I think the point is that there are options, for both tech and owner. Figure out what works best for both and what makes everyone profit. There is no Golden answer. Skill level, shop specialty, demographics all play a part.
I made the switch from hourly to flat rate and it was the best thing I could have done. I left the small shop that always cried when the had to buy specialist tools even though they loved to advertise they were specialist in all makes. When you talk I 100% understand where your coming... 100% how it is! To me it's like this Flat rate = Feast or Famine. Luckily our dealer is very busy and it's a buffet at least 3-4 days a week .Since then I doubled my net pay, learnt how to work better, faster , cleaner, added a whole shit load of new tools and equipment and I go to training every 3 months, I am a better technician because of this.I feel that I am finally in control as a flat rate technician , like I'm my own boss, my hard work directly affects my pay check. Honestly who works like its flat rate when you get paid hourly? Nobody, why would you? Why would you work faster, buy that special tool to do the job faster, so that you can make the same amount at the end of the week. The dealerships is where the action is. I love coming home from a 8 hour shift and making 30, it makes those days that you only made 5 a faint memory. Keep the vids rolling brother. I'd like to see more videos of what's happening in the shop type videos...
Good points sir. I work in a oem diesel truck shop, I'm paid hourly with a monthly productivity bonus. I've worked about every pay scale there is, hourly with a billed hours productivity bonus works best for me. In the slow times, you have your hourly pay, you're not stressing about your paycheck, in the busy times you have incentive to be productive and make a nice bonus above your hourly wage, for someone like me who is flat rate minded, it works best. In the 9 months of last year I worked for this company, my lowest month was my 1st month with the company, 86% efficient, next lowest month was December at 96%, all other months were over 100% efficiency. Love the videos, keep up the great work, can't wait for part 2!
One problem I have seen in my area is that flat rate work creates categories of work that are profitable and other categories that are not. To that end you see shops here that will not work on certain makes or years of vehicles. For example, I know of a shop in the area that will not work on vehicles more than 10 years old. The rust and general decay kills the profit on those vehicles and the only way to keep the mechanics happy is to give them newer/easier vehicles. That can be bad for a shop owner. No one likes to turn work away, especially if it's a fleet customer or long time customer who happens to have a older/odder/European/large/small/etc vehicle. You almost need a hybrid system.
I used to be straight flat rate at a small dealership. The cash jobs were very easy money in contrast to the warranty work. Things became really ugly, really fast when the service manager (delegates the repair orders) hired his son as a tech. The son basically rode the gravy train on biscuit wheels with reduced working hours among other perks that were exclusive to the father/son team while the rest of the techs did oil changes and ball busting warranty. The solution was to pack it up and find a better place to work. Every interview I went on started with "do any of the service manager's relatives work as techs?". I am now working flat rate with a 40hr guarantee somewhere better. For me, this is the best of both worlds as I dont have to worry about the slow seasons and can still profit from the busy periods. Remember, techs communicate best with their feet AND toolboxes have wheels for a reason.
I worked flat rate for 10 years. My quality of work was my number 1 priority on any job I did. My billed hours weren't always as high as the flat rate guys who were butchers. The manager knew this and for that reason I made more per billed hour. Why he kept the butchers is what I always wondered. Used to piss me off. Great discussion. Love your channel.
Great video! I look forward to part 2! I have yet to see an hourly tech that can outperform me. There may be some out there, but I haven't seen one. I have learned to manage my time and my environment to be as productive as possible. Flat rate hacks piss me off. They give all of us a bad reputation. I take pride in my work and I don't like seeing comebacks!
FLAT RATE is great for self-motivated, always learning, CONSISTENT (NO NEED for someone to TELL them to work). IF someone owns a business (individual - who does construction/painting/repairs/ect...
I'm a heavy equipment tech that works on construction and steel mill equipment so flat rate wouldn't work for me because on some jobs it literally takes me two days of cleaning to be able to get to a 2 hour job . Ive also been called out on electrical nightmares on huge machines like Cat 992s, Kawasaki 135s where mill mechanics have worked on them that don't know what their doing and don't care . They cut wires, hook thing up wrong or splice into random wires and I'm the one that has to figure out the electrical problem that now doesn't relate to a factory schematic.
I was a flat rate shop foreman at a Toyota dealer for a few years. There was a bonus for being the foreman. Made decent money. Lots of stress, drama, and competition between fellow workers. When working there I saw lots of lazy prima-donna techs that had chips on their shoulders about doing certain jobs. There were a bunch of hacks and rip off artists as well. Management didn’t care because these “hacks” and “rip off artists” flagged the most hours every week. I couldn’t take it anymore. I left the dealer and went to heavy equipment/diesel. I’m hourly now, making the same I did flagging a 50-60 hour work week on flat rate consistently. Every single guy in the shop here pulls his weight and nobody is lazy. I’m a firm believer that happiness has much more to do with work ethic than pay incentives. When the workers are happy and aren’t stressed about what their pay check is going to look like, they can concentrate on fixing the equipment or vehicle properly. Flat rate needs to go away.
Years ago I worked in a motor pool for a large company. We got paid by the hour and if we exceeded a certain level of production, we got what they called "piece work pay". I was the low man on a team of 4 and if I got lazy or careless, that team would transfer me to an F-troup team. It was the best of both worlds as we all worked hard and made about 30-40% more on top of our hourly pay.
At the shop I work at currently we are hourly employee’s and my co worker has done nothing but work the flat rate system and my boss tends to tell me about how different me and him are as workers. He is much faster paced than me but he tends to break a lot of parts and some times leaves bolts loose on accident. Where with me since I’ve never worked anything but hourly so I may take a bit longer, i tend to be more thorough and I’ll be easier on things even if it takes longer just so I don’t break them.
I agree with a large majority of what you have said, Mike. You have made good points. The one thing I'd like to say though, is that I do think if youre in a shop with a large amount of diag work. You should probably be hourly with an incentive plan.
My personal opinion from working in both hourly and flat rate. Looking at the majority of technicians I have worked with, someone working hourly is going to give more attention to detail, whereas the flat rate guy is going to learn shortcuts after a while which may or may not lead to come-backs, but it does lead to treating a customer's vehicle more like a number than it does treating it like an actual human being's vehicle.
When I was hourly at NTB I was at 40 percent efficiency. Simply due to the low volume. I'm flat rate now at Jag Rover, and 115 percent efficiency. Hard to make good efficiency when no one comes in because the whole town knows the shop is a joke.
It all depends on the technician and the shop. I’m an alignment/suspension technician at a body shop in a small town and hourly works great for me and my boss. On the other hand, the body techs are flat rate and it works great for them.
Great video. I started hourly and moved to flat rate. The work ethic (quality) you see in a hourly tech will be close to what you will see in a flat rate technician. The shop foreman / shop manager needs to stress quality work. And quality work should be rewarded. A hack is a hack all day long. It is up to management to pay for quality work and walk through the shop making sure the work is being done to manufacture’s standards / specifications. Fire the hacks because they hurt technicians who care about quality work and a good paycheck.
I won't say flat rate creates hacks, I learned to work more efficiently in flat rate. My opinion is that the key differences between the two is body damage, and training. Flat rate is motivation to get the move on, usually at the cost of the premature fatigue of your own body. Plus of course a strictly flat rate pay system won't pay you to help and teach other technicians. So I'm for salary 😉 just my two cents
Super Mario Diagnostics your absolutely right Mario and in my situation I’m flat rate and the shop Forman. I need to feed my family but how do I do that when I lose money to help other guys? It’s a double edge sword. I will help anyone but it definitely makes it cut throat. I’ve worked with great techs and you get two top guys together that are flat rate it can also create a tone of issue due to the competition. Take that same guy and put him in another location where they don’t work together in the same shop and they are best friends. Not to mention your body 🤬 my body is tore up and makes me think what the hell am I going to be doing in 5 years. I can’t work like this forever and unfortunately in Tucson I can’t find a shop that I can make what I feel I’m worth without it being flat rate. Your shop seems to understand man and they found you so that’s awesome and wish they’re more shops that see that.
Cody’s Auto diagnostics you're absolutely right about the tech competition/friendship. Spot on, to me shop environment goes much further than flag hours.
@@codysautodiagnosticsprogra8706 I agree. I'm also flat rate and the shop foreman who dispatches. I feel like I'd make substantially more money if I went back to just being a flat rate tech. It's hard dealing with the stress being a shop foreman.
I was in a shop where they switched to flat rate and the techs were making too much and switched him back. Flat rate is good for jobs that you perform all the time and get better at and faster. Ie you don’t have to remove certain thing just loosen and move out of the way, or a better way to get at the bolt in bad place. There are pros and cons to each. Great vid stay off that doodle jump just concentrate on getting that poop out.
GOOD JOB EXPLAINING THOSE DIFFERENCES, COMING FROM BEING FLAT RATE MASTER TECH JUST LIKE YOU … I SEEN GREAT TECHNICIANS THAT WERE FLAT RATE AND PUMPING GOOD HONEST HOURS, AND SCAMMING HACK FLAT RATE TECHNICIANS SELLING WORK NOT NEEDED, OR NOT EVEN DOING HALF THE WORK, AND BILLING THE HOURS AND THE SERVICE ADVISORS AND OWNERS ACTING AS IF THEY DONT KNOW WHATS GOING ON, BECAUSE THEIR MAKING MONEY... PLEASE MAKE A VIDEO ON THAT... BUT WATCHING ALL THAT, MADE ME OPEN MY OWN SHOP
I think it comes down to your work ethics and dedication to your career. I am okay with either pay scale, but I prefer a salary. I work the same speed, quality, and maintain consistent productivity, regardless of what I'm paid. However, I understand that is not always the norm. I'm a very loyal person who will do what it takes to help the organization. I also place a great value on anything that has my name attached to it-no matter what it is! Great points Mike, bottom line is if you're honest and hard working, success and money will come and really are not a factor IMHO. I've worked both and enjoyed both. The shop will do what it takes to keep a good technician, but it takes work ethics to get it.
Been my experience the guys that turn 70+ hours a week doesn't do his comebacks. The shop hands those off to the "slow guy" because they shop depends on the 70hr guy to keep cranking work out. Guess who I am? Also been my experience shops don't want to charge for diagnostic work. Zero problem charging 5-7 hours for 4 struts and alignment that takes 2.5 hours but no way you can get paid 2 hours for a no-start. They dictate how long it should take to diag something. Usually the SA which isn't a tech or was last a tech 20 years ago decides whether you get paid. Say you should have figured it out faster. I say...here. YOU do it. Lets see YOU figure out the customers neighbors BIL wired up the radio to the CAN network. But swore NOTHING had been done to the car. I HATE flat-rate. If I'm on the clock i need to get paid.
I couldn't get an hourly to do more than 10%. Plus the hourly refused to do extra stuff around the shop. Not my job description. So just had to send them home or eventually fire them. I do flat rate now. Good people make 3 times as much a week. Plus I made more on flat rate. More I pay means more I made. They get shit right so they don't have to fix it for free. The hourlys were the shit work cause they thought shit work gave them job security cause they would get paid to redo shit. And they would screw on redo too. And yes I busted office people on porn sites and games.
Hybrid pay system. Large chains like Firestone pay this way. And I believe most franchised dealerships in the state as well. Especially in California where employees MUST be paid atleast California minimum wage for any hours that they are AT work, but not flagging work hours. This is known as "applied time". Most non-hourly dealerships techs don't have this issue since most will flag 40-50 hours a week assuming a constant flow of work at $22-24 an hour (twice CA minimum wage) since they are required to provide a majority of their own tools. Some independent repair shops will implement a salary guarantee on top of flagged hours to attempt to attract talent
QUALITY is the difference - the workforce is full of Quantity (no trade skills) - no one is equal (someone smarter/faster/stronger ect...) - GET rid of the minimum wage it has created a workforce of people who want to ruin businesses with sky high labor prices with no skills.
I have worked both flat rate and hourly and in my experience as long as there isnt a favoritism thing going on and the shop stays consistently busy, flat rate is great. But with hourly i like the consistency in pay...it makes it easier (for me) to budget my income and bills.
I'm flat rate and I'm constantly thinking about hours, .5 and .2 all day. I have google spreadsheet on my phone which I then check against our shop management system to keep them honest. Service advisors are allways selling me short. Pictures of the RO and estimate are a must
Yes! I work at an independent shop and I have to keep records of every job I do. It's not that the service guys are trying to cheat me, it's them not double checking the name on the ticket before it's closed out.
I think it would be best to start your career off hourly and learn the ropes and work on efficiency. Once you’ve mastered that, move on to flat rate (at a busy shop) and rake in the cash. As a shop owner, I think it would be the opposite. I would want the new guys on flat rate and then once they master the trade, I would want them on hourly.
Monte Stu unfortunately techs don’t usually get the choice. Most places are flat rate. I’ve been in the business for 15 years and only one place has paid me hourly. Decent pay but the work is crap, parts are crap. I’d rather be flat rate and put out quality than hourly and use autozone parts!
I worked in sales where my pay was pure commission. I hated it. I believe flat rate is like that, work you eat. If I had a shop I would pay a minimal base hourly rate, not minimum wage per se, maybe $6 an hour for showing up. Something the tech can take home regardless. It's a show of appreciation and value. That will be base then have the flat rate as the main pay. This way you own him/her during slow times and have him/her do none repair jobs but at the same time when they do repairs you pay them normal flat rate. Double the work for pay maybe but it can be a good motivator.
I'm an hourly technician but I came from a job at a junkyard where I was payed commission off the motors I pulled and I have to say you are right. Since I moved jobs to my hourly position I have noticed myself slowing down because why risk rushing and screwing something up for the same amount of money just to have my boss get upset with me
FIRST THING FIRST shop / dealership reputation is super super important .The biggest problem with flat rate is the warranty times from dealerships and the shop seems to forget that it's the shops responsibility to get the work into the shop , I had great days and shit days as a dealership tech . Most shit days were because of lack of customers coming in the door . If you have customer flow and reputable people flat rate will never stop you from making money
How's that? If tech ain't making money then shop ain't? Tech has to make more for shop to make more. Shop is more or less a commission office employee in that scenario. Shop only gets paid for their office work when tech makes money. So if tech sitting waiting for a car the shop is off the clock doing office work for free. Flat rate is win/win. Hourly someone has to be the loser for the other to be the winner.
@@SgtJoeSmith flat rape is a win for the shop. Flat rate doesn't cover you for when a job goes sideways, econoline tune up and coil boots stick in the tubes........just an example
@@MrErikw26 so you come out ahead on 30 jobs and then fall little short on 1. It's called the law of averages. It's like the stock market. There's crashes but over all it keeps going up.
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@@SgtJoeSmith in what way is flat rate win/win? You must be management and not a tech
Dealer flat rate and private shop flat rate are completely different. There is no warranty time at a private shop. There are good and bad points of flat rate . I chose to leave the auto industry because it was stressful . Happiness is easier to find when you don’t have the flat rate gun pointed at your head.
I'm there to make every dollar I can make because any upsell I make I do it doesn't go to someone else they pay me a production rate to do those repairs I make alot of money from doing what I recommend we got one hourly guy that is always looking for somewhere to sit down be on his phone sit in his car all while on the clock and I've told the Forman that shit needs to stop
A hybrid system would make the most sense. Pay a tech a base amount and then add commission to get the move on. If a tech is making 20 bucks a flat rate hour what not pay 13 bucks an hour hourly and add commission percentage to make up the difference. It would keep techs from sweating bullets on slow days and then still get a move on when it’s busy.
We do that with the new techs something like $12 clock time plus $12 flag time. The ones thattill dont want to push a broom or clean shop if things slow down are my first pick for the axe.
If you want to make money as a technician go with flat rates, if you want to work for the shop go with hourly because when its busy in the shop your employers will want those cars done no matter if your flat rate or hourly technician.
Whatever happened to having a good work ethic no matter what compensation system is used? Maybe that all went out the window with good benefits, pensions, etc? Still, there is no excuse for being a hack.
If you are getting paid shitty and no benefits what's the incentive to work hard? You get what you pay for. There's a big difference between an apprentice and a journeyman. You wouldn't pay a journeyman apprentice rate would you? If you are a hack the clearly you never cared in the first place.
I like the way my shop does it. We get an hourly wage BUT every labor hour billed we get a commission so there is security & the drive to bill hours. I do find though hourly get the BS jobs nobody wants & the flat rate guys mop up all the gravy,
Great video Mike and yes I’m sure this is going to stir some stuff up lol. I’ve been flat rate all my career so I don’t know what it’s like to be hourly. Like Mario said I’m concerned with how my body is going to treat me in the following years due to amount of work I tell it to produce
Thanks for the video FRM. Question how do you come up with a quote for a custom? I take 1.3 x1.5 for the hourly rate when working on a skid loader, excavator, or any pice of heavy equipment. its an outdoor power equipment 1.3x1.3 for the rate.
@@flatratemaster Sorry my question came out wrong. How do you guys come up with your flat rate? I know that every Auto maker has one. Do you go by that? For example Chevy say it takes. .7 to do an alternator on a 2015 Silverado 5.3. How would you come up with the rate for a 2000 Silverado with a 5.3? Let's say from the rust belt? Or do you have a chart for that?
As you said (hourly - don't matter) where the UNION MAN mentality been around way tooo many of them. They will not work until precisely 7:30AM on the dot (then say that is that not my job). At end of day they are the FIRST one out the door, totally worthless (workforce is loaded with them). I think FLAT RATE should be more standard (the LOSS of productivity and laziness today is ridiculous). ✔
I completely disagree with you flat rate master on the issue of quality of work btw flat rate and hourly. Take the Rust nation or belt in New England for example where to do a brake job the right way, you'll need to spend that extra hour or so to clean the caliper brackets, hubs, sliding pins of salt build up etc. MOST Flat rates don't spend that extra time to do the job right bcuz they are thinking about the next job that's coming in. So the QUALITY and NOT quantity of work you'll get from an hourly technician or mechanic is far SUPERIOR to that of flat rate, PERIOD.
I agree. The rust up here in northern ny makes many simple jobs turn into nightmares really fast. There is no way a flate rate guy is going to spend the extra time he should spend to do the job correctly if hes on fr system. The rust belt is a whole other ball game
I live up in the rust belt, honestly we charge more for labor when we see somethings gonna take awhile to do right. It’s up to us to spot those things and get the correct labor before we sell the job. Check if the slide pins move, calipers stick etc. prevents you wanting to cut corners
We dont have the flat rate system in Sweden, Almost all techs have a fixed monthly paycheck but some dealers have a bonus system to encourage techs to be more efficient. How many hours do the average tech sell each day in US?
I work for a Toyota Dealer and good motivated techs sell about 15 -20 hours a day. But there are only a few that do that in my shop, out of about 40 techs
We are payed hourly, but my job being a fleet based, my bosses prefer to pay us hourly. Especially with the amount of OT myself and the other tech accumulate over the pay period. But that is just my employer.
What you forgot is that flat rate tech is supposed to get over time if your in shop over 40 hours, let's say you worked 48 hours and billed 60, your supposed to get 8 hours over time .. You can fight and say no I'm wrong, but do some research you'll be shocked. Per Florida labor laws you get paid for overtime even on salary and hourly, your supposed to get paid overtime if u work over 40 hours a week..
Different states have different laws. The dealer I used to work for used a loop hole law to get around paying people overtime because there’s a law stating that “garagemen” don’t need to be compensated with overtime pay from the early 1900’s.
I have a question. I am a Lube tech at a Toyota Dealer and am looking to move onto flat rate. I am recommending things that are going to the main shop techs, brakes, flushes, alignments, valve cover gaskets etc. I sold a steering rack and spark plugs, and front brakes on a V6 Avalon on Saturday. That was a 10 hour job that came out of express. I am getting paid 12$ hourly as a Lube tech. I have acquired alot of tools from the time I started to now, which isa around 2 years (Mostly Matco).The director will not move me over to the main shop, due to me not being able to diag and due to me being very valuable in Express, due to the fact I get the cars in and out. I really enjoy working with this Dealer, but I have gotten an offer to go to a smaller Toyota Dealer and 16$ Flat rate. I would rather stay at this dealer because of the amount of cars that come in the shop. My question is, how do I learn more about diag if I am constantly changing oil, rotating tires, and sending MultiPoints back to the advisors?
You need to take the time to learn these things on your own. Nobody in the shop is going to really help you out unless you have a decent foreman. Go check out Scanner Danner here on TH-cam and buy his book. You’ll learn quite a bit from him. Also, don’t just jump ship from your dealer if you’re happy there. The other Toyota dealer may be offering you that $16 an hour flat rate, but they may not have the work load your current dealer does. Study, learn, and absorb information from the right people. You don’t want to be a parts changer like most flat rate techs are.
You can also look into automotive programs offered from community colleges in your area and take some classes on electricity and engine performance. Those two things are what will separate you from everyone else. Check out Scanner Danner Also, get your Toyota online courses done so you can go to electrical class at your local region.
Does your dealership offer online classes for Toyota? Does your dealership have an on site mentorship program? TH-cam videos by Scanner Danner and the South Main Auto shop are excellent tutorials. Eric the Car Guy has a list of how to videos also.
@@CopCat34 We do have online modules and I am taking them. After you take the prerequisites, you can go down to the Toyota University to get hands on training and diagnostics. The thing is, there are techs in the shop that are waiting to go as well. I havent obtained any of my ASE certs yet. My dealer does not have any type of mentoring program for us express techs because team leaders would need to step in and be the mentor. They do not do it because they dont get paid extra for it. I work for a corporate dealer, so they dont really care about the low man, only their bottom line. I am already subbed to SOuth Main Auto and Eric the car guy and those guys taught me how to do brake jobs lol, along with the toyota online modules. I did a brake job on a sunday, because we are open, and no issues, and it was my first one. I am also starting to do alignments, tires and tire repairs. That is easy stuff though. I want to dive into the flushes, brakes, valve cover gaskets, plugs, steering racks, axles, wheel bearings, along with diag nosing check engine lights and basic customer concerns. Maybe one day
@@thatmechanicguy8773 Thanks for the info, yeah I am slacking when it comes to the electrical, it is the toughest part for me. Any tips? Are you a Toyota Tech? I will also check out Scanner Danners channel, and thanks.
FRM you have hands on experience and you are straight forward and honest, so i thinkthose who might not agree still respect your opinion. I respect your opinion and enjoy your channell
Great video thanks brother. I have never worked flat rate. I have worked for an independent company and a large company. There is a big difference between the two. Both payed overtime after 40 state law. Keep up the great work see you in the next video thanks again brother. I will wait for part two don't want to get to far into it yet.
When it's slow- You got time to lean, you got time to clean. I don't get the mindset of some flat rate guys. If you've billed 50 hours but it was 35 hours actual time, there's no reason to not take the time to sweep up your bays and do some cleaning.
At least in my area hourly never pays anywhere close to flat wage per hour. Also the mentality of I have x number of lifts I want a tech on each to turn work in and out regardless of actual work available to keep said techs busy is common. Crappy management in my opinion. Treatment of employees like a number is not good business practice. You should discuss how hourly or salary employees effect flat rate techs. I see this often with parts. They order wrong one or whatever and customer is there and so is the flat rate techs. Guess who loses the customer and the tech. No repercussions for parts employee. IMHO the mistake on the parts employee....lost time for both customer and tech should come out of parts pocket. It would stop.....real quick.
I really dont understand managers that will tolerate unproductive flat rate employees it makes no sense to me, basically shows they have 0 drive and are not motivatable at all.
Wow what a minefield To me it comes down to the manager Worked at one shop as I got faster the hours kept getting less Pull a raditor on a 379 long nose 7 hours first time out when i left it was down to 2 1/2 That was diag,verify, R&R raditor,transfer parts ,fill ,bleed air ,test drive Talk about moving the field goal poles Like I said MINEFIELD here step any where on this subject and your gonna get blown up by others LOL!!!
Flaterate is way more EFFICIENT/CONSISTENT and one has to do it RIGHT - or you will not be working there long and/or working for FREE fixing everything coming back. No way one could be 'hacking' on jobs and be around anywhere period - it would catch up with you and NO one would hire you.
@ If you watched the video it is very clear he addressed the 'quality' issue and if you work flat rate. EVERYONE who owns a business (construction doing concrete, is FLAT RATE). As they are NOT paid until the job is complete and customer is happy with the work. So your bogus statement talking about 'brake jobs' is not even accurate, much less they are not going to be giving this out to guys with SKILL SETS. This is not a fast food joint....
Nope,, I am in a studio, not even a tech, oh wait, I work as a tech, manage a shop with 5 other techs, offer support to those techs as needed and am still paid flat rate on cars I repair Here is some timelapse videos of me working on cars th-cam.com/video/Cl_car8dqls/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/Cl_car8dqls/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/mDgUxOVedyg/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/TNM6PMXUBg4/w-d-xo.html Here is a video of a day in my life at the shop th-cam.com/video/y2twWsLP34c/w-d-xo.html Here is a video in the style of another channel th-cam.com/video/qjr3_nrtOtg/w-d-xo.html And here is a video I made just for people like you th-cam.com/video/iK1gnHIDx_4/w-d-xo.html
I'm flat rate/commission how ever you want to put it. I do like it I make more money with it, yes I just my ass for it but I would not want hourly. I will say it is because of flat rate there is not a lot of new techs coming into the industry. My thoughts anyways.
No. When a recall pays 1.7 hrs to replace 4 door locks vs cp pay is 1.5 hrs per lock. Or warranty pays 11.1 hrs to replace pistons on direct injected, turbocharged engine. Includes installing piston rings and swapping pistons on the connecting rods. Fuck that shit!
We have a production system in place. Anything 40 and over we get our Max rate, anything under 40 we drop to double minimum wage. In California double minimum is $24 an hour, so not too bad. But it cost a crap ton to live here...
If I'm semi skilled with my own tools, am I entitled to double minimum in LA? I've gotten offered $13 an hour with my own tools at various Honda dealers.... Any clarification on the law would be much appreciated because I want to be paid adequately and the law is worded in a way that can be easily misconstrued
Just add a line to the rate book. Make it pay enough hours and guys will be fighting over who gets to clean the can. Snappy will come out with a $500 Mictolithium toilet brush to make you more efficient. :)
I think the point is that there are options, for both tech and owner. Figure out what works best for both and what makes everyone profit. There is no Golden answer. Skill level, shop specialty, demographics all play a part.
I made the switch from hourly to flat rate and it was the best thing I could have done. I left the small shop that always cried when the had to buy specialist tools even though they loved to advertise they were specialist in all makes. When you talk I 100% understand where your coming... 100% how it is! To me it's like this Flat rate = Feast or Famine. Luckily our dealer is very busy and it's a buffet at least 3-4 days a week .Since then I doubled my net pay, learnt how to work better, faster , cleaner, added a whole shit load of new tools and equipment and I go to training every 3 months, I am a better technician because of this.I feel that I am finally in control as a flat rate technician , like I'm my own boss, my hard work directly affects my pay check. Honestly who works like its flat rate when you get paid hourly? Nobody, why would you? Why would you work faster, buy that special tool to do the job faster, so that you can make the same amount at the end of the week. The dealerships is where the action is. I love coming home from a 8 hour shift and making 30, it makes those days that you only made 5 a faint memory. Keep the vids rolling brother. I'd like to see more videos of what's happening in the shop type videos...
Good points sir. I work in a oem diesel truck shop, I'm paid hourly with a monthly productivity bonus. I've worked about every pay scale there is, hourly with a billed hours productivity bonus works best for me. In the slow times, you have your hourly pay, you're not stressing about your paycheck, in the busy times you have incentive to be productive and make a nice bonus above your hourly wage, for someone like me who is flat rate minded, it works best. In the 9 months of last year I worked for this company, my lowest month was my 1st month with the company, 86% efficient, next lowest month was December at 96%, all other months were over 100% efficiency. Love the videos, keep up the great work, can't wait for part 2!
One problem I have seen in my area is that flat rate work creates categories of work that are profitable and other categories that are not. To that end you see shops here that will not work on certain makes or years of vehicles. For example, I know of a shop in the area that will not work on vehicles more than 10 years old. The rust and general decay kills the profit on those vehicles and the only way to keep the mechanics happy is to give them newer/easier vehicles. That can be bad for a shop owner. No one likes to turn work away, especially if it's a fleet customer or long time customer who happens to have a older/odder/European/large/small/etc vehicle. You almost need a hybrid system.
I used to be straight flat rate at a small dealership. The cash jobs were very easy money in contrast to the warranty work. Things became really ugly, really fast when the service manager (delegates the repair orders) hired his son as a tech. The son basically rode the gravy train on biscuit wheels with reduced working hours among other perks that were exclusive to the father/son team while the rest of the techs did oil changes and ball busting warranty. The solution was to pack it up and find a better place to work. Every interview I went on started with "do any of the service manager's relatives work as techs?". I am now working flat rate with a 40hr guarantee somewhere better. For me, this is the best of both worlds as I dont have to worry about the slow seasons and can still profit from the busy periods.
Remember, techs communicate best with their feet AND toolboxes have wheels for a reason.
Your average flate rate tech doesn't do 125 percent productivity. If you look across the industry it's an average of 90per
I worked flat rate for 10 years. My quality of work was my number 1 priority on any job I did. My billed hours weren't always as high as the flat rate guys who were butchers. The manager knew this and for that reason I made more per billed hour. Why he kept the butchers is what I always wondered. Used to piss me off. Great discussion. Love your channel.
Great video! I look forward to part 2! I have yet to see an hourly tech that can outperform me. There may be some out there, but I haven't seen one. I have learned to manage my time and my environment to be as productive as possible. Flat rate hacks piss me off. They give all of us a bad reputation. I take pride in my work and I don't like seeing comebacks!
FLAT RATE is great for self-motivated, always learning, CONSISTENT (NO NEED for someone to TELL them to work). IF someone owns a business (individual - who does construction/painting/repairs/ect...
I'm a heavy equipment tech that works on construction and steel mill equipment so flat rate wouldn't work for me because on some jobs it literally takes me two days of cleaning to be able to get to a 2 hour job . Ive also been called out on electrical nightmares on huge machines like Cat 992s, Kawasaki 135s where mill mechanics have worked on them that don't know what their doing and don't care . They cut wires, hook thing up wrong or splice into random wires and I'm the one that has to figure out the electrical problem that now doesn't relate to a factory schematic.
I was a flat rate shop foreman at a Toyota dealer for a few years. There was a bonus for being the foreman. Made decent money. Lots of stress, drama, and competition between fellow workers. When working there I saw lots of lazy prima-donna techs that had chips on their shoulders about doing certain jobs. There were a bunch of hacks and rip off artists as well. Management didn’t care because these “hacks” and “rip off artists” flagged the most hours every week. I couldn’t take it anymore.
I left the dealer and went to heavy equipment/diesel. I’m hourly now, making the same I did flagging a 50-60 hour work week on flat rate consistently.
Every single guy in the shop here pulls his weight and nobody is lazy. I’m a firm believer that happiness has much more to do with work ethic than pay incentives. When the workers are happy and aren’t stressed about what their pay check is going to look like, they can concentrate on fixing the equipment or vehicle properly. Flat rate needs to go away.
Years ago I worked in a motor pool for a large company. We got paid by the hour and if we exceeded a certain level of production, we got what they called "piece work pay". I was the low man on a team of 4 and if I got lazy or careless, that team would transfer me to an F-troup team. It was the best of both worlds as we all worked hard and made about 30-40% more on top of our hourly pay.
At the shop I work at currently we are hourly employee’s and my co worker has done nothing but work the flat rate system and my boss tends to tell me about how different me and him are as workers. He is much faster paced than me but he tends to break a lot of parts and some times leaves bolts loose on accident. Where with me since I’ve never worked anything but hourly so I may take a bit longer, i tend to be more thorough and I’ll be easier on things even if it takes longer just so I don’t break them.
I agree with a large majority of what you have said, Mike. You have made good points. The one thing I'd like to say though, is that I do think if youre in a shop with a large amount of diag work. You should probably be hourly with an incentive plan.
My personal opinion from working in both hourly and flat rate. Looking at the majority of technicians I have worked with, someone working hourly is going to give more attention to detail, whereas the flat rate guy is going to learn shortcuts after a while which may or may not lead to come-backs, but it does lead to treating a customer's vehicle more like a number than it does treating it like an actual human being's vehicle.
We've tried different pay plans. Currently we all agreed on 50/50. We get paid 50% rate per worked hour, 50% per billed hour. It works great for us
When I was hourly at NTB I was at 40 percent efficiency. Simply due to the low volume. I'm flat rate now at Jag Rover, and 115 percent efficiency.
Hard to make good efficiency when no one comes in because the whole town knows the shop is a joke.
Iv done both but if do individual they pay most by hour....like 18 wheelers or equipment
It all depends on the technician and the shop. I’m an alignment/suspension technician at a body shop in a small town and hourly works great for me and my boss. On the other hand, the body techs are flat rate and it works great for them.
Great video. I started hourly and moved to flat rate. The work ethic (quality) you see in a hourly tech will be close to what you will see in a flat rate technician. The shop foreman / shop manager needs to stress quality work. And quality work should be rewarded. A hack is a hack all day long. It is up to management to pay for quality work and walk through the shop making sure the work is being done to manufacture’s standards / specifications. Fire the hacks because they hurt technicians who care about quality work and a good paycheck.
I won't say flat rate creates hacks, I learned to work more efficiently in flat rate. My opinion is that the key differences between the two is body damage, and training. Flat rate is motivation to get the move on, usually at the cost of the premature fatigue of your own body. Plus of course a strictly flat rate pay system won't pay you to help and teach other technicians. So I'm for salary 😉 just my two cents
Super Mario Diagnostics your absolutely right Mario and in my situation I’m flat rate and the shop Forman. I need to feed my family but how do I do that when I lose money to help other guys? It’s a double edge sword. I will help anyone but it definitely makes it cut throat. I’ve worked with great techs and you get two top guys together that are flat rate it can also create a tone of issue due to the competition. Take that same guy and put him in another location where they don’t work together in the same shop and they are best friends. Not to mention your body 🤬 my body is tore up and makes me think what the hell am I going to be doing in 5 years. I can’t work like this forever and unfortunately in Tucson I can’t find a shop that I can make what I feel I’m worth without it being flat rate. Your shop seems to understand man and they found you so that’s awesome and wish they’re more shops that see that.
Cody’s Auto diagnostics you're absolutely right about the tech competition/friendship. Spot on, to me shop environment goes much further than flag hours.
@@codysautodiagnosticsprogra8706 I agree. I'm also flat rate and the shop foreman who dispatches. I feel like I'd make substantially more money if I went back to just being a flat rate tech. It's hard dealing with the stress being a shop foreman.
Voltage Drop Diagnostics yeah exactly. The stress sometimes isn’t worth it!
I was in a shop where they switched to flat rate and the techs were making too much and switched him back. Flat rate is good for jobs that you perform all the time and get better at and faster. Ie you don’t have to remove certain thing just loosen and move out of the way, or a better way to get at the bolt in bad place. There are pros and cons to each. Great vid stay off that doodle jump just concentrate on getting that poop out.
Our field techs are required 100% efficiency or above. Quarterly efficiency bonuses
GOOD JOB EXPLAINING THOSE DIFFERENCES, COMING FROM BEING FLAT RATE MASTER TECH JUST LIKE YOU … I SEEN GREAT TECHNICIANS THAT WERE FLAT RATE AND PUMPING GOOD HONEST HOURS, AND SCAMMING HACK FLAT RATE TECHNICIANS SELLING WORK NOT NEEDED, OR NOT EVEN DOING HALF THE WORK, AND BILLING THE HOURS AND THE SERVICE ADVISORS AND OWNERS ACTING AS IF THEY DONT KNOW WHATS GOING ON, BECAUSE THEIR MAKING MONEY... PLEASE MAKE A VIDEO ON THAT... BUT WATCHING ALL THAT, MADE ME OPEN MY OWN SHOP
I think it comes down to your work ethics and dedication to your career. I am okay with either pay scale, but I prefer a salary. I work the same speed, quality, and maintain consistent productivity, regardless of what I'm paid.
However, I understand that is not always the norm. I'm a very loyal person who will do what it takes to help the organization. I also place a great value on anything that has my name attached to it-no matter what it is!
Great points Mike, bottom line is if you're honest and hard working, success and money will come and really are not a factor IMHO. I've worked both and enjoyed both. The shop will do what it takes to keep a good technician, but it takes work ethics to get it.
Been my experience the guys that turn 70+ hours a week doesn't do his comebacks. The shop hands those off to the "slow guy" because they shop depends on the 70hr guy to keep cranking work out. Guess who I am? Also been my experience shops don't want to charge for diagnostic work. Zero problem charging 5-7 hours for 4 struts and alignment that takes 2.5 hours but no way you can get paid 2 hours for a no-start. They dictate how long it should take to diag something. Usually the SA which isn't a tech or was last a tech 20 years ago decides whether you get paid. Say you should have figured it out faster. I say...here. YOU do it. Lets see YOU figure out the customers neighbors BIL wired up the radio to the CAN network. But swore NOTHING had been done to the car. I HATE flat-rate. If I'm on the clock i need to get paid.
I couldn't get an hourly to do more than 10%. Plus the hourly refused to do extra stuff around the shop. Not my job description. So just had to send them home or eventually fire them. I do flat rate now. Good people make 3 times as much a week. Plus I made more on flat rate. More I pay means more I made. They get shit right so they don't have to fix it for free. The hourlys were the shit work cause they thought shit work gave them job security cause they would get paid to redo shit. And they would screw on redo too. And yes I busted office people on porn sites and games.
Hybrid pay system. Large chains like Firestone pay this way. And I believe most franchised dealerships in the state as well. Especially in California where employees MUST be paid atleast California minimum wage for any hours that they are AT work, but not flagging work hours. This is known as "applied time". Most non-hourly dealerships techs don't have this issue since most will flag 40-50 hours a week assuming a constant flow of work at $22-24 an hour (twice CA minimum wage) since they are required to provide a majority of their own tools. Some independent repair shops will implement a salary guarantee on top of flagged hours to attempt to attract talent
QUALITY is the difference - the workforce is full of Quantity (no trade skills) - no one is equal (someone smarter/faster/stronger ect...) - GET rid of the minimum wage it has created a workforce of people who want to ruin businesses with sky high labor prices with no skills.
I have worked both flat rate and hourly and in my experience as long as there isnt a favoritism thing going on and the shop stays consistently busy, flat rate is great. But with hourly i like the consistency in pay...it makes it easier (for me) to budget my income and bills.
I'm flat rate and I'm constantly thinking about hours, .5 and .2 all day. I have google spreadsheet on my phone which I then check against our shop management system to keep them honest. Service advisors are allways selling me short. Pictures of the RO and estimate are a must
You have to track your hours. The cashier and service advisor will short change you almost each pay period.
LoL I see techs complaining about that all the time. You must work at a Dealer
Only way to do it
Yes! I work at an independent shop and I have to keep records of every job I do. It's not that the service guys are trying to cheat me, it's them not double checking the name on the ticket before it's closed out.
Sounds like you need to grease your boxes wheels
I think it would be best to start your career off hourly and learn the ropes and work on efficiency. Once you’ve mastered that, move on to flat rate (at a busy shop) and rake in the cash. As a shop owner, I think it would be the opposite. I would want the new guys on flat rate and then once they master the trade, I would want them on hourly.
Monte Stu unfortunately techs don’t usually get the choice. Most places are flat rate. I’ve been in the business for 15 years and only one place has paid me hourly. Decent pay but the work is crap, parts are crap. I’d rather be flat rate and put out quality than hourly and use autozone parts!
I agree, no one should be thrown to the wolves starting out
I worked in sales where my pay was pure commission. I hated it. I believe flat rate is like that, work you eat. If I had a shop I would pay a minimal base hourly rate, not minimum wage per se, maybe $6 an hour for showing up. Something the tech can take home regardless. It's a show of appreciation and value. That will be base then have the flat rate as the main pay. This way you own him/her during slow times and have him/her do none repair jobs but at the same time when they do repairs you pay them normal flat rate. Double the work for pay maybe but it can be a good motivator.
I'm an hourly technician but I came from a job at a junkyard where I was payed commission off the motors I pulled and I have to say you are right. Since I moved jobs to my hourly position I have noticed myself slowing down because why risk rushing and screwing something up for the same amount of money just to have my boss get upset with me
Boss makes a dollar and I make a dime thing!
Never heard that one
I had to pause the vid to crack up!!!
Very funnee!!
If you're hourly and have good productivity it time to demand flat rate pay!
FIRST THING FIRST shop / dealership reputation is super super important .The biggest problem with flat rate is the warranty times from dealerships and the shop seems to forget that it's the shops responsibility to get the work into the shop , I had great days and shit days as a dealership tech . Most shit days were because of lack of customers coming in the door . If you have customer flow and reputable people flat rate will never stop you from making money
Flat rate benefits the shop at the expense of the technician
How's that? If tech ain't making money then shop ain't? Tech has to make more for shop to make more. Shop is more or less a commission office employee in that scenario. Shop only gets paid for their office work when tech makes money. So if tech sitting waiting for a car the shop is off the clock doing office work for free.
Flat rate is win/win. Hourly someone has to be the loser for the other to be the winner.
@@SgtJoeSmith flat rape is a win for the shop. Flat rate doesn't cover you for when a job goes sideways, econoline tune up and coil boots stick in the tubes........just an example
@@MrErikw26 so you come out ahead on 30 jobs and then fall little short on 1. It's called the law of averages. It's like the stock market. There's crashes but over all it keeps going up.
@@SgtJoeSmith in what way is flat rate win/win? You must be management and not a tech
@ nope. Tech that gets shit done and makes twice than I would hourly
You can keep your flat rate system!
I've done both. If paid for what he or she is worth, I believe hourly is better
Dealer flat rate and private shop flat rate are completely different. There is no warranty time at a private shop. There are good and bad points of flat rate . I chose to leave the auto industry because it was stressful . Happiness is easier to find when you don’t have the flat rate gun pointed at your head.
I'm there to make every dollar I can make because any upsell I make I do it doesn't go to someone else they pay me a production rate to do those repairs I make alot of money from doing what I recommend we got one hourly guy that is always looking for somewhere to sit down be on his phone sit in his car all while on the clock and I've told the Forman that shit needs to stop
A hybrid system would make the most sense. Pay a tech a base amount and then add commission to get the move on. If a tech is making 20 bucks a flat rate hour what not pay 13 bucks an hour hourly and add commission percentage to make up the difference. It would keep techs from sweating bullets on slow days and then still get a move on when it’s busy.
zack mcclain that is California law. We get $24 hourly. But we have a flat rate of $40. So they pay the difference in a bonus.
@@floppycoc1046 exactly. You must work at a dealership?
Lotta truck stops are like that also
We do that with the new techs something like $12 clock time plus $12 flag time. The ones thattill dont want to push a broom or clean shop if things slow down are my first pick for the axe.
I tried that. No one ever made more than base. They do bare minimum work for minimum base and go home. Flat rate is the way to go.
The flat rate system would be awesome if shops would give the tech 50% of the labor. That would fix the industry.
The shop I am at charges $115 per labor hour, I get $27 of that... 67.50 would be much more fair... considering im doing the damn work.
If you want to make money as a technician go with flat rates, if you want to work for the shop go with hourly because when its busy in the shop your employers will want those cars done no matter if your flat rate or hourly technician.
Whatever happened to having a good work ethic no matter what compensation system is used? Maybe that all went out the window with good benefits, pensions, etc? Still, there is no excuse for being a hack.
Makes me wonder what it will be like when minimum wage is $15 an hour 🙁
@@Raylude5 Its coming, seems to be inevitable. What will shops do, that is the question?
If you are getting paid shitty and no benefits what's the incentive to work hard? You get what you pay for. There's a big difference between an apprentice and a journeyman. You wouldn't pay a journeyman apprentice rate would you? If you are a hack the clearly you never cared in the first place.
What about salaried employees with productivity bonuses? Common in other industries, is it ever used in the auto repair world?
It is, hourly with some type of bonus
I like the way my shop does it. We get an hourly wage BUT every labor hour billed we get a commission so there is security & the drive to bill hours. I do find though hourly get the BS jobs nobody wants & the flat rate guys mop up all the gravy,
Good video, gives the big picture view which I think a lot of tech's forget as they get older
Great video Mike and yes I’m sure this is going to stir some stuff up lol. I’ve been flat rate all my career so I don’t know what it’s like to be hourly. Like Mario said I’m concerned with how my body is going to treat me in the following years due to amount of work I tell it to produce
Thanks for the video FRM.
Question how do you come up with a quote for a custom?
I take 1.3 x1.5 for the hourly rate when working on a skid loader, excavator, or any pice of heavy equipment. its an outdoor power equipment 1.3x1.3 for the rate.
Don't do any custom work, sorry
@@flatratemaster
Sorry my question came out wrong.
How do you guys come up with your flat rate? I know that every Auto maker has one. Do you go by that?
For example Chevy say it takes. .7 to do an alternator on a 2015 Silverado 5.3.
How would you come up with the rate for a 2000 Silverado with a 5.3? Let's say from the rust belt?
Or do you have a chart for that?
As you said (hourly - don't matter) where the UNION MAN mentality been around way tooo many of them. They will not work until precisely 7:30AM on the dot (then say that is that not my job). At end of day they are the FIRST one out the door, totally worthless (workforce is loaded with them). I think FLAT RATE should be more standard (the LOSS of productivity and laziness today is ridiculous). ✔
I completely disagree with you flat rate master on the issue of quality of work btw flat rate and hourly. Take the Rust nation or belt in New England for example where to do a brake job the right way, you'll need to spend that extra hour or so to clean the caliper brackets, hubs, sliding pins of salt build up etc. MOST Flat rates don't spend that extra time to do the job right bcuz they are thinking about the next job that's coming in. So the QUALITY and NOT quantity of work you'll get from an hourly technician or mechanic is far SUPERIOR to that of flat rate, PERIOD.
I agree. The rust up here in northern ny makes many simple jobs turn into nightmares really fast. There is no way a flate rate guy is going to spend the extra time he should spend to do the job correctly if hes on fr system. The rust belt is a whole other ball game
You are generalizing man. I have seen hack work performed in both flat rate shops and hourly shops.
I live up in the rust belt, honestly we charge more for labor when we see somethings gonna take awhile to do right. It’s up to us to spot those things and get the correct labor before we sell the job. Check if the slide pins move, calipers stick etc. prevents you wanting to cut corners
This is where the shop owner ADDS time to the Work order for these Maintenance items. That time translates into more pay.
If it technician gladly accepts warranty work best thing to do is not ask any questions ......
I don’t know a single garage in the uk that’s flat rate.
No it is a North American thing, US and Canada
We dont have the flat rate system in Sweden, Almost all techs have a fixed monthly paycheck but some dealers have a bonus system to encourage techs to be more efficient. How many hours do the average tech sell each day in US?
Our garage is the same. Over 80% productive we get a bonus every extra hour we sell
@@chrisoldman6674 Okey, So its about the same ;) dealer techs here avarage about 70% and independent shops around 60% according to a study in 2018.
But if you do solid work with as few comebacks as possible you surely can negotiate your wage?
I work for a Toyota Dealer and good motivated techs sell about 15 -20 hours a day. But there are only a few that do that in my shop, out of about 40 techs
I expect 10 to 12 hours per tech at the shop, doesn't always happen
We are payed hourly, but my job being a fleet based, my bosses prefer to pay us hourly. Especially with the amount of OT myself and the other tech accumulate over the pay period. But that is just my employer.
What you forgot is that flat rate tech is supposed to get over time if your in shop over 40 hours, let's say you worked 48 hours and billed 60, your supposed to get 8 hours over time .. You can fight and say no I'm wrong, but do some research you'll be shocked. Per Florida labor laws you get paid for overtime even on salary and hourly, your supposed to get paid overtime if u work over 40 hours a week..
Different states have different laws. The dealer I used to work for used a loop hole law to get around paying people overtime because there’s a law stating that “garagemen” don’t need to be compensated with overtime pay from the early 1900’s.
I have a question. I am a Lube tech at a Toyota Dealer and am looking to move onto flat rate. I am recommending things that are going to the main shop techs, brakes, flushes, alignments, valve cover gaskets etc. I sold a steering rack and spark plugs, and front brakes on a V6 Avalon on Saturday. That was a 10 hour job that came out of express. I am getting paid 12$ hourly as a Lube tech. I have acquired alot of tools from the time I started to now, which isa around 2 years (Mostly Matco).The director will not move me over to the main shop, due to me not being able to diag and due to me being very valuable in Express, due to the fact I get the cars in and out. I really enjoy working with this Dealer, but I have gotten an offer to go to a smaller Toyota Dealer and 16$ Flat rate. I would rather stay at this dealer because of the amount of cars that come in the shop. My question is, how do I learn more about diag if I am constantly changing oil, rotating tires, and sending MultiPoints back to the advisors?
You need to take the time to learn these things on your own. Nobody in the shop is going to really help you out unless you have a decent foreman. Go check out Scanner Danner here on TH-cam and buy his book. You’ll learn quite a bit from him. Also, don’t just jump ship from your dealer if you’re happy there. The other Toyota dealer may be offering you that $16 an hour flat rate, but they may not have the work load your current dealer does. Study, learn, and absorb information from the right people. You don’t want to be a parts changer like most flat rate techs are.
You can also look into automotive programs offered from community colleges in your area and take some classes on electricity and engine performance. Those two things are what will separate you from everyone else.
Check out Scanner Danner
Also, get your Toyota online courses done so you can go to electrical class at your local region.
Does your dealership offer online classes for Toyota? Does your dealership have an on site mentorship program? TH-cam videos by Scanner Danner and the South Main Auto shop are excellent tutorials. Eric the Car Guy has a list of how to videos also.
@@CopCat34 We do have online modules and I am taking them. After you take the prerequisites, you can go down to the Toyota University to get hands on training and diagnostics. The thing is, there are techs in the shop that are waiting to go as well. I havent obtained any of my ASE certs yet. My dealer does not have any type of mentoring program for us express techs because team leaders would need to step in and be the mentor. They do not do it because they dont get paid extra for it. I work for a corporate dealer, so they dont really care about the low man, only their bottom line. I am already subbed to SOuth Main Auto and Eric the car guy and those guys taught me how to do brake jobs lol, along with the toyota online modules. I did a brake job on a sunday, because we are open, and no issues, and it was my first one. I am also starting to do alignments, tires and tire repairs. That is easy stuff though. I want to dive into the flushes, brakes, valve cover gaskets, plugs, steering racks, axles, wheel bearings, along with diag nosing check engine lights and basic customer concerns. Maybe one day
@@thatmechanicguy8773 Thanks for the info, yeah I am slacking when it comes to the electrical, it is the toughest part for me. Any tips? Are you a Toyota Tech? I will also check out Scanner Danners channel, and thanks.
thanks for showing us both sides
swr
I love these 10 minute rants/videos.
FRM you have hands on experience and you are straight forward and honest, so i thinkthose who might not agree still respect your opinion. I respect your opinion and enjoy your channell
As a shop owner I'd want my techs to be focused on doing the job right, and not be tempted to hack....
salary or hourly is best if your paid well
Great video thanks brother. I have never worked flat rate. I have worked for an independent company and a large company. There is a big difference between the two. Both payed overtime after 40 state law. Keep up the great work see you in the next video thanks again brother.
I will wait for part two don't want to get to far into it yet.
When it's slow- You got time to lean, you got time to clean.
I don't get the mindset of some flat rate guys. If you've billed 50 hours but it was 35 hours actual time, there's no reason to not take the time to sweep up your bays and do some cleaning.
David Kanengieter “that’s not my job” is what I always hear.
On a slow day, i clean and organize my bays/tools, never got that standing in a nasty bay with no work
I could rant for days about the 'ain't my job' attitude guys.
Another great vid mike - answered some questions.
Nice👍. You should talk about the different types of overtime pay.
At least in my area hourly never pays anywhere close to flat wage per hour. Also the mentality of I have x number of lifts I want a tech on each to turn work in and out regardless of actual work available to keep said techs busy is common. Crappy management in my opinion. Treatment of employees like a number is not good business practice.
You should discuss how hourly or salary employees effect flat rate techs. I see this often with parts. They order wrong one or whatever and customer is there and so is the flat rate techs. Guess who loses the customer and the tech. No repercussions for parts employee. IMHO the mistake on the parts employee....lost time for both customer and tech should come out of parts pocket. It would stop.....real quick.
I really dont understand managers that will tolerate unproductive flat rate employees it makes no sense to me, basically shows they have 0 drive and are not motivatable at all.
Wow what a minefield
To me it comes down to the manager
Worked at one shop as I got faster the hours kept getting less
Pull a raditor on a 379 long nose 7 hours first time out when i left it was down to 2 1/2
That was diag,verify, R&R raditor,transfer parts ,fill ,bleed air ,test drive
Talk about moving the field goal poles
Like I said MINEFIELD here step any where on this subject and your gonna get blown up by others LOL!!!
Flaterate is way more EFFICIENT/CONSISTENT and one has to do it RIGHT - or you will not be working there long and/or working for FREE fixing everything coming back. No way one could be 'hacking' on jobs and be around anywhere period - it would catch up with you and NO one would hire you.
@ If you watched the video it is very clear he addressed the 'quality' issue and if you work flat rate. EVERYONE who owns a business (construction doing concrete, is FLAT RATE). As they are NOT paid until the job is complete and customer is happy with the work. So your bogus statement talking about 'brake jobs' is not even accurate, much less they are not going to be giving this out to guys with SKILL SETS.
This is not a fast food joint....
I'd play Gran Turismo on the Playstation 1 if I was the boss of the dealership. Just for one day lol. ;)
Would you please start sharing how many hours you run a week, after all , you are the flat rate master
50-60 is my guess
I billed 49.1 hrs last week
Let's just put this to bed..... There's hacks in any and every pay scale
Pro tip: do something else
I'm pissed off cuz of that stupid Matco hat lol
Hit or Miss Either Way They Both Have There Perks 👨🏼🔧🧰😀😊
8:24 yeah, I am spending my time watching The Flat Rate Master :D :D
I don't think this guy fixes anything. In not one video have I seen you working.
Nope,, I am in a studio, not even a tech, oh wait, I work as a tech, manage a shop with 5 other techs, offer support to those techs as needed and am still paid flat rate on cars I repair
Here is some timelapse videos of me working on cars
th-cam.com/video/Cl_car8dqls/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/Cl_car8dqls/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/mDgUxOVedyg/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/TNM6PMXUBg4/w-d-xo.html
Here is a video of a day in my life at the shop
th-cam.com/video/y2twWsLP34c/w-d-xo.html
Here is a video in the style of another channel
th-cam.com/video/qjr3_nrtOtg/w-d-xo.html
And here is a video I made just for people like you
th-cam.com/video/iK1gnHIDx_4/w-d-xo.html
I'm flat rate/commission how ever you want to put it. I do like it I make more money with it, yes I just my ass for it but I would not want hourly. I will say it is because of flat rate there is not a lot of new techs coming into the industry. My thoughts anyways.
Excellent video! !!!
hourly tech = got time to lean, got time to clean......lol
Nice topic mike. I would love to play doodle jump all day and get payed. #hourlydoodlejumppay
Great video
"incentivized"
Shop owner: large numbers and no call back
I thought some of that was funny. I get paid 8:00 to 5:00 but i maintain only are shop equipment. Im not fixing other peoples stuff.
Happy medium 😏. Commission
wanna know what creates hacks? when people with no pride start working.
I cant stand a hack do it right or don't do it at all
Then pay them properly . Flat rate should be illegal
No. When a recall pays 1.7 hrs to replace 4 door locks vs cp pay is 1.5 hrs per lock. Or warranty pays 11.1 hrs to replace pistons on direct injected, turbocharged engine. Includes installing piston rings and swapping pistons on the connecting rods. Fuck that shit!
We have a production system in place. Anything 40 and over we get our Max rate, anything under 40 we drop to double minimum wage. In California double minimum is $24 an hour, so not too bad. But it cost a crap ton to live here...
If I'm semi skilled with my own tools, am I entitled to double minimum in LA? I've gotten offered $13 an hour with my own tools at various Honda dealers.... Any clarification on the law would be much appreciated because I want to be paid adequately and the law is worded in a way that can be easily misconstrued
Flat rate cleaning the shiter at the shop 😂
Just add a line to the rate book. Make it pay enough hours and guys will be fighting over who gets to clean the can. Snappy will come out with a $500 Mictolithium toilet brush to make you more efficient. :)
I’m salary