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If it's based on the Tacoma we will get a cheaper, less refined vehicle. We used to get a Prado, now we will get a pickup truck. Just check the weight of a door in a Tacoma vs any 4 Runner. The 4 Runner has an overbuilt feeling we are about to loose in the name of profits.
Dump the unfortunate overwrought origami Darth Vader front end of this last "refresh" on most trims, especially bad on the Pro. The more conservative TRD Sport front end by far the best looking of the current variants, IMO, too bad it's not available on others... almost harkens back or pays homage to some mid gen Land Cruisers, Tacos, etc Marry that more grown-up look with the Pro and other variants' fun bits and you have something. Keep the basic package of the rest of it, just-right size, etc, other than obvious powertrain changes (what we need is a good inline turbo 6 or even 5!) and some interior refinement like some first rate (comfort) seats) - and clean up the center stack and - without going too digital. Generally, don't fix too much what ain't broke. I do like that the AC vents are still "normal," ie up high/face level versus being forced below by the high screens these days, and I like that the screen is at least integrated into the dash... keep the plasticky, blocky sharp angle / edge tacked-on screen crap down that seems to be epidemic now. Not opinionated on this am I?!
@@springertubeyou trippin. This guy really said the trd sport is the best looking. I think nobody agrees with you besides the soccer moms. Trd pro is by far the best looking and most aggressive. They won’t keep the same exact design. They will refresh it but Toyota has already come out and said it won’t sway far from what the 4Runner has always been throughout its history. It’s gonna look even better and I’m a 5th gen owner of a built up sr5 and it’s time for a new design. They won’t keep the same after the 5th gen has been around for as long as it has. But the trd sport is literally the most worthless trim they added on just to squeeze out every penny out of the 5th gen. It basically looks like the city slickin limited trim. Brings shame to the trd name.
@@andyham6094 To each their own for sure, sounds you're tripping yourself on the Kool Aid. I would've thought must be a Gen Y fanboi til I heard how many gens...the front end on the currents is an overwrought embarrassment looking like it was designed by an 11 year old in "study hall."
I don't know how the new hybrid Sequoia is selling, but I know I have not seen one on the road. Sad to hear that so many people are willing to trade rock solid reliability, for screens and gadgets. Option wise, all I need is an Aux jack, power windows, and ice cold A/C. LOVE good old dials, levers, knobs, and switches. Just what the American public needs..........MORE things to distract them from focusing on driving.
I have a ‘21 ORP with 47k miles and I get 21mpg with mostly highway and backroad driving. Definitely wish that it was more up to date, but I bought it for what it is: Extremely Capable and Profoundly Reliable.
Just bought a 2021 SR5 Premium with XP Predator package. It's basically my dream car and I love everything about it! Look forward to seeing what Toyota does with the new 4Runner.
I think this is the peak for the 4 Runner in terms of reliability. Everything in the future will sacrifice some reliability for looks and creature comforts. This may be a highly sought after vehicle in 15 years
Toyota is building Hybrids and other engines for decades. They won't put a garbage in their vehicles. After 15 years, all will be electric. Toyota trying for 600 miles range battery. There will be no or far away from home gas stations with crazy prices. Used vehicles with ICE price will tank.
@anjansingh3093 Keep dreaming. The grid in thr US can't handle everyone having an electric vehicle and it doesn't look like that's changing anytime soon
My first 4x4 was an FJ Cruiser, followed by a 5th gen 4Runner, followed by a 5th gen 4Runner lol. I loved this platform and engine! Toyota is now past it's golden age.
Tommy I’m driving a 2022 4Runner TRD Pro and I see all these reviews and knit picking little things. This is my first Toyota as I have had Jeep, Mercury, Ford two, Chevy, GMC and my wife drives Honda CRV. So far I am very satisfied. Also with Work I rent about 50-60 Rentals a year for work. This is a Hunting Truck for Me and I tow a fishing boat, also first time in 35 years I have not had a Truck and this 4Runner is way better off-road, and MPG is better. In 5 years I’ll let you know how good it has been.
My SUV of choice would be the 4Runner, hands down. Very capable and stout, and made in Japan. Hopefully Toyota will keep making them there. I don't think it matters that it is "old". People buy them because of that. The vehicle is perfection, because it has been around for so long. Why mess with it?
I recently purchased a 2022 TRD Pro 4Runner, and I like it much more than I thought I would. To me, it is the perfect size, comfortable, handles great even on the road (better than most people say). I totally get the comments on the powertrain; however, I added a pedal commander, and this really improved the way it accelerates and shifts gears. It doesn’t seem to hunt the gears as much as before. The engines actually feels plenty powerful with good torque. I did not think that until I added the pedal commander. And it is just a solid vehicle that you know will be reliable and is fun to drive. As far as tech, it has everything I need: 360 cameras , blind spot monitoring, cross traffic alerts, apple car play, Bluetooth, phone and voice commands. I don’t need anything else. The biggest downside is the mpg, but I look at it from a total cost of ownership perspective. What additional costs I pay in lower mpg will be offset by less repairs.
I got my 2020 4Runner with 50k miles one owner sr5 3rd row 4x4 and been modding it myself purchased for 37k with 10k down and I think it’s the best decision I’ve ever made
I'm NOT looking forward to change. Change means new problems, new headaches and more trips to the garage for repairs (potentially). From what I've see and heard, the newer 5th gens are flying off the lots more so then years past, consumers want a reliable vehicle that is tried, tested and true. If you've been a Toyota fan most of your life then you'll know and understand that most of us do not want or need all the gidges and gadgets. We like the basic, reliable functionable options that come with the 4runner. So call it "old" or a "dinosaur" but that's what we like, this is why 4Runner is what it is today. Hoping for minimal changes.
Have a 23 Tundra and love it. 25' 4Runner built off of the new 24' Taco would be a great addition for us esp for rock crawling and tougher trails. The 4Runner is just a grinder and if they can keep that lineage going it will be a huge hit. It could fine a new gear in terms of sales imo if they do it right.
@@Offshore1977 I have the Trd wheels. There was clearance for the mud flaps, but I took them off. I prefer the look. I did trim some of the front wheel well liner with a utility knife in front of the wheel. Plenty of clearance at the body mount. I do have SPC upper control arms and a diff drop.
Tommy you can make a vehicle that is outdated and so behind the times look so great with all of your banter and your great comments. When the new forerunner is debuted, I really hope TFL put you on the job to view it and roll it out because you do such a great job.
A couple of things I see that could change (and not for the better) No roll down rear window a la the new sequoia, a giant screen which will not fit well with the 4runner, and maybe the biggest change, no longer manufactured in Japan, but in Texas or Mexico.
This is my biggest worry. Since every new truck at Toyota has to be based on the new TNGA platform, they will have to sacrifice a lot of the little things that make the 4Runner so great and unique, all in the name of cost cutting, efficiency and increasing profitability. I think like the new Tundra, it'll still be a "good" vehicle, but there will be a lot of little disappointments. It'll be overall larger/heavier but somehow have less useable interior space. It'll be more fragile, finnicky and slightly less reliable. It'll have more generic tech gimmicks, big screens, and fewer manual knobs/levers. It'll lose little things like the roll-down rear window or the overall analog feel that gives it so much character. I really wanted a 4Runner in a couple of years, but that might change now.
The current 4Runner has the X factor. Mix of reliability, looks, functionality (rear window, knobs, rear access) and the Toyota vibe. The only thing that I would change if it was not being redesigned would be to offer a larger gas tank. 24 gallons just doesn't get it done. Hopefully the new 4Runner will not be too expensive, and will have better range. Thanks for the video.
I would love to see the new 4Runner to do a modern retro approach like the Bronco. Bring back the 80s removable fiberglass top. Yet, they can do a modern retro.
You are dead on right about the 4Runner being based on the Tacoma and vice versa. Especially since the Land Cruiser has to be based of the Lexus GX 550. Slotting that below the LX 600 / and Former USA Land Cruiser.
I’m glad I bought my 2021 4runner before car prices went crazy! 50k for a TRD off road is moving into nope territory A positive is that the next 4runner could at least have a 3rd pedal, although i would love to see a removable top like everyone else. I’m sure the next gens turbo will be dead reliable.
Look a turbo isn’t a huge problem, it’s the hybrid that I don’t want. Just give us the option of a hybrid on all cars and let us decide. I personally would never buy the new sequoia mainly for that reason. It’s way more unreliable and takes up way too much space to the point that the back of the car can’t fit anything, what is the point of a big suv that cannot fit anything in the back. And lastly there is the back window, I use this option all the time, a power back window lets me stick stuff out the back like kayaks and wood which you cannot do with the new window without the glass coming down and shattering on the kayak, wood, etc…
New 4 runner will be sweet . Love what toyota is doing design wise with tacoma, gx, sequoia, tundra. However get the 5th gen while it lasts. I have a 22 4 runner. I will have 500k miles on it……. See you in 20 years.
I worked on Toyotas for 5 years this platform is reliable as hell but my personal opinion is it's extremely sluggish the performance to gas efficiency just doesn't balance it's self out they're excellent off road but in my opinion it's better options for grocery getters
We recently sold both of our vehicles ‘17 4Runner and a ‘21 Sequoia to downsize to just one vehicle and I can’t make up my mind. Watching every TH-cam video on each one isn’t helping. I’m needing a vehicle now and I can’t wait for the new ones to arrive. I’m torn between the Tacoma and the 4Runner. Mostly for overland trips with my wife and dog. Thinking Tacoma for the space for all of our gear but that 4Runner is just so nice. I’ve read about all the issues with the Tacomas coolant leak, transmission gear hunting and little things that don’t seem right for Toyota.
I would bet that the new 4Runner will also be made in North America and not in Japan. Having been a Toyota watcher for years, it's becoming clear that where the GX and T4R shared a platform and manufactured along side one another, that's likely to change and the (just announced) Land Cruiser will take that spot. I'd also bet that this is an effort by Toyota to keep the T4R's price at around a $40k starting point. The new TLC will start at $65k and be priced just below the GX. I'm sure the ne T4R will be great, but it will diverge (as Tommy said) from the GX platform and be Taco-based.
It would make sense to move its production from Japan, they don’t sell it over there so why produce something that not gonna sell in their own country?
The front tie downs are NOT recovery points. They're just designed to be used during shipping on the boat from Japan. You can seriously damage the 4Runner if they're used as recovery points under extreme stress. I love my 5th gen but one thing it needs and is lacking are true front recovery points.
This is a great daily driver. That’s what you look for in a vehicle Very few take these off road. It’s comfortable around city and highway. Now is the time to buy one because if they increase the price $5k no gas savings on the new model will cover that.
I am on the fence between a 4Runner and a Rav4 for light off-roadyness. But the reliability and longevity of the 4Runner keeps pulling me back.. I'm wanting something for long road trips (about 350 miles) but capable of making it to some off-the-beaten-path zones for camping away from campsites. the cargo space of the 4Runner seems nice too.
Light off roadyness= go with the Rav4. TRD/Adventure or the Hybrids. They're extremely reliable with current Gen5 Rav4's already breaking 400,000miles. If you're going to do any legitimate off-road go 4runner.
The Rav4 honestly cannot really keep up with a 4Runner off-road. If you're doing light stuff, the Rav4 would do fine, but if you're doing anything other than basic pedestrian off-roading, the 4Runner is by far the better choice!
@@oldwelshwitch I had Rav4 before 4Runner. have you look at the Rav4 Hybrids? 40mpg combined with 14.5gal fuel tank is closer to 600miles range. New Rav4 AWD system seem to have improved alot. I don't deny that I'm very confident with the 4Runner off pavement but on a long trip I won't push more than 300miles. But With Rav4 Hybrid I think you can comfortably hit 500miles before thinking to refuel. I'm yet to spend some time at the driving seat of my friend's Rav4 Prime. Again I absolutely love my 4Runners but for fuel range (since you talked about long trips) I would think about Rav4 Hybrid as well. BTW, 4Runners are endless money pits with aftermarket stuff and I keep on buying skids, lights, sliders, different tires, etc..
@@LionRunner I haven’t really looked too in depth at the hybrids, but I’m not against it. have you heard anything good about the woodland edition? I’m wondering if that’s the sweet spot or if it’s just a gimmick. Good to know about the money pit thing on 4Runner haha! Yes I am looking to move about 400 miles away from home to another city, but wanting to be able to travel back to see my parents semi-regularly, maybe a couple times a month.
The Car Care Nut (Toyota mechanic) has proven that the first few years of major Toyota refreshes have NOT been very reliable. Especially with new engine introductions.
The fact that TFL highlights a 14 year old vehicle one in every few videos shows just how perfect it is. Toyota, keep this formula. Durability > (is great than) the latest gizmos and ever-changing emissions standards. By the way, only so called reviewers care about the latest tech. And sure, many consumers, but not 4runner shoppers/buyers/owners.
I hope they leave the V6 NA in it, I'd much rather have an engine that's way to big for the vehicle that never works than a little engine with a turbo that never quits working.
I REALLY wish the 4runner could retain it's V6 even in Hybrid.. I really don’t like this huge push for everything to be 4cyl.. I hope it has that cool new body of the GX550 with a similar grill that it currently has. It would be cool if that outlet in the cargo was a 1500W like the sienna. I know since the TACO is 4cyl that the 4Runner will be too.. but I wish...
My daily driver is a 2000 4Runner that we bought new. Coming up on 250K miles soon. The original 24 year old muffler and tailpipe finally gave up, so I'm putting a cat back system on it. Upgraded the brakes to Tundra brakes and it stops much better. It has a 2" lift, upgraded upper control arms, 285/70 17 Falken Wildpeak AT-3w tires with 6 spoke Level 8 wheels. I love the look of the 3rd gen 4Runners the best....especially with a lift and larger tires. The 3rd gens were just before Toyota started to make the 4Runner a little more luxury oriented for the soccer moms. I like that it has a stick shift for the 4WD instead of a button or dial.
Just revamp the engine to 300hp and torque like the Lexus engine variant . Drop the weight by 250-500 pounds, add a couple more gears and make it standard 35 inch tires. Offer some hybrid options and that would sell very well!
I'll keep my 4.0/5 Speed. 300,000 miles on my Tacoma with this combo and zero problems and I've never touched the trans oil. Even Toyota managed have problems on the 3.5 Twin Turbo used in the Tundra. Even if they get the turbo engines super reliable, will we still see easily achievable 300,000 to 400,000 trouble free miles with regular maintenance?
Me personally i think it drives great, if anything give it the new 8 speed transmission that will help out with fuel economy and maybe a bump in power even though its not needed. I actually like the 4runner overall.
Here’s what they need to change. - Transmission. Maybe cosmetic (mini sequoia) Here’s what they need to keep - everything (especially the roll down rear window, mater of a fact add roll down third row windows) Been living my best “jeep life” for weeks now, just leaving all the windows down.
I also hope they get it right... and RETAIN some knobs and buttons , don't overdo it on screen size. I'm buying a truck not a freakin' iPad on wheels LOL ! Some of the screens actually stick up beyond the dash height and super ugly, looking like an aftethought on lot of vehicles. Really nice job and perspective, Tommy !
I just drove one of these for the first time - 8hr drive. as a person who is 6'3" i found the seating position to be miserable. Very "feet forward" and felt really out of place on a Truck/SUV
Been on the fence about getting a 2023 4Runner (TRD Off-Road Premium) or sticking with my 2020 Max Tow Sport S Jeep Gladiator 😬 if the 4Runner could haul more it'd be an easy decision. I want either to be my LAST vehicle and Toyota's reliability is what has me questioning my commitment to the Jeep
I'll bet the Cruiser will be a Prado with specs intended to compete with the Bronco and Wrangler (locker, 35's (bronco 34's)), while the 4runner competes directly with the Grand Cherokee as a lateral engine two row SUV. Maybe they'll do IRS? Removable panels to get an edge over the GC. Gas mileage and power to compete with the most awarded SUV.
they are smart to wait on the 4Runner, so they can sell more GXs first at higher price, then LC comes out at a higher price, and both take out higher end buyers who would otherwise have gotten the new 4runner
Isn't Toyota having problems with the turbocharged engines in the Tundra. Turbocharging is not innately a problem, but more components, more heat etc leads to reduced reliability by it's very nature.
I just got notified that a TRD Pro was available for me after being on a wait list for 18 months. I passed. I totally get the appeal of the 5th gen being basic and tried and true. But the fact is it’s just plain outdated and the prices they are charging for it at this point is borderline insulting. Not paying 2023 prices for a 2015 truck. I’m definitely interested in the next gen model though when it gets to dealers in 2029 with a $20K ADM.
Whenever the new version comes out I will purchase 2 of the old versions. Start driving one of them and in 20 years ill break out the other one. Currently own a 2010 bought october 2009. 312547 miles . Never went to my mechanic other than oil change brakes and tires (BFG KO2) Plus rumor has it no roll down rear window in new version😢 Dont care about 2 more mpg. Reliability is key
The 4runner is currently based off the prado underpinnings so the new land cruiser prado is the old 4runner in spirit. the 4runner name will be something entirely new
It’s been so long since the Toyota 4Runner has been out 14 years since it was first introduced into the market and it still looks the same as before no big changes and it still looks old school body on frame and it’s still looks like the last old Toyota 4Runner and the interior still just like the last old Toyota 4Runner. The 5 speed automatic in the Toyota 4Runner is still way behind the gears compared to newer Toyota and Lexus models. And will there be a Toyota 4Runner Trail hunter?
One thing I didn't hear you mention was the towing capacity. I would like to see that increase which I think it will because I believe it has increased in the new Tacoma's.
I think you're wrong about the land cruiser, I have a feeling it's going to be a wrangler Bronco competitor, something along the lines of a new fj cruiser
Were it not for onerous cafe standards, Toyota would likely continue with this relatively bomb-proof engine. They could stand to update the transmission which would likely confer greater fuel economy in the process. I'd change the front to give it a greater approach angle, and then do the same for the rear. I would also give the customer the option to drive off the lot with street tires or with some decent all-terrain ones. The interior needs to be updated to include tech that gives you a big screen with all the camera angles, and do a "Bronco", and create spaces for Aux switchgear.
You don't understand one thing. There will be no 4runner and land cruiser Prado together in US. 4runner will be repackaged version of the Prado, which is sold outside US. So 4runner, Prado and Lexus GX will share the same platform. If Toyota brings Land Cruiser in US, it will be just similar SUV what we call 300 in Europe and new Lexus LX already is sold based on this platform. Toyota knows that 4runner is their crown jewel in US and will not screw it up by basing it on Tacoma.
It’s unfortunate that cars are getting so expensive. So many people who would love to buy one these would never be able to because of the cost and the bigger than the sun interest rates.
I traded my beloved xrunner (twins on the way) for my 4runner 10 years ago and I only love it more and more. Everything has always worked and would drive it anywhere still this day. Why change it? If the new generation is introduced incorrectly, god forbid another crossover, I will buy the current generation if I can still find one.
Because the 4runner will have a Trailhunter trim, does that mean that the new 4runner TRD Pro will be more of a desert runner similar to the Bronco Wildtrax or Bronco Raptor ?
Look at the 2023 Toyota Prado EXR offered in the Middle East. De-clad it and turn it into the new 4Runner. That said, it only has a center diff-lock, 6-spd and a 4.0 V6, so...
Well the good news is that the GX 550 kept the pop up glass from the 460, so its possible the new 4runner still has the roll down rear window and maybe just maybe goes into their roots of the 1st generation and makes a removable top like the wrangler and bronco do 🙏
The new 4Runner will likely be built on the Tacoma platform. It should not get bigger like the new GX550. Add a full roof to a 5ft bed double cab Tacoma and you have your new 4Runner. And the interior, powertrain etc can be used as well. Maybe even the same model lineup. 4Runner tie-downs shown are for shipping purposes on boats from Japan to America..They are no recovery points.
And here in the US we wish USA gets what you get in Australia. Like the Nissan Petrol that runs on Diesel, the 4.5L v8 LC70s with 180L fuel combined, Prado with 2.8L dual tanks, etc..
Tommy I think you're wrong I understand where you coming from thinking that 4Runner will be based on data, because the Sequoia is based on the tundra but a thing is that we gotta remember Tacoma is assembled in Mexico and designed in the USA as well as the tundra and the Sequoia are designed in North America and assembled in the USA on the Texas plant, the 4Runner is built in Japan, it might be designed for the North American Market but 100% it will be built in thahara Factory in Japan right along with the Land Cruiser so I think we're going to see a lot of features from the Land Cruiser just a cheaper and smaller package
I predict most will be AWD with only the TRD pro getting 4WD. It will offer the top 2 engines from the Taco and auto only. And just to be controversial, independent rear suspension.
I know it won’t happen, but what I would’ve liked to see happen with the GX and 4Runner was a hybridized setup that used cues from Rivian. Use the 3.5L V6 out of the IS350 and make it RWD, then put 2 independent battery packs up front to control the front wheels. In city driving, you’d have great fuel economy at low speeds with FWD only driving, when going off roading you could change drive modes and go into 100% 4WD. If a front wheel got lifted the ECU would know to stop sending power to that wheel.
I think 4Runner goes away or gets fused in with the LC Prado. It’s basically the same truck already. The GX & 4Runner are the same, minus the engines. How do you beat the 5th gen? You kinda don’t.
Toyota NEEDS to make all their vehicles at least full battery electric hybrid for added power and efficiency. This is extremely important. I have a 1977 Toyota Pickup and will only part with it when Toyota has a full hybrid (or full BEV) Tacoma.
If it aint broke, dont fix it. Just update the creature comforts only. Keep the body, trims and engine. However, Toyota needs to bring back the 5-speed manual with locking diff.
Looking at any turbo engine from the 80s, they’re toasted nowadays, as opposed to any Toyota naturally aspirated from the same period. Turbos are being forced into new production vehicles due to emissions regulations, it’s not the result of engine’s evolution.
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Toyota knocked out of the park their Minivan which is going to be a real problem for...drum roll please... *TOYOTA.*
If it's based on the Tacoma we will get a cheaper, less refined vehicle. We used to get a Prado, now we will get a pickup truck. Just check the weight of a door in a Tacoma vs any 4 Runner. The 4 Runner has an overbuilt feeling we are about to loose in the name of profits.
This is the only time where I’d wish Toyota would be like Jeep. Keep the exterior, and update the interior.
Bingo! The exterior is still good looking.
no
Dump the unfortunate overwrought origami Darth Vader front end of this last "refresh" on most trims, especially bad on the Pro. The more conservative TRD Sport front end by far the best looking of the current variants, IMO, too bad it's not available on others... almost harkens back or pays homage to some mid gen Land Cruisers, Tacos, etc Marry that more grown-up look with the Pro and other variants' fun bits and you have something. Keep the basic package of the rest of it, just-right size, etc, other than obvious powertrain changes (what we need is a good inline turbo 6 or even 5!) and some interior refinement like some first rate (comfort) seats) - and clean up the center stack and - without going too digital. Generally, don't fix too much what ain't broke. I do like that the AC vents are still "normal," ie up high/face level versus being forced below by the high screens these days, and I like that the screen is at least integrated into the dash... keep the plasticky, blocky sharp angle / edge tacked-on screen crap down that seems to be epidemic now. Not opinionated on this am I?!
@@springertubeyou trippin. This guy really said the trd sport is the best looking. I think nobody agrees with you besides the soccer moms. Trd pro is by far the best looking and most aggressive. They won’t keep the same exact design. They will refresh it but Toyota has already come out and said it won’t sway far from what the 4Runner has always been throughout its history. It’s gonna look even better and I’m a 5th gen owner of a built up sr5 and it’s time for a new design. They won’t keep the same after the 5th gen has been around for as long as it has. But the trd sport is literally the most worthless trim they added on just to squeeze out every penny out of the 5th gen. It basically looks like the city slickin limited trim. Brings shame to the trd name.
@@andyham6094 To each their own for sure, sounds you're tripping yourself on the Kool Aid. I would've thought must be a Gen Y fanboi til I heard how many gens...the front end on the currents is an overwrought embarrassment looking like it was designed by an 11 year old in "study hall."
I don't know how the new hybrid Sequoia is selling, but I know I have not seen one on the road.
Sad to hear that so many people are willing to trade rock solid reliability, for screens and gadgets. Option wise, all I need is an Aux jack, power windows, and ice cold A/C. LOVE good old dials, levers, knobs, and switches.
Just what the American public needs..........MORE things to distract them from focusing on driving.
“Outdated” but that’s why we love them. It gets to a point technology becomes too much and unnecessary.
I have a ‘21 ORP with 47k miles and I get 21mpg with mostly highway and backroad driving. Definitely wish that it was more up to date, but I bought it for what it is: Extremely Capable and Profoundly Reliable.
Never get tired of these Toyota 4Runner videos !
Can’t wait to see the new $60k+ price tag.
It’s become a really sad reality that being a car person has become to expensive of a hobby for regular citizens 🥲🥲
I paid $38000+ for a Limited in 1998, with inflation rates you're talkin almost $71k in 2023.
60k yeeeea Right dealers these days high 70s to 80k for a solid year or two
Yep, Sequoia went from $52,000 to $75,000 with the “upgrade” new model.
get over it, that is how all new vehicle are.
Just bought a 2021 SR5 Premium with XP Predator package. It's basically my dream car and I love everything about it! Look forward to seeing what Toyota does with the new 4Runner.
I think this is the peak for the 4 Runner in terms of reliability. Everything in the future will sacrifice some reliability for looks and creature comforts. This may be a highly sought after vehicle in 15 years
may? it definitely will be
Agree. I love my outdated ride.
Toyota is building Hybrids and other engines for decades. They won't put a garbage in their vehicles. After 15 years, all will be electric. Toyota trying for 600 miles range battery. There will be no or far away from home gas stations with crazy prices. Used vehicles with ICE price will tank.
@anjansingh3093 Keep dreaming. The grid in thr US can't handle everyone having an electric vehicle and it doesn't look like that's changing anytime soon
umm no they are more reliable NOW than back then!
My first 4x4 was an FJ Cruiser, followed by a 5th gen 4Runner, followed by a 5th gen 4Runner lol. I loved this platform and engine!
Toyota is now past it's golden age.
Completely agree with your 4Runner predictions.
Would be great if 4Runner returns to its roots and brings back the hardtop convertible.
Tommy I’m driving a 2022 4Runner TRD Pro and I see all these reviews and knit picking little things. This is my first Toyota as I have had Jeep, Mercury, Ford two, Chevy, GMC and my wife drives Honda CRV. So far I am very satisfied. Also with Work I rent about 50-60 Rentals a year for work. This is a Hunting Truck for Me and I tow a fishing boat, also first time in 35 years I have not had a Truck and this 4Runner is way better off-road, and MPG is better. In 5 years I’ll let you know how good it has been.
My SUV of choice would be the 4Runner, hands down. Very capable and stout, and made in Japan. Hopefully Toyota will keep making them there. I don't think it matters that it is "old". People buy them because of that. The vehicle is perfection, because it has been around for so long. Why mess with it?
I recently purchased a 2022 TRD Pro 4Runner, and I like it much more than I thought I would. To me, it is the perfect size, comfortable, handles great even on the road (better than most people say). I totally get the comments on the powertrain; however, I added a pedal commander, and this really improved the way it accelerates and shifts gears. It doesn’t seem to hunt the gears as much as before. The engines actually feels plenty powerful with good torque. I did not think that until I added the pedal commander. And it is just a solid vehicle that you know will be reliable and is fun to drive. As far as tech, it has everything I need: 360 cameras , blind spot monitoring, cross traffic alerts, apple car play, Bluetooth, phone and voice commands. I don’t need anything else.
The biggest downside is the mpg, but I look at it from a total cost of ownership perspective. What additional costs I pay in lower mpg will be offset by less repairs.
I got my 2020 4Runner with 50k miles one owner sr5 3rd row 4x4 and been modding it myself purchased for 37k with 10k down and I think it’s the best decision I’ve ever made
I'm NOT looking forward to change. Change means new problems, new headaches and more trips to the garage for repairs (potentially). From what I've see and heard, the newer 5th gens are flying off the lots more so then years past, consumers want a reliable vehicle that is tried, tested and true.
If you've been a Toyota fan most of your life then you'll know and understand that most of us do not want or need all the gidges and gadgets. We like the basic, reliable functionable options that come with the 4runner. So call it "old" or a "dinosaur" but that's what we like, this is why 4Runner is what it is today.
Hoping for minimal changes.
Have a 23 Tundra and love it. 25' 4Runner built off of the new 24' Taco would be a great addition for us esp for rock crawling and tougher trails. The 4Runner is just a grinder and if they can keep that lineage going it will be a huge hit. It could fine a new gear in terms of sales imo if they do it right.
I average 16-18 around town and 19-22 out on open roads in my 22 Off-road Premium with a 2.6" front lift and 1.75" rear on 255/80r17 Ridge grapplers.
in canada I averaged around 26 miles per gallon with my 4runner.
RIP your needle bearing then front ring gear.
Did you need any other mods to fit 255/80/17?
Mud flap delete or BMC, or off set wheels?
@@Offshore1977 I have the Trd wheels. There was clearance for the mud flaps, but I took them off. I prefer the look. I did trim some of the front wheel well liner with a utility knife in front of the wheel. Plenty of clearance at the body mount. I do have SPC upper control arms and a diff drop.
Tommy you can make a vehicle that is outdated and so behind the times look so great with all of your banter and your great comments. When the new forerunner is debuted, I really hope TFL put you on the job to view it and roll it out because you do such a great job.
*4Runner
A couple of things I see that could change (and not for the better) No roll down rear window a la the new sequoia, a giant screen which will not fit well with the 4runner, and maybe the biggest change, no longer manufactured in Japan, but in Texas or Mexico.
This is my biggest worry. Since every new truck at Toyota has to be based on the new TNGA platform, they will have to sacrifice a lot of the little things that make the 4Runner so great and unique, all in the name of cost cutting, efficiency and increasing profitability. I think like the new Tundra, it'll still be a "good" vehicle, but there will be a lot of little disappointments. It'll be overall larger/heavier but somehow have less useable interior space. It'll be more fragile, finnicky and slightly less reliable. It'll have more generic tech gimmicks, big screens, and fewer manual knobs/levers. It'll lose little things like the roll-down rear window or the overall analog feel that gives it so much character. I really wanted a 4Runner in a couple of years, but that might change now.
Not being made in Japan is horrible
The current 4Runner has the X factor. Mix of reliability, looks, functionality (rear window, knobs, rear access) and the Toyota vibe. The only thing that I would change if it was not being redesigned would be to offer a larger gas tank. 24 gallons just doesn't get it done. Hopefully the new 4Runner will not be too expensive, and will have better range. Thanks for the video.
I would love to see the new 4Runner to do a modern retro approach like the Bronco.
Bring back the 80s removable fiberglass top. Yet, they can do a modern retro.
You are dead on right about the 4Runner being based on the Tacoma and vice versa. Especially since the Land Cruiser has to be based of the Lexus GX 550. Slotting that below the LX 600 / and Former USA Land Cruiser.
Personally owning two of them. Solid and need no change. If one wants fancy get a fancy GX or LX. Leave this the way it is.
@toyota never get rid of the back window Leave it! LEAVE IT AS IS! we love it
I’m glad I bought my 2021 4runner before car prices went crazy! 50k for a TRD off road is moving into nope territory
A positive is that the next 4runner could at least have a 3rd pedal, although i would love to see a removable top like everyone else.
I’m sure the next gens turbo will be dead reliable.
Look a turbo isn’t a huge problem, it’s the hybrid that I don’t want. Just give us the option of a hybrid on all cars and let us decide. I personally would never buy the new sequoia mainly for that reason. It’s way more unreliable and takes up way too much space to the point that the back of the car can’t fit anything, what is the point of a big suv that cannot fit anything in the back. And lastly there is the back window, I use this option all the time, a power back window lets me stick stuff out the back like kayaks and wood which you cannot do with the new window without the glass coming down and shattering on the kayak, wood, etc…
New 4 runner will be sweet . Love what toyota is doing design wise with tacoma, gx, sequoia, tundra. However get the 5th gen while it lasts. I have a 22 4 runner. I will have 500k miles on it……. See you in 20 years.
800k if you really take care of it!
2023 ORP
Averaging 19mpg city, 20-24mpg highway (up and down Colorado mountains).
Absolutely love the 4 Runner.
this video is perfect timing for me.. I am on the fence wanting to buy one right now!
If you keep your vehicle for 10+ years.....go with the 5th Gen. I can pretty much guarantee the new ones will be nowhere near the 2023 in reliability.
@@jimmorrison2124 I definitely do, I like to make a good investment and stick with it. thanks Jim!
One word describes why I love my 4Runner. Reliable.
I worked on Toyotas for 5 years this platform is reliable as hell but my personal opinion is it's extremely sluggish the performance to gas efficiency just doesn't balance it's self out they're excellent off road but in my opinion it's better options for grocery getters
We recently sold both of our vehicles ‘17 4Runner and a ‘21 Sequoia to downsize to just one vehicle and I can’t make up my mind. Watching every TH-cam video on each one isn’t helping. I’m needing a vehicle now and I can’t wait for the new ones to arrive. I’m torn between the Tacoma and the 4Runner. Mostly for overland trips with my wife and dog. Thinking Tacoma for the space for all of our gear but that 4Runner is just so nice. I’ve read about all the issues with the Tacomas coolant leak, transmission gear hunting and little things that don’t seem right for Toyota.
I would bet that the new 4Runner will also be made in North America and not in Japan. Having been a Toyota watcher for years, it's becoming clear that where the GX and T4R shared a platform and manufactured along side one another, that's likely to change and the (just announced) Land Cruiser will take that spot. I'd also bet that this is an effort by Toyota to keep the T4R's price at around a $40k starting point. The new TLC will start at $65k and be priced just below the GX. I'm sure the ne T4R will be great, but it will diverge (as Tommy said) from the GX platform and be Taco-based.
It would make sense to move its production from Japan, they don’t sell it over there so why produce something that not gonna sell in their own country?
New generation: 4 cylinder turbo charged 🤦♂️🤦♂️
Generation after: 3 cylinder twin turbo 😆😆
so what? get over it
I own a 22 Tundra SR5. Thinking of trading it in for a 23 4Runner Off road. I like the old school look and interior on the 4Runner.
Great video! I still miss the retractable window and TAILGATE on my 1994 4Runner.
The front tie downs are NOT recovery points. They're just designed to be used during shipping on the boat from Japan. You can seriously damage the 4Runner if they're used as recovery points under extreme stress. I love my 5th gen but one thing it needs and is lacking are true front recovery points.
I think they nailed it all the way home for the Tacoma cannot wait to see the 4
runner version to put my deposit down as soon as availability.
This is a great daily driver. That’s what you look for in a vehicle Very few take these off road. It’s comfortable around city and highway. Now is the time to buy one because if they increase the price $5k no gas savings on the new model will cover that.
I am on the fence between a 4Runner and a Rav4 for light off-roadyness. But the reliability and longevity of the 4Runner keeps pulling me back.. I'm wanting something for long road trips (about 350 miles) but capable of making it to some off-the-beaten-path zones for camping away from campsites. the cargo space of the 4Runner seems nice too.
Light off roadyness= go with the Rav4. TRD/Adventure or the Hybrids. They're extremely reliable with current Gen5 Rav4's already breaking 400,000miles.
If you're going to do any legitimate off-road go 4runner.
@@jmichael6931 good to know! Thank you!
The Rav4 honestly cannot really keep up with a 4Runner off-road. If you're doing light stuff, the Rav4 would do fine, but if you're doing anything other than basic pedestrian off-roading, the 4Runner is by far the better choice!
@@oldwelshwitch I had Rav4 before 4Runner. have you look at the Rav4 Hybrids? 40mpg combined with 14.5gal fuel tank is closer to 600miles range. New Rav4 AWD system seem to have improved alot. I don't deny that I'm very confident with the 4Runner off pavement but on a long trip I won't push more than 300miles. But With Rav4 Hybrid I think you can comfortably hit 500miles before thinking to refuel. I'm yet to spend some time at the driving seat of my friend's Rav4 Prime. Again I absolutely love my 4Runners but for fuel range (since you talked about long trips) I would think about Rav4 Hybrid as well. BTW, 4Runners are endless money pits with aftermarket stuff and I keep on buying skids, lights, sliders, different tires, etc..
@@LionRunner I haven’t really looked too in depth at the hybrids, but I’m not against it. have you heard anything good about the woodland edition? I’m wondering if that’s the sweet spot or if it’s just a gimmick. Good to know about the money pit thing on 4Runner haha! Yes I am looking to move about 400 miles away from home to another city, but wanting to be able to travel back to see my parents semi-regularly, maybe a couple times a month.
The Car Care Nut (Toyota mechanic) has proven that the first few years of major Toyota refreshes have NOT been very reliable. Especially with new engine introductions.
The fact that TFL highlights a 14 year old vehicle one in every few videos shows just how perfect it is. Toyota, keep this formula. Durability > (is great than) the latest gizmos and ever-changing emissions standards. By the way, only so called reviewers care about the latest tech. And sure, many consumers, but not 4runner shoppers/buyers/owners.
I hope they leave the V6 NA in it, I'd much rather have an engine that's way to big for the vehicle that never works than a little engine with a turbo that never quits working.
old school digital clock and the clock on the infotainment screen. 😆
I REALLY wish the 4runner could retain it's V6 even in Hybrid..
I really don’t like this huge push for everything to be 4cyl..
I hope it has that cool new body of the GX550 with a similar grill that it currently has.
It would be cool if that outlet in the cargo was a 1500W like the sienna. I know since the TACO is 4cyl that the 4Runner will be too.. but I wish...
My daily driver is a 2000 4Runner that we bought new. Coming up on 250K miles soon. The original 24 year old muffler and tailpipe finally gave up, so I'm putting a cat back system on it. Upgraded the brakes to Tundra brakes and it stops much better. It has a 2" lift, upgraded upper control arms, 285/70 17 Falken Wildpeak AT-3w tires with 6 spoke Level 8 wheels. I love the look of the 3rd gen 4Runners the best....especially with a lift and larger tires. The 3rd gens were just before Toyota started to make the 4Runner a little more luxury oriented for the soccer moms. I like that it has a stick shift for the 4WD instead of a button or dial.
Just revamp the engine to 300hp and torque like the Lexus engine variant . Drop the weight by 250-500 pounds, add a couple more gears and make it standard 35 inch tires. Offer some hybrid options and that would sell very well!
I'll keep my 4.0/5 Speed. 300,000 miles on my Tacoma with this combo and zero problems and I've never touched the trans oil. Even Toyota managed have problems on the 3.5 Twin Turbo used in the Tundra. Even if they get the turbo engines super reliable, will we still see easily achievable 300,000 to 400,000 trouble free miles with regular maintenance?
Current gen 4Runner gives you everything, a good V6 engine, mpg of a V8 and performance of a V4.
FYI, those aren't recovery points, they are emergency towing eyelets, you can tow for 50 miles up to 18 mph.
Me personally i think it drives great, if anything give it the new 8 speed transmission that will help out with fuel economy and maybe a bump in power even though its not needed. I actually like the 4runner overall.
Here’s what they need to change.
- Transmission.
Maybe cosmetic (mini sequoia)
Here’s what they need to keep
- everything (especially the roll down rear window, mater of a fact add roll down third row windows)
Been living my best “jeep life” for weeks now, just leaving all the windows down.
I also hope they get it right... and RETAIN some knobs and buttons , don't overdo it on screen size. I'm buying a truck not a freakin' iPad on wheels LOL ! Some of the screens actually stick up beyond the dash height and super ugly, looking like an aftethought on lot of vehicles. Really nice job and perspective, Tommy !
I have a 2007 sr5 224000 miles never a problem 🤞🏻. Still scoots!
I just drove one of these for the first time - 8hr drive. as a person who is 6'3" i found the seating position to be miserable. Very "feet forward" and felt really out of place on a Truck/SUV
I bought one last year and I’m going to drive it until they ban it and drag me out of it. Fed up with poorly built American trucks.
Been on the fence about getting a 2023 4Runner (TRD Off-Road Premium) or sticking with my 2020 Max Tow Sport S Jeep Gladiator 😬 if the 4Runner could haul more it'd be an easy decision. I want either to be my LAST vehicle and Toyota's reliability is what has me questioning my commitment to the Jeep
Random question... what neighborhood are you driving through? It looks so nice!
I’m diggin’ that Anniversary model!
I'll bet the Cruiser will be a Prado with specs intended to compete with the Bronco and Wrangler (locker, 35's (bronco 34's)), while the 4runner competes directly with the Grand Cherokee as a lateral engine two row SUV. Maybe they'll do IRS? Removable panels to get an edge over the GC. Gas mileage and power to compete with the most awarded SUV.
they are smart to wait on the 4Runner, so they can sell more GXs first at higher price, then LC comes out at a higher price, and both take out higher end buyers who would otherwise have gotten the new 4runner
How do you explain the engine and turbo problems in the new Tundra if Toyota has “perfected” turbos?
They do make their own turbos and waste gates, so far only the Lexus vehicles with turbos run better than the Toyotas.
Isn't Toyota having problems with the turbocharged engines in the Tundra. Turbocharging is not innately a problem, but more components, more heat etc leads to reduced reliability by it's very nature.
Amazing how Tommy can keep talking and talking and talking.
I just got notified that a TRD Pro was available for me after being on a wait list for 18 months. I passed. I totally get the appeal of the 5th gen being basic and tried and true. But the fact is it’s just plain outdated and the prices they are charging for it at this point is borderline insulting. Not paying 2023 prices for a 2015 truck. I’m definitely interested in the next gen model though when it gets to dealers in 2029 with a $20K ADM.
Thx for passing on pro😂
@@mrketo7077 No problem, hope whoever gets it enjoys it. It was only offered to me because someone else turned it down as well.
*sighs* this one is my lottery wishlist vehicle. That black paint and colourful stripe and the bronze wheels. A fella can dream.
Whenever the new version comes out I will purchase 2 of the old versions. Start driving one of them and in 20 years ill break out the other one. Currently own a 2010 bought october 2009. 312547 miles . Never went to my mechanic other than oil change brakes and tires (BFG KO2) Plus rumor has it no roll down rear window in new version😢 Dont care about 2 more mpg. Reliability is key
Update the grill and headlights, Leave the rear the same, update interior. 4runner is like a rolex, design is timeless.
The 4runner is currently based off the prado underpinnings so the new land cruiser prado is the old 4runner in spirit. the 4runner name will be something entirely new
It’s been so long since the Toyota 4Runner has been out 14 years since it was first introduced into the market and it still looks the same as before no big changes and it still looks old school body on frame and it’s still looks like the last old Toyota 4Runner and the interior still just like the last old Toyota 4Runner. The 5 speed automatic in the Toyota 4Runner is still way behind the gears compared to newer Toyota and Lexus models. And will there be a Toyota 4Runner Trail hunter?
One thing I didn't hear you mention was the towing capacity. I would like to see that increase which I think it will because I believe it has increased in the new Tacoma's.
5000 towing capacity
Because the Tacoma will have two separate rear suspension designs available, I agree that the 4Runner is likely to be based on the upcoming Tacoma.
Toyota has a history that says if they make it there is a good chance it’s issue will be limited.
I think you're wrong about the land cruiser, I have a feeling it's going to be a wrangler Bronco competitor, something along the lines of a new fj cruiser
Were it not for onerous cafe standards, Toyota would likely continue with this relatively bomb-proof engine. They could stand to update the transmission which would likely confer greater fuel economy in the process. I'd change the front to give it a greater approach angle, and then do the same for the rear. I would also give the customer the option to drive off the lot with street tires or with some decent all-terrain ones. The interior needs to be updated to include tech that gives you a big screen with all the camera angles, and do a "Bronco", and create spaces for Aux switchgear.
What about the Stout?good video 👍🏽
You don't understand one thing. There will be no 4runner and land cruiser Prado together in US. 4runner will be repackaged version of the Prado, which is sold outside US. So 4runner, Prado and Lexus GX will share the same platform. If Toyota brings Land Cruiser in US, it will be just similar SUV what we call 300 in Europe and new Lexus LX already is sold based on this platform. Toyota knows that 4runner is their crown jewel in US and will not screw it up by basing it on Tacoma.
It’s unfortunate that cars are getting so expensive. So many people who would love to buy one these would never be able to because of the cost and the bigger than the sun interest rates.
Do we think the 4Runner will get the 6spd manual like the 2024 Tacoma?
I traded my beloved xrunner (twins on the way) for my 4runner 10 years ago and I only love it more and more. Everything has always worked and would drive it anywhere still this day. Why change it?
If the new generation is introduced incorrectly, god forbid another crossover, I will buy the current generation if I can still find one.
Because the 4runner will have a Trailhunter trim, does that mean that the new 4runner TRD Pro will be more of a desert runner similar to the Bronco Wildtrax or Bronco Raptor ?
There is a bunch of rumors saying the new Land Cruiser(Prado) will replace the 4Runner. I guess we'll find out soon enough!
I feel that 4 runner will be discontinued ...just like toyota did with the FJ Cruiser?
I just want it to come out already and see how the engine performs.
Look at the 2023 Toyota Prado EXR offered in the Middle East. De-clad it and turn it into the new 4Runner. That said, it only has a center diff-lock, 6-spd and a 4.0 V6, so...
I hope they keep the sliding window in the rear hatch. GX550 doesn't have that.
Well the good news is that the GX 550 kept the pop up glass from the 460, so its possible the new 4runner still has the roll down rear window and maybe just maybe goes into their roots of the 1st generation and makes a removable top like the wrangler and bronco do 🙏
The new 4Runner will likely be built on the Tacoma platform. It should not get bigger like the new GX550. Add a full roof to a 5ft bed double cab Tacoma and you have your new 4Runner. And the interior, powertrain etc can be used as well. Maybe even the same model lineup. 4Runner tie-downs shown are for shipping purposes on boats from Japan to America..They are no recovery points.
I had always wished we got this model in Australia 🇦🇺
And here in the US we wish USA gets what you get in Australia. Like the Nissan Petrol that runs on Diesel, the 4.5L v8 LC70s with 180L fuel combined, Prado with 2.8L dual tanks, etc..
Tommy I think you're wrong I understand where you coming from thinking that 4Runner will be based on data, because the Sequoia is based on the tundra but a thing is that we gotta remember Tacoma is assembled in Mexico and designed in the USA as well as the tundra and the Sequoia are designed in North America and assembled in the USA on the Texas plant, the 4Runner is built in Japan, it might be designed for the North American Market but 100% it will be built in thahara Factory in Japan right along with the Land Cruiser so I think we're going to see a lot of features from the Land Cruiser just a cheaper and smaller package
I predict most will be AWD with only the TRD pro getting 4WD. It will offer the top 2 engines from the Taco and auto only. And just to be controversial, independent rear suspension.
I just want…the size of the second gen sequoia, the interior of the 3rd gen, and the durability and capability of the LC200. WHY CANT WE HAVE THAT
The 4Runner (imo) is so close to being the perfect vehicle. MPG and updated interior would go a long way to that reality.
I know it won’t happen, but what I would’ve liked to see happen with the GX and 4Runner was a hybridized setup that used cues from Rivian. Use the 3.5L V6 out of the IS350 and make it RWD, then put 2 independent battery packs up front to control the front wheels. In city driving, you’d have great fuel economy at low speeds with FWD only driving, when going off roading you could change drive modes and go into 100% 4WD. If a front wheel got lifted the ECU would know to stop sending power to that wheel.
What does a new 6th gen coming out do to the 5th gen price wise? Does it make a considerable difference as 2025 roll out?
I’d like to see an awd of 4auto option on the off road trims.
I think 4Runner goes away or gets fused in with the LC Prado. It’s basically the same truck already. The GX & 4Runner are the same, minus the engines. How do you beat the 5th gen? You kinda don’t.
Toyota NEEDS to make all their vehicles at least full battery electric hybrid for added power and efficiency. This is extremely important.
I have a 1977 Toyota Pickup and will only part with it when Toyota has a full hybrid (or full BEV) Tacoma.
This platform had a lot of room for improvement with so many components hanging below the frame
If it aint broke, dont fix it. Just update the creature comforts only. Keep the body, trims and engine. However, Toyota needs to bring back the 5-speed manual with locking diff.
Looking at any turbo engine from the 80s, they’re toasted nowadays, as opposed to any Toyota naturally aspirated from the same period. Turbos are being forced into new production vehicles due to emissions regulations, it’s not the result of engine’s evolution.