Totally agree, price and quality should be proportional, but very often isn't. I now live in a multi family home in the city and used to live on a large property in a suburb with long wires and verticals for HF that have gotten more and more noisy over decades. Trying to SWL with passive and later active electrical antennas was quite a journey. Short active electrical antennas gave me results so bad that I stopped SWLing for years and in the end of 2006, when SDRs became more popular I built the SDR by myself (with sound card A/D) and a shielded indoor loop as well, which was a great first step into the right direction. Then later I was able to install an antenna in the attic, where an electrical whip failed badly, even my indoor magnetic (beside the RX in the shack) was much better. Because of the massive local electrical noise I thought I'd try something magnetic and highly symmetrical, to give the unwanted local e-field the least chance of coupling into my RX. Because I was spoiled from operating real big wires, verticals and a beam in my early SWL/ham career in the late 70s and 80s, I had high standards and because of the noise from poorly choked switching supplies in literally every electrical device, I kind of gave up on dream of good signal to noise. So I thought I spend a last time up to 100 bucks into a ready made preamp that looked very well designed for what I was looking for. So I bought this (active-antenna.eu/) LZ1AQ design, ready made preamp and created two loops 90° shifted made from stiff copper wire (1m diamater), used for high current electrical installations (20 bucks from a home depot like store), put it into the attic connected to the custom crimped CAT7 ethernet cable, measured the wiring, turned it on and I was simply speechless with the signal to noise my place! Here is some of the theory behind the basics of his concept: www.lz1aq.signacor.com/docs/wsml/wideband-active-sm-loop-antenna.htm I put this up a year ago and am still very happy with the results, reminds me on the good old days in the 80s. I recommended it to two friends, one compared it to his high outdoor longwire and has a similar S/N indoor, the other one has not taken the time to install it. So now I am really wondering if it is my noisy location that makes this antenna shine over my homemade shielded loop wideband antenna, which isn't all symmetrical, neither the preamp, nor the cable into the shack. This LZ1AQ preamp has 4 selectable modes, controllable by the converter in your shack, 1 electrical antenna, loop A, loop B and loop A&B on the magnetic amplifier ... the S/N on the loops in magnetic mode is amazing and because the loops are not shielded, their self resonance is, depending on the diameter usually way above 30 MHz, so you can use it over the entire range with a good match from VLF to HF. Some friends have wire antennas in the attic and they have no chance to pick up what I am picking up ... e.g. digital HFDL ground station messages from Guam and Hawaii almost on a daily basis while I am located in Munich, Germany! If you are a person who enjoys building some of the mechanical part of the antenna by yourself, are able to crimp ethernet and know which is the hot end of the soldering iron, live in a noisy environment, this might be (one of) the best solutions for you ... for sure in this price range ... here is how customers got inventive on the antenna around this genius preamp. active-antenna.eu/amplifier-kit/testemonials/ I have no affiliations to LZ1AQ, I am just impressed with this very unorthodox receiving and feeding concept that does an outstanding job in my place - BC signals with 70-90 dB over the noise is totally normal. Please make sure your SDR can handle the dynamic ... I recommend nothing under 12 bit and possible use some preselection. To give you an example what signal to noise we are dealing with ON5KQ used to have an KIWI SDR connected to a horizontal LZ1AQ loop, but his station is currently down ... hopefully he'll be back on again, because this is how I learned about this oustanding system. I hope there will soon be a version that send the signal of loop a and loop b simultaneously independant into the shack, so you can use modern dual channel SDRs and phase shift the signals by software, practically turning the mechanically fixed antenna electronically, nullung out unwanted signals and be able to save these settings in software presets. So don't give up on HF in crowded RF polluted places, try magnetic antennas, even a poorly designed magnetic one will outperform an active whip antenna or wire.
I have lots of noise here and it is noticeable that the ML-30 is less prone to that _specific_ pick up than my Wellbrook loop or a small active Whip (tried PA0RDT & transverter-store) types. The performance is probably like one of the prototype stages of the other big names, they went on get wider coverage or more consistent noise floor but here it's like "nah that's OK, will sell, get a million made" - cheap. My antenna of choice here is the (active-antena eu) design from LZ1AQ, nothing allows me to reduce my noise problem like that kit but the ML-30 is good in parts and very kind to the wallet.
hi been watching a while can you please help with a question? I want a very very receiver but not sure if i should get a older top of the line commercial grade like a watkins or a r390a or something or a more modern rig like a icom r7100? or kenwood r5000? I do like the feel of real knobs and buttons but if the old top of the line receivers are far behind in rx and sensitivity and so forth I would buy a newer albeit cheaper feeling receiver,,,,my budget is 1000 more or less on a used unit...so older top of the line commercial rig or mid to upper grade consumer line? what would you do? I want the best I can get for my budget...if you can give me some pointers I would be extremely grateful also i find some radios in the past fatiguing to work and listen to for long time so non fatiguing audio and ergonomic use is very important as well thanks and best wishes~!
Someone on another channel demonstrated that the bias tee that comes with the MLA-30 adds a lot of noise. Is there a good low cost bias tee one could use with it?
can't say, mine has a Filter that blocks everything below 1.8 MHz so I can't compare. But if I look at the performance of both at 2 or 3 MHz .. I would say the W6LVP might be better in longwave and mediumwave
OfficialSWLchannel thanks for the reply. We are looking for an antenna to receive the signal from an NDB beacon for doing off-the-air monitoring of the facility.
While what you say of the MLA 30 being as good as or better than the W6LVP, both will suffer from the winter wind & ice weather conditions. I will bet that neither of them makes it through the winter months in the same condition as they are now? Giles, do some close up shots of the mechanical construction of these 2 loops and how they might handle different weather conditions of rain, snow, ice, etc.
@@busterbrown8830 latter , i am actually aware of the dangers and have decided i am going to put a poly vinyl loom over the exposed metal made from a a cpap hose, and the box itself covered with another exterior case , just in case... literally..so basically fortify the unit against the ice with junk i have just stored away for a "rainy day"
I've always felt that commercial loop receiving antennas were way overpriced for what they are. I mean, they're basically just a preamp with a loop of wire. I've looked at the Wellbrook loops for years, but could never justify the hundreds of dollars they cost. Yeah, I hate the idea of giving all my money to the Chinese. I dunno, maybe I'll just build my own using as many American made parts as possible. I bet I could build one for pretty inexpensive, I already have most of the parts. Then I'd have an American made loop antenna. Anyway, we'll talk more in the chat later on. :-)
That depends what youre listenning too i got the W6LVP loop,Wellbrook ALA1530 and they both work excellent dont think this cheap chinese loop would let me monitor hf aero anybody get put a piece of wire and monitor radio stations lots of people complain what it cost without having one....
Totally agree, price and quality should be proportional, but very often isn't.
I now live in a multi family home in the city and used to live on a large property in a suburb with long wires and verticals for HF that have gotten more and more noisy over decades.
Trying to SWL with passive and later active electrical antennas was quite a journey. Short active electrical antennas gave me results so bad that I stopped SWLing for years and in the end of 2006, when SDRs became more popular I built the SDR by myself (with sound card A/D) and a shielded indoor loop as well, which was a great first step into the right direction. Then later I was able to install an antenna in the attic, where an electrical whip failed badly, even my indoor magnetic (beside the RX in the shack) was much better. Because of the massive local electrical noise I thought I'd try something magnetic and highly symmetrical, to give the unwanted local e-field the least chance of coupling into my RX.
Because I was spoiled from operating real big wires, verticals and a beam in my early SWL/ham career in the late 70s and 80s, I had high standards and because of the noise from poorly choked switching supplies in literally every electrical device, I kind of gave up on dream of good signal to noise. So I thought I spend a last time up to 100 bucks into a ready made preamp that looked very well designed for what I was looking for.
So I bought this (active-antenna.eu/) LZ1AQ design, ready made preamp and created two loops 90° shifted made from stiff copper wire (1m diamater), used for high current electrical installations (20 bucks from a home depot like store), put it into the attic connected to the custom crimped CAT7 ethernet cable, measured the wiring, turned it on and I was simply speechless with the signal to noise my place! Here is some of the theory behind the basics of his concept: www.lz1aq.signacor.com/docs/wsml/wideband-active-sm-loop-antenna.htm
I put this up a year ago and am still very happy with the results, reminds me on the good old days in the 80s. I recommended it to two friends, one compared it to his high outdoor longwire and has a similar S/N indoor, the other one has not taken the time to install it. So now I am really wondering if it is my noisy location that makes this antenna shine over my homemade shielded loop wideband antenna, which isn't all symmetrical, neither the preamp, nor the cable into the shack.
This LZ1AQ preamp has 4 selectable modes, controllable by the converter in your shack, 1 electrical antenna, loop A, loop B and loop A&B on the magnetic amplifier ... the S/N on the loops in magnetic mode is amazing and because the loops are not shielded, their self resonance is, depending on the diameter usually way above 30 MHz, so you can use it over the entire range with a good match from VLF to HF.
Some friends have wire antennas in the attic and they have no chance to pick up what I am picking up ... e.g. digital HFDL ground station messages from Guam and Hawaii almost on a daily basis while I am located in Munich, Germany! If you are a person who enjoys building some of the mechanical part of the antenna by yourself, are able to crimp ethernet and know which is the hot end of the soldering iron, live in a noisy environment, this might be (one of) the best solutions for you ... for sure in this price range ... here is how customers got inventive on the antenna around this genius preamp. active-antenna.eu/amplifier-kit/testemonials/
I have no affiliations to LZ1AQ, I am just impressed with this very unorthodox receiving and feeding concept that does an outstanding job in my place - BC signals with 70-90 dB over the noise is totally normal. Please make sure your SDR can handle the dynamic ... I recommend nothing under 12 bit and possible use some preselection.
To give you an example what signal to noise we are dealing with ON5KQ used to have an KIWI SDR connected to a horizontal LZ1AQ loop, but his station is currently down ... hopefully he'll be back on again, because this is how I learned about this oustanding system.
I hope there will soon be a version that send the signal of loop a and loop b simultaneously independant into the shack, so you can use modern dual channel SDRs and phase shift the signals by software, practically turning the mechanically fixed antenna electronically, nullung out unwanted signals and be able to save these settings in software presets.
So don't give up on HF in crowded RF polluted places, try magnetic antennas, even a poorly designed magnetic one will outperform an active whip antenna or wire.
I enjoyed your reply above, so I'd like to get your advice on the passive magnetic loop antenna I'm building here: swling.com/blog/page/2/ Thanks
I have lots of noise here and it is noticeable that the ML-30 is less prone to that _specific_ pick up than my Wellbrook loop or a small active Whip (tried PA0RDT & transverter-store) types.
The performance is probably like one of the prototype stages of the other big names, they went on get wider coverage or more consistent noise floor but here it's like "nah that's OK, will sell, get a million made" - cheap.
My antenna of choice here is the (active-antena eu) design from LZ1AQ, nothing allows me to reduce my noise problem like that kit but the ML-30 is good in parts and very kind to the wallet.
I bought 3 of these. Haven't received mine yet. Great show!
hi been watching a while can you please help with a question? I want a very very receiver but not sure if i should get a older top of the line commercial grade like a watkins or a r390a or something or a more modern rig like a icom r7100? or kenwood r5000? I do like the feel of real knobs and buttons but if the old top of the line receivers are far behind in rx and sensitivity and so forth I would buy a newer albeit cheaper feeling receiver,,,,my budget is 1000 more or less on a used unit...so older top of the line commercial rig or mid to upper grade consumer line? what would you do? I want the best I can get for my budget...if you can give me some pointers I would be extremely grateful also i find some radios in the past fatiguing to work and listen to for long time so non fatiguing audio and ergonomic use is very important as well thanks and best wishes~!
Someone on another channel demonstrated that the bias tee that comes with the MLA-30 adds a lot of noise. Is there a good low cost bias tee one could use with it?
Gilles- please put in your video description the time and day of your live streaming.
Hi.. Where can i buy and adapter to Connect this antenna with my tecsun (3.5 mm Jack)? Ty
OK.. I understand the mla 30 needs a power supply. What voltage for power? connector?
I enjoyed your video. I have a question, how does the MLA-30 compare to the W6LVP when receiving in the area of 200KHz thru 600Khz?
can't say, mine has a Filter that blocks everything below 1.8 MHz so I can't compare. But if I look at the performance of both at 2 or 3 MHz .. I would say the W6LVP might be better in longwave and mediumwave
OfficialSWLchannel thanks for the reply. We are looking for an antenna to receive the signal from an NDB beacon for doing off-the-air monitoring of the facility.
While what you say of the MLA 30 being as good as or better than the W6LVP, both will suffer from the winter wind & ice weather conditions.
I will bet that neither of them makes it through the winter months in the same condition as they are now?
Giles, do some close up shots of the mechanical construction of these 2 loops and how they might handle different weather conditions of rain, snow, ice, etc.
mine fell off the mount and crashed into the ground, it also has been through major storms, its waterproof and pretty tough
@@lovinradios6495 Is that winter weather with ice & snow? or just rain and wind?
@@busterbrown8830 latter , i am actually aware of the dangers and have decided i am going to put a poly vinyl loom over the exposed metal made from a a cpap hose, and the box itself covered with another exterior case , just in case... literally..so basically fortify the unit against the ice with junk i have just stored away for a "rainy day"
I want to get one. There are a few vendors on eBay, can anyone recommend a reliable vendor?
I've always felt that commercial loop receiving antennas were way overpriced for what they are. I mean, they're basically just a preamp with a loop of wire. I've looked at the Wellbrook loops for years, but could never justify the hundreds of dollars they cost. Yeah, I hate the idea of giving all my money to the Chinese. I dunno, maybe I'll just build my own using as many American made parts as possible. I bet I could build one for pretty inexpensive, I already have most of the parts. Then I'd have an American made loop antenna. Anyway, we'll talk more in the chat later on. :-)
Yes, you giving your money to the Chines, but in return they buy US T-bonds with it.
It's another loop, the money loop!
That depends what youre listenning too i got the W6LVP loop,Wellbrook ALA1530 and they both work excellent dont think this cheap chinese loop would let me monitor hf aero anybody get put a piece of wire and monitor radio stations lots of people complain what it cost without having one....