I agree to that. I do think that the rotations feel nice now also with the new burst actions, but i rather have a little bit more options to strengthen the team in certain Situations. I think with that there would also fall a bit more responsability during down- and uptime phases on the ranged dps instead.
been saying it since heavensward; support should be a fourth, full fledged role. Buff the dps of "pure" dps, nerf the supporters a little, and make light parties 1-1-1-1 of each tank-healer-supp-dps. but it is what it is, way too late for that now for sure
@@MyVanir That's fair that in a very competent group it would be less necessary. But since Phys Ranged damage is already awful damage currently, it would be an option. I personally would just rather dps buffs to slightly worse than melee but I doubt people will go for that.
PCT : Can Dash and get movement speed buff, Can party Shield, Can party heal, Can give raid buff - Highest DPS MCH: No movement skill, No Shield, No heal, No raid buff - Bottom tier DPS for god knows how long already just beacuse its a P range and dev team decide to tax the F out of your dps you think yoshiP will balance the jobs? as a MCH main , LMAO
Summoner is at the bottom of the dps tier. Red mage has a better version of combat rez and better raid utility which it controls. Summoner has no control over its resources.
I'm leveling this currently. Unlocked flamethrower. Looks cool but locked in place for 10 seconds.... be great if it filled heat gauge or something but not a fan of those locked in place to x to happen skill. This coming from me not knowing the fulls in and out of the jobs yet so take it like that
Had a VPR mentor say to another VPR that asked for advice about how to beat the enrage for P1 and the VPR said "If you dont have a PCT, everyone should pot". Its insane.
I was told that playing 2 melee rn is a litteral meme, pct and rdm are better. That if youre a viper, you should dump the class. Some PFs are locking it as not choosable. After Yoshi P legit said "I wont nerf picto cuz its new and that would feel bad." Bro what about Viper players, theyre getting kicked out due to crap damage. Caster slots now locked to pictos with no summoner or blm in sight. This is creating such a toxic ult community that its making me want to quit on this ultimate, and previous ultimates were some of my fav content to run
Viper is generally bad in ultimates and will probably always be. Viper isnt really bursty and has a more even sustained damage profile. In ultimates you generally have a lot of downtime and viper cant really build resources during downtime
For the four savage fights in a given tier and the ultimate, assume the picto player plays perfectly. Calculate the amount of potency they can output, and from that their damage. Do this for every other class. Then, calculate how much each class's raidbuff is worth by using the average damage of two healers, two tanks, and three other DPSs. Congratulations, you now know exactly how much damage picto does in every fight for the tier. Game balance is actually *extremely* easy if you only care about one thing. It's why the game has been so well balanced up to this point: because it comes at the expense of any sense of class identity.
@@xL0stKIlahthis line of thinking is why we're here to begin with. Now dont get me wrong, for the most part, it is actually quite a good way to go about things in a case where the strongest class has maybe a little bit of an upper hand. But pic to is so blatantly OP that they would have to seriouspy buff everything else, which would perpetuate the issue that is power creep. This is one of those rare occurrences where a job NEEDS to be nerfed and boss health values need to be adjusted. Buffing everything for catch up is putting a band aid on a big issue
"We'll fix it in 8.0" Is not a flex and should be derided. There is no reason for this dev team to be moving this slow with anything but the abject refusal to introduce anything out of the EXACT SPECIFIC PREDETERMINED WINDOW is getting ridiculous.
Bro, you act like job balancing is the only work they are doing... they literally have to work on msq patch aswell as the next expansion, two more savage wing, one more Ultimate, two alliance raid, cosmic explaration, the new Bazja type content, and the trial series and EX
@@MrKnaives This isn't our problem. And I'm tired of them using it as an excuse. There was more content in previous expansions, and it wasn't an excuse then, either. It shouldn't be an excuse after a decade of making the game. Either do your jobs, or get out.
@Zyart it's not, but the development needs to be cost effective. If they go all out on development budget and the game doesn't bring in enough new player and revenue, then the game will even more fucked. They need to balance what players want, and job balancing isn't as broken that the game is unplayable. That's why they are pushing it further and further and just putting a bandage on it till 8.0
I feel like the disparity on some jobs in FRU is because the fight is hell for jobs that have 1 minute bursts that require a target. SMN and MCH have an immediate 20 second drift on their 60 seconds as soon as Fatebreaker goes untargetable. It just kind of kicks the already underperforming jobs while they're already down.
That and also Samurai gets mega shafted, the boss leaves around 30 seconds in. Samurai's dot goes up around 8 secs in, their dot ticks for 20 secs or so. So their damage is dogshit in it. Boss comes back, Sam gets 1 full cycle of dot, it's not even buffed, then he can't dot again cuz it'll be a wasted GCD since the boss dies before it can even tick half of it's duration. In comes phase 2... Literally the same issue lol
@@henriquerodrigues7795 Not sure what other SAM's have been doing. But I just double tendo midare the first 30s ignoring the dot completely unless I can get a full 40s+ of uptime. And starting in p3, SAM's have much better bana uptime from what I've seen. The more infuriating thing is our 60s skill always barely just not coming off CD before the next 'trio' starts.
The without target part is key. PCT gets to do its most cast intensive stuff with no target and 'store' its damage. Would be interesting if they gave jobs something like 'combo' in ffxi where during downtimes its not just wait for healers / position.
@@LevaniaMeyano I don't want the dot to ever go but fights like this are going to make JP complain hard about the dot so I'm worried it'll be removed so SAM becomes an insanely brain-dead job.
I honestly don't know what the dev team is thinking. On SB, Samurai was really strong on release, got nerfed, was still very popular . Reaper was strong but not even that strong on EW, got nerfed, still a popular and viable job. Now Picto is the most broken job ever released in this game, and they refused to nerf it, even slightly. Heck, no one is asking the job to be "bad," but when content becomes easier because you have this job in the group, something is not right.
The problem with the "buff 16 jobs" mentality is that it is possible (and it has happened in the past) to buff one job more than another, so only some of the jobs will feel "fine" whereas others will still feel neglected.
The things about Pictomancer, beyond balance, is that its DESIGN takes advantage of FFXIV combat and content design, in a way NO. OTHER. JOB. DOES. This has been a CONSISTENT and constantly talked about issue with FFXIV, and Job design and the content you take those Jobs into, that "2min burst, 1min CD with 2 charges, hit 1-2-3, repeat" Job design is not only boring but also completely out of flow with how the game works from a mechanical design position Pictomancer is SO. FLEXIBLE. in a game where almost NO Job is even close to as flexible. The only Jobs that come to mind are Black Mage in the sense that is TECHNICALLY doesnt have a "fixed rotation" but its competing WITH Picto, and then Healers, in the sense that they have so little DPS skills that you are technically using Healer skills in specific and fight dependant moments as opposed to "2min/4min/delay 20s then 6min ect They need to do something with how Jobs even WORK inside of the game. The fact that Pictomancer can plan and USE skills in down time. It can completely ignore what would otherwise be 1min burst windows for other Jobs and just hold off using it so long as they dont overcap with their GENEROUS skill charges. And more importantly, all their highest hitting skills for Burst, are always available. Every other Job has to hit every button, in the right order, everytime, no flexibility in holding off using buttons. Dragoon was the best example, in that if you DIDNT use High Jump off cooldown? Rotation ruined. Nonsense design. Thats not what this game is, and while thats not so much an issue now, the result is Dragoon is just boring, even MORE boring now than launch. Every other Job in downtime, just sits around, thumb in ass. Even if they do, its usually just completely trivial things like Monk just going "I can give myself 2 chakra in downtime" And the charge skills on PCT are all off-timed so that youre not just ignoring it till its burst. The way DRK has "omg 2 charges of Shadowbringer" as if that means anything, because you just use 2 in Burst anyway, its a 2min cooldown that looks like its not. It just goes back to same thing, that people have been complaining about FOREVER. This game is OLD, DATED, Job design AND gear design is just a complete mess.
Honestly, it's flexibility is the stuff I find great about PCT. We really need to do away with this 2min burst meta. Only reason we have it in the first place is because people couldn't do what high end players could do for marginal differences in damage at the time.
I lol'd pretty hard at "monk gets 2 chakra" xD. It's crazy how they don't make changes to help other jobs fulfil their designs, for example why not make it so SSS gives you a bug that lets you open 5 chakras immediately. Don't even get me started on gauge jobs, every single gauge job needs a way to generate it in downtime, they get so shafted in this ultimate, viper is especially bad, because the job can't fucking burst coming out of downtime, the job needs almost 10 seconds to burst out of downtime, so who cares if you held 100 gauge, you can't use it in any buffs. Viper literally need a new monk anatman, do what I always thought anatman should've done, which is if you're in combat and you spend like idk 5 secs or 4 secs using it, you get all your buffs, viper literally needs that
I definitely feel like picto isn't the problem. It's a fantastic job clearly designed by someone who knew the current stape of ffxiv's combat extremely well. The problem is that picto was designed around the current combat while everything else was shoe horned into it. Even viper doesn't fit well, feeling more like it was designed to replicate other melee. While picto being a caster gave them the flexibility to not fit any other mold due to all the current casters being wildly different. So they really need to stop shackling jobs to other jobs and instead let them stand on their own. Like dark knights drain and carve and split share a cooldown purely because warrior's two ogcds share a cooldown. There's no other reason for this other then self imposed shackes
I think DRK’s change was also in preparation for the future, somewhat culling its kit + burst phase now for more space to grow when the level cap is raised. Though to be honest, I think DRK doesn’t need more buttons to press in burst. I’d appreciate if Square Enix turned its button compressing/cooldown micromanagement attention towards jank like SMN’s energy drain having an aoe and single target button, when they really should just be consolidated into one button that does aoe damage (with falloff, if squenix insists.) Maybe then … we can keep the next lunge
Volpi, lemme tell ya as a 20 year MMORPG veteran, it's not about making you forget. It is far more simple. Picto sells Dawntrail. So Picto will find it's proper place by 8.0 because the class would have had its time in the sun and it would be time to share the spotlight with the new classes. (Sad to see that Viper got so forgotten when it was the job I was most excited for and haven't even touched PCT myself.)
as every group, we also had a pct in FRU... - he decided when things died in p2-p3 transition. when he said "syv, your crystal dies now" it didn't matter if my crystal was on 10% or 30% hp at that time, it would die. - a common joke was "pct crit? you mean dmg worth my entire burst phase?" (im a warrior but still, it's ridiculous that its true) - melee died in p3? don't worry, pct just pots and we still overkill it by 5%+ pct consistently is top rdps AND adps, even in full uptime fights, which is ridiculous for an rdps job which isn't even a melee. this is probably the first time a nerf is desperately needed and its not even the gameplay or rotation, it's that every single skill has insane potencies, why?
@@LightTheBlackMage SE really should learn from this. Let it go through live and let a lot more people try it than a couple thousand. because a sample of 10k is a lot more true than a sample of 1k. If the class is dead, then buff it a little. But SE buffed it to the point that you're literally trolling without a PCT 99% of the time.
Meanwhile Viper is on the opposite end of the spectrum and literally gets fucked by encounters with any amount of actual downtime. It completely destroys double reawaken timing or at least lining up 50 gauge with the timing for the free reawaken. And Viper really only has reawaken for its main source of damage
As a RPR, i just think of the "First time?" meme. RPR has had this issue since DSR. TOP was just better designed with not many downtime phases so jobs like VPR/RPR performed way better than in DSR, but DSR and FRU RPR and VPR too feels awful cause of all the short phases. RPR/VPR have the identical burst windows with double awaken/enshroud windows
@@AlalaCrisp rpr was good in both these fights? a party that couldnt get past dsr p2 with rpr was just shit, vpr in FRU p1 does less damage than pranged
This is true for phase 1 at maximum. Viper is MASSIVELY gauge positive, miles more than Reaper. Its bigger concern is getting buffs back asap to start bursting. It takes nearly twice as long as SAM.
this job is SE's fear of nerfs coming back to haunt them. since launch, they have a very straightforward choice between nerfing the potency of one or two spells on one job, or significantly destabilizing every other role by raising hundreds to thousands of potencies in total, thus indirectly buffing the raid buffs (WHICH PICTOMANCER HAS!) that already dominate the meta, and by god they're going to keep doing the latter if it means avoiding a couple dozen angry people on the forums
The issue is the picto problem isnt solved as easily as "nerf potency of one or two spells". You would have to nerf potency of the paintings. But you can't significantly do so without them no longer being viable. Hence you would also need to nerf potency of other abilities. But then you could run into the issue of the job not being at the level SE thinks it should be in full uptime fights(it would basically need to do SMN/RDM damage in full uptime fights to be balanced in ults)
in a meta where the entirety of balance is centralized around two minute windows, you should absolutely be targeting the potency a job gets to hold under buffs, every time. whether or not that might make it "worse" in some situations is irrelevant; the entire problem right now is that, irrespective of what else you run and what encounter you're in, full uptime or forced downtime, single target or multi target, pictomancer is always better. well-balanced jobs *should* be better in certain scenarios and worse in others, that's what gives you reasons to bring them
I don't appreciate the comment about Aphelios and Yugioh cards in comparison to Pictomancer........mainly because it's too fucking true and I play both of those other games lol
All they have to do is modify potency. They do not need to TOUCH the job's identity or the way it plays. It doesn't even have to be a significant tweak it just has to be somewhat in line with the rest of the jobs. Jobs should not be designed based on ultimate raids. Very few players compared to the rest of the playerbase actively pursue ultimate clears. That is not to say that the job should not be balanced, but they need to avoid homogenizing jobs so that they can all "raid on equal ground". Back in Stormblood, jobs were interesting and unique, and all jobs were viable despite any flaws they might have had. They need to go back to that kind of design.
They can’t really boost the other jobs to match it without reworking the difficulties of all the encounters, so a nerf is really the only logical response, which makes the decision to leave it be hard to understand.
Well the thing is, now that the Ultimate is out, they can no longer really buff any jobs without making it trivial. If every job gets further buffed, the Ultimate's DPS checks might as well not exist, and we're gonna start skipping parts of mechs. From now on, they sort of have to nerf PCT and do compensation buffs for a couple jobs if they want to keep the highlight encounter until 7.3 balanced.
@@wackyzap1304honestly I don't even think nerfing potency of Pictomancer fully fixes it. It's another 2 minute meta problem, Pictomancers 2 minute bursts are insane but its filler is very weak compared to BLM and even RDM (if the RDM is lucky with crits.) If stary muse was on a 3 or 4 minute CD, and in general raid buff alignment only allowed 2 to 4 big burst periods again unlike the 4 to 8 big burst periods we have under the 2 minute meta I think current Pictomancer would be fine. For ultimates it's a different story because it's the only class that gains massively from downtime.
As someone who has played many an MMO. Giving other jobs downtime tools doesn't necessarily homogenize them. So long as the advantages gained have meaningful differences from one another. There's a lot of different ways a job can utilize downtime. Give BRD as special Peloton that works in combat. You channel it, play your harp, and everyone gets a movespeed buff. Let machinists summon mecha pets durring downtime or lay down traps. If they know the boss is going to move to X spot once they become targetable again, they can trap that spot for an instant burst of damage. Just make any existing traps despawn at the start of any pull to prevent cheese or extra waiting time between pulls. Let DRK build mana without a target. Flesh out RDM's white magic kit and let them cast single target shields during downtime. Give SCH Miasma back and turn it into a lingering AoE poison cloud. Each of these feel very different in execution, and each has their pros and cons that will cause them to shine on different fights. It doesn't have to be these exact suggestions. These are just examples of what can be done to solve this problem while adding uniqueness to each job.
I will say, as a BLM main, I have enjoyed being able to catch up to PCT on my damage in non-downtime content. I no longer get laughed/trolled out of parties for playing my true love.
I made a reddit post couple days ago where I pointed out the same thing that it's really not a guestion of potency/min. It's the whole job/fight design that is giving PCT massive upperhand compared to other jobs. The comments then were filled with "It really is just potency issue, PCT should do same dps as SMN/RDM and not be there together with BLM when PCT isn't even that hard to play" which honestly was mindboggling. People can't seem to understand that even if PCT dps on normal uptime content is on the top end, it's not causing any actual issues. It's the low uptime fights like Ultimates where the problem lies due to the very foundation how the job is designed.
What you don't seem to understand is that over the last years they sanded out every edge out of every job to make them cookie cutter homogenized clones, and for a new job to suddenly have a niche is completely contradictory to what has been done. It brings into question why they even bothered kneecapping every job over the years, why the homogenization was needed if they're just going to not just release a job that breaks that mold, but also double down on it by saying it's fine. If every role had jobs that did better on fights with some downtime or better in fights with full uptime, and the combat design was actually varied and not just full uptime arena fights with 1 ultimate a year that has measurable downtime, then pictomancer wouldn't be an issue.
I think PCT being the 2nd easiest caster but top end of all DPS in full uptime fights is still an issue, because it's not reasonable to expect even half of the people on PCT to perform as well on BLM. They haven't ever balanced casters around the expectation that they will bring top end BLM damage. If you compare M4S 50% rDPS amounts, the gap between PCT and RDM or SMN is more than twice that of the gap between the best/worst melee, and more than what an extra melee LB3's worth of damage would bring (even if it was an instacast ability). This is on top of having much better mobility with smudge than RDM/SMN and arguably BLM (aetherial manipulation relies on someone being where you need to be), a more spammable selfish or partywide shield than any other caster (every 60s having 20% more HP on the squishiest party member can be as valuable as the partywide 90s one if your healers/tanks aren't giving you single target mits), and the raise tax on DPS never got adjusted despite swiftcast being 40s instead of 60s now. It's more and more likely a healer would be perfectly fine instacasting the rez instead of the RDM/SMN. All that stuff makes a decent amount of difference in pretty much any setting. If you're in a kinda weak party, you're more likely to keep yourself alive and bring the damage needed to clear. If you're in a good one, the extra damage lets more messy pulls clear (which just feels bad that PCT can be better at making runs with a lot of deaths clear than the rez mages) or clean ones clear while outright skipping mechanics.
I would argue that it shouldn't outperform BLM on full uptime fights, or VPR for that matter, and looking back at 7.05 it was more than 10% ahead of VPR and BLM. It is less of an issue than in ultimates, but I don't see why an easier job should contribute that much more damage. PCT has a problem with potency/minute AND disproportional gains from downtime, both can be addressed by just targeting the Living Muse results. You can drop Pom/Wing/Claw/Maw to 850 from 1100, and Mog of the Ages/Madeen to 500 and 600 respectively, it'd still be comfortably above BLM at that point, but less blatantly so, and would result in minimal rotation changes.
@@MissSmoozie except in that case Living Muse would be a dps loss outside of preparing it for burst. 1 of the best options I came agross was that the dps from painting would be divided into 2 parts, a direct dmg from the cast when an enemy was targeted and the motif, making it work like DNC dance where you can do it during downtime, but some of it's dmg is from doing it during uptime. As for the performance as I said, in full uptime fights while PCT dps is high, it's not an actual issue. It is higher than it should be, but not an issue. It would be an issue if other casters were left out from extreme/savage prog cause only PCT was good enough, but that doesn't happen cause RDM and SMN are still extremely useful in seeing through mechanics that are not dps checks, which have also been low this tier. Again, I agree that PCT could use a nerf or 2, but just pure potency changes are not the fix.
@@NakedRadish Having it be a loss outside burst isn't necessarily a problem though looking at FRU, you should end up spending almost every charge for a gain, but you can gut Mog of Ages/Madeen completely to like 200 and keep the rest of Living Muse 900 to keep it slightly positive to filler though. The reason PCT being overtuned in general is important though, as it gives the leeway to reduce the damage enough that PCT becomes good, but not absurd in spotty uptime, while still good in full uptime, iirc the above example is about -12% dps, which still has it be in a good spot, if SE was just willing to take the backlash they could 100% just remove potency and get it where it should be, which is at the very least behind BLM, i.e. it has to lose about 11% dps in full uptime, and that coincides with where it also stops being such an anomaly in e.g. FRU. The preferable fix to PCT is most likely as you say to tie part of the damage from Living Muse to finishing painting, so the ogcd portion gets smaller, probably make the entire thing barely dps positive during uptime (drop it 100 potency), reduce the potency on RGB with 20, and make the hammer average 500 potency, making it just barely above neutral, it's useful for movement and shifting potency into buffs while naked, and becomes a pure dps gain with gear.
@mishaelalucoji9620 it's not even rng, if phys ranged is meant to be support then give all the jobs in the role the tools to do so. Give them the Rez over smn/rdm and give them raid buffs and other supportive tools. Otherwise, give phys ranged the damage to at least be closer to melee than what it currently is.
@@cablefeed3738 As a SAM, MCH, and SMN player for years, the current state of the game makes me very sad. Tbf, SAM has gotten away with doing a disgusting amount of personal dps for a really long time, so I guess it's not right to complain too much about it not being around the top of the pack at the moment, but it still sucks to see. SMN is just depressing in how little it brings to the table now. And well, I never expect anything good for MCH at this point...
@@OrionXIXIComplain about make MCH cooler. Why not transforming into mini brute justice even the damage sucks. Or maybe freaking gundam with lot of lasor..... But welp.... yeah MCH apart from HW just straight to dumpster fire.
3:21 - I will never NOT think it looks badass when the Tanks and Melee (and occasional RDM or SMN) gap close at the boss together after some mechanic. It just looks so cool to me seeing them all fling themselves into the action. almost as one.
I think the game needs a hard look at potencies across all jobs, monster hp, and general job identify but that is a lot such that it likely won't be a thing until 8.0
If they buff everything else, then PCT will be shit and guess what.. its gets buffed again and the whole pattern repeats itself. Powercreeping the shit out of old content.
I think Pictomancer is very well designed job for the current level of encounters. The problem is far less Pictomancer and far more other jobs not being kept competitive in both damage and mechanical design. It feels like they cut corners on the the design of far too many jobs (SMN, RDM and MCH come to mind especially) leaving them practically unchanged. It is little wonder many jobs feel obsolete compared to a job almost tailor-made to deal with the current encounter difficulty.
Like it has been said, Picto being busted in downtime heavy fights isn't a problem in a vacuum, having jobs that excel in some situations over others is fine. But after a decade of restrictive gearing systems and constant role AND encounter homogenization (game is just arena boss fights and no classic mmo encounters, slimes and golems in DRS are the exception), for them to suddenly drop the nuke that is picto, and then double down on it by saying it's fine and it's the other jobs that have to be brought up - then why did the game's variety suffer for a decade? What design philosophy are they even following???
I feel like the easiest thing to nerf would be to make Starry Muse's damage buff only affect the Pictomancer. They'd keep their personal damage, keep the playstyle and rotation, but lose some of the utility that would keep them on top even with the Media Tour potencies.
Even if it is the case, in general is like the other jobs are so underpowered right now, it is like they are stuck in old expansions, like Machinist/Bard/Red Mage and so on are, meanwhile Viper and Picto are dominating, you know, the old powercreep. Adjusting PCT will solve nothing, all the jobs are in need of a rework/mega buff to get them back on track; yes, every job works differently, but they need a lot of increased numbers to compete in today's contents. Yeah, PCT is strong and all, but at least compare to contents that have more clear to it, picto loses hard to Samurai and Viper and some other jobs in other contents like the savages and even the extremes, only time will really tell. FFXIV is in need of a serious job balance.
11:43 This. They shouldn't be the highest damage when they have the best mobility ability in the game, a self mit, raid wide mit, raid buff, faster gcd in raidbuff, performs overwhelmingly better than other jobs in downtime, instant casts, auto direct crit abilities, simple rotation. It's like someone on the xiv forums made a OC job with little to no idea of making a job that feels fairly balanced.
Square put themselves on a hard spot by not addressing Picto's bs, because now what can they do? "buff every other job" (again)? then this Ultimate will become a massive joke DPS wise, I've seen clearing groups borderline skipping mechanics with just a PCT, can you imagine if the other 3 dps were brought up even higher? I honestly don't think they can do that, not without touching this ultimate itself, which I don't think they will do. I always say that the ONE change Picto deserves, and will change absolutely nothing on how the Job plays is the hammer combo, the fact each of it's three hits is a guaranteed Crit Direct Hit has to GO, using tools to see how much each job critted is insane because you see a 30% difference to any other job. If they were to remove that alone the job will remain the exact same in terms of playstyle.
The problem with buffing other classes here is, if you buff other classes you also buff picto, as he gives buff, soo if other classes deals more damage, soo does Picto as his buffs gives them more, soo his Rdps will be even higher
They don't dare to nerf PCT because they saw what happened to Helldivers 2 : When you made something too strong and enjoyable, nerfing it to the ground only upsets people. That's why they opt the unconventional route of buffing other jobs. But PCT strengths isn't just the numbers alone, it's rotations and combos are intuitive and straightforward, and holds a lot more advantages against the encounters they designed. All jobs still has to seek for their niche in adapting to encounter designs, while PCT just goes 'hurr durr hammer goes bonk' or 'just paint a happy little tree when boss is untargetable'. That is why buffing other job's numbers is not going to be enough.
Its not possible to buff other jobs up to PCT level. It has a raid buff, so any buff to another job buffs PCTs dmg. I'd say best thing for them to do would be to nerf the raid buff to a self buff and then MAYBE some minor potency reductions
PCT is interesting because people have been complaining about Job homogenization for YEARS. PCT is probably one of the more unique ones in awhile because of how it works, but now we see the downside of that - balance issues. And yes, I do agree that PCT is entirely too crazy right now, given that it has more raid utility than most any other DPS and yet does more consistent damage than the most selfish of them. But I think the FRU debacle is just revealing what most people didn't want to consider - the more unique the Jobs, the more trouble they'll be to balance. FFXIV is built on letting a player swap Jobs very easily, encouraging people to try different roles and be flexible. In theory, this works really well with letting different Jobs excel at different things, letting players swap based on the situation. But in reality, many people refuse to swap from their mains, it's a pain to level and BiS different Jobs (especially in different roles), and you end up with a toxic PF environment that just starts locking in certain team comps.
If they homogenize pictomancer, honestly a proper protest would be in order. but people aren't gonna commit to it so we're just going to keep going down that route unless people become a bigger problem on the opposite side of that spectrum.
It's funny how when they try for more job identity people get upset, like this is why homogenization exists, because hard-core players can't stop whining that not all jobs have the exact same damage output 😂
To explain why Picto got that big buff between Media Tour and Live: Players theorised that Picto had a funky AOE rotation. If you did Rainbow Drip into Holy over and over, it was actually your best possible rotation for 2+ targets, according to media tour numbers. And they couldn't nerf Rainbow Drip or Holy's damage because they would then be worse to use in the single target rotation that you get for every 2 minutes. This put them in a pretty tight bind and just forced them to mega buff the Motif damage, but in doing so caused Picto's overall damage to skyrocket. Throw in the downtime boost and it's just going crazy. And apparently the reason that has been privately stated as to why the job buffs didn't happen in 7.1 was because of the ultimate, and how they didn't want the exact same thing that happened during 7.05 to happen where DPS checks became trivial after major changes. I personally don't agree with that because now it'll be changed just before the 2nd tier of savage, they were never going to avoid buffing just before hard content gets released. And quite frankly the choice about this is real frustrating to make. They genuinely can't nerf Picto's damage rotation, they have to do the other version and buff everyone else. But they also can't do it to the level required shown by this Ultimate, otherwise Picto would only be playable in crazy downtime fights. The best solution is honestly give them a small full uptime nerf, followed by a change in how Ultimates are designed. We've never had a full uptime ultimate, just specific phases. They'll need to create some to allow other classes to shine a bit more. More ultimates with more mechanics like Hello World and Ultimate Relativity would be amazing to see, and is probably the best answer without gutting job identity. And then they can mix and match between the two, so all classes get to shine. Also the final cry, PLEASE SQUARE ENIX STOP WITH THE RANGED TAX BS. I'm done with it, I'm so tired by that excuse. There is not a single point in this fight where a physical ranged DPS gets to do something easier due to their freedom of movement. We actually celebrated once we realised that our BRD could do something useful with Warden's Paean into Phase 2. And because of these Picto shenanigans it's physical ranged that are getting slack for it, due to the fact that the majority of a phys ranged's damage is in their ability to keep a boss targeted. Give them more damage, let them actually feel like they can play the game please. I'm seeing so many phys ranged players want to quit because they don't feel valued by the game, and that's not ok.
The funky AoE rotation was removed by just making Rainbow Drip's damage fall off really hard past the first target. The extra thousand-ish potency per minute that they gave the job against a single target wasn't connected to that, it's just another thing that they happened to do at the same time.
I agree on the Phys ranged tax, it desperately needs to go, BRD and DNC can kind of slip through the cracks since they can buff other jobs and DNC can just juice the fuck out of a picto or melee, but MCH is getting ROYALLY screwed over, to the point where its probably going to start getting excluded from PF again similar to what happened in second tier of Pandamonium. I have not seen a single fight yet where the Phys ranged full up time thing has had any type of meaningful effect on their dmg, they are always behind the other 3 dps almost no matter what, the only exception is MCH can potentially be ahead of SMN and RDM but SMN is just a phys ranged in a caster coat, and both RDM and SMN have the Rez tax, which is just as dmging to those 2 casters, especially after Picto's addition to the game, as the phys ranged tax is to all the phys ranged. This tax mentality has got to go for both phys ranged and the rez casters or else it is going to kill those jobs and cause a huge amount of people that play those jobs to just straight up quit.
it's the RNG of the job that kills me. your best damage dealing ability is hidden behind a random proc that may or may not go off once to 3 times in a boss fight.
Picto reminds me of deathknight from WoW when it first came out. It seemed like the devs wanted to make a job that countered all challenges before it somehow and then forgot that every other job doesn’t do that.
This is literally a case of Yoshi P is so afraid to nerf Picto because of the backlash he would get if he did, that he is willing to literally break his game to keep from it.
Ironically enough they might be getting more backlash now compared to whatever vocal minority would've complained at launch for "boo hoo my new job is weaker now".
They nerfed Samurai in Stormblood and Reaper in Endwalker, and both jobs were still among the most popular ones. The game survived, and I don't know a single person who left the game because of a nerf. DT balance is all over the place, and Picto is just the worst of it all. I think the problem here is that the dev team is quite literally lost in the balance department.
@@Cloudo4 Same reason samurai and dark knight were almost universally blocked in PF during early stormblood - ignorant casuals who hear something, don't bother getting the actual details and doing the "mob with torches and pitchforks" gig.
They made a job where their downtime tool also happens to be their primary burst damage tool. That's not en easy problem to solve without changing the mechanical identity of the job. And in a game where job identity is basically a precious commodity that would be incredibly bad. Outside of just straight up lowering potency across the board for Picto I don't see another way to solve this
It needs to be a 1:2 combo of nerfing baseline potency and re-evaluating the ultimate formula and, quite frankly, absurd downtime lengths/frequency. There's a lot of phases they could tweak while providing full uptime/unforced downtime. Yeah, maybe melees have to use ranged tools more, at least it's not forced downtime. It'd also alleviate ranged tax. It'd heighten melee uptime skill expression. It'd fix a lot of things getting away from this tired formula of only focusing on mechanics with your weapon sheathed.
I think when it comes to the point where you are making an objectively bad choice for NOT picking the busted thing is when the designers made a grave mistake
I mean what do you expect when you release an ultimate with a lot of downtime that the job that excels is the job that can paint pictures during the downtime.
@@greenjoe21 Which also counters BLMs power. It's hard to win with how damn perfect they created PCT. The real problem is definitely Ranged Physical still. Movement and downtime should be their domain but it still doesn't mean much
Honestly just redistribute the damage potencies. Lower motif damage and rebalance against core elemental spells if downtime gains are so problematic to the landscape of jobs. Otherwise sounds like we need more full uptime encounters.
I can proudly say that I haven't touched Picto with an 10 foot long Pole... I'm an BLM and haven't even unlocked the Job, don't plan to ever unlock it either because simplicity kills my excitement of the Game. I don't hate Picto for being what it is or the People playing it, just don't force me to pick up Picto and we are fine 👀👍
I was watching a stream of Peridot (caster on Kindred, the first team to kill FRU on stream) trying to do some reclears of FRU on BLM. He switched back to PCT after an hour because the damage difference was that much. Peridot is a god tier BLM player.
as a caster main. i miss being able to play the other ones without feeling like im throwing more constructively: flamethrower should generate heat. just saying the sentence makes sense and also solves a couple problems with an otherwise struggling job
They could possibly reduce the castime and recast of motifs then reduce the potency of the abilities to make up for it. That way the reliance on downtime is reduced while not hurting the job to much in uptime sections.
Honestly, considering that ffxiv only has 21 classes with zero build customization, it is a catastrophe that the game is not perfectly balanced every time. Their job seems so easy compared to other games. Think about this again in the context of other rpg's you've played: Every job in this game has exactly 1 build. WoW has 39 specs, each with talent trees, more interesting gearing (embellishments, tierset bonuses, trinkets) leading to way more build permutations than ffxiv's gigantic number of 1 per class. Just coming over from wow to xiv during endwalker I was pleasantly surprised by the balance. Over time I learned that balancing this game is just a way easier task, now I wonder what the fuck square enix is smoking to take this long to fix balance and acting on community feedback about playstyle changes. You have them talking about things they're considering to change for 8.0 What the fuck are they doing over there for them to need 2 years to act on community feedback on class design? 21 classes with ZERO build customization. What is taking them so long? What are people going to do if the redesigns for 8.0 still suck? Wait another 2 years? And don't forget that that patch is going to ship with 2 more undercooked classes. THe XIV community needs to demand more rapid iteration on the game. Especially on class design which is basically the lens through which you view the entire rest of the game.
To quote the Ex-black mage now picto player in my fru static at the end of p1: "yo guys I did a million damage in 4 abilities, can we hold for 15 seconds?"
Some pf lock caster slot for picto since few days ago... so, yeah... can confirm with my FRU static, we run with rdm at first, we have to optimize our dps after we hit enrage every phase, just like the usual ultimate on patch mind you. Our rdm decide to switch to picto on p3 transition since rdm kinda suck there. Then we're like 5% or more percent ahead on every phase. Freestyle picto, barely trying. No more dps check, its dumb.
The job and its power is hurting the game. Basically if you play picto you’re smart if you play anything else you’re dumb. With the combination of DT story and picto ff14 is going downhill fast. I’ll be playing poe2 until Yoshi gets his act together.
The dude in charge of balacing mages have no idea what he is doing Rdm being lower on dmg than summoner whole endwalker expac is baffling and picto being so high right now (especialy on FRU) is ridiculous Blm should be the highest dps at all time because of the technicity of the job, yet they fuck up everytime
@@GENKI_INU Yeah i know they love the rez tax but where is the difficulty tax then ? Summoner is close to vegetative state in term of brain power meanwhile you have to be in melee range to burst with rdm, it doesn't make sense
@@Gathoderiz Well technically you do go in for smn as well in ifrit phase and swiftcast is never up when you need to raise because you have burn in garuda phase so rdm has huge advance in that department as well. Also death penalty for smn is a lot worse then rdm.
Honestly, I wonder how viable that would be for meme clears. 2% less stats and no lb gen, but you have until phase 6 that you actually need lb, so you have plenty of time. Honestly, I’d like to see someone try it, It would be very funny.
I think it's a big mistake that Square Enix does not want to nerf any class but instead increased every other classes power to compensate, because that'll only result in a power-creep spiral of ever-increasing potencies, reducing the difficulty of encounters. If a class is too strong then simply nerf it, period. Have a baseline of "how much dmg/sec should a class do" and adjust it accordingly, regardless of whether it requires a buff or a nerf.
The player perception matters a lot tho. With people being inherantly loss averse, nerfs will feel a lot worse than everything else being buffed by an equal degree. MOBAs (a nod at happy's reference to aphelios) are a good place to see these sentiments. edit: Thats not to say they shouldnt nerf at all, but they have to find a delicate balance, which would inevitably lean more into buffing others more than theyre nerfing picto
@@lmpoknya People say that PCT is overpowered since DT release. They had plenty of time to nerf it a little pretty fast. Most people wouldnt even care.
My hot take is that MCH should do almost as much RDPS as the weaker melees (not enough to actually consistently beat them though) since it's "supposed" to be the "selfish" physical ranged so it should theoretically be ABOVE the utility/support DPS of BRD, DNC, RDM, and SMN while edging towards the non-selfish melees like NIN. Instead it's worse than both BRD and DNC while having none of their utility and buffs. But it's still phys-ranged which means free uptime, so it can't be at the same level as the other "selfish" DPS obviously. And yeah PCT has needed a nerf since day one, there should NEVER be a world where it's doing more than BLM, yet here we are. SAM VPR BLM should always be the top 3 DPS since they have no partywide utility other than default role actions like Addle and Feint. They either need to reduce PCT's damage output, OR completely remove all of it's party buffing and party utility and full commit to it being a "selfish" DPS like SAM, VPR, and BLM. Ideal DPS Ranking should look something like this, strongest at the top: SAM/VPR BLM Other Melees and PCT MCH RDM/SMN BRD/DNC
Not sure vpr and sam should on same lvl as when it come to complexity vpr is lot lower then that of ninja and many of the other dps and in either case blm should be above them both. Mch should be much higher but perhaps make it a little more risky job to play. I also think need give it a gap closer so it could flex in the 2nd melee slot alot easier.
As a mch main seeing the stats in this ult made me realize our brief moment in the spotlight with TOP was only because of circumstances. We never left the rat tier. And now why would anyone bring us if we can't even buff the picto's damage? Heck picto has their Tempura to cover our one unique thing with Dismantle. I know you said Aphelios, but Picto is more like release Xin Zhao. Meanwhile us mch are removed stun Eve.
Honestly those jokes about giving us Machinists a Defibrillator as a rez skill feels less like a joke and more something we should legitimately start asking for just do we have something handy to bring to raids.
I'm a white mage main who's currently re-playing FFXIV as a dragoon (just started Heavensward :D). I've never played anything other than White Mage, I don't consume all that much content around FFXIV, and I'm such a casual player that I had no idea pictomancer was so crazy. I've been seeing a LOT of them in the various dungeons I've been working through, but I just assumed the class was fun. Had no idea it was such a hot topic lol
As someone who played through the degeneration of the WoW content scene, they need to nip this Pictomancer problem in the bud in 7.2. If you let locked slots and talk of blackballing entire roles sit around long enough it'll trickle down. From FRU to the 7.2 Savage and eventually down to the 7.3 Extreme.
A PCT nerf would just be a temporary bandaid on the main issue. The other jobs need to be better designed but realistically they'll never do that until 8.0 so I can totally see YoshiP bend over backwards and nerf the crap out of it until it becomes completely useless.
This always lead me to the conclusion how SMN is one of the greatest potential jobs yet absolutely left in the dirt. Imagine if it would have that kind of flexibility and versatility as PCT, by for example having Ramuh, Leviathan and Shiva as extra summons with unique capabilities than just having an extra Bahamut doing the exact same thing just cooler and a bit stronger... at this point common modders do better work with jobs than the SE team and that's sad.
@@seajay7944 The logic was since it didn't have a res it would be stronger than summoner and redmage, but weaker than blackmage because it has a raidbuff and blm is generally harder.
I'm not sure. The discourse when it released, at least on TH-cam seemed to be more polarizing than DoA. Seemed to be either a) It would be dead on arrival if it couldn't beat the DPS of BLM because why would you bring one over that in a prog setting when it didn't have a rez. The raid buff would have needed to be immense. b) It would be a 100% pick because the combination of the raid buffs and potential damage would make the others redundant. The issue here is that people were assuming that phys range would be more relevant. Instead we have comps of 2 casters becoming much more the norm. Seems silly to take a Phys range when you can take PCT/RDM or PCT/BLM. If you want a phys, you take RDM, drop a melee and take a dnc/brd so you can just pump your big hitters. I'm sure they'll get balanced, but the game is in a wild spot right now with some jobs.
I know that this opinion of mine will be anectdotal, but after we started to fail damage checks in FRU, our raidlead suggested that our black mage should swap to picto. Something that he does not want to do, and he is also performing his rotation perfectly. Just that mentallity feels really weird to have.
Even so a PCT does bring more dmg overall, its never a single classes fault if you dont meet the dps check. I have been in so many PF groups and sometimes you just destroy the boss and sometimes you barely make it no matter if you got a PCT or not. BLM is surely not THAT bad that its his fault.
Just let BLM stack flarestars like polyglot. Would help the extreme rigid timing (and help more casual players), helps with downtime and gives nice burst potential. Or give them something like meditate for ice phase like supercharging despair with it the next time. Would also make ice phase more wanted like ice leylines that freeze you in place for some time I think the answer is not destroying classes that can use downtimes but either design fights with less of those OR give jobs INTERESTING abilities to use it. And with that I don’t mean just copy pasting things between jobs but interesting spins on their class fantasy like the motives for PCT, Ice for BLM or maybe a battle ready stance for VPR.
Best things I can think of for downtime: 1. a cutscene that freezes timers (so buffs don't disappear) 2. downtime that requires continuous movement (not sure if there are any jobs that can build gauge in downtime while moving) 3. those downtimes in some fights where your character is held by some magical "I cant move or do anything" (I guess functionally this is almost identical to 1 above) Would probably get old quite quick over the span of several fights though...
The most infuriating thing is that they created Flare Star to kill non-standard lines/gameplay, but completely missed the mark on what was one of the actual reasons (or issues in their eyes) for doing them in the first place, which was that the potency of the Ice Spells you use in Umbral Ice was absolutely pathetic, making it so that by skipping them you will gain dps over the course of a fight. All they had to do was to make the Umbral Ice phase of the rotation actually worth doing, maybe make it super buff or upgrade an additional thing that you use in the Astral Fire phase, or maybe make Despair or something upgrade Blizzard 4 into a big and powerful spell. They could have perfectly done something like that and leave the non-standard lines alone as an option for flexibility, movement, rotation alignment and correction. Also I still cannot fathom why they decided to gut Thunder like they did and make it way harder to use optimally for the majority of players, contrary to how it was before Dawntrail. Sadly we live in a reality where the person or group of people designing BLM have literal zero idea of what they are doing with the job. PD: The big irony is that we now have scuffed non-standard lines back🤣.
@@arxswartz9377 They could do so many things with BLM and fire/ice. Like change Flarestar and add also 6 ice stacks. You can have up to 6 fire and 6 ice stacks but you need 3 each to cast . This should be one of those with 100% crit/dh so it actually matters. The stacks dont go away on stance swap. Now maybe also make ice phase buff ice spells like fire phase buff fire spells and we could actually use B4 to get the ice stacks for this big skill. Would be fun as hell as you could do meaningful damage in both stances while getting your big fat skill together. They really need to come up with something new. I dont wanna see a 4th poly stack in 8.0. This solves nothing.
If they're worried about the negative feedback that they'd receive by nerfing PCT then they can balance it out by giving phys. ranged players the MCH buffs they've been wanting for the past 5 years and finally fixing it's AOE kit. The cries of the PCT players will be drowned out by the collective cheers of everyone else.
I like when jobs are better in certain circumstances, such as low movement, high movement, burst, or downtime, etc. I dislike homogenization of jobs....which I feel ff14 has been doing a lot of. Picto actually feels like a new job....BECAUSE it leverages downtime in a way that is fun. Its how I always wanted BLM to play....I get to charge up my spells and use them. I would not mind them hitting the raid buff, because I think this design plays better as a selfish dps anyways. However, that is what the core design of the class wants to be....selfish dps that can use downtime to leverage very high potency uptime. The issue with nerfing them to account for the downtime......is that will make pictos have to cast in downtime only to hit like wet noodles and it will feel rather pointless as a class. The issue is what makes this job unique and fun and a breath of fresh air is what is also giving it competitive advantages in downtime based fights. And outside of the raid buff, I don't think you can change much on that.
Picto’s damage is insane, for sure. I’ve seen them rip aggro from tanks during their bursts and have had to fight fully geared 630 Pictos for aggro at times. I tried it out myself and its utility and flexibility are insanely good, especially with a party wide mitigation and busted movement ability.
The problem with it affecting other jobs is higher than ever honestly, MCH and SMN in particular are the most affected, MCH more than any job in the GAME! and the ranged tax which doesn't even need to exist anymore with how strats are always designed around uptime for melee anyways doesn't even affect picto either. It's just such a massive problem that has such a simple solution, but their balance philosophy is constantly going against them, Right now the meta is to just run full buffs to skyrocket a PCT's buffs because like Happy said, 99% of all groups have a pct, and you're basically greifing if you don't have one
@sag2057 basically ranged tax is the job has lesser potencies/damage based on the fact that they can move outside of the bosses reach while still maintaining uptime. It's there way of keeping the ranged balanced, yet isn't relevant because starts are made for melee uptime
@@sag2057This tax is due to range phy has 100% uptime. But this only happen in the past (below SB era, SHB basically make hitbox bigger again) as at that time the boss hitbox basically small as 4 man dungeon boss and there are lot of away mechanic (thus except MT, other melee can hardly hit it >>> this is why melee has range option as filler). This make overall damage to the boss between dps are the same. Nowadays, range tax basically stupid. Extreme, ultimate, savage boss hitbox basically really large. Mechanic which force melee to be in downtime or caster to be always move become minimum. Thus it is still insane that range phy still has this tax.
SMN really needed more to be added to it and definitely not whatever solar bahamut was, which only seems to get in the way of what it already had rather than be a step forward. The whole reason for the overhaul in EW was to establish a new foundation from which it could be built up in future expansions but that potential has just not been met from the very first step made after changing it.
honestly the devs total neglect of player feedback is the main reason I wont be playing anymore, its obvious they dont care about what the playerbase has to say anymore
As a SMN main, who is mostly Savage geared with BiS (missing Weapon and chest) and using the same gear for a Picto, AND knows exactly what they are doing as a SMN to play (mostly) perfectly, and knowing how to play picto (but has not mastered the rotations), I can honestly say the difference between the two even in that scenario is fully noticeable. While my test was limited and did not involve mechanics, a full 2 minute rotation, including Opener was around a 25% to 35% difference. I love SMN, I have since ARR. But with Picto as it is I feel I am bringing my static down, by bringing SMN and not Picto. They do not blame me, nor do they ask me to bring something else. Still the difference is so great that it feels bad to play the job I love. Untargetable bosses wreck our rotation and crash our DPS because our burst is now out of sync with the 2-minute meta for buffs and burst. Having regular Bahamut come out in the burst, or worse Phoenix, instead of the stupid sword dragon which is where our best burst is just depressing. I do agree a job like BLM should do more DPS per GCD just because of both difficulty and the fact you need to plan your times to cast and to stand still far more then SMN, but it should not be such a great difference that it actually feels bad, or make you feel like a liability.
I say i feel your pain but prioritze your fun instead of the clear. It truly isnt that serious bc the content can be cleared by other classes as well. Yes picto needs a nerf, but dont let it suck your fun away
People like to bring up old Shb and pre-shb SMN but those were a mess. You had to put in way more effort than other classes, even the top dps, just to contribute above the general average. A result of it being an amalgamated mess of abilities that you had to play back and forth like a piano to get the most out of with out of date mechanisms other jobs had moved past or improved on. by ShB it was creatively gridlocked with no space for new systems or abilities moving forward, due to them trying to build around a foundation which itself was the core issue. Thank god they ripped that out and gave us something not just with more class identity (old SMN was mainly arcanist with airs) but a base foundation for growth in future expansions which could absorb new ideas. Thing is though the first step forward hasnt really met that potential. We have space for new CDs, OGcds and additional mechanisms for better complexity but instead we got solar bahamut which seems to be tripping over what little we already had. We needed flesh on our bones, and solar bahamut just isnt it.
@@tenjenk My three base requests for changes they can make, that are relatively minimalistic are: Sword dragon REPLACES Bahamut, The primals summoned after Phoenix switch to an alternate set of primals, even if it is just a skin. and finally (I doubt they will give us this) Turn the Ifirt charge into a non closer, and/or break it from the main rotation and into an oGCD. If we got those three changes I think most SMN would have been happy in DT, as it stands the rework they said most jobs would get for 8.0 has even more to make SMN happy.
The problem with Aphellios is he is overdesigned with an air of needing a degree in mechanical engineering to effectively use his kit. A literal more apt description would have been Hwei. Hwei is literally a magical artist, has multiple abilities per paint used and does big damage and provides decent utility to his team. He's not overly complex, much like Picto and just can do whatever he needs. Aoe? He has that. Crowd control? He has that too. Shields and move speed increase? He has that. Zoning and long range attacks? Yeah he has that as well.
We're too far down the rabbit hole to be worried about homogenization. Just give every job and ability to charge their gauge during downtime. Along with some MAJOR MCH buffs and call it a day.
I progged my first Savage tier purely through PF on SMN and every time I joined a group I had a nagging thought in the back of my head that they were probably disappointed I wasn't a PCT. Which...probably says something.
As a SMN and PCT player, that's definitely a real feeling, but likewise when stuff goes south in a run where you are on PCT, you end up aware of situations where a rez would've saved a pull from being a wipe. But the amount of time I save by just playing PCT and killing the boss faster probably makes up for the extra pulls here and there...
Given the studio's penchant for learning all the wrong lessons from everything, I would not doubt in the slightest the philosophy was along the lines of, "Well player feedback says they dont think Picto belongs in FF XIV and dont want to play it.... but if we make it strong, then everyone will want to play it!" Yeah thats not... Thats not a good response.
One of my issues with Picto is it goes against my usual view of classes, being that classes with buffs should do less than those without, since ones with buffs bring raid damage, while the "selfish" jobs just take. The fact Picto both gives and takes damage, as well as having basically everything but a rez, it really makes you wonder why even bother bringing any other caster when they just dont bring the damage. Its why I'm happy my statics caster is a red mage, its nice having someone who wants to play a different caster just because they want to.
a damage buff is nothing more than just damage in another form, the other utility I agree with but simply saying like for example reaper should automatically do less than samurai because it has a turd of a raid buff is terrible balance, if anything most 'buff' jobs should have a higher ceiling as it requires a competent party to 'burst' into your buffs to make up the damage vs a 'selfish' job. anyway the job design of this game is awful which is why I don't play it anymore anyway.
Pictomancer's strongest attacks are tied to its motifs (canvas). Outside of combat, painting them is instant, but during combat it takes some time to prepare them. And therein lies (most of) the problem: Pictomancer is a job that benefits the most during "downtimes" while in fights (like say, when a boss becomes untargetable).
I love when selfish dps have less dps than a class with everything.
Like machinist for years . . . oh wait
As a dancer I wouldn't hate like... them leaning more into the SUPPORT part of the Support DPS role, on the note of expanding class kits
This, give phys ranged a reason for dog water damage. Give them a each a Rez, additional support buttons. SOMETHING
I agree to that. I do think that the rotations feel nice now also with the new burst actions, but i rather have a little bit more options to strengthen the team in certain Situations. I think with that there would also fall a bit more responsability during down- and uptime phases on the ranged dps instead.
been saying it since heavensward; support should be a fourth, full fledged role. Buff the dps of "pure" dps, nerf the supporters a little, and make light parties 1-1-1-1 of each tank-healer-supp-dps. but it is what it is, way too late for that now for sure
@@Shaen0-92 A raise should never be a compensation for bad damage, because it just fucks over a job in runs where no one dies.
@@MyVanir That's fair that in a very competent group it would be less necessary. But since Phys Ranged damage is already awful damage currently, it would be an option.
I personally would just rather dps buffs to slightly worse than melee but I doubt people will go for that.
PCT : Can Dash and get movement speed buff, Can party Shield, Can party heal, Can give raid buff - Highest DPS
MCH: No movement skill, No Shield, No heal, No raid buff - Bottom tier DPS for god knows how long already just beacuse its a P range and dev team decide to tax the F out of your dps
you think yoshiP will balance the jobs? as a MCH main , LMAO
Just take 200 potency off the Muses, Rainbow Drip, etc. all the shit with over 1000 and put it on MCH's tools
And maybe give us a raid buff
And no, another Dismantle equivalent is not enough.
Without raidwide buff your job sucks its simple
Summoner is at the bottom of the dps tier. Red mage has a better version of combat rez and better raid utility which it controls. Summoner has no control over its resources.
I'm leveling this currently. Unlocked flamethrower. Looks cool but locked in place for 10 seconds.... be great if it filled heat gauge or something but not a fan of those locked in place to x to happen skill.
This coming from me not knowing the fulls in and out of the jobs yet so take it like that
Had a VPR mentor say to another VPR that asked for advice about how to beat the enrage for P1 and the VPR said "If you dont have a PCT, everyone should pot". Its insane.
I was told that playing 2 melee rn is a litteral meme, pct and rdm are better. That if youre a viper, you should dump the class. Some PFs are locking it as not choosable.
After Yoshi P legit said "I wont nerf picto cuz its new and that would feel bad." Bro what about Viper players, theyre getting kicked out due to crap damage. Caster slots now locked to pictos with no summoner or blm in sight. This is creating such a toxic ult community that its making me want to quit on this ultimate, and previous ultimates were some of my fav content to run
They should've put Viper up to par with pictomancer, feels bad just giving love to one of the new jobs instead and casting the other aside
Viper is generally bad in ultimates and will probably always be. Viper isnt really bursty and has a more even sustained damage profile. In ultimates you generally have a lot of downtime and viper cant really build resources during downtime
@@temporaryjedi Combat Rez is severely restricted on Summoner so its makes for a poor rez mage. Summoner's damage needs to be higher than Red Mage.
@@TobinatorTxBringing back the Dot would be a start.
I'm so tired of them refusing to balance all the jobs.
Near impossible. They should just leave picto and buff everything else
For the four savage fights in a given tier and the ultimate, assume the picto player plays perfectly. Calculate the amount of potency they can output, and from that their damage. Do this for every other class. Then, calculate how much each class's raidbuff is worth by using the average damage of two healers, two tanks, and three other DPSs. Congratulations, you now know exactly how much damage picto does in every fight for the tier.
Game balance is actually *extremely* easy if you only care about one thing. It's why the game has been so well balanced up to this point: because it comes at the expense of any sense of class identity.
@@xL0stKIlahthis line of thinking is why we're here to begin with. Now dont get me wrong, for the most part, it is actually quite a good way to go about things in a case where the strongest class has maybe a little bit of an upper hand. But pic to is so blatantly OP that they would have to seriouspy buff everything else, which would perpetuate the issue that is power creep. This is one of those rare occurrences where a job NEEDS to be nerfed and boss health values need to be adjusted. Buffing everything for catch up is putting a band aid on a big issue
Balance jobs 8 hours later why are we still on phase 1 god!! meh leave it alone
"We'll fix it in 8.0" Is not a flex and should be derided. There is no reason for this dev team to be moving this slow with anything but the abject refusal to introduce anything out of the EXACT SPECIFIC PREDETERMINED WINDOW is getting ridiculous.
Bro, you act like job balancing is the only work they are doing... they literally have to work on msq patch aswell as the next expansion, two more savage wing, one more Ultimate, two alliance raid, cosmic explaration, the new Bazja type content, and the trial series and EX
@@MrKnaives This isn't our problem. And I'm tired of them using it as an excuse. There was more content in previous expansions, and it wasn't an excuse then, either. It shouldn't be an excuse after a decade of making the game. Either do your jobs, or get out.
Square Enix needs to hire more people ASAP. FFXIV is their golden goose nowadays and they're just letting it die a slow death
@@MrKnaives The solution is hiring more employees, but the Square Enix CEO is an NFT-bro and incompetency is almost always associated with it
@Zyart it's not, but the development needs to be cost effective. If they go all out on development budget and the game doesn't bring in enough new player and revenue, then the game will even more fucked. They need to balance what players want, and job balancing isn't as broken that the game is unplayable. That's why they are pushing it further and further and just putting a bandage on it till 8.0
If they nerf picto can wait for CONGRATULATIONS (Fru was easier in 7.1) on the your FUTURES REWRITTEN ULTIMATE (it was easier in 7.1) CLEAR
LMAO
Eh, FRU waa easier than DSR and ToP anyway so it doesn't really matter
@@Yokai_Yuri To be fair, everything is easier than ToP..
I feel like the disparity on some jobs in FRU is because the fight is hell for jobs that have 1 minute bursts that require a target. SMN and MCH have an immediate 20 second drift on their 60 seconds as soon as Fatebreaker goes untargetable. It just kind of kicks the already underperforming jobs while they're already down.
True. As MCH you overcap all your shit permanently because of the long downtimes. It really doesnt feel good.
That and also Samurai gets mega shafted, the boss leaves around 30 seconds in. Samurai's dot goes up around 8 secs in, their dot ticks for 20 secs or so. So their damage is dogshit in it. Boss comes back, Sam gets 1 full cycle of dot, it's not even buffed, then he can't dot again cuz it'll be a wasted GCD since the boss dies before it can even tick half of it's duration. In comes phase 2... Literally the same issue lol
@@henriquerodrigues7795 Not sure what other SAM's have been doing. But I just double tendo midare the first 30s ignoring the dot completely unless I can get a full 40s+ of uptime. And starting in p3, SAM's have much better bana uptime from what I've seen. The more infuriating thing is our 60s skill always barely just not coming off CD before the next 'trio' starts.
The without target part is key. PCT gets to do its most cast intensive stuff with no target and 'store' its damage. Would be interesting if they gave jobs something like 'combo' in ffxi where during downtimes its not just wait for healers / position.
@@LevaniaMeyano I don't want the dot to ever go but fights like this are going to make JP complain hard about the dot so I'm worried it'll be removed so SAM becomes an insanely brain-dead job.
At some point they have to just start nerfing jobs when they've tweaked them too high, one job nerf vs buffing like 16 others? How is that logical.
Especially because PCT has a group buff. If you buff everything else, PCT rdps goes up again because the others do more dmg under buffs.
I honestly don't know what the dev team is thinking. On SB, Samurai was really strong on release, got nerfed, was still very popular . Reaper was strong but not even that strong on EW, got nerfed, still a popular and viable job. Now Picto is the most broken job ever released in this game, and they refused to nerf it, even slightly. Heck, no one is asking the job to be "bad," but when content becomes easier because you have this job in the group, something is not right.
Been saying the same for years. Nobody likes their job to be nerfed, but it's less healthy overall to virtually only buff jobs.
The problem with the "buff 16 jobs" mentality is that it is possible (and it has happened in the past) to buff one job more than another, so only some of the jobs will feel "fine" whereas others will still feel neglected.
@@ibs4541 Or we can bring up the elephant in the room with their refusal to scale back the INSANE sustain tanks have nowadays.
The things about Pictomancer, beyond balance, is that its DESIGN takes advantage of FFXIV combat and content design, in a way NO. OTHER. JOB. DOES.
This has been a CONSISTENT and constantly talked about issue with FFXIV, and Job design and the content you take those Jobs into, that "2min burst, 1min CD with 2 charges, hit 1-2-3, repeat" Job design is not only boring but also completely out of flow with how the game works from a mechanical design position
Pictomancer is SO. FLEXIBLE. in a game where almost NO Job is even close to as flexible. The only Jobs that come to mind are Black Mage in the sense that is TECHNICALLY doesnt have a "fixed rotation" but its competing WITH Picto, and then Healers, in the sense that they have so little DPS skills that you are technically using Healer skills in specific and fight dependant moments as opposed to "2min/4min/delay 20s then 6min ect
They need to do something with how Jobs even WORK inside of the game. The fact that Pictomancer can plan and USE skills in down time. It can completely ignore what would otherwise be 1min burst windows for other Jobs and just hold off using it so long as they dont overcap with their GENEROUS skill charges. And more importantly, all their highest hitting skills for Burst, are always available.
Every other Job has to hit every button, in the right order, everytime, no flexibility in holding off using buttons. Dragoon was the best example, in that if you DIDNT use High Jump off cooldown? Rotation ruined. Nonsense design. Thats not what this game is, and while thats not so much an issue now, the result is Dragoon is just boring, even MORE boring now than launch.
Every other Job in downtime, just sits around, thumb in ass. Even if they do, its usually just completely trivial things like Monk just going "I can give myself 2 chakra in downtime"
And the charge skills on PCT are all off-timed so that youre not just ignoring it till its burst. The way DRK has "omg 2 charges of Shadowbringer" as if that means anything, because you just use 2 in Burst anyway, its a 2min cooldown that looks like its not.
It just goes back to same thing, that people have been complaining about FOREVER. This game is OLD, DATED, Job design AND gear design is just a complete mess.
Knowing how FFXIV team usually does thing, I suspect they will fix PCT like how they fix non standard BLM.
Honestly, it's flexibility is the stuff I find great about PCT. We really need to do away with this 2min burst meta. Only reason we have it in the first place is because people couldn't do what high end players could do for marginal differences in damage at the time.
@@Kylesico912x fr
I lol'd pretty hard at "monk gets 2 chakra" xD. It's crazy how they don't make changes to help other jobs fulfil their designs, for example why not make it so SSS gives you a bug that lets you open 5 chakras immediately. Don't even get me started on gauge jobs, every single gauge job needs a way to generate it in downtime, they get so shafted in this ultimate, viper is especially bad, because the job can't fucking burst coming out of downtime, the job needs almost 10 seconds to burst out of downtime, so who cares if you held 100 gauge, you can't use it in any buffs. Viper literally need a new monk anatman, do what I always thought anatman should've done, which is if you're in combat and you spend like idk 5 secs or 4 secs using it, you get all your buffs, viper literally needs that
@@Verpal or in other words, ruin parts of what made the class appealing.
They've nerfed the fun out of every job and now they're afraid to adjust some potencies? Ridiculous.
I definitely feel like picto isn't the problem. It's a fantastic job clearly designed by someone who knew the current stape of ffxiv's combat extremely well. The problem is that picto was designed around the current combat while everything else was shoe horned into it. Even viper doesn't fit well, feeling more like it was designed to replicate other melee. While picto being a caster gave them the flexibility to not fit any other mold due to all the current casters being wildly different.
So they really need to stop shackling jobs to other jobs and instead let them stand on their own. Like dark knights drain and carve and split share a cooldown purely because warrior's two ogcds share a cooldown. There's no other reason for this other then self imposed shackes
I think DRK’s change was also in preparation for the future, somewhat culling its kit + burst phase now for more space to grow when the level cap is raised. Though to be honest, I think DRK doesn’t need more buttons to press in burst. I’d appreciate if Square Enix turned its button compressing/cooldown micromanagement attention towards jank like SMN’s energy drain having an aoe and single target button, when they really should just be consolidated into one button that does aoe damage (with falloff, if squenix insists.) Maybe then … we can keep the next lunge
when I checked fflogs today, over 100 pictos have clears, 3 blackmages and 1 summoner
Zero red mages??
@@bolladragon There's 1 non-Picto clear and that has RDM
Red mage has like 23 clears
@@bolladragon RDM is the second most used caster, and it's almost exclusively in double caster + single melee comps
@@Anbob658 Because of dualcast rezzes.
"We'll fix it in 8.0" sounds awfully like "the new busted jobs will make you forget about Pictomancer's unbalance".
Which is wild because they nerfed RPR into the ground in 6.1 if I recall.
@@Scerttle Check the patch notes again then because there was no nerf for reaper except for their healing potency.
@@Scerttle RPR never got nerfed (besides the heal), they just spent the rest of the expansion buffing every other melee instead.
Volpi, lemme tell ya as a 20 year MMORPG veteran, it's not about making you forget. It is far more simple.
Picto sells Dawntrail.
So Picto will find it's proper place by 8.0 because the class would have had its time in the sun and it would be time to share the spotlight with the new classes. (Sad to see that Viper got so forgotten when it was the job I was most excited for and haven't even touched PCT myself.)
I don't mind unbalanced jobs if it means more job identity in the future
as every group, we also had a pct in FRU...
- he decided when things died in p2-p3 transition. when he said "syv, your crystal dies now" it didn't matter if my crystal was on 10% or 30% hp at that time, it would die.
- a common joke was "pct crit? you mean dmg worth my entire burst phase?" (im a warrior but still, it's ridiculous that its true)
- melee died in p3? don't worry, pct just pots and we still overkill it by 5%+
pct consistently is top rdps AND adps, even in full uptime fights, which is ridiculous for an rdps job which isn't even a melee. this is probably the first time a nerf is desperately needed and its not even the gameplay or rotation, it's that every single skill has insane potencies, why?
Ever seen a star prism hit almost 200k? Cuz I see it regularly... That shit is disgusting 😂
@@Irisfantasies no crit, no dhr, solo on a dummy so without party buff, low roll, not bis
@@Irisfantasies me hearing my teammate say "300K" in an EX
Because SE was afraid the job would be dead on arrival after the response given by the media tour.
@@LightTheBlackMage SE really should learn from this. Let it go through live and let a lot more people try it than a couple thousand. because a sample of 10k is a lot more true than a sample of 1k. If the class is dead, then buff it a little. But SE buffed it to the point that you're literally trolling without a PCT 99% of the time.
The ultra wide disclaimer is wild. Witch hunting in 14 is real.
Am confused. Is there hatred towards Ultrawide in ffxiv?
@Irrashaimase1 probably easily confused with zoom hacks
@@TheBen2424 I see now!
yeah the casuals of the community get super salty about anything related to plugins
Game fell off so they got nothing else to talk about, it ain't 2021 anymore.
Meanwhile Viper is on the opposite end of the spectrum and literally gets fucked by encounters with any amount of actual downtime. It completely destroys double reawaken timing or at least lining up 50 gauge with the timing for the free reawaken. And Viper really only has reawaken for its main source of damage
As a RPR, i just think of the "First time?" meme. RPR has had this issue since DSR. TOP was just better designed with not many downtime phases so jobs like VPR/RPR performed way better than in DSR, but DSR and FRU RPR and VPR too feels awful cause of all the short phases. RPR/VPR have the identical burst windows with double awaken/enshroud windows
@@AlalaCrisp rpr was good in both these fights? a party that couldnt get past dsr p2 with rpr was just shit, vpr in FRU p1 does less damage than pranged
This is true for phase 1 at maximum. Viper is MASSIVELY gauge positive, miles more than Reaper. Its bigger concern is getting buffs back asap to start bursting. It takes nearly twice as long as SAM.
VPR needs its buff back IMO
@@DragonWolf69 that changes nothing
this job is SE's fear of nerfs coming back to haunt them. since launch, they have a very straightforward choice between nerfing the potency of one or two spells on one job, or significantly destabilizing every other role by raising hundreds to thousands of potencies in total, thus indirectly buffing the raid buffs (WHICH PICTOMANCER HAS!) that already dominate the meta, and by god they're going to keep doing the latter if it means avoiding a couple dozen angry people on the forums
The issue is the picto problem isnt solved as easily as "nerf potency of one or two spells". You would have to nerf potency of the paintings. But you can't significantly do so without them no longer being viable. Hence you would also need to nerf potency of other abilities. But then you could run into the issue of the job not being at the level SE thinks it should be in full uptime fights(it would basically need to do SMN/RDM damage in full uptime fights to be balanced in ults)
@@florac1995that's fine...
@@florac1995 PCT doing caster damage sounds fine to me.
@@florac1995 So just let it do SMN/RDM damage in full uptime and give it a res.
in a meta where the entirety of balance is centralized around two minute windows, you should absolutely be targeting the potency a job gets to hold under buffs, every time. whether or not that might make it "worse" in some situations is irrelevant; the entire problem right now is that, irrespective of what else you run and what encounter you're in, full uptime or forced downtime, single target or multi target, pictomancer is always better. well-balanced jobs *should* be better in certain scenarios and worse in others, that's what gives you reasons to bring them
I don't appreciate the comment about Aphelios and Yugioh cards in comparison to Pictomancer........mainly because it's too fucking true and I play both of those other games lol
All they have to do is modify potency. They do not need to TOUCH the job's identity or the way it plays. It doesn't even have to be a significant tweak it just has to be somewhat in line with the rest of the jobs.
Jobs should not be designed based on ultimate raids. Very few players compared to the rest of the playerbase actively pursue ultimate clears. That is not to say that the job should not be balanced, but they need to avoid homogenizing jobs so that they can all "raid on equal ground". Back in Stormblood, jobs were interesting and unique, and all jobs were viable despite any flaws they might have had. They need to go back to that kind of design.
Stromblood was peak gameplay !! I miss stromblood …
picto=brawl meta knight
I actually get that reference
Fr
That takes me back haha
Lmao
This is lowkey such a great knowledge and age check lol
They can’t really boost the other jobs to match it without reworking the difficulties of all the encounters, so a nerf is really the only logical response, which makes the decision to leave it be hard to understand.
Because it's awesome how powerful Pictomancer is and how it's better than black mage, which I hate.
The devs are braindead. The solution is simple, yet they'd rather ruin their old content and do 20x the work in buffing other jobs.
Well the thing is, now that the Ultimate is out, they can no longer really buff any jobs without making it trivial. If every job gets further buffed, the Ultimate's DPS checks might as well not exist, and we're gonna start skipping parts of mechs. From now on, they sort of have to nerf PCT and do compensation buffs for a couple jobs if they want to keep the highlight encounter until 7.3 balanced.
@@wackyzap1304honestly I don't even think nerfing potency of Pictomancer fully fixes it.
It's another 2 minute meta problem, Pictomancers 2 minute bursts are insane but its filler is very weak compared to BLM and even RDM (if the RDM is lucky with crits.)
If stary muse was on a 3 or 4 minute CD, and in general raid buff alignment only allowed 2 to 4 big burst periods again unlike the 4 to 8 big burst periods we have under the 2 minute meta I think current Pictomancer would be fine. For ultimates it's a different story because it's the only class that gains massively from downtime.
Agreed, it would even reflect on normal mode content again. Buff everyjob and the alliance raid melts, for example
As someone who has played many an MMO. Giving other jobs downtime tools doesn't necessarily homogenize them. So long as the advantages gained have meaningful differences from one another.
There's a lot of different ways a job can utilize downtime.
Give BRD as special Peloton that works in combat. You channel it, play your harp, and everyone gets a movespeed buff.
Let machinists summon mecha pets durring downtime or lay down traps. If they know the boss is going to move to X spot once they become targetable again, they can trap that spot for an instant burst of damage. Just make any existing traps despawn at the start of any pull to prevent cheese or extra waiting time between pulls.
Let DRK build mana without a target.
Flesh out RDM's white magic kit and let them cast single target shields during downtime.
Give SCH Miasma back and turn it into a lingering AoE poison cloud.
Each of these feel very different in execution, and each has their pros and cons that will cause them to shine on different fights. It doesn't have to be these exact suggestions. These are just examples of what can be done to solve this problem while adding uniqueness to each job.
I will say, as a BLM main, I have enjoyed being able to catch up to PCT on my damage in non-downtime content. I no longer get laughed/trolled out of parties for playing my true love.
I made a reddit post couple days ago where I pointed out the same thing that it's really not a guestion of potency/min. It's the whole job/fight design that is giving PCT massive upperhand compared to other jobs. The comments then were filled with "It really is just potency issue, PCT should do same dps as SMN/RDM and not be there together with BLM when PCT isn't even that hard to play" which honestly was mindboggling.
People can't seem to understand that even if PCT dps on normal uptime content is on the top end, it's not causing any actual issues. It's the low uptime fights like Ultimates where the problem lies due to the very foundation how the job is designed.
What you don't seem to understand is that over the last years they sanded out every edge out of every job to make them cookie cutter homogenized clones, and for a new job to suddenly have a niche is completely contradictory to what has been done. It brings into question why they even bothered kneecapping every job over the years, why the homogenization was needed if they're just going to not just release a job that breaks that mold, but also double down on it by saying it's fine.
If every role had jobs that did better on fights with some downtime or better in fights with full uptime, and the combat design was actually varied and not just full uptime arena fights with 1 ultimate a year that has measurable downtime, then pictomancer wouldn't be an issue.
I think PCT being the 2nd easiest caster but top end of all DPS in full uptime fights is still an issue, because it's not reasonable to expect even half of the people on PCT to perform as well on BLM. They haven't ever balanced casters around the expectation that they will bring top end BLM damage. If you compare M4S 50% rDPS amounts, the gap between PCT and RDM or SMN is more than twice that of the gap between the best/worst melee, and more than what an extra melee LB3's worth of damage would bring (even if it was an instacast ability).
This is on top of having much better mobility with smudge than RDM/SMN and arguably BLM (aetherial manipulation relies on someone being where you need to be), a more spammable selfish or partywide shield than any other caster (every 60s having 20% more HP on the squishiest party member can be as valuable as the partywide 90s one if your healers/tanks aren't giving you single target mits), and the raise tax on DPS never got adjusted despite swiftcast being 40s instead of 60s now. It's more and more likely a healer would be perfectly fine instacasting the rez instead of the RDM/SMN.
All that stuff makes a decent amount of difference in pretty much any setting. If you're in a kinda weak party, you're more likely to keep yourself alive and bring the damage needed to clear. If you're in a good one, the extra damage lets more messy pulls clear (which just feels bad that PCT can be better at making runs with a lot of deaths clear than the rez mages) or clean ones clear while outright skipping mechanics.
I would argue that it shouldn't outperform BLM on full uptime fights, or VPR for that matter, and looking back at 7.05 it was more than 10% ahead of VPR and BLM. It is less of an issue than in ultimates, but I don't see why an easier job should contribute that much more damage. PCT has a problem with potency/minute AND disproportional gains from downtime, both can be addressed by just targeting the Living Muse results. You can drop Pom/Wing/Claw/Maw to 850 from 1100, and Mog of the Ages/Madeen to 500 and 600 respectively, it'd still be comfortably above BLM at that point, but less blatantly so, and would result in minimal rotation changes.
@@MissSmoozie except in that case Living Muse would be a dps loss outside of preparing it for burst. 1 of the best options I came agross was that the dps from painting would be divided into 2 parts, a direct dmg from the cast when an enemy was targeted and the motif, making it work like DNC dance where you can do it during downtime, but some of it's dmg is from doing it during uptime.
As for the performance as I said, in full uptime fights while PCT dps is high, it's not an actual issue. It is higher than it should be, but not an issue. It would be an issue if other casters were left out from extreme/savage prog cause only PCT was good enough, but that doesn't happen cause RDM and SMN are still extremely useful in seeing through mechanics that are not dps checks, which have also been low this tier. Again, I agree that PCT could use a nerf or 2, but just pure potency changes are not the fix.
@@NakedRadish Having it be a loss outside burst isn't necessarily a problem though looking at FRU, you should end up spending almost every charge for a gain, but you can gut Mog of Ages/Madeen completely to like 200 and keep the rest of Living Muse 900 to keep it slightly positive to filler though.
The reason PCT being overtuned in general is important though, as it gives the leeway to reduce the damage enough that PCT becomes good, but not absurd in spotty uptime, while still good in full uptime, iirc the above example is about -12% dps, which still has it be in a good spot, if SE was just willing to take the backlash they could 100% just remove potency and get it where it should be, which is at the very least behind BLM, i.e. it has to lose about 11% dps in full uptime, and that coincides with where it also stops being such an anomaly in e.g. FRU.
The preferable fix to PCT is most likely as you say to tie part of the damage from Living Muse to finishing painting, so the ogcd portion gets smaller, probably make the entire thing barely dps positive during uptime (drop it 100 potency), reduce the potency on RGB with 20, and make the hammer average 500 potency, making it just barely above neutral, it's useful for movement and shifting potency into buffs while naked, and becomes a pure dps gain with gear.
Phys Ranged role is the real issue here, its for the 1% stat increase and that's it. The role needs a complete rework.
RNG is everything in that role.
@mishaelalucoji9620 it's not even rng, if phys ranged is meant to be support then give all the jobs in the role the tools to do so.
Give them the Rez over smn/rdm and give them raid buffs and other supportive tools.
Otherwise, give phys ranged the damage to at least be closer to melee than what it currently is.
naah phys range is good bard and dancer does a good job to buff the picto, just run 3 buff kittens for the picto and you gucci
@@apathy251 as a PCT main I endorse this plan!
@@apathy251machinist steps out from the convo sad sad
Smn & Mch need more love...
... don't want to get excluded from PFs :/
Summoner, Redmage, Mechanist, and Whitemage really need love.
Reaper, Warrior, and Samurai could do with a little bit of love.
Honestly as bad as I feel - I hope people do start excluding from PF. Would give the XIV team a kick up the butt to balance things
@@cablefeed3738 As a SAM, MCH, and SMN player for years, the current state of the game makes me very sad. Tbf, SAM has gotten away with doing a disgusting amount of personal dps for a really long time, so I guess it's not right to complain too much about it not being around the top of the pack at the moment, but it still sucks to see. SMN is just depressing in how little it brings to the table now. And well, I never expect anything good for MCH at this point...
@@OrionXIXIComplain about make MCH cooler. Why not transforming into mini brute justice even the damage sucks. Or maybe freaking gundam with lot of lasor..... But welp.... yeah MCH apart from HW just straight to dumpster fire.
@@Shaen0-92 People locked mch during abyssos and it didn't do anything, why would that change now lol
3:21 - I will never NOT think it looks badass when the Tanks and Melee (and occasional RDM or SMN) gap close at the boss together after some mechanic. It just looks so cool to me seeing them all fling themselves into the action. almost as one.
Thats epic !
I was joking with my discord that the first world first group is the one to clear without pictomancer. I think it was the 24th clear.
Also YUGIOH MENTIONED?
this is what happens when you balance an entire game and content around RP weebs that dont know how to set up their hotbar properly
I've been saying. Downtime? "Laughs in Picto" since launch day.
The fix is in 8.0 is such a hollow excuse. Some of these issues have existed for almost as long as the game has been out.
Picto has only been around since 7.0 though
If the solution is buff everything else significantly, they would need to increase every boss's (at least from endwalker and beyond) HP by like 10-15%
I think the game needs a hard look at potencies across all jobs, monster hp, and general job identify but that is a lot such that it likely won't be a thing until 8.0
And that's exactly why the solution is to just nerf the one job. But Square are too stubborn to do what is logical.
If they buff everything else, then PCT will be shit and guess what.. its gets buffed again and the whole pattern repeats itself. Powercreeping the shit out of old content.
They won't, Square doesn't care about old content. New players barely even hear Shiva's phase 2 song nowadays because she dies after like 10 seconds.
I think Pictomancer is very well designed job for the current level of encounters. The problem is far less Pictomancer and far more other jobs not being kept competitive in both damage and mechanical design.
It feels like they cut corners on the the design of far too many jobs (SMN, RDM and MCH come to mind especially) leaving them practically unchanged. It is little wonder many jobs feel obsolete compared to a job almost tailor-made to deal with the current encounter difficulty.
Like it has been said, Picto being busted in downtime heavy fights isn't a problem in a vacuum, having jobs that excel in some situations over others is fine. But after a decade of restrictive gearing systems and constant role AND encounter homogenization (game is just arena boss fights and no classic mmo encounters, slimes and golems in DRS are the exception), for them to suddenly drop the nuke that is picto, and then double down on it by saying it's fine and it's the other jobs that have to be brought up - then why did the game's variety suffer for a decade? What design philosophy are they even following???
I feel like the easiest thing to nerf would be to make Starry Muse's damage buff only affect the Pictomancer. They'd keep their personal damage, keep the playstyle and rotation, but lose some of the utility that would keep them on top even with the Media Tour potencies.
Honestly, best idea I've read so far
but would this help it against being picked over blm, rdm, and smn? Blm should be top dps
Even if it is the case, in general is like the other jobs are so underpowered right now, it is like they are stuck in old expansions, like Machinist/Bard/Red Mage and so on are, meanwhile Viper and Picto are dominating, you know, the old powercreep. Adjusting PCT will solve nothing, all the jobs are in need of a rework/mega buff to get them back on track; yes, every job works differently, but they need a lot of increased numbers to compete in today's contents. Yeah, PCT is strong and all, but at least compare to contents that have more clear to it, picto loses hard to Samurai and Viper and some other jobs in other contents like the savages and even the extremes, only time will really tell. FFXIV is in need of a serious job balance.
11:43 This. They shouldn't be the highest damage when they have the best mobility ability in the game, a self mit, raid wide mit, raid buff, faster gcd in raidbuff, performs overwhelmingly better than other jobs in downtime, instant casts, auto direct crit abilities, simple rotation. It's like someone on the xiv forums made a OC job with little to no idea of making a job that feels fairly balanced.
Square put themselves on a hard spot by not addressing Picto's bs, because now what can they do? "buff every other job" (again)? then this Ultimate will become a massive joke DPS wise, I've seen clearing groups borderline skipping mechanics with just a PCT, can you imagine if the other 3 dps were brought up even higher? I honestly don't think they can do that, not without touching this ultimate itself, which I don't think they will do.
I always say that the ONE change Picto deserves, and will change absolutely nothing on how the Job plays is the hammer combo, the fact each of it's three hits is a guaranteed Crit Direct Hit has to GO, using tools to see how much each job critted is insane because you see a 30% difference to any other job. If they were to remove that alone the job will remain the exact same in terms of playstyle.
Honestly Square have to rework every other job to balance the game.
The problem with buffing other classes here is, if you buff other classes you also buff picto, as he gives buff, soo if other classes deals more damage, soo does Picto as his buffs gives them more, soo his Rdps will be even higher
They don't dare to nerf PCT because they saw what happened to Helldivers 2 : When you made something too strong and enjoyable, nerfing it to the ground only upsets people. That's why they opt the unconventional route of buffing other jobs. But PCT strengths isn't just the numbers alone, it's rotations and combos are intuitive and straightforward, and holds a lot more advantages against the encounters they designed. All jobs still has to seek for their niche in adapting to encounter designs, while PCT just goes 'hurr durr hammer goes bonk' or 'just paint a happy little tree when boss is untargetable'. That is why buffing other job's numbers is not going to be enough.
Its not possible to buff other jobs up to PCT level. It has a raid buff, so any buff to another job buffs PCTs dmg. I'd say best thing for them to do would be to nerf the raid buff to a self buff and then MAYBE some minor potency reductions
PCT is interesting because people have been complaining about Job homogenization for YEARS. PCT is probably one of the more unique ones in awhile because of how it works, but now we see the downside of that - balance issues.
And yes, I do agree that PCT is entirely too crazy right now, given that it has more raid utility than most any other DPS and yet does more consistent damage than the most selfish of them. But I think the FRU debacle is just revealing what most people didn't want to consider - the more unique the Jobs, the more trouble they'll be to balance.
FFXIV is built on letting a player swap Jobs very easily, encouraging people to try different roles and be flexible. In theory, this works really well with letting different Jobs excel at different things, letting players swap based on the situation. But in reality, many people refuse to swap from their mains, it's a pain to level and BiS different Jobs (especially in different roles), and you end up with a toxic PF environment that just starts locking in certain team comps.
They fucked up by trying something unique while every other job is a copy paste. It stands out so much more.
Fr
yep, people won't be happy until it's homogenized
Picto design is generally positively recieved, literally every complaint is number too big
its not hard to follow
If they homogenize pictomancer, honestly a proper protest would be in order. but people aren't gonna commit to it so we're just going to keep going down that route unless people become a bigger problem on the opposite side of that spectrum.
It's funny how when they try for more job identity people get upset, like this is why homogenization exists, because hard-core players can't stop whining that not all jobs have the exact same damage output 😂
To explain why Picto got that big buff between Media Tour and Live: Players theorised that Picto had a funky AOE rotation. If you did Rainbow Drip into Holy over and over, it was actually your best possible rotation for 2+ targets, according to media tour numbers. And they couldn't nerf Rainbow Drip or Holy's damage because they would then be worse to use in the single target rotation that you get for every 2 minutes. This put them in a pretty tight bind and just forced them to mega buff the Motif damage, but in doing so caused Picto's overall damage to skyrocket. Throw in the downtime boost and it's just going crazy.
And apparently the reason that has been privately stated as to why the job buffs didn't happen in 7.1 was because of the ultimate, and how they didn't want the exact same thing that happened during 7.05 to happen where DPS checks became trivial after major changes. I personally don't agree with that because now it'll be changed just before the 2nd tier of savage, they were never going to avoid buffing just before hard content gets released.
And quite frankly the choice about this is real frustrating to make. They genuinely can't nerf Picto's damage rotation, they have to do the other version and buff everyone else. But they also can't do it to the level required shown by this Ultimate, otherwise Picto would only be playable in crazy downtime fights. The best solution is honestly give them a small full uptime nerf, followed by a change in how Ultimates are designed. We've never had a full uptime ultimate, just specific phases. They'll need to create some to allow other classes to shine a bit more. More ultimates with more mechanics like Hello World and Ultimate Relativity would be amazing to see, and is probably the best answer without gutting job identity. And then they can mix and match between the two, so all classes get to shine.
Also the final cry, PLEASE SQUARE ENIX STOP WITH THE RANGED TAX BS. I'm done with it, I'm so tired by that excuse. There is not a single point in this fight where a physical ranged DPS gets to do something easier due to their freedom of movement. We actually celebrated once we realised that our BRD could do something useful with Warden's Paean into Phase 2. And because of these Picto shenanigans it's physical ranged that are getting slack for it, due to the fact that the majority of a phys ranged's damage is in their ability to keep a boss targeted. Give them more damage, let them actually feel like they can play the game please. I'm seeing so many phys ranged players want to quit because they don't feel valued by the game, and that's not ok.
The funky AoE rotation was removed by just making Rainbow Drip's damage fall off really hard past the first target. The extra thousand-ish potency per minute that they gave the job against a single target wasn't connected to that, it's just another thing that they happened to do at the same time.
I agree on the Phys ranged tax, it desperately needs to go, BRD and DNC can kind of slip through the cracks since they can buff other jobs and DNC can just juice the fuck out of a picto or melee, but MCH is getting ROYALLY screwed over, to the point where its probably going to start getting excluded from PF again similar to what happened in second tier of Pandamonium. I have not seen a single fight yet where the Phys ranged full up time thing has had any type of meaningful effect on their dmg, they are always behind the other 3 dps almost no matter what, the only exception is MCH can potentially be ahead of SMN and RDM but SMN is just a phys ranged in a caster coat, and both RDM and SMN have the Rez tax, which is just as dmging to those 2 casters, especially after Picto's addition to the game, as the phys ranged tax is to all the phys ranged. This tax mentality has got to go for both phys ranged and the rez casters or else it is going to kill those jobs and cause a huge amount of people that play those jobs to just straight up quit.
Summoner's media tour numbers was nerfed for an idiotic reason.
it's the RNG of the job that kills me. your best damage dealing ability is hidden behind a random proc that may or may not go off once to 3 times in a boss fight.
@@privateprinny333 Heck, make it ST, not like it'd cripple picto's aoe.
Picto reminds me of deathknight from WoW when it first came out. It seemed like the devs wanted to make a job that countered all challenges before it somehow and then forgot that every other job doesn’t do that.
This is literally a case of Yoshi P is so afraid to nerf Picto because of the backlash he would get if he did, that he is willing to literally break his game to keep from it.
Funnily enough they're now getting backlash for NOT nerfing a job which sorely needed it.
Why should there be a backlash anyway? Everyone knows how op it is since DT release. They should have nerfed it fast and be done with it.
Ironically enough they might be getting more backlash now compared to whatever vocal minority would've complained at launch for "boo hoo my new job is weaker now".
They nerfed Samurai in Stormblood and Reaper in Endwalker, and both jobs were still among the most popular ones. The game survived, and I don't know a single person who left the game because of a nerf. DT balance is all over the place, and Picto is just the worst of it all. I think the problem here is that the dev team is quite literally lost in the balance department.
@@Cloudo4 Same reason samurai and dark knight were almost universally blocked in PF during early stormblood - ignorant casuals who hear something, don't bother getting the actual details and doing the "mob with torches and pitchforks" gig.
My mother is happy with Pictomancer. Thank you Yoshi-P!
Bad balance will always be bad balance. Took em forever to fix tank balance for shb and ew but looks like the other parts are still worse.
They made a job where their downtime tool also happens to be their primary burst damage tool. That's not en easy problem to solve without changing the mechanical identity of the job. And in a game where job identity is basically a precious commodity that would be incredibly bad.
Outside of just straight up lowering potency across the board for Picto I don't see another way to solve this
You solve it by letting Pictomancer be the most powerful job because it's fun and powerful.
@@cablefeed3738 no
It needs to be a 1:2 combo of nerfing baseline potency and re-evaluating the ultimate formula and, quite frankly, absurd downtime lengths/frequency. There's a lot of phases they could tweak while providing full uptime/unforced downtime. Yeah, maybe melees have to use ranged tools more, at least it's not forced downtime. It'd also alleviate ranged tax. It'd heighten melee uptime skill expression. It'd fix a lot of things getting away from this tired formula of only focusing on mechanics with your weapon sheathed.
@cablefeed3738 nope it's gonna be balanced by the end of dawtrail, it got so out of hand devs will absolutely notice it.
@@cablefeed3738 Then let Summoner be massively overpowered because its fun.
I think when it comes to the point where you are making an objectively bad choice for NOT picking the busted thing is when the designers made a grave mistake
I mean what do you expect when you release an ultimate with a lot of downtime that the job that excels is the job that can paint pictures during the downtime.
This right here. It's like the raid is tailored for jobs that excel at downtime!
How do you counter a PCTs power? Keep them moving.
@@greenjoe21 Which also counters BLMs power. It's hard to win with how damn perfect they created PCT. The real problem is definitely Ranged Physical still. Movement and downtime should be their domain but it still doesn't mean much
@@Valanway fair point! Looks like someone's always on the short end.
the point is, PCT still shredding other jobs when the fight has no downtime
Honestly just redistribute the damage potencies. Lower motif damage and rebalance against core elemental spells if downtime gains are so problematic to the landscape of jobs.
Otherwise sounds like we need more full uptime encounters.
I can proudly say that I haven't touched Picto with an 10 foot long Pole...
I'm an BLM and haven't even unlocked the Job, don't plan to ever unlock it either because simplicity kills my excitement of the Game. I don't hate Picto for being what it is or the People playing it, just don't force me to pick up Picto and we are fine 👀👍
I was watching a stream of Peridot (caster on Kindred, the first team to kill FRU on stream) trying to do some reclears of FRU on BLM. He switched back to PCT after an hour because the damage difference was that much. Peridot is a god tier BLM player.
Peridot doing that is furst of all, sad, and funny at the same time.
In other FFs summoner is usually "weak", so in the MMO I suppose it figures.
as a caster main. i miss being able to play the other ones without feeling like im throwing
more constructively: flamethrower should generate heat. just saying the sentence makes sense and also solves a couple problems with an otherwise struggling job
They could possibly reduce the castime and recast of motifs then reduce the potency of the abilities to make up for it. That way the reliance on downtime is reduced while not hurting the job to much in uptime sections.
"we're gonna bring other jobs up to pictomancer" they say, and then nerf Enochian from 33% to 32% lol
Honestly, considering that ffxiv only has 21 classes with zero build customization, it is a catastrophe that the game is not perfectly balanced every time. Their job seems so easy compared to other games. Think about this again in the context of other rpg's you've played: Every job in this game has exactly 1 build.
WoW has 39 specs, each with talent trees, more interesting gearing (embellishments, tierset bonuses, trinkets) leading to way more build permutations than ffxiv's gigantic number of 1 per class. Just coming over from wow to xiv during endwalker I was pleasantly surprised by the balance. Over time I learned that balancing this game is just a way easier task, now I wonder what the fuck square enix is smoking to take this long to fix balance and acting on community feedback about playstyle changes.
You have them talking about things they're considering to change for 8.0 What the fuck are they doing over there for them to need 2 years to act on community feedback on class design? 21 classes with ZERO build customization. What is taking them so long? What are people going to do if the redesigns for 8.0 still suck? Wait another 2 years? And don't forget that that patch is going to ship with 2 more undercooked classes.
THe XIV community needs to demand more rapid iteration on the game. Especially on class design which is basically the lens through which you view the entire rest of the game.
I started to believe they are working on new MMO .. that why they care less about FF14 ..
from now on, i will just assume that SMN is a bad joke from yoships team
To quote the Ex-black mage now picto player in my fru static at the end of p1: "yo guys I did a million damage in 4 abilities, can we hold for 15 seconds?"
Some pf lock caster slot for picto since few days ago... so, yeah... can confirm with my FRU static, we run with rdm at first, we have to optimize our dps after we hit enrage every phase, just like the usual ultimate on patch mind you. Our rdm decide to switch to picto on p3 transition since rdm kinda suck there. Then we're like 5% or more percent ahead on every phase. Freestyle picto, barely trying. No more dps check, its dumb.
The job and its power is hurting the game. Basically if you play picto you’re smart if you play anything else you’re dumb. With the combination of DT story and picto ff14 is going downhill fast. I’ll be playing poe2 until Yoshi gets his act together.
The dude in charge of balacing mages have no idea what he is doing
Rdm being lower on dmg than summoner whole endwalker expac is baffling and picto being so high right now (especialy on FRU) is ridiculous
Blm should be the highest dps at all time because of the technicity of the job, yet they fuck up everytime
In their mind, it makes sense. Since RDM can chain rez and SMN is otherwise left with nothing, so it must do more damage than RDM.
@@GENKI_INU Yeah i know they love the rez tax but where is the difficulty tax then ? Summoner is close to vegetative state in term of brain power meanwhile you have to be in melee range to burst with rdm, it doesn't make sense
Difficulty should never be taxed. Ever.
It should, summoner should be the lowest job because it's so braindead
@@Gathoderiz Well technically you do go in for smn as well in ifrit phase and swiftcast is never up when you need to raise because you have burn in garuda phase so rdm has huge advance in that department as well. Also death penalty for smn is a lot worse then rdm.
Simply the fact that PCT gets to keep their paintings when they die is insane. Completely antithetical to all other jobs.
Who needs LB when you have 4 pictos 😂
Thats what 100-120k dps constant
Honestly, I wonder how viable that would be for meme clears. 2% less stats and no lb gen, but you have until phase 6 that you actually need lb, so you have plenty of time. Honestly, I’d like to see someone try it, It would be very funny.
I think it's a big mistake that Square Enix does not want to nerf any class but instead increased every other classes power to compensate, because that'll only result in a power-creep spiral of ever-increasing potencies, reducing the difficulty of encounters. If a class is too strong then simply nerf it, period. Have a baseline of "how much dmg/sec should a class do" and adjust it accordingly, regardless of whether it requires a buff or a nerf.
The player perception matters a lot tho. With people being inherantly loss averse, nerfs will feel a lot worse than everything else being buffed by an equal degree. MOBAs (a nod at happy's reference to aphelios) are a good place to see these sentiments.
edit: Thats not to say they shouldnt nerf at all, but they have to find a delicate balance, which would inevitably lean more into buffing others more than theyre nerfing picto
@@lmpoknya People say that PCT is overpowered since DT release. They had plenty of time to nerf it a little pretty fast. Most people wouldnt even care.
just add an artblock debuff where you randomly fail to draw a motif and cry for a few weeks, easy
💀💀💀
💀💀💀💀
Someone said picto is Smash Brawl Meta Knight earlier and the fact you just invented Brawl's tripping mechanic just for pictos is hilarious lmao
@@kirigherkins died in 2014 born in 2024, welcome back brawl metaKnight.
My hot take is that MCH should do almost as much RDPS as the weaker melees (not enough to actually consistently beat them though) since it's "supposed" to be the "selfish" physical ranged so it should theoretically be ABOVE the utility/support DPS of BRD, DNC, RDM, and SMN while edging towards the non-selfish melees like NIN. Instead it's worse than both BRD and DNC while having none of their utility and buffs. But it's still phys-ranged which means free uptime, so it can't be at the same level as the other "selfish" DPS obviously.
And yeah PCT has needed a nerf since day one, there should NEVER be a world where it's doing more than BLM, yet here we are. SAM VPR BLM should always be the top 3 DPS since they have no partywide utility other than default role actions like Addle and Feint. They either need to reduce PCT's damage output, OR completely remove all of it's party buffing and party utility and full commit to it being a "selfish" DPS like SAM, VPR, and BLM.
Ideal DPS Ranking should look something like this, strongest at the top:
SAM/VPR
BLM
Other Melees and PCT
MCH
RDM/SMN
BRD/DNC
Not sure vpr and sam should on same lvl as when it come to complexity vpr is lot lower then that of ninja and many of the other dps and in either case blm should be above them both. Mch should be much higher but perhaps make it a little more risky job to play. I also think need give it a gap closer so it could flex in the 2nd melee slot alot easier.
As a mch main seeing the stats in this ult made me realize our brief moment in the spotlight with TOP was only because of circumstances. We never left the rat tier. And now why would anyone bring us if we can't even buff the picto's damage? Heck picto has their Tempura to cover our one unique thing with Dismantle. I know you said Aphelios, but Picto is more like release Xin Zhao. Meanwhile us mch are removed stun Eve.
Honestly those jokes about giving us Machinists a Defibrillator as a rez skill feels less like a joke and more something we should legitimately start asking for just do we have something handy to bring to raids.
@bolladragon that honestly doesnt sound too bad. Raise through technology, basically what sage does
I'm a white mage main who's currently re-playing FFXIV as a dragoon (just started Heavensward :D). I've never played anything other than White Mage, I don't consume all that much content around FFXIV, and I'm such a casual player that I had no idea pictomancer was so crazy. I've been seeing a LOT of them in the various dungeons I've been working through, but I just assumed the class was fun. Had no idea it was such a hot topic lol
I think even the devs stopped playing their game.
It's funny because at the time it was hard to convince most people that a battle res-less caster could reasonably be allowed in a prog environment.
This is why you bring 2 casters
All the arguments had the caveat "If it doesn't do more damage than the melee".
As someone who played through the degeneration of the WoW content scene, they need to nip this Pictomancer problem in the bud in 7.2.
If you let locked slots and talk of blackballing entire roles sit around long enough it'll trickle down. From FRU to the 7.2 Savage and eventually down to the 7.3 Extreme.
A PCT nerf would just be a temporary bandaid on the main issue. The other jobs need to be better designed but realistically they'll never do that until 8.0 so I can totally see YoshiP bend over backwards and nerf the crap out of it until it becomes completely useless.
I think the job might be more balanced if rgb drew the outline on their motifs and cym gave it color.
This always lead me to the conclusion how SMN is one of the greatest potential jobs yet absolutely left in the dirt. Imagine if it would have that kind of flexibility and versatility as PCT, by for example having Ramuh, Leviathan and Shiva as extra summons with unique capabilities than just having an extra Bahamut doing the exact same thing just cooler and a bit stronger... at this point common modders do better work with jobs than the SE team and that's sad.
Remember when picto announcement and everyone say dead on arrival? Look at the caster right now....picto are everywhere...
?
This is why I've said wait until we get it in our hands
@@seajay7944 The logic was since it didn't have a res it would be stronger than summoner and redmage, but weaker than blackmage because it has a raidbuff and blm is generally harder.
we didn't think about downright incompetent balance practices.
I'm not sure. The discourse when it released, at least on TH-cam seemed to be more polarizing than DoA. Seemed to be either
a) It would be dead on arrival if it couldn't beat the DPS of BLM because why would you bring one over that in a prog setting when it didn't have a rez. The raid buff would have needed to be immense.
b) It would be a 100% pick because the combination of the raid buffs and potential damage would make the others redundant.
The issue here is that people were assuming that phys range would be more relevant. Instead we have comps of 2 casters becoming much more the norm. Seems silly to take a Phys range when you can take PCT/RDM or PCT/BLM. If you want a phys, you take RDM, drop a melee and take a dnc/brd so you can just pump your big hitters.
I'm sure they'll get balanced, but the game is in a wild spot right now with some jobs.
I know that this opinion of mine will be anectdotal, but after we started to fail damage checks in FRU, our raidlead suggested that our black mage should swap to picto. Something that he does not want to do, and he is also performing his rotation perfectly. Just that mentallity feels really weird to have.
Well, good then, the black mage understands how red mage feels either the black mage switches to picto or stops telling redmage to swap for damage.
what about your tanks and healers? are they playing drk/pld + ast/sch?
Even so a PCT does bring more dmg overall, its never a single classes fault if you dont meet the dps check. I have been in so many PF groups and sometimes you just destroy the boss and sometimes you barely make it no matter if you got a PCT or not. BLM is surely not THAT bad that its his fault.
@@Ducksquare They shouldn't have to switch what they like to play either.
@@akiahara idk i feel like its easier to flex/learn 2 healers 2 tanks like idk who couldn't play sch or ast , they share the same gearset too
I think Black Mage could get a 'Spell in Waiting' mechanic for downtime.
Just let BLM stack flarestars like polyglot.
Would help the extreme rigid timing (and help more casual players), helps with downtime and gives nice burst potential.
Or give them something like meditate for ice phase like supercharging despair with it the next time. Would also make ice phase more wanted like ice leylines that freeze you in place for some time
I think the answer is not destroying classes that can use downtimes but either design fights with less of those OR give jobs INTERESTING abilities to use it. And with that I don’t mean just copy pasting things between jobs but interesting spins on their class fantasy like the motives for PCT, Ice for BLM or maybe a battle ready stance for VPR.
Best things I can think of for downtime:
1. a cutscene that freezes timers (so buffs don't disappear)
2. downtime that requires continuous movement (not sure if there are any jobs that can build gauge in downtime while moving)
3. those downtimes in some fights where your character is held by some magical "I cant move or do anything" (I guess functionally this is almost identical to 1 above)
Would probably get old quite quick over the span of several fights though...
Stack pictos and win, who even needs an lb3 anymore.
So if not potency hit, either add battery to all DPS jobs for downtime or debuff to prevent batteries.
If they just left BLM as it was in EW and upped the DPS. This would be a non issue
If they just lowered PCT potency and fixed thunderhead all our problems would be solved
I miss my thunder procs. I miss them so much
The most infuriating thing is that they created Flare Star to kill non-standard lines/gameplay, but completely missed the mark on what was one of the actual reasons (or issues in their eyes) for doing them in the first place, which was that the potency of the Ice Spells you use in Umbral Ice was absolutely pathetic, making it so that by skipping them you will gain dps over the course of a fight.
All they had to do was to make the Umbral Ice phase of the rotation actually worth doing, maybe make it super buff or upgrade an additional thing that you use in the Astral Fire phase, or maybe make Despair or something upgrade Blizzard 4 into a big and powerful spell. They could have perfectly done something like that and leave the non-standard lines alone as an option for flexibility, movement, rotation alignment and correction. Also I still cannot fathom why they decided to gut Thunder like they did and make it way harder to use optimally for the majority of players, contrary to how it was before Dawntrail.
Sadly we live in a reality where the person or group of people designing BLM have literal zero idea of what they are doing with the job.
PD: The big irony is that we now have scuffed non-standard lines back🤣.
@@arxswartz9377 They could do so many things with BLM and fire/ice. Like change Flarestar and add also 6 ice stacks. You can have up to 6 fire and 6 ice stacks but you need 3 each to cast . This should be one of those with 100% crit/dh so it actually matters. The stacks dont go away on stance swap. Now maybe also make ice phase buff ice spells like fire phase buff fire spells and we could actually use B4 to get the ice stacks for this big skill. Would be fun as hell as you could do meaningful damage in both stances while getting your big fat skill together.
They really need to come up with something new. I dont wanna see a 4th poly stack in 8.0. This solves nothing.
If they're worried about the negative feedback that they'd receive by nerfing PCT then they can balance it out by giving phys. ranged players the MCH buffs they've been wanting for the past 5 years and finally fixing it's AOE kit. The cries of the PCT players will be drowned out by the collective cheers of everyone else.
I like when jobs are better in certain circumstances, such as low movement, high movement, burst, or downtime, etc. I dislike homogenization of jobs....which I feel ff14 has been doing a lot of. Picto actually feels like a new job....BECAUSE it leverages downtime in a way that is fun. Its how I always wanted BLM to play....I get to charge up my spells and use them.
I would not mind them hitting the raid buff, because I think this design plays better as a selfish dps anyways. However, that is what the core design of the class wants to be....selfish dps that can use downtime to leverage very high potency uptime. The issue with nerfing them to account for the downtime......is that will make pictos have to cast in downtime only to hit like wet noodles and it will feel rather pointless as a class.
The issue is what makes this job unique and fun and a breath of fresh air is what is also giving it competitive advantages in downtime based fights. And outside of the raid buff, I don't think you can change much on that.
Picto is going to get another buff 100% I am sure of it, have you guys seen the Pictos in DF for dailies and etc. they are all dogshit at the game.
Pictomancer is so powerful that even if you are are dogshit at the game you can still outperform the other dps 😂.
The aphelios comparison is so true lmfao
Picto’s damage is insane, for sure. I’ve seen them rip aggro from tanks during their bursts and have had to fight fully geared 630 Pictos for aggro at times. I tried it out myself and its utility and flexibility are insanely good, especially with a party wide mitigation and busted movement ability.
The problem with it affecting other jobs is higher than ever honestly, MCH and SMN in particular are the most affected, MCH more than any job in the GAME! and the ranged tax which doesn't even need to exist anymore with how strats are always designed around uptime for melee anyways doesn't even affect picto either. It's just such a massive problem that has such a simple solution, but their balance philosophy is constantly going against them, Right now the meta is to just run full buffs to skyrocket a PCT's buffs because like Happy said, 99% of all groups have a pct, and you're basically greifing if you don't have one
Can you explain me what is ranged tax ?
@sag2057 basically ranged tax is the job has lesser potencies/damage based on the fact that they can move outside of the bosses reach while still maintaining uptime. It's there way of keeping the ranged balanced, yet isn't relevant because starts are made for melee uptime
@@sag2057This tax is due to range phy has 100% uptime. But this only happen in the past (below SB era, SHB basically make hitbox bigger again) as at that time the boss hitbox basically small as 4 man dungeon boss and there are lot of away mechanic (thus except MT, other melee can hardly hit it >>> this is why melee has range option as filler). This make overall damage to the boss between dps are the same.
Nowadays, range tax basically stupid. Extreme, ultimate, savage boss hitbox basically really large. Mechanic which force melee to be in downtime or caster to be always move become minimum. Thus it is still insane that range phy still has this tax.
SMN really needed more to be added to it and definitely not whatever solar bahamut was, which only seems to get in the way of what it already had rather than be a step forward. The whole reason for the overhaul in EW was to establish a new foundation from which it could be built up in future expansions but that potential has just not been met from the very first step made after changing it.
honestly the devs total neglect of player feedback is the main reason I wont be playing anymore, its obvious they dont care about what the playerbase has to say anymore
As a SMN main, who is mostly Savage geared with BiS (missing Weapon and chest) and using the same gear for a Picto, AND knows exactly what they are doing as a SMN to play (mostly) perfectly, and knowing how to play picto (but has not mastered the rotations), I can honestly say the difference between the two even in that scenario is fully noticeable. While my test was limited and did not involve mechanics, a full 2 minute rotation, including Opener was around a 25% to 35% difference. I love SMN, I have since ARR. But with Picto as it is I feel I am bringing my static down, by bringing SMN and not Picto. They do not blame me, nor do they ask me to bring something else. Still the difference is so great that it feels bad to play the job I love.
Untargetable bosses wreck our rotation and crash our DPS because our burst is now out of sync with the 2-minute meta for buffs and burst. Having regular Bahamut come out in the burst, or worse Phoenix, instead of the stupid sword dragon which is where our best burst is just depressing.
I do agree a job like BLM should do more DPS per GCD just because of both difficulty and the fact you need to plan your times to cast and to stand still far more then SMN, but it should not be such a great difference that it actually feels bad, or make you feel like a liability.
My personal favorite job to play is MCH. Trust me, I feel your pain.
I say i feel your pain but prioritze your fun instead of the clear. It truly isnt that serious bc the content can be cleared by other classes as well. Yes picto needs a nerf, but dont let it suck your fun away
I don't like that regular Bahamut is still in the rotation at level 100.
People like to bring up old Shb and pre-shb SMN but those were a mess. You had to put in way more effort than other classes, even the top dps, just to contribute above the general average. A result of it being an amalgamated mess of abilities that you had to play back and forth like a piano to get the most out of with out of date mechanisms other jobs had moved past or improved on. by ShB it was creatively gridlocked with no space for new systems or abilities moving forward, due to them trying to build around a foundation which itself was the core issue. Thank god they ripped that out and gave us something not just with more class identity (old SMN was mainly arcanist with airs) but a base foundation for growth in future expansions which could absorb new ideas.
Thing is though the first step forward hasnt really met that potential. We have space for new CDs, OGcds and additional mechanisms for better complexity but instead we got solar bahamut which seems to be tripping over what little we already had. We needed flesh on our bones, and solar bahamut just isnt it.
@@tenjenk My three base requests for changes they can make, that are relatively minimalistic are: Sword dragon REPLACES Bahamut, The primals summoned after Phoenix switch to an alternate set of primals, even if it is just a skin. and finally (I doubt they will give us this) Turn the Ifirt charge into a non closer, and/or break it from the main rotation and into an oGCD.
If we got those three changes I think most SMN would have been happy in DT, as it stands the rework they said most jobs would get for 8.0 has even more to make SMN happy.
I feel they will not do anything until 8.0 that is big and changing for Physical Ranged. but they should nerf Picto and Buff MCH.
man...Picto being compared to Aphelios is a crossover I never expected to hear in an XIV video, let alone from Mr. Happy...
The problem with Aphellios is he is overdesigned with an air of needing a degree in mechanical engineering to effectively use his kit. A literal more apt description would have been Hwei.
Hwei is literally a magical artist, has multiple abilities per paint used and does big damage and provides decent utility to his team. He's not overly complex, much like Picto and just can do whatever he needs. Aoe? He has that. Crowd control? He has that too. Shields and move speed increase? He has that. Zoning and long range attacks? Yeah he has that as well.
We're too far down the rabbit hole to be worried about homogenization. Just give every job and ability to charge their gauge during downtime.
Along with some MAJOR MCH buffs and call it a day.
I progged my first Savage tier purely through PF on SMN and every time I joined a group I had a nagging thought in the back of my head that they were probably disappointed I wasn't a PCT. Which...probably says something.
That literally only says something about yourself, not about Pictomancer
I can confirm this, everytime we got a picto and not another mage, voice chat made a party xD
As a SMN and PCT player, that's definitely a real feeling, but likewise when stuff goes south in a run where you are on PCT, you end up aware of situations where a rez would've saved a pull from being a wipe. But the amount of time I save by just playing PCT and killing the boss faster probably makes up for the extra pulls here and there...
Prog party loves rezzes, not dmg. Now clear party its another story.
Given the studio's penchant for learning all the wrong lessons from everything, I would not doubt in the slightest the philosophy was along the lines of, "Well player feedback says they dont think Picto belongs in FF XIV and dont want to play it.... but if we make it strong, then everyone will want to play it!"
Yeah thats not... Thats not a good response.
One of my issues with Picto is it goes against my usual view of classes, being that classes with buffs should do less than those without, since ones with buffs bring raid damage, while the "selfish" jobs just take. The fact Picto both gives and takes damage, as well as having basically everything but a rez, it really makes you wonder why even bother bringing any other caster when they just dont bring the damage.
Its why I'm happy my statics caster is a red mage, its nice having someone who wants to play a different caster just because they want to.
a damage buff is nothing more than just damage in another form, the other utility I agree with but simply saying like for example reaper should automatically do less than samurai because it has a turd of a raid buff is terrible balance, if anything most 'buff' jobs should have a higher ceiling as it requires a competent party to 'burst' into your buffs to make up the damage vs a 'selfish' job. anyway the job design of this game is awful which is why I don't play it anymore anyway.
Pictomancer's strongest attacks are tied to its motifs (canvas).
Outside of combat, painting them is instant, but during combat it takes some time to prepare them.
And therein lies (most of) the problem: Pictomancer is a job that benefits the most during "downtimes" while in fights (like say, when a boss becomes untargetable).
FF14 has alot more problems right now than......... Picto.
Exactly 💯 some 14 players throw grenades at the wrong targets
Actually atm picto is the main problem that reflects on all others
@@MrCharly780 Then you agree with me. Picto is a symptom.. not the problem.
@@lincolnjohnson4428 no because i think this has to be adressed and its valid people have concerns about it
@@MrCharly780 You are missing the entire point.... Read again then comment.