#AskEck Do you think a return to Coruscant's Underworld (city?) and seeking the Holocron - whatever you want to substitute that with - there (Kylo/Rey returning, essentially); would have been a good way of circumventing "beautiful" Coruscant and creating some level of controversy about the "righteousness" of the Jedi ?
The fact that the sequels had a roaming capital makes me even more angry at how the entire New Republic just disappeared after the First Order destroyed Hosnian Prime. I expected the New Republic to put up a good fight and a roaming capital makes the First Order's sudden galactic takeover make even more illogical. Like if Washington DC was bombed do you thinks the rest of the states would just roll over and let themselves be conquered by a new autocratic regime? No way, they would band to together and fight back. And if the US also had a roaming capital it would be even easier for the government to immediately retaliate. All the planets in the New Republic had their own governments and militaries, I'm sure they would immediately declare war. They would be even more inspired to fight since they just defeated the Empire 30 years ago and would not want to fall right back into a dictatorship. Plus, the First Order's most deadly weapon (Starkiller Base) was just destroyed meaning the enemy is most vulnerable.
Yeah, it undermines the idea that the government could be taken out in a single shot. Even with the new cannon's take on legend's Galaxy Gun. Multiple systems should have had all of the basic infrastructure in place for the government to instantly restart following lines of succession. That and the random demilitarizing of the New Republic in cannon is really contrived and arbitrary. There is no rational reason for the New Republic to demilitarize and reduce its forces to pre-clone wars era levels right after a major war. The fall of the Empire in cannon is not nearly as convincing as the imperial civil war in legends was on top of that.
@@mcsmedia8081 Especially when you consider that the First Order began with Imperial fleets disappearing into the unknown regions. What, was the New Republic like "Naw, they won't ever come back with those ships and wipe us out. Nonsense."
*His visuals have their own problems. There's too much shit cluttered all over to focus on anything and soak the visuals. And everything moves and transitions too fast.*
It feels like it’s all happening within the orbits of a few planets in a solar system, like here in real life instead of the feeling of hundreds of possible planets
Have a capital that's relocated every few years, even if its decades, sounds like a logistical and bureaucratic nightmare. Especially considering a galactic scaled government.
Here in my country we tried that after we got our independence from Spain. Plan was to change the capital every 4 years. Thing only lasted 2 years and ended up causing a short civil war.
@ClandestineOstrich Its marketing wasn't ineffective. These movies did not tank. They were pretty profitable: The Force Awakens is the 4th highest grossing film of all time.
@@theothertonydutch That TFA would be profitable was a given. It was the restart of a franchise with a generation-spanning inbuilt fanbase. The movie not being in the top 10 highest grossing movies would have been a surprise. The ones that are relevant are Rogue One , TLJ, Solo and ROS. They are the ones that had to stand on their own merits and could not count on the droves of inbuilt fans on the name of the franchise alone. And ultimately they didn't. Of these, the first retold a story Legends already told with interesting characters (that go on to influence the story for decades) with (IMHO) bland characters that all die at the end. And answered question nobody was asking and that got answered elegantly in other Legends material. Seriously, knowing how many big projects in our world suffer from bad design, even critically so at times, there was no need for deliberate sabotage by the designer. And the way the plans were stored, nobody but the forgettable action girl main character could have gotten them, which ultimately means she lucked out in that her dad used her old nickname as project name/password (I don't even remember which it was) instead of something that would have allowed any rebel spy to get the plans. Decent movie overall, but to me it will always carry the stigma of sealing the fate (or lack thereof) of one of my favorite characters in the new canon. The next left me not only dissatisfied, but actually angry of how little respect it had shown the existing movies. And the one that would follow, not reworking the movie to account for the tragic RL-fact of Carrie Fisher passing away (a year before the movie was set to release) made it that much harder for the next movie to be made and most likely cost it the original director. Which is something I actually would have understood if the movie we got was actually good. After TLJ, I had no motivation to see Solo and RoS, and everything they put out in terms of trailers just made them look worse. So I would actually say the marketing not only was ineffective, it managed to drive at least me away even further. And to top it off, regarding the original post: if the new canon actually tried to define itself, they probably should not have made the main characters bad copies of Legends characters. Or better yet, instead of reinventing the wheel (but worse), they could have taken Legends as a baseline, streamlined it and made selective retcons (like not dropping a moon on Chewbacca, if they want to keep him around) and would have had a host of developed everything to draw from. Instead we got the head of Lucas Film stating in an interview that there is no source material to draw from, ignoring the fact that half of the new characters are bad copies of characters in this non-existing source material.
@@barbarianjk2355 no the same fans were the ones bitching about the prequels because it’s not what they wanted. The key words NOT WHAT THEY WANTED. That’s why Lucas quit making Star Wars movies after the prequels. He said in an interview while bother putting all this effort in for the fans just to complain.
I think it’s a little overrated, to be honest. The place is a garbage heap underneath the shiny surface. Lusankya taking off showed how it’s one tectonic event away from a disaster.
@@Bluesonofman After having been made fun of for liking even some aspects of the prequel trilogy, it amuses me that suddenly they're the "good Star Wars" that everybody wants to return to.
I remember being upset that "Coruscant" was destroyed in episode VII, then later learning that it was actually Hosnian Prime and instantly not giving a shit anymore
@@KaiHung-wv3ulJJ wanted to blow it up but Lucasfilm stopped him. Hosnian Prime was supposed to be Coruscant but they renamed it, probably for fear of backlash. Starkiller base is illum, where the Jedi get their crystals in the cartoons, but I doubt JJ chose that.
I don’t think Coruscant “isn’t dirty enough”, in fact, it’s quite dirty, shifty, and grimy just a few hundred feet down from where we see most of the action there. That whole undercity is supposed to be a sordid hive, and is super underexplored imo.
Coruscant was originally intended to be a very dark and dirty place. The bright neon glitter might make Coruscant the jewel of the empire, but it also makes it easy for threats to lurk within blinding glares and crowded shadows. starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_Underworld
Yeah, the clone wars has shown off a lot of the world. Each level down you go the dirtier and dirtier it gets. We don’t even know which side of corusant we’re on unless we’re in view of the temple or senate. It’s just such a big planet and is super under appreciated
I'm one of those who just like to ignore everything after 6. It's legitimately terrible in almost all aspects. Unlike the prequels, time will not save it; it has no redeeming parts.
Everyone says time will not save it. That doesn't seem like a point that can reasonably be made without time. Minimum ten years, then people can say "time didn't save it". People (including myself and several in my age group) are lenient on the prequels because we grew up with them. So I'd say just wait.
@@jamesgiblin9134 The difference is the prequals are full of creativity and have their own vision and plot, and mesh well into the overarching story. There's also been the Clone Wars which showcases the good in the prequal era. Their dialogue was bad and some of the writing wasn't the best, but I think one can really appreciate the passion and ideas present. The sequals are tired rehashes of the original trilogy which just seems to be trying to replace it. There's nothing new to capture the imagination.
I would say that time will not be save the sequels the same way for the prequels. I mean people will probably have a soft spot for them and consider them to be superior films, but if they look at them as a whole, they won’t be as good stories. And any of the retcons or additions to the story will have to be pretty good to justify any of them, which I believe will be a lot harder considering they had no grand plan.
@@Janx14 Exactly. The prequels had a cohesive plot; it was just given a poorly written script. The story itself is actually good. Put the Clone Wars series on top of it all, and it isn't just acceptable, but outright good. Also, whilst the Old republic era might not be canon, it's my headcanon. I personally find that era as far superior to the actual current era.
Imagine episode 7 starting out showing the prosperity and strength of the new republic and Luke's revived jedi order at the jedi temple with some epic John William's music.
That's exactly how I thought it should have been! The first fifteen minutes of the movie catches us up with Luke, Leia, Han and their children, as we see how prosperous and peaceful the galaxy has been for the last decade. Then, the bad guys strike . . .
They didn't even have to go that far, we would have been happy if they just said "Yeah, so we're just gonna make film adaptations of the Heir to the Empire trilogy."
Instead we got to see them back to square one of ANH like nothing had changed after all these years. Might as well just said that the rebels beat Palpatine and the Death Star but lost the war and had been trying to resist them ever since. It makes no sense why they defeat the empire and then all of the sudden this new enemy appears years later and they immediately go back to small bases in the middle of nowhere with a small force rather than a new fleet
That's what made me really feel empty about this trilogy. All action, no politics or talk about the rest of the galaxy. I wanted to see what the aftermath of the empire's fall was like and the rise of the new republic in the eyes of the galaxy on screen, to make me feel like this is actual star wars... a galactic conflict, not a small plot about edge lords and untrained maggots fighting each other
I agree, there was a sense of disconnect with this series, they seem to have forgotten that it is about a galactic struggle, happening across many systems. Just a few scenes discussing the state of the galaxy would have gone a long way in making it feel like a conflict that actually affected a lot of people
All you needed to know the First Order was bad and menacing. It is funny because even when the Prequels had lots of politics to explain the situation of the galaxy, B1 battledroids, clone troopers, planets like Geonosis, Coruscant, Kamino and Mustafar all became iconic for an entire generation. Heck even the original trilogy had resemblances to tangible politics: "We are on an diplomatic mission." "If this is an connoisseur ship, where is the ambassador?" "The Imperial Senate will no longer be any of our concern. I have just received information that the Emperor has dissolved the Senate and given power to regional governors." With the Sequels it is just run to room, bang bang, shooty shooty. The bad guys are hilariously evil. The geopolitics of the galaxy are a rip off of the original trilogy except without tangible substance.
Lots of great books and comics to read if you want to know more about what happened after ROTJ and the political ramifications of that. I recommend the Aftermath trilogy of books. Alphabet Squadron by Alexander Freed is pretty good too.
Eck- "The sequels have been trying to find their own identity" Me- looks at everything copy and pasted from the original trilogy while simultaneously avoiding anything prequel related
@@michaelszilagyi4529 Well yeah. They weren't good movies (especially AotC). They had some good to great moments and Revenge was almost there. Turns out when the quality isn't there, people aren't happy.
@@UnknownUser-gd3ls AotC (and arguably Phantom) is a an objectively bad movie. It had some good cinematography and great music. Everything else, dialogue, acting, choreography, etc was bad. Revenge was the only one you could make a decent case for being more good than bad.
@@ZaZi-Zeta01 It really wasn't. The line delivery was atrocious. And not just from Anakin. I'm not putting that completely on the actors mind. Like I said previously, the dialogue was partially to blame and so was the direction.
Coruscant: a developed world with fascinating history and truly limitless possibilities (and it has layers like an onions each darker than the last, literally and figuratively) Hosnian Prime: a world that we saw 5 seconds and gets destroyed with other planets Jakku: Tatooine 2, now with Star Destroyer scraps and Mary Sues! Ach-To: Because Beak-less birds are cute Exegol: “I have millions of ships with tiny guns which all have the power of the Death Star!” -Palpatine before bass boosting the rebel fleet Coruscant: I am a joke to you? Edit: more stuff
At least Coruscant can live on. I was really optimistic we would return. But I guess that is saved for another time. Disney just hates prequel era fans lol
I didn't even know what planets were destroyed in TFA I thought they were just some random planets. The whole trilogy disney made was a mess of meaningless characters, events and unnecessary stupid story. The only thing disney has done right with Star Wars is Rogue One and The Mandalorian.
I would’ve loved to see the original battle of coruscant that they were planning for episode 9 because the one in Revenge of the Sith is my favorite SW space battle
Fans : Hey let's see some of the big cities and mega technological worlds! What we all praised in the prequels. Disney : Here's more sand worlds. And plain rock worlds. Ohh and salt worlds. And worst thing is they almost did that with canto byte. But then they just went full 20th century casino instead of actually being innovative and Sci fi esque. Fuck the people they hire suck...
You can't blame the writers, though. It isn't their fault Kennedy hired people who had no experience writing science fiction, or looking at their resumes, much at all.
@@analtubegut66 The question is what of the people who don't grow up with the Legends lore. The silent majority of people who just watch the movies. In my experience the normal non-fan people usually say the sequels are better than the prequels already. Whether this will grow or shrink with time seems the question.
I love how there's sequel fans in the comments trying to defend it. I like the prequels a lot, and I understand they have severe flaws, but I don't have the urge to defend them from rational criticism. I think this says a lot about the sequels in general.
OOM- 32 the thing is, there are no severe flaws in the prequels at all. I swear people act like there’s like 20 plot holes created in the films or something when in fact there’s none..
@@mackmitchell94 agreed. The prequels tell the story of how one man (palpatine) can take hold of an entire galactic government and how a man with good intentions can become one of the worse people ever in the galaxy, and they tell it pretty darn well.
Episode 7 damned the whole trilogy because it had no politics to establish the political landscape of the galaxy at that point in time. We have no context for how the Resistance operates and what the Republic is doing. The First Order as well. Coruscant was essential to the trilogy. I hope we see it in The Mandalorian with the lower levels.
As Mauler put it, " You know why the sequel films have shit worldbuilding? It's because of all of the people who hated the senate scenes [from the prequels]."
Without politics you cannot have an understanding of war. Without understanding war, you cannot have Star Wars. It’s literally about a galactic civil war, without any context about either side. Sure, maybe the prequels went to deep with trade blockades and no confidence votes in the Senate, but the factions were clear and the forces behind them distinct.
@@m.c.martin I'm aware of that. It's just that when people complain about politics in Star Wars, they typically refer to the examples presented in the prequels, while ignoring that the OT had them too, albeit to a smaller scale.
"Coruscant was in open rebellion against the First Order..." The planet? The entire planet was at war with the First Order? Alone, with the entire rest of the New Republic wiped out and the Resistance in hiding, Coruscant is fighting the First Order? Fucking hell, why wasn't *that* the entire movie? That would've been badass.
2 and a half hours of the Courscanti undercity dwellers using Guerilla Warfare to drag occupying forces into ambushes below the surface, fighting in alleys and sabotaging depots and garrisons. Give Please
Seeing how this has all played out, in hindsight I don’t think the story group had as much figured out as we believed. They probably didn’t want to touch Coruscant because they didn’t know how everything would shake out in Episode 9. I will point evidence to how disjointed episode 8 was from what TFA established, the story group probably wasn’t that involved, thats how Rian Johnson was allowed to subvert everything. I do think there was a “forget the old ways” or “let the past die” going on quietly in management at Lucasfilm (trying to create their own legacy 😴)
I've seen interviews that suggest the story group didn't have hardly a thing figured out and weren't working together. The whole project was super mishandled and Kathleen Kennedy (President of Lucas Films) , in a super softball interview question, wasn't even able to say she was a fan of Star Wars. Luckily, I've also heard that there is change coming, and people like Dave Filoni will be having more input going forward. But, I guess we'll just have to see.
TFA Established nothing that was good! In fact what did it establish at all!?! That the First Order somehow not only existed but was powerful enough to wipe out the New Republic in one fell swoop - Totally illogical! TLJ has its own problems but it is a far better movie than the abomination that was TFA! AND obviously than the complete Mess that is RoS! TFA left out any and all BACKSTORY relying entirely on TLJ and RoS to make up for this - Which neither movie was able to do! TFA Destroyed Han and Leia! TFA told us that Luke had run away and hid! Stop blaming TLJ for that, it was set in stone by TFA! TFA Gave us the whiny Man-Baby version of Kylo Ren - A character that is far better in BOTH TLJ and RoS! TFA Rey is by far the most "Mary-Sue" version because at least the other two movies didn't create her in the first place and were able to provide her with some {not much but some} character and training! TFA decided that you could somehow shoot a laser from one star system to another in the blink of an eye NOT YEARS as it would actually take! TFA gave us the cowardly version of Finn who was almost redeemed by TLJ until Rose had to get in the way! And was returned to being just a follower in RoS! TFA is a DISGRACE to Star Wars! TLJ isn't Star Wars at all....How could it be after TFA!?!
Actually though, Coruscant was shown ever so briefly in Rogue One during a flashback showing Krennic and Galen Erso at an Imperial function. Lore has also been added for things such as Celestial Power having a headquarters on Coruscant.
@@x3j505 Same goes for TCW and some of the books. I really don't get the problem of Coruscant losing galactic importance after losing both the Jedi, the Senat and eventually whatever Imperial institutions it had.
"The backlash they received in their heyday" Actually, I'm old enough to remember a time when people were comparing RotS to Greek tragedy. Sure, everyone knew the dialogue was a bit hokey, but the hate against the prequels is a pretty recent (2010's) phenomenon.
I'm old enough to have gone to see the original SW in the theater and drive inns. No idea how many times I saw it as a kid lol. But I do remember when the prequels came out how much I hated most of the first movie and felt meh about the second and did enjoy the last. But also I remember that pretty much everyone everywhere hated them or at least the phantom because of the stupid anikin kid and jar jar. The others where bad because of the actors and dialog but at least the characters where not horrible.
@@kevinsb70 Hayden Christianson actually is a pretty decent actor, but George isn't good fit for him as a director. Also, I was a fan of Obi Wan because of the way his character developed alongside Anakin, and would honestly would have preferred a more Shakespearean telling where Dooku killed Qui Gon. Revenge of the Sith is defiantly my favorite out of all of them because Sidious' betrayal and declaring himself Emperor al a Shakespeare's Caesar.
@@KRYMauL totally agree. All the actors from the movies where good in other movies but sucked in star wars....all the star wars was horrible for acting minus one or two people per movie. Lucas must just like bad acting and stiff delivery.
@@kevinsb70 He was supposedly known for saying faster and more intense. His strong suit is with actors like Harrison Ford or maybe RDJ who don’t need must direction on direction.
person person Of course every company wants money, but at least some do it for money *and for passion* and are actually creative and do sufficient research
...are you implying that Lucas didn't want money? Do you know how merchandise driven Lucasfilm was even before being sold to Disney? Also how do they make more money by using a planet less in movies? The main change in Lucasfilm has been Lucas himself leaving, which was going to happen anyway, and Kathleen Kennedy becoming director (which was George's choice not Disney's, by the way). Also, Disney doesn't control the story of the films nearly as much as some fans think, Lucasfilm remains in charge of the storytelling decisions. I love Star Wars as much as you do but it's always been about money--not only money, but still.
Darth Kwame but he cared about making money to reinvest in film tech innovation and enable his vision. It wasn’t greed, it stemmed from passion and a commitment to his craft. KK and Disney evidently don’t care about the story so it’s very different.
Exactly - I didn’t enjoy TFA and TROS at all because I feel like I’m watching an inferior version of something I’ve already watched before. And to repeat the same story lines actually makes them more stupid.... for example one would think that a mistake such as not guarding the shield generator good enough would be a lesson the first/final order would keep in mind, but nope
I’m still disappointed we didn’t see Coruscant, we could have made some great callbacks to episode 3. I still say Rise of Skywalker should have been two parts and the way finder should have been in the Imperial Palace. The climax of part 1 should have been a battle to liberate the planet while Rey and the Kylo had their duel in the former Jedi Temple.
2:01 and most importantly, it's the most populous planet in the galaxy 4:28 I think the reason is that it would remind people of the previous films... and how even the prequels were leagues above the new trilogy 5:50 well... they knw they were incompetent enugh where they would cause contridictions
My personal feeling is that they wanted everything new so they could sell merchandise based on new intellectual properties so they can cut ties as much as possible with the old stuff. They don't want the old fans because they are going to be the most critical and least likely to want to spend more money if they feel Disney isn't doing a good job. They want the new fans almost exclusively since the old fans are going to be the ones likely to say "hey this isn't as good as the old stuff" and are going to be willing to hand down their old merchandise to the new fans.
Unfortunately it's the old fans with the money to spend on the merchandising. So between alienating the old fans and writing crapy characters, the new merchandise didn't sell.
@@Mitheledh star wars is completly dead now, no one i know liked any of the disney star wars movies, its the best if we just boycott it all together and make disney regret their decision, and lucas his
There are videos on this very topic. Badrobot, JJ’s production company gets a cut of the merch sales from new content, hence why they go out of their way to only use new stuff.
I mean, why do you think the Prequels never really featured any of the planets from the original movies aside from Tatooine? It's crazy how people don't seem to realize that Disney is doing nothing new here.
Disney’s goal is to pretend years down the road that they always owned Star Wars, and acknowledging an planet that iconic that they didn’t invent makes that harder.
Although, if they kept everything more together, it would seem like one big thing, owned by Disney, rather than just the Star Wars before Disney and after.
My future kids won't ever know anything after 6 exists. I won't show them the Disney shit. . Their plan is, like you said, to claim they've always owned Star Wars but the irony is so many fans will not pass down these movies to the next generations.
Trevorrow's Episode 9 would've been just as bad, if not worse, than _The Rise of Skywalker._ Anything that came after _The Last Jedi_ was doomed to fail.
I think while it would been a mess it would of still of been a Star Wars movie. Themes were in keeping with the saga, had story progression as well as substantial world build. The one of the best parts of Star Wars. Unlike that thing
@@justinreeves2696 What about Rian Johnson? He single-handedly destroyed the entire sequel trilogy with one movie (objectively the worst Star Wars movie of all time) and butchered the character of Luke Skywalker, not to mention how he threw new characters like Poe and Finn under the bus. J.J gave us one good movie with _The Force Awakens,_ the Johnson completely threw out whatever was accomplished with the first movie to satisfy his own ego, leaving J.J to pick up the pieces.
That's like saying we shouldn't have had cars because some people cant operate a horse properly. A flying car would probably be different than a normal car too.
@@kinglukethe7th524 eh...the death toll from flying cars would probably far exceed automobile deaths. You're adding in a lot of factors to safety besides the lack of proper power generation and the technology that would utilize it. Flying cars would probably need a lot AI assistance if you were talking about something like Star Wars speeders.
@@oliveragag8576 That would have been the best but there are a number of official and de-facto trilogies which would have been a marked improvement over the big reset.
look, I get that a lot of people don't like the prequels and for good reason, personally I like them but that's only because I was a child when I watched them. but either way as bad as it objectively is.... It also some really deep and compelling ideas an concepts behind it.
As well as the sequels. The ideas, and concepts, are interesting, but the final product is questionable, if not bad... One thing that me made realize how bad the prequels really are was the prequels month by Linkara from "a top the fourth wall" After that i became more angry with people that now worships the prequels just to shit on the sequels... They are bad movies, that sometimes are worse than the sequels... Except.for the rise of the skywalker... That i like, but its really bad.
I loved the prequels. Ever since I heard Luke & Ben mention the “Clone Wars” in ANH, I wanted to hear more! I grew up wondering how Palpatine tricked everyone and turned the Republic into the Empire. And, we got to see Anakin’s arc as well? The prequels deserve far more credit than they’ve received.
@@maestro3947-b9g Not really, prequels give large world for us to fantasize (Coruscant , Mustafar , Kamino, Geonosis , Kashyyk , Utapau? , and Naboo )while the sequels give us basically recycled planet with different name.. ( Jakku, Exegol and Hosnian Prime) The only planet that I like is Crait because I never seen such planet like that before
@@aurorauplinks yes. But then i stoped. Didnt fall off with me. But the cartoon dont wipe off the problems with the movies. I have a similar opinion as Linkara in this regards: the movies should've offer enough character development for itself. But at the same time i understand now what lucas expected: i launch a half baked movie. And complete with comics and games and a cartoon. More money. (Remember that when the revenge of the sith came, there was not the clone wars 3d, just a game, the republic comics - a fine addition i must say - and the 2d cartoon)
In TFA they mention core prequel concepts like "balance or the Force" or the "Sith" that were not in the OT. So, I do not think the unexplained capital change to a generic planet was done for this reason. Rather, the real reason was historical: I think it was more like they wanted to rehash ANH (but bigger) and thus blow up the capital. But they were worried to blow up Couruscant because (i) it might been interpreted as a Prequel/Lucas bashing and (ii) as a blatant disrespect of the lore - remember the backlash when JJ (stupidly and disrespectfully) blew up the planet Vulcan in Star Trek 09 just for the lens flare?
I wouldn't mind destroying Coruscant if it was treated with respect and built up as an emotional moment. Destroying Vulcan sucks, but at least in that movie it was treated seriously because we see both Spock's emotional reaction to it.
You know something that still gets me angry is Kuat. We have never seen Kuat on screen before! I wanted to have hope that in the Mandorlian season 2 we would see Kuat. It would be neat if we could see Kuat making first order star destroyers. It would also make my day if Kuat was building Palpatine's secret fleet of star destroyers in episode 9! Because the only place in cannon that can make that many star destroyers is Kuat Drive Yards!
Ive never understood the fixstion among stsr wars fans with "the gritty, lived in design of the original trilogy". That reslly only comes in with the falcon (which was always portrayed as barely flightworthy and horribly behind on maintsnce) and Mos Eisly in general. Blaming the prequels for not looking like a ship thats falling apart is strange to me.
It's a nice contrast, what we see in the prequal trilogy compared to the originals, especially the different cultural styles. Take episode one for example. There's no galaxy wide conflict and our main planet of reference is a paradise world in Naboo, where everything is either highly exotic (Gungan tech) or just extremely streamlined and artistic (the Nabooians culture and tech). In contrast the war machines of the Republic Army in episodes two and three, have an emphasis on practicality over aesthetics, getting less fancy and more simplistic as the war continues. Eventually giving rise to the classic imposing Imperial style we're so familiar with as well as the cultural mishmash of ships the Rebellion uses, each built for efficiency with no cares for how pretty the ships are. Yet we still get some glimpses of exotic ships from differing cultures, namely the twin pod Cload cars of Bespin or the unique design of Mon Calamari ships. It's all relative, an opulent setting will have opulent stuff, while a tyrannical setting is going to have people using a minimalistic approach in how they design things.
The refinement of the Republic was hinted to by Obi-wan as far back as ANH? My expectations were fully met with the more elegant ships, uniforms, etc. The opening scene of TPM blew my mind. It was very “Star-Wars”, especially with its digital audio. I watched TPM over and over on Laserdisc (sourced from Japan) some 20 years ago. Thankfully, the films would be released on DVD by the time AOTC was released.
I feel like it could have been Kathleen Kennedy's fault for the lack of prequel content in movies, she clearly trying to seperate her trilogy with the older trilogy's, the change at galaxies edge and the lack of Hyden Christiansian( butchered the spelling I know) are evidence of this.
This is what happens when you hire and put in charge incompetent idiotic insane writers and dictators who don't give a damn about the heart and soul of Star Wars or the continuity to run the show. You know what you get? A rotten corpse of a once beloved franchise that has been horrible mangled from the inside out.
Disney Star Wars has a lot in common with 343's Halo. New people come in, eager to carve their own version of a beloved franchise, they introduce new (disappointing, minus a few) characters and enemies, create a boring, (almost non sensical plot), change things that were perfectly fine, mess with beloved characters (more Star Wars than Halo really) and just generally piss of loyal fans of beloved, long running franchise just for a quick buck. I only hope that Disney will learn from their mistakes the way 343 did. I'm not saying that the people creating Star Wars don't love it, but as with 343 - the people in charge need to compromise their vision what fans want or else the next generation won't get to love the franchise nearly as much as we did. Or in Disney speak: YOU COULD BE MAKING MORE MONEY!
@@emberfist8347 Yavin 4 was the first, but as the years passed, he established temples in other planets, such as: Ossus, Endor, Corellia and Dathomir. He even made a new one on Coruscant, but it was later destroyed by the One Sith Order.
I wanted to see Luke actually be competent at all, instead of the washed up "Oh my nephew is going dark, I better kill him in his sleep, not like I've ever redeemed anyone from the Dark side before."
@@colbyjohnson5788 At the end of the movie there was a montage of planets rebelling against the First Order and one of them is the forest moon of Endor
@@zico739 Out of all of the liegitmate weirdness and missteps of the Old Canon (I still love it to death though) you pick the fact it encompasses 25k years of inuniverse history to draw the line? XD
I concur. When I look at the old EU's timelines and the 7 eras that it evolved into with varying levels of cannon, permitting lots and lots of fan customization for their head cannons, I just sigh at the emptiness of the new cannon's timeline. 25,000+ years of time to play in, with lots of space to work with, meant that the there was tons of space to play in. The story was really growing in both directions from the zero year. All the detail, levels of cannon, and contradictions were fuel for countless hours of conversation. Still are as proven by all the content on Ekk's channel and other notable channels. The old EU had enough content for detailed resource books like atlases, biology books, books covering military hardware (each item with distinct designs, numbers, dates of production, etc) and even distinct in-universe cultures and holidays (like Life Day, loved and hated by many). New Canon is just empty by comparison. It'll take Lucasfilm 40 years or more to develop their new cannon to a point where it contains a comparable amount of content, and they didn't start off well by any means. The only part of the old EU that is still active is Bioware's SWTOR mmo, which has some good story telling.
I feel like JJ just had the mindset of “prequels bad” when I think it would have been SO cool to see the sequels tie concepts from the prequels and OT together more
It’s been in the books. I remember it was in Inferno Squad, Leia: Princess of Alderaan, and Lost Stars off of the top of my head. It was cool to see it under Imperial control, plus the Jedi Temple has been fleshed out in prequel-era content like Master & Apprentice and Dooku: Jedi Lost, but I always wondered what happened to it after Episode VI. It would’ve been nice to see it again in IX.
"I just want an excuse to read the books" explains very well why as a dedicated reader of what is now called legends, I've not been engaged with any of the new canon EU content. I've checked out maybe 1 or 2 books and nothing has felt meaningful. Possibly because they made legends out of the stories I grew up with, but the lack of anything really large and engaging is part of it. I think you nailed it
Perhaps one of my biggest issues with the sequels was how small they made the galaxy feel again. The OT felt like the Galaxy wasn't as populated and more empty than it actually was. The prequels gave us a vastly populated and a very large Galaxy, but instead going off of that, they tried to make it more like the OT and it just made me not care about the planets or Galaxy itself anymore
True or not, it's certainly suspicious isn't it? If nothing else it's Disney marking their territory by using Lucas' stuff as little as possible. And the Rise of Skywalker? Disney wouldn't have had so many callbacks there if they hadn't been scrambling to recover from The Last Jedi.
This reminds me so well of something I've seen regular in corporations, those on the ground spend a ton of time coming up with a solution to a problem, including testing out tons of ideas. Finally everyone agress on what to do, but should the head of the dept be replaced before the fix is implimented the new guy ALWAYS scraps the plan and decides on something unevaluated or tested, so they can claim credit for all if it, and it almost always invariably fails, and they blame everyone but themselves.
When the character that crosses over most from one book series to another is Commandant Deenlark from the Royal Imperial Academy on Coruscant, you know you have a problem.
One of the things I love about the Heir to the Empire adaptation that DarthAngelus is doing is seeing Luke and Leia on Coruscant. I'm not a prequel fan but even I would have gotten a kick out of more nods to that in the sequels, like maybe the Resistance was using captured Venators alongside Imperial Star Destroyers against the Resurgents. Or Rebel troops using stolen and repainted Clone Trooper armour. It's the same way I wanted actual X-Wings in Revenge of the Sith instead or ARC-170s, to show there's a progression of technology over the whole saga rather than every trilogy stopping and starting.
I dunno how that'll work out. As much as I think that would be a good idea at this point, others might not think the same. I've always felt like Star Wars should have a pretty solid mythos with no alt timelines. Star Wars is a Fantasy epic in Space, alternate continuities almost feels like it cheapens the brand in a way. IDK, I just feel like something like that won't happen.
@@jaredmartin2003 Legends already is an alternate continuity. They are still selling the old novels and stuff, just not really adding anything new. Though there is some new stuff added to Legends via SWTOR. There are also other alternate timelines from before Disney in the form of Infinities.
1:38 Wait, so if the capital was always moving ever few years, wouldn't that make it that much more difficult for the First Order to "control all the major systems within weeks,"? If you have multiple planets, systems, political organizations and peoples/species that have experienced direct New Republic rule and posses some knowledge of galactic affairs, wouldn't they have an advantage over a First Order that was confined to the shadows of the Outer Rim and Unknown Regions, and was motivated in part by feelings of nostalgia towards a long dead and hated regime? Wouldn't they have been more than a little 'out of touch' and be faced with widespread opposition? The entirety of the Disney Canon and its relationship to the Sequels feels like just one big case of the right hand not knowing what the left one was doing, and vice versa.
when you realize that collin trevorrow might have actually been able to justify the sequels and actually make them great but got fired for "creative differences"...
The Force Awakens shouldn’t have just destroyed the New Republic in one stroke. It should have shown us the outbreak of the war and show us the New Republic fighting back. Basically I’m suggesting that it starts as usual with the hunt for Luke Skywalker. And when Starkiller Base is revealed as a threat by Finn the Resistance contacts the New Republic saying Hosnian Prime is in danger from the First Order. Poe will then lead the Resistance fleet to Starkiller Base, Han, Chewie, Rey and Finn will go attack on the ground. And then when all Hope seems lost for the Resistance the New Republic Fleet will arrive. We will see this epic battle sequence and watch the New Republic at full strength. But Starkiller Bass will fire and the battle will be lost with Hosnian Prime destroyed. This will give so many benefits for the sequels I don’t know where to start. The New Republic will be shown in action, the First Order will feel threatening and powerful, Hosnian Prime will still be destroyed and we will see an overall more interesting sequel trilogy going forward. Starkiller Base could them be the forefront for a battle in 9 instead of Exegol. Honestly if the Sequels has taken more risks and been more interesting to begin with and have been planned out it all could have been so much better. I love the sequels but I can’t stand thinking of all the wasted potential of them.
As much as I liked Rey/Finn/Poe, the universe seems a lot smaller than the one in Legends. And while that might be coming eventually, I can only base my opinion on the Disney Canon that exists contemporaneously with the self that is forming the opinion.
*Stares in Rogue One, the Ahsoka arc of TCW season 7, Dooku Jedi Lost, Master & Apprentice, Obi-Wan and Anakin comic, Lost Stars, Queen's Shadow, Aftermath trilogy, multiple Forces of Destiny episodes, Leia: Princess of Alderaan, Dark Disciple, Charles Soule's Darth Vader comic, Tarkin novel, and the new Thrawn trilogy*
I disagree with what you said about coruscant not having a lived-in feeling. Definitely not in the films but in the clone wars it was always grimy and many things looked like they had gone decades or even centuries without cleaning.
Coruscant's been featured in Disney canon, onscreen; Rogue One has a flashback to the Erso's apartment where they celebrate the Imperial contract with Krennic, Clone Wars final season had 3 (arguably bad) episodes set on Coruscant, and you know the Bad Batch is bound to have at least a few episodes with the galactic capitol as the main setting, given what's goin down galaxy-wide at that time.
Because the people who made these movies are middle aged folks that sided with the idea of "the prequels ruined star wars", yet they made worse movies than the prequels because of it. No one respected George at the time these movies were made. And now that these movies are done and Clone Wars finished up, people suddenly love him again, including the prequel haters. Those of us who stuck with George through all the drama and bullshit could tell there was something missing in Episode 7, while all the prequel haters loved it cause it specifically excluded prequel content. And now that 8 and 9 wrapped up, these people wanna come out and say they loved George's work. They treated Clone Wars like a kid's show when it originally aired and NOW they want recognize its value. Thanks for nothing, prequel haters. Hope you're happy with a trilogy that does nothing to world build and nothing to pay tribute to George's work. It's just like watching the Originals again!
Despite all of my problems with TLJ, at least Rian Johnson acknowledged Palpatine being Darth Sidious and the downfall if the Jedi. Meanwhile JJ couldn't even handle small nods to the prequels like flags from the Boonta Eve podrace being at Maz's castle. They were present in a trailer, but cut from the final version of the film.
@@spezi_korn2019 even if you prefer the OT, you can't just pretend the prequels don't exist. That's what these people did, and now they want to stand up and demand George back.
I would say Coruscant is the SW version of ancient Rome in some ways. The eternal city, centre of the civilized world etc. But Rome was abandoned as capital which was Ravenna by some point in history. And that made sense after too many radical changes in government and so on. Same goes for Coruscant. The Clone Wars, the rise of the empire, the end of the senate (which was one of the major things defining "Coruscant" itself, many structures, millions of lives and most likely a big part of the planet´s economy was centered around this institution). With the senate gone (and Papa Palpatine surely eradicating lots of the structures that evolved around the senate during centuries) and the collapse of the empire there was simply a classic power vacuum which is usually taken advantage of by groups like the Black Sun. Without senate or emperor there was no galactic government whatsoever and Coruscant lost a major part of its identity because it was no longer the galactic capital or centre of power. The collapsing empire, growing stronger criminal factions... this will most likely damage the economy of Coruscant and just like Rome or Trantor (-> Foundation Trilogy by Isaac Asimov) the city was too large for its own good. All the ongoing trouble may have led to insufficient availability of power, food, water, clean air... maybe not enough freighters made their way to the planet. Then you have all those beings of different species and cultures certainly leading to violent conflicts that can no longer be fought against because the lack of a proper government. So after the fall of the empire Coruscant may just not have been "capital material" anymore. And the concept of a roaming capital may seem like a logistical nightmare but it also prevents some issues that evolved on Coruscant. First: An administration that has to move often will probably not be so oversized like the od senate. Second: The perception of time. Having actual periods (until the next move) may speed up the slow processes. Third: All those structures and diplomatic alliances between dynasties of senators, the criminal underground, the local economy and so on that played a big role in the senate´s way into corruption and decadence can not grow this easily if the capital does not stay on one planet for centuries. A senator can´t create his personal network across the planet or inherit the connections of his predecessors when the environment repeatedly changes. There are surely more advantages of a galactic government not merging inseparable with one single planet. Like with the ancient Rome, the old system that has initially worked well but decayed over centuries ultimateley failed and had to be replaced. In one case by a smaller, new designed capital, in the other one by a roaming capital. Coruscant probably still was a symbol for the not so old old republic, high culture and maybe even the Jedi, just like Rome was still of symbolic value.
If JJ didn't make it he doesn't make money off it. Coruscant isn't there because JJ only works with things he owns and can get royalties off, that's the sci fi he understands.
If people were honest, the prequels are probably the best Star Wars movies we have in episodes 1-9 (except maybe for Empire): they combine the best stories + graphics + action. But the first six episodes (movies) are the best too - they tell a complete story, the rise and fall (and rise again) of Anakin Skywalker. But the first three are all about Anakin who is a much more developed character than Luke, esp. given the Clone Wars cartoon series.
Maybe it's just me but I can't help but feel like the concept of a roaming capital is incredibly stupid in Star Wars ar least. As I understand the reason they give for the roaming capital is because they don't want any one planet to have to much power and influence in the New Republic, but unless your capital goes to every single planet in the New Republic than your just spreading the influence to various rich worlds. It doesn't address the problem that the Old Republic had of Outer Rim worlds being underrepresented and second class citizens compared to the Core Worlds. At best all it does is create pockets of underrepresented and second class planets spread between the various capital worlds. At worst it allows the capital worlds to thrive but leave the rest to rot. Politically it's absurd and practically it's ludicrous because Starships and fuel in Star Wars is expensive and unless the New Republic provides transport for all of their ambassadors the only planets who can afford to regularly relocate their ambassadors and their staff would be rich and very important worlds, which would end up being the only worlds represented and would likely be the worlds that end up hosting the capital for a time.
Please do the entire Grand Army Of The Republic vs. The UNSC both universe full military power in a all out war. The Republic jedi leaders, the null class arc troopers, bad batch, 6 million-2 billion clones(depending on legends or not), clone commandos the entire Republic fleet against the UNSC marine core, ODSTs, all spartin programs, and UNSC fleets. I would like to really see this the clones who are breed for war vs the toughest marines humanity as to offer.
I’m glad they didn’t blow Coruscant up, but it doesn’t make any sense that it wasn’t even mentioned, it’s literally the centre of the galaxy. It would have been great if we had a sequel trilogy that went there and explored the old temple, maybe to find some hidden room or to learn something regarding Rays training. Not that she needs training as a perfect being...
It just genuinely bums me out. The whole thing. This trilogy could have been great. And it simply wasn’t even good. Not awful. But it’s just...it has nothing to offer at all. Just bums me out...what could have been. And now it’s canon forever.
The new trilogy was just a slap in the face to all our childhoods. It's just bad/lazy writing on top of it all. *TFA was ok actually but I don't even want to talk about after that
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How to win battles in Empire at War with one simple trick (Thrawn hates him!): th-cam.com/video/HwECSusVtPY/w-d-xo.html
#AskEck
*Attempt 775*
Do the Forerunners vs the Imperium of Man faction versus video.
Flood invasion mass effect
@@thorshammer7883 I believe forerunner technology is too powerful for war hammer 40k to fight.
Hurray for the rambling!
#AskEck Do you think a return to Coruscant's Underworld (city?) and seeking the Holocron - whatever you want to substitute that with - there (Kylo/Rey returning, essentially); would have been a good way of circumventing "beautiful" Coruscant and creating some level of controversy about the "righteousness" of the Jedi ?
The fact that the sequels had a roaming capital makes me even more angry at how the entire New Republic just disappeared after the First Order destroyed Hosnian Prime. I expected the New Republic to put up a good fight and a roaming capital makes the First Order's sudden galactic takeover make even more illogical.
Like if Washington DC was bombed do you thinks the rest of the states would just roll over and let themselves be conquered by a new autocratic regime? No way, they would band to together and fight back. And if the US also had a roaming capital it would be even easier for the government to immediately retaliate.
All the planets in the New Republic had their own governments and militaries, I'm sure they would immediately declare war. They would be even more inspired to fight since they just defeated the Empire 30 years ago and would not want to fall right back into a dictatorship. Plus, the First Order's most deadly weapon (Starkiller Base) was just destroyed meaning the enemy is most vulnerable.
Yeah, it undermines the idea that the government could be taken out in a single shot. Even with the new cannon's take on legend's Galaxy Gun. Multiple systems should have had all of the basic infrastructure in place for the government to instantly restart following lines of succession. That and the random demilitarizing of the New Republic in cannon is really contrived and arbitrary. There is no rational reason for the New Republic to demilitarize and reduce its forces to pre-clone wars era levels right after a major war. The fall of the Empire in cannon is not nearly as convincing as the imperial civil war in legends was on top of that.
@@mcsmedia8081 Especially when you consider that the First Order began with Imperial fleets disappearing into the unknown regions. What, was the New Republic like "Naw, they won't ever come back with those ships and wipe us out. Nonsense."
@@jovalin5939 Pretty much. Mon Mothma thought that since Empire is no more, they don't need fleet anymore so they just scrapped most of it.
@@boruta1034 Who came up with this bullcrap?No one with even half a brain would have thought this?
Marcus Kurze Mon Mothma wanted to go back to the Pre Clone Wars Era Republic with low militarization.
Lost a planet Disney has, how embarrassing...
🤣👌🏽
If an item does not appear in our records then it does not exist.
Jon Evans
Fans: impossible perhaps the archives are incomplete
This is outrageous!
Brilliant!
JJ was, by far, the worst possible writer they could have chosen.
He does visually stunning well, but he doesn't do story.
*His visuals have their own problems. There's too much shit cluttered all over to focus on anything and soak the visuals. And everything moves and transitions too fast.*
@@vit968 In Abram's defense, that's how my life feels much of the time, so at least I can relate to what he is showing us...
@@vit968 That has a lot to do with the targeted audience, which is basically 12 year olds.
JJ needs to stick with star trek. Get Mr. Filoni or Mr. Farvarow on the phone. Let's give the fans how it should go. Stop pushing Rey on us she sucks
@@heywoodjablowme7530 Even Star Trek does not want him.
The Galaxy felt so much smaller in the sequels because of this.
The galaxy in all the sequel films just felt empty.
There was no galaxy
It feels like it’s all happening within the orbits of a few planets in a solar system, like here in real life instead of the feeling of hundreds of possible planets
@@snusemcgoose1001 didn’t the sequels take place over just one year too? Extremely short rise and destruction of the first order
@@dan7553 I think 2 years, there was a gap between TFA/ TLJ and TROS
Have a capital that's relocated every few years, even if its decades, sounds like a logistical and bureaucratic nightmare. Especially considering a galactic scaled government.
Indeed, which shows just how impractical and unwise the new "story group" is (more like a diversity group to me)
Here in my country we tried that after we got our independence from Spain.
Plan was to change the capital every 4 years.
Thing only lasted 2 years and ended up causing a short civil war.
@the lord of the spirals Which country is that?
@@The_Invisible_Hand Costa Rica
I’m sure it was just some bullshit that an author had to pull out to explain why Coruscant wasn’t blown up.
"The new extended lore went too far trying to define itself." Exactly, so far, it just feels like bad knockoff fan work.
@ClandestineOstrich Its marketing wasn't ineffective. These movies did not tank. They were pretty profitable: The Force Awakens is the 4th highest grossing film of all time.
Ja Kooistra but plenty of fans have lost interest in it because the sequels felt completely like fan fiction.
@@theothertonydutch That TFA would be profitable was a given. It was the restart of a franchise with a generation-spanning inbuilt fanbase. The movie not being in the top 10 highest grossing movies would have been a surprise.
The ones that are relevant are Rogue One , TLJ, Solo and ROS. They are the ones that had to stand on their own merits and could not count on the droves of inbuilt fans on the name of the franchise alone. And ultimately they didn't.
Of these, the first retold a story Legends already told with interesting characters (that go on to influence the story for decades) with (IMHO) bland characters that all die at the end. And answered question nobody was asking and that got answered elegantly in other Legends material. Seriously, knowing how many big projects in our world suffer from bad design, even critically so at times, there was no need for deliberate sabotage by the designer. And the way the plans were stored, nobody but the forgettable action girl main character could have gotten them, which ultimately means she lucked out in that her dad used her old nickname as project name/password (I don't even remember which it was) instead of something that would have allowed any rebel spy to get the plans.
Decent movie overall, but to me it will always carry the stigma of sealing the fate (or lack thereof) of one of my favorite characters in the new canon.
The next left me not only dissatisfied, but actually angry of how little respect it had shown the existing movies. And the one that would follow, not reworking the movie to account for the tragic RL-fact of Carrie Fisher passing away (a year before the movie was set to release) made it that much harder for the next movie to be made and most likely cost it the original director. Which is something I actually would have understood if the movie we got was actually good.
After TLJ, I had no motivation to see Solo and RoS, and everything they put out in terms of trailers just made them look worse. So I would actually say the marketing not only was ineffective, it managed to drive at least me away even further.
And to top it off, regarding the original post:
if the new canon actually tried to define itself, they probably should not have made the main characters bad copies of Legends characters.
Or better yet, instead of reinventing the wheel (but worse), they could have taken Legends as a baseline, streamlined it and made selective retcons (like not dropping a moon on Chewbacca, if they want to keep him around) and would have had a host of developed everything to draw from.
Instead we got the head of Lucas Film stating in an interview that there is no source material to draw from, ignoring the fact that half of the new characters are bad copies of characters in this non-existing source material.
So it’s the old EU again?
@@barbarianjk2355 no the same fans were the ones bitching about the prequels because it’s not what they wanted. The key words NOT WHAT THEY WANTED. That’s why Lucas quit making Star Wars movies after the prequels. He said in an interview while bother putting all this effort in for the fans just to complain.
Coruscant is such an underrated planet. At least it got mentioned in Fallen Order.
Yooo imagine if we get to go there in FO2
I think it’s a little overrated, to be honest. The place is a garbage heap underneath the shiny surface. Lusankya taking off showed how it’s one tectonic event away from a disaster.
@@Buzzy_Bland that's why it's great though...
Buzzy Bland thats the point?
Fr
JJ Abrams: We don't talk about the prequels.
Fans: Retcon the sequels.
Prequels are the only good star wars movies.
@@Bluesonofman Yeah I guess the OT are prequels now
Well they didn't open too many plotholes. Rise of Skywalker contradicts the aftermath trilogy
@@Bluesonofman After having been made fun of for liking even some aspects of the prequel trilogy, it amuses me that suddenly they're the "good Star Wars" that everybody wants to return to.
@@Bluesonofman which prequels the prequels to the sequels or the prequels to the sequels
I remember being upset that "Coruscant" was destroyed in episode VII, then later learning that it was actually Hosnian Prime and instantly not giving a shit anymore
People would be rioting on the streets if Coruscant was blown up.
@@KaiHung-wv3ulJJ wanted to blow it up but Lucasfilm stopped him. Hosnian Prime was supposed to be Coruscant but they renamed it, probably for fear of backlash.
Starkiller base is illum, where the Jedi get their crystals in the cartoons, but I doubt JJ chose that.
@@KaiHung-wv3ul for real, especially considering Coruscant is supposed to be the origins of humans in the lore
I don’t think Coruscant “isn’t dirty enough”, in fact, it’s quite dirty, shifty, and grimy just a few hundred feet down from where we see most of the action there. That whole undercity is supposed to be a sordid hive, and is super underexplored imo.
its literally like a 100 planet wide hive citys from warhammer stacked on top of each other
AND THEY THINK ITS CLEAN?
Coruscant was originally intended to be a very dark and dirty place. The bright neon glitter might make Coruscant the jewel of the empire, but it also makes it easy for threats to lurk within blinding glares and crowded shadows.
starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Wars:_Underworld
Yeah, the clone wars has shown off a lot of the world. Each level down you go the dirtier and dirtier it gets. We don’t even know which side of corusant we’re on unless we’re in view of the temple or senate. It’s just such a big planet and is super under appreciated
@@wilmagregg3131 Well, it's a large Hive world even by 40K standards.
I'm one of those who just like to ignore everything after 6. It's legitimately terrible in almost all aspects. Unlike the prequels, time will not save it; it has no redeeming parts.
What about old canon? You can pry the Jedi Knight games from my cold dead hands.
Everyone says time will not save it. That doesn't seem like a point that can reasonably be made without time. Minimum ten years, then people can say "time didn't save it". People (including myself and several in my age group) are lenient on the prequels because we grew up with them. So I'd say just wait.
@@jamesgiblin9134 The difference is the prequals are full of creativity and have their own vision and plot, and mesh well into the overarching story. There's also been the Clone Wars which showcases the good in the prequal era. Their dialogue was bad and some of the writing wasn't the best, but I think one can really appreciate the passion and ideas present.
The sequals are tired rehashes of the original trilogy which just seems to be trying to replace it. There's nothing new to capture the imagination.
I would say that time will not be save the sequels the same way for the prequels. I mean people will probably have a soft spot for them and consider them to be superior films, but if they look at them as a whole, they won’t be as good stories. And any of the retcons or additions to the story will have to be pretty good to justify any of them, which I believe will be a lot harder considering they had no grand plan.
@@Janx14 Exactly. The prequels had a cohesive plot; it was just given a poorly written script. The story itself is actually good. Put the Clone Wars series on top of it all, and it isn't just acceptable, but outright good.
Also, whilst the Old republic era might not be canon, it's my headcanon. I personally find that era as far superior to the actual current era.
Imagine episode 7 starting out showing the prosperity and strength of the new republic and Luke's revived jedi order at the jedi temple with some epic John William's music.
That's exactly how I thought it should have been! The first fifteen minutes of the movie catches us up with Luke, Leia, Han and their children, as we see how prosperous and peaceful the galaxy has been for the last decade. Then, the bad guys strike . . .
@@solan7978 But no, we had to go back to stage 1 and rehash the entire original trilogy instead.
They didn't even have to go that far, we would have been happy if they just said "Yeah, so we're just gonna make film adaptations of the Heir to the Empire trilogy."
Republic was absolutely devastated by clone wars and then further by Palpatine's empire. It won't have that much strength.
Instead we got to see them back to square one of ANH like nothing had changed after all these years. Might as well just said that the rebels beat Palpatine and the Death Star but lost the war and had been trying to resist them ever since. It makes no sense why they defeat the empire and then all of the sudden this new enemy appears years later and they immediately go back to small bases in the middle of nowhere with a small force rather than a new fleet
That's what made me really feel empty about this trilogy. All action, no politics or talk about the rest of the galaxy. I wanted to see what the aftermath of the empire's fall was like and the rise of the new republic in the eyes of the galaxy on screen, to make me feel like this is actual star wars... a galactic conflict, not a small plot about edge lords and untrained maggots fighting each other
I agree, there was a sense of disconnect with this series, they seem to have forgotten that it is about a galactic struggle, happening across many systems.
Just a few scenes discussing the state of the galaxy would have gone a long way in making it feel like a conflict that actually affected a lot of people
@@PurpleGoomba1 it's Disney they want it to be bland and inoffensive, also over correcting what they think was the problem with the prequel trilogy.
@@Elm0xz on film anyway, he seems to have no problem doing it on TV.
All you needed to know the First Order was bad and menacing. It is funny because even when the Prequels had lots of politics to explain the situation of the galaxy, B1 battledroids, clone troopers, planets like Geonosis, Coruscant, Kamino and Mustafar all became iconic for an entire generation. Heck even the original trilogy had resemblances to tangible politics:
"We are on an diplomatic mission."
"If this is an connoisseur ship, where is the ambassador?"
"The Imperial Senate will no longer be any of our concern. I have just received information that the Emperor has dissolved the Senate and given power to regional governors."
With the Sequels it is just run to room, bang bang, shooty shooty. The bad guys are hilariously evil. The geopolitics of the galaxy are a rip off of the original trilogy except without tangible substance.
Lots of great books and comics to read if you want to know more about what happened after ROTJ and the political ramifications of that. I recommend the Aftermath trilogy of books. Alphabet Squadron by Alexander Freed is pretty good too.
Eck- "The sequels have been trying to find their own identity"
Me- looks at everything copy and pasted from the original trilogy while simultaneously avoiding anything prequel related
Maybe because when we got something new, the prequels, everyone threw a fit
@@michaelszilagyi4529 Well yeah. They weren't good movies (especially AotC). They had some good to great moments and Revenge was almost there. Turns out when the quality isn't there, people aren't happy.
@@SuperSanity1 They are good movies. Not perfect, each filled with flaws in terms of execution, but they don't get enough credit where credit is due.
@@UnknownUser-gd3ls AotC (and arguably Phantom) is a an objectively bad movie. It had some good cinematography and great music. Everything else, dialogue, acting, choreography, etc was bad. Revenge was the only one you could make a decent case for being more good than bad.
@@ZaZi-Zeta01 It really wasn't. The line delivery was atrocious. And not just from Anakin. I'm not putting that completely on the actors mind. Like I said previously, the dialogue was partially to blame and so was the direction.
Coruscant: a developed world with fascinating history and truly limitless possibilities (and it has layers like an onions each darker than the last, literally and figuratively)
Hosnian Prime: a world that we saw 5 seconds and gets destroyed with other planets
Jakku: Tatooine 2, now with Star Destroyer scraps and Mary Sues!
Ach-To: Because Beak-less birds are cute
Exegol: “I have millions of ships with tiny guns which all have the power of the Death Star!” -Palpatine before bass boosting the rebel fleet
Coruscant: I am a joke to you?
Edit: more stuff
At least Coruscant can live on. I was really optimistic we would return. But I guess that is saved for another time.
Disney just hates prequel era fans lol
And too many people tought it was Coruscent in SW7 given the amazing world building.
@@SmashGuyROA Disney hates Star Wars fans in general. Otherwise they wouldn't have tried replacing canon with their fanfictions.
No one will ever convince me that the Porgs from Achtoo weren’t a product of Bad Robot marketing.
I dont hate the porges, but I really wanted to see chewie go return of the jedi and eat one....
I didn't even know what planets were destroyed in TFA I thought they were just some random planets. The whole trilogy disney made was a mess of meaningless characters, events and unnecessary stupid story.
The only thing disney has done right with Star Wars is Rogue One and The Mandalorian.
And more to come. Not like the Sequels can’t be redeemed.
And TCW Season 7
I liked Solo and Rebels too
@@sonny9493 Solo was really great! Maybe not the Han solo story we all wanted; but as a star wars movie it was great
@@PriceTheAvocadoKing I hope they do the squeal with Jabba in it. Unfortunate they may not due to toxic fans complaining about every little thing
I would’ve loved to see the original battle of coruscant that they were planning for episode 9 because the one in Revenge of the Sith is my favorite SW space battle
Remember the 2003 clone wars show where it zoomed from the surface of courscant to the combat in space, that was amazing.
@@sirshotty7689 the abilities of force Users also were shown quite good in that Version
It would be hard to top that though. They would probably focus more on the ground battle.
Me too man, me too
Fans : Hey let's see some of the big cities and mega technological worlds! What we all praised in the prequels.
Disney : Here's more sand worlds. And plain rock worlds. Ohh and salt worlds.
And worst thing is they almost did that with canto byte. But then they just went full 20th century casino instead of actually being innovative and Sci fi esque.
Fuck the people they hire suck...
Totally agree. The new films are visually boring as hell...
Seriously, why are there a hundred million desert planets in Disney Star Wars? It's the only thing they seem capable of coming up with.
You can't blame the writers, though. It isn't their fault Kennedy hired people who had no experience writing science fiction, or looking at their resumes, much at all.
Rubbing salt worlds in the wounds.
Galaxy is on war for like 50+ years. Cities tends to get destroyed during the war.
Disney Star Wars in an incoherent disaster. Glad Coruscant was spared.
Debatable. Not like they can’t redeem it.
@@achaudhari101 - they can't redeem it
@@analtubegut66 They said after Attack of the Clones was released, or after the Clone Wars movie was released ect.
@@jamesgiblin9134 - those movies didnt overwrite or decanonize 30 years of content though
Massive difference
@@analtubegut66 The question is what of the people who don't grow up with the Legends lore. The silent majority of people who just watch the movies. In my experience the normal non-fan people usually say the sequels are better than the prequels already. Whether this will grow or shrink with time seems the question.
I love how there's sequel fans in the comments trying to defend it.
I like the prequels a lot, and I understand they have severe flaws, but I don't have the urge to defend them from rational criticism.
I think this says a lot about the sequels in general.
Exactly. I don't understand sequel defenders. It's obvious there was no plan and the whole thing is a mess.
OOM- 32 the thing is, there are no severe flaws in the prequels at all. I swear people act like there’s like 20 plot holes created in the films or something when in fact there’s none..
@@mackmitchell94 agreed. The prequels tell the story of how one man (palpatine) can take hold of an entire galactic government and how a man with good intentions can become one of the worse people ever in the galaxy, and they tell it pretty darn well.
@@edwardrichtofen8530 That's honestly the best description I've heard of the prequels
@@azulknight474 thanks. I can explain it in even further detail but that is the main gist.
Episode 7 damned the whole trilogy because it had no politics to establish the political landscape of the galaxy at that point in time. We have no context for how the Resistance operates and what the Republic is doing. The First Order as well. Coruscant was essential to the trilogy. I hope we see it in The Mandalorian with the lower levels.
As Mauler put it, " You know why the sequel films have shit worldbuilding? It's because of all of the people who hated the senate scenes [from the prequels]."
Without politics you cannot have an understanding of war. Without understanding war, you cannot have Star Wars. It’s literally about a galactic civil war, without any context about either side. Sure, maybe the prequels went to deep with trade blockades and no confidence votes in the Senate, but the factions were clear and the forces behind them distinct.
Hey just be glad they didn’t use it and butcher it. It’s still out there and can be redeemed. Hopefully
@@harlannguyen4048 Except, there was politics in the OT as well. Obi Wan introduces the Empire and how the Galaxy got that way.
@@m.c.martin I'm aware of that. It's just that when people complain about politics in Star Wars, they typically refer to the examples presented in the prequels, while ignoring that the OT had them too, albeit to a smaller scale.
"Coruscant was in open rebellion against the First Order..."
The planet? The entire planet was at war with the First Order? Alone, with the entire rest of the New Republic wiped out and the Resistance in hiding, Coruscant is fighting the First Order? Fucking hell, why wasn't *that* the entire movie? That would've been badass.
2 and a half hours of the Courscanti undercity dwellers using Guerilla Warfare to drag occupying forces into ambushes below the surface, fighting in alleys and sabotaging depots and garrisons. Give Please
On the plus side at least it was not destroyed in TFA. Wow 772 likes in 10 hoursa thank you all so much.
Says the one who helped destroy a whole planet during the demon apocalypse
Honestly killing 100 billion+ people off screen is something even disney realises would cause a shitshow.
@@justinreeves2696 nani do you even doom
@@justinreeves2696 Mars is a dead planet so who cares.
Honestly I remember seeing tfa and thinking wow did they just destroy corusant. But no it's just some other random world I'd never heard of.
Seeing how this has all played out, in hindsight I don’t think the story group had as much figured out as we believed. They probably didn’t want to touch Coruscant because they didn’t know how everything would shake out in Episode 9. I will point evidence to how disjointed episode 8 was from what TFA established, the story group probably wasn’t that involved, thats how Rian Johnson was allowed to subvert everything. I do think there was a “forget the old ways” or “let the past die” going on quietly in management at Lucasfilm (trying to create their own legacy 😴)
I've seen interviews that suggest the story group didn't have hardly a thing figured out and weren't working together. The whole project was super mishandled and Kathleen Kennedy (President of Lucas Films) , in a super softball interview question, wasn't even able to say she was a fan of Star Wars.
Luckily, I've also heard that there is change coming, and people like Dave Filoni will be having more input going forward. But, I guess we'll just have to see.
They literally said “canon doesn’t matter”, if the Story group has their fingers in it, like with the comics and movies, ignore it as canon.
Dave Filoni did state in an interview that Lucas told him and his team on multiple occasions he was teaching them the ways of the force. 😃😁😎
Yeah Ryan Johnson stated that he got absolutely zero directions and was told do anything he wanted.
TFA Established nothing that was good! In fact what did it establish at all!?! That the First Order somehow not only existed but was powerful enough to wipe out the New Republic in one fell swoop - Totally illogical!
TLJ has its own problems but it is a far better movie than the abomination that was TFA! AND obviously than the complete Mess that is RoS!
TFA left out any and all BACKSTORY relying entirely on TLJ and RoS to make up for this - Which neither movie was able to do!
TFA Destroyed Han and Leia!
TFA told us that Luke had run away and hid! Stop blaming TLJ for that, it was set in stone by TFA!
TFA Gave us the whiny Man-Baby version of Kylo Ren - A character that is far better in BOTH TLJ and RoS!
TFA Rey is by far the most "Mary-Sue" version because at least the other two movies didn't create her in the first place and were able to provide her with some {not much but some} character and training!
TFA decided that you could somehow shoot a laser from one star system to another in the blink of an eye NOT YEARS as it would actually take!
TFA gave us the cowardly version of Finn who was almost redeemed by TLJ until Rose had to get in the way! And was returned to being just a follower in RoS!
TFA is a DISGRACE to Star Wars! TLJ isn't Star Wars at all....How could it be after TFA!?!
Actually though, Coruscant was shown ever so briefly in Rogue One during a flashback showing Krennic and Galen Erso at an Imperial function. Lore has also been added for things such as Celestial Power having a headquarters on Coruscant.
Rogue One was depicting it in the prequel era, though. True, it's 'new media', but chronologically old.
@@Monody512 It is still within the realm of Disney cannon, though
@@x3j505 Same goes for TCW and some of the books. I really don't get the problem of Coruscant losing galactic importance after losing both the Jedi, the Senat and eventually whatever Imperial institutions it had.
They mentioned it on the terrible boba fett show
"The backlash they received in their heyday"
Actually, I'm old enough to remember a time when people were comparing RotS to Greek tragedy. Sure, everyone knew the dialogue was a bit hokey, but the hate against the prequels is a pretty recent (2010's) phenomenon.
That's what I remember too.
I'm old enough to have gone to see the original SW in the theater and drive inns. No idea how many times I saw it as a kid lol. But I do remember when the prequels came out how much I hated most of the first movie and felt meh about the second and did enjoy the last. But also I remember that pretty much everyone everywhere hated them or at least the phantom because of the stupid anikin kid and jar jar. The others where bad because of the actors and dialog but at least the characters where not horrible.
@@kevinsb70 Hayden Christianson actually is a pretty decent actor, but George isn't good fit for him as a director. Also, I was a fan of Obi Wan because of the way his character developed alongside Anakin, and would honestly would have preferred a more Shakespearean telling where Dooku killed Qui Gon. Revenge of the Sith is defiantly my favorite out of all of them because Sidious' betrayal and declaring himself Emperor al a Shakespeare's Caesar.
@@KRYMauL totally agree. All the actors from the movies where good in other movies but sucked in star wars....all the star wars was horrible for acting minus one or two people per movie. Lucas must just like bad acting and stiff delivery.
@@kevinsb70 He was supposedly known for saying faster and more intense. His strong suit is with actors like Harrison Ford or maybe RDJ who don’t need must direction on direction.
Disney has been replacing planets that don't need to be replaced.
Not really considering Coruscant still exists in the new Canon.
He means replacing not in the literal sense of existence, but the significance and role of the planets.
Antonov A-40 good clarification for those
Like Moraband and Exogul
Phantom T or Korriban as some of us like to still call it
Simple Answer: Because they don’t care. They just want the money
_EXACTLY_
person person Of course every company wants money, but at least some do it for money *and for passion* and are actually creative and do sufficient research
...are you implying that Lucas didn't want money? Do you know how merchandise driven Lucasfilm was even before being sold to Disney? Also how do they make more money by using a planet less in movies? The main change in Lucasfilm has been Lucas himself leaving, which was going to happen anyway, and Kathleen Kennedy becoming director (which was George's choice not Disney's, by the way). Also, Disney doesn't control the story of the films nearly as much as some fans think, Lucasfilm remains in charge of the storytelling decisions.
I love Star Wars as much as you do but it's always been about money--not only money, but still.
SoggyWaffles24 ONLY MONEY
Darth Kwame but he cared about making money to reinvest in film tech innovation and enable his vision. It wasn’t greed, it stemmed from passion and a commitment to his craft. KK and Disney evidently don’t care about the story so it’s very different.
To give them credit they did do a good job with Not Coruscant,
just like with Not Tatione, and Not Endor, and Not Star Wars.
I hate that there are so many desert planets.
Don't forget Not Korriban and Not Yavin as well as Not Empire and Not Rebels
@@DillsyYourDaddy67 lmao Not Korriban
@@emberfist8347 There's a galactic water shortage.
Let's add Not Tython into the mix.
“Closely wanted to follow the original trilogy”. You misspelled copied and tried to pass off as his own.
Exactly - I didn’t enjoy TFA and TROS at all because I feel like I’m watching an inferior version of something I’ve already watched before.
And to repeat the same story lines actually makes them more stupid.... for example one would think that a mistake such as not guarding the shield generator good enough would be a lesson the first/final order would keep in mind, but nope
@@belleliu72 Funny how people keep writing new ´canon´ just to plug the pot holes of those last shitty movies.
Because that would have to acknowledge the prequel trilogy exists, something the Big Bad Mouse will avoid at all costs.
I'm enjoying that they had to admit it for Battlefront 2 due to massive fan backlash over the first one.
They did for a while. But looks like they regretted it.
This comment aged like milk
I’m still disappointed we didn’t see Coruscant, we could have made some great callbacks to episode 3. I still say Rise of Skywalker should have been two parts and the way finder should have been in the Imperial Palace. The climax of part 1 should have been a battle to liberate the planet while Rey and the Kylo had their duel in the former Jedi Temple.
To all those who disliked the prequel series.....
They look pretty good now don't they
The prequels.
Bad films, but I still enjoy them.
The 'Disnilogy"
Bad films, and I pretend they don't exist.
Simple as. ^.-.^
No the prequels(except ROTS) still suck. TFA and TLJ are still good, TROS sucked
Jakob Krmelj no TLJ was also bad
@@Krmelj1308 TLJ was ultra trash
@@Krmelj1308 Pretty sure 9/10 people would disagree with you to some degree there.
2:01 and most importantly, it's the most populous planet in the galaxy
4:28 I think the reason is that it would remind people of the previous films... and how even the prequels were leagues above the new trilogy
5:50 well... they knw they were incompetent enugh where they would cause contridictions
My personal feeling is that they wanted everything new so they could sell merchandise based on new intellectual properties so they can cut ties as much as possible with the old stuff. They don't want the old fans because they are going to be the most critical and least likely to want to spend more money if they feel Disney isn't doing a good job. They want the new fans almost exclusively since the old fans are going to be the ones likely to say "hey this isn't as good as the old stuff" and are going to be willing to hand down their old merchandise to the new fans.
Unfortunately it's the old fans with the money to spend on the merchandising. So between alienating the old fans and writing crapy characters, the new merchandise didn't sell.
NAH It is because Kennedy wanted everything to be new/her creation.
@@Mitheledh star wars is completly dead now, no one i know liked any of the disney star wars movies, its the best if we just boycott it all together and make disney regret their decision, and lucas his
There are videos on this very topic. Badrobot, JJ’s production company gets a cut of the merch sales from new content, hence why they go out of their way to only use new stuff.
I mean, why do you think the Prequels never really featured any of the planets from the original movies aside from Tatooine?
It's crazy how people don't seem to realize that Disney is doing nothing new here.
Disney’s goal is to pretend years down the road that they always owned Star Wars, and acknowledging an planet that iconic that they didn’t invent makes that harder.
Aziz This is likely true.
Although, if they kept everything more together, it would seem like one big thing, owned by Disney, rather than just the Star Wars before Disney and after.
My future kids won't ever know anything after 6 exists. I won't show them the Disney shit. . Their plan is, like you said, to claim they've always owned Star Wars but the irony is so many fans will not pass down these movies to the next generations.
Remember andor? Most episodes have parts set on courtesan. The mandalorian also had a few episodes on coruscant.
We really missed out
Why ask why Coruscant is missing from these star wars movies, when star wars is missing from these star wars movies?
If only we actually got Trevorrow's Episode 9. It sounds like it could have been the Revenge of the Sith of the sequels, the best of the three.
Trevorrow's Episode 9 would've been just as bad, if not worse, than _The Rise of Skywalker._ Anything that came after _The Last Jedi_ was doomed to fail.
Except JJ took a whole shit on Star Wars
I think while it would been a mess it would of still of been a Star Wars movie. Themes were in keeping with the saga, had story progression as well as substantial world build. The one of the best parts of Star Wars. Unlike that thing
Wasgz Zak it wouldn’t have been a mess of a movie. Tros was though
@@justinreeves2696 What about Rian Johnson? He single-handedly destroyed the entire sequel trilogy with one movie (objectively the worst Star Wars movie of all time) and butchered the character of Luke Skywalker, not to mention how he threw new characters like Poe and Finn under the bus. J.J gave us one good movie with _The Force Awakens,_ the Johnson completely threw out whatever was accomplished with the first movie to satisfy his own ego, leaving J.J to pick up the pieces.
4:48 "we don't have flying cars..." We can't have them yet cuz people can't even park wheeled vehicles properly
Or drive them properly
That's like saying we shouldn't have had cars because some people cant operate a horse properly. A flying car would probably be different than a normal car too.
@@kinglukethe7th524 eh...the death toll from flying cars would probably far exceed automobile deaths. You're adding in a lot of factors to safety besides the lack of proper power generation and the technology that would utilize it. Flying cars would probably need a lot AI assistance if you were talking about something like Star Wars speeders.
Self-piloting flying cars would probably be an easier AI problem than self-driving ground vehicles.
I wish we could’ve gotten a different sequel trilogy.
If Carrie Fischer was still alive I'd support a redo. JJ Abrams really dropped the ball imo, yes I'm talking to you TFA.
Me too. Oh well there's always fanfiction...
There was it's called the thrawn trilogy
@@oliveragag8576 That would have been the best but there are a number of official and de-facto trilogies which would have been a marked improvement over the big reset.
I would even be fine with not having any sequel trilogy.
Getting rid of one of the most iconic cities in the franchise without a big battle or something is REALLY stupid... Even for Disney...
Disney has always been like that
Or they can always revisit that concept like as a final showdown against the Sith in the Old Republic.
The good thing about that is Coruscant is still available for Dave Filoni freely explore
look, I get that a lot of people don't like the prequels and for good reason, personally I like them but that's only because I was a child when I watched them. but either way as bad as it objectively is.... It also some really deep and compelling ideas an concepts behind it.
As well as the sequels. The ideas, and concepts, are interesting, but the final product is questionable, if not bad...
One thing that me made realize how bad the prequels really are was the prequels month by Linkara from "a top the fourth wall"
After that i became more angry with people that now worships the prequels just to shit on the sequels... They are bad movies, that sometimes are worse than the sequels... Except.for the rise of the skywalker... That i like, but its really bad.
I loved the prequels. Ever since I heard Luke & Ben mention the “Clone Wars” in ANH, I wanted to hear more! I grew up wondering how Palpatine tricked everyone and turned the Republic into the Empire. And, we got to see Anakin’s arc as well? The prequels deserve far more credit than they’ve received.
@@maestro3947-b9g have you watched the 3d clone wars
@@maestro3947-b9g Not really, prequels give large world for us to fantasize (Coruscant , Mustafar , Kamino, Geonosis , Kashyyk , Utapau? , and Naboo )while the sequels give us basically recycled planet with different name.. ( Jakku, Exegol and Hosnian Prime) The only planet that I like is Crait because I never seen such planet like that before
@@aurorauplinks yes. But then i stoped. Didnt fall off with me. But the cartoon dont wipe off the problems with the movies.
I have a similar opinion as Linkara in this regards: the movies should've offer enough character development for itself.
But at the same time i understand now what lucas expected: i launch a half baked movie. And complete with comics and games and a cartoon. More money. (Remember that when the revenge of the sith came, there was not the clone wars 3d, just a game, the republic comics - a fine addition i must say - and the 2d cartoon)
In TFA they mention core prequel concepts like "balance or the Force" or the "Sith" that were not in the OT. So, I do not think the unexplained capital change to a generic planet was done for this reason. Rather, the real reason was historical:
I think it was more like they wanted to rehash ANH (but bigger) and thus blow up the capital. But they were worried to blow up Couruscant because
(i) it might been interpreted as a Prequel/Lucas bashing and
(ii) as a blatant disrespect of the lore - remember the backlash when JJ (stupidly and disrespectfully) blew up the planet Vulcan in Star Trek 09 just for the lens flare?
And yet, everything else disrespects both Lucas and the lore.
I wouldn't mind destroying Coruscant if it was treated with respect and built up as an emotional moment. Destroying Vulcan sucks, but at least in that movie it was treated seriously because we see both Spock's emotional reaction to it.
They probably left it out bc jj Abrams doesn't know the lore behind it....
You know something that still gets me angry is Kuat. We have never seen Kuat on screen before! I wanted to have hope that in the Mandorlian season 2 we would see Kuat. It would be neat if we could see Kuat making first order star destroyers. It would also make my day if Kuat was building Palpatine's secret fleet of star destroyers in episode 9! Because the only place in cannon that can make that many star destroyers is Kuat Drive Yards!
Ive never understood the fixstion among stsr wars fans with "the gritty, lived in design of the original trilogy". That reslly only comes in with the falcon (which was always portrayed as barely flightworthy and horribly behind on maintsnce) and Mos Eisly in general. Blaming the prequels for not looking like a ship thats falling apart is strange to me.
That was the point it was the golden age of the Republic, the age of decadence as the war progresses it becomes more lived-in.
It's a nice contrast, what we see in the prequal trilogy compared to the originals, especially the different cultural styles. Take episode one for example. There's no galaxy wide conflict and our main planet of reference is a paradise world in Naboo, where everything is either highly exotic (Gungan tech) or just extremely streamlined and artistic (the Nabooians culture and tech). In contrast the war machines of the Republic Army in episodes two and three, have an emphasis on practicality over aesthetics, getting less fancy and more simplistic as the war continues. Eventually giving rise to the classic imposing Imperial style we're so familiar with as well as the cultural mishmash of ships the Rebellion uses, each built for efficiency with no cares for how pretty the ships are. Yet we still get some glimpses of exotic ships from differing cultures, namely the twin pod Cload cars of Bespin or the unique design of Mon Calamari ships. It's all relative, an opulent setting will have opulent stuff, while a tyrannical setting is going to have people using a minimalistic approach in how they design things.
The refinement of the Republic was hinted to by Obi-wan as far back as ANH? My expectations were fully met with the more elegant ships, uniforms, etc. The opening scene of TPM blew my mind. It was very “Star-Wars”, especially with its digital audio. I watched TPM over and over on Laserdisc (sourced from Japan) some 20 years ago. Thankfully, the films would be released on DVD by the time AOTC was released.
I feel like it could have been Kathleen Kennedy's fault for the lack of prequel content in movies, she clearly trying to seperate her trilogy with the older trilogy's, the change at galaxies edge and the lack of Hyden Christiansian( butchered the spelling I know) are evidence of this.
@person person the older fans maybe but I grew up with them and loved them.
This is what happens when you hire and put in charge incompetent idiotic insane writers and dictators who don't give a damn about the heart and soul of Star Wars or the continuity to run the show. You know what you get? A rotten corpse of a once beloved franchise that has been horrible mangled from the inside out.
Honestly... J.J Likes WAY TOO MUCH the smell of his own fart to be working on an already existing universe
@@Exdorme We can only hope Dave Filoni and Jon Favreau use all these Disney + shows to retcon the sequels, and eventually do the trilogy RIGHT.
You nailed it right on the head in your opening statement. Coruscant is a PREQUEL planet. Of course Disney is going to stay FAR away from it.
Dumb reasons and Disney Star Wars. Two things definitely made for each other.
Nah.
@@achaudhari101 you mistyped 'Yah". Felt you should know.
@@Beuwen_The_Dragon No because not all of the stuff Disney has done with Star Wars is garbage.
@@achaudhari101 Not all. Just the majority.
Disney Star Wars has a lot in common with 343's Halo.
New people come in, eager to carve their own version of a beloved franchise, they introduce new (disappointing, minus a few) characters and enemies, create a boring, (almost non sensical plot), change things that were perfectly fine, mess with beloved characters (more Star Wars than Halo really) and just generally piss of loyal fans of beloved, long running franchise just for a quick buck.
I only hope that Disney will learn from their mistakes the way 343 did.
I'm not saying that the people creating Star Wars don't love it, but as with 343 - the people in charge need to compromise their vision what fans want or else the next generation won't get to love the franchise nearly as much as we did.
Or in Disney speak:
YOU COULD BE MAKING MORE MONEY!
I really wanted to see Luke rebuilding the old Jedi Temple on Coruscant
Sadly they didn't happen in the Legends either He picked the Temple of Yavin 4 of all places when the place was built by a Sith.
The imperial palace was built over where the jedi temple was built over the sith monument
@@emberfist8347 Yavin 4 was the first, but as the years passed, he established temples in other planets, such as: Ossus, Endor, Corellia and Dathomir. He even made a new one on Coruscant, but it was later destroyed by the One Sith Order.
I wanted to see Luke actually be competent at all, instead of the washed up "Oh my nephew is going dark, I better kill him in his sleep, not like I've ever redeemed anyone from the Dark side before."
I was high-key offended when in episode 9 Endor of all places showed up but coruscant is nowhere to be seen or mentioned
Endor didn’t even appear in Rise of Skywalker. It was another one of Endor’s moons that they say the Death Star debris landed on.
@@colbyjohnson5788 At the end of the movie there was a montage of planets rebelling against the First Order and one of them is the forest moon of Endor
“And this is why you have failed”
And this is why the Expanded Universe is so much better in every aspect, including less continuity contradictions.
Marc Spector Not every aspect. 25,000 years? Utter nonsense.
There were a ton more contradictions in the EU, but the main EU story was better than the disney
@@zico739 Out of all of the liegitmate weirdness and missteps of the Old Canon (I still love it to death though) you pick the fact it encompasses 25k years of inuniverse history to draw the line? XD
@@zico739 Why is 25,000 years of history nonsense?
I concur. When I look at the old EU's timelines and the 7 eras that it evolved into with varying levels of cannon, permitting lots and lots of fan customization for their head cannons, I just sigh at the emptiness of the new cannon's timeline. 25,000+ years of time to play in, with lots of space to work with, meant that the there was tons of space to play in. The story was really growing in both directions from the zero year. All the detail, levels of cannon, and contradictions were fuel for countless hours of conversation. Still are as proven by all the content on Ekk's channel and other notable channels. The old EU had enough content for detailed resource books like atlases, biology books, books covering military hardware (each item with distinct designs, numbers, dates of production, etc) and even distinct in-universe cultures and holidays (like Life Day, loved and hated by many). New Canon is just empty by comparison. It'll take Lucasfilm 40 years or more to develop their new cannon to a point where it contains a comparable amount of content, and they didn't start off well by any means. The only part of the old EU that is still active is Bioware's SWTOR mmo, which has some good story telling.
I feel like JJ just had the mindset of “prequels bad” when I think it would have been SO cool to see the sequels tie concepts from the prequels and OT together more
Last time I was this early starwars was still good
2005?
Congratulations on arriving twice just now then!
Still is.
Clone wars S7, Mandalorian, Rogue One, comics, games, etc.
Zenith Gaming2 exactly
So what's that 15 years
It’s been in the books. I remember it was in Inferno Squad, Leia: Princess of Alderaan, and Lost Stars off of the top of my head. It was cool to see it under Imperial control, plus the Jedi Temple has been fleshed out in prequel-era content like Master & Apprentice and Dooku: Jedi Lost, but I always wondered what happened to it after Episode VI. It would’ve been nice to see it again in IX.
I think he said books set in that specific era. Haven’t read Leia or lost stars but inferno squad is fall of the empire/ot era.
Master & Apprentice is a fantastic book. Highly recommend
At least they didn't include Coruscant so it could be tarnished like everything else they've touched.
How would they tarnish it?
Rogue one handled mustafar well.
I think Vader’s castle is the best thing Disney added to the lore.
Agreed.
@@zenithproductions8307 Rogue One wasn't a mainline movie so there's that.
techno639 Idk maybe by literally blowing it up in the sorry excuse of a trilogy known as the sequels.....
Coruscant will forever be my favorite planet, and it’s a huge part of Star Wars lore! So disappointed that it hadn’t been used since episode 3
I'm glad Coruscant appeared in Rogue One for a few seconds xD
"I just want an excuse to read the books" explains very well why as a dedicated reader of what is now called legends, I've not been engaged with any of the new canon EU content. I've checked out maybe 1 or 2 books and nothing has felt meaningful. Possibly because they made legends out of the stories I grew up with, but the lack of anything really large and engaging is part of it. I think you nailed it
We need Corusant in Battlefront 2.
I dont even play Battlefront 2 but i would buy it just to play a Coruscant map. That would be epic.
and they now stopped development, without adding coruscantat all, oh but Exegol? now THATS important. fucking EA twats.
Perhaps one of my biggest issues with the sequels was how small they made the galaxy feel again. The OT felt like the Galaxy wasn't as populated and more empty than it actually was. The prequels gave us a vastly populated and a very large Galaxy, but instead going off of that, they tried to make it more like the OT and it just made me not care about the planets or Galaxy itself anymore
Because they had to change it by 20% to get all the money from merchandise?
True or not, it's certainly suspicious isn't it?
If nothing else it's Disney marking their territory by using Lucas' stuff as little as possible.
And the Rise of Skywalker? Disney wouldn't have had so many callbacks there if they hadn't been scrambling to recover from The Last Jedi.
I don't know about coruscant merchandise tho. You got those?
OOM- 32 I carry all the god stuff
Including the sexy merchandise
@@oom-3262 I googled it there is a Planet Coruscant toy.
Underworlddream yep, got the LEGO coruscant
1.Lucasfilm is now run by NPCs instead of folks who love Star Wars.
2.Disney is run by NPCs instead of folks who love Disney.
The revelation of Coruscant in The Phantom Menace is still my favorite single moment of all the star Wars films!
This reminds me so well of something I've seen regular in corporations, those on the ground spend a ton of time coming up with a solution to a problem, including testing out tons of ideas. Finally everyone agress on what to do, but should the head of the dept be replaced before the fix is implimented the new guy ALWAYS scraps the plan and decides on something unevaluated or tested, so they can claim credit for all if it, and it almost always invariably fails, and they blame everyone but themselves.
When the character that crosses over most from one book series to another is Commandant Deenlark from the Royal Imperial Academy on Coruscant, you know you have a problem.
Which is?
@@kubli365 he's an officer in the Royal Academy who appears in both Lost Stars and Thrawn. And that's about all the crossover I've seen.
And he was an asshole too
One of the things I love about the Heir to the Empire adaptation that DarthAngelus is doing is seeing Luke and Leia on Coruscant.
I'm not a prequel fan but even I would have gotten a kick out of more nods to that in the sequels, like maybe the Resistance was using captured Venators alongside Imperial Star Destroyers against the Resurgents. Or Rebel troops using stolen and repainted Clone Trooper armour. It's the same way I wanted actual X-Wings in Revenge of the Sith instead or ARC-170s, to show there's a progression of technology over the whole saga rather than every trilogy stopping and starting.
I really think they should release the sword of the Jedi Trilogy and continue the legends timeline as a parallel universe like the marvel multiverse.
Oooh, that sounds like a trilogy about Jaina Solo. Yes, please!
I dunno how that'll work out. As much as I think that would be a good idea at this point, others might not think the same. I've always felt like Star Wars should have a pretty solid mythos with no alt timelines. Star Wars is a Fantasy epic in Space, alternate continuities almost feels like it cheapens the brand in a way. IDK, I just feel like something like that won't happen.
@@jaredmartin2003 Legends already is an alternate continuity. They are still selling the old novels and stuff, just not really adding anything new. Though there is some new stuff added to Legends via SWTOR. There are also other alternate timelines from before Disney in the form of Infinities.
Then they wouldn't sell any new stuff.
Thats sounds messy messier than 40k where there is no real canon
1:38 Wait, so if the capital was always moving ever few years, wouldn't that make it that much more difficult for the First Order to "control all the major systems within weeks,"?
If you have multiple planets, systems, political organizations and peoples/species that have experienced direct New Republic rule and posses some knowledge of galactic affairs, wouldn't they have an advantage over a First Order that was confined to the shadows of the Outer Rim and Unknown Regions, and was motivated in part by feelings of nostalgia towards a long dead and hated regime? Wouldn't they have been more than a little 'out of touch' and be faced with widespread opposition?
The entirety of the Disney Canon and its relationship to the Sequels feels like just one big case of the right hand not knowing what the left one was doing, and vice versa.
There's only one dumb reason:
DISNEY!
when you realize that collin trevorrow might have actually been able to justify the sequels and actually make them great but got fired for "creative differences"...
Can we all collectively agree the sequels don't exist
why?
Resist.. urge.. to explain..!
Star wars Ideas the fact that you need to ask
even the writers said you can just "hEaDcAnOn the bits you don't like out because it's all fake!"
@@cinemaandghostsproductions732 because Disney has done the same with "legend"
The Force Awakens shouldn’t have just destroyed the New Republic in one stroke. It should have shown us the outbreak of the war and show us the New Republic fighting back. Basically I’m suggesting that it starts as usual with the hunt for Luke Skywalker. And when Starkiller Base is revealed as a threat by Finn the Resistance contacts the New Republic saying Hosnian Prime is in danger from the First Order. Poe will then lead the Resistance fleet to Starkiller Base, Han, Chewie, Rey and Finn will go attack on the ground. And then when all Hope seems lost for the Resistance the New Republic Fleet will arrive. We will see this epic battle sequence and watch the New Republic at full strength. But Starkiller Bass will fire and the battle will be lost with Hosnian Prime destroyed. This will give so many benefits for the sequels I don’t know where to start. The New Republic will be shown in action, the First Order will feel threatening and powerful, Hosnian Prime will still be destroyed and we will see an overall more interesting sequel trilogy going forward. Starkiller Base could them be the forefront for a battle in 9 instead of Exegol. Honestly if the Sequels has taken more risks and been more interesting to begin with and have been planned out it all could have been so much better. I love the sequels but I can’t stand thinking of all the wasted potential of them.
As much as I liked Rey/Finn/Poe, the universe seems a lot smaller than the one in Legends. And while that might be coming eventually, I can only base my opinion on the Disney Canon that exists contemporaneously with the self that is forming the opinion.
*Stares in Rogue One, the Ahsoka arc of TCW season 7, Dooku Jedi Lost, Master & Apprentice, Obi-Wan and Anakin comic, Lost Stars, Queen's Shadow, Aftermath trilogy, multiple Forces of Destiny episodes, Leia: Princess of Alderaan, Dark Disciple, Charles Soule's Darth Vader comic, Tarkin novel, and the new Thrawn trilogy*
I disagree with what you said about coruscant not having a lived-in feeling. Definitely not in the films but in the clone wars it was always grimy and many things looked like they had gone decades or even centuries without cleaning.
Plus there was the scenes during the Speeder Chase in Episode II.
Coruscant's been featured in Disney canon, onscreen; Rogue One has a flashback to the Erso's apartment where they celebrate the Imperial contract with Krennic, Clone Wars final season had 3 (arguably bad) episodes set on Coruscant, and you know the Bad Batch is bound to have at least a few episodes with the galactic capitol as the main setting, given what's goin down galaxy-wide at that time.
Petition to decanonize the entire disney cannon
Look, an angry pack of Disney lawyers! Take cover! Hope that they don’t sue you.
@@eidechsentyp1236
Then we will make them bleed.
Make them lose as much money as possible and not give a single penny to them.
I officially sign the petition. Keep Kylo Ren and Solo: A Star Wars Story as canon though
SoggyWaffles24 We keep mandalorian, Solo, and Rogue one
The force awakens was good
Never ever change that outro !
Because the people who made these movies are middle aged folks that sided with the idea of "the prequels ruined star wars", yet they made worse movies than the prequels because of it.
No one respected George at the time these movies were made. And now that these movies are done and Clone Wars finished up, people suddenly love him again, including the prequel haters.
Those of us who stuck with George through all the drama and bullshit could tell there was something missing in Episode 7, while all the prequel haters loved it cause it specifically excluded prequel content.
And now that 8 and 9 wrapped up, these people wanna come out and say they loved George's work. They treated Clone Wars like a kid's show when it originally aired and NOW they want recognize its value.
Thanks for nothing, prequel haters. Hope you're happy with a trilogy that does nothing to world build and nothing to pay tribute to George's work. It's just like watching the Originals again!
Prequels > OT > Sequels
Despite all of my problems with TLJ, at least Rian Johnson acknowledged Palpatine being Darth Sidious and the downfall if the Jedi.
Meanwhile JJ couldn't even handle small nods to the prequels like flags from the Boonta Eve podrace being at Maz's castle. They were present in a trailer, but cut from the final version of the film.
@@spezi_korn2019 even if you prefer the OT, you can't just pretend the prequels don't exist. That's what these people did, and now they want to stand up and demand George back.
@Drake never said the originals were better than the prequels
"mas amedda was also there" sums up mas amedda perfectly
Because Jar jar Abrams and Kathleen Kennedy don't want coruscant back blame them even Disney.
@Eye Above All personally I think Crapleen works better, it kinda rolls of the tongue more naturally
I would say Coruscant is the SW version of ancient Rome in some ways. The eternal city, centre of the civilized world etc. But Rome was abandoned as capital which was Ravenna by some point in history. And that made sense after too many radical changes in government and so on. Same goes for Coruscant. The Clone Wars, the rise of the empire, the end of the senate (which was one of the major things defining "Coruscant" itself, many structures, millions of lives and most likely a big part of the planet´s economy was centered around this institution). With the senate gone (and Papa Palpatine surely eradicating lots of the structures that evolved around the senate during centuries) and the collapse of the empire there was simply a classic power vacuum which is usually taken advantage of by groups like the Black Sun. Without senate or emperor there was no galactic government whatsoever and Coruscant lost a major part of its identity because it was no longer the galactic capital or centre of power. The collapsing empire, growing stronger criminal factions... this will most likely damage the economy of Coruscant and just like Rome or Trantor (-> Foundation Trilogy by Isaac Asimov) the city was too large for its own good. All the ongoing trouble may have led to insufficient availability of power, food, water, clean air... maybe not enough freighters made their way to the planet. Then you have all those beings of different species and cultures certainly leading to violent conflicts that can no longer be fought against because the lack of a proper government. So after the fall of the empire Coruscant may just not have been "capital material" anymore. And the concept of a roaming capital may seem like a logistical nightmare but it also prevents some issues that evolved on Coruscant. First: An administration that has to move often will probably not be so oversized like the od senate. Second: The perception of time. Having actual periods (until the next move) may speed up the slow processes. Third: All those structures and diplomatic alliances between dynasties of senators, the criminal underground, the local economy and so on that played a big role in the senate´s way into corruption and decadence can not grow this easily if the capital does not stay on one planet for centuries. A senator can´t create his personal network across the planet or inherit the connections of his predecessors when the environment repeatedly changes.
There are surely more advantages of a galactic government not merging inseparable with one single planet. Like with the ancient Rome, the old system that has initially worked well but decayed over centuries ultimateley failed and had to be replaced. In one case by a smaller, new designed capital, in the other one by a roaming capital. Coruscant probably still was a symbol for the not so old old republic, high culture and maybe even the Jedi, just like Rome was still of symbolic value.
Star Wars fans "so, why isn´t Coruscant not even mentioned in the new saga?"
JJ Abramns "Coru- what?"
If JJ didn't make it he doesn't make money off it. Coruscant isn't there because JJ only works with things he owns and can get royalties off, that's the sci fi he understands.
If people were honest, the prequels are probably the best Star Wars movies we have in episodes 1-9 (except maybe for Empire): they combine the best stories + graphics + action. But the first six episodes (movies) are the best too - they tell a complete story, the rise and fall (and rise again) of Anakin Skywalker. But the first three are all about Anakin who is a much more developed character than Luke, esp. given the Clone Wars cartoon series.
Maybe it's just me but I can't help but feel like the concept of a roaming capital is incredibly stupid in Star Wars ar least.
As I understand the reason they give for the roaming capital is because they don't want any one planet to have to much power and influence in the New Republic, but unless your capital goes to every single planet in the New Republic than your just spreading the influence to various rich worlds. It doesn't address the problem that the Old Republic had of Outer Rim worlds being underrepresented and second class citizens compared to the Core Worlds. At best all it does is create pockets of underrepresented and second class planets spread between the various capital worlds. At worst it allows the capital worlds to thrive but leave the rest to rot.
Politically it's absurd and practically it's ludicrous because Starships and fuel in Star Wars is expensive and unless the New Republic provides transport for all of their ambassadors the only planets who can afford to regularly relocate their ambassadors and their staff would be rich and very important worlds, which would end up being the only worlds represented and would likely be the worlds that end up hosting the capital for a time.
Please do the entire Grand Army Of The Republic vs. The UNSC both universe full military power in a all out war. The Republic jedi leaders, the null class arc troopers, bad batch, 6 million-2 billion clones(depending on legends or not), clone commandos the entire Republic fleet against the UNSC marine core, ODSTs, all spartin programs, and UNSC fleets. I would like to really see this the clones who are breed for war vs the toughest marines humanity as to offer.
omg..... let me guess: Justin’s strat is boarding/capture ships
I’m glad they didn’t blow Coruscant up, but it doesn’t make any sense that it wasn’t even mentioned, it’s literally the centre of the galaxy. It would have been great if we had a sequel trilogy that went there and explored the old temple, maybe to find some hidden room or to learn something regarding Rays training. Not that she needs training as a perfect being...
It just genuinely bums me out. The whole thing. This trilogy could have been great. And it simply wasn’t even good. Not awful. But it’s just...it has nothing to offer at all. Just bums me out...what could have been. And now it’s canon forever.
What really made me mad is that they didn’t even show coruscant celebrating at the end of rise of skywalker
The sequels had the most boring planets, wow desert, Forest, snow Forrest! Originality! Ahahahahahah
Exegol is nice.
@@achaudhari101 yeah that actually looked pretty scary and cool I will admit, to bad it was in a crap movie
Eck underestimates how much we like his rambling videos.
I enjoy hearing his thoughts on topics like these.
The new trilogy was just a slap in the face to all our childhoods. It's just bad/lazy writing on top of it all.
*TFA was ok actually but I don't even want to talk about after that
0:36 reminds me of a highly updated version of the space battles in Star Wars Rebellion, an old 4X game.
Things i want to see. Republic Commando 2
A Rebellion remake.