I can eliminate the sources. Your response has definitely helped my brain relax tonight and I'll be reworking my pre-compost tomorrow for a 2nd cycle. Also.. can you remind me again. 2nd cycle is best for breeders and 1st cycle is best for everything else?
@@ericaboss1835 No such thing as having an over analytical brain! The analysis is always good! It’s not getting analysis paralysis that’s the trick 🤣. 2 cycle pre-compost is best for breeders if setting up for maximum cocoon production is the goal. You need other factors too like high moisture levels, easy food, appropriate worm density, etc. But 2 cycle pre-compost is definitely on that list! 👍 ‘Everyone else’ likes 2 cycle pre-compost too! But grow out bin worms do fine with the 1 cycle stuff 😊. I save my 2 cycle for my breeders as I only have so much and they get first dibs 😝. I also often want to slow down my castings generation or stretch out the time between feedings and bin refreshing (busy, busy!) in my grow out bins. 1 cycle pre-compost as bedding helps with that. Again, it all depends on what your specific goals are at the moment which cycle will best. And as your goals change you can change the type/cycle of pre-compost given to specific worms. Ok? 🪱🪱
Yes! That's perfect! Thank you. Will be attempting my first breeder bins as soon as my pre-compost is done with its cycle 2. Also.. do you think dried fig leaves will work for the leaf component? I'm in California and we don't have many fallen leaves around. I suppose I could take some from the forest if I absolutely have to, but would be easy if I could use dried pear, orange, or fig leaves that I can harvest from my backyard. We also have a Japanese maple tree, but I'm thinking those leaves won't be thick enough? Thoughts?
@@ericaboss1835 Are you asking about adding leaves to a breeder bin? I actually don’t do that anymore 😊. The leaves act as an unwanted obstruction to worm movement thru the bin, slowing down the meet and mating of the breeders. The breeder bin components shown in this video are what I’ve been doing for quite a while now. I don’t remember exactly when I stopped using leaves in breeder bins 🙄. As for leaves in grow out bins, they’re great, especially if you want to slow down a bin as leaves generally take longer to breakdown and be processed in the bin ecosystem. Thick and/or waxy leaves take the longest. Like really long. Citrus leaves do contain citrus oils. Generally we don’t want to add oils to worm bins as they could coat the worm body and cause respiratory distress or even suffocation. I simply don’t know how much oil is in citrus leaves and if it’d be a problem. 🤷♂️. You can certainly try by placing leaves in a spot where the worms can get into the leaves or avoid them if they want. I suspect that as the leaves dry the worms will be happy to munch on them and any biota that the leaves have. 💕 I did read that it’s best to avoid insect repellent leaves and wood like redwood, cypress, etc. I don’t know if this is a ‘fact’ or a ‘better safe than sorry’ thing, especially as worms are not insects. Just thought I’d mention it 😎. Thin crinkly leaves like maple would be a real worm treat! 🪱
Uk temperature is 25c max lol still not warm enough really for the warm weather crops, but it’s helping. I’d say I may start cutting out the small melons again as it’s long enough lol. Not hot enough for long enough so not worth the effect
@@cherylhowker1792 Farming anything is hard work! And so much of it is out of our control 😩. Sometimes it’s a case of take what you can get and be happy! 😊
@@lynnelichtenstern-ug1fb Did it make a cameo? I have a small baby one living in my shower these days 🙄. I catch and release the one I can. It’s the iguanas I can do without! 😎
Uk temperature is 25c max lol still not warm enough really for the warm weather crops, but it’s helping. I’d say I may start cutting out the small melons again as it’s long enough lol. Not hot enough for long enough so not worth the effect
Hello Jayne from Alberta, Canada. Made a batch of pre-compost a couple weeks ago as I'm switching to bin system from the 'worm bag' system which I can't keep evenly hydrated. Worms came out of bag system very sluggish, after a week in the pre-compost they are lively and are looking much better. Thanks for your videos the information is excellent!
@@albertabluesky Oh that’s excellent news Albert! I had the small bag in a bucket system when I started - for 9 months! It did work well but moisture management was a challenge at times 😩. I much prefer the bin system 🤩.
My survivor worms perked right back up once they were placed into fresh pre-compost. It’s great stuff! I’m so glad it’s working for you too 😍🪱
Hello Jayne, I started my pre compost bins about 8 weeks ago, still working on how to get the temperature higher in my newer bins, i reach about 125 degrees for a few days and staying above 100 for another week eventually going to around 85. I let it stabilize to 85 for a couple weeks and turned over a few times.
Used to feed my bins this last week, and I have not seen my worms to be as alive and active with in an hour or 2 of adding a 1 inch layer of pre compost. They have been as active for days now enjoying it. Thank you for sharing this process…
@@fsicil1 Welcome Francisco to the Castings Crew! You did fantastic with the pre-compost! I would not worry about getting the temperature any higher. I stay below 130F myself. The mid to high 120F range is plenty to get you the great biota feast the works love - as you’ve seen! Your temperature peak and then the longer slow cool down is perfect 👍.
It’s so awesome your works are loving it! And once you get the hang of the ratios to make the pre-compost it couldn’t be easier and cheaper and you can’t beat the results! Thanks so much for sharing your results 😍😎🪱
Great news! I asked the café where I was having breakfast nearby for their coffee grounds today. It was still early for them to have a full load, but I still got some. Now, I'm just waiting for my wheel to come back. Three of my usual food scrap producers are back in Taiwan for the summer, lol (always good to have less dishes and laundry to do though, enjoying the vacation ha) 🎉 Happy summer, Jayne!
@@Soil4Soul Hi Cassie! That’s awesome about the coffee grounds! Do you think you’ll be able to get more?
I’m afraid I don’t remember about the wheel…?
Are the food scrap produces 3 of your kids? Or students? Less work is great when it comes to meal prep and laundry 🤩. More time for worms 🤣🪱
@@RockinWorms hahaha my husband, my usual driver (I don't have a camara man but I do have a driver lol -- as I'm not familiar with Canadian traffic and don't go out much, I don't drive here), and 2 of my 3 kids are back to Taiwan for summer. No much cooking, laundry, food scrapes and everything. Quiet vacation for newbie worm mama. 😆 I guess coffee ground can wait. Happy weekend, Jayne.
@@Soil4Soul While I’m sure you’ll miss the family hustle and bustle, it’ll be nice to slow down for a little while 😊.
I’m actually the driver for Cameraman! I’m too Type A to be a good passenger 🤣.
You have a good weekend too! 🪱🪱
Appreciate all your hard work and that of cameraman too in cranking out your videos. Your spotlighting the details of not only what to do, but also what not to do has been invaluable to me in my worming adventure. Just hit the subscribe button, so I guess i am officially one of your casting crew. Thanks a bunch, Phil H
@@Phil-Z-Mon Aww! Welcome to the Castings Crew Phil! Thanks for subscribing - that really helps me too 🥰. I’m glad you’re finding all the information helpful. 🪱🪱🪱
Jayne, it would be so helpful if you could reduce the amount of labour you have to do through the summer to do your pre-compost. As you know, every time you handle the material, it takes time. I wonder if a wedge type system assembly line would work where you take finished material off the end straight into a breeder bin and sit it for a day to acclimatize indoors. I know this is a seasonal problem, but I feel for you working in those temperatures!
~ Sandra
@@NanasWorms I totally agree with you that I need to address this! It’s too killer to be out in the heat for long and there’s not enough time to get work done as it is 😡. This is my first full summer operating these many bins. Frankly I wasn’t prepared! I definitely need to plan better for next year, perhaps by ‘stocking up’ on pre-compost in late spring. Of course that has issues too - storage space, keeping bugs out, keeping it from dry out, etc. I need to out my thinking cap on! 🧐. I appreciate your idea and will give it some serious thought! 😍🤩🪱
You are such a wonderful teacher! Texas heat is brutal as well and I hope to have many more bins going by next summer. I hope you figure out these make ahead issues too! Keep it up, Jayne. I look forward to all of your videos!
@@kellylables Hi Kelly! It’s brutal hot is so many places. We worm wranglers have to make changes to adjust to it 🥵. Texas! Woof! You guys are super hot already too 😳.
This is my first summer in full swing so I’m learning as I go and really need to plan better for next year! I’ll be sharing what works and what doesn’t 🤩. Thanks so much for your support and watching 💕🪱🪱
Jayne, if you don't need the precompost so soon, is it better to let it cool by itself over many weeks ? I'm thinking of its quality for worm food. Thanks for your videos.
@@timmcilraith8762 Hi Tim! I don’t know that it would make much of a difference overall. The biota is the same. It’s more a case of the longer the compost sits, the more it breaks down. At cooler temps it’s still composting but just as a slower pace.
If I don’t need the pre-compost I’d let it cool down naturally simply because it’s less work for me! 🪱🪱
New Subscriber here, and wanted to know if the pre-compost is primarily for bedding, or for food ? Or is it good for both ? Thanks.
Also does the amount you feed have to be reduced, or just extend the time between feedings ?
@@davidhumphrey171 Hello! Welcome to the Castings Crew! Thanks for subbing 😍.
It is indeed good for both bedding and food. They burrow under it as bedding and then feast on the biota. They also like any pieces of cardboard shred that on the pre-compost. They eat it all! 🤩👍🪱
Do you blend your food scraps and add it or just use vegetable water in your pre-compost mix?
@@kylewestrom7849 Hey Kyle! How have you been?
I’ve done both. Lately it’s been more veggie water, pasta water, rice rinse water, corn boil water, etc. I don’t have the access to lots of yucky veggies right now. 😩. In the past when I had lots of ‘extra’ veggie I could purée them to use in the pre-compost mixture. Both methods work well. So whatever is easiest for you is what you should do! 👍😎🪱
Is the mass storage the resin you say you need a bigger bin to start with? And why the smaller container don’t heat up and break down as much
@@cherylhowker1792 Yes. More mass in any composting system sets up a positive feedback loop which accelerates the composting process. The mass holds in heat better as well as moisture. The biota love this! So they’re happy and reproduce more. This makes even more heat and moisture so they make even more biota. It keeps going until the food lessens, the heat reduces, or the type of biota growing has reached its limit.
The benefit of mass is why successfully scaling down pre- compost making to 18-20 gallon totes was such a breakthrough! It’s been generally held that anything less than 3 feet cubed won’t work fast. Well, we showed that up for false! Yippee! But it’s also why pre-composting in a 5 gallon bucket is really hard. Not enough mass to get the cycle kicked off.
You’ve got the understanding perfectly! 😍🪱🤩
@@RockinWorms I’ve had my latest box going and the heat coming outta it warm to the touch on top. Today I went and checked and nope- it’s not really broken down much at all, I’ve had it all out and aired and put back in- didn’t add any, it’s sitting at 30c so not hot enough needs to be 40-50 to be in the green zone- would be about 100f . Think the 30=80f on the thermostat.
What can I do?
I wanna go get some yeast as mines been thrown out we think- outta date so carer chucks it- it’s for the worms not me to eat!!!
So I will try get more but may be a week!
What can I do in the mean time? It’s only my 2nd box so I’m really not sure what I’m doing tbh. And I’ve watched everything again.
I don’t wanna add anything - like water incase I make it worse!
@@RockinWorms I’m also aware that I was hoping this lit would be done by now lol shows I have no idea. So will need to do another cycle of coir. As I do have lots of that. As got a great deal but I know the precompost is better for the worms.
@@cherylhowker1792 Ues the pre-compost is much better for the worms 😍. Each worm wrangler will have their own circumstances and we need time to learn teller and tweak as needed. You’re doing great! 👍 🤩🪱
@@cherylhowker1792 Oh no on the yeast being thrown out 😡. I keep mine in the freezer. Lasts years there.
You can try sugar water to feed the biota that’s there. Molasses or corn syrup works too. Jam or jelly. Anything high in sugar. Thin it out a bit so it mixes in easier or can pour on top and let it seep down. People have reported fresh cut grass works if you want to up the nitrogen vs adding biota. You also have castings from your work bins - adding a generous amount will also increase the biota.
The first time or two making pre/co post can be challenging. Sometimes it happens great and other times it’s a bit of a struggle. 😩. Just know that it’ll come right in the end and once you’ve got the first batch done and can use some of that as an add to the next batch, it gets so much easier. My first attempts were in the 105-107F range. So don’t despair.
Quite moist is ok, soppy is not the best. 😊🪱
Hi Jane, I'm curious about your statement that your worms prefer mesophilic microbes over thermophilic populations. I use thermophilic compost methods in large batches to denature the seeds to prevent them from sprouting in finished vermicompost. Is your opinion based on anecdotal evidence or is there any science to back that up. I am looking to create the best environment for my worms, maybe I could innoculate my bedding with a vermicompost extract to reintroduce those beneficial microbes while still eliminating seeds through the thermophilic process. Thanks for your efforts, I appreciate it.
@@projectoldman3383 Hi! Welcome to the Castings Crew!
I’d have to rewatch the video to refresh myself on my exact wording but what I mean to convey is that the worms are good with both mesophilic and thermophilic bacteria which are most present in pre-compost temperatures between 68F - 133F. It is temps above the 133F temps that seem to be mostly biota that the worms don’t like so much. My conclusion is indeed based on feedback from my own subscribers that have had negative worm reactions from compost heated into the 140F+ range. As in the worms died. There’s a lot of holes in official worm research! I hope that changes as worms are studied more due to real benefits that are being recognized they have. Until then anecdotal data is what we’ve got to work with. 😊
I have just read that thermophilic ranges up higher than I previously knew! I didn’t learn that from what I’d read before. I’ve learned something new! I apologize for my ignorance on this and for any confusion I’ve caused you and everyone else 🥲. I’ll start referencing it as the low to middle thermophilic temperature range as the heat range that seems to be best suited for making biota the worms like best 💕. Thank you for pointing me in the direction so I could learn this!
As pre-compost cools down lower range thermophilic and mesophilic bacteria will eventually recolonize. That takes time. And also there’s less food for them in the tote as lots of it was consumed during the heat up phase. If you can reintroduce meso/lower thermophilic bacteria quickly thru an extract that would be fantastic! Do you have a process to do that??
For me, since I’m impatient and don’t have an extract to use, and I also often need/want my pre-compost in my worms bins sooner rather than later, waiting an additional extended timeframe for the desired biota to recolonize naturally doesn’t work for me. It’s more efficient to just keep the pre-compost in the desired temperature range to begin with.
I also don’t have to contend with weed seeds as none of my pre-compost ingredients would have seeds in it. If you’re adding ingredients that would have seeds (like grass or weeds) then cooking/denaturing the seeds first can make sense. This is where the specifics of a worm wrangler’s situation comes into play.
My hope is to set worm wranglers on a path that is better for their worms, easy to do, and cost effective as well. I am thrilled to expand my knowledge along the way too! Thanks for commenting!! 🤩🪱🪱
@@RockinWorms wow, thanks for your response. I’ve been using thermophilic compost that heats up to between 130-150 then cools to ambient and is mixed with shredded leaves and peat moss as bedding for a few years with no problems but I am now trying to optimize my breeder bins. I am expanding my 8’x 2’ CFT system to include a 4’x 8’ wedge system and need to populate quickly. I’ve got 7 mortar tray breeder bins on the 3rd 21 day cycle getting more cocoons each time and I just add the separated bedding/castings with the cocoons to my wedge system. I’m trying to get the wedge filled and ready by late spring 2025 , it’s about 15% full now. Fingers crossed.
Is that 1 hot turn precompost? Or 2 ? As looks like 1 to me but I know you trying to slow them down
It’s one cycle looking on the top layer. Then it gets progressively more broken down as I dig deeper. It kinda works out great! I have the chunky stuff for the grow out bins and the finished finer stuff for the breeder bins. I didn’t plan it that way but I’m happy that’s how it’s working out 👍🤩😎🪱
Jayne-- I asked before , IM interested in getting a larger bin than my factory 360. I can get a shoebox size , but Im looking the bigger size like you show in the racks . How large are they and where can I get one?
Humorous! I’m sorry if I previously missed your question 😩
My bins are the Sterilite brand that Walmart sells. 28 quart size. They are approximately 23.5”x17”x6”. The exact ones I bought are still out of stock on Walmart online. Sometimes they’re in the store. Walmart does have the same size with a different colored lid in a 20 pack. Price is several dollars more per bin than what I paid last year 😩.
Check out hardware stores as well for similar sized bins. Good luck finding them for a good price! 🪱😊
@@RockinWorms Thanks for replying. I actually 1 sterlite 58 qt from walmart , but My walmart does not have the size you have so I will try and order of they are available. The shorter height is easier to work with for what Im wanting to do.
@@yes350yes I just learned that Sterilite has their own direct sales website! Check that out and see if that makes sense as a place to buy the bins 👍🪱
Hi, Jane. I would like to have european nightcrawlers but I'm not finding them for sale in Europe.
Do you or anyone here know if there is any place where I can buy them?
@@tatianadossantos9027 Hey Tatiana! I’m not going to be of any help but hopefully someone will chime in. What country are you in? 🪱
Definitely a newbie question... So please forgive me. Precompost 2 cycle. What does that mean? I've seen your videos on precompost.. and how to make sure it gets hot enough. I have a bin of precompost that has been heated and then cooled, but I'm guessing a (2 cycle precompost) means I have to reheat and recool? If that's the case, do I just add more coffee, cardboard, and veg slurry? If thats the case, isn't the new material technically a 1 cycle and the old stuff a 2 cycle? Sorry.. again. I'm probably over thinking things again, but I cannot find a definitive answer online. 😩
@@ericaboss1835 Hi Erica! Welcome! I’m afraid definitive answers are in short supply in the current worm world. More research is being done as the amazing help worms can give humans becomes more known and appreciated. But it’s going to take decades to fill in the blanks of worm abilities, best practices, etc. Until then we’ve all got opinions and experience and knowledge to share!
You’re right! A 2 cycle pre-compost means what you thought. We heat and cool the mix and then heat and cool it again. Technically the end result will indeed have both 1 cycle and 2 cycle pre-compost. But if we broaden out the definition of 2 cycle to include the 2nd cycle added material that is as broken down as much as the double cycled first batch then we find that the amount of 1 cycle pre-compost is not as much as we’d expect. Why is this? It’s mostly because the second batch of materials is going onto an already actively hot composting bin with so much more biota in it than what we started off with. And this existing biota is hungry and looking for more food in the form of the newly added carbon and nitrogen or old carbon that is better able to be processed. They jump right on it and work much faster than the starting biota could that had to grow and establish the pre-compost ecosystem from zero. It’s akin to having a running start in a race 😎.
That said, in this system where we totally push the boundaries of what can be accomplished in breaking down organic material in a fast and easy way, with the express goal of making awesome worm food and bedding, not every piece of cardboard will be decomposed in a matter of days or even a few weeks. But most if not all will be well on its way, the biota grown will be fantastic and our worms will be thrilled 👍❤️😎. Ok?
Now circling back to your other question… yes, the 2nd cycling means adding fresh ‘something’ to rejuvenate the biota and make it shift back into high decomposing gear. That ‘something’ can be adding more carbon and nitrogen (I wouldn’t add carbon without more nitrogen, unless you have a nitrogen issue already happening aka smells bad, as higher carbon ratios slow down composting), more liquid, more biota (aka yeast or similar), and/or more air in common with any of the foregoing ingredients. It’s probably easiest if I give you a few real examples from my pre-composting 😊. My top few inches get really dry and aren’t broken down much at all despite the biota bloom often seen. So adding in more liquid and mixing, which also adds air, will awaken the biota and get it working at a higher level, breaking down that cardboard more. 👍
In past batches I’ve had smelly bottom layers due to too much liquid. So in that case I added more carbon to soak it up and mixed it up, which adds air. That got the tote cooking again. If I saw that there was more unbroken down cardboard than expected or maybe the tote didn’t heat up all that much, I added yeast which added more biota, more liquid and also air as I mixed the yeast in.
Pre-composting is a living ecosystem and it’ll be different every darn time. So we need to do our best to analyze what’s happening, where we need to go and how best to get there. I hope to provide the tools and general knowledge to help get you to a happy end result! I know this isn’t the definitive answer you were hoping for - wouldn’t it be great to have an exact recipe to follow?! - but it’s the best I can do. I hope it helps you! And always, always come ask questions and we’ll figure it out together! 😍🤩🪱
Thank you! My over analytical brain wants to make sure I do everything within my control correctly so that when other stuff comes up, I can eliminate the sources. Your response has definitely helped my brain relax tonight and I'll be reworking my pre-compost tomorrow for a 2nd cycle. Also.. can you remind me again. 2nd cycle is best for breeders and 1st cycle is best for everything else?
@@ericaboss1835 No such thing as having an over analytical brain! The analysis is always good! It’s not getting analysis paralysis that’s the trick 🤣.
2 cycle pre-compost is best for breeders if setting up for maximum cocoon production is the goal. You need other factors too like high moisture levels, easy food, appropriate worm density, etc. But 2 cycle pre-compost is definitely on that list! 👍
‘Everyone else’ likes 2 cycle pre-compost too! But grow out bin worms do fine with the 1 cycle stuff 😊. I save my 2 cycle for my breeders as I only have so much and they get first dibs 😝. I also often want to slow down my castings generation or stretch out the time between feedings and bin refreshing (busy, busy!) in my grow out bins. 1 cycle pre-compost as bedding helps with that.
Again, it all depends on what your specific goals are at the moment which cycle will best. And as your goals change you can change the type/cycle of pre-compost given to specific worms. Ok? 🪱🪱
Yes! That's perfect! Thank you. Will be attempting my first breeder bins as soon as my pre-compost is done with its cycle 2. Also.. do you think dried fig leaves will work for the leaf component? I'm in California and we don't have many fallen leaves around. I suppose I could take some from the forest if I absolutely have to, but would be easy if I could use dried pear, orange, or fig leaves that I can harvest from my backyard. We also have a Japanese maple tree, but I'm thinking those leaves won't be thick enough? Thoughts?
@@ericaboss1835 Are you asking about adding leaves to a breeder bin? I actually don’t do that anymore 😊. The leaves act as an unwanted obstruction to worm movement thru the bin, slowing down the meet and mating of the breeders. The breeder bin components shown in this video are what I’ve been doing for quite a while now. I don’t remember exactly when I stopped using leaves in breeder bins 🙄.
As for leaves in grow out bins, they’re great, especially if you want to slow down a bin as leaves generally take longer to breakdown and be processed in the bin ecosystem. Thick and/or waxy leaves take the longest. Like really long.
Citrus leaves do contain citrus oils. Generally we don’t want to add oils to worm bins as they could coat the worm body and cause respiratory distress or even suffocation. I simply don’t know how much oil is in citrus leaves and if it’d be a problem. 🤷♂️. You can certainly try by placing leaves in a spot where the worms can get into the leaves or avoid them if they want. I suspect that as the leaves dry the worms will be happy to munch on them and any biota that the leaves have. 💕
I did read that it’s best to avoid insect repellent leaves and wood like redwood, cypress, etc. I don’t know if this is a ‘fact’ or a ‘better safe than sorry’ thing, especially as worms are not insects. Just thought I’d mention it 😎.
Thin crinkly leaves like maple would be a real worm treat! 🪱
Uk temperature is 25c max lol still not warm enough really for the warm weather crops, but it’s helping.
I’d say I may start cutting out the small melons again as it’s long enough lol. Not hot enough for long enough so not worth the effect
@@cherylhowker1792 Farming anything is hard work! And so much of it is out of our control 😩. Sometimes it’s a case of take what you can get and be happy! 😊
If you just add 3 or 4 inches of the pre compost to your tub, it shouldn't heat up.
@@rickjay4639 You mean to the worm bin? It does cool down by the next day after I move it from the smaller tote to a 5 gallon bucket. 🪱
Lizard!
@@lynnelichtenstern-ug1fb Did it make a cameo? I have a small baby one living in my shower these days 🙄. I catch and release the one I can. It’s the iguanas I can do without! 😎
Uk temperature is 25c max lol still not warm enough really for the warm weather crops, but it’s helping.
I’d say I may start cutting out the small melons again as it’s long enough lol. Not hot enough for long enough so not worth the effect