Great video. Thanks for sharing and explaining your framework with such detail (without been extra technical). I consider your dev strategy as a good one, and so many years in the market as a solo dev proves it. Keep doing videos like this once in a while. Bye.
I think that if you are a coder with some artisitic capabilities you would feel at home with a framework, an artist with coder capabailities would probably go for game engines. Nice that you are so consistently using your existing code that long. The urge to reinvent the way you do things is very strong. But not always wise. As a hobby game developer I want to try new things, but its a great lesson if you make a living out of it! Great video, like more of these!
This was really interesting; thanks for sharing. I started with Monogame a short while back (as a hobby) and have found it much more to my liking than Unity. I'm sure everyone has their own tastes, but for me Unity was doing everything the Unity way and I wanted to do stuff my way which involved writing a lot on top of it and barely using the engine. I think I've been more productive on a framework than I was with an engine.
Great video! I love to see these details, especially how you avoid too much coupling with libGDX. I'm always considering writing my own so that I can have more control and "future proof" my projects.
I think we can say with confidence that you have made your own game engine :P LibGDX is the framework (library) that you have built your game loop ontop of, and all of it's logic. Cool is see how you have structured everything.
@@orangepixelgames Yea, on occasion I have had some deep thoughts about what exactly the term "engine" exactly means in software. And from what I've seen, the pattern is that a game engine has to have an already existing "game loop" where all the game logic occurrs. And new game logic has to somehow hook into that loop in some way.
Great video. Interesting to hear the history about where it came from and how it evolved over the years. Perhaps it could be fun to load up one of your old concepts and go over why you decided to not continue with it for a future video.
This is great insight to your process. I love how your open about. I haven't finished the video quote yet, so I apologize if you answer my next question. How did you learn like the core stuff? Like most tutorials of frameworks I've watched, usually do with everything through the framework. How did you learn how to what is low-level or close to the metal stuff? What books did you read? I'm learning a framework myself but I also want to learn how to build from the ground up.
Teaching approaches have changed over the years. You might be better off with an older book that builds techniques & fundamentals one-by-one. Most video tutorials, and even most newer books, go more cookbook-style, where you learn how to do "This One Thing", then "That Other Thing", without really understanding what's going on, why do it this way, or how they're connected.
Great walk though thank you. Im a long term Java dev and im looking at writting a game atm and going through the standard framework or engine question. One thing you breifly mentioned was porting to consoles. Im torn between using monogame and learning c# which might be slower but allows console exports or using libgdx in java which would be quicker as its my day job but no console export. If you could go into more detail on your porting experiences that would be amazing.
If you wanna do consoles, monogame is a better path than Java. Just know that consoles require devkit access (not free and often not cheap) and PC is still the biggest market, in which case Java should do just fine
Very informative video! I think it shows that it is not the engine that makes a game but what the creator weaves with the tools provided to create. The lighting system sounds like it also saves on system resources but still provides the end result you are achieving into your creations. Thank you for this insight. Is there any drawbacks to your framework or constraints that you have come across that you have worked around or still tinkering with? Is there any performance differences between libgdx and monogame builds? I have only played some of your titles on pc at the moment and back in the day when I owned an Ouya lol the little box that could.
No performance differences, but that's also because the code is straightforward, and simple 2D sprite movement, and not a lot of overhead on things because it's all written for the thing it needs to do 😉. And sure the downside is that sometimes you need to put a lot of time into figuring things out that perhaps you haven't done before in your game. That's why I try to limit new technical challenges to just one per game project 😁
@@orangepixelgames Java to C# isn't a hard leap, especially comparing to post-Java 8, where they've been layering in more functional stuff. Given how you've already gone for a layered & modular architecture, you could probably get the hang of the language in weeks, and port your common-framework over in a matter of 5-6 months or less (assuming no active games in development).
I would like to use LibGDX but when analyzing the license I had some doubts about Apache 2 so I went to get some games from developers who use it like you. I bought two or three of your games and I didn't find the Apache 2 license either during the purchase or in the project files, so I wanted to ask. Doesn't the Apache 2 license require you to keep a copy of the license with every application sold or released?
@@orangepixelgames Well, I also thought it was like that, but reading the Apache license calmly and talking to a lawyer, the conclusion is that even when compiled, you need to add the license for end users. Can you tell me how you came to a different conclusion? This would help me a lot because I have a game yet to be released and it's holding me back.
Pretty sure the license is just for the source code and using that when creating another library with LibGDX code as base. You can also check: libgdx.com/funding/#:~:text=It%20is%20free%2C%20Apache%202,the%20games%20of%20their%20dreams.&text=libGDX%20is%20being%20developed%20lovingly,300%20volunteers%20across%20the%20globe. Or ask in their discord if you want to be sure
Not sure if they still run without putting time into them, but I can certainly dig into them and talk about what the idea was and why it didn't work! 😁
Great Video!!! I am interested in monogame, the issue is that there aren't many tutorials, and for what I found people say to work with XNA and then do some small changes... I have a little more skill on C# then on JAVA and because Monogame can port for almost everything... But I'm like you if I can find a good framework I prefer that then using an engine, yeah with engine everything seems esear, but with a framework I believe that you have all the control of the game...
Java's a great language, especially for learning, and for projects where long-term stability is prioritized (with as little maintenance as possible). In a parallel universe, if Microsoft had bought Sun instead of competing with Oracle, maybe Unity would've been built on Java 😄
I really hesitated to try libgdx with kotlin but I saw it a bit too late, I'll have to try someday as I find Kotlin way better than C# (unity) but I don't know yet what I'm losing/gaining by using a game engine and how much work I'd have to do or not by switching
Ha! Someone had to ask 😁 my main problem is that I often start the next project as a silly prototype while my other game is being wrapped up. And I then use the tools I have setup .. which means Java 🙃 it's just not giving myself time to set stuff up in-between projects
A game FRAMEWORK instead of Unity or Unreal ? FUCK NO! I've been working as a 3d game artist for 20 years now and Unreal 5 is a fucking dream come true and is also the reason I learned C++. which is powerful as hell.
Great video. Thanks for sharing and explaining your framework with such detail (without been extra technical). I consider your dev strategy as a good one, and so many years in the market as a solo dev proves it. Keep doing videos like this once in a while. Bye.
I'm amazed people are also watching this video.. so perhaps I will do more in the future
I think that if you are a coder with some artisitic capabilities you would feel at home with a framework, an artist with coder capabailities would probably go for game engines. Nice that you are so consistently using your existing code that long. The urge to reinvent the way you do things is very strong. But not always wise. As a hobby game developer I want to try new things, but its a great lesson if you make a living out of it! Great video, like more of these!
Oh sure, for some (many?) people, a framework and building most things yourself, probably isn't the way to go! Good thing that are options 😁
Always interesting to see how things work behind the scenes, thanks for the video!
Thanks for watching!
This was really interesting; thanks for sharing. I started with Monogame a short while back (as a hobby) and have found it much more to my liking than Unity. I'm sure everyone has their own tastes, but for me Unity was doing everything the Unity way and I wanted to do stuff my way which involved writing a lot on top of it and barely using the engine. I think I've been more productive on a framework than I was with an engine.
Same reason for me using my framework.. guess we like code and are maybe control freaks 😉
Great video! I love to see these details, especially how you avoid too much coupling with libGDX. I'm always considering writing my own so that I can have more control and "future proof" my projects.
Future proof was always a big reason behind my code/tool decisions
Hey Pascal, thanks for the video. Would be nice to have same in-depth video about your setup for drawing creatives and creating music. Cheers!
I use Gimp! To do my art, no other setup, and music I can't do, so I hire brilliant musicians for that 😎
libgdx is a lot of fun
It is!
I'm really interested to explore it do you have good resources on it ?
Try www.libgdx.com 🙃
another really brilliant video, I'm really liking these
Good to hear 🙃
I think we can say with confidence that you have made your own game engine :P
LibGDX is the framework (library) that you have built your game loop ontop of, and all of it's logic.
Cool is see how you have structured everything.
We could say that! Just not sure the term 'game engine' means the same for everyone these days 😉
@@orangepixelgames Yea, on occasion I have had some deep thoughts about what exactly the term "engine" exactly means in software. And from what I've seen, the pattern is that a game engine has to have an already existing "game loop" where all the game logic occurrs. And new game logic has to somehow hook into that loop in some way.
Great video. Interesting to hear the history about where it came from and how it evolved over the years. Perhaps it could be fun to load up one of your old concepts and go over why you decided to not continue with it for a future video.
Check next video, I did exactly that 😏
This is great insight to your process. I love how your open about. I haven't finished the video quote yet, so I apologize if you answer my next question. How did you learn like the core stuff? Like most tutorials of frameworks I've watched, usually do with everything through the framework. How did you learn how to what is low-level or close to the metal stuff? What books did you read? I'm learning a framework myself but I also want to learn how to build from the ground up.
You learn one thing at a time, and then improve it over the years after as you learn more things and better ways to do things 🙃
Teaching approaches have changed over the years. You might be better off with an older book that builds techniques & fundamentals one-by-one. Most video tutorials, and even most newer books, go more cookbook-style, where you learn how to do "This One Thing", then "That Other Thing", without really understanding what's going on, why do it this way, or how they're connected.
Great walk though thank you. Im a long term Java dev and im looking at writting a game atm and going through the standard framework or engine question.
One thing you breifly mentioned was porting to consoles.
Im torn between using monogame and learning c# which might be slower but allows console exports or using libgdx in java which would be quicker as its my day job but no console export.
If you could go into more detail on your porting experiences that would be amazing.
If you wanna do consoles, monogame is a better path than Java. Just know that consoles require devkit access (not free and often not cheap) and PC is still the biggest market, in which case Java should do just fine
Very informative video! I think it shows that it is not the engine that makes a game but what the creator weaves with the tools provided to create. The lighting system sounds like it also saves on system resources but still provides the end result you are achieving into your creations. Thank you for this insight.
Is there any drawbacks to your framework or constraints that you have come across that you have worked around or still tinkering with? Is there any performance differences between libgdx and monogame builds? I have only played some of your titles on pc at the moment and back in the day when I owned an Ouya lol the little box that could.
No performance differences, but that's also because the code is straightforward, and simple 2D sprite movement, and not a lot of overhead on things because it's all written for the thing it needs to do 😉. And sure the downside is that sometimes you need to put a lot of time into figuring things out that perhaps you haven't done before in your game. That's why I try to limit new technical challenges to just one per game project 😁
This was highly informative, think ill need to rewatch on desktop. Phones are a little tiny to see the more detailed sections
Quite interesting thanks for sharing, I do pretty much the same for all my games but I started with XNA and then ported everything into Monogame.
If I wasn't so much into Java , I guess monogame would have been my go-to library
@@orangepixelgames Java to C# isn't a hard leap, especially comparing to post-Java 8, where they've been layering in more functional stuff. Given how you've already gone for a layered & modular architecture, you could probably get the hang of the language in weeks, and port your common-framework over in a matter of 5-6 months or less (assuming no active games in development).
I would like to use LibGDX but when analyzing the license I had some doubts about Apache 2 so I went to get some games from developers who use it like you.
I bought two or three of your games and I didn't find the Apache 2 license either during the purchase or in the project files, so I wanted to ask. Doesn't the Apache 2 license require you to keep a copy of the license with every application sold or released?
That's the license for the source code of LibGDX, not the usage or "compiled" software you release with it. 😉
@@orangepixelgames Well, I also thought it was like that, but reading the Apache license calmly and talking to a lawyer, the conclusion is that even when compiled, you need to add the license for end users.
Can you tell me how you came to a different conclusion?
This would help me a lot because I have a game yet to be released and it's holding me back.
Pretty sure the license is just for the source code and using that when creating another library with LibGDX code as base. You can also check: libgdx.com/funding/#:~:text=It%20is%20free%2C%20Apache%202,the%20games%20of%20their%20dreams.&text=libGDX%20is%20being%20developed%20lovingly,300%20volunteers%20across%20the%20globe.
Or ask in their discord if you want to be sure
@@orangepixelgames Thank you very much! And congratulations on your great games :)
you should do a video running your unfinished older games
Not sure if they still run without putting time into them, but I can certainly dig into them and talk about what the idea was and why it didn't work! 😁
Great Video!!! I am interested in monogame, the issue is that there aren't many tutorials, and for what I found people say to work with XNA and then do some small changes...
I have a little more skill on C# then on JAVA and because Monogame can port for almost everything... But I'm like you if I can find a good framework I prefer that then using an engine, yeah with engine everything seems esear, but with a framework I believe that you have all the control of the game...
build your own framework! just pick a good library (like LibGDX.. it's Java, but it's not that hard of a language if you already know C or C#)
You could take a look at RayLib, too. It doesn't have as many features as libGDX/MonoGame, but it binds into almost any language in existance.
Think that for recommended to me a few videos ago, might check it out if it find some free time 😅
Great video!! I've always wanted to learn Libgdx, but with the first Gradle build error, I am like, "Nah, let's turn on Godot"
😁 Gradle can certainly be a pain, but once setup, LibGDX is painless
@@orangepixelgames Yeah, for sure! I think I should stop trying to set it up with Kotlin and go back to good old Java instead :)
Super interesting video, thanks a lot !
No problem! Thanks for watching
Nice to see another framework user! I use pygame and python for my projects!
tried Python a few times.. it's certainly a different language! :D cool to hear you use it
Same use pygame. Maybe I'll use pygame-ce forward but really nice framework and so many well made tutorials.
@@just_for_funarts9905 Yea I meant pygame ce but most ppl just call it pygame as well LOL
Nice one. I wonder if you ever did any game freelancing, like before your first successful games?
Oh sure, a lot of games made by me but published by other developers back in the like the first 5-6 years of running Orangepixel 🙃
Yess, I think Java is one of the best programming languages for games, especially for beginners, and LibGDX is very easy to learn
Not sure it's the best, but it's certainly over looked too much!
@@orangepixelgames Definitely, although my favorite to use is Rust with Macroquad :D
Java's a great language, especially for learning, and for projects where long-term stability is prioritized (with as little maintenance as possible). In a parallel universe, if Microsoft had bought Sun instead of competing with Oracle, maybe Unity would've been built on Java 😄
I really hesitated to try libgdx with kotlin but I saw it a bit too late, I'll have to try someday as I find Kotlin way better than C# (unity) but I don't know yet what I'm losing/gaining by using a game engine and how much work I'd have to do or not by switching
Never used Kotlin. As for Unity vs a library/framework, think that would be a big difference to get used to!
@@orangepixelgamesyou should try ! It's interoperable with java pretty easily ! It's the goat of languages 😂
Nice video - off topic, but curious when you'll be porting your games to xbox? I'd love to try them on that platform!
Still a work in progress! Same as the Playstation versions..
If you're using monogame for console, why not just use it for everything?
Ha! Someone had to ask 😁 my main problem is that I often start the next project as a silly prototype while my other game is being wrapped up. And I then use the tools I have setup .. which means Java 🙃 it's just not giving myself time to set stuff up in-between projects
if I understand you, you rewrote the whole game in c#, or used some code transpiler to do that?
Most is done by a transpiler, with manual work to fix the things that are broken 😉
@@orangepixelgames can you tell me do you use your implement of physics engine or use box2d or something else for libgdx and monogame?
@@marko95gI use my own code for physics and collisions, so it's transpiled easily between languages
A game FRAMEWORK instead of Unity or Unreal ? FUCK NO! I've been working as a 3d game artist for 20 years now and Unreal 5 is a fucking dream come true and is also the reason I learned C++. which is powerful as hell.