I did a test of Mini Mag Target vs CCI Standard Velocity Target at 30 yards with a Ruger 10/22 fitted with a Volquartsen carbon fiber barrel that I custom bedded. The Mini Mags grouped at 2.7". The Standard Velocity Target was 0.3" Interesting how your rifle was dramatically different from mine. As you mentioned, each rifle is different and there's no one type of ammo that could be considered best overall.
I would be curious to see how the groups changed at 100yrds. The barrel makes a HUGE difference. The Volquartsen has a much tighter chamber than a stock Ruger barrel. Hope you subscribe.
Eye opening ... obviously, there are so many things that can influence this type of test, but from what I could see, it was done as scientifically as possible less lots of expensive tooling to control the test.
My Ruger 10/22 shoots all 40 grain round nose super accurately but I can’t find an accurate 36 grain “hunting” round, so I just hunt with with 40 grain target ammo, as long as it’s accurate there’s no real need for a hollow point
great video. very useful. nice approach to your work. eg indoors instead of outdoors, realistic distance of 50 yards and a rifle rest nice work, much appreciated i subscribed
Thanks. Please Subscribe. Technically it is an outdoor range but 30ft walls on 3 sides, so no issues with crosswind drift. It's not entirely ideal as the range's folding benches aren't as stable as shooting from a wood or concrete one. But considering many people shoot from Walmart card tables in their backyard, it'll do.
@@Moondog2A I was at the Worlds Field Target Airgun match competing as a newbie. I marveled at how the top 10 had NO muzzle movement during the shoot offs. After that I made no crosshair movement my focus. Followed by wind doping.....in 2011 or 2010 I placed 7th in PCP 20 fpe class. Good shootin.
@@Dutch.1722 Thank you so much for the compliment on my skillz. If you're ever in the San Francisco area, look me up. My home range has regular airgun and air pistol matches.
Really good testing there! Surprising results for me, I've had really good luck with the CCI Standard Velocity. Maybe I should put some more time in with the Mini-mags? I really like the through the scope shots too. What set-up are you using to get those?
I pulled a phone mount made for telescopes/spotting scopes. But since it's on my rifle scope I had to space it out a bit with some spare photo parts to match the eye-relief. Here's the mount I used: amzn.to/3iLn5mx but if you had to buy the spare photo adapters, it might be cheaper to by something like this: amzn.to/3nyNzv2 Maybe we should contact them and offer to do a review? :-D
@@Moondog2A Gotcha, I have seen those for sale but I didn't think they would work. Looks like they work really well for you. Might have to give them a shot.
@@TheOldFatDadGoober I found a similar ball-arm that I used back off my phone clamp from the scope clamp at a reasonable price. I think you have a similar camera holder for your spotting scope? Try using this: amzn.to/33MqL36
Old fart here...I have an older 10/22 that I installed an Archangel take-apart stock (Wonderful!!!!) with a 3x9x40 inexpensive scope. I only use the 6 power as I only shoot out to about 60m or so. My rifle loves the CCI Minimag 40g. bullets. Several years ago I bought 4-5 1600 rd. boxes (probably lifetime supply) of this fabulous ammo. Zeroed rifle @ 25m with 3/4 inch group from rest, right on center of 1 inch bullseye (indoors). Shoots one hole group (1 inch low @ 15m) and outdoors 1.5 inch groups about 1 inch high @ 50m. Calm or slight wind does not seem to affect it much so I don't have to rely on the marks on my recticle and appears dead on @ 60m, but I do not shoot beyond that because shooting critters beyond that, my rifle "wanders" too much freehand
Well said. The best advice anybody ever gave me was find a cheap ammo that shoots best at a distance you have fun shooting at and then buy a crap ton of that ammo.
I did a hundred round test at a hundred yards, of CCI Standard Velocity, CCI Mini-Mag 40 grain and Aguila Super Extra 40 grain, cleaning the bore between each type of ammo. Using my 10/22 Match rifle, all shot around 1moa, but the CCI Standard Velocity had much fewer flyers.
I've got an old Remington Model 24 with iron sights, 50 yards with CCI Mini mag Hollow Points my groups are 1in to 1 1/2in and my eyes are bad and I'm 63 years old. Different guns like different ammo
Very interesting results, but I think it may be more telling of the accuracy (or finickiness) of the rifle. I'd be wary of even small game hunting past 30yds with those groups. Admittedly, I'm not (yet) familiar with other results you've gotten with the Takedown, so this is just my initial impression. In comparison, my Kidd 10/22 has never shot anything larger than .75" groups with any CCI Ive tried at 50yds (it's a sub-MOA shooter with SK Semi). My stock (though built) 10/22 is probably closer to an inch.
Idk who will have the same issue, I just got a Ruger mark Iv, cci hollows we’re too short and we’re causing feeding issues. Currently looking for other cci options that might work better! Hopefully I remember to come back here with which worked
Thanks. I plan to do a future test with CCI green tag and Tactical as soon as I can track down that ammo. But as you know, ammo's hard to come by nowadays and these are the only CCI varieties I had stocked up on before COVID.
I need to foul the barrel with that specific ammos lube before you shoot a group. Cci standard is different than minimags. You can see it in your testing, the mag RN did the best because it was fouled by the HP.....
i've had nothing but weird experiences with mini-mag after getting a henry 22. i have been shooting mini mag mostly and i get a fair bit of rounds off center and even the odd round far off from where i aim. i was told that it was because i have poor technique causing low precision. however i also have some subsonic that i have been shooting and they seem to be far more consistent. i aim in a spot and the bullet hits. i shoot again aiming at the exact same spot and it hits again extremely close to where the last one hit, for example. i don't know what to make of it.
Stay away from Mini-Mags or any high-velocity 22LR if you're going for tighter groups shooting at +50yrds or more is what the Precision shooters in my club tell me. Subsonic 22LR will shoot tighter groups because the bullets are much more stable in the air (provided the powder and cartridges are manufactured consistently). At 50yrds-75yrds, supersonic bullets slow down and transition to sub-sonic speed and that causes turbulence around the bullet that causes them to wobble and deviate. th-cam.com/video/bELu-if5ckU/w-d-xo.html
@@Moondog2A i guess that makes sense. are high velocity 22s more consistent when shot from a handgun? perhaps they can't build up enough velocity in a short barrel to become unstable. edit- i also forgot to add that i am shooting at only 20-25 yards with my henry rifle.
At 20-25yrd range, transonic transition shouldn't be the issue then. Like they say, every gun is different and each likes and hates different ammo. My pistols only cycle mini-mags which is the only reason I have a reasonable supply of it on-hand to test with. My Marlin 60 likes prefers CCI Tactical (though I haven't tested it with Standard yet). My 10/22 actually prefers Aguila Super-Extra over CCI.
@@nobody2021 I don't know yet. I didn't buy much standard velocity 22LR normally preferring to just buy MiniMags and Aguila HV. But with COVID shortages it's been hard to find any 22LR ammo to test against SV or HV. But I was just able to buy 200rnds of CCI subsonic yesterday and plan to try it out soon. I'll post a video as soon as I can get back to the range and try it out.
Hello. I see you have the Ruger 10/22 takedown. How is the accuracy of it please? What I mean is the accuracy of taking it down and putting it back up, so on and so forth. Does the accuracy change after you take it down and put it back up many times?
The 10/22 TD can be accurate if you lock down the lockdown nut to the point that its stiff to reconnect. If it gets too easy to put it on, that means there's too much tolerance. You also shouldn't rest the forward half which can shift your POI. Keep your rest above the magwell and it will be as accurate as a normal 10/22. Hope you subscribed.
Did you fire any rounds of the new ammo between groups to normalize the lubricant in the bore? Some people say this doesn't have an effect but I have found it to make a difference for first few rounds of the group. Usually waxed lead is most noticeable but that wax would transfer onto the copper plated groups as well. Actually in this case could explain why your middle groups with the 40 CPRN were the best and not effected as much.
No, in this test I did not "season" the barrel with a specific ammo type. But I did a follow-up test where I cleaned and snaked the bore between before switching to a different ammo. The results were surprising th-cam.com/video/UA4QA0L4FNM/w-d-xo.html
@@Moondog2A that's fair. I will answer on this comment just for conversation sake. My findings are somewhat similar to yours though heat did not appear to effect mine unless a ton of rounds were fired. First 4 rounds when switching would be eractic especially when switching between copper and lubed lead. When firing 3x 10 rnd groups then switching ammo the groups would get consistently better with 3rd group always being best. I no longer clean the bore of my 22lr's now besides a tiny bit of oil. I cleaned a super accurate old Remington 510 targermaster that I thought was a smoothbore only to find out that 1. It was rifled 2. It does not fire near as good groupings after scrubbing the bore. Turned a sub MOA rifle into 4 MOA rifle with same ammo. I'm hoping after several hundred rounds the group size will improve and have found my 10/22 barrels really come into their own after many many rounds are fired through them. No cleaning for me anymore but don't take my findings as truth everyone has their own findings and beliefs and this is just my own experience. Keep up the good videos though. Will be subscribing to see more of your content!
I can make almost any rifle shoot tighter with a Volquartsen barrel upgrade. But this test was strictly off the shelf for folks to get a better idea of a baseline.
I didn't have a chrono so I didn't record those numbers. I just reported the manufacturers numbers which independent testers have reported are generally accurate.
Yes. Though some precision guys with upgraded barrels prefer Standard Velocity because LRN doesn't deposit copper on your groves like Minimags will over time.
For my riflescope? I used this one but had to modify it. amzn.to/33hSPOw I recommend this one instead: amzn.to/3LlEv8V And please SUB to this channel, thanx!
@@Moondog2A then stick with it, one day it'll shoot a good group, 🤣🤣🤣🤣 sorry but having sold 3 Ruger 10/22 for being the most inaccurate firearms I've ever shot after 54 years of shooting, I couldn't resist, I must try harder, good video and very professional editing 👏👏
@@michaelbritain5546 Maybe it's because grew up shooting dimes with my Marlin and I had really low, low expectations when I bought my 10/22 especially the takedown version which has the worst reputation for holding zero of any 10/22. But I discovered it wasn't as bad as I thought. I do these ammo tests with this 10/22 to show folks the "Worst Case Accuracy" so-to-speak.
@@Moondog2A that works for me, have a Marlin 925 and a Marlin 49dl autoloader, both as accurate as my CZ 425, keep up the great videos and I'll refrain from giving you grief about the 10/22 🤣👍
Here is the previous ammo test I mentioned: th-cam.com/video/Hz7seUqEd68/w-d-xo.html
I did a test of Mini Mag Target vs CCI Standard Velocity Target at 30 yards with a Ruger 10/22 fitted with a Volquartsen carbon fiber barrel that I custom bedded. The Mini Mags grouped at 2.7". The Standard Velocity Target was 0.3" Interesting how your rifle was dramatically different from mine. As you mentioned, each rifle is different and there's no one type of ammo that could be considered best overall.
I would be curious to see how the groups changed at 100yrds. The barrel makes a HUGE difference. The Volquartsen has a much tighter chamber than a stock Ruger barrel. Hope you subscribe.
Eye opening ... obviously, there are so many things that can influence this type of test, but from what I could see, it was done as scientifically as possible less lots of expensive tooling to control the test.
My Ruger 10/22 shoots all 40 grain round nose super accurately but I can’t find an accurate 36 grain “hunting” round, so I just hunt with with 40 grain target ammo, as long as it’s accurate there’s no real need for a hollow point
better penetration anyways... don't tell anyone i said that tho right now... sheeeeiiittt
try the 36gr federal blue box bulk ammo, it wont disappoint
CCI has a 40 gr copper washed segmenting HV HP
Great video, buddy! I felt like I was right there with you wanting to squeeze the trigger.
And you probably would have gotten better groups than me if you did. ;-)
great video. very useful. nice approach to your work.
eg indoors instead of outdoors, realistic distance of 50 yards and a rifle rest
nice work, much appreciated
i subscribed
Thanks. Please Subscribe. Technically it is an outdoor range but 30ft walls on 3 sides, so no issues with crosswind drift. It's not entirely ideal as the range's folding benches aren't as stable as shooting from a wood or concrete one. But considering many people shoot from Walmart card tables in their backyard, it'll do.
@@Moondog2A I was at the Worlds Field Target Airgun match competing as a newbie. I marveled at how the top 10 had NO muzzle movement during the shoot offs. After that I made no crosshair movement my focus. Followed by wind doping.....in 2011 or 2010 I placed 7th in PCP 20 fpe class. Good shootin.
@@Dutch.1722 Thank you so much for the compliment on my skillz. If you're ever in the San Francisco area, look me up. My home range has regular airgun and air pistol matches.
Another fab video. I get far better results with MM 36 hp than with MM 40 rn with my 10/22. So as you say, every gun is different; perplexing.
Yeah every gun is different. In my guns, HP's are generally less consistent than solid bullets. Hope you subscribe!
@@Moondog2A I subscribed long ago. Great channel!
Really good testing there! Surprising results for me, I've had really good luck with the CCI Standard Velocity. Maybe I should put some more time in with the Mini-mags?
I really like the through the scope shots too. What set-up are you using to get those?
I pulled a phone mount made for telescopes/spotting scopes. But since it's on my rifle scope I had to space it out a bit with some spare photo parts to match the eye-relief. Here's the mount I used: amzn.to/3iLn5mx but if you had to buy the spare photo adapters, it might be cheaper to by something like this: amzn.to/3nyNzv2
Maybe we should contact them and offer to do a review? :-D
@@Moondog2A Gotcha, I have seen those for sale but I didn't think they would work. Looks like they work really well for you. Might have to give them a shot.
@@TheOldFatDadGoober I found a similar ball-arm that I used back off my phone clamp from the scope clamp at a reasonable price. I think you have a similar camera holder for your spotting scope? Try using this: amzn.to/33MqL36
Join my FB group and you can also share your newest vids there facebook.com/groups/gearhor/
Old fart here...I have an older 10/22 that I installed an Archangel take-apart stock (Wonderful!!!!) with a 3x9x40 inexpensive scope. I only use the 6 power as I only shoot out to about 60m or so. My rifle loves the CCI Minimag 40g. bullets. Several years ago I bought 4-5 1600 rd. boxes (probably lifetime supply) of this fabulous ammo. Zeroed rifle @ 25m with 3/4 inch group from rest, right on center of 1 inch bullseye (indoors). Shoots one hole group (1 inch low @ 15m) and outdoors 1.5 inch groups about 1 inch high @ 50m. Calm or slight wind does not seem to affect it much so I don't have to rely on the marks on my recticle and appears dead on @ 60m, but I do not shoot beyond that because shooting critters beyond that, my rifle "wanders" too much freehand
Well said. The best advice anybody ever gave me was find a cheap ammo that shoots best at a distance you have fun shooting at and then buy a crap ton of that ammo.
I did a hundred round test at a hundred yards, of CCI Standard Velocity, CCI Mini-Mag 40 grain and Aguila Super Extra 40 grain, cleaning the bore between each type of ammo. Using my 10/22 Match rifle, all shot around 1moa, but the CCI Standard Velocity had much fewer flyers.
I wonder if that's because it's essentially subsonic or if it's more consistent burn in the powder?
I've got an old Remington Model 24 with iron sights, 50 yards with CCI Mini mag Hollow Points my groups are 1in to 1 1/2in and my eyes are bad and I'm 63 years old. Different guns like different ammo
Those Remington 24's and 34's were great shooters. Please SUBSCRIBE.
@@Moondog2A I did thx
I would like to see that same test done but on 100 and 150 yards as well
Very interesting results, but I think it may be more telling of the accuracy (or finickiness) of the rifle. I'd be wary of even small game hunting past 30yds with those groups. Admittedly, I'm not (yet) familiar with other results you've gotten with the Takedown, so this is just my initial impression.
In comparison, my Kidd 10/22 has never shot anything larger than .75" groups with any CCI Ive tried at 50yds (it's a sub-MOA shooter with SK Semi). My stock (though built) 10/22 is probably closer to an inch.
That Kidd barrel makes a big difference.
I love the all lead bullets, it probably me but they make a very nice sound from a pistol
A nice loud pop out of my P22. Be sure to subscribe.
Idk who will have the same issue, I just got a Ruger mark Iv, cci hollows we’re too short and we’re causing feeding issues. Currently looking for other cci options that might work better! Hopefully I remember to come back here with which worked
If you want a hotter round to cycle a finicky Mar IV, you could try Blazer which is essentially Mini-Mags but with a lead bullet like CCI standard.
Sorry i must not of caught it or cant seem to find it. How many yards (or feet) away were your targets?
6" target stickers at 50yrds
My cz452 and Ruger American 22 long rifle loves CCI standard velocity 40 grain lead round nose!!!
True, CCI Standard shoots better in bolt guns. Hope you subscribed.
Ah! Should have watched the new video. 🤠👍 Awesome!
Thanks. I plan to do a future test with CCI green tag and Tactical as soon as I can track down that ammo. But as you know, ammo's hard to come by nowadays and these are the only CCI varieties I had stocked up on before COVID.
I need to foul the barrel with that specific ammos lube before you shoot a group. Cci standard is different than minimags. You can see it in your testing, the mag RN did the best because it was fouled by the HP.....
You said you fired 10 test rounds to zero scope but curious as to which ammo you used for that?
CCI Mini-Mags
i've had nothing but weird experiences with mini-mag after getting a henry 22. i have been shooting mini mag mostly and i get a fair bit of rounds off center and even the odd round far off from where i aim. i was told that it was because i have poor technique causing low precision. however i also have some subsonic that i have been shooting and they seem to be far more consistent. i aim in a spot and the bullet hits. i shoot again aiming at the exact same spot and it hits again extremely close to where the last one hit, for example. i don't know what to make of it.
Stay away from Mini-Mags or any high-velocity 22LR if you're going for tighter groups shooting at +50yrds or more is what the Precision shooters in my club tell me. Subsonic 22LR will shoot tighter groups because the bullets are much more stable in the air (provided the powder and cartridges are manufactured consistently). At 50yrds-75yrds, supersonic bullets slow down and transition to sub-sonic speed and that causes turbulence around the bullet that causes them to wobble and deviate. th-cam.com/video/bELu-if5ckU/w-d-xo.html
@@Moondog2A i guess that makes sense. are high velocity 22s more consistent when shot from a handgun? perhaps they can't build up enough velocity in a short barrel to become unstable.
edit- i also forgot to add that i am shooting at only 20-25 yards with my henry rifle.
At 20-25yrd range, transonic transition shouldn't be the issue then. Like they say, every gun is different and each likes and hates different ammo. My pistols only cycle mini-mags which is the only reason I have a reasonable supply of it on-hand to test with. My Marlin 60 likes prefers CCI Tactical (though I haven't tested it with Standard yet). My 10/22 actually prefers Aguila Super-Extra over CCI.
@@Moondog2A do you own any guns in which you see a significant increase in accuracy when using lower velocity ammo?
@@nobody2021 I don't know yet. I didn't buy much standard velocity 22LR normally preferring to just buy MiniMags and Aguila HV. But with COVID shortages it's been hard to find any 22LR ammo to test against SV or HV. But I was just able to buy 200rnds of CCI subsonic yesterday and plan to try it out soon. I'll post a video as soon as I can get back to the range and try it out.
Hello. I see you have the Ruger 10/22 takedown. How is the accuracy of it please? What I mean is the accuracy of taking it down and putting it back up, so on and so forth. Does the accuracy change after you take it down and put it back up many times?
The 10/22 TD can be accurate if you lock down the lockdown nut to the point that its stiff to reconnect. If it gets too easy to put it on, that means there's too much tolerance. You also shouldn't rest the forward half which can shift your POI. Keep your rest above the magwell and it will be as accurate as a normal 10/22. Hope you subscribed.
@@Moondog2A Thanks a lot!
@@liedebunker1253 You're welcome.
Did you fire any rounds of the new ammo between groups to normalize the lubricant in the bore? Some people say this doesn't have an effect but I have found it to make a difference for first few rounds of the group. Usually waxed lead is most noticeable but that wax would transfer onto the copper plated groups as well. Actually in this case could explain why your middle groups with the 40 CPRN were the best and not effected as much.
No, in this test I did not "season" the barrel with a specific ammo type. But I did a follow-up test where I cleaned and snaked the bore between before switching to a different ammo. The results were surprising th-cam.com/video/UA4QA0L4FNM/w-d-xo.html
@@Moondog2A that's fair. I will answer on this comment just for conversation sake. My findings are somewhat similar to yours though heat did not appear to effect mine unless a ton of rounds were fired. First 4 rounds when switching would be eractic especially when switching between copper and lubed lead. When firing 3x 10 rnd groups then switching ammo the groups would get consistently better with 3rd group always being best.
I no longer clean the bore of my 22lr's now besides a tiny bit of oil. I cleaned a super accurate old Remington 510 targermaster that I thought was a smoothbore only to find out that 1. It was rifled 2. It does not fire near as good groupings after scrubbing the bore. Turned a sub MOA rifle into 4 MOA rifle with same ammo. I'm hoping after several hundred rounds the group size will improve and have found my 10/22 barrels really come into their own after many many rounds are fired through them. No cleaning for me anymore but don't take my findings as truth everyone has their own findings and beliefs and this is just my own experience.
Keep up the good videos though. Will be subscribing to see more of your content!
Take-down? Should get the Volquartsen take down barrel for this summer. Maybe that's why SV came in last.
I can make almost any rifle shoot tighter with a Volquartsen barrel upgrade. But this test was strictly off the shelf for folks to get a better idea of a baseline.
Hi, what is the measured velocity at the muzzle for the CCI std velocity ?
I didn't have a chrono so I didn't record those numbers. I just reported the manufacturers numbers which independent testers have reported are generally accurate.
What camera set up are you using to view what you see through the optic?
I used my phone and a modified spotting scope adapter but it's a little complicated. I've since upgraded to a Svbony scope adapter amzn.to/3v35Gf0
I own a Marlin XT 22LR, is it okay to shoot CCI Minimag?
Yes. Though some precision guys with upgraded barrels prefer Standard Velocity because LRN doesn't deposit copper on your groves like Minimags will over time.
@@MoondogReviews Thanks.
Wow i never knew the mini mag is so loud! Does anyone know why is it that hollow points r louder?
Mini Mags are packed with more powder than Standard, which makes them go about 200fps faster.
Great video
Link for the phone holder?
For my riflescope? I used this one but had to modify it. amzn.to/33hSPOw
I recommend this one instead: amzn.to/3LlEv8V
And please SUB to this channel, thanx!
Those 0030 CCI 40gr/1235fps RN are hard to beat. Hard to find too!
What scope/reticle is that?
It's a UTG Bugbuster with an old school MilDot reticle th-cam.com/video/9mDs_EtGc1E/w-d-xo.html
Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks!
Sweet video. I had a buddy named Moondog... Haven't heard from him in awhile.. he's probably in prison lol
It wasn't me, I swear.
Rocksteady set up you have there. Your crosshairs don't move hardly.
Any mistakes are entirely user error on my part.
CCI mini mag cprn rock
Maybe use an accurate bolt action rifle and not a POS 10/22 as it's an accuracy test.
Haha. Well, it's an accuracy test for a POS 10/22.
@@Moondog2A then stick with it, one day it'll shoot a good group, 🤣🤣🤣🤣 sorry but having sold 3 Ruger 10/22 for being the most inaccurate firearms I've ever shot after 54 years of shooting, I couldn't resist, I must try harder, good video and very professional editing 👏👏
@@michaelbritain5546 Maybe it's because grew up shooting dimes with my Marlin and I had really low, low expectations when I bought my 10/22 especially the takedown version which has the worst reputation for holding zero of any 10/22. But I discovered it wasn't as bad as I thought. I do these ammo tests with this 10/22 to show folks the "Worst Case Accuracy" so-to-speak.
@@Moondog2A that works for me, have a Marlin 925 and a Marlin 49dl autoloader, both as accurate as my CZ 425, keep up the great videos and I'll refrain from giving you grief about the 10/22 🤣👍
I agree with you 100 per cent about the 10 22 worst shooting gun i ever had
The heavier ,40 grain pills will be more accurate than the 36 grain pills.
Dead nuts
🇧🇷 🇧🇷
Thanks for watching. Hope you subscribed.
Dropped a hog at 50 yd with one shot. CCI MM RN 40gr.
Nice. People tend to discount 22LR but forget that shot placement is key. How big was the hog?
@@Moondog2A 150lbs. He dropped like a bag of potato’s. Second follow. Up shot hit less than an inch apart. Between ear and eye.