How "Moderates" Serve The Right
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ธ.ค. 2021
- This week we're talking about everyone's favorite grillpilled neighbor - the American "centrist" or "moderate". As much as they like to see themselves as enlightened arbiters of progress, centrists are little more than spoilers for actual democratic progress at best, and complete lackeys for the Right in most cases. Let's look at the insufficiency of the moderate worldview!
How "Moderates" Serve The Right - Second Thought
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Political Funding
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www.jacobinmag.com/2021/10/jo...
Further Reading
www.nytimes.com/interactive/2...
(rebuttal) quillette.com/2018/06/01/cent...
www.jacobinmag.com/2014/01/th...
/ beware-the-moderate • The TRUTH about Centrism
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It’s impossible to break the stranglehold of the “ moderate “ in a nation with two parties entirely beholden to corporate America .
America is not a capitalist society, it’s communism for the one percent. It doesn’t matter what your political view is in this country until it aligns with corporate interests. The oligarchs rule the system.
Exactly!! 👏🏼
they're right winger without extremist tendencies. elon musk's cheerleader gag farms, the jan 6th drops the soap variant excluded, but still terrible
Almost impossible, except for Fascism.
education is the only way for people to break free
If I’ve learned anything from your channel, it’s that every political word, term, and statement has its universal definition and an American definition.
propaganda has been the largest growing industry in the US for the last century. It is how the self-destructive business and policy keeps being successful. Looking at the history of financial institutions operate as or for cult ideology. Anyone who taps into the cult mentality can rapidly gain wealth and power as long as they don't threaten another cult's territory. I would not be surprised if all the tech giants operate under cult of personality. The US is probably the world's largest death cult that is slowly killing itself the behest of cult leaders.
Everywhere else they call it "Human rights" in america they call it "Communist" and "a bad idea"
@@MariaHernandez-ps6rx those commies don't sound as bad as they used to
@Miles Doyle dude, on the off chance you're not a bot
Shut up
That's way to long, I ain't reading that shit, and bible quotes aren't the way to get anyone to convert.
@@MariaHernandez-ps6rx And don't forget "woke". That's now the dirty word for championing any basic human rights.
"They wont even admit the knife was there"- wow, Malcolm, so FRICKING true
he's such a fucking legend
"If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. If an elephant has its foot on the tail of a mouse, and you say that you are neutral, the mouse will not appreciate your neutrality."
"Silence is compliance."
@@arise8078 thats the point of the quote, when one is clearly in the wrong and hurting another, choosing to do nothing is an act of violence on the side of the aggressor
i’ve got another good quote about this. “ nine people are sitting on a bus. Three people vote to crash the bus over the cliff. Two people vote to get ice cream instead. Four people don’t vote. The bus crashes over the cliff and everyone dies.”
Centerism allows for compromise between parties in a democratic system, but of course centerists are going to be on the right if your two parties represent the right and extreme right
"Neutrality helps the opressor, never the victim."
“They won’t even admit the knife was there” that quote still rings true nearly 60 years later.
Damn. Yes. Those words are quite meaningful in a time when conservatives are trying to change how history is taught for the worse, so as to "protect" white kids' feelings. Lying about the past helps no one. Pretending that the effects of slavery don't today still exist harms so many. Those words are meaningful in so many other ways as well.
Both Parties are evil.
@@davidlafleche1142 one is a fuck load more evil than the other right now. So stop your "both sides" bellyaching because the left isn't trying to strip away rights from minorities.
@@MrFox-ox2ze Both the Republican and Democratic Parties are infested with Roman Catholics and other devil-worshippers. They will unite to lead people to the Antichrist. "These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast" (Revelation 17:13, KJV). Even so, come, Lord Jesus! Establish the Kingdom in Jerusalem and save the world from the tyranny of Democracy (Daniel 7:7, KJV)!
@@davidlafleche1142 Sorry friend, but your choice of religion means nothing in the context of leading and governing. We do not and will NEVER live in a theocracy.
This is where the saying "All Progress is Change, but not all change is progress." Comes to mind.
Then I guess just be moderate left?
@Bannari totally. Your either a communist or a imperialist nazi . There’s no in between. And there’s no war in ba sing sai
@Bannari Moooom! The alt-right is mocking anyone with a hint of being on the left again!
@Bannari who knew I was conservative because I don't get falling down piss drunk at the bar XD
What, precisely, in the left wing platform do you feel is not progress?
An inherent vulnerability of compromise is that one party can suggest something FAR upstream of what they want, and then "settle" for exactly what they ACTUALLY want.
i.e. they want loosed regulations, so they suggest absolutely no regulations whatsoever, and then "settle" for loosened regulations.
sometimes i kind of wish there was more of this tactic on the left just to counterbalance it instead of trying to make incremental and presentable suggestions...but i don't know what's really best
@@Envy_May The bitter irony is that if the Left tries to do this, the Right is very good at spinning this as them being crazies.
The sad fact of the matter is that the people who vote for the right also tend to be much more vulnerable to such misinformation.
The inherent weakness in any US political “compromise” is that both sides serve the same master 😉
"'Meet me in the middle,' says the unjust man.
You take a step toward him; he takes a step back.
'Meet me in the middle,' says the unjust man."
@@Envy_Mayyes, EXACTLY! SOMEBODY finally SAID IT! THANK YOU!
Well, the cartoon at the beginning perfectly showed it:
What is the middle ground between beating a black man to death and giving him equal rights?
Just breaking his legs in the sake of compromise?
Compromise is often a good, but on some topics there can be no middle ground.
The tolerance paradox
Maybe we have different views on centrism
How ive seen it is centrism isnt between "beating a black man to death and giving him equal rights" but rather between oppressing ethnic minorities, and having "white guilt", in which case the centre would be what you want, "equal rights"
I see myself as a centrist due to my lack of radical beliefs. I take some (mostly social) policies from the left, and a few (mostly economic) from the right, so I'd consider myself centrist. Is it seen as different in america?
@@potassium1311Based. The reason people want to call themselves “moderates” is because they don’t want to get lumped in with the extremists on *either* side.
@@Seven-ce9znIt’s not the tolerance paradox.
@@potassium1311 I'm not from the U.S. of A, and actually find your positions here similar to mine.
TLDR; I agree with you, but being a centrist can mean very different thing to different people.
But there is some muddy terminology, mostly because political terms are not all too exact (think of how an American conservative would be considered far right in Europe).
The centrist or moderate who discards the extreme far out policies to get a nuanced position (we shouldn't oppress people based on their skin color, and neither shame other people for the same on the other extreme) does not discard those policies because of their origin, but because of their extremeness.
On the other hand, there is a certain kind of moderate who positions himself by gradually re-centering on the spectrum, which means his position moves with the spectrum. For wide swaths of the population this happens unconscious and low key, like the de-stigmatization of homosexuality over the last few decades. In the eighties, for example, the centrist position on that was not 'let them be equal, because it doesn't really affect me anyways' but more 'we shouldn't actually punishing them, but it is still disgusting, so get them out of sight'.
Once you try to find the center for the sake of compromise, you lost, since then the old tactic of 'demanding twice the amount of what we actually want' defaults you towards the real position of the far spectrum. An example would be how the medicaid bill got watered down to actually pass, thus actually conforming to republican policy whilst being pressed on by the democrats (extreme over simplification here of course).
"They won't even admit that the knife is there"
Malcom was talking too much truth to life.
That knife analogy is really powerful and accurate
Facts
He has a point, but you cannot equate that to modern day imo. I consider myself a centrist, I think all people should have all rights (gay, trans, even sentient robots) but I do not think things like gun control are as important. I don’t like capitalism but most people on both sides are way too passionate with little information. I don’t have an issue with abortions and would consider myself mostly politically left. I do still think that there should be freedoms that can be enjoyed in life because ultimately nothing matters (I think gun modding is a cool hobby) and I think you can go too far into authoritarian control by asking for everything to be regulated. I am open minded on all subjects and have changed opinions many times, feel free to change my mind if you disagree.
@@god8348 you’re not a centrist
@@god8348 regulations = authoritarianism
You can't make this up man
So Schrödinger’s cat isn’t a paradox, the cat is just a centrist
th-cam.com/video/JdKsWuqPfpw/w-d-xo.html
Clever ;)
Good one.
I understand the thought experiment but it was always so STUPID to me.
@@silentj624 Schrödinger also thought it was stupid, and he used it to show how ridiculous the theories on quantum mechanics at the time were. The thought experiment does still hold up today though.
centrism is a privilege afforded only to those whose right to exist haven't been made a political issue.
Tellem
"If 1 n**i is sitting at a table and the other 9 people don't say anything, you have 10 n**is sitting at a table"
Nah i dont agree tbh
@@glxrybxy8484 why?
@@glxrybxy8484 but they are right like trans people not being able to receive care makes their existence political right?
I've been trying to convince the people around me that we need to do more, but they simply don't want to. I get told that, "It's out of our control." I try to tell them that if we all worked together, then it would be in our control, but I am met with silence. On occation I am regaled with the many negative things that are holding us back.
I am losing hope and a will to continue. I want good to happen, and I see these things happen from time to time, but it is so much easier to see the bad. I think I just need to get off of the internet for a while because even a video like this depresses me.
I never sent a chat like this before. I'm merely trying something new. Goodbye.
Best of luck mate!!!!
Stay in good health, you’re not alone in all this.
and this is why you don't just search for only negative-sided videos kids
@ros9764 What is a negative sided video?
Maybe try watching content on political action/activism
"Justice delayed is justice denied". That's a great quote. I'm gonna remember that one.
What do you like about it?? I actively hate the quote, it's used by the anarchist crowd to say mob rule should take over and it's okay to lynch someone in the streets if a lengthy trial is the alternative. I'm my opinion it's a very hateful and evil way of thinking
What does it mean though?
@@spadethelizard4608Imagine you are told by your teacher that you failed a test despite getting every question right. The teacher says it is because they don't like the color of your hair.
Obviously, you would be upset, and complain to the principal. But instead of firmly reprimanding the teacher or removing them from the classroom, the principal says, "Just be patient. They'll come around eventually. You don't need to be upset about it, change will come with time"
So you put up with it for now. A week goes past. Then a month. Then a year. Has the teacher's opinion changed? No, it hasn't. They still give you poor marks simply because they don't like the color of your hair.
People tend to not change opinions (or in the real case, laws) on their own. If no one makes an attempt to challenge authority on an issue, they will not fix it. You have to persuade them to fix it, and in a democracy you do that through a lot of things (protesting againsy the issue, voting for people that support your opinion on the issue, signing a petition, etc).
By telling people to just accept injustice because things will eventually change, you fail to realize that, if you don't make your voice heard, nothing will change.
@@spadethelizard4608 too little to late
Not a radical position at all
simple: you can’t compromise with bullies
You can't compromise between a bully and bullied, but you can compromise with two fighters.
You also can't just call any opposition bullies.
@@USA_UNITED1776I think it's safe to say you can call the racists, homophobes, sexists and people who take away human rights bullies
@@TedBilk people who take away human rights but not homophobes sexists or racists, bullying is harming people, holding negative and bigoted political opinions does not harm anyone beyond harming your feewings
@@TedBilk anyone who takes away human rights are criminal. but not all racist homophobes or sexist people do that.
"Article 19
Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers." everyone has a human right to be sexist or homophobic or racist if they want if you say otherwise you my friend are arguing for peoples human rights to be taken away.
In US politics, the term "moderate" is used as in self-descriptions by the type of conservative that you describe in some circumstances, but also by some people who have a disdain for both parties equally, can't quite put their finger on why, and typically end up voting for democrats while gritting their teeth at what their candidates end up doing in office. The latter group would benefit from watching this video and determining that in fact they are further "left" than both parties, and that we are given the choice between two parties criminal neoliberal capitalists.
There's a reason Bernie was so popular. It was because he was the first lefty in either party since FDR. But rampant corruption in both parties knew this and did everything they could to shut him down.
I am certainly of the former group. I tend to vote Democrat; but I would vote Republican if a decent and sane candidate came along. I believe in lassaiz faire capitalism; *NOT* crony capitalism. I have no issues with socialized Healthcare -- we need more of it; it's not affordable to the middle class, these days and that's a problem. I have an issue with the green new deal -- it does not appear to be economically realistic or viable. So... does this make me Republican? Not quite. Glenn Beck would not like my stance on some things -- Paul Krugman would also not like my stance on some things.
@@gilian2587 In my opinion capital markets are effective in markets with high price elasticity of demand, where price has a strong causal relationship with demand. Capital markets fail with low price elasticity of demand markets, e.g healthcare, because there is less causality between price and demand. If there is a drug that I need to live, or even just to live healthily, typically my demand will not waiver very much with price increases. This is when socialized markets are more effective.
I will add that laissez-faire capitalism is often "crony capitalism" in that a market with no restrictions allows for actors to cause negative externalities which they often don't internalize. See: pollution, emissions, glaciers melting, etc etc. Also, in laissez-faire, market actors will often trend toward monopoly or non-competitive market practices and collusion, so as to maximize the profits for all market participants. This sort of scenario creates is particularly damaging in these inelastic markets, but is damaging in any market where it takes place. Not to mention laissez-faire capitalism implies no protections for the workers who actually add the value that their employers profit on. All nasty stuff in my opinion.
@@Implicit_Truth Then, it doesn't sound like our views are completely at odds.
I agree with you that protections for workers is important.
With respect to CO2 emissions; my understanding is that a higher CO2 density per air volume increases the factor by which infrared radiation is retained in the atmosphere. The main concern is that the El Nino and La Nina cycle will be permanently and irrevocably disrupted; which could lead to some areas of the globe receiving more water and other areas receiving less. The current, most commonly proposed cure to this issue is switching to using wind and solar power -- which both require either a backup electrical generation mechanism or a battery farm to smooth out their intermittentcy. The Democratic party has not spearheaded any initiatives to build more nuclear power plants; in contrast to recommendations from well respected climatologists like James Hansen.
@@gilian2587 I believe in lassaiz faire capitalism but only for things we don't NEED. Some things fall in a grey area so I say some regulation is needed, some things are completely frivolous and I say let er' rip. Socially, I'm quite libertarian.
“Reaching across the aisle” never means compromising with left wing ideas. It always means appeasing the conservative constituents and telling leftists that they “ask for too much”
Ah good old American politics. I see "centrists" saying it all the time oh well the left has some good ideas but we just can't go that far... why why can't we go that far.
@@jacksmith-vs4ct because of my bank account cx that's why cx it comes from a place of pathetic behavior.
@@jacksmith-vs4ct this is also how the 'sensible blairite enlightened centrists' have been gaslighting the left in the UK since forever.
Reaching across the aisle is akin to me compromising with my fiancé.
I represent the Left and our “compromises” are always closer to what she wanted lol
Well said!
"Stick a knife in my back 9 inches and pull it out 6 inches, that's not progress."
Malcolm X was fucking legit.
might be a legend, but that analogy is flawed. A lot of things are not black or white.
@@buttheadrulesagain No one said anything was black and white, you seem to have missed the point quite spectacularly here
As for the analogy, before you get medical attention, not pulling the knife at all is the best thing to do, and pulling it all the way out is the worst. If you pull it some, it might cut more of your organs. If you pull it all the way out, you bleed out. Medical staff would set up to treat you before pulling it out and immediately treat you after pulling it out.
@@buttheadrulesagain ain’t a legend it’s a simple phrase. If you don’t get it ask teacher at school.
@@SaltoDaKid I was saying he is a legend (my bad, I was not clear). I understand what he is saying and still think it is flawed thinking. Having some rights vs having no rights IS progress.
I love how Jreg's anti-centrist ideology gets a video essay. A true philosopher indeed.
I’m not left nor right, no liberal no conservative, I’m a foreigner, and y’all are some weird folks over in the US for allowing your political system to be so divisive and bereft of any real democratic sense
"Justice delayed is justice denied" I like that, good line.
So you’d prefer a guilty until proven innocent system?
@@relvezz6997 that doesn't follow whatsoever.
It's dumb though. Karma exists.
@@relvezz6997 excuse me what the fuck? "justice delayed is justice denied" doesnt refer to court cases, its in reference to how the government doesnt respond to or even makes cases of injustice worse, meaning, if you promise justice in a few years from now, every few months, thats not justice, thats denial of justice, because it never arrives.
idk where you got guilty until proven innocent from this, but its not an individual issue, its a nation wide issue, if not a global issue.
@@BygoneT not really..?
I hate when politicians spout “think of the children” or “no increased taxes” while pushing for legislation to do more stuff
"Think of the children!" Espouses the legislator trying to make it illegal for anyone under 18 to be transgender.
Zeducation has a great outro combining a few clips, one of which was Madame Pelosi Antoinette saying "have to be ready to throw a punch - for the children" in 2019
"Think of the children!" fights to keep Child Marriage legal, sweeps child molestation under the rug, defunds anti human trafficking organizations, names on loleta island black books
Charlie Baker used that excuse to ban all vape sales in the state of Massachusetts because like 10 high school kids bought a bad batch of THC-vape juice off the street that made them sick (maybe some died I don't remember), so he killed an entire industry and hundreds of jobs statewide that was regulated because he was "thinking of the children".
Edit: In an effort to combat black market sales he made the entire industry effectively a black market, real brainiac type move.
Hey car, go further, but think of the emissions and no more gas money
As someone who, for a long time, viewed himself somewhat as an Independent, what changed my mind is genuinely coming to understand how stupid our American politics are.
I found that almost *all* my opinions were far further left than anything even available to us, in America, with the closest being Bernie thus far.
It kinda shook me in some way, because i often didn't think of myself as being an Extremist. But everything left of Neoliberalism is considered extreme, here.
I think for many Self Identified Centrists, Moderates, etc, they *want* to be compromising, and they *want* to be understanding at their core. But we live in an Artificially Polarized Society, that magnifies issues that are superficial, or minor in scope, while shuffling away bigger issues or twisting them to fire at eachother. I feel many such Independents fall for that false polarization, ironically, by thinking they haven't. That they're smart because they see both sides of an Arguement, that they've escaped the Duality, only to have been trapped by it, as much as others.
I feel if we had a society that had a far more well defined left, having a Centrist menality would not be a bad thing at all. Because a Compromising nature is inherently a good thing, I believe. Diplomacy is founded on the idea that no one gets exactly what they want, but what they need.
But we can't have Diplomacy, even, until we're at a Stage where Progress can actually be made and instated in a genuine way, rather than base lip service by people protecting that Status Quo. Compromise should not be about protecting the facets of society underpining our misery, but instead about leaning towards change in a slow, and methodical way. About de-escalation, and civil pursuits of liberty so it is no longer *necessary* to pursue Justice, Equity, and Workers rights through the most violent or uprooting means.
Thats what it should be about. But it isn't...not yet, anyway.
Holy shit, the way you explained the transformation of leftists into conservatives just completely *clicked* for me. Your explanation was incredible. My mom always talked about how she and my dad suddenly went from liberal to conservative, because the definition changed suddenly. I never understood why until now!
(p.s.: I don’t personally share their views! I’m super left-wing. I just thought the concept of the parties switching was super bizarre)
@@moshinrafsanjani7379 i doubt it, just indicative of the mentality of most leftists
Thought I had an aneurism for a sec there
As an Australian, without the vocabulary this has I told my mother the other day: "The "left" in America just seems less "right" than the "rights". They're both still Right". I knew what I meant at the time and this was pretty much it ❣️
American left is different from American Liberal/Moderates.
@@EdgieAlias I think this is why they used quotation marks. Liberals are perceived as the left by a great deal of the population, often including themselves.
In my country the liberal party is considered right
@@schoggistangeli4839 yes same here in Australia. The "Liberal Party" is definitely the further right of the two ... But I definitely wouldn't consider them "right-wing" in a global sense. They'd be considered moderates on a world stage.
@@EmperorRyker yes thank you for interpreting that as I meant it .. I didn't mean the people that call themselves left. They are left. Just in the political landscape. It's so ridiculous to hear ANYONE call Joe Biden followers "the radical left" when if anything they're *just* left of centre.
Powerful MLK and Malcom X quotes. Awesome you found clips of them saying it. Appreciate it
something about prozzies?
th-cam.com/video/JdKsWuqPfpw/w-d-xo.html.
I was wrong about mlk ,
And thanks for the people for who explained mlk bio
@@everythingsfine1395 In what way was MLK a right winger?
@@Dachusblot
Okay i get it
Imagine growing up in a country where Joe Biden is thought of as left wing. Christ.
You give us too much credit. Plenty of people here consider Joe Biden an "extreme leftist communist".
Bernies a leftist, and even then not to an extreme. hes pretty close to the center 😂
@@elmerandrewcrowley2822hes far left in American terms therefore hes considered very left wing there, you act like we’re dumb for having a different definition of it when our political situation is obviously going to be very different
@@brandonjade2146 Lmao nah it's dumb that America is so self-centered they it creates its own definitions for things in the first place. For example Football... a sport where only one person is allowed to touch the ball with their foot. Or left wing politics that actually isn't left wing. The wings of politics is not measured like that. Something is either left wing or it isn't, it's not comparative.
its crazyyy how can the left wing candidate STILL not support universal healthcare? shits mad
The only thing that determines if people call themselves centrist/moderater/whatever imo. is whether they align with any popular left/right political movement or not. Like some other commenters said, even very left or right people can identify as centrist if they feel different from the main movements and its pundits, and its participants. You can make any centrist allign with you, but they are not your "ally".
Saying that centrist only want the status quo or traditional, safe policy is a partisan brainrot take. Stay true to yourself and dont feel forced to politically and emotionally align with people you feel nothing in common with. And most importantly, vote in local elections, and vote on policy.
Do you believe the left and right are symmetric? Surely, centrists benefit a side more than the other. In fact, one side is explicitly promoting no change, while the other is promoting some change. Centrists do not lend their political power to either side. By doing that, they disproportionately benefit the party of inaction, QED.
@@SaurianSavior Your profile picture is pretty funny in this context. It's like I'm in one of those staged convo reddit posts.
@@SaurianSavior Centrist are not the average between the two extremes, some issues I am left on, others I am right and sometimes neither make compelling arguments.
This makes soooo much sense. There’s a lot of “movements” by certain people and those can be overwhelming to side behind due to something flawed in their argument. I believe there’s a lot of people that say true things and say false things, and to completely devote yourself to someone means everything they are saying is right and that’s rare to find.
I totally agree. This shit alienated people who could be convinced of the lefts arguments but now don’t want to be because they were all called fascists for not fitting nicely into society’s box. Something you’d think a progressive would be against…
"I think a multitude makes discord, not good counsel." - Duchess Satine (Star Wars: The Clone Wars S2, Ep13)
The scene in question sees Duchess Satine arguing that war can be avoided, while Obi-Wan Kenobi argues that a military offensive is necessary. One senator tries to intervene and defuse the situation, saying that "there are two sides to every dilemma," but in reality, he is only undermining Satine's position.
Seems like a pretty good summary of this topic.
“Disney made Star Wars political” buddy I have six incredible movies to tell you about
A friend of mine once said:
Sometimes trying to find a compromise is like trying to let two people drive the same car. One wants to turn right and one wants to turn left but no matter how hard or softly they pull, they will continue to go straight on.
I think they would just crash.
@@claudiusflavius2493
That's the point - comprising between the two results in no actual change being made.
@@GTAVictor9128 what he's saying is a crash isn't "no change" it's a bad thing and that's what happens with centrism too
Its like to the left and right is a cliff, and then both sides are complaining you didnt make a choice.
@@benmasta5814 literally no
As someone who considers policies based on ideas and their ramifications. I don’t consider myself a centrist. I probably go with left or left leaning ideas 95% of the time. However that does not stop me from criticizing both sides of politics.
True
Criticizing elements of both sides is *so much better* than pretending both are equal, whether you think they're equally bad or equally harmless.
At least you are actually politically aware and active. It is far better than almost every other US person you will find except by luck.
That's exactly how I am.
Criticizing both sides is not the same as the ideological jujitsu centrist politicians practice to avoid committing to any actual change
reading Birmingham Jail and seeing how all of my thoughts about this country were formalized 50+ years ago was a moment of true enlightenment.
"Powers America to defeat China" followed immediately by "Don't listen to the extremes"
Genuinely fucking incredible.
It’s really disappointing how easily manipulated the majority of the people are. We are taught to believe that the country is evenly divided with most people not being too far left or too far right, but every time a left leaning option is presented to us (higher wages, universal healthcare, infrastructure spending) 60% or more of people are in favor of it. Around 60% of Florida voted for a $15 minimum wage AND still chose Donald Trump on the same ballot.
Or perhaps, instead of assuming that. You could realize that what people *say,* and what they actually *do* are often completely different.
I don't disagree that there is some hypocrisy here, but $15 is not worth what it was a year ago, especially considering that the 8.5% core inflation figure pitched by the Fed doesn't reflect reality for the average American, or at least, not down here in Florida.
Since Spring 2021, when the $15 Federal Minimum Wage was proposed by the Biden Administration, Florida's rent has increased by 25%, and gasoline has increased by 35.2%.
If you do some rough math, and go by the Census data for household spending, you'll find that the average car owning renter has to spend about 18% more to maintain their 2021 standard of living. This means that $15 in May 2022 is actually equal to about $12.72 in May 2021, which is just 72 cents over the minimum wage Manchin pitched last year.
Also, the $15 minimum wage in Florida is being implemented in $1 annual increments, and won't actually get that high until 2025, so at the end of it all, this minimum wage increase is not an increase, but a cost of living correction in an era of high inflation.
@@99certain45 hey Aaron, be careful your sound logic gets lost on most ppl. I still stand by the notion that I’m neither left or right, I think both parties are the reason this county will soon be lost
A lot of working class republicans don’t realize that they are voting against their own interests!!
@@brianatippens3010 and working class democrats are also being screwed over too. Ever seen how California is ran? Majority Liberal, Majority Left-wing, you can't use the right-wing scapegoat there.
Now on the Right-wing hand, you have Mississippi. They've been hit with hurricanes that are financially near impossible to recover from and generally do not fare economically well.
when you realize both parties are the problem, thats when you recognize and take out the fake illusion of choice in our voting systems.
USA: Either healthcare or etho-state
Most of eastern europe: Why not both
eastern europe: *fails*
@BK Americans are only dimly aware that anywhere outside the USA even exists.
More like, most of planet Earth.
Every black person I meet is a racist. The way they bring race into EVERYTHING makes it impossible to trust them or make friends with them. America started to heal during the Reagan years when the races started to work it out. Then Bush sr then Clinton then Bush jr years and things were progressively getting better. Then Obama comes in and suddenly the Dems are pushing the racial divide for votes, telling every white person you either scream at people like we do, or you're a "literal nazi". The narrative is designed to cause division for votes. It is designed to turn white people into a hated minority.
Eastern Europe neglects their healthcare because right wing
Ive been arguing this for decades. Most people are blind to this and believe and act on irrational fear instead of reality.
This comment will fit almost any "argument" video
I used to be a centrist back in the beginning of my political journey. At that time I subscribed to the idea that “We should consider good ideas, whether they come from the right or the left” and similar ones. The thing is that, I’ve realised that basically ALL of the good ideas come from the left, while the right doesn’t present anything particularly valuable. Also, the ideology of my centrism was already notably left-leaning. And so I drifted first to social democracy, them to democratic/moderate socialism, and then to the ultra-left politics.
“Free stuff” and taxing the middle class into oblivion is NOT a “good idea” . But hey, it’s what they all do so 🤷♂️
Yeah no you’ve just always been a commie that tried to pretend being a centrist. Also you can’t just say “good” ideas, you’re biased towards thinking that but in politics most of the time there’s no objective good.
@@NuzhdarHamdownError 404, middle class not found.
It seems you're looking for a page that doesn't exist, did you mean
The Only Class That Matters Is The Working Class
Imo I’m still centrist because politics is quite a bit more nuanced than “1 side is right more often than the other.”
Believing that the left is more right than others is biased when they’re the only ones creating new ideas, and even then, the split between ‘good idea that benefits everyone’ and ‘idea that sounds good on paper but actually has a ton of unintended consequences’ is like 60-40. It’s a bit difficult to affiliate with a group that is wrong almost as often as it is right, even if it is right more often than the other side.
@@NuzhdarHamdown I mean, the corporatist boot-fellators are hell bent on stomping everything below their ultra-wealthy benefactors into the dirt, so what middle class do you mean, exactly?
For many americans, socialism has been redefined as providing a public service, rather than having anything to do about the means of production
Public services shouldn't be coming out of my tax dollars if all I do is go to work and come home with my own vehicle.
@@Zeromaus Im not a socialist but you are wrong on what you just said. You drive on publically maintained roads. You drive on roads that are safe because publically funded police keep off criminals. You don't worry about hitting a landmine on your way to work because your publically funded military fends off invaders. Not saying the state should control the means of production, but taxes are still a necessity for society to work.
@@logancopper3385 People who own large amounts of property and those in the country have built roads with the help of their neighbors for ages.. Private companies and citizens have been seen repairing potholes these past few years that the government has ignored. I'd much rather the police not be patrolling roads and I know I'm not the only one -- speedtraps don't keep us safe. We have a large amount of people in the military who would happily act as a volunteer force in the name of defense, don't believe this? Look at the Ukranian volunteer force, or our volunteer firefighters. The necessity of taxes is an illusion.
@@Zeromaus 1. 98% of streets and highways are publically owned and maintained, not privately. 2. Your police argument is that you're sour you're not allowed to go at dangerous speeds and get away with it? If you want to say you don't like government because you're selfish that's fine but don't pretend cops are bad because you're too impatient to go the speed limit. 3. Your statement about the military is based on literally nothing. Where's your source on that, I see no proof of that. Furthermore, Ukraine has a legitimate military and those 'volunteers' were primarily drafted, and the 20,000 volunteers soldier number that have been thrown around has been completely unverified. I.e. Everything you said is just something you pulled out of nowhere or read on a sketchy site and have taken as proof because you don't like the facts.
@@logancopper3385 Cops literally don't prevent crime though, they just show up after the crime has been committed and file paperwork on it.
Firefighters are a fair example of volunteer workers -- people will always be there to fill the gaps.
A lot of this stems from the McCarthy era, when being a socialist or a lefty could get you incriminated. This sent the political debate irreversibly on a right wing trajectory.
Unfortunately true. Look at how even Biden is labeled a communist when he’s nowhere near one. And conflating any even vaguely leftist idea as communist while we’re at it! It’s exhausting tbh.
@@Caterfree10 this is why I think the Cold War wasn't as much of a win for the US as we believe. Collectivism is now actively shunned and demonized as "communist ideas" instead of caring for your fellow countrymen. Aggressive individualism is hailed as this amazing thing when in reality, it is hurting the American people. The degree of individualism in this country is a selfish "Screw you, I got mine" world view.
@@ARV1999 living through this godforsaken pandemic has definitely taught me that tbh. It’s frustrating and I wish I had any clues as to how to fucking fix this.
The rise of neoliberalism only reinforced that...
@@ARV1999 Capital (the capitalist/ruling class) is more trans-national than we’d like to think. It doesn’t have principled national allegiance, outside of taking advantage of the US’ current status as the leading imperialist power.
Just look at how “we” (american presidents & corporations like IBM) collab’d w/ notsees & fascists prior to, during, and well after the wars (just 1 example: see ‘Operation Paper-clip in which the US brought over hundreds of notsee scientists & hired them in our government).
Capital (its sociopaths & beneficiaries) is the only “side” that “wins” these wars in any meaningful sense - it just makes sure to manufacture mass consent for them by brainwashing americans in such a subtle yet unparalleled way that notsee propaganda minister Goebbels literally admired our propaganda - the best kind, because while it works very effectively, most of the people swimming in it are too dumb/indoctrinated/addicted-to-the-boot to see the propaganda for what it is w/out getting uncomfortable & deflecting to some other country.
It's interesting. I love your vids. Signed up to nebula because it.
A lot of what you talk about is just absolutely great, and has helped me find more books to read for my own work in philosophy and ethics.
But it is also very interesting to as a Scandinavian to see things in the US that are just not correct here.
I have been waiting for a channel like yours for a long long time. It’s so validating and supportive to have a voice like yours. Thank you for this!
That Malcolm X qoute made me realise that things unfortunately haven't changed significantly enough for decades now .
I think things have changed a-lot
wait do we still live in segregation?
More like poc haven't changed their own nature significantly enough lmao
@@ericfisher565
Yes actually. Peoplenare still segregated.
@@ericfisher565 yes, actually, the legacy of redlining lives on today through public schools funded by property tax. Meaning poor black neighbourhoods have poor, black schools
I feel this view only really works in a country with a two party system like the US. I live in Finland and consider myself a centrist, because I literally vote for a centrist party (there is a party in Finland called the Cenrists, but I don't vote for them). There is an entire spectrum of parties with different views on economics and social issues, and you are able to find your own place somewhere in there. Idk about the US, but here centrists aren't obsessed with "compromise" any more than the other parties, and simply don't have a political agenda that aligns with either extreme.
An example of a simplified centrist view here would be "I support wellfare and want to keep taxes high in order to support it, but I also want to support the free market and give people the opportunity to start a business. I also support progressive social values and want to improve the position of marginalized peoples."
You’re right. The US political spectrum is so to the right that a “centrist” is really a conservative in the European political spectrum
@Miles Doyle bruh we're not reviewing your essay for you
I've always known that a two party system was inferior. There are so many people in America of all shapes and sizes and creeds. Two parties cannot feasibly meet everyone's demands.
@Miles Doyle people don’t read these btw
Thats still centrism my dude, that's still "compromise" between capitalism and socialism which is still just capitalism.
That's the knife in everyone's back.
Just because the multi-party system has a party that represents the centrist "compromise" between the rulling classes and working class people, doesn't make that centrist ideology any less dangerous. Us Europeans really need to get over the idea that our political systems are just because they're better than the US. Being less evil doesn't make us not evil.
In the US, I rarely see a centrist who agrees with left wing politics more than right. Seems to skew 90% conservative with maybe a few left learning social beliefs. That's all ya need to consider yourself a centrist. It's usually a conservative who doesn't wanna be tied down by a label.
Mainly because a lot of left wing stances just dont work
I mean- America is a country with two major right leaning parties (yeah- you can argue as much as you want but the democratic party is a centre right party-)
@@iamthewalrus2579 funny how America was functioning way better during the trump republican days
@@moshinrafsanjani7379 he was the first president of the 21st century to not start a war
@@moshinrafsanjani7379 he was against illegal migration from Mexico and around that time the cartels were rampant so it was a security concern if mexicans were going into the us undocumented at a high level
this has been an observation of miine for a long time now and I've been racking my brain trying to fill in the gaps as to why this happens, this video has thus been a big help for me!
Ralph Nader once said that the political spectrum is not even a left-right issue, but a top-down one (especially in a near-oligarchy like the US).
Yeah US is pretty much an oligarchy
@@pebblepod30 false
@@pebblepod30 but if you give up on entry to gain gun control, then give up on gun control to gain abortion. When do you stop _LOSING?_
@@pebblepod30 That's not left, genius. The real left WANTS guns.
"Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary...The whole proletariat must be armed at once with muskets, rifles, cannon and ammunition, and the revival of the old-style citizens’ militia, directed against the workers, must be opposed. " - Karl Marx
Jack Monaghan left vs right IS bottom vs Top.
Can’t agree more, it’s time to see what the “center” really is, a way of delaying the changes that we need.
you can't complain that democracy isn't working to solve an issue when the reason it isn't solved is that people voted against you
@Bruzzh 2121
Ofc you’ll think so , your a liberal not a leftist , and tomorrow you’ll count as a right winger , that’s it
@@jordancarter9064
You didn’t see the stats of the people who want free health , and free college .. lol it’s clear a few people stops the progress , starting from biden , to every other republicans, ilhan omar support free education but im sure you hate the name so much lol
@@everythingsfine1395 Exactly....
@@Martin8120
I know right , i realized this long time ago , biden is anti immigrant and liberal , pelocy is a capitalist and liberal those people are just right wingers , in today society and they are blocking the progressiveness ,
I started out my road into politics as someone considering each idea on it's own merits. And I honestly think the left gets way more ideas right than the right does when you look at each idea individuality. I don't think rationality favors centrism. Maybe it does on a few issues, but not overall.
Spoiler you’re just a leftist
Yeah, I think true centrism would be looking at how each group tackles each issue, and seeing which option is moral or harmful (instead of from a holistic perspective of staying between two sides) Even then you’d see that the left favors general wellbeing a lot more than the right.
I don't remember where I first heard it, or even if where I first heard it was the source, but I remember a saying that goes like "Life is left-leaning"
It's unnatural and against human nature to be right
@@tabithal2977exactly. Humans only prevailed because of collectivism, not cheap individualism.
@@tabithal2977 yes, I too love dehumanizing people who disagree with me…
So tell me again, which side resembles the Nazis?
Unpopular opinion: Political debates these days are toxic and pointless af. Why? Because we lable every polarizing statements as "left" or "right", "liberal" or "conservative", instead of what is right or wrong.
These days? That’s how it’s always been.
@@bobblueford Not unpopular, yet people are getting hyped up about being the "left" or "right", people who are the "right" are seeing Trump as America's Messiah and going fucking nuts over it while the "left" are going nuts over neopronouns correctness and wokeness.
@@Cause56 I disagree, it's over generalizing. It depends on what topic is being debated.
A moderate mindset only makes sense if the two sides of politics are in sync in the first place, in the case of the U.S. the right has had the power for as long as we can recall, as such trying to be "the man in the middle" only ends up being tossed the same direction as the powerful right. Think of it like a seesaw, if you have too much weight on one end, sitting in the middle will just slide you down to that same end.
Damn that seesaw methaphor was dope
The only time I want a centrist… is in the kitchen/fashion/design/music. Where wild new trends, classic old or combined into something “in the middle” are available as choices for everyone.
harmless things…
I honestly see centrists as being eternally afraid of angering the right wing. Too scared to be brave and do what they know is correct. instead they placate themselves and say things like "our only chance to win" "lesser of 2 evils" "even those those ideals poll at 85% it's too radical to win on"
Excellent metaphor!
Best metaphor for this problem ever…
And you’re absolutely right, if we weren’t so polarized, middle ground would be fine…but that’s not where we’re at.
"The Radical Left is when I don't like it"
-My Conservative Stepdad
?
@@ni3070 I was making fun of how Conservatives describe the "Radical Left" and "Socialism" as Boogeymen with no real meaning other than "Bad thing I don't like".
We can't have Healthcare as a right, nor a robust welfare state, or fair taxation because "ThAt'S SoCiAlIsM". we can't even get half-baked Compromises past because anything pushed by a Democrat is still somehow too "Radical Left" to The Right.
@@BlitzkriegOmega ohkk
@@BlitzkriegOmega The right has realized that they can just demand that everything happens exactly the way they want it with no attempt at reaching an agreement with the rest of society and their base will still loudly cheer them on.
@@BlitzkriegOmega we talk often about how the rich dont get taxed enough but the real problem is the middle class and even the poor are the ones who deal the brunt of our tax brackets
Malcolm X has many great quotes. My favorite is _by any means necessary_
I went from far-right to just regular right to centrism (cause I hate bias and the government told me that “extremes” are bad) then I became left, and now a socialist.
That Malcom X quote really surprised me.
The boogeyman of my high school text book made a solid point.
He's considered a Boogeyman due to his more radical views. In fact, most of the civil rights movement included socialist leaders. MLK in fact is far more socialist then most believe. Second thought made an entire video on the white washing of the civil rights movement.
He was troubled, but his cause was just
I recently got my mother to read "The Autobiography of Malcolm X" and she said it totally changed her view on the man.
Centrism utterly fails when the possible range of debate is pre-emptively narrowed by corporate interests. What is the possible moderate position between Obamacare and fully private health insurance?
@@Lobos222 How the fuck do you nationalize a sector and keep its capitalistic principles? Capitalistic principle would be for a private owner to take labor value from those working and count it as profit to take for themselves.
@@Lobos222 markets is not part of capitalism and feudal nations ALSO had markets
@@Lobos222 I agree with you that this channel is too far to the left. Socialism won't work, it needs to be some sort of mix. It is part of human nature for us to derive meaning from the work we do to sustain ourselves. If everyone just gets paid, whether they work or not, they will suffer from the apathy of not supporting themselves. They may have the food, shelter and healthcare to survive, but it will be hollow. That being said, the channel does raise some very salient points that cannot be ignored. You point out that Bernie is part of that "compromise", but the ultimate decision is not going to be impacted in any meaningful way by Bernie's pull when nearly every other senator is deciding based on corporate interests. Technically he is part of the compromise, but realistically he is a fringe data point that can be ignored in the final analysis.
As for the ultimate solution, I think it is part of the government's role to ensure people can live healthy, meaningful lives, regardless of their circumstances of birth. Having the government act as the sole health insurance provider for the nation seems like a decent compromise. Hospitals and doctors will still be private businesses, a la capitalism. All the government is doing is acting like a giant nationwide insurance company, taking in money and paying it out, which is one of the only things the government is good at. They always get their taxes and they always pay their bills.
@@dylanlinzer6734 nationalized industries still have profit motive my dude, wtf are you talking about.
@@sashan4722 Seems you dont understand. No nationalized does not. Wtf you talking about? You think nationalized health care the government gonna be trying to get some sweet profits or would it all go back into the system cuz Governments are about spending money not taking profits to hold for some random nonsense.
When your political system has been reduced to scary authoritarians and friendly authoritarians, it's time to ask why everyone keeps voting for authoritarians.
In Brazil's parliament we have something called "centrão", which translates to something like "the big center", it's composed by the biggest chunk of the parliament, and it consists of politicians who allegedly have "no ideology" and shift between left and right. In reality they work in favor of capitalists. Many of them are lobbyists working in favor of big companies. They only vote propositions that aim to increase the parliamentarian's salary and such, and for the rulling government to get anything approved by them they have to negotiate and increase their paycheck. The only time the left was able to make any significant changes to the welfare state in Brazil was during the corruption scandals when the left party had to pay these so called "center" through a slush fund so they would approve the propositions. So yeah, when you're in the capitalist system where cash rules everything and the majority of the representatives vote accordingly to whoever pays more, how can you expect they would ever vote anything to improve our life.
I asked a Biden supporter why Biden didn't give a public option despite Biden promising that he will. He just responded with "lol"
Jesus...
Yikes
Get Psaki Bombed, kid
Orange man bad.
Beyond that, they don't care.
He might still.
To be perfectly honest. I think the idea of separating politics as a whole into strictly binary states is kind of weird... there are millions of people with millions of different problems requiring millions of different solutions. And I know that generally global politics are kind of divided in left and right, but the extreme separation of left and right into only two parties and only two candidates, with very strongly divided voters I would say is pretty uniquely american. To think that if I believe that a problem has some solution and that solution is more of a "left" solution, therefore I must be allied to all left solutions is weird. My home country might not be perfect by any stretch or even better, but there are several parties, way more than two, and each party focuses on different kinds of problems, some are more about fighting poverty and create jobs, others more about crime and justice, others more about ecology and green energy. And so the senate has representatives from all different places, discussing all kinds of problems. If some politician is extremely against restricting guns or defunding the police, they are not necessarily against reducing carbon emissions or having better healthcare. People are on the "left" or on the "right" on individual problems. So in a sense no one is a centrist, but yet to americans maybe all of them are centrists.
It was a culture shock for me that americans are so divided, like two camps that share some general opinions that a lot of time have very little to do with each other. But I mean it is pretty obvious why the culture grew to be that way, there is only two options on the ballot, you only have to think in terms of left and right, you want something on the right to be done? you better agree and fight for everything else that is included in the package. Right-wing politicians don't even want to address or criticize the most agregious parts of their policies and their people... because they are all united in the right, they are all a team against the other team. Criticizing any part of their movement would only affect the other parts. Which is nonsense, everyone is in a deadlock, unable to move a finger in any direction because everyone is united into two very broad groups.
Like it or not everything is "Yes" or "No" take
You can at very maximum create a new mean to achive somethint but the goals are alwqys binaries
@@atanaZion yes, that wasn't my point. My point is that you don't necessarily have to create a group that is all yes and a second group that is all no. People can and should be able to answer yes or no for individual problems, instead of forming weird alliances, defending a certain topic even if it is horrible and they don't care about it just because they are in the No group. So all the midly yes people go further into the yes group, because that is how they can achieve what they really care about and viceversa.
It is weird... health care, gun laws, immigration, things that are not connected in any obvious way and yet people with very clearly binary politics act like it, if you think left in one of those issues then you better think left in all of them. Or right. It is an all or nothing mentality, which often just leads to a stalemate in which nothing happens, because it is all or nothing. You either get a left president or a right president. And the left half will support all the left decisions and the right half will support all the right decisions.
I get that solutions to problema have to be left or right, but peoples and whole systems don't necessarily have to be all left or all right, there is a lot more nuance than that, and yet the ballot only asks left or right.
@@diegog1853 "Ppl that aren't connected in any single way"
It literally is
Left tipically have a pro-immigration and globalization mindset as part of their progressive and "down with prejudice" stuff, aswell as being pro-grun
They are literally traits that Wikipedia (the most popular opinion on any matter) lists as part of one side of another
@@diegog1853 You can't have a sideless politic or government
You can have a government which will either go towards one extreme or another time to time
@@atanaZion Never said that people wouldn't pick sides, it is just that they would pick sides on specific problems instead of just clustering all problems together clumsily.
And those goverments already exist you know... Goverments that don't have only two parties, left and right
An absolutely fantastic video that I look forward to sharing.
When 84% of Americans support a policy, but 90% of the people who purchase the attention of politicians oppose it, the politicians get a distinctly skewed view of the center.
I don't think the issue here are the centrists. The thing is that if you have only 2 parties, both of which are on the right you will always end up with a government that is on the right. The issue with America and it's politics is that it is controlled by powerful institutions and lobbies who ultimate dictate the course of action, so whether the right or left is ruling matters little
Wish more people understood this
The problem comes when centrists view Democrats as "the Left" and place themselves in the middle of a center-right and far-right party.
How are liberal parties on anything but the left? His analysis of how changing systems affect centrism is completely backwards. Centrism is fundamentally a reflection of victory, and it is solidly left wing in most societies. To be in the center means to accept that which the left has cemented. The positions of the centrist are that of leftists in years past, and as such it is nothing more than leftism driving the speed limit. The right is a stationary position which politics have moved away from, whereas the left is an ever changing position which can only be sustained by constant motion.
That's what a centrist would say...
Wow, you people are insane.
Coming in to this video as a moderate, I have to say that this made me confront my political beliefs. Nothing that was said was a new idea, but I think I finally came to admit that there can be no bipartisanship with a party that is completely and utterly opposed to progress and human decency. There haven’t been good ideas on "both sides" in a long time and the quicker that centrists/moderates can admit that truth, and contribute a pragmatic approach to ideas and policies that a majority of people support, the quicker we’ll be able to move things in a better direction.
You may be right, but I also don't want to jump into whatever fresh new idea at the time without some sort of transition process. Often times the Right serves as a way for us to think our new ideas through before widespread implementation. Second Thought said today's progressives will become tomorrow's moderates. Although I think society tomorrow will progress further than it has today, I think it's good to have some degree of friction on the way. At the end of the day, I think all need each other; moderates, far left, far right, socialists, capitalists etc.
Be careful though. All Progress is Change but not all Change is Progress you know. I see myself as moderate right, I mostly want to stick to what has been tried and true but if the idea looks good enough I wouldn't be opposed to it.
@@Landofjello @your first statement " I don't want to jump into whatever fresh new idea at the time with some transition process." Think back to the point where black ppl weren't allowed to own property and when that act was being passed. It was a fresh progressive idea, now go to an older black person and picture yourself telling them that. How does that sound?
@@pokeminerboi6051 Nothing currently debated on the right has been true whatsoever.
I agree, the left is a party that is completely and utterly opposed to progress and human decency.
The first clip in the video (the MLK clip) was an anti democrat clip. He criticised moderates that voted for democrats who started the KKK.
Something about the topic of immigration in the US that's always bothered me is that those against it that claim migrants aren't ACTUALLY seeking asylum are the same people that treat Mexico like the sole birthplace of drugs and rapists. Which is it, then? Mexico is an awful place full of drug-related and sexual violence that people might reasonably seek asylumn from, or it's not actually "that bad" and no one has any reason to seek asylum from the country???
Yeah, but what if all these migrants will bring the drug carthels with themselves?
Oh yeah, carthels already did like decades ago. No need to isolate anymore.
The worst part of centrism is when self-described “centrists” act all holier-than-thou while adding nothing to the conversation.
They're so caught up in liberalism that they think that someone being biased when talking about politics is an inherently bad thing.
How do you suppose that we convince centrists to come more leftwards then? Do you think insults and passive aggressive comments will work?
@@JohnDoe-rg4tl by the same token your not convincing anyone to come to the right by insulting them either, you're actively working against you're own parties goals by being so obnoxious nobody wants to be on your side
@@shaunobrien8975 I would argue it doesnt work to bash an individual but to bash an idea and make the idea seems stupid is effective. Make it so people dont want to claim as such because it would be embarrassing to do so. They did it with socialist ideas for quit sometime now with red scare with quit some effectiveness
See John Doe here is great for the leftist cause. He is a prime example of how conservative ideology makes you just a suucker. This man complains about leftist and handouts while all the richest people in the US continue to get many hand outs. Seems to me he thinks like MANY conservatives think. They dont have an issue with handouts. They have issues with consumer side economics. Even after decades showing supply side economics does not work they keep pushing it. They still want handouts just not for you.
I‘d say moderates are mostly an American thing. Countries with proper democracies have parties for everyone, dealing with various issues
most countries have centrist parties. Scandinavian countries arre cventrist models.n Centrism is not bad, the thing is that the usa is very capitalist cou ntry and these people (the guy from the video) are radical left wing and want someting bad change
Well, it's logical. If there are two sides, one just wanting to exist, and the other wanting to exterminate them, they arent equal by definition, and saying they are just helps the hateful one
Of course this assumes that your initial description of the two sides is factually accurate, which it isn't. I could just as easily make an oversimplified and inaccurate description of the two sides as "one side wants to kill black people, the other side wants to kill white people, the middle wants to kill nobody".
I doubt I'll be able to change your mind about the problems the Democratic party has. But if you actually want to understand why moderates/independents exist, and not just pat yourself on the back in an echo chamber over your own "superiority", you need to understand that moderates are moderates because they look at Democrats and see legitimately harmful and dangerous things. No (or at least, no moderate I've ever talked to) becomes moderate out of some vague "desire for compromise" or a simplistic rationale that the middle ground is magically best, they become moderate because there are specific policies from each party that they have legitimate and strong opposition to. I for one will never call myself a Democrat so long as the Democratic party continues to trample all over the right to keep and bear arms, and by extension the right to self-defense against criminals, tyrants, foreign invaders, and any other threat. I hold very strongly the belief that those rights are fundamental and pre-existing human rights that belong to all people, and thus I will never align myself fully with a group that desires to destroy them.
I don't know which part is better. When you made up a quote that no centrist has ever said, or when you acted like stopping illegal immigration was stopping legal immigration
Get rid of the party system so you vote on an individual person rather then just voting in someone just because they are in a certain party
I refuse to vote for either two main parties, and I encourage everyone else to. I’d rather “waste a vote” than vote for either ass clown in the primaries. Or the mid terms. Or locally. If you pick either party to run with, you’re part of the problem.
This idea seems great until you realise the importance of money in national politics. Rich people or candidates sponsored by big business would have a solid headstart and I think you realise where it's heading... If you say that it is what's already happening - fine, but a lack of parties would only make it worse and is it really worth it?
EDIT I realise that it's different in the US where you de facto have two parties and here in Poland where seven different sides with real chances of winning seats in the parliament, and even more different in all the other democracies around the world, but in any case, a total lack of parties is not the way
EXACTLY THANK YOU IVE THOUGHT THIS FOR SO LONG
@@streetpilot4098 the issue with that is you end up being part of the reason the worse President gets selected almost every year.
Voting for the lesser if evil is always the best option just to slow down damage down to give America more time to actually remove the 2 party system
@@silverfang4583 That's not how that works. That's literally the opposite of removing the two party system. You don't get rid of the two party system by voting for either of the two parties in the two party system. The best way to get rid of the two party system is to stop enabling it. Stop voting for it. Voting for "the lesser of two evils" is still voting for evil, and I refuse to vote for evil. They know they're going to get your vote anyway, so they don't even try. The evidence is only getting more apparent of that. My vote doesn't go to the worse option. It doesn't help them, it does quite the opposite really. It helps the independents and third parties gain traction, and in my state, I helped a third party just gain official party status. And this is two years after the two party system in over 20 states made it harder for independents and third parties to gain ballot access, while making funding their own parties even easier. And since the third parties and independents don't do as well (for now anyway), my vote makes a hell of a lot more of a difference for them than it does for the other two parties. Your argument constantly gets repeated and defended, and look where it's gotten us and who it's given us for our two "options".
If the theory you suggested actually worked, we wouldn't be in this mess. We would've been out of it a very long time ago.
It's not really a secret that none of the both big parties in america can be called "left" which is why the centre between the both is not really in the middle but just between slightly right wing and far right. American politics are not a good measure to judge the idea of centrism as a whole just because of that fact.
I hate both parties, Democrats more since the bullshit we live through. We shouldn't have any parties and just vote based on who is best qualified to better the American people's interest.
I wanted to make a comment on this, but then I read the comments and saw all of the centrists who got butthurt and realized that I don't particularly feel like arguing with someone who didn't actually watch the video.
I really enjoy your content and delivery, thanks for the brilliant videos.
The problem I've always had was that to identify with one party is to accept not just some of their beliefs, but all of them. I don't know much about politics but I do know that the moment I label myself as left or right, people will assume that every common belief of whichever I chose is what I believe, which is untrue. I don't know if my values are more left than right or vice versa, but I don't like labels, which is entirely what left and right are, labels.
The worst part is the ideas of what the left or right is. They are both very general terms, and in the US, are often used incorrectly. Like Democrats aren’t leftists. There are leftists in the Democratic Party, but they don’t have numbers or influence to drive policy…
This is literally everything wrong with politics described perfectly in one paragraph.
Talking about MurricaMan's post
The issue is that, IN THEORY, our 2 party system is SUPPOSED to address the need of coalitions. In parliamentary systems, you generally have few conservative parties, and many liberal parties. Generally, coalitions have to formed to establish a government. The US system is supposed to address the coalition step, although more like skip it, really. A bunch of moderates have to coalition with the fewer leftists for dems to win the government. The problem is that in practice this doesn't work, at all. Because you have selection happening at multiple levels, both individual (we all get to vote for 1 representative, 1 candidate for presidency, etc.) and group (party level), and because individuals have no power unless their party has a significant advantage, so really the selection is most strong at the party level. When that happens we lose variation among the individuals in the party and the emergent culture is just the bare minimum the the largest factions in the party can coerce the rest to follow.
I think the main problem is that both parties are clearly right on the politicalspectrum and only differ in some points. Democrats are center right neo liberal capitalists and Republicans are far right corporate ethno nationalists or something like that. But I could easily see how you could learn to love Social Democracy. Image a world where big Companies and Industry are tightly regulated so they can neither screw over their employees and their customers nor pollute your water. Imagine Billionaires being heavily taxed to fund top quality education for your kids aswell as public parks, pools social programs, public housing, universal heathcare and nationwide coverage of cheap high quality and fast public transport. Imagine lifting so much poor out of poverty through education that the streets are completely safe.
Now you might think what is that crazy commie utopia talk...
Its almost every major European country. And I bet despite what you've propably been told by corporate shills trying to hold you down you'd love it here.
Greetings from Vienna.
Exactly this i don't get it how people don't understand this
A nice way of saying "if you are not with us then you are against us".
Exactly. Wingers are such narrow-minded people who only want to appease their own ideologies.
AGREED. The way the left should go forward is by trying to swing in the moderates/centrists, not declare them a right wing group somewhere between the KKK and an average person.
Being a centrist or moderate is nothing but aid for the right
@@TheCrazedGuitarist good
@@TheCrazedGuitarist and vice versa for the left
This video gave me motivation, I really thought you guys were winning for a second there
Thankyou
This has needed to be said for decade.
One of David Harvey's recent podcast episodes was also about monopolistic competition, and that really ties into this discussion where you would think two parties with a functional monopoly would spread out to cover the maximum ideological area, but in reality they end up so close together that there is minimal discernable difference between the two.
This video kind of outlines this idea, but in terms of business competition.
The funny part is that the end of the video has a disclaimer that in the real world there are more than two competitors and people come from more than just two sides, but in our current political landscape, that isn't the case.
th-cam.com/video/jILgxeNBK_8/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=TED-Ed
I didn't know Harvey had a podcast, what's it called?
@@Hyperventilacion I believe it's called "Anti-Capitalist Chronicles" on Democracy at Work, they have a TH-cam channel. The Monopolistic Competition episode was aired about 1 month ago I think.
@@Hyperventilacion th-cam.com/video/VWfQVhOJTHE/w-d-xo.html
Virtually every civil rights (whether it's the "abolition" of slavery or gay marriage) in the US were not handed down by the government, rights were fought for by the people, and most cost many lives. If you're overall content with the status quo and are against progressive movements more often than not, you're enabling the right by default. There's no such thing as "centrism" in practice, they're just less radical conservatives.
Those same moderates/conservatives look back at those historical figures and fights of the people as good things too. When it happens today though and ppl are protesting it's "omg but what about the property damage".
Any right you think you have is granted by those who hold more power than you do, and they granted because they’ve found a way to maintain or even further their control in the new paradigm you ask for.
"status quo ... Right wing" Maybe 30 years ago.
Then why do you support government overreach today?
@@BLTspace I mean the amount of people, especially centrists or even conservatives who invoke MLK is astounding.
As a black American, i feel that being Independent is in my best interest. I can only speak for myself. Funny that the great Malcolm X was brought up. I actually love his quote in regards to comparing each respective major party as, paraphrasing, wolves who bare their fangs and conniving foxes.🤷🏽♀️
I can understand the analogy about the fox being that it’s majestic in its sighting but at its worse is a sneaky predator that can create a lot of destruction in a short amount of time.
Yeah and here JT is saying that if you're not left then you're helping the right and part of the problem. He's nothing but a far left propagandist
LOL even when you're centrist you still get attacked. That's how screwed up we are politically
Being a moderate doesn’t mean that you are in the middle of every issue, just that you have views that fall on both sides of the aisle
oh i didnt know a nazi who wants socialism is a moderate thats new
so you want free healthcare but only for white people?
Case in point; I have a pretty great relationship with authorities but my economic beliefs fairly left leaning but when I say pretty great it doesn’t mean blind locality and left leaning does mean exactly that „lean“ not fall into the camp entirely.
Example for that being that while my core beliefs may be more ideological, my pragmatism prevents me from advocating for them because I know that they are momentarily ( aka in the moment of my lifetime on this planet ) implausible if not impossible.
The example he uses in his thumbnail is a perfect example, sometimes a bad position is so engraved in the public conversation that you have to take small steps unless you plan on forcing people to like the changed you want to implement.
Even if a big step is far more desirable in almost every way, strategically it may not be the best idea. Many ideological folks for instance always push for the most radical solution. Radical solutions CAN work but in a democracy, they need to get approved.
I prefer realpolitik over dreaming of a paradise that neither me nor my children nor my childrens children will experience.
That too is a form of centrism. However, this doesn’t mean that centrism is always the answer, after all, there is a time and a place. I think in working, healthy democracies, ( say, to pick a fairly uncontroversial example, Switzerland ) being a moderate gives stability in all the right ways and allows for a steady and unproblematic progress but in a dysfunctional democracy, sometimes you have to pick a time and essentially fight, either politically or even with actual force ( although the last part luckily hasn’t applied in the western world in decades )
@@Arcaryon counterpoint: if you do not advocate for what you actually believe in, but rather for what you consider achievable - any compromise you make will push the end result further from what you actually believe is the right thing to do
you are essentially making concessions before being asked for them and without getting a concession in return
you always should at least start advocating from the position you want - even if you know, that you likely will have to make some concessions on that position due to whatever situation you are dealing with...
thats also what an ideal is - not something you achieve in one go or ever... it is something to strive toward
though you are right - in politics that arent incredibly onesided, the moderate/centrist position is not automatically right wing... in the US the situation is different though and politics have regressed so much that small incremental progress is still not going anywhere... its essentially trying to fix a dam break flooding the area below by bucket brigading the water back up
Yes exactly, I feel like alot of people misunderstand this. Also there are compromises that can be reached.
I have been moved extreme left over my years without changing a belief. I find it funny that it was assumed that I would go right as I got older. Could we fix the problems we've had since before I was born?
I moved left as I got older mainly because people kept saying I'd go right when I got older, and I thought it was weird that ideology should be determined on age and not on facts, so I began to read books to try and understand things more concretely, and reading books and actually understanding things in political economy and history and philosophy made me not only more left wing but more confident in my positions.
so you became more wrong as you got older
The phrase "you'll become more conservative as you get older" only held some truth in the past as it assumed life would get easier and you would generally be more prosperous in the future and our governenace and politics wouldn't need radical left energy. It was true for boomers and the silent generation and those who grew up in prosperous times and didn't start out life in debt. It's not true anymore.
Ik think people not becoming more right wing as a standard also has to do with hoe we receive information in the 21st century. This could be die to media sources being more right wing in the 20th century, or more legt wing in the 21st century. Ik think it had to do with having more access to information, and that cooperation over individualism is a left wing viewpoint.
I've gotten more right, mostly because I don't subscribe to the usage of coercion as a means to establish truth even if the outcome is true. Method is more important not because of some deontological rule, but because as I understand the little bit I know from the scientific process, the human mind needs lots of filtering to reach anything even remotely close to what can be considered some conception of truth. When I was younger, the book burners were on the right, Now they're on the left.
Edit: There's a slight difference a change of conceptions of truth, vs a change in methods. If either side places the basic value of double checking human error below the ideal of some moral superiority, they're probably subhuman.
So, basically, you assume that every "right" is radical, and every "leftist" stands for pure human rights and nothing radical at all. And that is sooo untrue statement.
Yep, a glance at the thumbnail and you see it who likes to demonize the other side and also obviously, who’s against those who say “don’t demonize each other, unite and work together”.
@@someul that's why rights are the most demonized in the media and liberals enjoy the support from all places.
@@believer1571
"my side is the victim"
@@believer1571You DO know liberals are right wing right?
I’ve always tried to view each side without bias but it’s REALLY fucking hard to side with the right
I thought me and my friends were somewhat conservative, until I started looking at the individual topics and turns out just about everybody I know leans a decent amount to the left. I thought we were more conservative only because people told us we were conservative and that lines up completely with what you stated in this video. In fact its to the extent where I think a lot of people think they're conservative because its been told to them and in some areas seen as a part of the culture despite how detrimental that can be. Its to the point where I only occasionally see a talking point from the right that isn't already debunked.
so the left hates Jewish people just so you know
Then you haven’t been paying attention to even your own views
Until I was old enough to start exploring ideas and their meanings, I was the exact same. Turns out I’m pretty much in the center (lean left 60% and right 40%), but still the amount of brainwashing I received to think I was conservative was ridiculous. It took me about 6 months out of the “only get news and ideas from people your parents support” to realize I’d been fooled.
In my opinion, I'm fairly conservative. However, the right is a general mix of complete idiots, selfish rich assholes, and lunatics, to the point where if you're not like that, you're on the left. It's fucking crazy how utterly incomprehensible the GOP is.
As an Australian I always thought I was quite conservative too but realised i disagreed with a lot of right wing ideas. The media in Australia is also largely owned by Murdoch and Newscorp so it was hard to find other perspectives on information
"Centrists and moderates are people and politicians who..."
Love how you separated politicians from the rest of us decent people
There are two types of people: people, and politicians.
@@thecastaways2 and billionaires
Most politicians are older and significantly wealthier than the rest of the population. It makes sense to differentiate between them and the rest. The world is a much different place for a millionaire than for a typical wage slave.
"In any compromise between good and evil, it is only evil that stands to profit. In any compromise between food and poison, the only outcome is death."
- Ayn Rand
Yeah but in politics you rarely can call something good or evil. You’d be biased to say so, and an unhealthy bias not even a reasonable one.
...But Ayn Rand is super right IIRC...
What should have told you MLK was not a “moderate” was the government was so willing to protect him on his rallies especially his later ones. Then when they didn’t need him anymore he disappeared.
Exactly. Once he started talking about class and income inequality he was no longer "one of the good ones."
If compromise is so great, why does the word have a negative connotation in EVERY OTHER CONTEXT?
"Security has been compromised."
"You compromised your values; my trust in you is compromised."
Tell me you don't understand how words work without actually telling me you don't understand
"Uh... ACKSHUALLY..."
Jesus fucking Christ. Does no one understand what a rhetorical question is anymore?
@@nrrork We not know which of at least two completely opposite view are your holding in your mind, this in certain way explain the current american political discord.
@@nrrork Rhetorical questions should still be rhetorically sound. That's what rhetoric is for.
This might be the worst take I have seen yet.
Manchin and Sinema are wonderful examples they heavily agree with the conservatives on economic issues and strongly benefit businesses.
Anything that helps people or pushes left economic issues into a bills has to be stonewalled by downgrading or cutting the funding for it.
I'm convinced both these clowns have a big bonus / payday on the horizon for tanking democrat legislation and most likely the midterms as well.
@@phiksit They both are and have been getting large corporate donations, Manchin sold out long ago.
Algorithmic appreciation of your mastery over sarcasm. ❤️
I can agree to most of your statements. As someone who has been labeled as, and identified (At one point, I'm more left leaning I think now) you've given me a lot to consider.
However, I think its important distinction to make that maybe politicians won't be convinced by discourse. But average people like your audience is another story. I don't feel like that distinction was made and I also feel like its an important one. Conversation and talking can, has, and will continue to change peoples perspectives. At least for a few. And that's always a good start.
It seems to me that the first thing we need to overcome is the appalling lack of understanding of power among Americans. We are ignorant of so many things it borders on impossible to break through, yet we absolutely have to do it and I think your videos do a good job of, at least getting people to question their own preconceptions.
We are so easily distracted with issues such as race, age, sex, and money, that we rarely if ever look at the motivations behind, what are so obviously counter-productive actions after the fact.
A large majority of Democratic Party faithful have chosen selective amnesia regarding Biden's entire history. About the same majority of republican faithful have chosen that same condition regarding Trump's.
The Democrats scream about bipartisanship and compromise while completely ignoring the long established fact that they get absolutely no support form the republicans. The republicans themselves have openly stated that they will never, under any circumstances support any part of a Democratic agenda.
Meanwhile, rank and file members of the Republican party scream about making America great again, family values, and rule of law, while ignoring the fact that their leader has for well over forty years broken numerous laws, been divorced multiple times, has been shown in court to be a serial liar and fraud who made what money he has by stealing it from those who did business with him.
And all of those people pushing the "party matters" meme are either ignorant, or hope that we are, of the fact that the only currency in government is power.
Idk bro sounds like a centrist take there 🥱🥱
@@SpliefDaGrief That is not a centrist take. I am on the Left and have for years stated that Centrist Dems need to stop this bullshit bipartisanship thing. This is not the 1980s with Tip O'Neal. The GOP continues to operate in bad faith. Stop trying to appease them and then when you water the bill down, they just sit back and not vote on it anyway, claiming they had nothing to do with it.
@Green Mamba Games The real problem is inaction by the people such as yourself. Tell me when you are getting out your guns and we are all going to meet?
@@SpliefDaGrief I'm to the left of Bernie and the left that's left of me is revolutionary, so I don't see how you can try to label me as centrist.
My reply isn't about labels, it's about how little we understand how our governments work, and what is the motivation for those systems.
Just watch the video. There is no left/right, Dem/Repub divide. There is one tiny minority that controls all government and the only divide that maters in government is top/bottom.
I hate that word "power" but that's from someone who lacks it, maybe I'll change my mind if I gained some, but then again I see that it's necessary, we don't want to live with a world with no one enforcing laws... sigh, yeah the laws are only for the weak, but thought change if where all under one powerful incorruptible fair entity. Damn, I wish that singularity starts soon.
The problem is that people see it as a binary or a sliding scale, a two party system forces you to choose the lesser of two evils. While it’s technically better that thing stay the same, rather than being actively regressive, it’s ultimately not getting us anywhere.
A centrist/moderate is a person who holds a collection of right leaning and left leaning view points.
the only right wing idea I hold is pro gun.
5:57 We already have a term for an economy that is a mixture of socialism, and capitalism. It's just called a "mixed economy".
So according to some of these centrists. Any economy that is an admixture socialism, and capitalism is now considered to be centrist to them.
But here's a fun fact. You don't necessarily have to be a centrist in order to support a mixed economy.
The issue is is that capitalism and socialism have a major difference, which is who owns the means of production. You can only have one or the other. Capitalism, since it’s in it’s best interests, will always try to overthrow a system that doesn’t give the majority of the power to the wealthy. There is social democracy, but this system is still capitalist, and relies on exploitation to be able to deliver its programs.
@@carsonnelson7783 Okay. But what does this have anything to do with my point?
@@americanliberal09 I was just pointing out the systems can’t coexist or be mixed. I’m not exactly sure what your point is, seems unclear to me. I’m guessing you’re saying that centrists are able to be progressive despite still supporting capitalism, which I explained why you can’t be meaningfully progressive. Did I misunderstand your point?
@@carsonnelson7783 *I’m guessing you’re saying that centrists are able to be progressive despite still supporting capitalism*
Nope. That wasn't even my point at all. I was just trying to debunk this notion that having an economy that is a mixture of socialism, and capitalism is a reserved thing for centrists. When in reality, it really isn't.
@@americanliberal09 That makes a bit more sense. Still, I don’t see how a mixture of socialism and capitalism is the same as a mixed economy. If you support what is a mixed economy, you support capitalism and the government which upholds it. I guess you can be on the political spectrum outside of the center and support the status quo, although that’s definitely not the point Second Thought is trying to make here.
I remember my early adult years when someone called me a centrist because I was apposed to the 2 party system we are in. But when I went to learn about what that meant. I thought something was off about it and I have just ended up feeling like an outsider, politically speaking. No one ever wants to actually hear an opposing view and think on it. They will just use the bad merits of their opposition, in order to dismiss it and nothing gets resolved. It’s like the middle is that ideology that paves hell with good intentions, trying to find compromise in an unbalanced system
Third party is not centrism
If you want more parties that’s not being centrist, that’s being a mentally stable human being. The two parties are basically the exact same except one side is open about not giving a fuck about people, while the other tries to LOOK like they give a fuck except they don’t actually do any real work. I want a different party (that isn’t fucked up) as well
And then you are called a fence sitter.
@@chimedemon MORE PARTIES DOES NOT MEAN MORE FUCKING FREEDOM
As someone who finds themselves in the center, I see I had no clue what I was talking about. It was all idealist propositions. Well crap. Now I see I need to dive into politics more. I guess I'm more left with the basic definition you've laid out. I prefer change. For in life, change seems to be the most constant constant. Thank you.
Good luck on your political journey ❤️
I went with Radical Centrism instead. xD
Like whatever works, works, who cares who agrees with me.
Most of the people are left in heart, but do not know about it. Thanks to propaganda.
You wouldn't prefer change if you got what you wanted though
@@_VISION. well the problem is I don't know what I want because of my lack of understanding. I've spent the past month trying to learn. Picked up books. Some I've read some I haven't. In time I'll have my own set of ideals.
If the us political parties were in other countries they would be considered
Right and far right respectively
"Justice delayed is justice denied."
Words used by every dictator to rush their party into horrendous actions so that they don't stop to think about what they're doing first.
But how do you know if what you are doing is justice.
@@spinosaurusstriker If it pushes for the equality of everyone, it is justice. If it pushes for the benefit of one group over another, it is not justice.
@@logancopper3385 Dictators can literally say anything to take or hold onto power. Your personal feelings on how a quote can be used, (even when that quote in question has never been used like that in any recorded speech ever.) doesn't contradict that delaying the process of the justice system is the equivalent of denying its power even works.
@@mrct592 No no, its not that dictators *can* use that quote, its that the quote is pro-dictatorship in nature. The idea of "I think justice means this and therefore any means should be used to reach it, and moderate people who try to take a non-extreme approach are only delaying justice!" is the most Adolf-Bonaparte shit ever dude lol