What a shame class 89 was dropped due to BR deciding that a 140 MPH line speed loco was required for the ECML and ironic too that class 91 only runs at 125 MPH max today as far as I know although there are or were stretches of the ECML that had flashing green signals for 140 MPH running. With more development work the reliability problems presumably could have been overcome and then class 89 would have been a superb all rounder. Thanks for posting this excellent historic video.
@@richardstout6364 Are you sure about that? I ask because the Class 89 had DC traction motors while the Euroshuttle Class 9 & the Class 92 have asynchronous three-phase induction motors.
@@Martindyna yes, I didn’t mean equipment directly went to each but the technology was developed into these. This was also the primary reason GNER was able to bring her back as spares became more easily obtainable for certain other internal equipment.
Fantastic video of a unique part of British railway history! :D I was just wondering, would it be possible for me to use some of your footage as part of an upcoming documentary I'm creating about the history of the Class 89 and the Class 91?
Yes that's absolutelty fine,use anything you want.I really enjoy watching your documentries by the way,you go in depth on subjects that others mostly just skim over if even mention at all.
Not yet in use but soon! The footage is excellent. Back when the railway was run by railwaymen and not politicians and management graduates, who I wouldnt trust to tie up my shoelaces let alone run the railway!
Great compilation! Wish i had a video camera then, it arrived at Hornsey shed in December 1987 & i was lucky enough to photograph its many test runs between there and Potters Bar in 1988 ( a few pics on Flikr)
Assumed that early running was done with hauled Mk3s, but it's clear from this it was using a HST set with the powercars removed and a generator fitted BG at one end to provide the three phase train supply. I presume the TGS at the other end has been modified with buffers and a drop head buckeye to allow a screw coupling fitted loco to couple if required (the same as done with the TGS on the surrogate DVT sets).
Excellent shots, especially considering how little record there is of the Badger on TH-cam. Interesting to see the various scratch rakes of vehicles assembled for it to haul in service, including both all-first class and all-standard class formations(must have confused the hell out of the punters!) Many thanks.
Unique one off locomotive, should be in working preservation, on railtours from time to time, and part of the national collection amongst others. Such a pity more weren't produced. 125mph performance, with 6,000hp on tap, so it could move very swiftly when required to do so.
Wow the badger couldn't half sprint off the line! Looks like would would show a 91 and a HST a clean pair of heels!!! Amazing! Incidentally I much perfer the original version of intercity livery it carried. This swallow version doesn't sit on the shape quite so well.
forgive me if im being thick, but when this was filmed, i assume the ECML staple stock was HSTs at this point, so what happened when 89 got in to KX? im assuming again that the stock was haulled out again by something else... but what?
Al H BR introduced the Driving Van Trailer (DVT) around this time, but those for the ECML were not available for the first few years of the electric services. BR took the "country" end power cars off several HST sets and fitted traditional draw gear to the "London" end power cars on these sets. These sets were hauled by the 89 or 91s with the HST power car providing, initially, power for the coaches; later the power cars were also used to provide traction power as they had been suffering from cooling problems when just providing hotel power. When traditional coaches were being hauled another loco would have brought the coaches into King's Cross or taken then off to Bounds Green.
@@neildahlgaard-sigsworth3819 Wasn't it more that the HST engines were getting oiled up just providing hotel power? Can't see for the moment why they would overheat on light load.
It was not scrapped but it lost out to class 91 due to it's slower 125 mph design speed. Also it had electrical reliability problems which was a great shame because it's performance was phenomenal (there was / is another video on YT showing Class 89 starting a very long train with apparent consummate ease). Even an engineer from SNCF who was invited for a ride on the footplate was impressed with it's performance up Shap back in the day.
@@TheLegoTrainStation Of course you are correct. Likewise re-gearing the HSTs for 100 MPH design speed (like XPT) would be advantageous for acceleration now that those shorter formations are not allowed to go 125 MPH.
Lovely machine which you've shown to great effect. Acceleration is pretty sweet. Thanks for this. 🍻
What a shame class 89 was dropped due to BR deciding that a 140 MPH line speed loco was required for the ECML and ironic too that class 91 only runs at 125 MPH max today as far as I know although there are or were stretches of the ECML that had flashing green signals for 140 MPH running.
With more development work the reliability problems presumably could have been overcome and then class 89 would have been a superb all rounder.
Thanks for posting this excellent historic video.
Much of the technology of the Class 89 ended up in the brush built class 9 (le shuttle) and Class 92. So not a complete waste.
@@richardstout6364 Are you sure about that? I ask because the Class 89 had DC traction motors while the Euroshuttle Class 9 & the Class 92 have asynchronous three-phase induction motors.
@@Martindyna yes, I didn’t mean equipment directly went to each but the technology was developed into these. This was also the primary reason GNER was able to bring her back as spares became more easily obtainable for certain other internal equipment.
Fantastic video of a unique part of British railway history! :D
I was just wondering, would it be possible for me to use some of your footage as part of an upcoming documentary I'm creating about the history of the Class 89 and the Class 91?
Yes that's absolutelty fine,use anything you want.I really enjoy watching your documentries by the way,you go in depth on subjects that others mostly just skim over if even mention at all.
@@avocet1989 Thank you very kindly, I'll include a special thanks for you in the description :)
Lovely to see Newark as I remember it in the 80s spent thousands of hours there
Yes,the 89 could easily out-accelerate a 91 or an HST.It was a shame only one was built and that it is not in use today.
Not yet in use but soon! The footage is excellent. Back when the railway was run by railwaymen and not politicians and management graduates, who I wouldnt trust to tie up my shoelaces let alone run the railway!
Great compilation of a very interesting prototype
Great compilation! Wish i had a video camera then, it arrived at Hornsey shed in December 1987 & i was lucky enough to photograph its many test runs between there and Potters Bar in 1988 ( a few pics on Flikr)
Assumed that early running was done with hauled Mk3s, but it's clear from this it was using a HST set with the powercars removed and a generator fitted BG at one end to provide the three phase train supply. I presume the TGS at the other end has been modified with buffers and a drop head buckeye to allow a screw coupling fitted loco to couple if required (the same as done with the TGS on the surrogate DVT sets).
Good old 47 powering at 1:30
What happened to the 89
Excellent shots, especially considering how little record there is of the Badger on TH-cam. Interesting to see the various scratch rakes of vehicles assembled for it to haul in service, including both all-first class and all-standard class formations(must have confused the hell out of the punters!) Many thanks.
The class 47 at 2mins sounds like it has an HST Valenta sound from it
Unique one off locomotive, should be in working preservation, on railtours from time to time, and part of the national collection amongst others.
Such a pity more weren't produced.
125mph performance, with 6,000hp on tap, so it could move very swiftly when required to do so.
Wow the badger couldn't half sprint off the line!
Looks like would would show a 91 and a HST a clean pair of heels!!! Amazing!
Incidentally I much perfer the original version of intercity livery it carried. This swallow version doesn't sit on the shape quite so well.
It looks so quick that maybe you would feel the slight shove in your back; amazing indeed!
when were the DVTs fitted to the sets haulled by 89?
I'm pretty sure I saw this at Euston about 2007 time?
Are there other locomotives that have a double slant as did the class 89?
Kagemusha Shimozu the class 90 had one too.
What was the generator coach for?
It was running with a rake of HST Mk3s. They have different electrical supplies to loco hauled coaches so the generator was needed to provide power.
forgive me if im being thick, but when this was filmed, i assume the ECML staple stock was HSTs at this point, so what happened when 89 got in to KX? im assuming again that the stock was haulled out again by something else... but what?
Al H BR introduced the Driving Van Trailer (DVT) around this time, but those for the ECML were not available for the first few years of the electric services. BR took the "country" end power cars off several HST sets and fitted traditional draw gear to the "London" end power cars on these sets. These sets were hauled by the 89 or 91s with the HST power car providing, initially, power for the coaches; later the power cars were also used to provide traction power as they had been suffering from cooling problems when just providing hotel power. When traditional coaches were being hauled another loco would have brought the coaches into King's Cross or taken then off to Bounds Green.
@@neildahlgaard-sigsworth3819 Wasn't it more that the HST engines were getting oiled up just providing hotel power? Can't see for the moment why they would overheat on light load.
The KX 08 would also assist in shunt release.
Is this loco going to run again main line?
why was the class 89 scrapped?
It's not been scrapped! It's now owned by the AC Locomotive Group and undergoing restoration.
It was not scrapped but it lost out to class 91 due to it's slower 125 mph design speed.
Also it had electrical reliability problems which was a great shame because it's performance was phenomenal (there was / is another video on YT showing Class 89 starting a very long train with apparent consummate ease). Even an engineer from SNCF who was invited for a ride on the footplate was impressed with it's performance up Shap back in the day.
@@Martindyna I guess if the 91s were geared for 125 instead of 140, they would accelerate faster too.
@@TheLegoTrainStation Of course you are correct. Likewise re-gearing the HSTs for 100 MPH design speed (like XPT) would be advantageous for acceleration now that those shorter formations are not allowed to go 125 MPH.
It looked disgusting..Nice archive though, thank you
Kind of looks like an ugly class 90.
when were the DVTs fitted to the sets haulled by 89?