The nail in the coffin of split singles was when Jawa introduced the world's first transverse ported 2 stroke motor in 1946. A transverse ported 250 2 stroke produces more power and torque than a 2 stroke split single of the same displacement. It can also be made to rev higher, hence why the split single 2 strokes became a dead end branch on the 2 stroke evolutionary tree.
my dad use to race 175 et 250 cc twin carb hillclimb and motorcross , so lately i bought a 125 cc to study and make it run on the stand . i adapt a electronic ignition , a set of new rings , adjust the ports , new bearings . with a 19 mm carburetor it take 8000 rpm . i found a 175 cc , same thing , need to change 1 piston . twin exhaust , 1 carb 22mm will switch to 28 mm soon . now i build a modern frame to test on the road to test the top speed . will post a video soon ....
@@szymon6207 It was enough . Shit, modern cars only need around 30bhp to maintain 70mph. this is one reason why you see 8 and 10 speed transmissions in them. At highways speeds they basically climb to gear that equals idle speed
The pre-war Trojan car, designed by Leslie Hounsfield, used the split single, but had two of them, making it a four cylinder split single twin (Eek!). It also made do with two (vee-shaped) connecting rods, meaning the rods had to bend with each crankshaft revolution, thereby leading to a four cylinder car engine with only seven moving parts...... my head is starting to hurt. They were so quirky that apparently many garages used to display signs reading "No Trojans". Hounsfield later set up a company making camp beds, which surly shows something. Trojans advertised their cars with the slogan "Can you afford to walk" after working out their cars were so cheap to run that over 200 miles shoes and socks for the same distance would cost more. Their motors could be tuned up and, in much the same way as Stan Stevens was known as the Yamaha LC tuning guru, Trojans had a tuning expert by the name of Scroggs, a Group Captain in the RAF; getting the engine to go faster was known by Trojan owners as "Scrogging" the motor. I assure you I am not making any of this up.
They were , at one point, manufactured in the old Sopwith factory in Kingston by Leyland Motors. It later became Hawker Siddeley and made Hunters, Harriers and Hawks. Well, the parts, no runway so complete planes would have been a bit awkward.
Excellent choice in subject matter, Keep up the good work this wasn’t easy to find these bikes. My family had a motorcycle dealership, Bsa and Bridgestone, the Bridgestone 175 cc what is a twin, stock edge crank stroke was 180 between the two cylinders, but they would twist the crank until both pistons ran 360, and they called that a twingle, They did this for better traction in the dirt, less power pulses through the drive system.
Hi, check out the Csepel 250/U. It is a Hungarian made motorbike from the early 50's. It used the twingle layout and produced a poor 8 HP from 250ccm. But looked nice.
0:07 The second cylinder does not suck, the mixture is pushed in by the crankcase pressure! What's more some split singles have pistons that are rising and falling at the same time, e.g., the TWN split single. TWN Cornet: compression ratio was 6.5 : 1. The SS250 DKW had more than 20 hp, approx. 25 hp.
My family and I owned a 175 Allstate and two 250s.Very slow machines with enormously heavy crankshafts. When you cut the ignition the engine would still turn over for a couple of seconds. I wish I still had mine.
We bought a new Puch 250 sold by Sears in 1968, and I still have it. It also still runs and has only 300 miles on it. Notice it is Not an "Allstate" model and had the "Sears" badges on it.
You missed a Huge seller, the 175 and 250 Twingle sold by Sears as a Allstate from the early 50's to the late 60s. They were made by Puch. The cylinders were in sync as there was a master connecting rod with a tab off to the front for the slave cylinder. Neat thing was with my 175 cc unit the porting for the rear cylinder was different than that of the front cylinder. Did some 2 cycle performance work over the years and it was one was ported for low end torque and the other for higher end torque.
Wow, okay, toto mi uniklo. Možno sa o tom nehovorí medzi anglicko hovoriacou komunitou, tak mi to uniklo pri vyhľadávaní. Určite si to preštudujem, ďakujem
The video describes the TWN as a 'Cornet' but the model shown is the Triumph/TWN 'Boss' 2 banana down pies ,2 carbs .The 'Cornet appears later with the guy in shorts. Adtrizun 'Boss' owner.
All of your videos are fantastic in my opinion, VisioRacer ! I enjoy every single one ! Can I ask your first name ? Mine is Scott, I live in Arizona USA .
Oh God...the Isetta...although 72 miles to the gallon in the 50s was pretty great...mind you it could only hold like 3 gallons. Also it started out with 3 wheels but for obvious reasons it went to 4...
This is what I was thinking, all of these bikes sound more 4 stroke than a 2 stroke would usually sound. But in particular they do sound quite similar to my f650gs twin .
There is a Honda split single that is four stroke and each cylinder has its own combustion area also it’s cam chain is in the middle The bike is a Honda 250 rebel And I have one
The Allstate 250 sounds like its just been made by Honda. Did JAWA not make a split single engine, I'm sure they did, but I might be mistaken, thinking that one cylinder is the inlet and the other is the exhaust port, is temperature not a problem, cylinders working at different temperatures,, exhaust port always hotter than the inlet, good video,
Sounds like you could convert them to a ICSE, internal combustion Stirling engine. You'd need a different crank shaft and some 'plumbing' too, but it's possible...
I think twingle also exist on four strokes but differently. Its a parallel twin that has both pistons on the same height all the time, but not like usually firing every other stroke (every 180deg), they fire at the same time every 360deg. There even was a kawasaki 1000cc 4cyl race bike that had 2 cylinders fire at the same time lol
@@Filip_Phreriks sorry i meant 360 deg not 180. i'm talking about twin cylinders that have BOTH pistons going up at the same time. Normally they dont fire together but in a twingle conversion they do. Its called twingle because its a twin but acts like a single.
Considering that's old 2 strokes with not that much hp, I'd rather say they are pretty smooth on a torque delivery. But they might differ from the ones Poland had in 60's-80's.
In the 60s I had a puch sport model with the twin carbs, one either side. They were cheap and ugly, in Austria. Always hard to start and usually had to push start, like the guy in the video. The pistons work like a 2 stage compression, the back one being a little behind the first, being the power stroke. Both pistons were on the same connecting rod. Never impressed me.
from a mechanical concept it's very interesting design. From a combustion point of view, this is the worst possible design. Look at the top piston crown at the end of the movie. There's a lot of pitting as a sever knock occurs in top of the secondary piston.
They worked fine, but an efficiently ported 180 degree twin is more efficient, has less vibration, revs faster, and is far more tunable. All the disadvantages of a single, all the disadvantages of a twin, plus the scavenging difficulties of the cross flow porting.
If anyone has any information on the model with the 'hairdryer' cooling system, please reach out to me. I'm keen to have any information I can get. Thanks.
It's a total loss oil system, one is for gas the other is oil (50w per the manual). It's premixing with a pump like you would do with an other 2 strokes but in the tank.
"Multiply the bore and stroke dimensions by two" is wrong. You mean "multiply the product of bore and stroke". "5 Of The Only Split-Single Engines" makes no sense. perhaps you mean "The Only 5 Split-Single Engines"?
@M Bacon yes, granted, they are less complicated in construction in comparison to a 4-stroke etc., but my point is that it's over-complicated for the issues it's trying to resolve, port timing.
It is and it isn't. The single combustion chamber saves metal and machine time versus two. The second cylinder reduces the need for an exhaust expansion chamber making exhaust engineering and manufacture cheaper. The Allstate was meant to be a cheap commuter to slog through urban traffic. Lots of idling, lots of stop and go, and little high rpm running. In that role the twingle makes some sense. YPVS and Reed valves were still on the horizon.
Big thanks to you, guys, only thanks to you this channel has reached 400,000 subscribers!
keep up the great videos.. 👍
A very good channel !
Where did the video of 4age Toyota go to
Congratulations on the 400k subs!
Okay you're welkom
The nail in the coffin of split singles was when Jawa introduced the world's first transverse ported 2 stroke motor in 1946.
A transverse ported 250 2 stroke produces more power and torque than a 2 stroke split single of the same displacement. It can also be made to rev higher, hence why the split single 2 strokes became a dead end branch on the 2 stroke evolutionary tree.
Andy Reid is transverse the same as cross flow scavenging? Never heard of that
my dad use to race 175 et 250 cc twin carb hillclimb and motorcross , so lately i bought a 125 cc to study and make it run on the stand . i adapt a electronic ignition , a set of new rings , adjust the ports , new bearings . with a 19 mm carburetor it take 8000 rpm . i found a 175 cc , same thing , need to change 1 piston . twin exhaust , 1 carb 22mm will switch to 28 mm soon . now i build a modern frame to test on the road to test the top speed . will post a video soon ....
Such a clever way to adress the overheating, intake/exhaust and fluel efficiency problems of the 2 stroke engine
isetta 10bhp !
Atilliator Are you Hungarian?
@@zoltancsikos5604 nah, an Atilliator was the person in charge of siege equipment during the middle ages :-}
@@szymon6207 It was enough . Shit, modern cars only need around 30bhp to maintain 70mph. this is one reason why you see 8 and 10 speed transmissions in them. At highways speeds they basically climb to gear that equals idle speed
@@zuestoots5176 my fiat 126 bis have 26hp and it is enough for 120km/h at a level road
The pre-war Trojan car, designed by Leslie Hounsfield, used the split single, but had two of them, making it a four cylinder split single twin (Eek!). It also made do with two (vee-shaped) connecting rods, meaning the rods had to bend with each crankshaft revolution, thereby leading to a four cylinder car engine with only seven moving parts...... my head is starting to hurt. They were so quirky that apparently many garages used to display signs reading "No Trojans". Hounsfield later set up a company making camp beds, which surly shows something.
Trojans advertised their cars with the slogan "Can you afford to walk" after working out their cars were so cheap to run that over 200 miles shoes and socks for the same distance would cost more. Their motors could be tuned up and, in much the same way as Stan Stevens was known as the Yamaha LC tuning guru, Trojans had a tuning expert by the name of Scroggs, a Group Captain in the RAF; getting the engine to go faster was known by Trojan owners as "Scrogging" the motor. I assure you I am not making any of this up.
They were , at one point, manufactured in the old Sopwith factory in Kingston by Leyland Motors. It later became Hawker Siddeley and made Hunters, Harriers and Hawks. Well, the parts, no runway so complete planes would have been a bit awkward.
James Doggart dude try split twin!
Excellent stuff!
Weren't Trojans built in Croydon,the factory being on the Purley Way?
The hungarian bike manufacturer Csepel also made a split-single bike, the Csepel 250/50 U
Yes
That's a pretty wild layout, I hadn't heard of it before...pretty unique sound too.
Cool stuff, I like the esoteric motors.
moto legends !
Glad to see you back with new content man
Thank you very much for the subtitles Visio!
Pleased to help
Jeah man, please more two stroke .
Yes!
Excellent choice in subject matter, Keep up the good work this wasn’t easy to find these bikes. My family had a motorcycle dealership, Bsa and Bridgestone, the Bridgestone 175 cc what is a twin, stock edge crank stroke was 180 between the two cylinders, but they would twist the crank until both pistons ran 360, and they called that a twingle, They did this for better traction in the dirt, less power pulses through the drive system.
Im still happy that you came back to make more vids
That 250 Puch was beautiful and sounded perfect.
Hi, check out the Csepel 250/U. It is a Hungarian made motorbike from the early 50's. It used the twingle layout and produced a poor 8 HP from 250ccm. But looked nice.
I have never even heard of a split single..
LOOK AT ME, I`m LEARNING :D
Wow I was just thinking about engines like this randomly sometime this morning
Yes
You seem to be having audio issues in some sections, like the audio loses most of its definition.
Yes
I subscribed. I love any kind of engine, and I like the way you talk!😀
Iso Isetta at Caramulo (Portugal)!
Omg I want this for my motorized bike....it would rev till heaven......and the sound is fat for the displacement....
Some old Polish 2 stroke WSK (and probably some others too) motorcycles had this exact soundtrack out of 125cc, and later on 175cc's too.
Just stick with the chinadoll
silverpairaducks too heavy
0:07 The second cylinder does not suck, the mixture is pushed in by the crankcase pressure! What's more some split singles have pistons that are rising and falling at the same time, e.g., the TWN split single. TWN Cornet: compression ratio was 6.5 : 1. The SS250 DKW had more than 20 hp, approx. 25 hp.
Nice, the subtitles is back!!!!!!! Excellent video!!!!
A nice cackle-buzz noise out of that DKW...
TWN also made the 'Contessa" a scooter which had a 197cc split single with electric starter, quite a fast bike for the time.
Twingles sound great!
A co třeba Slovenská motorka Manet M90? To je podle mě taky hodně zajmavý kousek
čekal sem že tu uvvidm maneta
Initial Kurwa
zrovna jsem to chtěl napsat
No
I LOVE the S-exhaust at 2:30
Unique sound. I didn't know these existed.
i have a Sears/ Puch 175 with 1900 original miles on it ...................there is no mistaking the sound of a twingle !......
Great to see you still posting videos
My family and I owned a 175 Allstate and two 250s.Very slow machines with enormously heavy crankshafts. When you cut the ignition the engine would still turn over for a couple of seconds. I wish I still had mine.
Could u please do a best sounding rally engines video?
No
@@Felixthecatz okay
Twitch B the poster Tron Born looks to be a random person not connected to this channel. They have been posting random Yes / No in a few threads.
@@bobroberts2371 I know
Never heard about this layout before
Good to see the subtitles back!
Hat off to you sir, never knew such engines existed,
and i thought i was a petrol head my first engine was 2t...
I love engines!
Congrats on 400000 subs! This engine concept is totally new to me. 👍
I know where a isetta is buried.. since the 1950s when i get the time i dig it up ...greetings from Germany 🇩🇪
Probably used for a septic tank?
Love your videos!👌🏻
We bought a new Puch 250 sold by Sears in 1968, and I still have it.
It also still runs and has only 300 miles on it. Notice it is Not an "Allstate" model and had the "Sears" badges on it.
Collectors be interested.........
You missed a Huge seller, the 175 and 250 Twingle sold by Sears as a Allstate from the early 50's to the late 60s. They were made by Puch. The cylinders were in sync as there was a master connecting rod with a tab off to the front for the slave cylinder. Neat thing was with my 175 cc unit the porting for the rear cylinder was different than that of the front cylinder. Did some 2 cycle performance work over the years and it was one was ported for low end torque and the other for higher end torque.
What about Manet 90? You forgot?
...a je to Tva domaci znacka.
th-cam.com/video/-jXxw_Y7Exc/w-d-xo.html
Wow, okay, toto mi uniklo. Možno sa o tom nehovorí medzi anglicko hovoriacou komunitou, tak mi to uniklo pri vyhľadávaní. Určite si to preštudujem, ďakujem
The video describes the TWN as a 'Cornet' but the model shown is the Triumph/TWN 'Boss' 2 banana down pies ,2 carbs .The 'Cornet appears later with the guy in shorts. Adtrizun 'Boss' owner.
All of your videos are fantastic in my opinion, VisioRacer ! I enjoy every single one ! Can I ask your first name ? Mine is Scott, I live in Arizona USA .
Of course Bridgestone wasn’t the only one that did that people were doing it with Yamaha, Suzuki also.
Oh God...the Isetta...although 72 miles to the gallon in the 50s was pretty great...mind you it could only hold like 3 gallons. Also it started out with 3 wheels but for obvious reasons it went to 4...
Listen very carefully and you’ll notice that the Allstate 250 sounds quite similar to a flat-twin or a BMW in-line twin with a 360° firing interval.
This is what I was thinking, all of these bikes sound more 4 stroke than a 2 stroke would usually sound. But in particular they do sound quite similar to my f650gs twin .
You should have shown more puchs:)
Greetings from Austria
love the unusual engines.
big thanks for that subtitle
Man I'd love to hear a big bore split single! Could you imagine what a 600cc would sound like?!
Imagined
Sound like vibration lol
The BMW Isetta had a four stroke single cylinder.
Why do you have no ads?
There is a Honda split single that is four stroke and each cylinder has its own combustion area also it’s cam chain is in the middle
The bike is a Honda 250 rebel
And I have one
The Allstate 250 sounds like its just been made by Honda. Did JAWA not make a split single engine, I'm sure they did, but I might be mistaken, thinking that one cylinder is the inlet and the other is the exhaust port, is temperature not a problem, cylinders working at different temperatures,, exhaust port always hotter than the inlet, good video,
Sounds like you could convert them to a ICSE, internal combustion Stirling engine. You'd need a different crank shaft and some 'plumbing' too, but it's possible...
The hungarians maked the Csepel 250 U this bike have 1 cylinder and twin pistons. This bike the rarest with twin piston.
Videl som zopár ďalších, ktoré boli aj v komentároch, ale zatiaľ som nenašiel ani v komentároch motorku, ktorú mal aj môj starý otec - Manet 90.
I think twingle also exist on four strokes but differently. Its a parallel twin that has both pistons on the same height all the time, but not like usually firing every other stroke (every 180deg), they fire at the same time every 360deg.
There even was a kawasaki 1000cc 4cyl race bike that had 2 cylinders fire at the same time lol
That's because of the cross plane crankshaft design. The cylinders itself have little to do with it.
@@Filip_Phreriks sorry i meant 360 deg not 180. i'm talking about twin cylinders that have BOTH pistons going up at the same time. Normally they dont fire together but in a twingle conversion they do. Its called twingle because its a twin but acts like a single.
Hey thanks for making pauses between parts of the video ;)
Wasn’t the Isetta made by BMW
Can you do this with a 4 stroke layout?
凄い!
What are the torque curves like....
Considering that's old 2 strokes with not that much hp, I'd rather say they are pretty smooth on a torque delivery. But they might differ from the ones Poland had in 60's-80's.
You should have mentioned Yezdi and Jawa motorcycles.
Outro missing? 😢
DKW SS racing bike, with built in compressor
You forgot our czechslovakian Manet 90.
Yo tuve el motor de una Iso así, tenían mucha fuerza
In the 60s I had a puch sport model with the twin carbs, one either side. They were cheap and ugly, in Austria. Always hard to start and usually had to push start, like the guy in the video. The pistons work like a 2 stage compression, the back one being a little behind the first, being the power stroke. Both pistons were on the same connecting rod. Never impressed me.
from a mechanical concept it's very interesting design. From a combustion point of view, this is the worst possible design. Look at the top piston crown at the end of the movie. There's a lot of pitting as a sever knock occurs in top of the secondary piston.
What about the Honda cm 200 twin?
That's a parallel twin four stroke engine.
Trojan built twin twingle (4 cylinders two spark plugs) powered cars, trucks and vans in the 1930s thru to I think the 1950s
How about the new Benelli 300s?
Miss your outro music dude
TWN is named triumph werke nürnberg ag. The real german triumph. My and my brother own two of them
Can you do one on ford ecoboost engines
but puch is Austrian and not only sold in USA
Interesting. Like most two strokes though they sound terrible.
Well, I guess they didn't work too well.
They worked fine, but an efficiently ported 180 degree twin is more efficient, has less vibration, revs faster, and is far more tunable. All the disadvantages of a single, all the disadvantages of a twin, plus the scavenging difficulties of the cross flow porting.
If anyone has any information on the model with the 'hairdryer' cooling system, please reach out to me. I'm keen to have any information I can get. Thanks.
Twingle!
а как же ОКА?)
It sounds like a 4 stroke
Did the bmw isetta also had the same engine layperson?
No, BMW used their own four-stroke single-cylinder, 250cc and 300cc.
VisioRacer thank you :)
1:45 dual gas caps??
It's a total loss oil system, one is for gas the other is oil (50w per the manual). It's premixing with a pump like you would do with an other 2 strokes but in the tank.
You forgot slovak motocycle manet m90
These engines sound very lazy. Not crisp throttle response at all. It almost like they can barely accelerate themselves let alone the bike.
Great so u put some austrian copy called puch but u don’t mention Jawa😒😢
❤❤❤❤
Not worth the extra complexity for the advantages gained really were they.
"Multiply the bore and stroke dimensions by two" is wrong. You mean "multiply the product of bore and stroke".
"5 Of The Only Split-Single Engines" makes no sense. perhaps you mean "The Only 5 Split-Single Engines"?
Unnecessarily over-complicated
@M Bacon I meant for what it's trying to achieve. Why do you think they didn't persevere with them?
@M Bacon yes, granted, they are less complicated in construction in comparison to a 4-stroke etc., but my point is that it's over-complicated for the issues it's trying to resolve, port timing.
It is and it isn't. The single combustion chamber saves metal and machine time versus two. The second cylinder reduces the need for an exhaust expansion chamber making exhaust engineering and manufacture cheaper. The Allstate was meant to be a cheap commuter to slog through urban traffic. Lots of idling, lots of stop and go, and little high rpm running. In that role the twingle makes some sense. YPVS and Reed valves were still on the horizon.
@@ahoneyman YPVS???
@@lucascady4992 Yamaha 2 stroke technology in the 80's. Basically it was a valve that opened at high rpm to make high rpm running more efficient.
first xdlsd