@NDHFilms You say that like it hasn't ping-ponged back and forth with a lot of the material that's come out since then, especially the tv shows. "Same As It Never Was", anyone?
It's a really strange journey. It's super interesting me to that it started as a parody or a jab at pulpy bubblegum comics (Daredevil) of the time, taking anthropomorphic turtles and giving them a super serious 90's edge. Then it evolved to juxtapose ITSELF. Goofy, pizza loving non-violent turtles are beloved compared to the original murderous ones.
@@bryanc7094 1) You cant substitute "Gritty" with "Edgy". Edgy is quite literally defined as something that tries too hard to be dark and gritty. 2) Edginess did not die in the nineties. The mid 2000s were filled to the brim with edgy shlock as well. 3) U implying the OG tmnt was garbage? SMH
I remember being able to get in an argument with someone claiming that TMNT was a Japanese comic book series (probably because of them being released in black and white like manga), and I even asked them if they knew the names of the two men who created the Ninja Turtles, to which they told me it was "somebody Japanese", and they couldn't be more wrong. ;P
Eastman and Laird have always been one of the strangest contrasts in any creative industry, you have one who was okay with almost everything changed about their creation which made it so successful and the other is very resentful and hates what his creation has twisted into in different ways but regardless I think both men are in their own way dealing with the same scary thing for any creative individual, to become a footnote in the shadow of their creation, when it grows far beyond the ones who made it in the hands of others, its a massively bitter pill to swallow since you couldn't ask for a worst situation to cut your nose off to spite your face since you might not like it, but its success still contributes to your own.
Hate is a strong word to use for Peter though. I disliked alot of the early changes but realised he could keep his comics and still have franchise do other things. He headed a bunch of those multicolored headband turtle shows. Kevin on the otherhand seemed to have thought the tmnt was a stepping stone to other things, after a while he seamed tired of it and wanted to try other things but like the prodigal son he realised the grass isnt always greener and came back home.
Both of their thoughts about the direction that TMNT took make sense. I'm more of a fan of the dark, gritty, and more serious TMNT, because, to me, that's what TMNT is. This is why the original comics, 1990 movie, and 03 cartoon are easily the best things from TMNT in my opinion. It stays true to the original comics. But I see why one would want to go balls to the walls with licensing and expansion, and making things more kid friendly.
@@kaydee1485 thats true though when your doing interviews and make faces when the interviewer brings up the more successful versions of your creations, its understandable for US the audience to look at that as "hatred for the way things shaped out" and yeah he eventually got over it and made good on his legacy, but not after Several failed attempts at making something for himself land did he learn that hubris
@@KFXG honestly when you really think about it, this situation with TMNT parallels Teen Titans VS Teen Titans GO with the one being more creatively interesting and for older audiences while the other is a childish farce in comparison but is also a unarguably great financial success and it kinda puts in the same mindset of what was the bigger success? (not arguing quality on that one, just commercial success that might leave a creative unhappy it took off while the original languished by comparison)
I wasnt aware TMNT was an indie property. I can remember when I was 9 making a coloured TMNT comic with one of my friends, and bringing a new page to school every few days to work on with him. I think it's cool that two guys can create something so unique and inspiring that some kids at school were set on the same track!
CT is pretty good though I think a bit naive. He's missing a really obvious piece of the puzzle. I will hopefully offer a more complete story on how TMNT happened.
Silly question, but what was the story of what happened to their original home/office. It burnt down or something, but was there any story behind that?
Costumes lol. When i was 5 i wanted to be a ninja turtle for halloween so bad, but the costumes were sold out. So my mom got some green clothes from a thrift store and made front and back turtle shell out of poster board, a bandana, got face paint and all. Then my dad (who ran a K-mart store back then) had gotten a costume shipped from another store to his and took it home to me and totally stole my mom's thunder. 30 years later, i still feel guilty about not wearing mom's costume
poor bugger Ol Eastman. Was trying to do the right thing by artists/creators and had a big heart but sadly made just abut every mistake in business possible! xx Nice new shelves Chris! you have well out grown the pics duct taped to the wall behind you now! hahah
Right I had guess it was like 25-50 split, with at least half going to running the company or setting up a cushion. Only 20 for the company is pretty crazy even to someone who doesn't know anything about business. Like even a household couldn't run on only that much. People spend more of their paycheck on basic stuff.
@@DSan-kl2yc really FN generous of a publisher, especially from a business stand point. I gotta respect the man for trying. If He just hired a business consultant, he could've pulled it off. Then again, his uncle kind of was his business consultant. If he'd just listened, he could've pulled it off.
You should’ve looked for a toysize human in a flashers coat and hat. They blend in with people the second they leave the sewer. Hopefully somebody lost a Ralph to take care of him and tell him what to do to get pizza as he needs leadership.
I think these guys show how far a simple concept can take you. They got so much mileage out of just a handful of comic pages. I think the TMNT phenomena demonstrates the opportunities that can arise by continually developing new ideas, recognizing what works, and owning what you create. Even if you're not super talented you may be lucky enough to create the next Harry Potter or TMNT.
But then you run into the problem of people TRYING to make a thing happen as opposed to it just happening organically. That’s why the comic market is absolutely flooded with things attempting to be a franchise and it goes nowhere. Tmnt just had the most absolute dumb luck of being at the right place at the right time and even then it should not have worked but it did
OMG, you discovered them before the cartoon!!! i did too, but i was 7 when i read the original issue. this actually had a weird effect on my life. when the cartoon came out and "turtle mania" gripped my group of friends, i was the sole "the book was better" kid. this was kind of alienating... until the movie that straight up was some of the comic arcs, remixed.
Peter Laird's entire personality seems to be complaining about the cartoon. He hated Krang, Bebop & Rocksteady, the Shredder, Mona Lisa, every character anyone would ever write in asking when they would appear in Mirage Vol IV (The one he had sole 'custody' on) would be accompanied by a paragraph or two of him complaining about how emotionally bankrupt the idea was, or something. It was wild. It was a self published comic, he didn't even need to print letters at all-- in fact, this was post 2000 when most comics had stopped doing this because they had let internet forums take over. But he just had to post "These are the types of letters you turds are sending in, and this is why you're stupid!" or something. Actually, I'd like to see an episode on him just in case there's some other way to interpret those letters that I've missed. He also really hated the different colored masks... like to an absurd degree. He never explained why, he just did. When they first announced the new 2003 reboot, I was genuinely worried that they'd all have red masks; or even worse the studio would have demanded they be different colors, and he chose _new_ different colors out of spite. Thankfully that didn't happen...
$60M for TMNT franchise ownership is robbery. There are scrub basketball players making that much in three years. Hell, George Lucas took nearly 10X that for Star Wars. The TNNT name is a license to print money for eternity.
@@schweitzer-man6227 yeah, i love TMNT but it does not have the cultural cache, the ubiquity of a Star Wars. TMNT had captured a generation, but Star Wars captured multiple. And TMNT was not riding high when nickelodeon made the offer. An equivalent offer in 1993/94 might've been laughable. In the 2000's not so much
With the exception of the very late 80s and early 90s, Star Wars had always been bigger than TMNT. You also have to consider that when the acquisition was being made, there wasn't much of anything going on with the Turtles. The 2003 series was wrapping up meaning that there was no cartoon anymore. There hadn't been much in terms of video games since the PS2 era. There was no movie in active development. This also meant that there would be no new toy line based on anything. All Viacom was buying at that point were what had already existed. Any movie, cartoon or anything would have to be created from scratch. It's true they could make money off of what had already been created but that content would never produce as much money as it did when it was originally created. So $60 million for what could be considered a dormant franchise isn't that bad.
For anyone wondering, the intro scene is an edit from the movie "BKO: Bangkok Knockout", from 2010. It's worth a watch for the action scenes and stunts. Don't watch it for the story.
I had liked the first film but the next two were a bit weird in focusing on the past and the protector seemed like a better sequel to ong bak. I'd have to check out Ong Bak The New Generation.
@@LogicbyDesign Thanks for the heads up, though I was half right. I just should have double checked. The *German* title is "Ong Bak: The New Generation". Yah...all English words for the German title and entirely made up by the distributors to fool customers. I edited my comment with the original title.
Ahh, their timing was perfect and TMNT was on FIRE back in the '80's and even though you did a great job with this episode, too me, it still slightly downplayed the impact our favorite Ninja Reptile Brothers had on the industry. This independent comic, STORMED, the industry! Stacks of ripoffs jumped onto the stands and while none of them would last, Eastman and Laird had, forever, cracked open the market that had been so dominated by Marvel & DC! I know there were lots of other great independents, (WARP Graphics, Elf Quest, my personal fave) & Dark Horse Comics, to name just two but none have dominated or had the longevity TMNT has enjoyed, especially considering how short the original series ran. Well, enough jabbering from me, great intro & episode Chris! You da man!
I was in 9th grade when the b&w indy comics explosion hit. It was a wonderful time to be a young newbie comic collector. I was raised in VA in the middle of nowhere, so getting my grubby mitts on any indy comics back then was like striking gold.
I used to collect these comics back in the 80's before the tv show. They had a really strong New England vibe and sparked my interest in that whole world where a lot of the entertainers of the time were rooted. They were awesome.
Came here for TMNT history, and I wasn't disappointed! I first discovered them in cartoon form, and then later in the Archie series, which started by adapting the episodes and diverged into its own wonderful thing. I then read some of the original comics, and that blew me away with how gritty it was compared to the cartoon. I said this in another video, but TMNT 2K3 is probably my favorite version of the Ninja Turtles, as it followed the comics more closely, and they took Eastman and Laird's method of "throw everything at the wall and see what sticks," and made a more cohesive story out of it.
Same here, as far as how I learned about the TMNT and opinion on the 4Kids series. I read that the Archie comics stopped adapting cartoon episodes because it turned out that they weren't legally allowed to do so.
Word! The costumes are amazing and the fact that they did all those fight scenes in those costumes is even more awe-inspiring! All without CGI, because back then we didn't have CGI worth shit lol!
@@Galvion1980 Word. I was just thinking at the end of the video that Mikey's nunchaku skills look pretty damn top-notch despite being done by someone in what was probably a heavy and hot rubber suit. Way better than either of the Bay Turtles.
I just rewatched it after probably twenty years (im 33) and damn, it held up incredibly well in every facet of its production. It was beautiful and touching, funny, shot well, had incredible puppetry and suitmation. It was incredible.
"We came up with April's jumpsuit!" - "Err, no, ya didn't, here's proof." - "Yeah, well.. we.. we invented the color yellow!" I am just joking yet I've seen actual claims even more ridiculous than that...
This was a great video. Learned more about Eastman and Laird than I had before and in a more fluid way. What a fascinating story. Yeah, I'd love to see you do Laird, too.
Man, what a great episode! I really love how thorough you are with these topics, and how you don't only give the information but also the context and bigger picture of what happened while also being really easy to watch.
I think if he made it a 80-20 split throughout everything. That’s including toys and other merchandise not just publishing and they had a contract for lets say, the first three years but the creator still owned the rights to their creation and after can do whatever they like once the contract was up. Then I think Tundra would have lasted longer than it did.
Yo mma pro, would you ever make a comictropes episode on dark horse presents or Paul Chadwick's concrete? Id love to see dark horse get more love from the comics community on utube. PS ur channel is great
Thanks for taking my mind off things for just a little while. Congratulations on the silver play button. You keep putting em up and I'll keep watching.
I started with the animated series back in the early 90s when I was like 4 or 5, right near the end of the run. While I haven't been super thrilled with some of the iterations, new mutation springs to mind, I've still loved a vast majority of the stuff that's been created. Also, I'm super jealous of the TMNT retro cabinet in the background
Love your channel and your videos. I got to meet Eastman last year at the South Carolina Comic Con. He couldn't have been nicer. He spent 5 mins with everyone in line (which made the wait long but was worth it) and I got him to draw Raphael for me. Keep safe and keep up with the videos.
I loved this one! I’m really big on the Eastman/Laird OG TMNT books myself, and it’s great to see a video on that side of it from another fan. I also never knew Eastman had such a crazy entrepreneurial story. I hope you cover the Milestone Comics story someday!
I met Kevin Eastman in 1994 at WonderCon in Oakland. I was a young, enthusiastic comic creator who had just formed a company with several friends (YOUTH COMIX GROUP--we were all 16) he was very encouraging. Folks in the small group clustered around Eastman encouraged me to show him my portfolio which I shyly did. Eastman paid me the best compliment I’ve ever received: “see, this is why I don’t put my own stories in Heavy Metal, I can’t compete with the kids today!” (Referencing the talk he had just given) Of course, he was probably just being nice, but it really lit me up. After all, I started drawing comics because of buying the First graphic novel a few years before. Mirage was a big influence on my friends and I in forming our company. I still have those four books, shelf-worn and ratty, which Eastman signed and drew a quick Leonardo on the first page of each.
Such a great episode! And that new background set decoration has upped the production value in an amazing way. Keep up the spectacular work Chris. 🐭🐢🐢🐢🐢
This is so funny. Heavy Metal Magazine is my first introduction to not only comics, but also helped removed a negative stigma of "porn" in art. Mind you I'm not claiming Heavy Metal was nothing but smut (although it was riding that razor edge), but the idea that something didn't have artistic value just because of its content was driven home thanks to Heavy Metal. In a way, it helped me form an open mind on most things outside of even art. I still have boxes full of old (and torn apart) issues of Heavy Metal from the early 90's to early 00's, and I love opening them up every once in a while.
I grew up to find out a relative Mark Bode helped produce early issues in the tmnt comics but he parted ways with then before they sold out 12:27 he mentions mark It was pretty cool meeting and discovering that my cousin mark worked with them. As a kid I lived with the bode family and discovered a basement full of a bunch of vaugh bode works. Found a bunch of t-shirts with naked big breasted futuristic babes on treaded motorcycles lol Please do a video on mark bode he is criminally underrated artist.
Im just finishing to read the classic era TMNT comic. Awesome job as usual Chris, your videos help me a lot to go through this hard times for the world, and horrible for my country, thanks a lot, greetings from Chile!!!!
I've still got a bunch of my old TMNT black and white comics from the 80s, including the issue with Cerebus. I was a kid when the first cartoon premiered, and I was so excited to watch it with my cousin...and then really disappointed when it wasn't anything like the gritty comic. Still have the RPG (which my friends and I played A LOT), though I've tried to find better game mechanics to run it with, since Palladium's system is pretty awful. Anyway, it was really interesting to learn all of this information! I had heard bits and pieces as it was happening - Peter Laird getting rich from TMNT, doing Heavy Metal, marrying Julie Strain, etc. - but in those days they were mostly just rumors and I wasn't connected enough to the industry to know whether it was true. Thanks for filling in the blanks!
I just dug out of the closet my old Mirage comics i didnt understand or like as a kid. I had from #14 and up...and their amazing to look at the art. As a kid i didnt like them being that i was used to the cartoons
Some people don't measure their own value by how much money they have in the bank. Kinda love Eastman for that. Making millions isn't nearly as important as what you do with it. For some of us it's not that we're 'bad' with money we just genuinely don't give a shit about money because at the end of the day we have more than enough to live comfortably off of so why scrooge mcduck it up and just shovel it in a vault for some reason?
40 years old and I loved the Turtles back in the day... had the first four books too. This is my favourite comic book channel, I appreciate what you do and I like the new set. Keep up the good work my dude 👍🏻
Do you think you’d ever do an episode on the Marvel No-Prize? I read the comic where they covered some of the examples and thought it could be interesting to cover!
Eastman seems like a really good and generous dude...just one who didn't have that much business sense. Like, I can't really be upset at the guy for throwing tons of money at comics he wanted to publish and making sure the creators of those comics were well compensated and kept their rights.
Oh and a side note...the content of this is pretty timely... I just picked up the City at War story for the main TMNT line.. going back now and picking up some of the earlier issues... I gotta say, the 2011- present Turtles is surprisingly awesome... Any chance you can do something on Usagi Yojimbo and it's creator Stan Sakai?
Stan Sakai does the lettering in Groo, and even after probably 35 years, he is still the letterer for that series! wow Also, after Grude, Yojimbo and Groo have the second and third highest body count in comic books (which are counted as on screen deaths).
I have met Kevin Eastman. He is funny, laid back and easy going. He was at the Baltimore ComicCon one year. Had him sign my original Ninja Turtle VHS movie. He just sat back, signed it and talked a lot. Would love to see him again.
Thank you for making these videos. I’m in the midst of writing and drawing a comic book that I’m hoping to self publish. These videos serve as inspiration and help me move forward especially with how uncertain the success or failure will be.
You know what this episode reminds me of the toys that made us it reminds me of that because it goes into the history and facts of comic books while the toys that made us does the same thing but for toys so chris whatever your doing to make this show good keep doing it by the way I recon this is a very good TH-cam channel and that I respect all those who work on this
The current IDW series is fantastic. I discovered it late and haven't quite made it half way through the hardcover collections but it's one of my absolute favourite series.
I discovered that series back in 2013/2014. I can't remember the last time I was buying TPBs so quickly. It's a great series that I would LOVE to see it get adapted into an animated series. I even got Kevin Eastman to autograph the first volume for me.
But with the availability of profits in the markets like stocks and housing, and with the increase in inflation and living cost, that $14 million during that time may have amounted to $40 million today.
@@FoxUnitNell Yes, because there's a difference between never having to work again rich, and so filthy rich you don't know what to do with yourself. Sarcasm really seems to be lacking in people's comprehension. *Rolls Eyes*
nice video bro. I met Kevin Eastman @NYCC 2019, he signed my TMNT #1-4 first prints. Kevin was really cool, we made jokes and talked a bit, It was an awesome experience.
Ngl I was about to close the video at the end after the actual review, but the sudden super wholesome mood of the outro speech drew me back in. Congratz on the silver button and stay safe, TropesMan
It's mind boggling how this franchise went from dark, gritty black-and-white to "Deck the halls with pepperoni"
Good. Edgy garbage died in the 90s where it belonged
@NDHFilms You say that like it hasn't ping-ponged back and forth with a lot of the material that's come out since then, especially the tv shows.
"Same As It Never Was", anyone?
@@bryanc7094
Cringe comment.
It's a really strange journey. It's super interesting me to that it started as a parody or a jab at pulpy bubblegum comics (Daredevil) of the time, taking anthropomorphic turtles and giving them a super serious 90's edge.
Then it evolved to juxtapose ITSELF. Goofy, pizza loving non-violent turtles are beloved compared to the original murderous ones.
@@bryanc7094 1) You cant substitute "Gritty" with "Edgy". Edgy is quite literally defined as something that tries too hard to be dark and gritty.
2) Edginess did not die in the nineties. The mid 2000s were filled to the brim with edgy shlock as well.
3) U implying the OG tmnt was garbage? SMH
Between telling us Laird was more of a purist between the two, and him heading the 2003 animated adaptation, I can see why it came out the way it did.
"so, your suppose to be us, from other worlds? i don't see it..."
"what's with the multi colored headbands?"
"heh, Sellouts!"
Best "oh hi!" EVER
Jack Hinich that’s exactly what I was going to say!
I wouldn't say it's his best, but it's good.
I was going to say the same thing
Dunno man, that one where Chris is "dying" still number one for me.
Jack Hinich yeah
And I often grown whenever they're don
Well I gotta say, props; that was fantastic
“And the ninjas, seen in frank miller’s [everything]”
@Dalek SupremeIntroducing the Leonardo Who Shredds.
@Dalek Supreme Enter the Turtleverse
Ninjas where everywhere in the 80's.
I remember being able to get in an argument with someone claiming that TMNT was a Japanese comic book series (probably because of them being released in black and white like manga), and I even asked them if they knew the names of the two men who created the Ninja Turtles, to which they told me it was "somebody Japanese", and they couldn't be more wrong. ;P
How old was this person?
@@danielg.w5733 I don't remember, but I believe he was in his twenties.
To be honest, for a time I thought hey were Italians simply because all the ninjas had Italian names😂😊
Noted: never collaborate with Dave Sim on anything.
Eastman and Laird have always been one of the strangest contrasts in any creative industry, you have one who was okay with almost everything changed about their creation which made it so successful and the other is very resentful and hates what his creation has twisted into in different ways but regardless I think both men are in their own way dealing with the same scary thing for any creative individual, to become a footnote in the shadow of their creation, when it grows far beyond the ones who made it in the hands of others, its a massively bitter pill to swallow since you couldn't ask for a worst situation to cut your nose off to spite your face since you might not like it, but its success still contributes to your own.
Hate is a strong word to use for Peter though. I disliked alot of the early changes but realised he could keep his comics and still have franchise do other things. He headed a bunch of those multicolored headband turtle shows. Kevin on the otherhand seemed to have thought the tmnt was a stepping stone to other things, after a while he seamed tired of it and wanted to try other things but like the prodigal son he realised the grass isnt always greener and came back home.
Both of their thoughts about the direction that TMNT took make sense. I'm more of a fan of the dark, gritty, and more serious TMNT, because, to me, that's what TMNT is. This is why the original comics, 1990 movie, and 03 cartoon are easily the best things from TMNT in my opinion. It stays true to the original comics. But I see why one would want to go balls to the walls with licensing and expansion, and making things more kid friendly.
@@kaydee1485 thats true though when your doing interviews and make faces when the interviewer brings up the more successful versions of your creations, its understandable for US the audience to look at that as "hatred for the way things shaped out" and yeah he eventually got over it and made good on his legacy, but not after Several failed attempts at making something for himself land did he learn that hubris
@@KFXG honestly when you really think about it, this situation with TMNT parallels Teen Titans VS Teen Titans GO with the one being more creatively interesting and for older audiences while the other is a childish farce in comparison but is also a unarguably great financial success and it kinda puts in the same mindset of what was the bigger success? (not arguing quality on that one, just commercial success that might leave a creative unhappy it took off while the original languished by comparison)
I wasnt aware TMNT was an indie property. I can remember when I was 9 making a coloured TMNT comic with one of my friends, and bringing a new page to school every few days to work on with him. I think it's cool that two guys can create something so unique and inspiring that some kids at school were set on the same track!
CT is pretty good though I think a bit naive. He's missing a really obvious piece of the puzzle. I will hopefully offer a more complete story on how TMNT happened.
@@thomasmuandersontheneousul4184 with a comment this bold i'd like to see what you have to say that he's allegedly missed
@@thomasmuandersontheneousul41841 year later and you have not clarified what he allegedly missed. 🐔 bock bock
Silly question, but what was the story of what happened to their original home/office. It burnt down or something, but was there any story behind that?
Well it was just Peter’s house. They grew out of it as they got bigger. No fire I’m aware of.
didnt expect to see you here
That Turtles In Time arcade machine is glorious.
*GLORIOUS*
It's the 89 arcade game. Turtles in Time has a different title screen and uses a different font for its notification to advance to the next screen.
@@daegan_ftw doesnt matter. still GLORIOUS!!! lol
Half the time of this review I was distracted by the arcade masine
@@daegan_ftw Looks like the Arcade1up cabinet. That one has both the 89 arcade and the arcade version of Turtles in Time.
That's not turtles in time dude.
These intros just keep getting better!
This episode was pure nostalgia for me. So many childhood events related to TMNT. From playing with action figures, to games and costume parties.
Costumes lol. When i was 5 i wanted to be a ninja turtle for halloween so bad, but the costumes were sold out. So my mom got some green clothes from a thrift store and made front and back turtle shell out of poster board, a bandana, got face paint and all. Then my dad (who ran a K-mart store back then) had gotten a costume shipped from another store to his and took it home to me and totally stole my mom's thunder. 30 years later, i still feel guilty about not wearing mom's costume
There's a Netflix series called the "The Toys That Made Us" they have a an episode on TMNT that's really good
A fellow man of culture, I see.
When they announced season 3 of that series, that was the episode I was looking forward to the most.
@@Thrawns_Office It's the one episode I watch over & over.
Marvel Legends better be there, at least the Toybiz ones.
There's a documentary called "Turtle Power" that's even better.
Truly pioneers... today there's any number of "studios" and even "presses" that are one person putting out webcomics!
poor bugger Ol Eastman. Was trying to do the right thing by artists/creators and had a big heart but sadly made just abut every mistake in business possible! xx Nice new shelves Chris! you have well out grown the pics duct taped to the wall behind you now! hahah
sup splash!
He’s like the John Romero of comics! Lol I just realized the pictures were taped like last week when somebody pointed it out lol
His heart is why he’s in this predicament!!
Right I had guess it was like 25-50 split, with at least half going to running the company or setting up a cushion. Only 20 for the company is pretty crazy even to someone who doesn't know anything about business. Like even a household couldn't run on only that much. People spend more of their paycheck on basic stuff.
@@DSan-kl2yc really FN generous of a publisher, especially from a business stand point. I gotta respect the man for trying. If He just hired a business consultant, he could've pulled it off. Then again, his uncle kind of was his business consultant. If he'd just listened, he could've pulled it off.
oh hi you caught me watching comic tropes within the first minute it uploaded
Lost my 80s tv show Leonardo toy in the park. Still feel the hurt 3 decades later.
You should’ve looked for a toysize human in a flashers coat and hat. They blend in with people the second they leave the sewer. Hopefully somebody lost a Ralph to take care of him and tell him what to do to get pizza as he needs leadership.
I think these guys show how far a simple concept can take you. They got so much mileage out of just a handful of comic pages. I think the TMNT phenomena demonstrates the opportunities that can arise by continually developing new ideas, recognizing what works, and owning what you create. Even if you're not super talented you may be lucky enough to create the next Harry Potter or TMNT.
But then you run into the problem of people TRYING to make a thing happen as opposed to it just happening organically. That’s why the comic market is absolutely flooded with things attempting to be a franchise and it goes nowhere.
Tmnt just had the most absolute dumb luck of being at the right place at the right time and even then it should not have worked but it did
Hopefully me
OMG, you discovered them before the cartoon!!!
i did too, but i was 7 when i read the original issue. this actually had a weird effect on my life. when the cartoon came out and "turtle mania" gripped my group of friends, i was the sole "the book was better" kid. this was kind of alienating... until the movie that straight up was some of the comic arcs, remixed.
Hope we get a comic tropes on Peter Laird
agreed. eastman was "good ideas, poorly handled" and makes you wonder the other side of the coin of the TMNT creators
You pretty much got the full Peter Laird story in this video.
Peter Laird's entire personality seems to be complaining about the cartoon. He hated Krang, Bebop & Rocksteady, the Shredder, Mona Lisa, every character anyone would ever write in asking when they would appear in Mirage Vol IV (The one he had sole 'custody' on) would be accompanied by a paragraph or two of him complaining about how emotionally bankrupt the idea was, or something. It was wild. It was a self published comic, he didn't even need to print letters at all-- in fact, this was post 2000 when most comics had stopped doing this because they had let internet forums take over. But he just had to post "These are the types of letters you turds are sending in, and this is why you're stupid!" or something. Actually, I'd like to see an episode on him just in case there's some other way to interpret those letters that I've missed.
He also really hated the different colored masks... like to an absurd degree. He never explained why, he just did. When they first announced the new 2003 reboot, I was genuinely worried that they'd all have red masks; or even worse the studio would have demanded they be different colors, and he chose _new_ different colors out of spite. Thankfully that didn't happen...
$60M for TMNT franchise ownership is robbery. There are scrub basketball players making that much in three years. Hell, George Lucas took nearly 10X that for Star Wars. The TNNT name is a license to print money for eternity.
TMNT is NOT the same as Star Wars.
@@schweitzer-man6227 Disney has greatly diminished the value of Star Wars since, but, yeah, Star Wars was more valuable when they bought it.
@@schweitzer-man6227 yeah, i love TMNT but it does not have the cultural cache, the ubiquity of a Star Wars. TMNT had captured a generation, but Star Wars captured multiple. And TMNT was not riding high when nickelodeon made the offer. An equivalent offer in 1993/94 might've been laughable. In the 2000's not so much
With the exception of the very late 80s and early 90s, Star Wars had always been bigger than TMNT. You also have to consider that when the acquisition was being made, there wasn't much of anything going on with the Turtles. The 2003 series was wrapping up meaning that there was no cartoon anymore. There hadn't been much in terms of video games since the PS2 era. There was no movie in active development. This also meant that there would be no new toy line based on anything. All Viacom was buying at that point were what had already existed. Any movie, cartoon or anything would have to be created from scratch. It's true they could make money off of what had already been created but that content would never produce as much money as it did when it was originally created. So $60 million for what could be considered a dormant franchise isn't that bad.
@@KasumiKenshirou Can you people go away already?
For anyone wondering, the intro scene is an edit from the movie "BKO: Bangkok Knockout", from 2010.
It's worth a watch for the action scenes and stunts. Don't watch it for the story.
I had liked the first film but the next two were a bit weird in focusing on the past and the protector seemed like a better sequel to ong bak. I'd have to check out Ong Bak The New Generation.
who watche ANY Tony Jaa movie for the story?
Kung fu movies have stories??? That's like saying porn movies have stories.
That’s not from ong bak bro
@@LogicbyDesign
Thanks for the heads up, though I was half right. I just should have double checked. The *German* title is "Ong Bak: The New Generation".
Yah...all English words for the German title and entirely made up by the distributors to fool customers.
I edited my comment with the original title.
Ahh, their timing was perfect and TMNT was on FIRE back in the '80's and even though you did a great job with this episode, too me, it still slightly downplayed the impact our favorite Ninja Reptile Brothers had on the industry. This independent comic, STORMED, the industry! Stacks of ripoffs jumped onto the stands and while none of them would last, Eastman and Laird had, forever, cracked open the market that had been so dominated by Marvel & DC! I know there were lots of other great independents, (WARP Graphics, Elf Quest, my personal fave) & Dark Horse Comics, to name just two but none have dominated or had the longevity TMNT has enjoyed, especially considering how short the original series ran. Well, enough jabbering from me, great intro & episode Chris! You da man!
Kevin Eastman landed Julie Strain. I think he did pretty good for himself.
They split in 2007.
@@IrishMorgenstern I know. But he still landed her for 10 years.
I have seen his new wife. He's better off now
Julie Strain is attractive but girls like her are a dime a dozen now
@giftofgab247 he wasn't with her in the 80s he was with her in the late 90s early 2000 they only broke up less than 15 years ago
I was in 9th grade when the b&w indy comics explosion hit. It was a wonderful time to be a young newbie comic collector. I was raised in VA in the middle of nowhere, so getting my grubby mitts on any indy comics back then was like striking gold.
Not to sound pushy, but when’s Madman going to be an episode?
Jack of All Claws Hard agree, just started reading them and it's hard to put them down.
I used to collect these comics back in the 80's before the tv show. They had a really strong New England vibe and sparked my interest in that whole world where a lot of the entertainers of the time were rooted. They were awesome.
Came here for TMNT history, and I wasn't disappointed! I first discovered them in cartoon form, and then later in the Archie series, which started by adapting the episodes and diverged into its own wonderful thing. I then read some of the original comics, and that blew me away with how gritty it was compared to the cartoon.
I said this in another video, but TMNT 2K3 is probably my favorite version of the Ninja Turtles, as it followed the comics more closely, and they took Eastman and Laird's method of "throw everything at the wall and see what sticks," and made a more cohesive story out of it.
Same here, as far as how I learned about the TMNT and opinion on the 4Kids series.
I read that the Archie comics stopped adapting cartoon episodes because it turned out that they weren't legally allowed to do so.
I'm just here to say Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990) is one of the best superhero movies of all time.
Word! The costumes are amazing and the fact that they did all those fight scenes in those costumes is even more awe-inspiring! All without CGI, because back then we didn't have CGI worth shit lol!
@@Galvion1980 Word. I was just thinking at the end of the video that Mikey's nunchaku skills look pretty damn top-notch despite being done by someone in what was probably a heavy and hot rubber suit. Way better than either of the Bay Turtles.
Definitely ! Lots more love in these old movies than in the Bay version. But to each their own...
I just rewatched it after probably twenty years (im 33) and damn, it held up incredibly well in every facet of its production. It was beautiful and touching, funny, shot well, had incredible puppetry and suitmation. It was incredible.
19:15 is that Julie Strain? 😮😮😮😮
"We came up with April's jumpsuit!" - "Err, no, ya didn't, here's proof." - "Yeah, well.. we.. we invented the color yellow!"
I am just joking yet I've seen actual claims even more ridiculous than that...
Yeah that was an insane claim to make.
This was a great video. Learned more about Eastman and Laird than I had before and in a more fluid way. What a fascinating story. Yeah, I'd love to see you do Laird, too.
Man, what a great episode! I really love how thorough you are with these topics, and how you don't only give the information but also the context and bigger picture of what happened while also being really easy to watch.
I think if he made it a 80-20 split throughout everything. That’s including toys and other merchandise not just publishing and they had a contract for lets say, the first three years but the creator still owned the rights to their creation and after can do whatever they like once the contract was up. Then I think Tundra would have lasted longer than it did.
Yo mma pro, would you ever make a comictropes episode on dark horse presents or Paul Chadwick's concrete? Id love to see dark horse get more love from the comics community on utube.
PS ur channel is great
Yes ecspecially their Aliens/Predator/AVP comics
Thank you for featuring my picture! I hope you could make it out with that camera.
Thanks for taking my mind off things for just a little while. Congratulations on the silver play button. You keep putting em up and I'll keep watching.
I started with the animated series back in the early 90s when I was like 4 or 5, right near the end of the run. While I haven't been super thrilled with some of the iterations, new mutation springs to mind, I've still loved a vast majority of the stuff that's been created.
Also, I'm super jealous of the TMNT retro cabinet in the background
Ok but I'mma have to draw fanart of that intro, it was so good
You've covered all my favorite indie titles except GRENDEL ! Matt Wagner deserves a moment in the spotlight.
Love your channel and your videos. I got to meet Eastman last year at the South Carolina Comic Con. He couldn't have been nicer. He spent 5 mins with everyone in line (which made the wait long but was worth it) and I got him to draw Raphael for me. Keep safe and keep up with the videos.
GREAT episode! The "post credits" scene made me laugh out loud literally! I'd love to see you do a James O'Barr episode and an Alex Ross episode.
Very timely video. I've been on a big TMNT kick recently. Keep up the good work Chris and stay safe.
I loved this one! I’m really big on the Eastman/Laird OG TMNT books myself, and it’s great to see a video on that side of it from another fan. I also never knew Eastman had such a crazy entrepreneurial story. I hope you cover the Milestone Comics story someday!
Had to stop at 0:30 to say that this was the best intro to date! Slightly edging out the taking out the trash for Chuck Austin's X-Men
Whenever you say something like "I discovered them in the 80's" I'm shocked! You seem so young! Are you sure you were alive back then? lol
Right?
Yes, it surprises me too, he looks way younger.
if he's in his mid-40's, that would be about right.
I met Kevin Eastman in 1994 at WonderCon in Oakland. I was a young, enthusiastic comic creator who had just formed a company with several friends (YOUTH COMIX GROUP--we were all 16) he was very encouraging. Folks in the small group clustered around Eastman encouraged me to show him my portfolio which I shyly did. Eastman paid me the best compliment I’ve ever received: “see, this is why I don’t put my own stories in Heavy Metal, I can’t compete with the kids today!” (Referencing the talk he had just given)
Of course, he was probably just being nice, but it really lit me up. After all, I started drawing comics because of buying the First graphic novel a few years before. Mirage was a big influence on my friends and I in forming our company. I still have those four books, shelf-worn and ratty, which Eastman signed and drew a quick Leonardo on the first page of each.
I’m surprised that this is only really about Eastman, and not also Laird - would he be the subject of a future episode perhaps?
I love your channel! We actually just had Kevin on our show. The Turtles will always be very special to us.
Such a great episode! And that new background set decoration has upped the production value in an amazing way. Keep up the spectacular work Chris. 🐭🐢🐢🐢🐢
My favorite channel by far!!! Keep it up see you next time Chris!!!! Last weeks shooter upload was inspiring
Appreciate all the hard effort and research you do with every video.
This is so funny. Heavy Metal Magazine is my first introduction to not only comics, but also helped removed a negative stigma of "porn" in art. Mind you I'm not claiming Heavy Metal was nothing but smut (although it was riding that razor edge), but the idea that something didn't have artistic value just because of its content was driven home thanks to Heavy Metal. In a way, it helped me form an open mind on most things outside of even art. I still have boxes full of old (and torn apart) issues of Heavy Metal from the early 90's to early 00's, and I love opening them up every once in a while.
I grew up to find out a relative Mark Bode helped produce early issues in the tmnt comics but he parted ways with then before they sold out 12:27 he mentions mark
It was pretty cool meeting and discovering that my cousin mark worked with them. As a kid I lived with the bode family and discovered a basement full of a bunch of vaugh bode works. Found a bunch of t-shirts with naked big breasted futuristic babes on treaded motorcycles lol
Please do a video on mark bode he is criminally underrated artist.
Your level of production just went up to 3000. Great video. Tons of info. Aweskk OK e oh hi intro. Congrats.
I started with number 8, still have the same one in mint condition. Absolutely worthless, but I love it dearly.
you have the best comic book channel by far. The passion is evident in every video you release.
1:42
'Oh hi! You caught me cooking the books.'
Way fun! Thanks for making this week of isolation during the Covid 19 virus a little easier. Love your work
Im just finishing to read the classic era TMNT comic. Awesome job as usual Chris, your videos help me a lot to go through this hard times for the world, and horrible for my country, thanks a lot, greetings from Chile!!!!
I've still got a bunch of my old TMNT black and white comics from the 80s, including the issue with Cerebus. I was a kid when the first cartoon premiered, and I was so excited to watch it with my cousin...and then really disappointed when it wasn't anything like the gritty comic. Still have the RPG (which my friends and I played A LOT), though I've tried to find better game mechanics to run it with, since Palladium's system is pretty awful. Anyway, it was really interesting to learn all of this information! I had heard bits and pieces as it was happening - Peter Laird getting rich from TMNT, doing Heavy Metal, marrying Julie Strain, etc. - but in those days they were mostly just rumors and I wasn't connected enough to the industry to know whether it was true. Thanks for filling in the blanks!
I just dug out of the closet my old Mirage comics i didnt understand or like as a kid. I had from #14 and up...and their amazing to look at the art. As a kid i didnt like them being that i was used to the cartoons
These intros are getting increasingly insane. That was awesome.
Some people don't measure their own value by how much money they have in the bank. Kinda love Eastman for that. Making millions isn't nearly as important as what you do with it. For some of us it's not that we're 'bad' with money we just genuinely don't give a shit about money because at the end of the day we have more than enough to live comfortably off of so why scrooge mcduck it up and just shovel it in a vault for some reason?
“Arguing that they came up with the IMPORTANT elements of TMNT, like... April’s jumpsuit...”
😐
40 years old and I loved the Turtles back in the day... had the first four books too.
This is my favourite comic book channel, I appreciate what you do and I like the new set. Keep up the good work my dude 👍🏻
Do you think you’d ever do an episode on the Marvel No-Prize? I read the comic where they covered some of the examples and thought it could be interesting to cover!
Tronomics2000 - Thats a really good idea. I’d love to know more about it.
I read that they started sending out empty envelopes "containing" the no-prize and people still didn't get it!
Yeah, I would love to know more about the Marvel No-Prize! I've always wondered..
Another great episode as always. Thanks Chris! Love the arcade 1up cab in the background
The smile when you say "the brand continued to evolve and mutate", lol. I enjoyed seeing you enjoying your wordplay, lol.
Well done, man. These episodes keep getting better and better
The absolute BEST thing about this video is Kevin Eastman's VERY 90's cool guy outfit at 13:44. Suavemente!
Oddly enough his face looks like a Doonesbury character there
edison Oh my gosh!! You’re SO right! I can’t believe I didn’t see that. Peak 90’s!!
Eastman seems like a really good and generous dude...just one who didn't have that much business sense. Like, I can't really be upset at the guy for throwing tons of money at comics he wanted to publish and making sure the creators of those comics were well compensated and kept their rights.
Oh and a side note...the content of this is pretty timely... I just picked up the City at War story for the main TMNT line.. going back now and picking up some of the earlier issues... I gotta say, the 2011- present Turtles is surprisingly awesome... Any chance you can do something on Usagi Yojimbo and it's creator Stan Sakai?
Stan Sakai does the lettering in Groo, and even after probably 35 years, he is still the letterer for that series! wow Also, after Grude, Yojimbo and Groo have the second and third highest body count in comic books (which are counted as on screen deaths).
This one was really well researched. Great vid. Thanks Chris!
I love how your title is referencing the famous comics journal interview he did x
I have met Kevin Eastman. He is funny, laid back and easy going. He was at the Baltimore ComicCon one year. Had him sign my original Ninja Turtle VHS movie. He just sat back, signed it and talked a lot. Would love to see him again.
Was wondering what to watch before bed and this got uploaded one minute ago. Perfect timing!
Thank you for making these videos. I’m in the midst of writing and drawing a comic book that I’m hoping to self publish. These videos serve as inspiration and help me move forward especially with how uncertain the success or failure will be.
You should talk about Evan Dorkins comics more specifically Eltingville
The ending. I am in tears. I was hoping someone would make that edit. Needed that after a long shift. Thanks, dude.
Wow. I'm from Brazil and the ultimate TMNT collection will be released here soon. What a coincidence.
Já peguei na pré venda
Pipoca&Nanquim né? Tbm achei coincidência...
Awesome video, and the intro was great. I've heard the story of tmnts creation many times before, but I never get sick of hearing it
You know what this episode reminds me of the toys that made us it reminds me of that because it goes into the history and facts of comic books while the toys that made us does the same thing but for toys so chris whatever your doing to make this show good keep doing it by the way I recon this is a very good TH-cam channel and that I respect all those who work on this
Dude, the editting on this one is amazing. Great job keeping up the pace!
Shoutout to the indies! Loving the new look.
Everyone's fan art was so much fun to see. Nice video!
The current IDW series is fantastic. I discovered it late and haven't quite made it half way through the hardcover collections but it's one of my absolute favourite series.
I discovered that series back in 2013/2014. I can't remember the last time I was buying TPBs so quickly. It's a great series that I would LOVE to see it get adapted into an animated series.
I even got Kevin Eastman to autograph the first volume for me.
Glad to see you're still at it! Great vid! Keep em coming!
With a networth of $20 mill, I'm certain Eastman isn't missing the $14 mill he wasted in the 90's, lol!
But with the availability of profits in the markets like stocks and housing, and with the increase in inflation and living cost, that $14 million during that time may have amounted to $40 million today.
Terr Cain Yeah, but that had to hurt at the time. Plus, there was no way to know if he would recover. Most who lose that much money never get it back.
@@truefanforum3273 agreed. at least eastman is stable.
Ian R. Nava Huber I don't know much about either Eastman or Laird so I can't speak on that.
@@FoxUnitNell Yes, because there's a difference between never having to work again rich, and so filthy rich you don't know what to do with yourself. Sarcasm really seems to be lacking in people's comprehension. *Rolls Eyes*
nice video bro. I met Kevin Eastman @NYCC 2019, he signed my TMNT #1-4 first prints. Kevin was really cool, we made jokes and talked a bit, It was an awesome experience.
Another great comic tropes episode.
Great, great, great! Terrific episode, Chris. Chordially, MU from Kingston WA.
All those lawsuits have ruined so many great ideas and people. Such a shame
I love Ninja Turtles too! The Akira piece and Turtles cabinet in the background are amazing 😍 great video!! Love the story of Mirage Studios.
Oh, that intro was flawless editing!
For a time with no internet they became pretty popular pretty quickly. The Eastman and Laird stuff is the best.
TMNT was an obsession as a kid and its very cool that its had this parallel life with its mainstream products and underground comics
Fantastic episode. Thanks for all your content. A fan in France.
Wow I forgot how much parody was in TMNT origin story😂🍻
I was literally thinking earlier today, while rewatching your Cerebus video, that you should make a TMNT video at some point. Great video, I loved it!
How long have you had the silver play button? That's great! You really deserve it.
Ngl I was about to close the video at the end after the actual review, but the sudden super wholesome mood of the outro speech drew me back in. Congratz on the silver button and stay safe, TropesMan