This somewhat makes the assumption that, at kids levels, all coaches from other sports are professionals, which is also not true, certainly not where I grew up, and can easily relate to some of the coaching mistakes you mentioned regarding my own experience as a kid that practiced several sports (but mostly basketball - feeling stark differences in quality between coaches even of the same sport). And also that all historical fencing coaches are amateurs, and don't have a sport teaching background carried from other sports, which is also not true - there is plenty of clubs that have this "fixed". And bringing kids into the sport in this context would help historical fencers get better at teaching kids. This being said, there are plenty of valid claims in this video that make it a good video worth watching, I just wanted to add some more nuance to the conversation.
I certainly agree. I trained martial arts in my youth where I don’t think I trained anything, except possibly coordination. And yes, there are a lot of clubs that have good instructors. But we’re far behind more established sports.
Agreed. I've been coaching WMA/HEMA for nearly 30 years and am often horrified by the quality of other coaching I see in this. For the first 10 years I only coached adults, because I felt I didn't have the training or experience to teach kids. I rectified that by getting the sports coaching training I needed. I am fortunate that I also have a teaching degree and understood what I was lacking, even though I started out miles ahead of others. I've been trying to tell people for years that they need to understand the things you mentioned in here (and more, besides). Most don't want to hear it, though. I'm not sure why that is, although I have my hypotheses.
All the points you made here are totally valid. I don't disagree with any of them, but I'd like to take the conversation in another direction, by mentioning 2 things I believe would be beneficial for children from learning HEMA. Besides all the ''sport'' aspects, which I'm not qualified to discuss, I think getting into HEMA young could bring them some more cultural, philosophical benefits that could be helpful for their whole lives. - Learning to love learning, and learning to love History. While of course putting a XVth century fencing treatise in the hands of an 8 years old make no sense, HEMA trainig would be a great way to show children that History wasn't just a long series of dates, or boring classroom lessons, but also something more organic, more alive, something that people actually lived through in the past. Most children unfortunately don't like History classes in school, but as soon as you take them on a day trip to visit a local castle, you can see the awe in their eyes. The problem with the way History is taught to kids is that it's all very abstract. Kids would remember a lot more from their History classes if they could see pictures, historical costumes, songs, and martial arts from the past, among other things, instead of long tedious lessons and texts. Adding a bit of cultural/historical knowledge here and there during their HEMA practice could do wonders. In that sense, I believe having children learn historical fencing young could lead them to realise that History is cool. That could also lead them to love and embrace their heritage, but that's another topic. Overall, I believe it could just open their eyes to the fact that learning something new can be cool and fun. - Learning respect. While HEMA is far from being as codified as a lot of Asian Martial Arts, the HEMA community in its vast majority shares values of respect. Respect of the instructor, the sparring partner, the aversary in the tournament, the referee/judge. I have never once seen a HEMAist being bad sports (though I'm sure it does happen from time to time), throwing a tantrum, being openly arrogant and cocky, disrespecting or even assaulting someone like it happens so often in some other sports (football for example, but in many sports in fact). I believe children could learn a lot about respecting others (and themselves) from starting HEMA young, while still not having to go through the very high level of discipline seen in other Martial Arts. And I know that a lot of kids could benefit from that ;) These things of course don't contradict your arguments, but I thought they would be worth mentioning :) Colin
I have to disagree. Many coaches are barely coaches and small groups of kids aren’t hard to teach as long as you hold their attention, etc. I use foam exclusively with them when I do rarely teach younger students and I also make the terms easy to understand. Ex: a wide passing step becomes a candy cane because I want them to recreate the pattern. It makes it easier to watch a few students and ensure no one gets hurt even with boffers, masks, etc. No coach should be expected to be a personal trainer unless they have the credentials. And if we expect coaches to be able to provide the perfect development, we will only get a handful at best. Fencing class is for fencing. Lifting is for the gym, etc.
If we teach kids we should make sure that we plan their training in a way that benefits them. This isn't hard, but it means educating ourselves and adapting our curriculum based on their needs. How long is an exercise? How does that change with development? How much cardio do you get in various development phases, how do you integrate strength training. It's absolutely, 100% true, that you cannot fit all the needs of optimal training into one class or that kids should be lifting during fencing classes. There's not time to do that when you train kids a couple of hours each week at most. However, there's no reason, as I see it, for instructors to not educate themselves on the basics of these things, to avoid pitfalls and make training more beneficial and worthwhile.
There’s nothing in this video against historical fencing for kids - only bad coaching. Almost every sport at kids’ level is run by volunteer parent coaches outside of the more “elite” end. There’s absolutely no reason to believe historical fencing would be any worse for kids than other sports and there isn’t really an argument put forward in the video. My HEMA instructor is a teacher. Guy is 100% able to do everything you said in this video but kids still should stay away?
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This somewhat makes the assumption that, at kids levels, all coaches from other sports are professionals, which is also not true, certainly not where I grew up, and can easily relate to some of the coaching mistakes you mentioned regarding my own experience as a kid that practiced several sports (but mostly basketball - feeling stark differences in quality between coaches even of the same sport). And also that all historical fencing coaches are amateurs, and don't have a sport teaching background carried from other sports, which is also not true - there is plenty of clubs that have this "fixed".
And bringing kids into the sport in this context would help historical fencers get better at teaching kids.
This being said, there are plenty of valid claims in this video that make it a good video worth watching, I just wanted to add some more nuance to the conversation.
I certainly agree. I trained martial arts in my youth where I don’t think I trained anything, except possibly coordination.
And yes, there are a lot of clubs that have good instructors. But we’re far behind more established sports.
Agreed. I've been coaching WMA/HEMA for nearly 30 years and am often horrified by the quality of other coaching I see in this. For the first 10 years I only coached adults, because I felt I didn't have the training or experience to teach kids. I rectified that by getting the sports coaching training I needed. I am fortunate that I also have a teaching degree and understood what I was lacking, even though I started out miles ahead of others. I've been trying to tell people for years that they need to understand the things you mentioned in here (and more, besides). Most don't want to hear it, though. I'm not sure why that is, although I have my hypotheses.
It’s because it’s easier to not listen :)
All the points you made here are totally valid. I don't disagree with any of them, but I'd like to take the conversation in another direction, by mentioning 2 things I believe would be beneficial for children from learning HEMA.
Besides all the ''sport'' aspects, which I'm not qualified to discuss, I think getting into HEMA young could bring them some more cultural, philosophical benefits that could be helpful for their whole lives.
- Learning to love learning, and learning to love History. While of course putting a XVth century fencing treatise in the hands of an 8 years old make no sense, HEMA trainig would be a great way to show children that History wasn't just a long series of dates, or boring classroom lessons, but also something more organic, more alive, something that people actually lived through in the past. Most children unfortunately don't like History classes in school, but as soon as you take them on a day trip to visit a local castle, you can see the awe in their eyes. The problem with the way History is taught to kids is that it's all very abstract. Kids would remember a lot more from their History classes if they could see pictures, historical costumes, songs, and martial arts from the past, among other things, instead of long tedious lessons and texts. Adding a bit of cultural/historical knowledge here and there during their HEMA practice could do wonders.
In that sense, I believe having children learn historical fencing young could lead them to realise that History is cool. That could also lead them to love and embrace their heritage, but that's another topic. Overall, I believe it could just open their eyes to the fact that learning something new can be cool and fun.
- Learning respect. While HEMA is far from being as codified as a lot of Asian Martial Arts, the HEMA community in its vast majority shares values of respect. Respect of the instructor, the sparring partner, the aversary in the tournament, the referee/judge. I have never once seen a HEMAist being bad sports (though I'm sure it does happen from time to time), throwing a tantrum, being openly arrogant and cocky, disrespecting or even assaulting someone like it happens so often in some other sports (football for example, but in many sports in fact). I believe children could learn a lot about respecting others (and themselves) from starting HEMA young, while still not having to go through the very high level of discipline seen in other Martial Arts. And I know that a lot of kids could benefit from that ;)
These things of course don't contradict your arguments, but I thought they would be worth mentioning :)
Colin
Very good points. I may return with a video about why kids SHOULD train HEMA.
I have to disagree. Many coaches are barely coaches and small groups of kids aren’t hard to teach as long as you hold their attention, etc. I use foam exclusively with them when I do rarely teach younger students and I also make the terms easy to understand. Ex: a wide passing step becomes a candy cane because I want them to recreate the pattern. It makes it easier to watch a few students and ensure no one gets hurt even with boffers, masks, etc. No coach should be expected to be a personal trainer unless they have the credentials. And if we expect coaches to be able to provide the perfect development, we will only get a handful at best. Fencing class is for fencing. Lifting is for the gym, etc.
If we teach kids we should make sure that we plan their training in a way that benefits them. This isn't hard, but it means educating ourselves and adapting our curriculum based on their needs. How long is an exercise? How does that change with development? How much cardio do you get in various development phases, how do you integrate strength training.
It's absolutely, 100% true, that you cannot fit all the needs of optimal training into one class or that kids should be lifting during fencing classes. There's not time to do that when you train kids a couple of hours each week at most. However, there's no reason, as I see it, for instructors to not educate themselves on the basics of these things, to avoid pitfalls and make training more beneficial and worthwhile.
There’s nothing in this video against historical fencing for kids - only bad coaching.
Almost every sport at kids’ level is run by volunteer parent coaches outside of the more “elite” end. There’s absolutely no reason to believe historical fencing would be any worse for kids than other sports and there isn’t really an argument put forward in the video.
My HEMA instructor is a teacher. Guy is 100% able to do everything you said in this video but kids still should stay away?
p͎r͎o͎m͎o͎s͎m͎