Warhammer Did not "Save" Total War: An Autopsy
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 พ.ย. 2024
- Total War has been dead since 2013 and only now has the illusion of its strength been broken.
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'Warhammer did not sell on the Total War IP, it sold on the Warhammer IP'.
So true
4:50 well said. your fall of a franchise treatise has aged like gold. it was already good when it went up, now youve seen everything you said be vindicated. thats the great thing about choosing the path of honesty and genuine intellectual curiosity, you find yourself in the position of seeing your previous work be vindicated, while everyone elses is obsolesced. your fall of a franchise video will stand tall for years (or decades). you call it months before the crescendo of total war, and now you reap the rewards. feels good man.
the complete other side of the coin is that pathetic thread at 7:00. glad to see it get the ruthless sardonic mocking it deserves.
will share your video in a few hours (got to wait until my last community post gets a bit older so they dont overlap and the algorithm suppresses the new one. well said.
Whoa Volound was here!!!
Keep up the awesome content guys 🙂👍
Seeing how Warhammerites so arrogantly dismissed grievances of Three Kingdom players - only to get screwed over by CA anyway - is one of the funniest bits of poetic justice I've seen in a while.
For your proud unwavering devotion to CA you get the worst game in the series' history. A fair trade deal.
It was such a straight forward give the audience more of the same while improving, and adjusting minimally on what came before it type sequel. I don't think anyone could've expected them to fuck it up this badly. CA doesn't just not understand the appeal of Total War, they don't understand the appeal of map games in general at the top level apparently. The realms of chaos are the worst feature I've experienced in a game of this type, and I'm shocked it could've gotten past play testing. It's so tedious, and restricting of player freedom, and it doesn't even give you good rewards for doing the stupid thing. CA could've looked over their own DLC for Warhammer 2, and just based their main campaign off the stuff their player base liked the most in Warhammer 2, but they didn't because... uh anyone know? I don't.
Warhammer fans are hated all around the world in all communities because they are horrible human beings, selfish and despicable
@@Carwash2 what’s incredible is the TH-camrs who got the early access said that they all unanimously said “this is bad”. And CA didn’t fucking care or listen at all and kept on trucking.
So not only does this speak to the sheer arrogance of the company, but also demonstrates how hollow their early access program is.
It’s nothing but a tool to put the TH-camrs on a leash, they get the early access clips that is basically necessary for their channel growth…but at the same time they get contributed by NDAs. If they don’t play ball? They get clipped and the channel dies a death for not being the most current on videos, because the fans of this series are shallow and only jump from one flashy thing to the next.
I used to love Total War, Medieval 2, Empire and Shogun 2 were so much fun
I haven't cared about the series since they started charging $100nz for every game Rome2 onwards, it's sad to see how bad the quality of the games are these days
Also really sad the legacy games don't have UI scaling for high resolution monitors, I miss Empire
I've considered at several points getting a 1440p or 4K monitor to play Shogun 2, but I've stuck with 1080p just because I know it works.
Rome II was so shit compared to Shogun II. The design was shit, the gameplay sucked.
I've seen franchises that chased trends survive when the artificial inflation inevitably falters but that's because they have a sizeable if neglected core audience. CA has all but completely destroyed that so they can only survive by either a servant/master or parasitic relationship to other Franchises or media trends. Total war Warhammer is an example of the former relation while Three kingdoms is an example of the latter.
They got lucky with Warhammer and then 3K and then proceeded to throw those away, I don't know if they can count on another one at this point.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 People who play tabletop Warhammer and 40k think that paying five-hundred dollars for one army that they have to paint and assemble themselves is a good deal, it's no surprise that five-hundred dollars for ALL armies got their attention. I don't know what CA is going to do next, but it wouldn't surprise me if a 40k game has been floated multiple times in their back-rooms, if only to keep that specific audience.
@@HisRotundity yeah, if you've already been gouged out of thousands for cheap plastic, what is another few hundred for copy-pasted games and low-effort DLC?
@@HisRotundity I've been saying this for awhile now, CA's ace up their sleeve and at this imo only way of bouncing back is a Total Warhammer 40k. Not only is it bringing back TW fans, TW WH fans, but also pulling in an entire new fan base with the 40k universe. And even if/when they fk that up they have one last life raft left with a Total Warhammer Horus Heresy, which is arguably the most die hard of the die hard fan bases in the Warhammer brand.
I'd be a lying bastard if I said a TW 40k wouldn't bring me back, and I'd be double dog damned if I said no to a TW Horus Heresy series.
@@HisRotundity many of us are buying minis from other companies instead since GW is both expensive and often lackluster. There’s so many good options that aren’t GW these days. And 3D printing is getting more and more common as a way of getting minis since you can get so many different kinds of minis and not have to sell your house for 10 “not WWI Germans”.
Speaking of finishing campaigns, remember in Medieval 2 where you unlocked factions by either destroying them in the campaign, or by winning your first campaign? DLC now lol.
Gotta squeeze money from poor fellas as many as possible.
Warhammer 3 is not just a train wreck, it is the destruction of an entire railway system
Perhaps they could start updating and support some of the older releases to patch up old problems left behind e.g. Medieval 2's greatsword animation bug, Empire's and Shogun 2's bugs and design errors like the inferior Kisho Ninja and most notably Rome II. This would at least ensure more customers who buy these games are left satisfied and show that they've repented for their awful business model and that they're really committed to set things right, thus slowly rebuild some of their goodwill.
Of course, this most probably won't happen. There is no way out of the hole they dug themselves in, this is the end of Total War.
i actually commented on an official CA livestream in 2019 when they were reading the chat and responding to comments, and they said the codebase and the familiarity with it is long lost and to "just use mods".
@@Volound How did we got to the point where the moders know beter of how the game works than its creators. At this point just give the ins and outs of the game to some moders and i bet in weeks they will know how the game works perfectly and fix it.
@@stefankatsarov5806 When finance, marketing, HR, and shareholders are in command, gameplay quality is no longer the priority; they prefer hiring incompetent yes-men.
Modders don't have those restrictions.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 Very well said sir.
Realm Divide in S2 was such a great mechanic to keep the late-game interesting, as by that point in normal gameplay you'd be so big that few would be able to rival your doomstacks.
0:36 a truly chaotic "road map". Takes them two months to release nothing but a promise of super basic fixes. Most of which have/could have been fixed by modders in those two months.
They don't even have their """"saving grace"""" immortal empires until 4 months and it's in BETA?! That shows a huge lack of faith in their own product as you already said. But I especially like how they can release DLCs to charge their customers...on a forecast that's supposed to show what they plan to do to fix the game.
1:23 yes. Absolute pure cringe. I don't know why they act like this voice actor is some renowned celebrity/member of the marketing the fans love, where it'll all be a good in-joke the fans know of. He got introduced in this games marketing and doesn't sound like a proffesional at all. Actually sounds like they pulled some random intern infront of a mic and said "do your best "coming this summer" movie trailer guy voice."
4:42 yeah, the strange thing was in your fall of a franchise video...you already covered the "MosT pOpUlar GaME oF tHE FrANcHisE!11!!!" you mentioned how it's only going of the momentum of the warhammer IP and every other game around it was tanking! Troy, Thrones, Attila and the execution of 3K proved that. Now it's the end of the "epic" warhammer trilogy and they ended on a wet fart. Bravo.
10:21 yup. You have to shell out practically full price, on 3 games and over £200 on KAWNTENT dlc for the "full warhammer total war experience". And what is involved on these DLCs? Game breaking over powered reskined units, a new starting postion, and a stat modifying tech tree/workshop. Copy and pasted across the board. Wow what brilliant effort, absolutely fleeced the fans.
Marking people who dislike the new TW titles as historical fans is something I see a lot, even in comments on your videos. I think it's completely dishonest since most of the games since Rome 2 have been historical and have many of the same problems as the Warhammer games. I love Warhammer Fantasy and while these AAA titles might have good graphics they have failed to represent this setting in the most important way, with gameplay. Warhammer Fantasy is supposed to be more gritty and historically inspired than other settings but these games have turned a fantasy battle wargame into a shoddy MOBA. If people are playing WH3 for the Fantasy stuff they should really try out Third Age or Beginning of the End Times to see what a proper fantasy Total War game looks like. A game with correct firearms, terrain advantages and no doomstacks or broken difficulty modifiers.
Yeah, they say "historical fans" and conveniently forget that Third Age is arguably the most successful mod in the series' lifetime.
Also I actually addressed this in some more detail in this more recent video on army systems in Total War: th-cam.com/video/rW7PFNqGuog/w-d-xo.html
Well if we look all time peak player count for Total War: Warhammer 3 it is 166,519 players. Not bad really...
If you are saying historical Total War games sell and are played better looking for Pharaoh peak of 5,424 players.
You asked for our opinnion. I think CA did manage to save Total War: Warhammer 3. It did sold well enough. It is getting more of DLC's (what is kind of money grab for them).
But yes, I am worried about future of history based total war games. Pharaoh did NOT sell well, it was most expensive historical "full" version of Total War games since ever. They have promised to give DLC's but we will see. I personally would not be totally surprised if they would sack these DLC's and even give money back for these few who bought Dynasty edition...
nah, TW WH3 sold well on launch and crashed down to 10k concurrent players just 2 months after its release, the fastest drop in the series history (faster than ETW and ToB).
And now, just 1.5 years from WH3's release, it manages 23-24k peak on weekends...this is equal or less than what Wh2 was doing in Feb 2022, more than 4 years after its launch.
In every other metric besides day 1 players WH2 performed way better than WH3. This is a monumental failure considering how many years they had to not f up 3. CA did not save WH3. They "released" IE ( a beta, lol) 6 months late and two lackluster overpriced DLC's which temporarily boosted the numbers...to then steeply decline again.
Anyone who was paying attention knew that WH TW was selling thanks to the WH IP, every "historical" game following Rome 2 ended an abandoned failure.
Warhammer didn't save the franchise. It merely paraded the corpse around for a time, I thought that was clearly stated in the video.
Edit: also SoC, how did I forget, SoC was such a bad DLC that it gave a slight boost to activity over 1 weekend, literally just a few days of increased activity before it subsided.
Warhammer didn't save Total War, it just bludgeoned the series to death and wore it's corpse.
I enjoy total war in general. If I want a serious game then it's rome 1 or medieval 2, I have shogun 2 in my steam library but never could get into it. And as for warhammer I enjoy it, the craziness of it anyway, after a 13 or 14 hour work day I jump on and play. I don't care about it failing beyond getting my moneys worth before its abandoned. Which I have with 150 plus hours.
I enjoy you and volounds videos because there should be more people like you fighting for the games they believe in, but CA is a sinking ship. And so is warhammer total war, which is unfortunate because I wanted to see where it would go.
I'm in a similar boat, I'm only invested in seeing where this road will lead CA, I have no hope that they will ever make a good game again but it sure is endlessly interesting to look at everything that went wrong.
I find it especially ironic and satisfying to see the whole "but it's popular!" argument die. And with that gone all that's left is a terrible game that is so clearly bad barely anyone is willing to defend it.
For all its faults, i can say i enjoyed attila when being a pirate was easy, and now when i bought it for 5 euros. And for all ots faults i can say they i enjoy TROY of all thing better than 3 kingdoms, twwh3 (which i played on a friends account), attila and rome 2. I think i can say is tied with shogun 2 actually
Warhammer III is like Cyberpunk and Warcraft 3 Reforged
Not even clolse. Warhamer 3 was a bad game in the end of a string of bad games. It finaly opened the eyes of ppl of how bad Warhamer games where. Cyberpunk was the first of its kind and the game before it of the company is one of the best games ever. Warcraft 3 was the same as Cyberpunk and Witcher, the diference being Cuberpunk is an OK to maybe good game and Warcraft3 reforged is one of the worst games ever.
@@stefankatsarov5806 I wouldnt say Witcher 3 is one of the best games lmao, combat is super boring and sluggish and everything else looks bland as fuck
@@Korvinian4601 Well for most ppl that have played it it is one of the best ever, and i can tell you from experience the game is everyting but bland whit an amazing world and storytelling and the combat isnt the main thing. Also i personally dont find the combat that bad, its honestly the same as many other games these days in therms of hack and slash mehanics. God of war combat is the same or worse yet ppl love it.
@@stefankatsarov5806 By that logic Warhammer Total War series is one of the best because most people played it and love it. The story was just Geralt doin smth, I guess.
"Also i personally dont find the combat that bad, its honestly the same as many other games these days" That's just low standard lmao. Also Im supposed to be a Witcher, one of the best duelists in the world, not some madman swing whatever.
@@Korvinian4601 Low standars or just its a hack and slash game and combat isnt important. God of war is a great game where the combat is super basic and yet ppl love it because the combat dosnt need to be spetial. Witcher 3 is an open world game where the world and story are the main focus, so combat isnt important and again its a hack and slash game that actialy has more things to do like signs and bombs than most hack and slash games. And the story isnt just gerlad does things, all the side quest are amazing whit their own stories, the main story in Witcher 2 is also great even if the game isnt all that good, the studio did amazingly to make you feel someting about every person you encounter. But maybe for you all campains are some one just does things, since that is every story ever if you strip it down and you find more entertainment in sandbox games.
Medieval 2 had so many things keeping you playing, americas, gunpowder, mongols, timurids
"It's been bad since Rome 2 came out."
You don't do Attila dirty like that.
Most people hate attila
@@alexanderivankovic8966 That is NOT what i'm getting, it seems to be a sleeper classic.
I’m worried that they will make the next historical total war super Arcady and shallow like war hammer. Haven’t been happy with total war since Rome 2 and even that game didn’t hit the mark.
They have already been doing that, 3K, ToB, Troy all ported the design elements of Warhammer. CA has been reselling the same game for years, only changing the paint job depending on the audience they were targeting.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 hit the nail on the head selling the same game for years just with a new coat of paint slapped on. Subbed
Modern Total War has always been super arcady, Warhammer is just peak arcadyness.
Empire was amazing and I will defend it to death with bayonet fixed!
Imagine they have the cheek in the roadmap the say free lc and it's regiments of renown they are copy paste units with higher stats but hey guy we are so good to our fans buy not charging you lol
I quit playing warhammer when I woke up to how gullible I was being.
it took about 6 months.
Their game engine is bad and they should feel bad!
never played Warhammer and will never.. cant wait till they release something new
OMG!! Never saw that vid from CA, that just says it all.
Warhammer straight up dragged Total War behind the shed and double-barrelled it.
and then skinned the corpse and started wearing it thinking you wouldnt notice
it will still be a commercial success but they blew it indeed.
At best it WAS a commercial success, with its initial sales, but seeing how bare bones the roadmap is, especially compared to the much better support that Rome 2 and WH2 got, doesn't leave me thinking CA is planning on supporting this one.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 im sure they will pump out a lot of DLC because the Warhammer fanbase is really "special" and will buy whatever. For me the next historical game is a make or break. I honestly think it will be a disaster but I still have a silver of hope that somehow they will ditch the greed and deliver a good game.
Has every TWW Game its own Blood & Gore DLC? Easy money I guess.
Warhammer III is the end times for Total War.
There is a Medieval 2 Warhammer mod that is more fun than what CA is selling you lol. It's called BOTET: Call of the End Times I think.
the woke mind virus played a part as well, make no mistake.
One of the most dummy thing total war has done is turning sandbox campaigns into RP story driven campaigns that you really just play once...
Ofc not, it made it worse, because CA made millions with as little effort as possible. It essentially killed innovation and engine development. All they had to do was mod Rome 2 to look like the Warhammer universe, split it into 3 games with 97 different dlc packs, sit back and watch as the cash poured in from millions of fanboys who had no idea what a Total War game was even suppossed to be.
The monetary success of Warhammer made them forget what made their best titles truly great in the first place and it incentivized them to pump out “content” at the expense of gameplay quality and actual engine development. Let alone even try to build a new engine.
Now with Warhammer over, all the fanboys are not gonna pay for the same game thats just been modded to look “historical”. And all the history fans are not gonna pay for a “new” game that has the same engine as the previous historical title that they bought 15 years ago.
So they either cut down their corporate wages and use the money to build a new game engine, or the franchise will die and they will have to find new jobs. Good luck have fun CA. This is exactly what should happen to any brand or company that cares more about profits than they do about product quality and customer satisfaction.
as WH fan I totaly Agree Dishonorable_Daimyo as with Volound aswell since Hype is really bad for game and we get Rome 2 of WH at WH3
Most of WH Content Partners are absoletely are reason why they killed WH3 aswell with Hype
Absolete Shameless by most of them
Funny how history repeats itself...
👏🙂
1:50 Omg the cringe!!!!! 🤣
13:40 very sad
16:20 looks like the franchise is going down. It is quite a fall since the magnificence of Medieval 2, Rome and Shogun 2.
I guess that is life.
I still understand why the community hates Warhammer it's the best game in the market in rts
"entry of the gladiators"
Go check that music, it's literally you with this post
Just one word for saving TW........Atari......
TW 40k and TW Horus Heresy
The author of the megasimp "Kindly leave Warhammer out of this..." post on Reddit deleted it a few days ago, along with his account. I replied to him telling him he deserves what's coming (meaning the inevitable abandonment of WH3, which was obvious in the context I said it), then he accused me of making threats to him, then deleted everything lol.
Warhammer fanboys interpret anything negative being said about their favorite toy as a "threat." CA may never make a decent game ever again but if I see this awful, unethical fanbase die off, I consider not having to deal with them a major win.
he didnt actually delete the thread, he just blocked you, LMAO. he did the same thing to me and i made the same mistake. loser is going around blocking people that comment on his thread laughing at him. cant even concede and admit his fuck up. has to double down. just goes to show how depraved and degenerated these people are.
Are there mods that fix three kingdoms?
I'm not exactly sure, you can ask on our Discord server, we have a few people who are into modding TW including the newer ones. One of them recently did a UI mod for WH2.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 imma do that
Im not even care with CA honestly, kkkkk anyone can take Medieval 2 and SSHIP mod from my pc, (even of steam fall, me and my friends will use hamachi) and that is the only matters.... Kkkkkkk
you cant use "self-aware comedy" if you painfully lack self-awareness
Rome 2 was shit :) Attila was ok tho 😊
Warhammer Total War is fun, but its NOT TOTAL WAR! Campaign map is SHALLOW AS FUCK, SAME building system since ROME 2, only with more slots (and even then its worse somehow), Unit balance.....whats that? Ranged spam is STUIPDLY effective (i suspect this is due to how they changed how armor works from Rome 2 and Attila), the AI....oh GOD the AI is as STUPID as ever, not much has changed.
And YOUR BIGGEST SELLING POINT is all 3 games connect together, and in order to play "SANDBOX" mode in WH 2 and 3 you need to have PURCHESED the previous games, which due to not getting future updates are inferior products to their sequels.
Range spam is also OP because of the stupid hp system they have where even if an arrow hits a shield it still does dmg and can kill an unit. Makes shields and formations and phisics usles. ( Also there are literaly no formations in wathamer ).
So what you're saying is that the game is "fun" ... as in "not fun".
@@Tom_Quixote I will use the quote people use to describe War Thunder "its almost fun". Its just not My kind of Total War ya know.
At this point I think that historical fans are putting words in the mouths of others that they never said.
"Historical vs fantasy" is a fallacy created and bought into by way too many people. Good games vs bad games is the only distinction that matters. Did you miss the part where I said Rome 2 damaged the franchise horrifically? Guess you didn't watch the video.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 Gonna give you that, indeed I did't watch the video because I don't like clickbait titles.
At this point I think warhammer total war crack addicts have the same attention span as WH3 had player retention. It drops to nothing almost immediately.
@@spacewargamer4181 it sure was enough to aggravate you into commenting.
@@dishonorable_daimyo1498 No shit sherlock
I have beeen saing it from day one of Warhammer. The ppl that will play it have never played totall war and the ones that have wont stick for long. By the time of the 2nd it was clear that TH-camrs where just playng it because the money was there. The new ppl think warhamer was some god tier totall war game because they didnt know beter and just atack the Shogun and Medieval lovers ( historical fans as a hole ). And let me tell thouse fans someting, the magic, grafics, mehanics and sound in warhamer arent even that good and they espetialy dont have the Grim Dark fealing of warhammer. Its a bit like if some one makes a Blade animation for kids. But hey, stupid, blind, deft or misinformed ppl deserve to be swindled.
Imagine saying Warhammer saved total war.