Can't tell ya my man. Find a demo day around you or if you know someone who has one you are considering. The "best" kayak is the one that fits you the best.
I've had a Hobie PA12 for a few years now and I think I love it more now than when I bought it. I fish with it in Minnesota and Wisconsin during the summer months catching crappies, bass, walleyes and northern pike. In the winter it comes with to Florida for the saltwater fish. I have a 16 foot aluminum fishing boat and a 24 foot Cobia for big water but the Hobie is the most fun to fish out of. I'm 6'8" and 65 years old with a bad shoulder. It has the leg room and comfort for hours of fishing.
I just purchased that Pilot and had it out once. It maneuvers really well. Tight turns. Easy to keep a steady 4mph. Comfortable seating position. Easy to stand it. I was a little shaky at first but had also never stood in a kayak. It has a recessed transducer area in the hull that fits the Helix SI transducer perfectly. The rear well will hold a 30qt cooler (sideways) probably larger if you go fore and aft. I installed yak attack flush mount rod holders in the molded in holder spots. Its fairly light at 85lbs. Make sure you go thru and tighten all the screws cause they all seemed a little loose. I will say this about the pedal drive...........it doesn't like weeds! The lake I was at last weekend was 95% covered in weeds and made testing it kinda hard. I plan on posting some more videos in the future. I started a thread on yakangler.com too. Posted some pics here www.yakangler.com/forum/18-kayak-specific/33292-perception-pescador-pilot-12?start=10
Just recently got rid of my Nucanoe Pursuit, and explored pedal drive kayaks and finally settled on hobie pro angler 14, had it for 2 weeks and haven't regretted a single day. The quality and detail they put in these kayaks are unmatched. You won't regret it.
It's worth the extra money, stable, fast. And rigging is a breeze. Only thing is, I recommend a trailer or boondox landing gear other wise you'll get tired of moving that big sim bich around
I've done a lot of research on pedal drives. I chose the Oldtown PDL. My Brother has a Native Slayer, and 3 bothers have Hobie Pro Angler. Based on my experience being around all 3, I like Oldtown or Pro Angler.
I've been fishing out of the Native Propel 13 for 3 years and absolutely love it. The hands-free reverse is the main reason I bought this yak. I use this option inshore to help pull reds and shook out from the mangroves. It also works great when you're trying to set up the best position in a current in and offshore. This past weekend I was using it when fighting a tarpon that wanted to pull me towards a swim buoy or when he was trying to swim back under my kayak. Definitely check out the Propel before making your final decision.
It's kinda fun to watch some of your older videos. everything got better over the years. and glad you have so many boats now. . . even if they don't always float.
I've owned the Hobie Outback (older model) and now own the Hobie Pro Angler 12. I would suggest you go with a Hobie and the Outback specifically (2015 or later). It is less expensive, easier to transport, very stable and has an awesome all day seat.
Reverse is needed a very small percentage of the time. Only needed it when I get caught up in the mangroves and then, as in other kayaks, I used the paddle or pushed off of the branches to back out. Anyway, good luck on your choice and if you can take some test drives. That could make the difference.
Love my Slayer Propel 10. Plenty stable, and light weight. Loading into my truck is easy. Have had it a year and use it almost every week. My bass boat has been sitting dormant for a few years feeling jealous, but that reminds me of the cost of fuel I have saved on the boat and towing. Fishing in strong wind is difficult in any kayak but with the slayer's pedal drive I was able to maintain my position over fish in gusts up to 30 mph. It was work however. I did upgrade the rudder and customize with a high end fish finder and custom built rod holders for slow trolling. only thing I realy don't like is water coming over the bow while pedaling in rough water. Solved that problem by covering cardboard with ductape and taping it to the bow as a shield for those rough days. It then stores rolled up in the front hatch until I need it again. Love the Slayer.
k guys, I posted this in here as it is (was) my intention to purchase the Titan and will use it for all of my fishing needs and BTB. I am a big guy, 6'2" 250lbs so this kayak has had my attention. Currently I own the 2013 PA 14, a great boat I would just like a different layout. My first kayak was the Native Mariner 13.5 and I loved the propel system. Today April 22, I rented the Native Titan and headed to Lake Conroe, wanted to spend the day in the kayak to see if I really was going to spend the kind of bank they request for the new Titan. I have seen many videos and as always I believe and the videos never inform us on how big the person in the kayaks are they jump around do their marketing dances and rave on how great the product ABC kayak is. AND !!!! it is always different when I get in the product ABC kayak. Why?? Because the guy in the video is 5'4" and 145 pounds, a very big difference between him and me. Another big indicator to me is that all the videos are shot on glass type of conditions, never in the real world condition. It is not like when I get to the water if I can't shave in it I am packing up and going home. Well I can say that I attended the demo days and tested the Titan, in Conroe glass conditions, (not a great test), however it still cavitation problems. Then I went to Missouri City demo days, bigger pond more wind slight chop, (better test) still the same problem. Today Lake Conroe (Scott's Ridge) high winds as the front pushed through some white caps not great conditions to be in a kayak but it was great conditions for testing the true performance of this vessel. After putting the kayak in the water I pulled it around to the small cove next to the launch and loaded a couple of poles my phone, a DP, and my life jacket. Of I went, out to the left around towards the swimming area. The water was very choppy, ( I would say 1-2 ft seas as a comparison) the kayak did not give me any concerns though it felt very stable even as I turn the kayak parallel to the waves to see if that gave me any concern. None I never felt I was going to turtle, something I would not have done in any other kayak. Tied up the first set off trees to see how it handles this kind of choppy conditions, was the nose going to handle this? Was it going to be too shaky? was it going to lift and slam down getting jerked by the rope tightening up and then giving slack as it settled into the next oncoming wave? Nothing I have fished this spot many of times in the same conditions and much better conditions. I prefer the better but today was not about that. I felt very comfortable, never being jerked around never slamming down, this kayak performed great. Released the rope and headed out to the middle of the lake out past the old rail tram entering the bigger body of water headed towards the 1097 bridge. I stopped paddling and stood up moved around and never felt in any danger. The is something I can not do in any other kayak period. I got on my knees and crawled out to the nose and sat on the front hatch cover of towards one side for strength and hung my legs of the front of the kayak. I almost fell in but what I was doing was not normal and would not be doing at anytime in normal fishing conditions. The kayak did not feel as it was going to flip, I almost fell as the waves were very rough and the wind was incredibly strong. Ok enough about the amazing stability with this kayak and down to what I think is the more important concern. The drive on this kayak needs to be reviewed. The center of the hull of the kayak is concave, and not just by a little, it is a very large area. I would think that it is designed this way to help allow the kayak to remain stable, and get into skinny water with it weight of nearly 150lbs. The kayak move or travels through the water superbly at either fast or slow speeds. What happens in smooth water and worse in chop is that the propeller creates positive and negative forces, drawing water in and pushing water out to thrust you in either direction. When peddling this actions causes the water to be drawn towards the propeller and you can take the center cover off and watch as it creates a void so the propeller is pulling air. Yes AIR, and you loose propulsion. When this happens it makes noise in both smooth or choppy conditions. the biggest concern is that when you are heading into a headwind you must apply more force to move forward, this causes the drive to cavitate, add some chop and the problem gets worse. the hull being concave, and the drive unit not being longer where the propeller is down further in the water really creates an large issue with getting this kayak through the water. I don't want to fish in mirror conditions, I want to fish anytime I want and when I get to my destination and it is choppy I want to put my yak in the water and catch fish. When I returned the Titan to ACK in Spring, I spoke to the manager, who quickly stated that he was told this was only a proto type and that changes may be made. In the same few minutes he told me that he had 24 of these units sold already. I hope for the people who have already purchased that this issue is resolved. I know that you can use the transom mount for a trolling motor but you can always use this and participate in many tournaments. I want this kayak just not sure I want something that I am going to struggle with in the water. Hope this helps.
dude that's great info. I'm so glad so many of you guys jumped in on this and gave so many great opinions. I've already made my decision and have my new kayak in my garage. The unveiling will be on Friday!!!
Great video - it's always better to hear from someone who's had one and lived with it vs. the salespeople's 'walk-thrus' - not to mention you're spending your own hard-earned $. Also, I'm too late and possibly mis-informed, but I thought I saw where you could remove the pedal system entirely from the Native and replace with a trolling motor. I could be mistaken about the brand so please don't crucify me, but if it's true, then that type of flexibility would have been key in any decision I made about a $2500 (and up) kayak.
I bought the Perception Pescador Pilot back in April and had it shipped to Alaska, It works great for lakes for trout and im looking forward to taking it out into the ocean for halibut fishing. I got mine with the upgraded/fixed drive and have no issues. Only small issue is the rod holders but i have a violet that has holders and I added flush mount holders. Ive also used my pilot to fly fish sitting and standing. Hope this helps
Yo Bro. I was in the same boat/ Kayak. I wanted a pedal drive kayak, However I needed two. My wife wanted one too. We have been married 34 years and wanted a new hobby we could enjoy together. I also did not want to blow a mortgage payment to get one. We bought 2 Pescodor Pilots and love them. We make sure the dives stay oil and have not had one problem. We have gone out to the lake more then 8 times and it has been GREAT! We look forward to to getting out onto the lake as much as possible. Perception is the way to go!!!!!! We will plan to do a Video soon.
I've researched the Hobie and Native Watercraft and I am leaning towards a Hobie with the Mirage 180 drive as it can be locked flat against the hull for some real shallow waterways and it is one with the reverse feature.
Old town pdl. Super comfortable, has a lot of space and is very stable. Also I've had it for some time now and it feels very well made, with quality material. I also had to do a lot of research to decide.
I was torn between a Old Town PDL or a Hobie PA12. I researched, watch hours of video and decided on a Hobie PA12. A few reasons for me were...wider, I'd say it's significantly wider than an Old Town is (those extra inches make a big difference), another was storage, there wasn't much room to store anything in the OldTown, You can't even store a Black Pack in the right way behind the seat. Another huge reason was the Vantage seat, I've a had a few different kayaks and in those I could only sit for about 2-3 hours then it would become very uncomfortable and the pain would linger for a couple days now I can comfortably sit an entire tournament and not be in any discomfort. Another reason was it's ease to hook up accessories with the H Rail and wire management Hobie has, it took me 20 minutes to run wire for my fish finder and it's all water tight. Lastly, it comes with about 300 bucks or so of accessories. The price difference for me was about 500 bucks but you can't buy size and storage. I've had mine out a bunch of times, some in calm water and most in 1-3 foot waves and it's performed flawlessly. I felt very cramped in the pdl and with the Hobie I have room to move around. Some cons are the weight but a set of Boonedox took care of that for transporting to a launch. Some say Hobie accessories are over priced but I don't think they are any more pricey than other kayak accessory manufactures and they fit right and are quality. I was nervous aand had a case of buyers remorse the first few days but the first tournament I was in we had rough windy conditions with 1.5-2ft waves and 15-18mph winds this thing didn't care so that took my doubts away real fast.
I own a hobie pro angler. And would highly recommend it. The motion of your feet with the mirage drive make you go effortlessly on the water on a speed you can fish great. And you can also crank. For me, the most important thing that make the mirage drive superior to bicycle type pedals is the motion of your feet.... this linear motion, instead of a circular motion makes you pedal with less effort and more strength. I ain't no rich guy, but I don't regret any cent spent on the hobie. I would look for other ways to save money on daily basis routines than saving on hobbies... and hobies!!! Thanks for great videos man!
great stuff! I can't argue that the mirage drive is superior...but they don't have an instant reverse, and it's not hands free. big negatives for an angler. But hobies are the bomb...no doubt
Just to add to the reverse problem. Now i do not own myself yet, but i rented one this past weekend. I made sure to use the reverse a few times just to try it out. The last time I used it I put it back in forward. The fins rotated then the cable snapped off. When i returned it I told them what happened. Thought it was my fault. Maybe i pulled too hard. They said they have seen it happen 4 or 5 times now since it has come out. If that would happen to you going into reverse you would be screwed, but on a good note there was nothing else to complain about for the pro angler. Well other then the obvious weight.
That was one of my hang ups too but to be honest, it's not bad at all to use once you get used to it. I have only used my reverse while hooked up with a fish a couple times and it wasn't a big deal. The best thing I've put on mine is a Bernies River Stik to keep me in place.
This is a know issue and I believe they fixed it but most of that is operator error. A lot of people don't make sure the pedals are close together and reef on the pull tags.
Being a wilderness systems prostaffer, I would go with the RADAR series and that can have a helix pedal drive then upgrading it to a motor drive. A real triple threat. Check it out, but pescador pilot is a great boat.
yeah I've heard good things about wilderness yaks, unfortunately I couldn't find a place nearby that would let me demo it, so I ended up with a native titan
lojo.fishing sounds like a great boat. If you could, would you please check out my channel? I do updates on all of my companies new products, with tips and tricks. Thanks!
I bought a brand new Hobie PA 14 at the end of the season last year and I can't believe how happy I am with this boat it's not the new model with the reverse butt many people don't realize you can just turn the Mirage drive around 180 degrees and you have reverse. turn 180 again and you're going forward again. Not to mention the sail kit that is available. And for the available drop in electric Drive big $$$$ for that torqeedo but eventually I figure I'll save up and buy it. the main thing is I love it love it love it I took it to Florida and caught lots of fish from sailfish, mahi-mah,i fish king mackerel. I primarily use it in Lake Erie. where I live most of the year working for Chrysler making Wranglers Jeeps. on my off time I primarily fish for walleye and bass. Rhe cool thing is I bought last year's demo for my wife the Hobie 11s inflatable and that thing is incredible! My wife weighs about a hundred pounds or so and she loves it too, she can handle it all by yourself and fits in the trunk of a car, check it onto a airplane. the pa-14 is a barge but I still handle it completely all by myself, even car topping it. Love it no regrets buying in it at all. I also equally love the Hobie -12 Outback... the Outback is a little bit lighter and just a little easier to handle by yourself and you can hang your feet over the side much easier than the pa-14 because of the a H rails that goes along each side of the PA 14- but they make up for it in functionality from everything to rod holders to fish finders cup holders built-in tackle box right in front of the vantage seat that is fully adjustable. I can't say enough good things about my Hobie crafts that I purchased for my wife and I
yeah man the hobies are beasts for sure, the main problem for me is that there is no instant reverse and it's not hands free. doesn't seem like a big deal, but for a dedicated angler like myself that is a big thing. But I'm still considering hobie as a front runner in my decision.
I have owned a Native Propel 10 for over 5 years. When I first bought it I thought I was nuts to spend that on a Kayak but I have used it so much that i think it was the best boat I ever bought, with all the enjoyment it has given me. It is small and easier to move around than a larger one but still big enough for my Yellow Lab to ride on the back with me. Once we came face to face with a 12 foot alligator in a narrow Lake Marion creek. It showed me to NEVER buy one without reverse as I had to peddle furiously in reverse, to save my dog. When a Gator is coming at you, his whole body submerges lower and lower until you just see huge eyeballs coming toward you. It is really creepy. No trouble with the drive system yet but The rudder cable snapped recently and I replaced it fairly easily for about $5 from Lowes. It seems like windy conditions prevail these days and we have a lot more waves so if I was to do it again, I think I would get the longer model as my 10 footer gets some overwash coming over the bow in real high waves. I watch my wife's 12 foot Malibu Stealth cut right through the waves without overwash so I think it is the extra length that helps out between waves. I carry four poles and fish two at a time, with a dog on the back and a Lowrance mounted on a track.
don't know if anyone mentioned this already but native manta Ray is $2000 and is fishing ready with tracks and flush rod mounts. I'd give that one a glance over if you want an affordable kayak from a more reputable company
I first had the Slayer Propel 10. Got stationed in Japan and sold it. I now Have a Native Manta Ray Propel 12. Got it for $1,900 and it is a really good kayak.
I do offshore kayak fishing in Western Australia which is a very rugged and exposed part of the world! I currently have a hobie revo 13 which is a great fast kayak for covering large distances, however it has very little storage. I sometimes fish in rivers and not having reverse is a PITA! as I don't have the new md180 drive. I'm in the process of selling my revo for a WS radar 135 pedal drive as it's fast, comfortable and has loads of storage and accessory mounting options. It's also light enough for me to car top it with a t-loader which means I don't need a trailer for transportation.
Yeah hobies are great kayaks, but not having a reverse can really be a pain when fishing. Thanks for the input brother! Catch some fish for all of us over here in the States!!!
Extremely important criteria: Repair history. I have a Hobie and long story short, the Mirage drive apparently used to have metal sprockets (the teeth where the chain wraps around) just like bicycles do. The new models apparently have been "redesigned" to downgrade to plastic sprockets. This is a recipe for teeth breaking off and great off-warranty work profitability for Hobie! I don't respect companies that BY DESIGN reduce the longevity of their product just to suck extra bucks from their customers. Again, I would look at the design of the moving parts of a kayak (the most fragile, and the ones that are expected to take the most pressure, such as the pedal drives and rudders) and see what these parts are made of. If there's repair history out there, that's even better. Any fix at the dealer will cost you at least $100 if not more, so don't just look at the price to purchase. Look at the price to maintain too!
I have had my Native propel since late 2014 after testing the hobie pro..I have had zero issues with the native besides one small one which is really just a maint thing, the rudder control having to be adjusted ever so often because they become loose. I do a lot of river fishing and I went with native because can you imagine pulling up the hobie on the bank upon other things, rails all the way around and it is just more manageable.. I have been off shore a few times and it is very stable but with waves can be a chore to get out past the waves..
I did a lot of research on the different types of pedal drive kayaks after several months of reading and watching videos about them I picked the perception. I looked at the quality and features offered compared to the price. I just received my new pilot 12 on 5-12-17. yes just a few days ago. here is a short list of the negative points. 1. confluence outdoor said it would be 58 days from the time I order till it is shipped to me. what they did not tell me is that the 58 days is 58 working days so it took 85 days to get my new boat 2. when I went to install the rudder I found the cables to have a lot of play in them. easy fix but still it is brand new 3. when I put the pedal drive unit together and install it on the boat I found that the bracket needed to hold the unit to the boat was missing. 4. upon further inspection I found I had no prop or mounting hardware to install the prop with. that is the list of isues I had with mine. and of course the company is not open on weekends so it was Monday yesterday. that I had to call. the good is that the service representative Jeff was very nice and easy to work with I sent him a few pictures and he is sending me the missing parts hopefully in time for my fishing trip this weekend.
Ya I love the boat and the features however I wish I would have just drove the 4 1/2 hours to a store in Virginia that had one in stock. Would have been a long day but well worth it
Academy did the same thing to me. I bought my Pescador Angler 12 in the winter and had them load it on my truck. Thinking they were supposed to be "professional," I didn't even check it (and it was freezing rain out too) and took it home and left it in the back yard fro about a month, until the weather got to where I could start working on it. When I finally looked at it, the footrests were missing, someone took the instructions off, a pad eye was broken, has scratches on it, etc. Apparently, they sold me a return for a new one, but it was too late. I spent the entire Spring getting it ready for that coming Summer. I called Confluence, but it was too much hassle to go through, so I just went to the store and replaced everything that was missing...that should have been there in the first place! It was supposed to come with an anchor, rod holder, etc. All that was gone. I got royally screwed, by Academy!!! NOTE: I hope they are reading this because I called them (Academy) and they tried to blame Preception and blew it off like it was nothing. I posted a similar review on Academy's site and they took it down. I noticed that all their reviews are positive, now I know why...they don't like the truth!!! Sad because I used to buy all my fishing and camping gear there. Not any more!!!
That sucks. But Jeff with confluence was a big help now if the parts just get here in time. I leave Friday morning for the fishing trip and would love to take my new boat
I'm a Hobie Guy, not only are the Kayaks Awesome but the new 180 fills the gap with the reverse. The Hobie Customer Service has got to be one of the better CS that I've used, had a few issues with my 180 Drive, Hobie had me goto my local dealer and the parts were replaced no questions asked. My friends with Natives say they are awesome kayaks but that can't go into shallow waters without lifting the drive vs the hobie mirage being able to go flush with the kayak. I mean either way you're dropping a few bones I say go demo each Kayak, most shops setup demo days.... Also the PA Rod Storage is awesome.
You've stated your a "big guy", I'm 6'5" and 310lbs. (guess that makes me REALLY big guy - lol) - I've demo'd (in the peddle category) the Hobie PA, the Old Town PDL, the Slayer, and the Wilderness System Radar 135, and Native Titan. Tracking - Wilderness hands down but the wettest ride (might have something to do with the "big guy" thing). Worst (my opinion) was the Native Titan (they have to fix the cavitation) - the fish will hear you coming from a mile away. The two I've narrowed down to are the Old Town Predator PDL and the Hobie PA. Both very stable and both very fast. PDL will turn on a dime and reverse or stop is instant and quiet. I'd heard the same problems with the Pilot - If you've heard of any Old Town PDL problems love to hear about them - thanks for the great vids.
I can't speak on the list you have, but I went with the predator pdl and love it! I'm 6'2 and 230lbs and it's perfect for me. Everything within reach you could possibly need on tournament day. The best advice has been said by others, go out and find a demo day and try them all. This time of year , they should be going on everywhere! Good luck and enjoy the process!
I’d compare the perception, native, and Hobie compass or outback. The pro angler is in a league of its own now accompanied by the native Titan. I’m stuck too. I really want a Hobie, but I’m not sure it’s worth the price tag.
for me the best is hobie pedal drive kayaks. if you go for a pedal drive just like pedaling a bicycle you get tired. but for a hobie it's just like excercising your legs you never get tired. and it runs fast even without exerting too much effort. hope you get my idea.... happy kayaking...
I bought the Peace Pilot 12 and received in Feb. Have only had it out half a dozen times. love it. I did add rod holder extenders that I will upgrade latter. I added the YakAttack leverloc Anchor Trolley that has broken twice. I'll pick up new pulleys tomorrow that are not plastic. I just sprung for the Boondox Landing gear today. I have had not problem with the kayak, but am still getting used to standing in it. not as stable as your Jackson I'm sure. Buy from ACK. 15% discount and great service.
I tested the Native Slayer Propel 13, Hobie Outback, and WS Radar 135. Native had the best propeller pedal system & paddled well but lacked stuff like thru hull transducer mount, Radar had the best features, stability, and paddling ability but slowest pedal system (it also twists), Outback had probably the fastest pedal system but was awful to paddle. No instant reverse hurts it as well. Paddling is important to me because a lot of lakes have floating hydrilla or brush&stumps in my area. You should definitely try to demo them if possible. I went into the shop expecting to just buy a Radar 135, but after testing out the Native Slayer, I'm not sure which I want...
The strange thing is they all have the same "basic" features. Rod holders, cup holder, tank well, etc. The size and shape is basically the same basic shape too, unless you want to go into specific hull designs, which most people never consider, they are mainly interested in "does it track well?" and "how does it turn?" Most of the other stuff, most anglers never think about. From there it all seems to come down to price. Like my father used to say, "Rich, poor or cobwebs in your wallet?!"
Great Video!!!! I know exactly what your going thru and I finally pulled the trigger on a Wildernerness Radar115 peddle drive. I pick mine up next week and will be trying it out on its Maiden Voyage on the 3rd.......I went with this brand due to price and reputation and simply just couldn't do the Hobie Prices!!!!! Will have a review for you in a week or so.....GoodLuck to you!!!!
I don't know too much about kayaks but I will say I tend to stay mid road to high end in cost. I purely believe that quality is better than quantity. Tight lines and good luck!
Hey bud, new sub here. I just picked up the Hobie PA 12 3 weeks ago. So glad I did. I tested a few others but none felt as finished and none had near as mach attention to detail as the Hobie PA. If you can afford it, get it.
I bought an old town pdl a month ago. had a Nucanoe Frontier before that. I love it. Its fast, though not as stable as the Nucanoe. If you are in reasonable condition you can pedal for hours at 3.8Mph. The pedal drive is incredibly quiet and the reverse is awesome. 2800. is very expensive but I found it much better than the Native or the Hobbie.
Here is my experience after doing my research and moving from a paddle to a peddle kayak: Pescador is a bit flimsy. The price is low but I did not trust the longevity and did not want to risk having to rig a third kayak. The Hobies are HEAVY-- getting to remote spots could be an issue. Not having hands-free instant reverse seems to be a waste of a pedal system, so Hobie did not make my final 3 list (especially at that price). Native has a new 12' Slayer Propel that is lighter (made from a different material) and runs about the same price as the SP 10. When considering the SP 10, 13, or Titan, you will probably need a rudder upgrade. The tracking stinks out of the box. I and many others have solved that problem with a BerleyPro rudder and/or BerleyPro steering upgrades (I installed both), so figure those into the price, because I think you will need one or both (people who have both seem to LOVE the change, as do I---well worth the money). Having both made my SP 10 a turning beast--I mean it turns on a dime and from what I have read no other kayak even comes close to the tight turns, turning response, and tracking that I get from my SP10. I am 6' and 240#. I can reach everything in my kayak (except in the front hatch) from my seat. I really don't get why anyone needs a 13' kayak (or even 12' really, as was my paddle yak, Pelican Catch 120). I avoided The Wilderness Systems because I don't trust that pop-up mechanism. It seems unnecessary and just something that could break. The Native propel unit can be moved out of the water very quickly (with a prop indexer installed, which will cost you an extra $30, but well worth it, I think.) No one can pop their prop out of the water to save hitting under water debris, because we generally don't see it, so the drive needs to be tough enough to take the hits. The propel unit is cast aluminum and a beast. I looked, compared, and went with the Native and I think I got the most for my money, despite the need for some aftermarket upgrades. I hope this helps you choose. Good luck, man.
As for my opinion I think I would either try to go all in and go Hobie, especially since you know kayak fishing isn't just passing interest. It's not really that crazy to justify financing something you are passionate about and you know you will get your money's worth. I bet if you go through a dealer they have a buyback program that will let you trade in and upgrade in the future as well.
I just bought the Perception crank 10.0, I bought it for the price and the simplicity of the peddle unit. As an Avid DIY fanatic I'm certain that what ever I dislike about the unit I'll be able to modify to my needs. the rudder up/down cable system look like absolute crap and the steering handle is less than ideal but all look easily up-gradable. The biggest issue I expect is the crash release, when the peddle unit hits something hard at speed. I've studied that a bit and the way they designed their system does not impress at all. So I expect that to actually challenge me to make it acceptable. The price is right and the simplicity looks to fit my needs. The having to pay the highest price so I can reach down and pull a lever to go in reverse rules out the Hobie for me. Hell I use a closed face real because I don't want to have to use 2 hands to cast. the Slayer peddle unit looks enormous and cumbersome but it does have hands free instant reverse and the crash system seems far better in it's design so if you don't want to be a modification freak I would go with the Slayer.
Just came across your vids. Great job! Am looking to buy my 1st and am looking at the same 3. REI has a sale this weekend on Perception ($1500). Visited a pro-Hobie dealer yesterday who also carries Perception. He said they are 'noisy' and the seat isn't as comfortable. But for $1000 less, I could slap a cushion on the chair and cast farther!Perception had less storage than the others. Most of the space is on deck with bungies. The rudder looked small, not sure if it's upgradable. Am going to view your other vids to see if you made your choice. Keep it up!
Decided to go with Perception Pescador. Been too dang hot to take it out yet. Tho Hobie now has reverse, I don't want to pause reeling and yank on a cable every time I need to change direction.
u might give the wilderness radar 135 a look over. this is a yak u can peddle or paddle equally as well. never hurts to check all your options before u buy
plus with Hobie you don't have to drill holes in your kayaks or anything the fish finder anchor trolley all comes with pre-drilled holes and inserts four wires all tucked away nice and neat no Drilling
I liked this video to use for reference with all the comments about different kayaks. I can read what other people have experienced. I know that one model of the Hobie the hatch leaks a lot.
I bought a Perception Pescador 120 Pilot Jan 1st 2019 and love it. Got it at Cabela's on close out for $1000 even. Hobie is like Harley, your paying for the name. all Kayaks will have fix's and needs and mods needed.
You seem to be hanging your decision making hat on price more than anything. There is obviously nothing wrong with that....we all have our budgets however....most times I make a decision based primarily on price...I end up regretting my decision. Which yak is going to provide you with adequate quality and maximize your enjoyment on the water? If you find yourself leaning towards one of the more expensive selections, dont settle. Put off the buy for a few more months and save more cash. In the long run you will probably be much happier. To me, this is a no brainer. I would no doubt pick the Hobie. Being 6'4" tall and 260#'s stability is key and the pedal drive system is far superior IMO to the others. I was actually ready to buy one until I won an Ultraskiff so I just decided to fill that fishing niche with that craft until I purchase my full on bass boat. I really liked the Big Rig too if I was going for a paddle option. Good luck with her whichever route you decide to go.
thanks man, great input. Yeah I'm a big guy as well (6'2 and 250) so stability is certainly the key. It's just gonna be very hard for me to wait and save up enough cash. It's like being a kid again, lol.
I do coffee cans, wife hates it, but save for what you want, and by the time u have enough for it, time has passed and also giving u more time to thing or look and research. So when the money is there and still want what was originally saved for then You have it. But if not then you have the money for a different option
I have the pescador pilot. I love the damn thing. One annoyance I have with it is lining up the prop to pull it up for shallow waters. There is an arrow on the top of the drive system to guide the prop or at least thats what it was aiming for. It just doesn't work as well as it should. I spend an extra minute aligning it, even sticking my hands in the water to feel the props line up just to save 30 seconds. Other than that, it's great. I'm about 180lbs and it is very stable for me. Some people complain about the loudness of the drive system, I would agree but if a fish knew the sound of my peddle yak coming towards it, we'd all be screwed. Besides the sound, good thing they don't know what a 12'5" yak on top of water looks like. If I had the money to buy a PA14, I'd buy two pescador pilots ;)
They all make noise. Watch the videos. Everyone jumped on the Pilot's noise because it fit right in with all the other problems they were having at the time. The fish don't seem to care about a little noise, now a drum circle, they would notice!
I went into Gander Mountain thinking Id spend $600 on a kayak but ended up getting the best one and I was very happy. The Predator Kayak is just so good. People see me on the water and they are amazed and jealous. Sometimes saving up for middle of the road or better is just worth it. I tend to stay away from the cheapest on any big item. Now I have more features on my Kayak but I'm also fishing in STYLE! lol Good Luck out there!
Don't forget about the Wilderness System's Radar. Still expensive, yet another option. If I won the lotto today, I'd buy a Hobie PA 12. I hate their 180 drive (not hands free), but its better than no reverse at all.
Lojo, I have a WS Radar 135 with pedals and it's performing great out on the Chesapeake and S. Carolina coast. I bought it last Fall with the intention of adding the Helix pedal drive and rudder systems as an upgrade when they became available. I finally installed the rudder and peddle drive systems this past April. What worked for me well was staging the purchases. $1500 last Fall for the boat and $1100 for the rudder/pedal drive. I had 6 months to save up and make sure the hull was right for my applications. I would have sold the Radar and moved on before upgrading a boat that wasn't working out but the Radar paddles great and was well laid out for me. Right away I noticed in pedaling my range extended by a factor of 3 in comparison to paddling (without rudder) and that was because of speed, lowered wind resistance and leg power/endurance over upper body. Reverse is instantaneous and the hull maneuvers responsively. WS also built the Radar around an electric drive if you wanted to go in that direction and have the $1900 laying around for that but at some point as you said, might just as well buy a boat with an outboard for that kind of money.
I actually demoed all 3 last month. Get the pilot brother you'll be impressed how fast it is and how much water you cover. It's stable as hell I tested it on a river and stood up jumped around you name it. Only real issue I had was the rudder! If it was longer it would be awesome it works yeah but at slow speeds it's just ehh but at full tilt you can turn on a dime. Hope this helps homey I plan on getting this myself but my loan officer told me no before purchasing a house.
i have an ocean kayak prowler big game 2. i'm getting a pedal kayak either this year or next. as I get older i don't want to lift a long heavy kayak on top of my car. if i have to have a trailer i may as well get a damn boat rather than a pedal kayak. so looking at those crucial criteria for what i'm looking for in a kayak, i plan on buying the native watercraft slayer propel 10. it's 65 pounds. i can fit it on top of my car easily. it's wider with a modified tri-hull and a carrying weight of 500 lbs. it's the easiest to get around if i have to carry it, wheel it on the beach (or anywhere for that matter), or turn it over in the water if i fall out of my kayak. my big game 2 is a bitch to turn back over and get back into. Hope this helps you and anyone else on the fence about which one to buy. good luck.
Don't be scared of the Pescador Pilot. I weigh 315lbs and the Pilot has a higher weight capacity than the Slayer. The rudder system and maneuverability is better with the Pilot. The Slayer over all has a nice drive system as far as a secure mounting but I like the Pilot better when the drive is in the zero draft position because you don't have a propeller and that large anti splash guard in your crotch. This really frees up space when you don't have the drive lowered. Another thing not mentioned is there is some slight wiggle room where you can raise or lower the height of the peddles on the Pilot by loosening the plate that secures the shaft and then raise or lower the shaft. This is good for leg comfort and possibly keeping your knees out of your chest. But this opens a can or worms as far as depth of draft with the deeper shaft and you can't go to high because the prop won't clear the hull. Like I said it is a slight adjustment that can be made but it could make a huge difference for some. Last thing I'd say is the actual layout of the Pilot is my favorite and was my personal final deciding factor. I did not want a hatch up front and like the tank well and mesh net for storage of a large tackle bag or fish catch cooler bag. Ok last last thing, there is a Pescador 12 that is not a pedal drive (just a plain old paddle kayak) not sure how to simplify what I want to say here but the gist is the Pilot makes a good paddle kayak when your not using the drive system. All that said the Wilderness Radar 135 looks like a really nice kayak and I'd be looking long and hard at that one if I didn't recently get the Pilot. It could be the one I get for my wife. Good luck with your decision and I hope it brings you years of happiness.
hey man great info. yeah the pilot was my leader for a long time...especially now that they fixed some of the problems they were having. but i'm concerned about the width of the boat compared to the bigger ones like hobie or the native titan, which are both much wider and therefore more stable.
lojo.fishing True but is a couple more inches of width worth almost twice the price? Try and find someone with a Pescador 12 or Pilot 12 who will let you try and stand up in it. I have not personally stoop up or much less even been in a Hobie PA or Titan so I can't compare it to the Pilot. I have no doubt it is better but I also know I personally couldn't afford that option. Well, even if I could I would not be able to keep it and my wife. One would have to go and despite which one I might pick she would make me suffer for that decision. LOL!
I have a Pescador Pilot and I LOVE THE DAMN THING...the only complaint that I have is that fishing pole holders behind the seat are TERRIBLE..but this is easily solved by buying some rail mounted ones or some DIY solutions.
I have a slayer propel 13 I don't know where you live but if you are in Florida I saw the tag on the shelf you can get a slayer for 1600 too. 1900 $ I seen them on face book so not sure if you got one yet but you don't have to spend 2k plus just keep looking like I said if you are down there
I have the slayer propel and love it. I think it is the best over all for the price point. Only negative it that the propeller does get tangled some times in kelp/seaweed and my buddies in the Hobies do not.... I do not think it is worth the extra $700 - 800. you can clear the propeller in less than 30 seconds.
I'll check through your more recent videos to see what you decided on, but have you had a look at the new Hobie Compass? Pretty sure it wasn't available when you made this. Very nice price point for a Hobie.
I would be wary of the pilot the drive issues alone are enough to wait on those and the fishing holders that are to short and wide for poles. I would give Old town PDL a try its in that same category as the PA12/14 but less expensive. I would also look to the Hobie Outback instead of PA12 that will save you about 1000 and you can put the H rail and square box in yourself pretty easy.
I have the Hobie PA 14, and I love it. But it's heavy so I bought a trailer, to transport it cause I drive an suv not a truck. I liked the slayer, but I always wanted a PA 14. So that what I went with, a 2016 model so no reverse here.
I am also in the market for a pedal drive. I have recently seen teasers for the Jackson coosa FD. I might wait until they come out and then run up to black creek in Jax and test drive them all. I have just heard good things about Jackson kayaks in general. Supposedly they have an excellent drive system from reviews done so far. Just a thought.
+markinaction1 yeah Jackson makes great kayaks. I had a big rig for a while and loved it. I'm not sure how I feel about the new pedal drive coosa. I was reading about it and wasn't impressed. Thanks for the input
I have a hobie PA12 it is buy far the best fishing yak you can buy. If however you are fishing offshore the best boat is a hobie adventure island, i just sold my AI because i'm back into bass fishing. Hope this helps you, DAN
I have the Perception pilot and I love it. I have a new 2018 model and have had no issues at all. I live on the coast in Corpus Christi and slay redfish and trout on a weekly basis in the upper Laguna Madre. I love the Perception and it's not so darn heavy like the Hobie. Mine gets up and goes when I have to pedal long distances. Good Luck. Richie
I have both the slayer and pa 14 , if I had to do it all over id get the slayer imo ,my pa 14 is heavy ,the reverse is a little sticky ,it bad to not lock in reverse def a awesome kayak ,the native is very sturdy I can stand up easy with out thinking I'm going to tip over ,only down side is the rudder as I'm sure you have heard about ,I don't have the boondocks rudder though ! any questions just ask ,I have a 16 slayer and a 17 pa 14
Great video brother, you are right on about the outragous price on Hobies. I dont think Hobies cost a fraction to make as compared to what they cost. They can jack up the price becus of the name Hobie. Id rather put down $3000 down payment on a mako flats boat. I hope that peddle drives come down in price.
Hobie outback $2499.00. If you are on a budget not as nice as the Hobie pro angler but a lot better than the Native or perception. I got mine a couple months ago when a place near here had last years model without reverse on clearance. I don't miss it at all, actually I have reverse it is my paddle.
get the pa14. buy once cry once. if you dont get the pro angler 14 do yourself a favor and dont demo one or try a friends cause you will be buying one. nothing compares. been in quite a few pedal and paddle kayaks and wish i would have just bought the best the first time around.
what about the jackson coosa fd, looks slick. i have the native slayer propel 10, when you get weeds on the prop, you have to pedal the prop into a vertical position to be able to lift it out of the hull to get at the weeds, also you have to lift it up as you approach shore, that coosa doesnt look like it has those issues, ingressing and egressing the surf should be easier as well, but it is $3,000 i think, pros and cons to all boats, good luck!
i have the native ultimate fx propel 13, no probs with it. i did get into my buddies native titan and i would say you can't flip it. i stood on one side on the rail of the titan and it allowed water to come just below the top of the boat(i weigh 250) but it is a lot heavier than mine i can stand in mine and pitch no prob, I've only been in those 2 yaks so i can't speak for anything else
Sweet video bro. Thanks for sharing. I will be looking for a Kayak one day lol when I get my money together and I don;t want to make a mistake buying one that is not going to be worth it. Thanks again. Tight lines.
With your size and style of fishing I would think the new Native Titan 13.5 check out Greg Blanchard, he just got one I'm sure it's pricey. Other than that Hobbie is the original PA is probably best suited for you but you could get away with an outback the price though. I would say save for Titan in my opinion it best suits your needs. Great channel keep it up.
Dude just get an Ascend FS12T from Bass Pro and put a transom trolling motor on it. That's what I did. I outrun anyone on a Hobie with no effort and my entire setup only cost around a grand.
I have had my outback for a year and I love it! Very expensive I think they could come down on the price but all in all very good. Take care God Bless!
Ha, I've also sold my paddle kayak and looking for the pedal. Slayer 13 and Hobie outback I've test both. The slayer 13 is more my fit, but the outback is less $$. Also consider what it comes with. I'm getting the outback because it comes with paddle, Slayer 13 does not. I need a paddle. so maybe you could look at what accessories the pedal drive comes with, may help you choosing what u want? Good luck!
I'm still waiting on Jackson kayak for there production run of there pedal kayaks, that would be another consideration, but for now I would go with Perception.
See my comment below, I own the Hobie and it does not compare to the Native. The two drive systems are night and day, the native pedal is so much more than the Hobie drive.
Came across this video, loved it, subbed and liked. I shoot most of my vids from my FeelFree Lure 13.5. I'm excited they finally have their drive system (n pedal/motorized )coming out especially since it lets you throw a battery in it for that motorized option. Price is always a factor but so are future upgrade options. If I could, I'd love to own a Hobie PA14. But like you said, for the money, I'd probably be in a boat. lol
big guy like you comming from a big rig, you cant go wrong with the PA. Especially if you are a guy who likes to carry more than just a rod and tackle bag with you out on the water. I personally have a good amount of fishing time on all 3 and the 1 thing thats obvious that sticks out like a sore thumb is storage space around , where as you dont have to reach around to the back or crawl to the front, and the PA have them beat hands down. I dont favor any of the makes but the PA would be my pick for a guy your size, and i can guaranty you wont regret it, and if you were to get any of the other two there would probably be times on the when u wish u would have gotten the PA. good luck with your pick man 🖒
Cheapest is the pilot but it has some issues, it can definitely carry you, super stable and fast. The slayer propel 13 it is about the same but it is much higher quality, I bought mine brand new for $1800, a deal. The hobie pa you are looking at $3300 plus $180 delivery fee and no discounts on them. They are super heavy, a pain to paddle. You can probably get a discount on the native and the pilots but not on the Hobie. If you only want to spend $1800 buy the pilot, if money is not an issue I would get the slayer.... Just one thing I hate about the propel is the GRASS
FYI all this post got me interested in pedal drives so I've been researching . Since this seem to be evolving around the Pescador, the least expensive pedal kayak, I was looking into them. For those who dont know the manufacturer of the Pescador is Confluence, www.confluenceoutdoor.com/ which also manufactures Wilderness Systems Kayaks, among other brands. They also made a pedal drive for Wilderness systems that is designed a little differently. Cost $1100.00 for the pedal drive alone. Its really hard to compare these pedal drives without specs, gear, bearings, etc on how they are put together. If Confluence has molds for Wilderness systems, they obviously did something to cut the costs on the Pescador, but I would think that they know what they are doing. Tagging this vid for future reference and to hear what others are saying on here. Turning into a great informative post lojo
If you do your research very well you will find out that the same pedal drive that's in the Pescador pilot is the same one that's in the wilderness and I know a lot of guys are going to say that I'm wrong but they don't know what they're talking about because I'm telling you it is and anybody that is worked in a kayak shop and knows kayaks very well will know what I'm talking about the Pescador pilot is a good kayak the pedal drive system they fixed all the little things that were wrong with it and it's just like any other kayak that first comes out there's going to be things wrong with it the company fixes it it ends up becoming a perfectly good product the Pescador retails for 1799 but I don't know where you're from but if you call the company called omtc you can get one for about 1599 because they're having a hell of a sale on them right now along with all their other pedal drive kayaks but me personally I own a Pescador and I love it I just bought it a couple days ago from omtc so check them out bro hope this helps hope this helps you find what you're looking for
I think hobies are insanely priced. I bought a brand new gheenoe 154, brand new yamaha 15 hp, and brand new trailer for 3500 OTD!!! This did not include the bow mounted trolling motor (add another 400 with mount, motor, battery). I push pole it. I paddle it. She runs 30 mph with one dude. I can fish 2 dudes easily. I can stand in it. It is stable, so stable that I stand on top of the seats to sight fish. And the electric trolling motor is awesome for fishing. Y'all are nuts buying a hobie. I can launch this thing anywhere, no boat ramp is required. I can get into super shallow water with a push pole. This is a back water assassin. And while it takes you 3 hours to go 10 miles in your hobie, it takes me 20 min. Y'all are nuts with your peddle hobie crafts. Who can piss their money like that and get a boat that goes 3mph? And car topping a hobie....WTF!! PS: the gheenoe 154 can't go offshore. The gheenoe can handle any back water.
Help me chose the best Pedal Drive Fishing Kayak!!! COMMENT below which one you think I should get!!! Love you guys!!!
lojo.fishing Choose* 😎
Can't tell ya my man. Find a demo day around you or if you know someone who has one you are considering. The "best" kayak is the one that fits you the best.
haha good lookin out!!!
Slayer always im on it every weekend two days a week. More in the summer
nice input!!!
I've had a Hobie PA12 for a few years now and I think I love it more now than when I bought it. I fish with it in Minnesota and Wisconsin during the summer months catching crappies, bass, walleyes and northern pike. In the winter it comes with to Florida for the saltwater fish. I have a 16 foot aluminum fishing boat and a 24 foot Cobia for big water but the Hobie is the most fun to fish out of. I'm 6'8" and 65 years old with a bad shoulder. It has the leg room and comfort for hours of fishing.
+Dan Langenfeld lol I've heard nothing but good things about hobie
I just purchased that Pilot and had it out once. It maneuvers really well. Tight turns. Easy to keep a steady 4mph. Comfortable seating position. Easy to stand it. I was a little shaky at first but had also never stood in a kayak. It has a recessed transducer area in the hull that fits the Helix SI transducer perfectly. The rear well will hold a 30qt cooler (sideways) probably larger if you go fore and aft. I installed yak attack flush mount rod holders in the molded in holder spots. Its fairly light at 85lbs. Make sure you go thru and tighten all the screws cause they all seemed a little loose. I will say this about the pedal drive...........it doesn't like weeds! The lake I was at last weekend was 95% covered in weeds and made testing it kinda hard. I plan on posting some more videos in the future. I started a thread on yakangler.com too. Posted some pics here www.yakangler.com/forum/18-kayak-specific/33292-perception-pescador-pilot-12?start=10
+USAFveteran462 good stuff man! Thanks for the info!
Just recently got rid of my Nucanoe Pursuit, and explored pedal drive kayaks and finally settled on hobie pro angler 14, had it for 2 weeks and haven't regretted a single day. The quality and detail they put in these kayaks are unmatched. You won't regret it.
yeah the more I read about this subject, the more I want a hobie
It's worth the extra money, stable, fast. And rigging is a breeze. Only thing is, I recommend a trailer or boondox landing gear other wise you'll get tired of moving that big sim bich around
I've done a lot of research on pedal drives. I chose the Oldtown PDL. My Brother has a Native Slayer, and 3 bothers have Hobie Pro Angler. Based on my experience being around all 3, I like Oldtown or Pro Angler.
good input man. thanks
I've been fishing out of the Native Propel 13 for 3 years and absolutely love it. The hands-free reverse is the main reason I bought this yak. I use this option inshore to help pull reds and shook out from the mangroves. It also works great when you're trying to set up the best position in a current in and offshore. This past weekend I was using it when fighting a tarpon that wanted to pull me towards a swim buoy or when he was trying to swim back under my kayak. Definitely check out the Propel before making your final decision.
+Brent Smith yeah man great input. I went with the native titan!!!
Hell Yeah man. Welcome to the Native family!!
It's kinda fun to watch some of your older videos. everything got better over the years. and glad you have so many boats now. . . even if they don't always float.
I've owned the Hobie Outback (older model) and now own the Hobie Pro Angler 12. I would suggest you go with a Hobie and the Outback specifically (2015 or later). It is less expensive, easier to transport, very stable and has an awesome all day seat.
+Tommy Pequeno yeah true. But no reverse...thats s big drawback for me. Hobie is definitely nice though
Reverse is needed a very small percentage of the time. Only needed it when I get caught up in the mangroves and then, as in other kayaks, I used the paddle or pushed off of the branches to back out. Anyway, good luck on your choice and if you can take some test drives. That could make the difference.
Love my Slayer Propel 10. Plenty stable, and light weight. Loading into my truck is easy. Have had it a year and use it almost every week. My bass boat has been sitting dormant for a few years feeling jealous, but that reminds me of the cost of fuel I have saved on the boat and towing. Fishing in strong wind is difficult in any kayak but with the slayer's pedal drive I was able to maintain my position over fish in gusts up to 30 mph. It was work however. I did upgrade the rudder and customize with a high end fish finder and custom built rod holders for slow trolling. only thing I realy don't like is water coming over the bow while pedaling in rough water. Solved that problem by covering cardboard with ductape and taping it to the bow as a shield for those rough days. It then stores rolled up in the front hatch until I need it again. Love the Slayer.
very nice input!!!
k guys, I posted this in here as it is (was) my intention to purchase the Titan and will use it for all of my fishing needs and BTB. I am a big guy, 6'2" 250lbs so this kayak has had my attention. Currently I own the 2013 PA 14, a great boat I would just like a different layout. My first kayak was the Native Mariner 13.5 and I loved the propel system.
Today April 22, I rented the Native Titan and headed to Lake Conroe, wanted to spend the day in the kayak to see if I really was going to spend the kind of bank they request for the new Titan. I have seen many videos and as always I believe and the videos never inform us on how big the person in the kayaks are they jump around do their marketing dances and rave on how great the product ABC kayak is. AND !!!! it is always different when I get in the product ABC kayak. Why?? Because the guy in the video is 5'4" and 145 pounds, a very big difference between him and me. Another big indicator to me is that all the videos are shot on glass type of conditions, never in the real world condition. It is not like when I get to the water if I can't shave in it I am packing up and going home.
Well I can say that I attended the demo days and tested the Titan, in Conroe glass conditions, (not a great test), however it still cavitation problems. Then I went to Missouri City demo days, bigger pond more wind slight chop, (better test) still the same problem.
Today Lake Conroe (Scott's Ridge) high winds as the front pushed through some white caps not great conditions to be in a kayak but it was great conditions for testing the true performance of this vessel.
After putting the kayak in the water I pulled it around to the small cove next to the launch and loaded a couple of poles my phone, a DP, and my life jacket. Of I went, out to the left around towards the swimming area. The water was very choppy, ( I would say 1-2 ft seas as a comparison) the kayak did not give me any concerns though it felt very stable even as I turn the kayak parallel to the waves to see if that gave me any concern. None I never felt I was going to turtle, something I would not have done in any other kayak.
Tied up the first set off trees to see how it handles this kind of choppy conditions, was the nose going to handle this? Was it going to be too shaky? was it going to lift and slam down getting jerked by the rope tightening up and then giving slack as it settled into the next oncoming wave? Nothing I have fished this spot many of times in the same conditions and much better conditions. I prefer the better but today was not about that. I felt very comfortable, never being jerked around never slamming down, this kayak performed great.
Released the rope and headed out to the middle of the lake out past the old rail tram entering the bigger body of water headed towards the 1097 bridge. I stopped paddling and stood up moved around and never felt in any danger. The is something I can not do in any other kayak period. I got on my knees and crawled out to the nose and sat on the front hatch cover of towards one side for strength and hung my legs of the front of the kayak. I almost fell in but what I was doing was not normal and would not be doing at anytime in normal fishing conditions. The kayak did not feel as it was going to flip, I almost fell as the waves were very rough and the wind was incredibly strong.
Ok enough about the amazing stability with this kayak and down to what I think is the more important concern.
The drive on this kayak needs to be reviewed. The center of the hull of the kayak is concave, and not just by a little, it is a very large area. I would think that it is designed this way to help allow the kayak to remain stable, and get into skinny water with it weight of nearly 150lbs. The kayak move or travels through the water superbly at either fast or slow speeds. What happens in smooth water and worse in chop is that the propeller creates positive and negative forces, drawing water in and pushing water out to thrust you in either direction. When peddling this actions causes the water to be drawn towards the propeller and you can take the center cover off and watch as it creates a void so the propeller is pulling air. Yes AIR, and you loose propulsion. When this happens it makes noise in both smooth or choppy conditions. the biggest concern is that when you are heading into a headwind you must apply more force to move forward, this causes the drive to cavitate, add some chop and the problem gets worse.
the hull being concave, and the drive unit not being longer where the propeller is down further in the water really creates an large issue with getting this kayak through the water. I don't want to fish in mirror conditions, I want to fish anytime I want and when I get to my destination and it is choppy I want to put my yak in the water and catch fish.
When I returned the Titan to ACK in Spring, I spoke to the manager, who quickly stated that he was told this was only a proto type and that changes may be made. In the same few minutes he told me that he had 24 of these units sold already. I hope for the people who have already purchased that this issue is resolved. I know that you can use the transom mount for a trolling motor but you can always use this and participate in many tournaments. I want this kayak just not sure I want something that I am going to struggle with in the water.
Hope this helps.
dude that's great info. I'm so glad so many of you guys jumped in on this and gave so many great opinions. I've already made my decision and have my new kayak in my garage. The unveiling will be on Friday!!!
Great video - it's always better to hear from someone who's had one and lived with it vs. the salespeople's 'walk-thrus' - not to mention you're spending your own hard-earned $. Also, I'm too late and possibly mis-informed, but I thought I saw where you could remove the pedal system entirely from the Native and replace with a trolling motor. I could be mistaken about the brand so please don't crucify me, but if it's true, then that type of flexibility would have been key in any decision I made about a $2500 (and up) kayak.
I bought the Perception Pescador Pilot back in April and had it shipped to Alaska, It works great for lakes for trout and im looking forward to taking it out into the ocean for halibut fishing. I got mine with the upgraded/fixed drive and have no issues. Only small issue is the rod holders but i have a violet that has holders and I added flush mount holders. Ive also used my pilot to fly fish sitting and standing. Hope this helps
yeah I've heard a lot of good things about the pilot
Yo Bro. I was in the same boat/ Kayak. I wanted a pedal drive kayak, However I needed two. My wife wanted one too. We have been married 34 years and wanted a new hobby we could enjoy together. I also did not want to blow a mortgage payment to get one. We bought 2 Pescodor Pilots and love them. We make sure the dives stay oil and have not had one problem. We have gone out to the lake more then 8 times and it has been GREAT! We look forward to to getting out onto the lake as much as possible. Perception is the way to go!!!!!! We will plan to do a Video soon.
Nice! Thanks for the input!!!
Please do a real video review and not one of these "it has these features" and "it looks great." Who cares?!
gotcha
I've researched the Hobie and Native Watercraft and I am leaning towards a Hobie with the Mirage 180 drive as it can be locked flat against the hull for some real shallow waterways and it is one with the reverse feature.
+Mike Smith yeah I'd give the edge to hobie
Old town pdl. Super comfortable, has a lot of space and is very stable. Also I've had it for some time now and it feels very well made, with quality material. I also had to do a lot of research to decide.
yeah I heard good things about it, it just didn't make my final 2. thanks for the input
I was torn between a Old Town PDL or a Hobie PA12. I researched, watch hours of video and decided on a Hobie PA12. A few reasons for me were...wider, I'd say it's significantly wider than an Old Town is (those extra inches make a big difference), another was storage, there wasn't much room to store anything in the OldTown, You can't even store a Black Pack in the right way behind the seat. Another huge reason was the Vantage seat, I've a had a few different kayaks and in those I could only sit for about 2-3 hours then it would become very uncomfortable and the pain would linger for a couple days now I can comfortably sit an entire tournament and not be in any discomfort. Another reason was it's ease to hook up accessories with the H Rail and wire management Hobie has, it took me 20 minutes to run wire for my fish finder and it's all water tight. Lastly, it comes with about 300 bucks or so of accessories. The price difference for me was about 500 bucks but you can't buy size and storage. I've had mine out a bunch of times, some in calm water and most in 1-3 foot waves and it's performed flawlessly. I felt very cramped in the pdl and with the Hobie I have room to move around. Some cons are the weight but a set of Boonedox took care of that for transporting to a launch. Some say Hobie accessories are over priced but I don't think they are any more pricey than other kayak accessory manufactures and they fit right and are quality. I was nervous aand had a case of buyers remorse the first few days but the first tournament I was in we had rough windy conditions with 1.5-2ft waves and 15-18mph winds this thing didn't care so that took my doubts away real fast.
+AnglerX that's some great input! Thanks for sharing
I own a hobie pro angler. And would highly recommend it. The motion of your feet with the mirage drive make you go effortlessly on the water on a speed you can fish great. And you can also crank. For me, the most important thing that make the mirage drive superior to bicycle type pedals is the motion of your feet.... this linear motion, instead of a circular motion makes you pedal with less effort and more strength. I ain't no rich guy, but I don't regret any cent spent on the hobie. I would look for other ways to save money on daily basis routines than saving on hobbies... and hobies!!! Thanks for great videos man!
great stuff! I can't argue that the mirage drive is superior...but they don't have an instant reverse, and it's not hands free. big negatives for an angler. But hobies are the bomb...no doubt
lojo.fishing you are right brother. The new ones might have reverse but it's not instant. Good point, thanks for answering
Just to add to the reverse problem. Now i do not own myself yet, but i rented one this past weekend. I made sure to use the reverse a few times just to try it out. The last time I used it I put it back in forward. The fins rotated then the cable snapped off. When i returned it I told them what happened. Thought it was my fault. Maybe i pulled too hard. They said they have seen it happen 4 or 5 times now since it has come out. If that would happen to you going into reverse you would be screwed, but on a good note there was nothing else to complain about for the pro angler. Well other then the obvious weight.
That was one of my hang ups too but to be honest, it's not bad at all to use once you get used to it. I have only used my reverse while hooked up with a fish a couple times and it wasn't a big deal. The best thing I've put on mine is a Bernies River Stik to keep me in place.
This is a know issue and I believe they fixed it but most of that is operator error. A lot of people don't make sure the pedals are close together and reef on the pull tags.
Being a wilderness systems prostaffer, I would go with the RADAR series and that can have a helix pedal drive then upgrading it to a motor drive. A real triple threat. Check it out, but pescador pilot is a great boat.
yeah I've heard good things about wilderness yaks, unfortunately I couldn't find a place nearby that would let me demo it, so I ended up with a native titan
lojo.fishing sounds like a great boat. If you could, would you please check out my channel? I do updates on all of my companies new products, with tips and tricks. Thanks!
I bought a brand new Hobie PA 14 at the end of the season last year and I can't believe how happy I am with this boat it's not the new model with the reverse butt many people don't realize you can just turn the Mirage drive around 180 degrees and you have reverse. turn 180 again and you're going forward again. Not to mention the sail kit that is available. And for the available drop in electric Drive big $$$$ for that torqeedo but eventually I figure I'll save up and buy it.
the main thing is I love it love it love it I took it to Florida and caught lots of fish from sailfish, mahi-mah,i fish king mackerel.
I primarily use it in Lake Erie. where I live most of the year working for Chrysler making Wranglers Jeeps. on my off time I primarily fish for walleye and bass.
Rhe cool thing is I bought last year's demo for my wife the Hobie 11s inflatable and that thing is incredible! My wife weighs about a hundred pounds or so and she loves it too, she can handle it all by yourself and fits in the trunk of a car, check it onto a airplane. the pa-14 is a barge but I still handle it completely all by myself, even car topping it. Love it no regrets buying in it at all. I also equally love the Hobie -12 Outback... the Outback is a little bit lighter and just a little easier to handle by yourself and you can hang your feet over the side much easier than the pa-14 because of the a H rails that goes along each side of the PA 14- but they make up for it in functionality from everything to rod holders to fish finders cup holders built-in tackle box right in front of the vantage seat that is fully adjustable. I can't say enough good things about my Hobie crafts that I purchased for my wife and I
yeah man the hobies are beasts for sure, the main problem for me is that there is no instant reverse and it's not hands free. doesn't seem like a big deal, but for a dedicated angler like myself that is a big thing. But I'm still considering hobie as a front runner in my decision.
I have owned a Native Propel 10 for over 5 years. When I first bought it I thought I was nuts to spend that on a Kayak but I have used it so much that i think it was the best boat I ever bought, with all the enjoyment it has given me. It is small and easier to move around than a larger one but still big enough for my Yellow Lab to ride on the back with me. Once we came face to face with a 12 foot alligator in a narrow Lake Marion creek. It showed me to NEVER buy one without reverse as I had to peddle furiously in reverse, to save my dog. When a Gator is coming at you, his whole body submerges lower and lower until you just see huge eyeballs coming toward you. It is really creepy.
No trouble with the drive system yet but The rudder cable snapped recently and I replaced it fairly easily for about $5 from Lowes. It seems like windy conditions prevail these days and we have a lot more waves so if I was to do it again, I think I would get the longer model as my 10 footer gets some overwash coming over the bow in real high waves. I watch my wife's 12 foot Malibu Stealth cut right through the waves without overwash so I think it is the extra length that helps out between waves.
I carry four poles and fish two at a time, with a dog on the back and a Lowrance mounted on a track.
Wow that's crazy about the gator, great input my friend!!!
don't know if anyone mentioned this already but native manta Ray is $2000 and is fishing ready with tracks and flush rod mounts. I'd give that one a glance over if you want an affordable kayak from a more reputable company
+Terry Bristol I definitely will. Thanks
I first had the Slayer Propel 10. Got stationed in Japan and sold it. I now Have a Native Manta Ray Propel 12. Got it for $1,900 and it is a really good kayak.
nice! thanks for the input!
I do offshore kayak fishing in Western Australia which is a very rugged and exposed part of the world! I currently have a hobie revo 13 which is a great fast kayak for covering large distances, however it has very little storage. I sometimes fish in rivers and not having reverse is a PITA! as I don't have the new md180 drive. I'm in the process of selling my revo for a WS radar 135 pedal drive as it's fast, comfortable and has loads of storage and accessory mounting options. It's also light enough for me to car top it with a t-loader which means I don't need a trailer for transportation.
Yeah hobies are great kayaks, but not having a reverse can really be a pain when fishing. Thanks for the input brother! Catch some fish for all of us over here in the States!!!
Extremely important criteria: Repair history.
I have a Hobie and long story short, the Mirage drive apparently used to have metal sprockets (the teeth where the chain wraps around) just like bicycles do. The new models apparently have been "redesigned" to downgrade to plastic sprockets. This is a recipe for teeth breaking off and great off-warranty work profitability for Hobie!
I don't respect companies that BY DESIGN reduce the longevity of their product just to suck extra bucks from their customers. Again, I would look at the design of the moving parts of a kayak (the most fragile, and the ones that are expected to take the most pressure, such as the pedal drives and rudders) and see what these parts are made of. If there's repair history out there, that's even better. Any fix at the dealer will cost you at least $100 if not more, so don't just look at the price to purchase. Look at the price to maintain too!
great input!!! thank you very much
lojo.fishing ill
I have had my Native propel since late 2014 after testing the hobie pro..I have had zero issues with the native besides one small one which is really just a maint thing, the rudder control having to be adjusted ever so often because they become loose. I do a lot of river fishing and I went with native because can you imagine pulling up the hobie on the bank upon other things, rails all the way around and it is just more manageable.. I have been off shore a few times and it is very stable but with waves can be a chore to get out past the waves..
yeah I really enjoyed my native when I had it, but the rudder control kept breaking and got really frustrating
I did a lot of research on the different types of pedal drive kayaks after several months of reading and watching videos about them I picked the perception. I looked at the quality and features offered compared to the price. I just received my new pilot 12 on 5-12-17. yes just a few days ago. here is a short list of the negative points.
1. confluence outdoor said it would be 58 days from the time I order till it is shipped to me. what they did not tell me is that the 58 days is 58 working days so it took 85 days to get my new boat
2. when I went to install the rudder I found the cables to have a lot of play in them. easy fix but still it is brand new
3. when I put the pedal drive unit together and install it on the boat I found that the bracket needed to hold the unit to the boat was missing.
4. upon further inspection I found I had no prop or mounting hardware to install the prop with.
that is the list of isues I had with mine. and of course the company is not open on weekends so it was Monday yesterday. that I had to call.
the good is that the service representative Jeff was very nice and easy to work with I sent him a few pictures and he is sending me the missing parts hopefully in time for my fishing trip this weekend.
wow that's way too many issues for a brand new yak. you are right to be a little disappointed.
WOW, that's a lot of water time to miss because someone dropped the ball on you. That's not very professional at all!!!
Ya I love the boat and the features however I wish I would have just drove the 4 1/2 hours to a store in Virginia that had one in stock. Would have been a long day but well worth it
Academy did the same thing to me. I bought my Pescador Angler 12 in the winter and had them load it on my truck. Thinking they were supposed to be "professional," I didn't even check it (and it was freezing rain out too) and took it home and left it in the back yard fro about a month, until the weather got to where I could start working on it. When I finally looked at it, the footrests were missing, someone took the instructions off, a pad eye was broken, has scratches on it, etc. Apparently, they sold me a return for a new one, but it was too late. I spent the entire Spring getting it ready for that coming Summer. I called Confluence, but it was too much hassle to go through, so I just went to the store and replaced everything that was missing...that should have been there in the first place! It was supposed to come with an anchor, rod holder, etc. All that was gone.
I got royally screwed, by Academy!!!
NOTE:
I hope they are reading this because I called them (Academy) and they tried to blame Preception and blew it off like it was nothing. I posted a similar review on Academy's site and they took it down. I noticed that all their reviews are positive, now I know why...they don't like the truth!!!
Sad because I used to buy all my fishing and camping gear there. Not any more!!!
That sucks. But Jeff with confluence was a big help now if the parts just get here in time. I leave Friday morning for the fishing trip and would love to take my new boat
I'm a Hobie Guy, not only are the Kayaks Awesome but the new 180 fills the gap with the reverse. The Hobie Customer Service has got to be one of the better CS that I've used, had a few issues with my 180 Drive, Hobie had me goto my local dealer and the parts were replaced no questions asked. My friends with Natives say they are awesome kayaks but that can't go into shallow waters without lifting the drive vs the hobie mirage being able to go flush with the kayak. I mean either way you're dropping a few bones I say go demo each Kayak, most shops setup demo days.... Also the PA Rod Storage is awesome.
+Nic yeah I ended up testing them all out
I own a Cuda, Ride 115 and a Hobie outback. Considering adding a propel 10 to my collection.
+Johnny Redrum that's one hell of a collection! I'm jealous
You've stated your a "big guy", I'm 6'5" and 310lbs. (guess that makes me REALLY big guy - lol) - I've demo'd (in the peddle category) the Hobie PA, the Old Town PDL, the Slayer, and the Wilderness System Radar 135, and Native Titan. Tracking - Wilderness hands down but the wettest ride (might have something to do with the "big guy" thing). Worst (my opinion) was the Native Titan (they have to fix the cavitation) - the fish will hear you coming from a mile away. The two I've narrowed down to are the Old Town Predator PDL and the Hobie PA. Both very stable and both very fast. PDL will turn on a dime and reverse or stop is instant and quiet. I'd heard the same problems with the Pilot - If you've heard of any Old Town PDL problems love to hear about them - thanks for the great vids.
+David Magnuson great info man!!! Yeah each kayak has it's own shortcomings...gonna be a tough decision
I can't speak on the list you have, but I went with the predator pdl and love it! I'm 6'2 and 230lbs and it's perfect for me. Everything within reach you could possibly need on tournament day. The best advice has been said by others, go out and find a demo day and try them all. This time of year , they should be going on everywhere! Good luck and enjoy the process!
yeah I think that's what I'm gonna do. thanks
I’d compare the perception, native, and Hobie compass or outback. The pro angler is in a league of its own now accompanied by the native Titan. I’m stuck too. I really want a Hobie, but I’m not sure it’s worth the price tag.
yeah it's hard to make that big of a commitment
for me the best is hobie pedal drive kayaks. if you go for a pedal drive just like pedaling a bicycle you get tired. but for a hobie it's just like excercising your legs you never get tired. and it runs fast even without exerting too much effort. hope you get my idea.... happy kayaking...
I bought the Peace Pilot 12 and received in Feb. Have only had it out half a dozen times. love it. I did add rod holder extenders that I will upgrade latter. I added the YakAttack leverloc Anchor Trolley that has broken twice. I'll pick up new pulleys tomorrow that are not plastic.
I just sprung for the Boondox Landing gear today. I have had not problem with the kayak, but am still getting used to standing in it. not as stable as your Jackson I'm sure.
Buy from ACK. 15% discount and great service.
Perception Pilot ×#"! spell xheck
+Roy Boden nice input. The pilot was on my radar for a long time. I've made my decision and that video goes up later today
I tested the Native Slayer Propel 13, Hobie Outback, and WS Radar 135. Native had the best propeller pedal system & paddled well but lacked stuff like thru hull transducer mount, Radar had the best features, stability, and paddling ability but slowest pedal system (it also twists), Outback had probably the fastest pedal system but was awful to paddle. No instant reverse hurts it as well. Paddling is important to me because a lot of lakes have floating hydrilla or brush&stumps in my area.
You should definitely try to demo them if possible. I went into the shop expecting to just buy a Radar 135, but after testing out the Native Slayer, I'm not sure which I want...
great info, most of these boats have their advantages and drawbacks...so tough to decide.
The strange thing is they all have the same "basic" features. Rod holders, cup holder, tank well, etc. The size and shape is basically the same basic shape too, unless you want to go into specific hull designs, which most people never consider, they are mainly interested in "does it track well?" and "how does it turn?" Most of the other stuff, most anglers never think about. From there it all seems to come down to price. Like my father used to say, "Rich, poor or cobwebs in your wallet?!"
haha very good point, i tried to consider as many things as I could to make an informed decision.
Great Video!!!! I know exactly what your going thru and I finally pulled the trigger on a Wildernerness Radar115 peddle drive. I pick mine up next week and will be trying it out on its Maiden Voyage on the 3rd.......I went with this brand due to price and reputation and simply just couldn't do the Hobie Prices!!!!! Will have a review for you in a week or so.....GoodLuck to you!!!!
great stuff man. yeah it was a tough decision but I ended up with a Native Titan, couldn't be happier
I don't know too much about kayaks but I will say I tend to stay mid road to high end in cost. I purely believe that quality is better than quantity. Tight lines and good luck!
yeah that's true, it's just hard to spend that money.
Especially when we don't have it!
Hey bud, new sub here. I just picked up the Hobie PA 12 3 weeks ago. So glad I did. I tested a few others but none felt as finished and none had near as mach attention to detail as the Hobie PA. If you can afford it, get it.
yeah man it's a great boat
I bought an old town pdl a month ago. had a Nucanoe Frontier before that. I love it. Its fast, though not as stable as the Nucanoe. If you are in reasonable condition you can pedal for hours at 3.8Mph. The pedal drive is incredibly quiet and the reverse is awesome. 2800. is very expensive but I found it much better than the Native or the Hobbie.
great info, i definitely considered the pdl
Here is my experience after doing my research and moving from a paddle to a peddle kayak: Pescador is a bit flimsy. The price is low but I did not trust the longevity and did not want to risk having to rig a third kayak. The Hobies are HEAVY-- getting to remote spots could be an issue. Not having hands-free instant reverse seems to be a waste of a pedal system, so Hobie did not make my final 3 list (especially at that price). Native has a new 12' Slayer Propel that is lighter (made from a different material) and runs about the same price as the SP 10. When considering the SP 10, 13, or Titan, you will probably need a rudder upgrade. The tracking stinks out of the box. I and many others have solved that problem with a BerleyPro rudder and/or BerleyPro steering upgrades (I installed both), so figure those into the price, because I think you will need one or both (people who have both seem to LOVE the change, as do I---well worth the money). Having both made my SP 10 a turning beast--I mean it turns on a dime and from what I have read no other kayak even comes close to the tight turns, turning response, and tracking that I get from my SP10. I am 6' and 240#. I can reach everything in my kayak (except in the front hatch) from my seat. I really don't get why anyone needs a 13' kayak (or even 12' really, as was my paddle yak, Pelican Catch 120). I avoided The Wilderness Systems because I don't trust that pop-up mechanism. It seems unnecessary and just something that could break. The Native propel unit can be moved out of the water very quickly (with a prop indexer installed, which will cost you an extra $30, but well worth it, I think.) No one can pop their prop out of the water to save hitting under water debris, because we generally don't see it, so the drive needs to be tough enough to take the hits. The propel unit is cast aluminum and a beast. I looked, compared, and went with the Native and I think I got the most for my money, despite the need for some aftermarket upgrades. I hope this helps you choose. Good luck, man.
good stuff man. I'm looking at Native more and more
Had the Mariner and upgraded to the Slayer. Can't say enough about having "Instant" reverse when you have a big fish on.
+Bob M true that
As for my opinion I think I would either try to go all in and go Hobie, especially since you know kayak fishing isn't just passing interest. It's not really that crazy to justify financing something you are passionate about and you know you will get your money's worth. I bet if you go through a dealer they have a buyback program that will let you trade in and upgrade in the future as well.
I just bought the Perception crank 10.0, I bought it for the price and the simplicity of the peddle unit. As an Avid DIY fanatic I'm certain that what ever I dislike about the unit I'll be able to modify to my needs. the rudder up/down cable system look like absolute crap and the steering handle is less than ideal but all look easily up-gradable. The biggest issue I expect is the crash release, when the peddle unit hits something hard at speed. I've studied that a bit and the way they designed their system does not impress at all. So I expect that to actually challenge me to make it acceptable. The price is right and the simplicity looks to fit my needs. The having to pay the highest price so I can reach down and pull a lever to go in reverse rules out the Hobie for me. Hell I use a closed face real because I don't want to have to use 2 hands to cast. the Slayer peddle unit looks enormous and cumbersome but it does have hands free instant reverse and the crash system seems far better in it's design so if you don't want to be a modification freak I would go with the Slayer.
Just came across your vids. Great job! Am looking to buy my 1st and am looking at the same 3. REI has a sale this weekend on Perception ($1500). Visited a pro-Hobie dealer yesterday who also carries Perception. He said they are 'noisy' and the seat isn't as comfortable. But for $1000 less, I could slap a cushion on the chair and cast farther!Perception had less storage than the others. Most of the space is on deck with bungies. The rudder looked small, not sure if it's upgradable. Am going to view your other vids to see if you made your choice. Keep it up!
very good point, it's a tough decision
Decided to go with Perception Pescador. Been too dang hot to take it out yet. Tho Hobie now has reverse, I don't want to pause reeling and yank on a cable every time I need to change direction.
u might give the wilderness radar 135 a look over. this is a yak u can peddle or paddle equally as well. never hurts to check all your options before u buy
very true, I've heard a lot of good things about it
Take a look at the new Jackson Coosa FD. Available for sale in a few weeks in most locations. Uses a 3 propeller system. @ $3,000.
+Rene Rogers it's definitely got my eye
plus with Hobie you don't have to drill holes in your kayaks or anything the fish finder anchor trolley all comes with pre-drilled holes and inserts four wires all tucked away nice and neat no Drilling
no drilling needed for the pilot 12
I liked this video to use for reference with all the comments about different kayaks.
I can read what other people have experienced. I know that one model of the Hobie the hatch leaks a lot.
yeah it's so tough to find one that will suit me perfectly
I bought a Perception Pescador 120 Pilot Jan 1st 2019 and love it. Got it at Cabela's on close out for $1000 even. Hobie is like Harley, your paying for the name. all Kayaks will have fix's and needs and mods needed.
You seem to be hanging your decision making hat on price more than anything. There is obviously nothing wrong with that....we all have our budgets however....most times I make a decision based primarily on price...I end up regretting my decision. Which yak is going to provide you with adequate quality and maximize your enjoyment on the water? If you find yourself leaning towards one of the more expensive selections, dont settle. Put off the buy for a few more months and save more cash. In the long run you will probably be much happier. To me, this is a no brainer. I would no doubt pick the Hobie. Being 6'4" tall and 260#'s stability is key and the pedal drive system is far superior IMO to the others. I was actually ready to buy one until I won an Ultraskiff so I just decided to fill that fishing niche with that craft until I purchase my full on bass boat. I really liked the Big Rig too if I was going for a paddle option. Good luck with her whichever route you decide to go.
thanks man, great input. Yeah I'm a big guy as well (6'2 and 250) so stability is certainly the key. It's just gonna be very hard for me to wait and save up enough cash. It's like being a kid again, lol.
I do coffee cans, wife hates it, but save for what you want, and by the time u have enough for it, time has passed and also giving u more time to thing or look and research. So when the money is there and still want what was originally saved for then You have it. But if not then you have the money for a different option
I have the pescador pilot. I love the damn thing. One annoyance I have with it is lining up the prop to pull it up for shallow waters. There is an arrow on the top of the drive system to guide the prop or at least thats what it was aiming for. It just doesn't work as well as it should. I spend an extra minute aligning it, even sticking my hands in the water to feel the props line up just to save 30 seconds. Other than that, it's great. I'm about 180lbs and it is very stable for me. Some people complain about the loudness of the drive system, I would agree but if a fish knew the sound of my peddle yak coming towards it, we'd all be screwed. Besides the sound, good thing they don't know what a 12'5" yak on top of water looks like. If I had the money to buy a PA14, I'd buy two pescador pilots ;)
Nice!!! Great info! The pilot is definitely going to make my final cut
They all make noise. Watch the videos. Everyone jumped on the Pilot's noise because it fit right in with all the other problems they were having at the time. The fish don't seem to care about a little noise, now a drum circle, they would notice!
I went into Gander Mountain thinking Id spend $600 on a kayak but ended up getting the best one and I was very happy. The Predator Kayak is just so good. People see me on the water and they are amazed and jealous. Sometimes saving up for middle of the road or better is just worth it. I tend to stay away from the cheapest on any big item. Now I have more features on my Kayak but I'm also fishing in STYLE! lol Good Luck out there!
Don't forget about the Wilderness System's Radar. Still expensive, yet another option.
If I won the lotto today, I'd buy a Hobie PA 12. I hate their 180 drive (not hands free), but its better than no reverse at all.
yeah that's one of the biggest problems with the Hobie is their terrible reverse design.
Far less expensive than Hobie and Old Town plus the Radar is pedal and motor capable.
Lojo, I have a WS Radar 135 with pedals and it's performing great out on the Chesapeake and S. Carolina coast. I bought it last Fall with the intention of adding the Helix pedal drive and rudder systems as an upgrade when they became available. I finally installed the rudder and peddle drive systems this past April. What worked for me well was staging the purchases. $1500 last Fall for the boat and $1100 for the rudder/pedal drive. I had 6 months to save up and make sure the hull was right for my applications. I would have sold the Radar and moved on before upgrading a boat that wasn't working out but the Radar paddles great and was well laid out for me. Right away I noticed in pedaling my range extended by a factor of 3 in comparison to paddling (without rudder) and that was because of speed, lowered wind resistance and leg power/endurance over upper body. Reverse is instantaneous and the hull maneuvers responsively. WS also built the Radar around an electric drive if you wanted to go in that direction and have the $1900 laying around for that but at some point as you said, might just as well buy a boat with an outboard for that kind of money.
I actually demoed all 3 last month. Get the pilot brother you'll be impressed how fast it is and how much water you cover. It's stable as hell I tested it on a river and stood up jumped around you name it. Only real issue I had was the rudder! If it was longer it would be awesome it works yeah but at slow speeds it's just ehh but at full tilt you can turn on a dime. Hope this helps homey I plan on getting this myself but my loan officer told me no before purchasing a house.
+alisha reed yeah thanks a lot
i have an ocean kayak prowler big game 2. i'm getting a pedal kayak either this year or next. as I get older i don't want to lift a long heavy kayak on top of my car. if i have to have a trailer i may as well get a damn boat rather than a pedal kayak. so looking at those crucial criteria for what i'm looking for in a kayak, i plan on buying the native watercraft slayer propel 10. it's 65 pounds. i can fit it on top of my car easily. it's wider with a modified tri-hull and a carrying weight of 500 lbs. it's the easiest to get around if i have to carry it, wheel it on the beach (or anywhere for that matter), or turn it over in the water if i fall out of my kayak. my big game 2 is a bitch to turn back over and get back into.
Hope this helps you and anyone else on the fence about which one to buy. good luck.
+yosemite scuba great input. Thanks
after i wrote that i saw another later video of you getting that big heavy kayak. it looks like a great fishing kayak. do you need a trailer for it?
+yosemite scuba nah I put it in the bed of my truck
awesome. didn't think of the bed of a truck angle.
Don't be scared of the Pescador Pilot. I weigh 315lbs and the Pilot has a higher weight capacity than the Slayer. The rudder system and maneuverability is better with the Pilot. The Slayer over all has a nice drive system as far as a secure mounting but I like the Pilot better when the drive is in the zero draft position because you don't have a propeller and that large anti splash guard in your crotch. This really frees up space when you don't have the drive lowered. Another thing not mentioned is there is some slight wiggle room where you can raise or lower the height of the peddles on the Pilot by loosening the plate that secures the shaft and then raise or lower the shaft. This is good for leg comfort and possibly keeping your knees out of your chest. But this opens a can or worms as far as depth of draft with the deeper shaft and you can't go to high because the prop won't clear the hull. Like I said it is a slight adjustment that can be made but it could make a huge difference for some. Last thing I'd say is the actual layout of the Pilot is my favorite and was my personal final deciding factor. I did not want a hatch up front and like the tank well and mesh net for storage of a large tackle bag or fish catch cooler bag. Ok last last thing, there is a Pescador 12 that is not a pedal drive (just a plain old paddle kayak) not sure how to simplify what I want to say here but the gist is the Pilot makes a good paddle kayak when your not using the drive system.
All that said the Wilderness Radar 135 looks like a really nice kayak and I'd be looking long and hard at that one if I didn't recently get the Pilot. It could be the one I get for my wife.
Good luck with your decision and I hope it brings you years of happiness.
hey man great info. yeah the pilot was my leader for a long time...especially now that they fixed some of the problems they were having. but i'm concerned about the width of the boat compared to the bigger ones like hobie or the native titan, which are both much wider and therefore more stable.
lojo.fishing True but is a couple more inches of width worth almost twice the price? Try and find someone with a Pescador 12 or Pilot 12 who will let you try and stand up in it. I have not personally stoop up or much less even been in a Hobie PA or Titan so I can't compare it to the Pilot. I have no doubt it is better but I also know I personally couldn't afford that option. Well, even if I could I would not be able to keep it and my wife. One would have to go and despite which one I might pick she would make me suffer for that decision. LOL!
haha I hear that man. gonna be a tough choice.
WOW, u have come a long way in 3 years 👍👍.
In the time I have watched your videos, I don't think I've seen u in a peddle Kayak??
I have a Pescador Pilot and I LOVE THE DAMN THING...the only complaint that I have is that fishing pole holders behind the seat are TERRIBLE..but this is easily solved by buying some rail mounted ones or some DIY solutions.
+itsmeadamg thanks for the input
I have a slayer propel 13 I don't know where you live but if you are in Florida I saw the tag on the shelf you can get a slayer for 1600 too. 1900 $ I seen them on face book so not sure if you got one yet but you don't have to spend 2k plus just keep looking like I said if you are down there
+LESS TALK MORE FISH yeah I'm around northwest Florida. I'm coming very close to coming to a decision. Slayer is in the final 3
You should get a feel free lure and get the overdrive/pedal drive when it comes out extremely stable boat and then it will have a pedal drive.
good input. the feel free lures are great boats, but I already bought my new yak.
I have the slayer propel and love it. I think it is the best over all for the price point. Only negative it that the propeller does get tangled some times in kelp/seaweed and my buddies in the Hobies do not.... I do not think it is worth the extra $700 - 800. you can clear the propeller in less than 30 seconds.
yeah I agree, although the native titan is what I ended up with, and it's price was the same as the PA.
Yeah good choice.... Tight lines!
I'll check through your more recent videos to see what you decided on, but have you had a look at the new Hobie Compass? Pretty sure it wasn't available when you made this. Very nice price point for a Hobie.
I would be wary of the pilot the drive issues alone are enough to wait on those and the fishing holders that are to short and wide for poles. I would give Old town PDL a try its in that same category as the PA12/14 but less expensive. I would also look to the Hobie Outback instead of PA12 that will save you about 1000 and you can put the H rail and square box in yourself pretty easy.
yeah some good tips for sure. hobie is awesome and the PDL has gotten very good reviews. thanks
I have the Hobie PA 14, and I love it. But it's heavy so I bought a trailer, to transport it cause I drive an suv not a truck. I liked the slayer, but I always wanted a PA 14. So that what I went with, a 2016 model so no reverse here.
+shadow_yak69 I'm leaning more and more to hobie
I own the Hobie PA12 and I could not be happier!! Awesome fishing kayak!!
yeah it made my final 2 list!
I am also in the market for a pedal drive. I have recently seen teasers for the Jackson coosa FD. I might wait until they come out and then run up to black creek in Jax and test drive them all. I have just heard good things about Jackson kayaks in general. Supposedly they have an excellent drive system from reviews done so far. Just a thought.
+markinaction1 yeah Jackson makes great kayaks. I had a big rig for a while and loved it. I'm not sure how I feel about the new pedal drive coosa. I was reading about it and wasn't impressed. Thanks for the input
Curious to see what you get!
gonna be a tough decision.
I have a hobie PA12 it is buy far the best fishing yak you can buy. If however you are fishing offshore the best boat is a hobie adventure island, i just sold my AI because i'm back into bass fishing. Hope this helps you, DAN
+dan mcgowan yeah hobies are great kayaks...and they made it into the final 2 of my decision
Get the perception. The issues are fixed. I've had no problems with mine. Plus 500-800$ buys lots of accessories.
yeah Perception told me personally they had all of the bugs worked out. we will see.
I have the Perception pilot and I love it. I have a new 2018 model and have had no issues at all. I live on the coast in Corpus Christi and slay redfish and trout on a weekly basis in the upper Laguna Madre. I love the Perception and it's not so darn heavy like the Hobie. Mine gets up and goes when I have to pedal long distances. Good Luck. Richie
Great clip mate, in the process of buying my first yak, very informative vid, many thanks
thanks
I have both the slayer and pa 14 , if I had to do it all over id get the slayer imo ,my pa 14 is heavy ,the reverse is a little sticky ,it bad to not lock in reverse def a awesome kayak ,the native is very sturdy I can stand up easy with out thinking I'm going to tip over ,only down side is the rudder as I'm sure you have heard about ,I don't have the boondocks rudder though ! any questions just ask ,I have a 16 slayer and a 17 pa 14
+blue grass Bassin nice! Good info for sure. I preferred the native over the hobie after I tested them both
Great video brother, you are right on about the outragous price on Hobies. I dont think Hobies cost a fraction to make as compared to what they cost. They can jack up the price becus of the name Hobie. Id rather put down $3000 down payment on a mako flats boat. I hope that peddle drives come down in price.
+Albert Cervantes yeah it's crazy
Hobie outback $2499.00. If you are on a budget not as nice as the Hobie pro angler but a lot better than the Native or perception. I got mine a couple months ago when a place near here had last years model without reverse on clearance. I don't miss it at all, actually I have reverse it is my paddle.
+Sean Marquis nice input
get the pa14. buy once cry once. if you dont get the pro angler 14 do yourself a favor and dont demo one or try a friends cause you will be buying one. nothing compares. been in quite a few pedal and paddle kayaks and wish i would have just bought the best the first time around.
+cantbuyrespect good tips
I just went with the Native Watercraft Titan. An outfitter here had it $500 off. It's a beast!
+Oldsole guidry that's a great deal!!!
what about the jackson coosa fd, looks slick. i have the native slayer propel 10, when you get weeds on the prop, you have to pedal the prop into a vertical position to be able to lift it out of the hull to get at the weeds, also you have to lift it up as you approach shore, that coosa doesnt look like it has those issues, ingressing and egressing the surf should be easier as well, but it is $3,000 i think, pros and cons to all boats, good luck!
yeah I liked how the coosa looked, but I just couldn't wait for it to come out
i have the native ultimate fx propel 13, no probs with it. i did get into my buddies native titan and i would say you can't flip it.
i stood on one side on the rail of the titan and it allowed water to come just below the top of the boat(i weigh 250)
but it is a lot heavier than mine
i can stand in mine and pitch no prob, I've only been in those 2 yaks so i can't speak for anything else
good input, yeah the titan is very stable.
Sweet video bro. Thanks for sharing. I will be looking for a Kayak one day lol when I get my money together and I don;t want to make a mistake buying one that is not going to be worth it. Thanks again. Tight lines.
+HouArtFishing yeah no problem man
Buy once, buy right, get the Hobie. You'll always wish you did if you go another route. I own my own boat but prefer the Hobie!
yeah hobie was in my final 2...but I went with a native titan instead. Thanks for your input.
With your size and style of fishing I would think the new Native Titan 13.5 check out Greg Blanchard, he just got one I'm sure it's pricey. Other than that Hobbie is the original PA is probably best suited for you but you could get away with an outback the price though. I would say save for Titan in my opinion it best suits your needs. Great channel keep it up.
yeah man I'm a big fan of Greg's channel, the titan is definitely on my radar now.
Dude just get an Ascend FS12T from Bass Pro and put a transom trolling motor on it. That's what I did. I outrun anyone on a Hobie with no effort and my entire setup only cost around a grand.
yeah I considered doing that with my jackson big rig, but I wanted a system that was truly hands free. Thanks for the input brother.
I have had my outback for a year and I love it! Very expensive I think they could come down on the price but all in all very good. Take care God Bless!
yeah that's the only thing about hobie that bothers me...very expensive.
Native drive, if it breaks the shaft, the whole thing must be replaced. I can buy individual parts for my Hobie.
+Tom Bulger true...good point
Ha, I've also sold my paddle kayak and looking for the pedal. Slayer 13 and Hobie outback I've test both. The slayer 13 is more my fit, but the outback is less $$. Also consider what it comes with. I'm getting the outback because it comes with paddle, Slayer 13 does not. I need a paddle. so maybe you could look at what accessories the pedal drive comes with, may help you choosing what u want?
Good luck!
very good advice!!! thanks
I own a Hobie PA12. It's amazing. Well worth the investment
+Larry St.Clair thanks for the input
I'm still waiting on Jackson kayak for there production run of there pedal kayaks, that would be another consideration, but for now I would go with Perception.
Yeah I have looked at the prototype jackson put out..I wasn't impressed. But good info!!!
See my comment below, I own the Hobie and it does not compare to the Native. The two drive systems are night and day, the native pedal is so much more than the Hobie drive.
It really does suck , I'm new to owning a Yak and being at the mercy of the current and the wind just sucks , I here ya mate!
+Joseph Limbrick truth 👊👊👊
Old Town makes one too, just to thicken the pot a little!!!
good call
Came across this video, loved it, subbed and liked. I shoot most of my vids from my FeelFree Lure 13.5. I'm excited they finally have their drive system (n pedal/motorized )coming out especially since it lets you throw a battery in it for that motorized option. Price is always a factor but so are future upgrade options. If I could, I'd love to own a Hobie PA14. But like you said, for the money, I'd probably be in a boat. lol
+Kayak Chris lol true that man. Thanks for the input
big guy like you comming from a big rig, you cant go wrong with the PA. Especially if you are a guy who likes to carry more than just a rod and tackle bag with you out on the water. I personally have a good amount of fishing time on all 3 and the 1 thing thats obvious that sticks out like a sore thumb is storage space around , where as you dont have to reach around to the back or crawl to the front, and the PA have them beat hands down. I dont favor any of the makes but the PA would be my pick for a guy your size, and i can guaranty you wont regret it, and if you were to get any of the other two there would probably be times on the when u wish u would have gotten the PA.
good luck with your pick man 🖒
yeah every choice has it's downside. I ended up choosing the titan due to it's superior stability, I've made a few videos of me fishing out of it
wait for the Jackson Coosa FD! it'll be pricey, but jackson makes the most durable yaks out there.
I agree and I love Jackson....but I needed a kayak like right now lol
Cheapest is the pilot but it has some issues, it can definitely carry you, super stable and fast. The slayer propel 13 it is about the same but it is much higher quality, I bought mine brand new for $1800, a deal. The hobie pa you are looking at $3300 plus $180 delivery fee and no discounts on them. They are super heavy, a pain to paddle. You can probably get a discount on the native and the pilots but not on the Hobie. If you only want to spend $1800 buy the pilot, if money is not an issue I would get the slayer.... Just one thing I hate about the propel is the GRASS
yeah very good point, I've got a lot of soul searching to do on this topic!!! lol
lojo.fishing brother, try to demo, I bet you have a lot of subs nearby that owe one of these, they would be happy to let you try it 😊
good idea. how could I get a discount on a slayer? like the new titan?
lojo.fishing I sent you some fb msg
FYI all this post got me interested in pedal drives so I've been researching .
Since this seem to be evolving around the Pescador, the least expensive pedal kayak, I was looking into them.
For those who dont know the manufacturer of the Pescador is Confluence, www.confluenceoutdoor.com/
which also manufactures Wilderness Systems Kayaks, among other brands.
They also made a pedal drive for Wilderness systems that is designed a little differently. Cost $1100.00 for the pedal drive alone. Its really hard to compare these pedal drives without specs, gear, bearings, etc on how they are put together.
If Confluence has molds for Wilderness systems, they obviously did something to cut the costs on the Pescador, but I would think that they know what they are doing.
Tagging this vid for future reference and to hear what others are saying on here. Turning into a great informative post lojo
lol yes it has!!! Good stuff man.
They saved $10 alone on the flush mount rod holders!
Lovely content! Keep it up!
thanks, will do
Ya gets wot ya pays fer. Go the Hobie. I've had one. A class act.
the hobie made it into my final 2...but I ended up going with the native. check out my new video...I talk about it.
Why you sold your big rig and decide to buy a paddle kayak I also have a big rig so far I like it anyway I really want to hear your opinion👍👍👍👍👍
dude I LOVED my big rig...it just didn't have a pedal drive...and I really wanted one with pedal drive.
Have you looked into a Vibe Ghost 130? You can add a pedal drive to the console.
nah i've never heard of it. but i'll surely look into it
What did you end up with. I’m still trying to decide
I ended up buying the native titan, then I returned it and got a hobie PA
So you like the hobie better than the others? I’m looking at picking up a hobie outback this weekend
hobie outback 2017 with reverse is amazing
yeah I've heard
If you do your research very well you will find out that the same pedal drive that's in the Pescador pilot is the same one that's in the wilderness and I know a lot of guys are going to say that I'm wrong but they don't know what they're talking about because I'm telling you it is and anybody that is worked in a kayak shop and knows kayaks very well will know what I'm talking about the Pescador pilot is a good kayak the pedal drive system they fixed all the little things that were wrong with it and it's just like any other kayak that first comes out there's going to be things wrong with it the company fixes it it ends up becoming a perfectly good product the Pescador retails for 1799 but I don't know where you're from but if you call the company called omtc you can get one for about 1599 because they're having a hell of a sale on them right now along with all their other pedal drive kayaks but me personally I own a Pescador and I love it I just bought it a couple days ago from omtc so check them out bro hope this helps hope this helps you find what you're looking for
that's some awesome analysis, thanks for sharing
I think hobies are insanely priced. I bought a brand new gheenoe 154, brand new yamaha 15 hp, and brand new trailer for 3500 OTD!!! This did not include the bow mounted trolling motor (add another 400 with mount, motor, battery). I push pole it. I paddle it. She runs 30 mph with one dude. I can fish 2 dudes easily. I can stand in it. It is stable, so stable that I stand on top of the seats to sight fish. And the electric trolling motor is awesome for fishing. Y'all are nuts buying a hobie. I can launch this thing anywhere, no boat ramp is required. I can get into super shallow water with a push pole. This is a back water assassin. And while it takes you 3 hours to go 10 miles in your hobie, it takes me 20 min. Y'all are nuts with your peddle hobie crafts. Who can piss their money like that and get a boat that goes 3mph? And car topping a hobie....WTF!! PS: the gheenoe 154 can't go offshore. The gheenoe can handle any back water.