When you think about it, a constellation theme actually makes way more sense. I've noticed that grass starters being extinct animals works because it's nature-related, water starters being semi-aquatic animals is a no brainer, but always wondered what the Chinese zodiac had to do with fire. Now I think I finally understand... fire starters are based off zodiacs in general, which are tied in with constellations made up of stars, and stars are literally burning balls of light that produce heat!
Extinct animals? I mean, yeah that works for Bulbasaur, whatever Meganium is meant to be, and possibly Treecko. But doesn't exactly work for Turtwig, Snivy, Chespin, Rowlet, Grookey, or Sprigatito
@@InhabitantOfOddworld snivy line might actually represent the theory that prehistoric snakes once had limbs, rowlet is an extinct owl from the past native to the Hawaii (?), Torterra aside from his mythical turtle inspiration, resembles an Ankylosaurus doesn't it?, Grooky prolly ancient apes representing how they used sticks LMAO, and sprigatitto is probably based from saber-toothed cats HAHAHA not accurately though but a Cat carrying a Saber/Rapier 🤣 I don't know about chespin but prolly an ancient Mammal that are ancestors of modern day pangolins, armadillo and the like, etc.
This makes a lot of sense. Gen 9 will be about exploration and both Portugal and Spain navigated the oceans by seeing stars and constellations. We even have the Lynx and the Swan and those could fit Sprigatito and Quaxly. The Legendaries are Lacerta.
Nice theory.i noticed out of the 3 generally agrees upon starter themes that the fire starter one was the most restrictive since there were only 12 so expanding that list definitely makes it fit better with the other starter themes
This theory actually makes a lot of sense I like the different points and it would be cool to see different fire starters based on constilations and zodiacs and animals featured in calendars from different civilizations throughout history
Exactly… I think the easiest explanation that people have been looking past is that the Pokémon company and gamefreak have been planning beyond 12 generations for a while, so there’s no point in expecting that all new fire starters will fit the Chinese zodiac all in succession. I really like this theory, though, it’s more explanatory and probably very true.
@@EspyJuju I don't get one thing, people call tigers and lions cats but don't call foxes dog? Even tho they are both in the canidae family (Latin for dog)
@@IanRomErv where I'm from we rarely use Latin names and we say foxes wolfs and dogs are all dogs, like how tigers lions and cats are all cats. Idk, it's a normal thing here so it's not as strange.
Honestly not a bad theory tbh, but I have some doubts about it. First, what about cyndaquil ? Because you said it is the rat however, cyndaquil is based on a solenodon or another animal of the same family as the hedgehogs, which means they’re not rodents. But, let’s say there is an answer to this, maybe the hedgehog is an animal in any astrology. Okay, but then, what about the grass starters and water starters. We had theories about them too but they’ve been denied, just like the fire starters theory. The thing is, I think I have an answer to all these issues. And this answer is the same as the answer to the issues of the pokémon chronology. For years, we had hints in the pokémon games to tell us which games happened before or after which games and we also had hints about how many years separated consecutive games. But then, beginning in gen5, this chronology became more vague. And today, I don’t even think we receive any new hint for the chronology in the games. So, what happened ? Well, I discussed this topic with friends but also pokémon youtubers with who we studied it and we came to the conclusion that Game Freak might have abandoned this chronology. Sad, very sad, but probably true since now, we don’t have these hints anymore and they even give us time travels to f*ck it all up lmao. And I think they might have done the same thing for the starters’ theme. The theories about the starters’ themes usually work for the older generations, but not quite for the newer ones. So, as sad as it sounds, I think it’s time to just let these theories go and discuss about other topics that game freak actually put purposefully in their games.
@@hennipap6800 first of all, since you only answer to a part of my comment, I'd like to know if you read my comment entirely. If not, please do. Also, you seem a bit too convinced that these theories still stand do I'd like to know if you are open minded enough to change your mind if you realize your arguments are not solid enough (because I do, if you bring me strong arguments, I could possibly change my mind and think these theories still stand)
This is the first time I heard of this theory. I think it is silly. It didn't hold up as early as gen 2. Cyndaquil is not a rat. It isn't anything close to a rat. It is a badger. It is hard to tell in the first stage. However the two evolved stages clarify things. This is clearly some badger. I can accept arguments for some other Mustilid. This is definitely not a rat or any kind of rodent. There is a huge difference between true rodents and mustrlids. I done some research online. I have found the connection. I looked up baby badger on Google images. I got it. That right there is the real life version of Cyndaquil. Just simplify the face stripes, exaggerate the baby proportions, make the color scheme a bit more colorful and add flames on the back. Then boom that is Cyndaquil. Gen 2 is good at sticking to more simplified and realistic designs. The Cyndaquil line is a good example of that. I like Gen 2. The first two gens stand out as two with the best designs. Gen 6 is good too. Everything else tends to be too overdesigned.
The only that Fuecoco becomes a part of the Chinese Zodiac is if its evolutions become more serpentine like Snivy. That could make be the Snake from the Chinese Zodiac. However, I agree with you on your theory. It makes sense that Game Freak would want to expand on their ideas for what the fire starters should be based on. And really, the Chinese Zodiac theory really didn’t make much sense to began with from all the way in Gen 2. Game Freak probably never decided on using the Chinese Zodiac as inspiration for the fire staters sense Cyndaquil wasn’t even a rat to begin with; it was more of a Shrew. It even evolved into more of a Badger by Typhlosion.
@@EspyJuju lol I hate when ppl try to discredit the theories on the starters but you had a interesting take that also seems true. Would love to hear your thoughts on the other starter theories.
I made some research regarding this topic, and got the following conclusion: All Zodiac Animals have their Fire Starter Pokémon counterpart. However not every Fire Starter represents a Zodiac Animal in their generation. Fennekin and Fuecoco does not belong to the Zodiac. There are no Fox, nor Crocodile in the Chinese Zodiac. However… There are 14 animals listed in the Japanese version of a TALE that explains how the Zodiac order were decided. The Tale starts with god desire to create an annual Calendar, with a cycle of 12 years, with animals as theme. He wrote several letters and spread worldwide inviting all animals to a race to his home, the 12 first to arrive will become a year representative of the Zodiac. Only 13 made the journey in time, others just had no interest, or just gave up in the middle. The 12 are the ones we know. The 13th were a Frog. Despite his effort to convince god to make an exception and include his species, it was upmost denied. So, the Frog just gave up and said he was going home. This is a Japanese joke, once the word “Kaeru” may mean “going home” or “frog” (also may mean “can buy” and “change”) The 14th is a Cat, but this one even managed to start the race, once the Rat misinformed it about the race’s time. The Cat did not read the letter as it were napping. But eventually, the Cat figured about it and rushed towards the god’s home. Again, god denied an exception, even knowing the Cat’s reason for being late. Since then the Cat hunts the Rat as retribution. This story explains why the Cat, a common critter, are not on the Chinese Calendar. Now, we link the points. Greninja, a Frog, and Meowscarada, a Cat, has a Fire Starter that does not fit on the Chinese Calendar in their generation. Neither are Fire type, like how their animal counterpart did not managed to be in the Calendar. Both have Protean, an ability that allows theoretically become a Fire type temporary. Cinderace, an official Zodiac member has Libero, that is identical to Protean. This is to separate it from the other two. Both becomes bipedal at the final evolution, a trait shared by the official Zodiac Fire Starters. Interestingly Meowscarada is the fastest of all Starters, maybe referring the rush to the god’s home.
Thats just made up and not making sense. Spriggi is a "Saberthooth" hence the theorie with extinct animals and a frog is just semiaquatic und Greninja is the assasin hence the 6th gen has roleplay as a theme of the starters
I like this theory and I think there is plenty of merit to it. The Pokemon Company has dabbled in so many different cultures that I wouldn't put it past them to use something from another. I also like the idea of a scorpion starter(even though they remind me of spiders)😅
Foxes are actually canine (even though they feel so much like felines) so it wasn't a stretch at all to have them representing the Dog. The theory itself is nice, but it's boring if only the fire starter have such logic behind their choices, so what's the theory behind the grass/water types?
I’m lost as to why folks keep forcing this zodiac theory for such a small subset of Pokémon when The Company hasn’t hinted towards it and they don’t have any similar methods for the grass and water starters…? Why would they have such a method for one element of starter Pokémon when starters typically have shared themes. There’s also 3 obvious exceptions that fans seem to either gloss over or highly stretch their reason to make it fit, which just makes the zodiac theory less credible.
Na they do. They have shared themes as a gen i.e. Alola starters bases off circus entertainment, but each grass, water, and fire share themes fire starters based off chinese zodiac (debatable) hence why we are here water starters are based off of weapons blastoise is based off cannons and feraligatr is brass knuckles ect, grass starters are all based off extinct animals
@@CharlesCurtisIII you’re right about the first part in Galar the starters are based around iconic British entertainment but no the grass starters aren’t based on extinct animals because literally every living species on this planet has an extinct ancestor. Also water starters don’t have themes based on weapons Swampert has an ancient Romanian helmet which isn’t a weapon it’s a peace of armor, Primerina doesn’t have any weapons as well and even Fraligator doesn’t people stretch it to have the brass knuckles. Blastoise wasn’t even designed to be a starter since gen 1 had 2 water turtles lines and they decided to cut Wartortle evolution and Blastoise pre evolution and link the 2 lines together due to cartridge limitations. Dr lava and DYKG covered this and I strongly recommend checking the cut Pokémon info we know about gen 1 and 2
@@nazeersadek6705 I’m not about to argue with ur flat ass face homeboy. ur using semantics armor/weapon all in the same category -Combat. & Yes the grass starters are Meganium (Magyarosaurus) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magyarosaurus Sceptile (Sinosaurus) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinosaurus Torterra (Edmontonia) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmontonia Serperior (Titanoboa) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanoboa Chesnaught (Glyptodon) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyptodon Decidueye (Grallistrix) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stilt-owl Primarina = a military spy or espionage in general. (Still combat related) “ And that might sound crazy, but like Empoleon, this might be a case where she's based on a specific historical figure. Who's the most famous military spy in history? Mata Hari. For those who don't know their WWI history, Mata Hari was a famed dancer who was accused by the French of spying for the Germans during WWI. She confessed to the crime and was executed by the French army. If you look up a picture of her, you'll see that she was usually decked out in jewels (like Primarina) and a lot of the time, wore a long, flowing blue skirt (again, like Primarina). Basically, her dancing uniform was laid out almost exactly like Primarina's look. Popplio and Brionne's names in Japanese end in "mari" like Mata Hari. But, its just a theory. “
So it is expanding beyond just the Chinese Zodiac to include all Zodiacs, or at least ones related to that region. I honestly didn't k ow there was more than the Chinese Zodiac and the Celestial Zodiac, or what ever the one we use commonly in the US, but it doesn't surprise me. Makes me wonder how they represent the calendar differently from each other.
I know I saw a meme where some had pointed out that a male and female crocodiles are referred to by bovine terms(cow, bull), thus I think a few Fire Starter Zodiac theorists are associating Fuecoco with the bull.
I never understood why people considered Fenekin the "rule breaker" by being a fox and not a straight up dog. foxes are part of the Canidae family and therefore a canine. foxes are also very closely related to the species that became domesticated dogs. meanwhile Cindaquil is "a mouse" and not a rat, yet nobody called him a rule breaker if the final evolution of Fuecoco is serpent-like or even Quetzalcoatl inspired, he will fit into the snake spot of the zodiac, and the theory will live on
I will never understand how you come up with these theories, I swear your brain works on another level hahaha. Awesome theory, and totally plausible! I’m excited to see if it’s supported in future generations!! Also amazing to see the views this video is getting already!!
It's a solid theory.The only way the new starter is a part of the Chinese zodiac is if it gains bull like characteristics in it's evolution like horns, and becomes a bull/crocodile mix. Another thing game freak could do if make the starters have 2 origins like they do for the legendaries. That way each starter fits in 2 different groups of zodiac
And if it's just what its advertised on the wrapper, "Fire Croc" then it's time to admit Fennekin isn't a dog either. We can argue back and forth on the rat and dragon thing, but if just a regular crocodile happens then it's time to admit a fox is a fox. It's time to let Fire Starters be as open to animal choice as the other two starters.
@@namegoeshere5220 I agree, yeah fennikin was always pushing it. Yes a fox is a canine but that shouldn't mean they are interchangeable. The only thing that saves cyndaquil is that it's labeled the fire mouse.
I would like to address your Question regarding what GF could do beyond Gen 12, if they where to keep this Theme running. They could have switched the Themes for the Starter Pokemon with eachother. Meaning they would then design the Waterstarters after a Zodiac (not necaserly the Cinese one, i would love to see a Water Skorpion Starter) the Grassstarters after Weapons, and the Firestarters after extinct or nearly extinct Animals. And once Gen 24 closes out, they can do another switch, making Fire Weapons, Water extinction and Grass Zodiac.
Yea...but Makar is not a crocodile... It's more like an aquatic dragon.. it's a mythological creature., It is regarded to be the Vahana of Goddess Ganga
I think that is a wonderful idea! But honestly I think fuecoco become a flying snake... Mostly due to the fact that Quetzalcoatl is a big part of the Mayan culture and if they had an India reference for the UK region they are gonna have a Mayan for the IP region
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According to the original story of how each animal became part of the Chinese Zodiacs, there was also a cat that tried to become part of the ranking, but failed for one reason or another. If the fire type starter zodiacs theory is true, then on gen 13, they should make a fire type starter that's just a depressed house cat. Not a tiger or a lion, but literally just a house cat.
The Zodiac theory hasn't been a thing since Gen 2; Typhlosion ain't no rat! And unless there's an important badger in some other Zodiac it's all moot... Also I know the Pyroar thing was a joke, but it's not ridiculous for starters to repeat common Pokemon, just look at Quaxly who is another Water duck...
Typholision IS a rat! Its the fire rat from the tale "Taketori Monogatari". A very old japanese folktale. The abilty is a big hint, because the fire rat has fire resistant furr.
Interesting theory, I've never even heard of the original Chinese Zodiac theory but it was fascinating. My other two observations though were that 1) I can't believe "Pokémon" isn't the video title, such an important key word, and 2) I feel like it's a little odd how when your character/avatar/trainer art/whatever you want call it comes onscreen, you put the entire image on there. I feel like it always looks better when it's a little more zoomed in and we can just see the torso/upper body Anyways feel free to disregard my unsolicited advice, I already hit like, subscribed, and commented so what more could you ask for
In Old Russian astrology there is actually, a FOX constellation, which comes before the new moon Hare, Wolf and Bear thus, are compatible with the Zoduac theory)
I like this theory, if this is the way it is, then maybe one day, we will get a fire starter that is my Celtic Horoscope Sign a Seahorse. I'm thinking it will be fire and flying, and in it's second stage it will fly horizontally with the ground and look kinda like an airplane and shoot out fire cannon balls. Then in its 3rd stage, it will fly vertically again, and look like a combination of knight armour and a hovercraft, with flames coming out from behind the individual pieces of armour. with horizontal prepellars for the hovercraft flying ability. Look out Charizard!
I like this theory, personally, based on the leaks, I assumed fuecoco and its evolutions were based on a basilisk (basically a giant rooster with reptilian parts or a giant reptile (normaly snake or crocodile) with rooster parts depending on who's telling the story) and that's how it aligned the the theory. But this one is much better.
I had a couple theories on the future of Pokémon if they continued the franchise past 13 generations. The first theory is that they just switch the the starter themes. For example, the zodiac signs for water, ancient beasts. For fire fire, and weapons for grass 🤷🏾♂️ Or We can finally get regional variants of Some of the older starters, but with untraditional type trios like flying fighting and rock, or as I like to call it, the Rock Paper Scissors trio lol
Upon seeing that connection you made between the goat and crocodile in astrology, I think that means Fuecoco could still evolve to get goat horns and that could satisfy the Chinese Zodiac theory as well as your theory about the star constellations.
At first I thought fuecoco would stretch into a snake when it evolves. But don't worry, the zodiac theory is still true because the crocodile is part of a zodiac, just a different one than the last 8 fire type starters.
Another zodiac? If you see this reply how do I find that zodiac because I wanna see it, not for proof but because I'm interested in the prospect of another zodiac.
This would also make Cyndaquil actually fit in as there is the Lonely Not Alone Hedgehog Constellation, also known as the Cepheus Constellation or the King Constellation which fits with Typhlosion's Japanese name has noy only Bakufū but also Bakufu which means Military Government aka the Shogunate. I wouldn't be suprised if this all is still a coincidence because all the fire starters are also similar to fire related animals in mythology too (I mean hell, the Sobek is a fire Nile Crocdile which Skeledirge is based on, the Dragon was a Lizard that Breathed Fire, the Kitsune is a Fire Fox, etc)
Idk if you're referring to something else but Sobek is the Egyptian god of the Nile River. I don't know of any association with fire and Sobek. My guess is you're using the wrong name for what you're talking about
I like the theory. However, if it's true I hope that GF will continue making some on the Chinese Zodiac. The goat, bull, and snake could all make for very fun pokemon that we haven't seen yet.
The Zodiac Theory wasn't ruined in gen 9, it was debunked in Gen 2. Yes, Cyndaquil is the fire MOUSE (not rat) in the english pokedex, but it's quite clearly an echidna (which aren't even rodents) and the japanese name refers to a porcupine. Plus, Quilava and typhlosion abandon the mouse name.
What if Fuecoco evolve into Fire/Ghost Pokemon and his arm will become ethereal/ghost-like. My explanation is the region of Paldea (Gen 9) is based on Spain/Portugal and those country are well known for exploration and spreading the religion of Catholic . And in Genesis, it is stated that the snake have arms but taken away by God for deceiving Eve. Maybe Fuecoco will Evolve into Fire/ Dark,Ghost or Psychic
Now this would be fun to implement. Perhaps a creature that fills it's hands with things like rocks and has to be "in balance" on both sides but uses them as weapons?
@@EspyJuju that could be cool. Have some weight based moves. I could see it being a pretty tanky pokemon. Maybe having moves that let it "equal out" things like pain split. It could also have a decent special attack since libra are known for being fairly intellectual. It can be considered a "waifu" mon since libra is governed by venus, the goddess of beauty. There's quite a lot that they can do with this concept.
Cyndaquil is an amalgamation of many rodents. Dominantly an echidna, hedghog, or porcupine. There are porcupine constellations in some world cultures such as the Navajo. 😊
I was fully on board with the fire starters following the Chinese Zodiac. Fennekin look enough like a dog to fit. Foxes are part of the Canidae family which also includes dogs. When Fuecoco was announced, I assumed it would turn into a snake similar to the Snivy line, but I did entertain the theory that it would become a reptilian bull- all they had to do was give Skeledirge horns. This theory is one I've always believed and still do. There are only 4 animals left from the Chinese Zodiac so, eventually it would be replaced with a new theme. I didn't expect it to be so soon though. I do think that moving forward fire starters will be from any zodiac or just constellations in general because that gives options to pick from.
I do think that for the fire starter zodiac it might be the line as a whole instead of the first form so depending on what fuecoco evolves into it might still fit one of them
@@EspyJuju yeah. There have been a few theories out there about it becoming either a snake or a horse which seem at least plausible. I think the horse one would be funny cause it would throw a lot of people. There is a video about it somewhere
If rumours are true, it will have a fire rooster on its head in final form….could be that they’re going around the Chinese zodiac again and he’s loosely based on the rooster?
Even if they did that it would seem the rooster would just be an accent piece not the larger part of the Pokemon design so I personally think it would be a bit of a stretch to say they are doing the rooster again.
@@IanRomErv I don’t remember seeing phoenix on the zodiac chart? Rooster makes more sense to me even with Torchic. Makes much more sense that they’d repeat the zodiac than to deviate from it after keeping to it for 8 generations.
Inspiration doesn't have to be Literal Snake & Crocodile are both Reptiles. Fox and Dog are both Canine. How bout a worm does that not have similarities to a Snake. what about Snivy having arms? or a Wolf & coyote being sometimes mistaken for dogs??
Thoo.. like we know cindaquil represent the rat signe but are more phylogeneticaly near of marsupial/elephant/bear dependly of which state of his evolution line we choose... so basically, game freack dont take zodiac litteraly but more in a morph/corpus alike or in a similarity ... so yes fuecoco can represent snake because its a reptile (more like in the common sense of reptile not in the genetical sense). So yes, game freak play with words And also maybe restrictive but also legit, like game freak cant make new pokemon generation until everyone die ahahha that will be an end... ans yes maybe we are near of it: that not mean that will not ahve some new pokemon or new forms sometimes or new games or new region ... but just not entirely new pokedex but also... it have a lot of living creature that pokemon dont be inspired yet
If Fuecoco is somehow apart of the Chinese Zodiac then I think it's actually doing the Dragon Zodiac again. It would make sense since Scarlet and Violet are sort of setting themselves up as Psuedo reboots in a sense, trying to create a new fresh game by including new ideas (like some of the crazy stuff that leakers have said about the gimmick and new ideas for regional forms) also innovating on old ideas (like the new pokemon centers) but still keeping a lot of the core ideas of the pokemon franchise. The reboot stuff also plays on the Past and Future themes of these games. The idea that Fuecoco is not in the Chinese Zodiac still works with this idea, in fact even better in it but Fuecoco possibly being another Dragon Zodiac starter could make sense
This is a really good theory, and makes more sense now how Fuecoco fits. Are there any beliefs where Cynaquil could fit besides the Chinese Zodiac? Reason I ask is because it doesn’t look like a mouse.
Cyndaquil is a tough area bc it takes so much inspiration from many rodents. There are many constellations that exist in only certain cultures and some fit better, such as a Porcupine constellation some cultures believe in.
Foxs and dogs split off from each other a few million years ago at most, Archosaurs and Squamates split apart about 300 million years ago. Snakes are MUCH less closely related to crocodilians than platypuses are to you.
The venonat/venomoth thing isn't a theory, i'm pretty sure someone got the beta red or blue(or green) If Fuecoco's evolution is a Snake with legs(despite starting as a crocodile) or gains horns to be more Bull like the Main Zodiac could work. This expanded zodiac to include other cultures based on the region seems like a 5d chess move. Its smart considering every new region they make will have some cultural spin outside of China/Japan.
There may no such thing as Crocodile in Chinese zodiac, but I want to Fuecoco for representing the snake symbol. And I've got lots of reasons. Crocodiles are like snake, because they are reptiles with scales, are crawling animals and have a long long body that can support the heat. The designers though that children like the starters with arms and legs. And here's one good scientific reason. Did you know that snakes ancestor was a quadrupede creature that lived in jurrasic times over 2.000.000.000 B.C ? It's true ! Take a look of the Tetrapodophis, for example. It's one of the snakes ancestors. This is going to solve skeledirge's zodiac problem. What do you think ? 😀
Foxes are cannids wich is the group of dogs , wolves , foxes , fennecs … fennekin isn’t a dog it intinuate one so it’s not that weird . Tho what makes less sense is cyndaquil wich is a echidna turning stoat turning badger . None of them are even related to rats !
@@sanguinetales that’s a mistranslation since its Japanese name is a combination of hi (fire) and yama-arashi (porcupine) and suggests that it might in fact be based on a porcupine, although it is definitely a wordplay on hi no arashi, which means 'storm of fire’
The last common ancestor of all mammals, from elephants to kangaroos to platypus, split off around 190 million years ago. By comparison, the archosaurs(crocodilians and birds) split from the lepidosaurs(lizards and snakes) around 300 million years ago, so you are significantly closer to a platypus then a crocodile is to a snake.
When you think about it, a constellation theme actually makes way more sense. I've noticed that grass starters being extinct animals works because it's nature-related, water starters being semi-aquatic animals is a no brainer, but always wondered what the Chinese zodiac had to do with fire. Now I think I finally understand... fire starters are based off zodiacs in general, which are tied in with constellations made up of stars, and stars are literally burning balls of light that produce heat!
It all comes together!
Does that mean Charmander is based on Draco?
Extinct animals? I mean, yeah that works for Bulbasaur, whatever Meganium is meant to be, and possibly Treecko.
But doesn't exactly work for Turtwig, Snivy, Chespin, Rowlet, Grookey, or Sprigatito
@@InhabitantOfOddworld snivy line might actually represent the theory that prehistoric snakes once had limbs, rowlet is an extinct owl from the past native to the Hawaii (?), Torterra aside from his mythical turtle inspiration, resembles an Ankylosaurus doesn't it?, Grooky prolly ancient apes representing how they used sticks LMAO, and sprigatitto is probably based from saber-toothed cats HAHAHA not accurately though but a Cat carrying a Saber/Rapier 🤣 I don't know about chespin but prolly an ancient Mammal that are ancestors of modern day pangolins, armadillo and the like, etc.
@Haren Punzalan
Keep reaching bucko, you're doing some good stretching
This makes a lot of sense. Gen 9 will be about exploration and both Portugal and Spain navigated the oceans by seeing stars and constellations. We even have the Lynx and the Swan and those could fit Sprigatito and Quaxly. The Legendaries are Lacerta.
Welp, we were close
Nice theory.i noticed out of the 3 generally agrees upon starter themes that the fire starter one was the most restrictive since there were only 12 so expanding that list definitely makes it fit better with the other starter themes
Nice profile pic
@@channelrandom2225 thanks
This theory actually makes a lot of sense I like the different points and it would be cool to see different fire starters based on constilations and zodiacs and animals featured in calendars from different civilizations throughout history
Would be super awesome to see!
Exactly… I think the easiest explanation that people have been looking past is that the Pokémon company and gamefreak have been planning beyond 12 generations for a while, so there’s no point in expecting that all new fire starters will fit the Chinese zodiac all in succession. I really like this theory, though, it’s more explanatory and probably very true.
And a super broad idea to pull from in my opinion!
@@EspyJuju I don't get one thing, people call tigers and lions cats but don't call foxes dog? Even tho they are both in the canidae family (Latin for dog)
@@aleksabanjevic8316 Because foxes haven’t been domesticated like wolves.
@@IanRomErv where I'm from we rarely use Latin names and we say foxes wolfs and dogs are all dogs, like how tigers lions and cats are all cats. Idk, it's a normal thing here so it's not as strange.
Honestly not a bad theory tbh, but I have some doubts about it. First, what about cyndaquil ? Because you said it is the rat however, cyndaquil is based on a solenodon or another animal of the same family as the hedgehogs, which means they’re not rodents. But, let’s say there is an answer to this, maybe the hedgehog is an animal in any astrology. Okay, but then, what about the grass starters and water starters. We had theories about them too but they’ve been denied, just like the fire starters theory.
The thing is, I think I have an answer to all these issues. And this answer is the same as the answer to the issues of the pokémon chronology. For years, we had hints in the pokémon games to tell us which games happened before or after which games and we also had hints about how many years separated consecutive games. But then, beginning in gen5, this chronology became more vague. And today, I don’t even think we receive any new hint for the chronology in the games. So, what happened ? Well, I discussed this topic with friends but also pokémon youtubers with who we studied it and we came to the conclusion that Game Freak might have abandoned this chronology. Sad, very sad, but probably true since now, we don’t have these hints anymore and they even give us time travels to f*ck it all up lmao. And I think they might have done the same thing for the starters’ theme. The theories about the starters’ themes usually work for the older generations, but not quite for the newer ones. So, as sad as it sounds, I think it’s time to just let these theories go and discuss about other topics that game freak actually put purposefully in their games.
All starters have theories. What are you talking about "denied"? Thats just not true.
@@hennipap6800 first of all, since you only answer to a part of my comment, I'd like to know if you read my comment entirely. If not, please do. Also, you seem a bit too convinced that these theories still stand do I'd like to know if you are open minded enough to change your mind if you realize your arguments are not solid enough (because I do, if you bring me strong arguments, I could possibly change my mind and think these theories still stand)
I love the idea, however Fuecoco becoming a snake isn’t totally off the table, with the existence of the Serpens constellation.
Never know what can happen with Pokemon! Hoping we get to see some more info on these games soon!
I know the leaks and I think fuecoco is better than a snake when it evolves even though I don’t know what it actually looks like.
It’s so cute and frankly! I’m actually torn between Sprigatito and Fuecoco. I’m waiting on their evolutions to make my choice.
Well...how do i put this?
It was wrong
I mean foxes are CLOSELY related with dogs so fennekin makes sense for the original theory but besides that this is a really good alternate theory.
That was a solid theory and considering Fuecoco you’re most likely correct
Fuecoco definitely makes it seem pretty solid in my opinion!
i still find it an huge coincidence that all fire starters are fire type
Now you're thinking. 🤔
This is the first time I heard of this theory. I think it is silly. It didn't hold up as early as gen 2. Cyndaquil is not a rat. It isn't anything close to a rat. It is a badger. It is hard to tell in the first stage. However the two evolved stages clarify things. This is clearly some badger. I can accept arguments for some other Mustilid. This is definitely not a rat or any kind of rodent. There is a huge difference between true rodents and mustrlids. I done some research online. I have found the connection. I looked up baby badger on Google images. I got it. That right there is the real life version of Cyndaquil. Just simplify the face stripes, exaggerate the baby proportions, make the color scheme a bit more colorful and add flames on the back. Then boom that is Cyndaquil. Gen 2 is good at sticking to more simplified and realistic designs. The Cyndaquil line is a good example of that. I like Gen 2. The first two gens stand out as two with the best designs. Gen 6 is good too. Everything else tends to be too overdesigned.
I have seen someone who loves the zodiac theory so much that he says fuecoco is a horse😂😂
Really have to make it work. 😅
came for the pokemon, stayed for the astronomy
As an avid stargazer, I couldn't resist. 🙏🏼
YES!!!! THERE'S STILL A PATTERN!!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH OH MY GOD I NEEDED THIS!!!
It's what I do. 😁
The only that Fuecoco becomes a part of the Chinese Zodiac is if its evolutions become more serpentine like Snivy. That could make be the Snake from the Chinese Zodiac. However, I agree with you on your theory. It makes sense that Game Freak would want to expand on their ideas for what the fire starters should be based on. And really, the Chinese Zodiac theory really didn’t make much sense to began with from all the way in Gen 2. Game Freak probably never decided on using the Chinese Zodiac as inspiration for the fire
staters sense Cyndaquil wasn’t even a rat to begin with; it was more of a Shrew. It even evolved into more of a Badger by Typhlosion.
I wonder if there’s a mouse constellation or something similar.
I had my fingers on homerow ready to fight you but this actually made sense. I'm going with this now.
You can still fight me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@EspyJuju lol I hate when ppl try to discredit the theories on the starters but you had a interesting take that also seems true. Would love to hear your thoughts on the other starter theories.
@@martonyomchale342 hoping to get there down the line!
We need to wait and see the final evolution
I made some research regarding this topic, and got the following conclusion:
All Zodiac Animals have their Fire Starter Pokémon counterpart.
However not every Fire Starter represents a Zodiac Animal in their generation.
Fennekin and Fuecoco does not belong to the Zodiac. There are no Fox, nor Crocodile in the Chinese Zodiac.
However…
There are 14 animals listed in the Japanese version of a TALE that explains how the Zodiac order were decided.
The Tale starts with god desire to create an annual Calendar, with a cycle of 12 years, with animals as theme.
He wrote several letters and spread worldwide inviting all animals to a race to his home, the 12 first to arrive will become a year representative of the Zodiac. Only 13 made the journey in time, others just had no interest, or just gave up in the middle.
The 12 are the ones we know.
The 13th were a Frog. Despite his effort to convince god to make an exception and include his species, it was upmost denied. So, the Frog just gave up and said he was going home.
This is a Japanese joke, once the word “Kaeru” may mean “going home” or “frog” (also may mean “can buy” and “change”)
The 14th is a Cat, but this one even managed to start the race, once the Rat misinformed it about the race’s time. The Cat did not read the letter as it were napping. But eventually, the Cat figured about it and rushed towards the god’s home. Again, god denied an exception, even knowing the Cat’s reason for being late. Since then the Cat hunts the Rat as retribution.
This story explains why the Cat, a common critter, are not on the Chinese Calendar.
Now, we link the points.
Greninja, a Frog, and Meowscarada, a Cat, has a Fire Starter that does not fit on the Chinese Calendar in their generation.
Neither are Fire type, like how their animal counterpart did not managed to be in the Calendar.
Both have Protean, an ability that allows theoretically become a Fire type temporary.
Cinderace, an official Zodiac member has Libero, that is identical to Protean. This is to separate it from the other two.
Both becomes bipedal at the final evolution, a trait shared by the official Zodiac Fire Starters.
Interestingly Meowscarada is the fastest of all Starters, maybe referring the rush to the god’s home.
Thats just made up and not making sense. Spriggi is a "Saberthooth" hence the theorie with extinct animals and a frog is just semiaquatic und Greninja is the assasin hence the 6th gen has roleplay as a theme of the starters
I like this theory and I think there is plenty of merit to it. The Pokemon Company has dabbled in so many different cultures that I wouldn't put it past them to use something from another. I also like the idea of a scorpion starter(even though they remind me of spiders)😅
Thanks weeb! Fire scorpion could be SO SICK.
This makes the most sense
Thank you!
Foxes are actually canine (even though they feel so much like felines) so it wasn't a stretch at all to have them representing the Dog. The theory itself is nice, but it's boring if only the fire starter have such logic behind their choices, so what's the theory behind the grass/water types?
I’m lost as to why folks keep forcing this zodiac theory for such a small subset of Pokémon when The Company hasn’t hinted towards it and they don’t have any similar methods for the grass and water starters…? Why would they have such a method for one element of starter Pokémon when starters typically have shared themes. There’s also 3 obvious exceptions that fans seem to either gloss over or highly stretch their reason to make it fit, which just makes the zodiac theory less credible.
Na they do. They have shared themes as a gen i.e. Alola starters bases off circus entertainment, but each grass, water, and fire share themes
fire starters based off chinese zodiac (debatable) hence why we are here
water starters are based off of weapons blastoise is based off cannons and feraligatr is brass knuckles ect,
grass starters are all based off extinct animals
@@CharlesCurtisIII you’re right about the first part in Galar the starters are based around iconic British entertainment but no the grass starters aren’t based on extinct animals because literally every living species on this planet has an extinct ancestor. Also water starters don’t have themes based on weapons Swampert has an ancient Romanian helmet which isn’t a weapon it’s a peace of armor, Primerina doesn’t have any weapons as well and even Fraligator doesn’t people stretch it to have the brass knuckles. Blastoise wasn’t even designed to be a starter since gen 1 had 2 water turtles lines and they decided to cut Wartortle evolution and Blastoise pre evolution and link the 2 lines together due to cartridge limitations. Dr lava and DYKG covered this and I strongly recommend checking the cut Pokémon info we know about gen 1 and 2
@@nazeersadek6705 I’m not about to argue with ur flat ass face homeboy. ur using semantics armor/weapon all in the same category -Combat. & Yes the grass starters are
Meganium (Magyarosaurus) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magyarosaurus
Sceptile (Sinosaurus) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinosaurus
Torterra (Edmontonia) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmontonia
Serperior (Titanoboa) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanoboa
Chesnaught (Glyptodon) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyptodon
Decidueye (Grallistrix) more info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stilt-owl
Primarina = a military spy or espionage in general. (Still combat related)
“ And that might sound crazy, but like Empoleon, this might be a case where she's based on a specific historical figure. Who's the most famous military spy in history? Mata Hari. For those who don't know their WWI history, Mata Hari was a famed dancer who was accused by the French of spying for the Germans during WWI. She confessed to the crime and was executed by the French army. If you look up a picture of her, you'll see that she was usually decked out in jewels (like Primarina) and a lot of the time, wore a long, flowing blue skirt (again, like Primarina). Basically, her dancing uniform was laid out almost exactly like Primarina's look. Popplio and Brionne's names in Japanese end in "mari" like Mata Hari. But, its just a theory. “
So it is expanding beyond just the Chinese Zodiac to include all Zodiacs, or at least ones related to that region. I honestly didn't k ow there was more than the Chinese Zodiac and the Celestial Zodiac, or what ever the one we use commonly in the US, but it doesn't surprise me. Makes me wonder how they represent the calendar differently from each other.
Ok I kinda like the astrology theme for the fire starters.
I just realized that there’s also a porcupine constellation!! You know Cyndaquil!! You really might be onto something here
I know I saw a meme where some had pointed out that a male and female crocodiles are referred to by bovine terms(cow, bull), thus I think a few Fire Starter Zodiac theorists are associating Fuecoco with the bull.
I never understood why people considered Fenekin the "rule breaker" by being a fox and not a straight up dog. foxes are part of the Canidae family and therefore a canine. foxes are also very closely related to the species that became domesticated dogs. meanwhile Cindaquil is "a mouse" and not a rat, yet nobody called him a rule breaker
if the final evolution of Fuecoco is serpent-like or even Quetzalcoatl inspired, he will fit into the snake spot of the zodiac, and the theory will live on
Skeledirge has an elongated body like a serpent but is a crocodile much like typhlosion is not a rat
I will never understand how you come up with these theories, I swear your brain works on another level hahaha. Awesome theory, and totally plausible! I’m excited to see if it’s supported in future generations!! Also amazing to see the views this video is getting already!!
I just watch those super creative TH-camrs like Pokeferlax until I get inspired. 😉
wait omg its both of my favourite youtubers
@@lucarionite452 if you like both of us you should check out this podcast episode that features both of us! th-cam.com/video/RGVqz3b2Cms/w-d-xo.html
@@EspyJuju oh thx so much ima watch it
100% agree, I’ve never thought it being restricted to just the Chinese calendar made much sense but this does.
Thank you Izzie!
It's a solid theory.The only way the new starter is a part of the Chinese zodiac is if it gains bull like characteristics in it's evolution like horns, and becomes a bull/crocodile mix. Another thing game freak could do if make the starters have 2 origins like they do for the legendaries. That way each starter fits in 2 different groups of zodiac
And if it's just what its advertised on the wrapper, "Fire Croc" then it's time to admit Fennekin isn't a dog either. We can argue back and forth on the rat and dragon thing, but if just a regular crocodile happens then it's time to admit a fox is a fox.
It's time to let Fire Starters be as open to animal choice as the other two starters.
@@namegoeshere5220 I agree, yeah fennikin was always pushing it. Yes a fox is a canine but that shouldn't mean they are interchangeable. The only thing that saves cyndaquil is that it's labeled the fire mouse.
I would like to address your Question regarding what GF could do beyond Gen 12, if they where to keep this Theme running. They could have switched the Themes for the Starter Pokemon with eachother. Meaning they would then design the Waterstarters after a Zodiac (not necaserly the Cinese one, i would love to see a Water Skorpion Starter) the Grassstarters after Weapons, and the Firestarters after extinct or nearly extinct Animals. And once Gen 24 closes out, they can do another switch, making Fire Weapons, Water extinction and Grass Zodiac.
That would be a fun idea!
The mental image that cute, unassuming Fuecoco could be based on the eldritch nightmare that is Cipactli is hilarious
It would be so good. Lol. Cthulhu starter next!
Yea...but Makar is not a crocodile... It's more like an aquatic dragon.. it's a mythological creature., It is regarded to be the Vahana of Goddess Ganga
I think that is a wonderful idea! But honestly I think fuecoco become a flying snake... Mostly due to the fact that Quetzalcoatl is a big part of the Mayan culture and if they had an India reference for the UK region they are gonna have a Mayan for the IP region
Definitely will have to see what happens with fuecoco in the future!
If you're liking the content feel free to check out my Pokemon Podcast "Loafing Around": th-cam.com/channels/-M3d1pq2i5IaK6DnXEHhWQ.html
My Channel's Discord: discord.gg/QRGqvUFkp3
And of course, the pre-theories and jokes I put on Twitter: twitter.com/EspyJujuYT
According to the original story of how each animal became part of the Chinese Zodiacs, there was also a cat that tried to become part of the ranking, but failed for one reason or another. If the fire type starter zodiacs theory is true, then on gen 13, they should make a fire type starter that's just a depressed house cat. Not a tiger or a lion, but literally just a house cat.
We already have Litten.
@@IanRomErv Litten is a young tiger, not a house cat
Also, that would only makes sense in a vietnam based region.
Unless fuecoco evolves into a horse, which is still an interesting idea on the table
The Zodiac theory hasn't been a thing since Gen 2; Typhlosion ain't no rat! And unless there's an important badger in some other Zodiac it's all moot...
Also I know the Pyroar thing was a joke, but it's not ridiculous for starters to repeat common Pokemon, just look at Quaxly who is another Water duck...
Typholision IS a rat! Its the fire rat from the tale "Taketori Monogatari". A very old japanese folktale. The abilty is a big hint, because the fire rat has fire resistant furr.
A theory for grass starters which i think is real is all grass starters are based on prehistoric animals so what is Sprigatito supposed to be?
We will see. We may need to come up with a new theory as well!
“There is no Easter bunny, there is no tooth fairy, and there is no fire starter zodiac”
So skeledirge may not be a zodiac starter, but the cute little birb on his head makes up for it entirely
True that
Great video! I learned something new. Let's battle when the games come out!
tbh the zodiac theory already broke with gen 2
cyndaquil is a hedgehog not a rat
and it's final evolution is a Honey Badger so it is only a vague representation.
Its the fire rat from "Taketori Monogatari"!!
Now this, this is genius
YOU'RE a genius. 💙
Interesting theory, I've never even heard of the original Chinese Zodiac theory but it was fascinating.
My other two observations though were that 1) I can't believe "Pokémon" isn't the video title, such an important key word, and 2) I feel like it's a little odd how when your character/avatar/trainer art/whatever you want call it comes onscreen, you put the entire image on there. I feel like it always looks better when it's a little more zoomed in and we can just see the torso/upper body
Anyways feel free to disregard my unsolicited advice, I already hit like, subscribed, and commented so what more could you ask for
1) Fair point. 😅 2) In other videos I do a better job at that and mix in chest up shots. Not sure why I didn't this time tbh.
In Old Russian astrology there is actually, a FOX constellation, which comes before the new moon
Hare, Wolf and Bear thus, are compatible with the Zoduac theory)
That would have been great to put in the video! Thanks for sharing!
This is an interesting theory that makes much more sense to me. Let's hope Fuecoco's evolved forms are good!
I have high hopes for our flame crocodile! And I'm glad you like the theory my man!
Solid theory!
I like this theory, if this is the way it is, then maybe one day, we will get a fire starter that is my Celtic Horoscope Sign a Seahorse. I'm thinking it will be fire and flying, and in it's second stage it will fly horizontally with the ground and look kinda like an airplane and shoot out fire cannon balls. Then in its 3rd stage, it will fly vertically again, and look like a combination of knight armour and a hovercraft, with flames coming out from behind the individual pieces of armour. with horizontal prepellars for the hovercraft flying ability. Look out Charizard!
That would be very cool!
@@EspyJuju thanks 🙏
Nice theory what other video ideas do you have planed?
Coming up next, the 20,000 year old civilization in Pokemon and what Pokemon they created. 🤔
I like this theory, personally, based on the leaks, I assumed fuecoco and its evolutions were based on a basilisk (basically a giant rooster with reptilian parts or a giant reptile (normaly snake or crocodile) with rooster parts depending on who's telling the story) and that's how it aligned the the theory. But this one is much better.
Thank you Rodrigo! I'm super excited to see fuecoco's final Evo.
I think u got the basilisk confused with a cockatrice.
I had a couple theories on the future of Pokémon if they continued the franchise past 13 generations.
The first theory is that they just switch the the starter themes. For example, the zodiac signs for water, ancient beasts. For fire fire, and weapons for grass 🤷🏾♂️
Or
We can finally get regional variants of Some of the older starters, but with untraditional type trios like flying fighting and rock, or as I like to call it, the Rock Paper Scissors trio lol
That could be super interesting!
Upon seeing that connection you made between the goat and crocodile in astrology, I think that means Fuecoco could still evolve to get goat horns and that could satisfy the Chinese Zodiac theory as well as your theory about the star constellations.
At first I thought fuecoco would stretch into a snake when it evolves. But don't worry, the zodiac theory is still true because the crocodile is part of a zodiac, just a different one than the last 8 fire type starters.
Exactly!
Another zodiac? If you see this reply how do I find that zodiac because I wanna see it, not for proof but because I'm interested in the prospect of another zodiac.
Look up the variations of the eastern zodiac, too. The Old Mongols had a crocodile in it!
A fire bug starter would be sick af
100% agree!
holy cow lotta views! nice job
Yea been saying the mayan zodiac could also be where fuecoco is based on thanks for making a video about this so i can share this with others
Anytime my man! Feel free to share! 😉
This would also make Cyndaquil actually fit in as there is the Lonely Not Alone Hedgehog Constellation, also known as the Cepheus Constellation or the King Constellation which fits with Typhlosion's Japanese name has noy only Bakufū but also Bakufu which means Military Government aka the Shogunate. I wouldn't be suprised if this all is still a coincidence because all the fire starters are also similar to fire related animals in mythology too (I mean hell, the Sobek is a fire Nile Crocdile which Skeledirge is based on, the Dragon was a Lizard that Breathed Fire, the Kitsune is a Fire Fox, etc)
Idk if you're referring to something else but Sobek is the Egyptian god of the Nile River. I don't know of any association with fire and Sobek. My guess is you're using the wrong name for what you're talking about
@@Andrewtr6 I remember seeing Sobek be refered to as a Solar Deity but I may be misremembering.
Ooooooooh so you could say that the real theme of Fire Starters would be constellations?
OK I put that comment too early sorry.
Exactly the idea. 😉
People are saying fuecoco is a horse
Maybe, just maybe, it doesnt have to be based off anything
BLASPHEMY
Great explanation! It makes so much more sense than simply the Chinese zodiac. I'd be keen for a bear starter after Usra Major and Minor.
We almost had a fire bear in Gen 2 before they designed Cyndaquil! What could have been.
@@EspyJuju well I’m glad we got cyndaquil, have a special place for that starter, but maybe we’ll see the bear return in the future
@@professorkauri let's hope! And all the Johto starters are AMAZING.
I like the theory. However, if it's true I hope that GF will continue making some on the Chinese Zodiac. The goat, bull, and snake could all make for very fun pokemon that we haven't seen yet.
I personally am very excited for a fire bull Pokemon! I think it would fit so well!
I still wait for a steel wool sheep for the sheep
And yes, steel wool can catch on fire
The Zodiac Theory wasn't ruined in gen 9, it was debunked in Gen 2. Yes, Cyndaquil is the fire MOUSE (not rat) in the english pokedex, but it's quite clearly an echidna (which aren't even rodents) and the japanese name refers to a porcupine. Plus, Quilava and typhlosion abandon the mouse name.
What if Fuecoco evolve into Fire/Ghost Pokemon and his arm will become ethereal/ghost-like.
My explanation is the region of Paldea (Gen 9) is based on Spain/Portugal and those country are well known for exploration and spreading the religion of Catholic . And in Genesis, it is stated that the snake have arms but taken away by God for deceiving Eve. Maybe Fuecoco will Evolve into Fire/ Dark,Ghost or Psychic
Could very well be! I definitely think we will see Fuecoco become a fire ghost.
This is actually a very plausible theory
great theory...just subbed and excited to see even more 🤗
I'll make sure to bring more for you! Coming up soon, 20,000 year old humans and their impact in the Pokemon world! 😉
So now I need a fire/steel type starter that is based on Libra being the scale.
Now this would be fun to implement. Perhaps a creature that fills it's hands with things like rocks and has to be "in balance" on both sides but uses them as weapons?
@@EspyJuju that could be cool. Have some weight based moves. I could see it being a pretty tanky pokemon. Maybe having moves that let it "equal out" things like pain split. It could also have a decent special attack since libra are known for being fairly intellectual. It can be considered a "waifu" mon since libra is governed by venus, the goddess of beauty. There's quite a lot that they can do with this concept.
@@purpleslushie big brain moves
This is such a good theoryyyyy
Thank you!
You mentioned Fenniken not being a dog but why not cyndaquil not being a rat?
Edit: also curious as to what else Cyndaquil could be...?
Cyndaquil is an amalgamation of many rodents. Dominantly an echidna, hedghog, or porcupine. There are porcupine constellations in some world cultures such as the Navajo. 😊
I was fully on board with the fire starters following the Chinese Zodiac. Fennekin look enough like a dog to fit. Foxes are part of the Canidae family which also includes dogs. When Fuecoco was announced, I assumed it would turn into a snake similar to the Snivy line, but I did entertain the theory that it would become a reptilian bull- all they had to do was give Skeledirge horns. This theory is one I've always believed and still do. There are only 4 animals left from the Chinese Zodiac so, eventually it would be replaced with a new theme. I didn't expect it to be so soon though. I do think that moving forward fire starters will be from any zodiac or just constellations in general because that gives options to pick from.
I do think that for the fire starter zodiac it might be the line as a whole instead of the first form so depending on what fuecoco evolves into it might still fit one of them
Time will tell!
@@EspyJuju yeah. There have been a few theories out there about it becoming either a snake or a horse which seem at least plausible. I think the horse one would be funny cause it would throw a lot of people. There is a video about it somewhere
The Gator is the bull.
If rumours are true, it will have a fire rooster on its head in final form….could be that they’re going around the Chinese zodiac again and he’s loosely based on the rooster?
Even if they did that it would seem the rooster would just be an accent piece not the larger part of the Pokemon design so I personally think it would be a bit of a stretch to say they are doing the rooster again.
@@EspyJuju Fennekin and Cyndaquil were stretches so it wouldn’t surprise me if they found another way to stretch again to be honest
We already have Torchic as a rooster, though he could also be a Phoenix.
@@IanRomErv I don’t remember seeing phoenix on the zodiac chart? Rooster makes more sense to me even with Torchic. Makes much more sense that they’d repeat the zodiac than to deviate from it after keeping to it for 8 generations.
Inspiration doesn't have to be Literal
Snake & Crocodile are both Reptiles.
Fox and Dog are both Canine.
How bout a worm does that not have similarities to a Snake.
what about Snivy having arms?
or a Wolf & coyote being sometimes mistaken for dogs??
more people need to see this
I agree. 😤 Haha
There is a theory Fuecoco is a horse or is going to evolve a bipedal horse like thing
So you're saying the fire starters are actually based on the constellations?, have to say i like that theory more than the Chinese Zodiac one
In short, yes. And thank you!
I like this theory, and we could get a fire lion. We got a water duck stater despite having ducklette.
Very fair point! Let's hope for a lion with a mane of pure fire!
Thoo.. like we know cindaquil represent the rat signe but are more phylogeneticaly near of marsupial/elephant/bear dependly of which state of his evolution line we choose... so basically, game freack dont take zodiac litteraly but more in a morph/corpus alike or in a similarity ... so yes fuecoco can represent snake because its a reptile (more like in the common sense of reptile not in the genetical sense).
So yes, game freak play with words
And also maybe restrictive but also legit, like game freak cant make new pokemon generation until everyone die ahahha that will be an end... ans yes maybe we are near of it: that not mean that will not ahve some new pokemon or new forms sometimes or new games or new region ... but just not entirely new pokedex but also... it have a lot of living creature that pokemon dont be inspired yet
I guess this theory makes sense if we take Gamefreak’s lack of predictability into account.
If Fuecoco is somehow apart of the Chinese Zodiac then I think it's actually doing the Dragon Zodiac again. It would make sense since Scarlet and Violet are sort of setting themselves up as Psuedo reboots in a sense, trying to create a new fresh game by including new ideas (like some of the crazy stuff that leakers have said about the gimmick and new ideas for regional forms) also innovating on old ideas (like the new pokemon centers) but still keeping a lot of the core ideas of the pokemon franchise. The reboot stuff also plays on the Past and Future themes of these games. The idea that Fuecoco is not in the Chinese Zodiac still works with this idea, in fact even better in it but Fuecoco possibly being another Dragon Zodiac starter could make sense
We will definitely have to see how he evolves!
Looks like Charmander has some competition.
This is a really good theory, and makes more sense now how Fuecoco fits. Are there any beliefs where Cynaquil could fit besides the Chinese Zodiac? Reason I ask is because it doesn’t look like a mouse.
Cyndaquil is a tough area bc it takes so much inspiration from many rodents. There are many constellations that exist in only certain cultures and some fit better, such as a Porcupine constellation some cultures believe in.
@@EspyJuju Wow! That’s interesting. Thanks for answering. Cyndaquil is my favorite pokemon out of all of the starters
@@susannahmitchell5558 definitely an adorable and phenomenal choice!
Like the Porcupine Constellation of the Navajo.
@@susannahmitchell5558 see, it all comes together. 😉
I would say if we stretch that a fox is a dog and mouse/badger is a rat then we can stretch that crocodile is a snake since both are reptiles.
Foxs and dogs split off from each other a few million years ago at most, Archosaurs and Squamates split apart about 300 million years ago.
Snakes are MUCH less closely related to crocodilians than platypuses are to you.
Hell, the closest living relatives of crocodilians are birds, so it would be less of a stretch to say that Fuecoco is the rooster.
To be honest I am glad that Fuecoco going to be a fire big 🐊 and I thought they make it as a snake 🐍
Will definitely have to see what happens with his final evolution!
Even as a crocodile furvoco could really be the snake like cindaquil is a rat even if it's an hedgehog
The venonat/venomoth thing isn't a theory, i'm pretty sure someone got the beta red or blue(or green)
If Fuecoco's evolution is a Snake with legs(despite starting as a crocodile) or gains horns to be more Bull like the Main Zodiac could work.
This expanded zodiac to include other cultures based on the region seems like a 5d chess move. Its smart considering every new region they make will have some cultural spin outside of China/Japan.
Thank you!
Funny thing is other fans think Fennekin is a cat. 😂
There may no such thing as Crocodile in Chinese zodiac, but I want to Fuecoco for representing the snake symbol. And I've got lots of reasons. Crocodiles are like snake, because they are reptiles with scales, are crawling animals and have a long long body that can support the heat. The designers though that children like the starters with arms and legs. And here's one good scientific reason. Did you know that snakes ancestor was a quadrupede creature that lived in jurrasic times over 2.000.000.000 B.C ? It's true ! Take a look of the Tetrapodophis, for example. It's one of the snakes ancestors. This is going to solve skeledirge's zodiac problem. What do you think ? 😀
Or maybe there is no theory and they just make starters based on the region and good concepts
IT CAN'T BE! 😅
I always thought Cyndaquil was a Chinchilla or a hedgehog
It's definitely a hedgehog.
I also think they are from the constellations.
Foxes are cannids wich is the group of dogs , wolves , foxes , fennecs … fennekin isn’t a dog it intinuate one so it’s not that weird .
Tho what makes less sense is cyndaquil wich is a echidna turning stoat turning badger . None of them are even related to rats !
But Cyndaquil is called rat by the Pokedex
There’s a porcupine constellation
@@sanguinetales that’s a mistranslation since its Japanese name is a combination of hi (fire) and yama-arashi (porcupine) and suggests that it might in fact be based on a porcupine, although it is definitely a wordplay on hi no arashi, which means 'storm of fire’
@@nazeersadek6705 But Its Chinese name (which is why the zodiac held up till now) was also Fire-Rat
@@sanguinetales I didn’t know about the Chinese name but surely since Pokémon is a Japanese franchise the Japanese names are more impotent?
Yo, this actualy is very good, 'cuz the gen 2 fira starter was supose to be a bear isn't? It always stump me up, but now it makes sense
Fuecoco is based on an alligator/crocodile. And they're reptiles, just like snakes.
The last common ancestor of all mammals, from elephants to kangaroos to platypus, split off around 190 million years ago. By comparison, the archosaurs(crocodilians and birds) split from the lepidosaurs(lizards and snakes) around 300 million years ago, so you are significantly closer to a platypus then a crocodile is to a snake.
Would have prefered for them to fill out the chinese zodiac first
I'm definitely hoping the return to the Chinese zodiac. So many good options!
SCORPION FIRE STARTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!
In short Fire Starters are Star Based
You sum it up well!