Coda Mission exactly. And this man is not humble. Don was arrogant but humble too. Would never talk about himself this way. He’s also a fictional character lol
@@BitmapJack Lol I'll never understand why people like you whom claim to hate something, como onto a video _specifically_ about the thing they hate, just to say how much they hate it. It's almost as if you all don't have a life lol. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's what it is.
Don Draper is thought to be more closely related to Draper Daniels, a creative at Leo Burnett in the 1950's (and agency style much similar to SCDP in the show. Daniels was credited with the creation of the Marlboro Man, character that ties much closer to Don Draper. Lois is a genius, but a much different style.
He wasn't an art director (Don Draper)... he was a copywriter or copy based Creative Director... As a copywriter... I feel ashamed that VICE got this wrong :-(
Richard Dunn The only time Don was shown being an art director was when he pitched his ideas to Rodger. Which, btw he was also the copywriter. He is really only shown as the creative director, which is neither. Their job is to create and perfect ideas. If anything he deals more in copy than art since he literally never does anything with art and writes or comes up with lines pretty often. Plus, he mentors Peggy, a copywriter.
+ThoseTolerableNoobs I've been saying for a year that Mad Men is NOT a realistic depiction of Madison Ave of the 60s. I was a graphic designer than programmer for PKL & JWalterThompson etc. Don Draper is good at what he is supposed to be doing, but he's NO creative talent. George Lois was not only GREAT at Art Direction (Don is just a sales guy) he was far better looking too. ALL the women working with him had the HOTS for him, trust me. ALL.But he wasn't a womanizer. Maybe THAT was some of his appeal, but I can still see him in my mind's eye, and I have NEVER again met a guy THAT good looking, and BRILLIANT too. The ppl putting him down in this video? THEY WERE JEALOUS. Why should George have ever said "WE" when GEORGE did it ON HIS OWN so *I* was quite appropriate, it wasn't a team effort, after all. Sure I did layouts & typesetting, than ad programming, but I ALWAYS followed GEORGE's (and other Art Directors') very specific specifications. The ART DIRECTORS are 'the' creators. Sure the copywriters have 'some' input, but not as much as depicted on Mad Men. I have fond memories of those days, regardless of the MCP nature of the men. Hell, they had to work outside the home and as we all know, now, (all women I mean), working in the corporate world is nothing but eventually self destructive.
TheGeekiestWoman Don Draper is a copywriter, not an artist, and whilst you might personally not consider the work he comes up with in the show to be any good - the show goes out of its way to portray Don as being considered to have extremely high amounts of talent. If he were bad at his job, the show wouldn't work.
You were a programmer? 'were'? You are supposed to have experience on Madison Avenue in the 60's because you were a programmer in the 60's? Any examples of online campaigns you did in 1963?
He's nothing like Don. Don wouldn't sit for this interview with all this bravado, Don would come in an earnestly explain his concepts with a swig of arrogance and an undertone of self-loathing and cynicism. And that's presuming that Don Draper would agree to the interview or even be alive to be interviewed to begin with!
That's what I thought. Don Draper didn't like to talk about himself. Sure, he had a monstrous ego, but he was a ton more enigmatic than this guy. I doubt Don Draper was written with this man, Lois in mind and any similarities, and I am sure there may be a few, are coincidence. But I didn't see much in common other than some very innovative ads.
Bhumi Kelly This didn't probe into Lois's behavior outside the office. But when you are not just in the fast lane, but created it, you can only imagine.
GlanceofGlory Don is probably just a composite of men but Weiner must have had a good researcher because the character of Don is identical in many ways to my best friend at prep school's father. They mother and father even looked like the actors who portray them and they lived at the same location and much of the other things are the same so it's too much to be coincidental. I can even recall the man showing up some ads and asking what we thought of them. No much since as teens we were interested in other things and didn't pay much attention to what our parents did lol
Reginald Joyboy Most likely it's a composite. A huge part of the show is about the unlikely narrator. Fiction about the 60's would either not portray Don's generation or make them out to be sort of the enemy or adversary to the hippie movement. The characters have period-accurate biases, prejudices, and attitudes, they're not the easy selection but they are still just as interesting (perhaps more) than obvious choices. This guy would be an easy choice, he's gregarious and wants to be hip, wants to be at the center of it all. If they borrowed anything, it was his accomplishments/ideas- little else. Who was this other guy you're speaking of?
Yes and no. She actually had children and juggled parenthood and her career. I think her life was tougher than Peggy Olson's. Read her book, Mad Women, it is quite interesting.
Mad Men, what a marvelous look into the world of my parents. I would have been about Bobby's age then. I was born in 56. It helps me to understand the nightly martinis and the indifferent parental style. Fast forward 30 years when I was raising my kids in the 90's and I was involved with everything and that's not an exaggeration. My kids were going to have the memories and opportunities that my parents could have cared less about. Now my kids have kids and they are busy with their lives and doing beautifully. The irony is I am treated with the same indifference by my children that I experienced from my parents. I'm beginning to wonder if my parents had it right all along
@@wordwan You've just read a real life account of what my parents were like. Stereotypes often are rooted in a kernel of truth. I drew the contrast between their alcohol soaked self absorbed value system and my helicopter parental style lamenting my children's lack of communication.
Got the feeling that this mini documentary started with a premise that quickly eroded as numbers of interviews went in directions perhaps not initially contemplated. In short, Draper's best talent may be self-promotion; Lois' best talent back then may have also been self-promotion.
+idolfan9495 same thing... some agencies have either/or, others have both. The only reason one would have both is because everyone important wants a distinct and definitive title.
+idolfan9495 I've never even seen the show all the the way through and don't know the names of most of the characters. But I have worked for multiple agencies and am just saying that these titles are subjective and mean only what agencies make them out to mean. For instance, we only had an Art Director, who handled not only the oversight if all renderings/ art related aspects of projects, but also was a main part of the idea-creating/ approving process as well. I'm just saying the Titles are subjective and that's a fact...
idolfan9495 Oh, I understand now. The video was creating a notion that the character was based off of this guy, so you were simply asserting the obvious discrepancy that Vice seemed to have missed.
6:19 - "everybody in the music business thinks if MTV was successful it would destroy people buying music" -- How ironic to hear this in a TH-cam video.
George Lois helped create legendary ad campaigns, break major companies to the world, and design 92 covers for Esquire. He's sometimes referred to as the inspiration for Don Draper.
People are looking at this video wrong. No he's not the inspiration for Draper's exact personality. But he held a similar job position which the show was centered around.
So did thousands of others, and they're just as undeserving of a Vice highlight or claim to be the Draper archetype. You're the one looking at this video wrong.
Don't be mean, Jane Goodnut. Support your claim without name-calling. The fact you're here and passionate about this subject tells me you're capable of doing so. Why not do so? I agree with MrBahBZ and TheZchristina97. They both make good points. What point is it that you're really trying to make?
That it is a presumptive and offensive generalisation to state 'people are looking at this video wrong'. If he has that opinion about a particular commentator then state that as a reply to that person's comment. But a blanket assertion like that is patently hyperbole - I'm not looking at the video wrong at all, to say I am is dumb.
People, look up the name Draper Daniels...although he was a Chicago Ad Man, many think he's the, or at least one of the main influences for Don...pretty telling that Weiner named the character Draper. Also that The Draper character came from the midwest, just outside Chicago in fact. This guy Lois is so boastful that it immediately screams of his insecurity. The character of Don Draper is confident and headstrong regarding his talents, but pretty secure without the need to scream it from the rooftops. This guy comes off like an immature crybaby clown. Very UN-Draper like.
***** Confidence and self esteem are tricky things. He's aware of his abilities and talents and is confident about those things and his general efficacy in life. What he does lack is a genuine sense of self worth. Those two things mechanistically different.
His character has been my inspiration to be in advertising for the past 5 years. Stopped the video as soon as VICE called him an art director. He is a copywriter turned creative director.
My grandpa was one of these guys but in LA and my grandma tells me stories about his life back then and it is pretty damn close to mad men. Great story vice you have done it again
Don Draper was a copywriter. George Lois was/is an Art Director/ Graphic Designer. Salvatore Romano was the Art Director in the show. So George Lois is probably the real Salvatore Romano. It’s funny how so many people are calling George Lois the real life Don Draper and completely missing the point.
When I was young and started in advertising, I had come to know personally several people in advertising who were like Don Draper, even one very young one. They are not that rare but there are not many and they disappeared from the scene between 1985 - 1993 in my country. Things got too sophisticated, too scientific, too strategic for people to just walk in with an idea based on nothing but an alcoholic epiphany. I have experienced only one instance where that worked, with Mercedes advertising but that was in 1982. The whole point is that Mad Men is fiction and it is called fiction for a reason. Reality is boring although there used to be a lot more internal intrige and sex involved than shown in the series. The sex disappeared, too, by the mid-eighties it was gone. I don't know why, actually.
Well, the show was based on the sixties which is earlier than the time period you mentioned where many behaviours present in advertising have been abandoned.
@@blava3155 That's right. One of the characteristics that disappeared by the end of the seventies is that one was dealing with the managing directors. As professionalism set in, one started to deal with professionals instead of the one who put his signature on the cheques. The real transformation was from advertising as a battle of opinions to advertising as a consequence of facts and strategy. But that is boring as hell even if it led to better advertising. You should not forget that the amount of messages to the public increased tremendously. A good idea was sufficient in the fifties. In the sixties you needed to have a lot more, like targeting the audience more precisely. This is shown in the series with the account manager who becomes the media guy. In the USA, advertising and marketing are almost synonymous, so there is more interest in advertising. In Europe, it is marketing that gets interest and people tend to hate advertising and see it as an intrusion. When I first was in the USA, 1982, I watched TV for a day and I was amazed that I could not figure out whether I watched the beginning of the next scene of a sitcom started or a commercial. That would not be possible in Europe.
Everyone lies, cheats and steals in advertising. I've been in the game for 8 years and it's all stress topped with ego. But in the end, when a campaign goes live, it's the greatest high any career will ever give you.
The creator even says that Don Draper is based off of Draper Daniels who created the Marlboro campaign. Daniels worked in Chicago,but he was a genius like don and also like don he was a bad businessman. Oh and like others have said this guy was an art director and not creative director or copywriter.
ffs people, it's still fun to actually hear him talk about the 60s and all the shit going down, and because he's erratic he's funny. He says himself he's the opposite of Don...
@12:34 this little end nugget is great. Love the wisdom from seniors whom have done it all before and have bottom line advice about life! LOL You know this idea of stealing credit is always what happens at agencies and design studios. Some design agencies funnel all of the ideas through one person. So they let this one person who is good on the phone sell the idea but its actually the work of many others. And they let this person take all of the credit. Its makes things convenient for marketing the agency/studio for the credit to go to one person. They get to bath in the limelight of some fame whilst the other talents who did all of the work are scratching their heads..THIS IS HOW THIS SHIT WORKS IN THIS BUSINESS??? THEN FINALLY WHEN THEY CANT TAKE THE IDEA OF SOMEONE TAKING ALL OF THE CREDIT FOR THEIR WORK THEY QUIT.. THATS OK THEY FILL IT WITH ANOTHER NAIVE GRADUATE EAGER TO WORK HARD AND MAKE THEIR MARK ONLY TO REALIZE AFTER A FEW YEARS OF WINNING AWARDS AND NOT GETTING CREDIT THEY QUIT....... AND THEY REALIZE ITS BULLSHIT...UNTIL THEY MAKE THEIR OWN COMPANY! THEN THEY CAN EXPLOIT TALENT AND CLAIM ALL OF THE CREDIT AND BE WHO THEY DESPISED!!!!
+greencorinne8 it reminds me more of hitchcocks movie vertigo. the spinning falling man. that movie was from the same era. and in that movie the woman had two seperate identities like draper. I think that is possibly where the maker of madmen drew his inspiration from for Dons character
I just assumed it was to hint at Don's sort of hazardous nature. I think Pete mentioned that he doesn't care about money, he only cares about reaching the next level. I just assumed it was him being so ambitious he was ready to commit career-suicide (think of the anti-tobacco ad) in order to distinguish himself.
It's Salvatore Romano's life, not Don. Don is the boss. George stated that Mad Men misinterpreting 1960's Mad Ave advertising industry. I think he should consider that it was not he's life that was being portayed. 🤔
Extremely interesting that George makes to Tony Soprano at the 2'18 mark. Interesting How - Mad Men was a hit because the "creative team " from The Sopranos worked on It from its inception. I discovered Mad Men late but quickly pick ed up on The Sopranos vibe. That series was based on the real De Cavaclante crime family. Tony Soprano based on an amalgam of "real life capos ( Mafia captains)". These same writers and directors from The Sopranos had listened to hours of FBI conversation. Real life so-called Mafiosi repeatedly alleged that an FBI informants were giving these guys the great stories, capers and dialogue for the TV series. It's obvious that the creative team for Mad Man based their ideas on George Lois.
Don Draper is a brilliant creative fiction - a copywriter based Creative Director. Copywriters generally do make the best team leaders. George Lois is a Creative. A man hard done by at times - a man who set himslef, with a little luck, in the right place with the right ideas at the right time. A man who created himself, as much as the mixture of illusion, ethics, politics and culture that make good advertising. All good creatives steal. Inspiration is not theft.
I'm sure everyone has said this already, but Don Draper was/is not an Art Director. If you can't get that simple fact right about the primary character in a mega hit TV series, I can't put any value into any of your alleged 'journalism'. FAIL.
Chris Herrmann Gillespie you're the first and thank-you. i enjoyed the piece but don draper's title is creative director and he rose to that position from being a copy writer. to me, it's a fairly major distinction and makes the whole vice team seem lazy to have missed the mistake even though it was just a puff piece.
I listened to serial podcast with Sarah Koenig a few months ago, I just finished watching mad men. I find this video on my recommendations and discover the guy don draper is loseys based on, had a partner whos daughter dis serial... crazy small world.
If there is anything more nauseating than people in advertizing talking about themselves its actors giving themselves awards. Good to see VICE do its best CNN impression.
I agree; very few Vice video's impress me... Vice pretends to be alternative media; but it pushes the same mainstream propaganda... Most Vice videos are 30% tall tale and 70% "true"... Many videos are 99% fake; and its obvious.... People don't trust Vice anymore
Reminder that Vice is the type of organization who if given the opportunity to remake madmen, would cast female people of color to play all the guy parts, because, "WOMAN CAN DO IT TOO HURR DURR."
Interesting guy, the comment at the end though was moronic. Never learn anything in advertising from failures? bullshit... each failure helps you refine your understanding of what works, and more importantly perhaps, what doesn't work (if you actually think/analyze)... I think all the drinking has fried this guys brain.
jewbacca It's a good topic for conversation. In this instance, I imagine some cross examination would have been fruitful. My thoughts are that he didn't dwell on the failure, as he saw nothing in the act itself that gave him any creative insight. One could say that even practicing guitar until one gets it right is a series of failures. In that case, one is building brain muscle coordination, memory, and understanding. You're supposed to chip away, (hack) till it magically comes out right. But you've learned a lot about the process of learning. And the blocks you put in front of yourself. Lois seems like a guy who floated on top of the waves, and let others paddle for shore. His vice and success came from being so single minded that he discarded the value of other talents.
A Chicago documentary claimed Don Draper was based on Draper Daniels, a guy at Leo Burnett in Chicago. And many of the ad campaigns in the show were actually Leo Burnett ad campaigns - so this New York guy may have provided some inspiration but probably not most of it.
Draper Daniels is the inspiration for Don Draper. Chicago was the heart of the Mad Men zeitgeist. So maybe that is real irony. New York want to mythologize it’s own creation story by couching it in a man who exemplifies the artful dodger. The story is the man, and the man is the story.
Next time Vice, do your research! The character of Don Draper is partially inspired by Draper Daniels, a creative director at Leo Burnett advertising agency in Chicago in the 1950s, who worked on the Marlboro Man campaign; and by Bill Backer, an advertising executive at McCann Erickson who created the "I'd Like to Buy the World a Coke" ad in 1971
For god's sake, Don Draper was NOT an art director! ARGH. He was a copywriter, then copy chief, then creative director. Creative directors can come from a design or copy background.
The show wasn’t even really about the ads . It’s was about the characters. Draper didn’t care about the ads..he didn’t have an ego...that was Don Drapers problem ..he didn’t believe anything he did was ever good enough. George Lois and Don Draper are not similar in any way. Don didn’t even Care about the awards he won. Did you watch the show?
Salvatore Romano was Art Director.
Don Draper was his boss, Creative Director.
Coda Mission exactly. And this man is not humble. Don was arrogant but humble too. Would never talk about himself this way. He’s also a fictional character lol
@Ben Rosen Oh, really? And you seem like a fucking idiot.
Coda Mission Thank you. I see someone else has worked in advertising...
@@townesprescot5441 Yea... Don was always reluctant to talk about himself.
Don would never talk about himself this much
fuck this show
When you live under an assumed identity maybe you should not.
Came here to say just this
@@BitmapJack Lol I'll never understand why people like you whom claim to hate something, como onto a video _specifically_ about the thing they hate, just to say how much they hate it. It's almost as if you all don't have a life lol. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's what it is.
Well who knows how Don will turn out to be in his 70s.
There’s no way he or anybody else is/was the real Don Draper. Nobody could be Don Draper. Not even Don Draper.
Bingo
Actually Don Draper WAS Don Draper. Really nobody could be Dick Whittman. LOL!
Leo Burnett maybe
I feel like no one at vice even watched mad men.
"Don Draper was a womanizer...I'm the opposite in every respect." So he's the real life Sal, then.
Martin Mireles That and Sal was also gay
@@anywaythewindblows8912 pretty sure that's the point he was getting at haha
Max Jones haha yea
LOL
@@anywaythewindblows8912 So true.
Don Draper is thought to be more closely related to Draper Daniels, a creative at Leo Burnett in the 1950's (and agency style much similar to SCDP in the show. Daniels was credited with the creation of the Marlboro Man, character that ties much closer to Don Draper. Lois is a genius, but a much different style.
Thanks for that info that would make more sense that they even paid how much do the guy by using his first name .
Thanks for the information! This makes much more sense.
This is correct WTTW Channel 11 in Chicago where Leo Burnette was based confirmed it, it was Draper Daniels.
He wasn't an art director (Don Draper)... he was a copywriter or copy based Creative Director... As a copywriter... I feel ashamed that VICE got this wrong :-(
Thank you! I caught that too.....smh
Richard Dunn The only time Don was shown being an art director was when he pitched his ideas to Rodger. Which, btw he was also the copywriter. He is really only shown as the creative director, which is neither. Their job is to create and perfect ideas. If anything he deals more in copy than art since he literally never does anything with art and writes or comes up with lines pretty often. Plus, he mentors Peggy, a copywriter.
This is true
Lol I was going to post this, like 10 seconds in they get something wrong.
Richard Dunn its vice. bunch of burnt out hippies. what do you expect?
1:09 - Does he even watch the show? Don Draper is extremely good at what he does - his ability to understand strangers is crucial to his character.
+ThoseTolerableNoobs I've been saying for a year that Mad Men is NOT a realistic depiction of Madison Ave of the 60s. I was a graphic designer than programmer for PKL & JWalterThompson etc. Don Draper is good at what he is supposed to be doing, but he's NO creative talent. George Lois was not only GREAT at Art Direction (Don is just a sales guy) he was far better looking too. ALL the women working with him had the HOTS for him, trust me. ALL.But he wasn't a womanizer. Maybe THAT was some of his appeal, but I can still see him in my mind's eye, and I have NEVER again met a guy THAT good looking, and BRILLIANT too. The ppl putting him down in this video? THEY WERE JEALOUS. Why should George have ever said "WE" when GEORGE did it ON HIS OWN so *I* was quite appropriate, it wasn't a team effort, after all. Sure I did layouts & typesetting, than ad programming, but I ALWAYS followed GEORGE's (and other Art Directors') very specific specifications. The ART DIRECTORS are 'the' creators. Sure the copywriters have 'some' input, but not as much as depicted on Mad Men.
I have fond memories of those days, regardless of the MCP nature of the men. Hell, they had to work outside the home and as we all know, now, (all women I mean), working in the corporate world is nothing but eventually self destructive.
TheGeekiestWoman Don Draper is a copywriter, not an artist, and whilst you might personally not consider the work he comes up with in the show to be any good - the show goes out of its way to portray Don as being considered to have extremely high amounts of talent. If he were bad at his job, the show wouldn't work.
You were a programmer? 'were'? You are supposed to have experience on Madison Avenue in the 60's because you were a programmer in the 60's?
Any examples of online campaigns you did in 1963?
Good point.
Don is fictional, this guy isn't
Don was a smooth & eloquent character.
This guy sounds like he was the creator behind, “Pawn Stars.”
VICE - The Real Click-Baiter?
it's clickbait that delivers
Fagballs McAssbutts Yours is the best name I have ever heard on TH-cam.
Antonio Perez Someone finally said it!
He's nothing like Don. Don wouldn't sit for this interview with all this bravado, Don would come in an earnestly explain his concepts with a swig of arrogance and an undertone of self-loathing and cynicism. And that's presuming that Don Draper would agree to the interview or even be alive to be interviewed to begin with!
That's what I thought. Don Draper didn't like to talk about himself. Sure, he had a monstrous ego, but he was a ton more enigmatic than this guy. I doubt Don Draper was written with this man, Lois in mind and any similarities, and I am sure there may be a few, are coincidence. But I didn't see much in common other than some very innovative ads.
Bhumi Kelly This didn't probe into Lois's behavior outside the office. But when you are not just in the fast lane, but created it, you can only imagine.
GlanceofGlory Don is probably just a composite of men but Weiner must have had a good researcher because the character of Don is identical in many ways to my best friend at prep school's father. They mother and father even looked like the actors who portray them and they lived at the same location and much of the other things are the same so it's too much to be coincidental. I can even recall the man showing up some ads and asking what we thought of them. No much since as teens we were interested in other things and didn't pay much attention to what our parents did lol
Reginald Joyboy Most likely it's a composite. A huge part of the show is about the unlikely narrator. Fiction about the 60's would either not portray Don's generation or make them out to be sort of the enemy or adversary to the hippie movement. The characters have period-accurate biases, prejudices, and attitudes, they're not the easy selection but they are still just as interesting (perhaps more) than obvious choices. This guy would be an easy choice, he's gregarious and wants to be hip, wants to be at the center of it all. If they borrowed anything, it was his accomplishments/ideas- little else.
Who was this other guy you're speaking of?
GlanceofGlory .... yeah....but don did sit down with cooper's man at the wall street journal and was very George Lois in that interview....
So is the Creative Director in pink the real-life Peggy Olson?
Hạnh-Minh Nguyễn More like the real-life Joan Holloway/Harris :-).
Nah, she looked too modest to be Joan lol
Abby More Yeah. And also last time we met, Joan was working in her own production house.
Yes and no. She actually had children and juggled parenthood and her career. I think her life was tougher than Peggy Olson's. Read her book, Mad Women, it is quite interesting.
Mad Men, what a marvelous look into the world of my parents. I would have been about Bobby's age then. I was born in 56. It helps me to understand the nightly martinis and the indifferent parental style. Fast forward 30 years when I was raising my kids in the 90's and I was involved with everything and that's not an exaggeration. My kids were going to have the memories and opportunities that my parents could have cared less about. Now my kids have kids and they are busy with their lives and doing beautifully. The irony is I am treated with the same indifference by my children that I experienced from my parents. I'm beginning to wonder if my parents had it right all along
Life is very, very, Ironic......no escaping that no matter how hard we try......it seems. 🤔😮🙄
We miss what we couldn't have and don't appretiate what we do have.
1st part is for you, 2nd for your children. I hope they come around.
@@wordwan You've just read a real life account of what my parents were like. Stereotypes often are rooted in a kernel of truth. I drew the contrast between their alcohol soaked self absorbed value system and my helicopter parental style lamenting my children's lack of communication.
@@palmatrh the key is something in between
It seems like these parenting styles rotate in cycles. You did the best you could and at the end of the day that’s all that matters.
Got the feeling that this mini documentary started with a premise that quickly eroded as numbers of interviews went in directions perhaps not initially contemplated. In short, Draper's best talent may be self-promotion; Lois' best talent back then may have also been self-promotion.
Don Draper is Creative Director, not Art Director.
+idolfan9495 same thing... some agencies have either/or, others have both. The only reason one would have both is because everyone important wants a distinct and definitive title.
+Max Wilson On the show, Sal was the Art Director. And after he got fired, Stan was.
+idolfan9495 I've never even seen the show all the the way through and don't know the names of most of the characters. But I have worked for multiple agencies and am just saying that these titles are subjective and mean only what agencies make them out to mean. For instance, we only had an Art Director, who handled not only the oversight if all renderings/ art related aspects of projects, but also was a main part of the idea-creating/ approving process as well. I'm just saying the Titles are subjective and that's a fact...
But the comment was referring to the show. DD was not Art Director on the show. Someone else was.
idolfan9495 Oh, I understand now. The video was creating a notion that the character was based off of this guy, so you were simply asserting the obvious discrepancy that Vice seemed to have missed.
6:19 - "everybody in the music business thinks if MTV was successful it would destroy people buying music" -- How ironic to hear this in a TH-cam video.
I no longer want my MTV
MTV CLASSIC IS GOOD!
Yep because it's not what it used to be.... a music channel
Why
Nvm I see
George Lois helped create legendary ad campaigns, break major companies to the world, and design 92 covers for Esquire. He's sometimes referred to as the inspiration for Don Draper.
not to be a dick, but isnt "madman's real don draper" a more slick title ?
max goedvolk grammatically, that suggests that George Lois was an invention of madmen. :)
max goedvolk They actually just wrote it that way to match the other "Real" series in title structure.
***** its a Creative Director, he was a copy in the past before Roger found him.
Pablo Figueroa
He was selling fur coats before Roger found him - he came up with ads for the coat company
People are looking at this video wrong. No he's not the inspiration for Draper's exact personality. But he held a similar job position which the show was centered around.
So did thousands of others, and they're just as undeserving of a Vice highlight or claim to be the Draper archetype. You're the one looking at this video wrong.
TheZchristina97 - You're looking at the video wrong, idiot.
Don't be mean, Jane Goodnut. Support your claim without name-calling. The fact you're here and passionate about this subject tells me you're capable of doing so. Why not do so? I agree with MrBahBZ and TheZchristina97. They both make good points. What point is it that you're really trying to make?
That it is a presumptive and offensive generalisation to state 'people are looking at this video wrong'. If he has that opinion about a particular commentator then state that as a reply to that person's comment. But a blanket assertion like that is patently hyperbole - I'm not looking at the video wrong at all, to say I am is dumb.
Jane Goodnut, I love you. You're fabulous and talented.
why is Ace Ventura interviewing this guy
People, look up the name Draper Daniels...although he was a Chicago Ad Man, many think he's the, or at least one of the main influences for Don...pretty telling that Weiner named the character Draper. Also that The Draper character came from the midwest, just outside Chicago in fact.
This guy Lois is so boastful that it immediately screams of his insecurity. The character of Don Draper is confident and headstrong regarding his talents, but pretty secure without the need to scream it from the rooftops. This guy comes off like an immature crybaby clown. Very UN-Draper like.
Gregory Gove Exactly, Don Draper knows he's the shit. He didn't feel the need to tell you something you already knew in that regard
***** Confidence and self esteem are tricky things. He's aware of his abilities and talents and is confident about those things and his general efficacy in life. What he does lack is a genuine sense of self worth. Those two things mechanistically different.
I could never imaging the Don Draper character in his old age boasting in this kind of animated way.
Gregory Gove Definitely not
His character has been my inspiration to be in advertising for the past 5 years. Stopped the video as soon as VICE called him an art director. He is a copywriter turned creative director.
Rest in peace to George Lois, who passed away on November 18th, 2022.
I love her sense of style and haircut! so beautiful!
Her name?
My grandpa was one of these guys but in LA and my grandma tells me stories about his life back then and it is pretty damn close to mad men. Great story vice you have done it again
He's not the art director. He's Creative!!
This sounds like a great agency to work for, and Duck is the man to run it.
That first 15 seconds. Truer words have never been spoken.
Don was Creative Director, this man was Art Director. You missed it, Vice.
Don Draper was a Creative Director and he is modeled after Draper Daniels. Its simple research, people
THIS VIDEO PROVES PS4 IS BETTER THEN XBOX ONE
*than
Paisley Plays What M8? The Real Dizz From 'Idiocracy'?
Paisley Plays What M8?
ha ha butthurt
ukeuwatch excuse me but that is an obscure reference.
Rich Homie Tom #CavsFanSince July 11th 2014 we all already knew that
Don Draper was a copywriter. George Lois was/is an Art Director/ Graphic Designer. Salvatore Romano was the Art Director in the show. So George Lois is probably the real Salvatore Romano.
It’s funny how so many people are calling George Lois the real life Don Draper and completely missing the point.
When I was young and started in advertising, I had come to know personally several people in advertising who were like Don Draper, even one very young one. They are not that rare but there are not many and they disappeared from the scene between 1985 - 1993 in my country. Things got too sophisticated, too scientific, too strategic for people to just walk in with an idea based on nothing but an alcoholic epiphany. I have experienced only one instance where that worked, with Mercedes advertising but that was in 1982. The whole point is that Mad Men is fiction and it is called fiction for a reason. Reality is boring although there used to be a lot more internal intrige and sex involved than shown in the series. The sex disappeared, too, by the mid-eighties it was gone. I don't know why, actually.
Well, the show was based on the sixties which is earlier than the time period you mentioned where many behaviours present in advertising have been abandoned.
@@blava3155 That's right. One of the characteristics that disappeared by the end of the seventies is that one was dealing with the managing directors. As professionalism set in, one started to deal with professionals instead of the one who put his signature on the cheques. The real transformation was from advertising as a battle of opinions to advertising as a consequence of facts and strategy. But that is boring as hell even if it led to better advertising. You should not forget that the amount of messages to the public increased tremendously. A good idea was sufficient in the fifties. In the sixties you needed to have a lot more, like targeting the audience more precisely. This is shown in the series with the account manager who becomes the media guy. In the USA, advertising and marketing are almost synonymous, so there is more interest in advertising. In Europe, it is marketing that gets interest and people tend to hate advertising and see it as an intrusion. When I first was in the USA, 1982, I watched TV for a day and I was amazed that I could not figure out whether I watched the beginning of the next scene of a sitcom started or a commercial. That would not be possible in Europe.
AIDS is why the sex stopped
Everyone lies, cheats and steals in advertising. I've been in the game for 8 years and it's all stress topped with ego. But in the end, when a campaign goes live, it's the greatest high any career will ever give you.
2 sentences out of 3 "aint bad." #canyoufigure 😳🙄
I seen alot of TV series but none comes close to Mad Men so much Drama, Details and the shock factors.
Holy damn, the host is SMOKIN"!!
i get it b/c she looks like ace ventura
She has a beautiful face but her hair is just bad
Grobee I love her hair
Damn this girl is drop dead gorgeous.
He's Greek-American. Thus the cool flag on 1:06 and 1:09.
If someone is going to give you money, then do it by all means. That line gave me a giggle.
The creator even says that Don Draper is based off of Draper Daniels who created the Marlboro campaign. Daniels worked in Chicago,but he was a genius like don and also like don he was a bad businessman. Oh and like others have said this guy was an art director and not creative director or copywriter.
Draper wasn't an art director, he was a copywriter and then a creative director, there is a distinction.
ffs people, it's still fun to actually hear him talk about the 60s and all the shit going down, and because he's erratic he's funny. He says himself he's the opposite of Don...
0:29 -- Don Draper is not the art director, he is the creative director.
Bold of this guy to assume Don Draper had no talent and that he has all the talent. Like okay, Squidward.
I thought don was full of himself but this guy takes the cake.
@12:34 this little end nugget is great. Love the wisdom from seniors whom have done it all before and have bottom line advice about life! LOL You know this idea of stealing credit is always what happens at agencies and design studios. Some design agencies funnel all of the ideas through one person. So they let this one person who is good on the phone sell the idea but its actually the work of many others. And they let this person take all of the credit. Its makes things convenient for marketing the agency/studio for the credit to go to one person. They get to bath in the limelight of some fame whilst the other talents who did all of the work are scratching their heads..THIS IS HOW THIS SHIT WORKS IN THIS BUSINESS??? THEN FINALLY WHEN THEY CANT TAKE THE IDEA OF SOMEONE TAKING ALL OF THE CREDIT FOR THEIR WORK THEY QUIT.. THATS OK THEY FILL IT WITH ANOTHER NAIVE GRADUATE EAGER TO WORK HARD AND MAKE THEIR MARK ONLY TO REALIZE AFTER A FEW YEARS OF WINNING AWARDS AND NOT GETTING CREDIT THEY QUIT....... AND THEY REALIZE ITS BULLSHIT...UNTIL THEY MAKE THEIR OWN COMPANY! THEN THEY CAN EXPLOIT TALENT AND CLAIM ALL OF THE CREDIT AND BE WHO THEY DESPISED!!!!
I don't know why I have such a hard time sitting through vice videos.
is that where the MadMen intro came from ? @1:30
I always wondered what was the meaning behind the man falling off.
That's such a great connection, I never even realized that before you pointed that out :')
+greencorinne8 it reminds me more of hitchcocks movie vertigo. the spinning falling man. that movie was from the same era. and in that movie the woman had two seperate identities like draper. I think that is possibly where the maker of madmen drew his inspiration from for Dons character
Mark Bond hmm interesting. that's why I read the comments. thanks for your take
I just assumed it was to hint at Don's sort of hazardous nature. I think Pete mentioned that he doesn't care about money, he only cares about reaching the next level. I just assumed it was him being so ambitious he was ready to commit career-suicide (think of the anti-tobacco ad) in order to distinguish himself.
It's Salvatore Romano's life, not Don. Don is the boss. George stated that Mad Men misinterpreting 1960's Mad Ave advertising industry. I think he should consider that it was not he's life that was being portayed. 🤔
12:06 "the similarities are ironic", um, don't you mean coincidental?! Where's the irony??
Prince Blake that is cos they aren't real similarities...this guy is nothing like Don Draper
I tell you what, 10 years later watching this video, He is nothing like Don Draper but in fact, a whole lot more interesting character!
Do the real sherlock holmes
it's the books author, or someone he knew, can't remember anymore
You’d have to go back a couple centuries to do that😂😂
Take it from an ex-McCann-Erickson executive, George Lois is not the real life Don Draper. No one self promotes himself more than George Lois.
Don Draper is David Ogilvy
This is like an old man Peter Griffin
Came here looking for people comparing the achievements of a fictional character with those of a real person and was not disappointed.
Extremely interesting that George makes to Tony Soprano at the 2'18 mark.
Interesting How -
Mad Men was a hit because the "creative team " from
The Sopranos worked on
It from its inception.
I discovered Mad Men late but quickly pick ed up on
The Sopranos vibe. That series was based on the real De Cavaclante crime family. Tony Soprano based on an amalgam of "real life capos ( Mafia captains)". These same writers and directors from The Sopranos had listened to hours of FBI conversation.
Real life so-called Mafiosi repeatedly alleged that an FBI informants were giving these guys the great stories, capers and dialogue for the TV series.
It's obvious that the creative team for Mad Man based their ideas on George Lois.
I loved Mad Men, nice interview
Gianna Toboni is simply adorable
peter455sd No she isn´t.
.
.
peter455sd Well that "girl" looks like a man so...
.
Many stories will never be made public.
The title says Don Draper. His voice says Teddy from Bob’s Burgers
Don Draper is a brilliant creative fiction - a copywriter based Creative Director. Copywriters generally do make the best team leaders. George Lois is a Creative. A man hard done by at times - a man who set himslef, with a little luck, in the right place with the right ideas at the right time. A man who created himself, as much as the mixture of illusion, ethics, politics and culture that make good advertising. All good creatives steal. Inspiration is not theft.
Don Draper had more class and legitimacy than this guy has ever dreamt of having.
He's not the art director--he's the creative director--Big difference.
This guy is nothing like Don Draper. This guy also seems to have taken credit all the time for other peoples' work.
I'm sick of the real ...
where is the real batman
Have you heard of ELON MUSK
He is Iron Man
Damn this story turned on George real quick. Fast-talking-grease ball
Don Draper was creative director, not art director. Pretty silly thing to mess up
This same interview is in some Ad Documentary on Netflix. George must have so many stories.
The resemblance is astonishing
Imagination is more important than knowledge. -- Albert Einstein.
I'm sure everyone has said this already, but Don Draper was/is not an Art Director. If you can't get that simple fact right about the primary character in a mega hit TV series, I can't put any value into any of your alleged 'journalism'. FAIL.
Chris Herrmann Gillespie you're the first and thank-you. i enjoyed the piece but don draper's title is creative director and he rose to that position from being a copy writer. to me, it's a fairly major distinction and makes the whole vice team seem lazy to have missed the mistake even though it was just a puff piece.
“It’s Toasted”.
Claims he's nothing like Don Draper, but exudes the same confidence, swagger, and ego. So yeah, outside of the New York accent, this is the guy.
I listened to serial podcast with Sarah Koenig a few months ago, I just finished watching mad men. I find this video on my recommendations and discover the guy don draper is loseys based on, had a partner whos daughter dis serial... crazy small world.
George lois is the guy in the "I am ali" documentary!!! I recognised him straight away
So therein is the paradox....When phony, contrived and full blown fakes are the most seductive and reveal true insights.
The only similiarity they have is that they were both good at the same job around the same time, this video is misleading.
If there is anything more nauseating than people in advertizing talking about themselves its actors giving themselves awards. Good to see VICE do its best CNN impression.
Had her story went that he threatened to throw THEM out the window, instead of himself, it would’ve sounded a little more Don Draperish 😂😂
I had to pause right at the beginning, art director? He's a Creative Director.
holy shit, haven't liked a Vice vid in ages!
Then why are you subscribed?
because before "in ages" there was some pretty darn good, consistent content coming out
There is always Vice News
Koleu yeah, decent channel.
I agree; very few Vice video's impress me... Vice pretends to be alternative media; but it pushes the same mainstream propaganda...
Most Vice videos are 30% tall tale and 70% "true"... Many videos are 99% fake; and its obvious.... People don't trust Vice anymore
CREATIVE DIRECTOR. NOT art. CREATIVE.
Just discovered “Mad Men” & luv the characters especially Don Draper. I doubt that Mr. Lewis was as compelling as Jon Hamm.
Nothing in real is half as compelling as TV
Anyone? Who is the reporter with short hair interviewing people? I kind fell in love! 🙇
Reminder that Vice is the type of organization who if given the opportunity to remake madmen, would cast female people of color to play all the guy parts, because, "WOMAN CAN DO IT TOO HURR DURR."
Don was the Creative Director, not an Art Director.
Interesting guy, the comment at the end though was moronic. Never learn anything in advertising from failures? bullshit... each failure helps you refine your understanding of what works, and more importantly perhaps, what doesn't work (if you actually think/analyze)... I think all the drinking has fried this guys brain.
jewbacca It's a good topic for conversation. In this instance, I imagine some cross examination would have been fruitful. My thoughts are that he didn't dwell on the failure, as he saw nothing in the act itself that gave him any creative insight. One could say that even practicing guitar until one gets it right is a series of failures. In that case, one is building brain muscle coordination, memory, and understanding. You're supposed to chip away, (hack) till it magically comes out right. But you've learned a lot about the process of learning. And the blocks you put in front of yourself. Lois seems like a guy who floated on top of the waves, and let others paddle for shore. His vice and success came from being so single minded that he discarded the value of other talents.
George has a dent in his head
New York, New York
Not to be confused with New York, Wyoming.
A Chicago documentary claimed Don Draper was based on Draper Daniels, a guy at Leo Burnett in Chicago. And many of the ad campaigns in the show were actually Leo Burnett ad campaigns - so this New York guy may have provided some inspiration but probably not most of it.
Draper Daniels is the inspiration for Don Draper. Chicago was the heart of the Mad Men zeitgeist.
So maybe that is real irony. New York want to mythologize it’s own creation story by couching it in a man who exemplifies the artful dodger. The story is the man, and the man is the story.
Next time Vice, do your research!
The character of Don Draper is partially inspired by Draper Daniels, a creative director at Leo Burnett advertising agency in Chicago in the 1950s, who worked on the Marlboro Man campaign; and by Bill Backer, an advertising executive at McCann Erickson who created the "I'd Like to Buy the World a Coke" ad in 1971
Now I know what Dire Straits meant when they said "I want my MTV"
Wow, when you see the teams picture you see how they done for the American art scene
For god's sake, Don Draper was NOT an art director! ARGH. He was a copywriter, then copy chief, then creative director. Creative directors can come from a design or copy background.
My only problem with Mad Men (and probably with Seinfeld also) is that it wasn't New York enough.
"Your a Bum" XD I died
The show wasn’t even really about the ads . It’s was about the characters. Draper didn’t care about the ads..he didn’t have an ego...that was Don Drapers problem ..he didn’t believe anything he did was ever good enough. George Lois and Don Draper are not similar in any way. Don didn’t even Care about the awards he won. Did you watch the show?
Thank you for this.