Mark Solms ~ Active Inference Insights 017 ~ Affect, Consciousness, Dreams

It’s more consciousness-talk on today’s episode of Active Inference Insights, as Darius discusses affective states, dreams, interoception and much more with psychoanalyst and neuropsychologist Professor Mark Solms.
Mark Solms
neuroscience.uct.ac.za/contac...
scholar.google.com/citations?...
mark_solms?lang=e...
"The Hidden Spring: A Journey to the Source of Consciousness"
"The Brain and the Inner World: An Introduction to the Neuroscience of the Subjective Experience"
Darius Parvizi-Wayne
/ dparviziwayne
www.researchgate.net/profile/...
Active Inference Insititute
www.activeinference.org
/ inferenceactive

[@joanmoloney8188]

think the 'hard problem' might mutate to delayed or absence of feeling in order to prioratise awareness of need .the hard problem of Affect.love Mr Solms.

[@alexandrazachary.musician]

Thanks so much Darius ❤️🙏🏽. I love Mark Solms and I totally love where the dual-aspect monism is going!!! Spinoza would be happy 😁. Finally after so much sloshing about in physicalism… not you… but many. ❤️❤️❤️

[@silviopina_111]

YAY!!! Don't know how I missed this Solms one, but found it now! 🎉

[@bellakrinkle9381]

Apologies, I'm rather focused on Fairbaign's object relations theory lately. I'll return another time.
It's great to see Dr. Solms doing new interviews. I subscribed.

[@rockapedra1130]

44:47 i like how the interviewer does not let himself get derailed away from the Hard problem. Solms has a lot of great ideas which i find fascinating but they don't quite penetrate into the Hard Problem imho. If I'm understanding Solms' stance correctly, he appears to treat subjectivity as an axiom? "Subjective feelings exist because they do. Things are dual, don't know why. Now let's talk about about how feelings are used." I don't think Solms is saying he has solved the Hard Problem, right? He just wants to talk about details and consequences AFTER the Miracle of subjectivity.

[@davedouglass438]

Would it be useful to restore SURPRISE/STARTLE into ongoing discussion of the core affects, as in Silvan Tomkins' work?
At minimum, this would allow a differentiation between Karll Friston's usage of 'surprise' (or surprisal) from Tomkins" ideas.

[@TechyBen]

30:00 is the explanation! The two "Mark Solms" both consider themselves "the same" but have some value difference *and are aware of that difference*. As that difference is some "value" not measured in the system *but between it's states*, it's a "feeling", because it can classify it, detect it, effect it, the thing "exists", but it cannot be observed directly, it's subjective! :D

[@rockapedra1130]

Can u flesh this out a bit? I'm not sure what u mean by it being "the explanation". Explanation of what? Not the Hard Problem, right?

[@TechyBen]

@@rockapedra1130 The self is the system that can detect changes in self. To do so, it's a feeling, because there is no external measurement for it, as an external system is detecting changes of other states, self is detecting changes of it's own state.

[@rockapedra1130]

@@TechyBenah, ok. So it's more of an explanation of the definition of "feeling". Not an explanation of how a feeling can come to manifest itself subjectively to begin with, right?

[@TechyBen]

@@rockapedra1130 Those are words. Things are what we (as existing things) classify.
If we classify something it is. What the complexity around this is, is "math" a thing that "physics/matter" is not.
We exist, I'm not worried about the mechanism and if it's made of matter, or made of the arrangement or function of matter.
Self classification seems to be a thing that exists, and that classification can be listed against other classifications, and we consider that a "feeling" (feeling hungry vs not, happy vs sad etc).

[@TechyBen]

@@rockapedra1130 (It can come to manifestation via the mechanisms that allow for self classification.
Sensations of our senses, thinking from our brain, social behaviours, etc. Mechanistically or socially, biologically or mentally)

[@davedouglass438]

Solms/Feldman Barrett discussion
Pt 1: th-cam.com/video/9yEPHUKyBOM/w-d-xo.html
Pt 2: th-cam.com/video/Ni3cIhn4xb4/w-d-xo.html

[@betel1345]

I'd love to see Lisa Feldman Barrett on here!

[@_ARCATEC_]

Subjective Perspective of a Conscious Organism
•X(s zPc q(o ) ZC ( O)Q zpc S)Y•
Extended Homeostatic Driver
•Xe h(s z q(δ E)Z(e ∆)Q z S)H eY•
Subjective Conscious Feeling
•X (s zc Fq() ZC ()Qf zc S) Y•

[@rockapedra1130]

Ah ... U mean
xxd dwfgr 56;65 fvhhev + 3?

[@_ARCATEC_]

@@rockapedra1130 Nope