@@bethmarriott9292 Could Melkor be at work again? Through Amazon Prime this time? Is Arda about to be remade? WAIT!...don't answer that. I don't wanna know.
@@snowy5628 The movies were faithful to the books except for some small details (eg Eowyn role, the fight between frodo and golum at the end, the omission of Bombadil etc) this ROP deliberately set out to present the opposite to Tolkien's vision.
@AesirUnlimited he changed the story because he Had no Choice! Filling 3 hours from each books! Also yeaa you are just plain wrong he just took out some parts! With ROP they have allot more than 3 hours! They are deliberately CHANGING Characters to fit their weak woke stories. They don't understand that at all and neither do you.
“The men are saying that we will not live out the night. They say that it is hopeless,” Halfeth said. Seeing the young boy’s fear and unease, Aragorn sought to comfort him with a reassuring hand on his shoulder and a gentle smile. “They’re completely right lmao. It’s so over for Rohirribros, (men of) the west has fallen. Millions must unsubscribe from Amazon Prime.”
If you read comments by the writers talking about The Stranger in an interview, what you realise is pretty bad. Having him be Gandalf is... kind of dumb. Having him not be Gandalf is probably even dumber after what they did in S1 to tease that he was - but its worse than that. They haven't decided. They are literally making it up as they go along!
I have made my peace with the fact that they don't have the rights to Tolkien's works, and thus cannot give us a good product. And for my sanity, I will absolutely NOT be watching the show. You already said it, when you talked about the foundation. It sadly won't get any better, and we all know it.
Seriously..R.O.P was one of the biggest disapointments. They took something with Soooooo much potential and torpedoed it in the first season. But alas...did we expect anything diffrent?
The visuals in S1 weren’t a major problem but definitely weren’t perfect, one of the main complaints I had was about the character wardrobes (especially Numenor) feeling cheap and like costumes
@@shiftymcgee9359 That could be said for season 1. Everyone knows the show is trash, written by lazy, incompetent people that thought they could easily exploit a brand for profit by just using the names of things from the books. Just like many creators that cover Star Trek haven't talked about the final season of STD, anyone that is focused on Tolkien can ignore this show. Just because someone bought the legal rights doesn't mean what they produce is in any way an addition to the work created by someone far more talented than they ever will be. After all, evil is not able to create anything new, it can only distort and destroy what has been invented or made by the forces of good.
@shiftymcgee9359 Little Platoon and friends like CF or Mauler aren't considered fans of any big franchise like LOTR, SW or HP but they all know that it's come a point where anything put out by the west is: shite until proven otherwise.
I always enjoyed the more "informal" reviews and speculations. I find these, ironically, to be more accurate than the "completely-100%-objective-totally-grounded-in-empirical-evidence-but-that's-just-my-opinion-do-your-own-research" type videos. Your reviews of the first season are a real highlight for me, not just for Tolkien or tv, but also in regards to media and news in general. Also, I was really confused by, but I ended up agreeing with your philosophy about reviewing the show even if you don't like it. If no one is there to provide feedback, other than just extreme one side or the other, I don't think anything will ever grow. I am highly doubtful this show will grow, but it certainly helped me to consider new perspectives.
To be fairly though, this isn't a review; it's a preview. As such it HAS to be fair and objective, because it's mainly speculation based on a teaser, a few photos and a magazine interview. To rant about what we think MIGHT happen is futile and could prove embarrassing.
I was not a fan of season 1, but I will probably end up watching season 2 with my non-Tolkien-fan friends--if only so they can laugh as I cringe. I'm not looking forward to it. But I will say that I appreciate the stance you're taking. Not surrendering hope, even when the odds are stacked against us. Continuing to seek out the good in the midst of bad. Thank you for your positivity. Thank you for being neither a hater or a shill. It's a tough line to walk, but the way you're walking it is admirable.
I'm with you brother. I am really hoping this one does justice better to the lore. But, my gut tells they just might want to ragebait the fandom even more, just to get people talking. I'm exhausted just thinking about it.
They can't do justice to the lore. They painted themselves into a corner with the incompetent choices made in the first season. Any continuation of that story is just more failure. Hilariously, they jumped right to the creation for the three elven rings, before the elves were taught the craft by Annatar, before the lesser rings were crafted, before the seven rings for the dwarves, before the nine rings for men. The entire reason why Sauron created the One Ring has been entirely cast aside. That is just one of the many ways the show has drastically deviated from the lore. The nonsense about mithril is another massive problem that underlines how much they don't understand Tolkien's elves and specifically the Naldor in Middle Earth. The past season and current marketing is teasing that orcs will be portrayed as sympathetic. I fully expect that they are going to bastardize the origin of the orcs.
Can't wait for season 2 and all the canon stuff. The first season was a set-up, almost a "prelude" season, like a pre-season, to see the motivations and stakes in every part of Middle-earth and to see the darkly fertile ground on which all the rings will arrive. Can't wait.
I will not watch the Rings of Power 2, they did too much wrong in season one. Even though there are so many great stories and ideas contained in the source material, they went with lighting struck Mithril-crap, no sorry, get lost with that.
That's one thing I don't understand. How broad is Amazon's access to Tolkien lore? I thought the rights they bought were limited to the Numenorean storyline and the creation of the ROP. This lightning-striking-the-silmaril-in-the-tree-to-make-mithril crap is a naked deletion of "The Silmarilliion".
3 things: 1) I think folk confuse a story addition to a lore deviation. Bombadil having a summer home in the East does not break the Lore... unless it specifically said he never went East. It does say (I think in the Council) that he at one point had greater influence but that he had withdrawn into his little land. Perhaps this season will offer why he withdraws. That would not be breaking Lore. 2) I think folk also need to compare the density of the material they are using compared to LotR proper (i.e. the amount of dialogue and detail offered the amount of character development). There is a lot of blank canvas that has to be filled out and lore additions be they big or small are necessary to adapt that source material. 3) I think it is only fair to apply the same criticism to both adaptations and folk often do not. I really don't recall anyone voicing issues over the apparent time compression in the Jackson adaptation. Who wants to see weeks to months of wilderness hiking. The compression served a narrative purpose. Noone seemed to mourned Fatty Bolgers absence or Gothmogs addition. Those changes didn't really break lore. Because we didn't see Fatty doesn't mean he didn't exist. The lack of Tolkien mentioning an orc named after the great Gothmog is not evidence one didn't exist. The same can be said for many of the changes in Rings of Power
Adapting the First Age - and actually doing it RIGHT - would be the Mt Everest of filmmaking achievements. In today's DEI-rules-all climate, it couldn't be done...and it SHOULDN'T be done by anyone who isn't committed to honoring established lore and canon. I don't know who could be trusted with it.
Maybe just adapting "Children of Hurin" to keep it manageable. You would get to see quite a bit of the most important bits but it would still be focused on one character.
Just to make it clear I have no animosity for anyone who like this series. But for me ROP just doesn't work. I need a show that is more faithful to the lore world that Tolkien created and envisioned.
I have cautious optimism. Season 1 was slower and did take many liberties from the source material, but overall I still found it enjoyable. I do feel season 2 will ramp up the action, and hopefully be a bit more true to the lore. But we shall see! I’m still very excited for season 2!
I'm cautiously optimistic. I think we'll get a more cohesive, mature and dark season, and I think the action will be turned up a notch. I think it has the potential to be absolutely glorious, but they gotta sharpen the writing. I do feel that we'll see a vast improvement in that regard, but I'm still a bit anxious.
@@thomasfrye6856 They don't deserve any charity from the fans of Tolkien after their poor work, followed by their dishonest marketing that called the audience racists for criticizing their bad work.
It’s tough, because I think the show set out its path that it wasn’t going to be a faithful adaptation of the Tolkiens story. They’re taking characters and broad story arcs and creating their own show which sucks but I can also understand why they’re doing it. I can watch the show now and enjoy it for the story it’s telling without trying to watch every scene and point out the canonical deficiencies. It’s not what the professor wrote but if I want pure Tolkien, I’ll just read the books, and this show can provide some nice entertainment
Pretty much how most of these corporate projects go. If you care about the IP: Dont watch it, it can only disappoint. If you just want background noise/something to shut off your brain to: watch it. It's an independent work that in no way actually relates to the source material, the only reason it has the names associated is to draw people in. It would fall into obscurity without the big name slapped on it, but remove the name and literally nothing about it would change with regards to context or comprehension of the material.
I will give this a chance and try to be optimistic. I think it would be impressive if season 2 is worse than season 1. That said I’m not expecting much.
People don't know 2nd age as well as LOTR. So that leaves more room for chages to the canon. For example taking the hobbits to Osgiliath is in my books unforgivable and how different PJ made Aragon. RoP's Elrond is much more accurate to the actual historical Elrond than in the movies. I enjoy both the movies and RoP but seem to be even more excited about RoP. Also, I really love that we get to see a lot of stuff based/inspired by the things that happened long time ago. Also remember, Tolkien was not there, he just translated old manuscripts.
I'm sure the writers heard from somebody SOMEWHERE that Sauron wasn't always evil. Unfortunately, they won't research where they actually heard that, or how cautious and qualified one's sympathy for him should be.
@@chargingrhino5636 From the perspective of the show I can totally get behind the idea of at least sympathising with Sauron because (imo) he left his old Morgoth serving life behind him and wanted to start fresh and atone. Annnd here comes Guyladriel to 180 that plan; from the perspective of the show she is to blame for the suffering that follows in LotR history (imo).
Thanks for this preview. I didn't hate or love season 1 but I was dissapointed & frustrated with it for most of the reasons you mentioned. I canceled my Prime membership b/c they started charging more for much less (2 day shpg turned into a week+, fewer free ad free movies, etc) so won't likely renew to watch S 2, Azon got too greedy for me.
The Mithril origin, all of the crazy time compression, a Celebrimbor that looked old enough to be Galadriel’s father (if they were human) and Halbrand being Sauron who also turned out to have had a some hand in the forging of the 3 Elven Rings of Power took me out of it. If the Stranger turns out Gandalf,.. I don’t know,.. We are getting at least 3 seasons of this show regardless. I gave it one season, without too much criticism. If this one seems to be just as weird, I’m out. It’s not worth voicing all of my issues over it. We have too much of that everywhere now-a-days. If we are being feed moldy bread, don’t turn on each other and Hobbits.
Creating toxicity is the point of the show. The motion picture industry thrives on it. The best thing we all can do is not support them, let them dig their own graves.
I can't really hate on people who like the show, even if I don't. The Romans had a phrase, ' De Gustibus non est Disputandem' which means - in matters of preferences, there's no arguing'. We've shortened it to 'There's no accounting for taste', which has turned it into more of a flippant put-down, when it used to be actually pretty good advice about personal interactions.
The Second Age is a mythological narrative, not a road trip story like LOTR. The narrative language is different between these two works (if we take the book The Fall of Númenor as the book for the Second Age). Therefore, it would be unrealistic to expect a documentary-style work from the series. It is not right to read the mythology it is based on as a history book. The interpretation of events and filling in the gaps should be handled on a theoretical basis, which is what the series does. When the series is approached from this perspective, its own internal consistency is important.
I enjoyed the first series of ROP. The Hobbit film trinity was lambasted for the changes to the story compared to the book and of course was too long. But I still watch it - Unexpected Journey and Desolation of Smaug are two good films. ROP was quite good, yes the dialogue at times was awful and they will need to improve on that, but you know, they were always going to change the lore. As for Tom Bombadil, introducing him is a great idea and will be played by a fantastic actor. The question I ask from you is… Could Tom have met Gandalf at that time? There is nothing from Tolkiens book but stretching the characters and what we know of them, could they have met? Could they have met in the East? Will Tom be a pivotal character that steers Gandalf back to the west to ensure he starts his stewardship of middle earth? I personally answer yes to all those questions. Tom Bombadil who actually is quite an interesting character will finally make it on film. That’s great and about time.
Greetings! I really admire you for having any hope for The Rings of Power. I do not. The only way I would have had hope for the show is if they had completely scrapped the first season and started over from scratch. But be assured, they will double down, because they cannot admit that they did great injustice to Tolkien. However, I am happy for the people who can enjoy the show. I cannot. I do not think they can turn the show around and I do not think they will even try.
The stranger is almost certainly a blue wizard and not Gandalf. Gandalf only appears in the 3rd age so they don’t have the rights to him. In one version, the blue wizards do appear in the 2nd age. Also, Tolkien in a letter said the blue wizards were involved in magic cults. Hence the cultists. I’m betting that one of the blue wizards is already in Rhun and sent the cultists to look for Sauron and the other blue wizard. That’s how the cultists already knew what Istari were and were referring to the stranger as the “other” blue wizard. I’m even guessing that the first blue wizard is Rómestámo (East Helper) and the stranger is Morinehtar (Darkness Slayer) and his name comes from his affinity for fire and fireflies.
I agree on everything you said. From my side I am pessimistic, as I see they are craming everything they can in a desperate attempt to attract again the LOTR fans. I guess we will have a pretty good idea after the 1st episode
I will first watch your reviews. In season one I fellt so dirty after each season that I needed a bath. So since I zrust your measured and well informed judgement I wait. At least Citdan has long hair now. What bothered me most was Elronds broken oath to Durin. Because sn oath is something really serious in Tolkien. And I hope they redeem Gilgalad whom they aldo did dirty. We can only hope but this time I will see the reviews first.
I will pirate and watch season 2 simply because I feel a deep NEED to see everything even remotely related to middle earth, but honestly season 1 was so bad in all ways except the visuals that half the time I was trying to decide if I should laugh or cry. It is beautiful to look at but the writing and scripting was beyond abysmal. Kinda like the Acolyte. Why can’t these big shows learn from GoT and HotD?! It’s not that hard to use logic and write decent dialogue! 😭
I feel like they are gonna double down. They're gonna blame us, the viewers, and not take responsibility. They'll think "well we already got rid of the people who arent gonna like it, how much worse can our viewers response be?"
Its not just that their lore knowledge is shaky at best, their story telling suxs. The first season has to many occasions which make literally no sense in universe and where the characters move according to the story line and not as people who make decisions and execute them. But thats not just a problem of this show. One has to wonder if good writers are really such a rare commodity or if the general public is happy with this type of content but if the later is the truth then what does this say about our species? Not to mention the implications this would have regarding RL global issues.
If you think Galadriel swimming in the sea and Sauron not surviving an injury are core foundational issues then maybe this show isn't ever going to be for you.
I like you are trying to be fair about ROP. It was bad, but not as bad as some suggest. I didn't mind the Harfoots, but I found any scene with the dwarves to be intolerable. I'll give season 2 a try, but my hopes aren't high. I disagree about the 'toxicity'. People who despise this show do have valid concerns, and have the right to express them.
yes naturally, that's how it should've been. but in reality, there has been a *lot* of toxicity in every channel and comment section, that serves no other purpose than to be obnoxious and it ironically silences valid criticisms because people will associate any complaint with these trolls and haters now, and they have literally bullied people who like it, so it's not that weird that people find the discourse to be toxic.
I wasn’t a fan of season 1. But then I saw what Disney was doing to Star Wars lore. And I felt lucky to be honest. The damage done on RoP is nothing compared to the Star Wars rubbish coming out
it feels like amazon is trying to save Rings of Power by including fan favorite characters, but they just made it worse. they basically executed their on tv series
my main worry is the amount of TH-camrs that'll be making videos spreading nothing but hate and ill will about this show and going after anyone that disagrees with them.
Instead of watching RoP season 1, I reread Lotr, the Hobbit and the silmarillion! I'm going to have to think what to do to honour Tolkien's creation instead of watching roP season 2 this year. Maybe listen to the bbc Lotr radio play, or watch the peter Jackson films again? Or maybe I'll reread Berin and Luthien or the fall of gondolin.
Halo, Witcher, Lord of the Rings, Velma. Corporate projects with beloved IPs' names attached because if they didn't have brand recognition, the series' couldnt and wouldnt draw hardly any viewership. Rinse and repeat with the next franchise - remember, hatewatching is still support.
It’s still crazy to me how they have the rights to the greatest fantasy tale ever told and the biggest budget for a show ever and they still managed to screw it up… the level of incompetence is actually staggering.
Did not see season one and I won’t bother watching season two, I got better things to do at my age. These people are just taking a giant dump in Tolkien’s grave the way I see it. It’s so disrespectful doing something like this they should be ashamed but they have such large egos that they can’t even see how wrong they are
It is not redeemable after the first season , the worst thing about this show was a lot of my favourite LotR content creators shilled for it and tried to praise it despite it being objectively awful in pretty much every aspect, nonsensical writing , terrible dialogue, atrocious casting for pretty much all the key characters , Elrond , Celebrimbor , Galadriel , Isildur all terrible. All that before the absolute desecration of the lore and themes within Tolkien's work.
The only way to fix this series is to scrap it and start again with people who actually care about Tolkien's work. Get rid of Payne and Mckay and hire an entirely new crew and a new cast for the most part. You are far more generous than I am.
This is a fantasy show and as such it has many good qualities, but it is not the sort of adaptation of Tolkien that I would like to watch, so I haven't and won't. Those that wish to watch it are more than welcome to enjoy it.
What good qualities? As an adaptation of Tolkien it is absolutely wretched. Judged as a standalone fantasy it is also wretched. It is honestly worse than those low budget CW shows, except this was the most expensive show in history. At least those working on those CW shows can argue that they lacked the resources and time to produce something better. This show had ample time and excessive money. It was objectively bad in all aspects of the motion picture arts. The scripts were bad. The costumes were bad. The acting was bad. The direction was bad. The editing was bad. The cinematography was bad. The special effects were bad. I think the people making this show engaged in massive embezzlement. Amazon should have aggressively audited everything and turned over the results to prosecutors in the relevant jurisdictions.
Though if you have the rights to the Akallabêth from the Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales you could make an excellent Second Age series. If done right of course.
It was just so bad you can’t even turn back the casual fans let alone a Tolkien fan 😂 most who quit in S1 will not even tune in with S2. My only hope is that the numbers are so bad we get it cancelled!
I hope they spend a lot more money. The show can't be fixed and the people responsible will never be punished appropriately, but we can laugh at how much Amazon wastes trying to buy a good reputation as studio. The problem is that they hired the wrong people and instead of firing them and throwing out their bad work, Amazon will spend good money chasing after bad.
Agreed with mostly everything said here. Obviously everyone is entitled to their own opinion and all that, but I really can’t get behind those who are saying that this season will be the same as the first. All of the promotional material scream a different story with the emphasis on real Tolkien stories (Annatar in Eregion, Durin III falling into greed, the King’s Men vs the Faithful) and real Tolkien characters (Tom Bombadil, Elrond, Cirdan, Durin III, Annatar). I don’t think it’s some kind of farce either to draw in book readers. I saw a quote the other day where the showrunners said that they read everything that is written online, and I want to believe that they’re admitting that they did things wrong and want to right those wrongs here. Call it a fool’s hope, but it’s hope nonetheless.
How can tell the story of Annatar in Eregion after they've already rushed past the creation of the three elven rings, before Annatar even taught them ring crafting? Through their incompetent choices in season one they have cut off the possibility of making a story that even remotely resembles the lore and is consistent with the previous episodes.
I have never seen a fan of Lord of the Rings hating a fan of Rings of Power. The problem arises when Rings of Power fans defend it fanatically by insulting Lord of the Rings as well as claiming that it doesn't break the lore and is not an abomination. You can enjoy Rings of Power all you want, but saying it's objectively good is just false. Plot holes, cheap visuals at many moments (Numenorean leather armor anyone?) incoherent narrative. Those are not subjective. Everyone has it's own guilty pleasure. I sure as hell have it, but I don't defend it till I die as the best thing I have ever watched xD
It dont matter to me how good rop is gonna be i already made my mind before the first season just by watching the material up to it airing that im not gonna support it. Im gonna see some of it but not support it if you catch my drift.
![ละลาย (LALALYE) - DAOU PITTAYA ต้าห์อู๋ พิทยา [OFFICIAL MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wo6r9TgausI/mqdefault.jpg)
"do not trust to hope; it has forsaken these lands"
You beat me to it Eomer. Well played.
Last time i was this early, the Valar were still singing
Had Melkor added his voice?
@@deanzaZZR HE HAD NOT and it was a simpler, happier time 😭
good one
@@bethmarriott9292 Could Melkor be at work again? Through Amazon Prime this time? Is Arda about to be remade? WAIT!...don't answer that. I don't wanna know.
They didn't respect Tolkien's work or the fanbase the first season... Doubtful they'll change now.
People act like the movies didn't do this when they changed major things.
People just like to hate on everything these days
@@snowy5628 The movies were faithful to the books except for some small details (eg Eowyn role, the fight between frodo and golum at the end, the omission of Bombadil etc) this ROP deliberately set out to present the opposite to Tolkien's vision.
@@snowy5628Peter Jackson did everything he could to NOT change Tolkiens stories!
@@AesirUnlimited that's why his version is the one ROP wish they were.
@AesirUnlimited he changed the story because he Had no Choice! Filling 3 hours from each books! Also yeaa you are just plain wrong he just took out some parts! With ROP they have allot more than 3 hours! They are deliberately CHANGING Characters to fit their weak woke stories. They don't understand that at all and neither do you.
Hopes: none. Fears: every conceivable type.
“The men are saying that we will not live out the night. They say that it is hopeless,” Halfeth said. Seeing the young boy’s fear and unease, Aragorn sought to comfort him with a reassuring hand on his shoulder and a gentle smile.
“They’re completely right lmao. It’s so over for Rohirribros, (men of) the west has fallen. Millions must unsubscribe from Amazon Prime.”
I can't wait to see how they explain Sauron slapping on a false moustache and simply walking back into Eregion
Sauron wearing fake mustache
Elves: “Annatar, the Lord of Gifts! 😊”
Fake mustache falls off:
Elves: “Sauron, the Maiar! 😮”
😂
@@Parocha*picks up and sticks mustache back on
"Annatar, You've returned! Be careful, Sauron has been sighted in the area"
Hope: it gets cancelled
Fear: it gets released
There is no hope for season 2. Only anger and sorrow at how evil is twisting and corrupting a work of good literature.
If you read comments by the writers talking about The Stranger in an interview, what you realise is pretty bad. Having him be Gandalf is... kind of dumb. Having him not be Gandalf is probably even dumber after what they did in S1 to tease that he was - but its worse than that. They haven't decided. They are literally making it up as they go along!
My hope is that this is all a bad dream and that I'll wqke up back in 2001 and watch LOTR the Fellowship in theaters
It's not easy to get a ship back on course once it's deep beneath the waves.
I do not dare to hope, for Amazon has forsaken Tolkien's writings in S1.
I have made my peace with the fact that they don't have the rights to Tolkien's works, and thus cannot give us a good product. And for my sanity, I will absolutely NOT be watching the show.
You already said it, when you talked about the foundation. It sadly won't get any better, and we all know it.
The visuals were always fantastic? Two words: Númenórean armor.
"It responds to stress"
This show may as well have as it's tag line: "Abandon hope; all ye who enter here."
Hope clouds observation, consider season one....
Seriously..R.O.P was one of the biggest disapointments. They took something with Soooooo much potential and torpedoed it in the first season. But alas...did we expect anything diffrent?
hopes: they stop making this shit
fears: they keep making this shit
The visuals in S1 weren’t a major problem but definitely weren’t perfect, one of the main complaints I had was about the character wardrobes (especially Numenor) feeling cheap and like costumes
As a fan of Tolkien I don't know why you would put yourself through watching this show.
It’s his job. Like tasting for poison so we don’t have to.
@@shiftymcgee9359 That could be said for season 1. Everyone knows the show is trash, written by lazy, incompetent people that thought they could easily exploit a brand for profit by just using the names of things from the books. Just like many creators that cover Star Trek haven't talked about the final season of STD, anyone that is focused on Tolkien can ignore this show. Just because someone bought the legal rights doesn't mean what they produce is in any way an addition to the work created by someone far more talented than they ever will be. After all, evil is not able to create anything new, it can only distort and destroy what has been invented or made by the forces of good.
@@shiftymcgee9359
No he's getting paid to promote the show.
@shiftymcgee9359 Little Platoon and friends like CF or Mauler aren't considered fans of any big franchise like LOTR, SW or HP but they all know that it's come a point where anything put out by the west is: shite until proven otherwise.
@@gdvvgdfv You lost all credibility by claiming MauLer isn't a fan of LotR.
Rings of Power was an insult to Tolkien
Too True, it really is.
Absolutely, 10000% x1000000000.
It wasn't even the kind of bad that you can laugh at
You need to look at it from their perspective though.
_money money money_
Peter Jackson was an insult to Tolkien.
Well said .
Though even when it comes to visuals ,the aesthetics of the elves is completely wrong .
Expectations can be guided by whether they fired the script writers of season 1.
I always enjoyed the more "informal" reviews and speculations. I find these, ironically, to be more accurate than the "completely-100%-objective-totally-grounded-in-empirical-evidence-but-that's-just-my-opinion-do-your-own-research" type videos. Your reviews of the first season are a real highlight for me, not just for Tolkien or tv, but also in regards to media and news in general.
Also, I was really confused by, but I ended up agreeing with your philosophy about reviewing the show even if you don't like it. If no one is there to provide feedback, other than just extreme one side or the other, I don't think anything will ever grow. I am highly doubtful this show will grow, but it certainly helped me to consider new perspectives.
To be fairly though, this isn't a review; it's a preview. As such it HAS to be fair and objective, because it's mainly speculation based on a teaser, a few photos and a magazine interview. To rant about what we think MIGHT happen is futile and could prove embarrassing.
Their portrayal is as twisted as the roots of the Dark Lord's malice
This can't be fixed. It's an abomination.
I was not a fan of season 1, but I will probably end up watching season 2 with my non-Tolkien-fan friends--if only so they can laugh as I cringe. I'm not looking forward to it.
But I will say that I appreciate the stance you're taking. Not surrendering hope, even when the odds are stacked against us. Continuing to seek out the good in the midst of bad. Thank you for your positivity. Thank you for being neither a hater or a shill. It's a tough line to walk, but the way you're walking it is admirable.
I'm with you brother. I am really hoping this one does justice better to the lore. But, my gut tells they just might want to ragebait the fandom even more, just to get people talking. I'm exhausted just thinking about it.
They can't do justice to the lore. They painted themselves into a corner with the incompetent choices made in the first season. Any continuation of that story is just more failure. Hilariously, they jumped right to the creation for the three elven rings, before the elves were taught the craft by Annatar, before the lesser rings were crafted, before the seven rings for the dwarves, before the nine rings for men. The entire reason why Sauron created the One Ring has been entirely cast aside.
That is just one of the many ways the show has drastically deviated from the lore. The nonsense about mithril is another massive problem that underlines how much they don't understand Tolkien's elves and specifically the Naldor in Middle Earth. The past season and current marketing is teasing that orcs will be portrayed as sympathetic. I fully expect that they are going to bastardize the origin of the orcs.
I just don't need this in my life. I'm happy to just watch the PJ trilogy EEs every year or two
Can't wait for season 2 and all the canon stuff. The first season was a set-up, almost a "prelude" season, like a pre-season, to see the motivations and stakes in every part of Middle-earth and to see the darkly fertile ground on which all the rings will arrive. Can't wait.
Spoiler: "Celebrimbor's body hung upon a pole, shot through with Orc-arrows."
I will not watch the Rings of Power 2, they did too much wrong in season one. Even though there are so many great stories and ideas contained in the source material, they went with lighting struck Mithril-crap, no sorry, get lost with that.
That's one thing I don't understand. How broad is Amazon's access to Tolkien lore? I thought the rights they bought were limited to the Numenorean storyline and the creation of the ROP. This lightning-striking-the-silmaril-in-the-tree-to-make-mithril crap is a naked deletion of "The Silmarilliion".
3 things: 1) I think folk confuse a story addition to a lore deviation. Bombadil having a summer home in the East does not break the Lore... unless it specifically said he never went East. It does say (I think in the Council) that he at one point had greater influence but that he had withdrawn into his little land. Perhaps this season will offer why he withdraws. That would not be breaking Lore. 2) I think folk also need to compare the density of the material they are using compared to LotR proper (i.e. the amount of dialogue and detail offered the amount of character development). There is a lot of blank canvas that has to be filled out and lore additions be they big or small are necessary to adapt that source material. 3) I think it is only fair to apply the same criticism to both adaptations and folk often do not. I really don't recall anyone voicing issues over the apparent time compression in the Jackson adaptation. Who wants to see weeks to months of wilderness hiking. The compression served a narrative purpose. Noone seemed to mourned Fatty Bolgers absence or Gothmogs addition. Those changes didn't really break lore. Because we didn't see Fatty doesn't mean he didn't exist. The lack of Tolkien mentioning an orc named after the great Gothmog is not evidence one didn't exist. The same can be said for many of the changes in Rings of Power
I would like the see the First Age
Adapting the First Age - and actually doing it RIGHT - would be the Mt Everest of filmmaking achievements. In today's DEI-rules-all climate, it couldn't be done...and it SHOULDN'T be done by anyone who isn't committed to honoring established lore and canon. I don't know who could be trusted with it.
Maybe just adapting "Children of Hurin" to keep it manageable. You would get to see quite a bit of the most important bits but it would still be focused on one character.
All fears no hope...
Pass.
“When did Hollywood abandon good adaptations for crap ones” -Saruman definitely
Just to make it clear I have no animosity for anyone who like this series. But for me ROP just doesn't work. I need a show that is more faithful to the lore world that Tolkien created and envisioned.
Amazon will slap Tom Bombadil and a couple of Barrowless Wights in it and call it faithful.
I have cautious optimism. Season 1 was slower and did take many liberties from the source material, but overall I still found it enjoyable. I do feel season 2 will ramp up the action, and hopefully be a bit more true to the lore. But we shall see! I’m still very excited for season 2!
I'm not that hopeful that season 2 is going to be better than season 1. I hope it is
Yeah I hope the second bout of diarrhea is better than the first XD
I'm cautiously optimistic. I think we'll get a more cohesive, mature and dark season, and I think the action will be turned up a notch. I think it has the potential to be absolutely glorious, but they gotta sharpen the writing. I do feel that we'll see a vast improvement in that regard, but I'm still a bit anxious.
Totally fair take, comment sections need more nuance like this.
Sweet summer child 😊
@@thomasfrye6856 They don't deserve any charity from the fans of Tolkien after their poor work, followed by their dishonest marketing that called the audience racists for criticizing their bad work.
@@stevenstehling when did they explicitly do that?
LoTR lore fans: " I want this show to end. It's so bad🤦♂️"
Amazon Rings of Power: "You fool...no man can kill me" 😈💰💰💰💰
It’s tough, because I think the show set out its path that it wasn’t going to be a faithful adaptation of the Tolkiens story. They’re taking characters and broad story arcs and creating their own show which sucks but I can also understand why they’re doing it. I can watch the show now and enjoy it for the story it’s telling without trying to watch every scene and point out the canonical deficiencies. It’s not what the professor wrote but if I want pure Tolkien, I’ll just read the books, and this show can provide some nice entertainment
Pretty much how most of these corporate projects go.
If you care about the IP: Dont watch it, it can only disappoint.
If you just want background noise/something to shut off your brain to: watch it.
It's an independent work that in no way actually relates to the source material, the only reason it has the names associated is to draw people in. It would fall into obscurity without the big name slapped on it, but remove the name and literally nothing about it would change with regards to context or comprehension of the material.
I will give this a chance and try to be optimistic. I think it would be impressive if season 2 is worse than season 1. That said I’m not expecting much.
People don't know 2nd age as well as LOTR. So that leaves more room for chages to the canon. For example taking the hobbits to Osgiliath is in my books unforgivable and how different PJ made Aragon. RoP's Elrond is much more accurate to the actual historical Elrond than in the movies. I enjoy both the movies and RoP but seem to be even more excited about RoP. Also, I really love that we get to see a lot of stuff based/inspired by the things that happened long time ago. Also remember, Tolkien was not there, he just translated old manuscripts.
They've pretty much confirmed they're going to focus on Sauron and making him sympathetic.
I'm sure the writers heard from somebody SOMEWHERE that Sauron wasn't always evil. Unfortunately, they won't research where they actually heard that, or how cautious and qualified one's sympathy for him should be.
@@chargingrhino5636 From the perspective of the show I can totally get behind the idea of at least sympathising with Sauron because (imo) he left his old Morgoth serving life behind him and wanted to start fresh and atone.
Annnd here comes Guyladriel to 180 that plan; from the perspective of the show she is to blame for the suffering that follows in LotR history (imo).
Thanks for this preview. I didn't hate or love season 1 but I was dissapointed & frustrated with it for most of the reasons you mentioned.
I canceled my Prime membership b/c they started charging more for much less (2 day shpg turned into a week+, fewer free ad free movies, etc) so won't likely renew to watch S 2, Azon got too greedy for me.
The Mithril origin, all of the crazy time compression, a Celebrimbor that looked old enough to be Galadriel’s father (if they were human) and Halbrand being Sauron who also turned out to have had a some hand in the forging of the 3 Elven Rings of Power took me out of it. If the Stranger turns out Gandalf,..
I don’t know,.. We are getting at least 3 seasons of this show regardless. I gave it one season, without too much criticism. If this one seems to be just as weird, I’m out. It’s not worth voicing all of my issues over it. We have too much of that everywhere now-a-days.
If we are being feed moldy bread, don’t turn on each other and Hobbits.
Creating toxicity is the point of the show. The motion picture industry thrives on it. The best thing we all can do is not support them, let them dig their own graves.
I can't really hate on people who like the show, even if I don't. The Romans had a phrase, ' De Gustibus non est Disputandem' which means - in matters of preferences, there's no arguing'. We've shortened it to 'There's no accounting for taste', which has turned it into more of a flippant put-down, when it used to be actually pretty good advice about personal interactions.
Without Respect We Reject
The Second Age is a mythological narrative, not a road trip story like LOTR. The narrative language is different between these two works (if we take the book The Fall of Númenor as the book for the Second Age). Therefore, it would be unrealistic to expect a documentary-style work from the series. It is not right to read the mythology it is based on as a history book. The interpretation of events and filling in the gaps should be handled on a theoretical basis, which is what the series does. When the series is approached from this perspective, its own internal consistency is important.
I enjoyed the first series of ROP. The Hobbit film trinity was lambasted for the changes to the story compared to the book and of course was too long. But I still watch it - Unexpected Journey and Desolation of Smaug are two good films.
ROP was quite good, yes the dialogue at times was awful and they will need to improve on that, but you know, they were always going to change the lore.
As for Tom Bombadil, introducing him is a great idea and will be played by a fantastic actor. The question I ask from you is…
Could Tom have met Gandalf at that time? There is nothing from Tolkiens book but stretching the characters and what we know of them, could they have met? Could they have met in the East? Will Tom be a pivotal character that steers Gandalf back to the west to ensure he starts his stewardship of middle earth?
I personally answer yes to all those questions. Tom Bombadil who actually is quite an interesting character will finally make it on film. That’s great and about time.
Greetings!
I really admire you for having any hope for The Rings of Power.
I do not.
The only way I would have had hope for the show is if they had completely scrapped the first season and started over from scratch.
But be assured, they will double down, because they cannot admit that they did great injustice to Tolkien.
However, I am happy for the people who can enjoy the show.
I cannot.
I do not think they can turn the show around and I do not think they will even try.
There is no hope, it's only fear and disappointment for this show
The stranger is almost certainly a blue wizard and not Gandalf. Gandalf only appears in the 3rd age so they don’t have the rights to him. In one version, the blue wizards do appear in the 2nd age. Also, Tolkien in a letter said the blue wizards were involved in magic cults. Hence the cultists. I’m betting that one of the blue wizards is already in Rhun and sent the cultists to look for Sauron and the other blue wizard. That’s how the cultists already knew what Istari were and were referring to the stranger as the “other” blue wizard. I’m even guessing that the first blue wizard is Rómestámo (East Helper) and the stranger is Morinehtar (Darkness Slayer) and his name comes from his affinity for fire and fireflies.
My one hope for RoP season 2: that it results in the cancellation of Rings of Power.
I agree on everything you said. From my side I am pessimistic, as I see they are craming everything they can in a desperate attempt to attract again the LOTR fans. I guess we will have a pretty good idea after the 1st episode
I will first watch your reviews. In season one I fellt so dirty after each season that I needed a bath. So since I zrust your measured and well informed judgement I wait. At least Citdan has long hair now. What bothered me most was Elronds broken oath to Durin. Because sn oath is something really serious in Tolkien. And I hope they redeem Gilgalad whom they aldo did dirty. We can only hope but this time I will see the reviews first.
I will pirate and watch season 2 simply because I feel a deep NEED to see everything even remotely related to middle earth, but honestly season 1 was so bad in all ways except the visuals that half the time I was trying to decide if I should laugh or cry. It is beautiful to look at but the writing and scripting was beyond abysmal. Kinda like the Acolyte. Why can’t these big shows learn from GoT and HotD?! It’s not that hard to use logic and write decent dialogue! 😭
Gonna watch it, but it's gonna suck.
Season 1 was painfully bad😭😭🙏🏽
I feel like they are gonna double down. They're gonna blame us, the viewers, and not take responsibility. They'll think "well we already got rid of the people who arent gonna like it, how much worse can our viewers response be?"
Its not just that their lore knowledge is shaky at best, their story telling suxs. The first season has to many occasions which make literally no sense in universe and where the characters move according to the story line and not as people who make decisions and execute them. But thats not just a problem of this show.
One has to wonder if good writers are really such a rare commodity or if the general public is happy with this type of content but if the later is the truth then what does this say about our species? Not to mention the implications this would have regarding RL global issues.
If you think Galadriel swimming in the sea and Sauron not surviving an injury are core foundational issues then maybe this show isn't ever going to be for you.
The showrunners deserve worse punishment than what Hùrin was subjected to
Oh god I didn't realise how soon season 2 is releasing.
I like you are trying to be fair about ROP. It was bad, but not as bad as some suggest. I didn't mind the Harfoots, but I found any scene with the dwarves to be intolerable. I'll give season 2 a try, but my hopes aren't high. I disagree about the 'toxicity'. People who despise this show do have valid concerns, and have the right to express them.
yes naturally, that's how it should've been. but in reality, there has been a *lot* of toxicity in every channel and comment section, that serves no other purpose than to be obnoxious and it ironically silences valid criticisms because people will associate any complaint with these trolls and haters now, and they have literally bullied people who like it, so it's not that weird that people find the discourse to be toxic.
Surprised they haven't cancelled this junk yet.
I wasn’t a fan of season 1. But then I saw what Disney was doing to Star Wars lore. And I felt lucky to be honest. The damage done on RoP is nothing compared to the Star Wars rubbish coming out
I have no hope for season 2, only fears. My biggest one is they will find a way to make this season worse than season 1.
Stop feeding the machine.
He's being paid off. He's promoting it even now. Read between the lines
it feels like amazon is trying to save Rings of Power by including fan favorite characters, but they just made it worse. they basically executed their on tv series
Season 1 wasn't enough for you?
my main worry is the amount of TH-camrs that'll be making videos spreading nothing but hate and ill will about this show and going after anyone that disagrees with them.
I've not watched Season 1, i doubt i will season 2. Everything i've heard makes me think Melkor has had a hand in this production.
When Melkor returns, Arda will be remade. This seems to be the only point of canon that Amazon understands.
My biggest hope for Rings of Power is that it get cancelled.
Instead of watching RoP season 1, I reread Lotr, the Hobbit and the silmarillion!
I'm going to have to think what to do to honour Tolkien's creation instead of watching roP season 2 this year.
Maybe listen to the bbc Lotr radio play, or watch the peter Jackson films again?
Or maybe I'll reread Berin and Luthien or the fall of gondolin.
How did Peter Jackson honour Tolkien ? 😂😂😂
My only hope for it is that it is canceled at this point
Halo, Witcher, Lord of the Rings, Velma.
Corporate projects with beloved IPs' names attached because if they didn't have brand recognition, the series' couldnt and wouldnt draw hardly any viewership.
Rinse and repeat with the next franchise - remember, hatewatching is still support.
I have long since given up hope for Rings of Power, they have learned nothing or almost nothing.
To quote Andor: "They don't care enough to learn"
Shitty big streaming company money grab TV never improves. And that's all this is
It’s still crazy to me how they have the rights to the greatest fantasy tale ever told and the biggest budget for a show ever and they still managed to screw it up… the level of incompetence is actually staggering.
Did not see season one and I won’t bother watching season two, I got better things to do at my age. These people are just taking a giant dump in Tolkien’s grave the way I see it. It’s so disrespectful doing something like this they should be ashamed but they have such large egos that they can’t even see how wrong they are
There is no hope after senseless S1.. unless they completely scrap it and start fresh.
It is not redeemable after the first season , the worst thing about this show was a lot of my favourite LotR content creators shilled for it and tried to praise it despite it being objectively awful in pretty much every aspect, nonsensical writing , terrible dialogue, atrocious casting for pretty much all the key characters , Elrond , Celebrimbor , Galadriel , Isildur all terrible. All that before the absolute desecration of the lore and themes within Tolkien's work.
To be honest, disrespecting Tolkien might be the point of these stupid show runner all along.
The only way to fix this series is to scrap it and start again with people who actually care about Tolkien's work. Get rid of Payne and Mckay and hire an entirely new crew and a new cast for the most part.
You are far more generous than I am.
This is a fantasy show and as such it has many good qualities, but it is not the sort of adaptation of Tolkien that I would like to watch, so I haven't and won't. Those that wish to watch it are more than welcome to enjoy it.
What good qualities? As an adaptation of Tolkien it is absolutely wretched. Judged as a standalone fantasy it is also wretched. It is honestly worse than those low budget CW shows, except this was the most expensive show in history. At least those working on those CW shows can argue that they lacked the resources and time to produce something better. This show had ample time and excessive money. It was objectively bad in all aspects of the motion picture arts. The scripts were bad. The costumes were bad. The acting was bad. The direction was bad. The editing was bad. The cinematography was bad. The special effects were bad. I think the people making this show engaged in massive embezzlement. Amazon should have aggressively audited everything and turned over the results to prosecutors in the relevant jurisdictions.
"Hope is the fool's ally"
Fear: nothing will be Tolkienian like season 1
Hope: ------
A 2nd age show would be really difficult to do well as so much would have to be written from appendixes rather than adapted from a straight narrative.
Though if you have the rights to the Akallabêth from the Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales you could make an excellent Second Age series. If done right of course.
Hope…..??
Please tell me you’ve been drinking.
It was just so bad you can’t even turn back the casual fans let alone a Tolkien fan 😂 most who quit in S1 will not even tune in with S2. My only hope is that the numbers are so bad we get it cancelled!
I hope they spend a lot more money. The show can't be fixed and the people responsible will never be punished appropriately, but we can laugh at how much Amazon wastes trying to buy a good reputation as studio. The problem is that they hired the wrong people and instead of firing them and throwing out their bad work, Amazon will spend good money chasing after bad.
There is no hope...
Agreed with mostly everything said here.
Obviously everyone is entitled to their own opinion and all that, but I really can’t get behind those who are saying that this season will be the same as the first.
All of the promotional material scream a different story with the emphasis on real Tolkien stories (Annatar in Eregion, Durin III falling into greed, the King’s Men vs the Faithful) and real Tolkien characters (Tom Bombadil, Elrond, Cirdan, Durin III, Annatar). I don’t think it’s some kind of farce either to draw in book readers. I saw a quote the other day where the showrunners said that they read everything that is written online, and I want to believe that they’re admitting that they did things wrong and want to right those wrongs here.
Call it a fool’s hope, but it’s hope nonetheless.
How can tell the story of Annatar in Eregion after they've already rushed past the creation of the three elven rings, before Annatar even taught them ring crafting? Through their incompetent choices in season one they have cut off the possibility of making a story that even remotely resembles the lore and is consistent with the previous episodes.
I have never seen a fan of Lord of the Rings hating a fan of Rings of Power. The problem arises when Rings of Power fans defend it fanatically by insulting Lord of the Rings as well as claiming that it doesn't break the lore and is not an abomination. You can enjoy Rings of Power all you want, but saying it's objectively good is just false.
Plot holes, cheap visuals at many moments (Numenorean leather armor anyone?) incoherent narrative. Those are not subjective.
Everyone has it's own guilty pleasure. I sure as hell have it, but I don't defend it till I die as the best thing I have ever watched xD
It dont matter to me how good rop is gonna be i already made my mind before the first season just by watching the material up to it airing that im not gonna support it. Im gonna see some of it but not support it if you catch my drift.
Hope?????😂