Bethesda needs to first reevaluate the value proposition of their own paid content, because Bards College blows it out of the water. Why is ‘Escape’ not a part of the DLC we already paid for? It’s better than 90% of Starfield’s quests. They then need to start a ban wave beginning with the Beowulf attachment author and the Vasco skin author. Terrible, low effort grifters should not be allowed.
@@Joov Kind of damned if you do damned if you don’t though. People said the quality of the Creations don’t warrant paying for them and they really need to make better content if they’re going to charge. But when they do, it becomes “this is so good it should just be part of the game.”
@@evolab8983you aren't wrong, but in this case I think people are more upset that they enjoyed the paid quest more than the main game. Instead of adding more enjoyable Starfield content, they added a quest that made most of the game look lazy by comparison. So in this case, the quest should be free as a sort of apology for the main game not living up to expectations, and allow everyone to experience it without paying extra.
@@Joov escape is really great, and most people get it free so I don’t care about the price. Definitely agree though, there needs to be restrictions. I think things should have to be *new stuff* to be paid. Not just skins or attachments, that’s a scam.
Regardless of how good the paid mods can be, it doesn't justify it because every time you buy them you slowly bring this practice to becoming the standard... ruining everything for everyone.
I thought it was supposed to be a way for us to support community mod authors, but Bethesda seems to just be turning it into another soulless micro transaction store.
Yeah they went the hands-off marketplace route like Steam does, which leads to the store being bloated with meme games, asset-flips, and unfinished early access games. And funnily enough one of the recent creations for Skyrim WAS an asset-flip... time truly is cyclical
It always was another soulless micro transaction store. Getting publicity with a huge release is all BGS was looking for in order to just drop all restrictions and let the cash flow.
Pay-to-play missions and content was always the logical end point of microtransactions. Bethesda is just escalating as usual. Pretty soon we'll just come full circle and charge 25 cents to continue when you die like at the arcade back in the day.
Exactly. There's no way the suits at BGS are looking at how much money people are willing to spend for crumbs of content on the Creations store, and not get instant hard-ons. This is not the final version, and I don't want to enable them any further.
Yep, can't have the Devs sell us low-effort Creations for $7 and then be surprised that randoms are selling low-effort Skins for money. The bar for quality was in h*ll before anyone without a check-mark even got a chance to decide what Creation Club would be to the Community; it didn't stand a chance...
Gotta admit, the free-market approach to Creations is interesting to observe as someone who hasn't bought any. The Libertarian bros are having a moment right now.
@@InconsequentialGaming Its the free-market race to the bottom, see how little you can do whiling charging as much as you can. Its not a good look for BSG but profit first.
@@darkenzor money or no, when you set the tone for a thing, you ultimately play a part in how that thing comes to be, just like raising kids or taking a wife, you can't be a s**ty dad, and then be confused as to how your brats turned into statistics, or why your marriage is failing. Had Bethesda started off on the right foot, and made quality content from the very beginning, I'm sure this conversation would be very different, and not be smeared with nearly as much apathy. It's almost like "f**k Bethesda", and who can really be mad at it? Not sure what needs to happen, but the folks over at Bethesda have gotta learn to respect us, the customer, if they keep this s**t up, I don't see a future for them in this newer landscape, as sad as that sounds to say. 🤷
@@XNyvedX Elianora is a hack. Its not hard to make and decorate cells. Its the easiest thing you can do in the tools other then edit npc inventories. Personally I always found her houses overly crowded and not very creative.
I've just spent the last few days porting my UC armour mods from Nexus onto Creations. For free, and I don't have an Xbox - I just want more people in the community to enjoy the stuff I make as a hobby. It really doesn't need to be any more complicated than that. Paid mods need to be carefully regulated by Bethesda - scammy asset flips will ruin it for everyone if left unchecked
Why does Bethesda allow this? I have a simple, honest answer. Companies don't want some of the money. They want ALL OF THE MONEY. And they will do ANYTHING to get more.
Bro what do you prefer: battle pass and huge microtransactions or just paid mods? That's Bethesda's way of making money and it's better than ea's or ubisoft's
@@FakeAdirTV We prefer neither, that's the whole point of speaking out. Bethesda, EA and Ubisoft are all rolling in money, they're not some struggling mom n pop companies that depend on predatory business practices to stay afloat, and they don't need you to defend them. If you think it's impossible to make money without doing that in the modern era, just look at baulder's gate, cyberpunk, elden ring, etc etc
I think Bethesda, needs some standard of quality and originality for these mods. I also completely disagree with allowing mods that were once free, to become monetized. That has the potential to really damage the modding community.
I'm fine with it if they actually are significantly improved, or as a way for the developer(And there needs to be some kind of way for the developer to be verified as such) to add a "donate" button. Basically, "Hey, this mod's for free on the creation club, but you can also buy it for $1 if you'd like". Something like that seems "fine" until there's an actual donate button, at least if it's clearly labeled as such. An actual donate button would be better though. The problem is that these mods need to be clearly labeled as also having a free version, and that any improvements really do need to be significant if they're charging for them.
Would you rather have them force modders remove their free mods to be on the creations store cause that's most certainly what they would do as the alternative, At the end of the day if you don't like it don't support it, it's a user to user decision after all
Agreed. I hope those kinds of creations will win out, instead of the low quality cash grabs. Although, maybe Bethesda lets those creators through because they relate to it...
Same, why would I continue making housing mods and faction edit mods for free like I did for Skyrim and Fallout if I don't get anything free in return? Just look at Starfield Nexus this is already happening. By the end of year one Skyrim and Fallout 4 has WAY more custom weapons / armors / items then Starfield dose now. Everything being released for free is super low quality and is very seldom.
it's not about paying for mods, it's about Bethesda getting the money for work they didn't do while also restricting modding by only allowing the stuff on their own platform
What this has done is only firmed my opinion. They don't want a well-regulated shop with a wide variety of mods from 1$ or so textures to 15$ DLC sized things. They want a microtransaction trash filled cash shop to make a bunch of money.
@@zachrohler1047 76 is an mmo that's just par for the course. I had a small hope Beth wouldn't go full AAA dev trash with it in singleplayer. So small you'd need a microscope to see it, but hope.
@MrJemoederopeenstokj I've never played it. They lost me at the mmo part. Never mind anything else people don't like. I just meant the cash shop was normal by mmo standards as far as I saw. Which to be fair is one of the reasons I don't really like mmos.
Remember that Todd is a fan of how Bejeweled (yes, the garbage mobile casino style game) deals with conveying success to feed into the addiction loop and microtransactions. He has even mentioned this on a talk in a past.
Yeah and they should enable console too. First they remove things like Mei Devine dress from players and then you try to use console command and poof, safe file ruined
the whole premise of paid mods was **supposedly** that bethesda could help fund and test big expansion size mods like falskaar or fallout london, they have *not* done this, theyve just pumped out the most low effort and even broken stuff possible for absurd prices. none of these reskins should even be allowed to be part of the creation club. all this is doing at this point is *hurting* the modding industry. this has nothing to do with helping modders, its greed all the way through.
@@godhump222 Except it isn't a small cut, though, is it? It wasn't for Creation Club and for Verified Creations they won't even tell us. I can't help but to think the reason that they won't tell us the cut they're getting from Verified mods is because that it's massive compared to the pennies the actual authors are getting in return. Oh, also, if they really want to sell and publish content that they themselves didn't even make... Least they could do is update it on time. The StarSim: Mining Conglomerate creation took half a year to get a basic bug fixing patch. This is Bethesda's fault. They get all the money, and they get to decide when they push the single button required to update a modder's work. Stop shilling
@@joeswanson3058 Without any real evidence of a massive cut all your words are just fear mongering and conspiracy. We already heard in THIS video that the mod developers who made paid mods want to continue and value the money that's coming in from their hard work. Also I'm pretty sure problems with individual mods is the mod authors problem. Stop trolling.
@@Hullabaloo27264 Bethesda takes a cut, which means they aren't immediately incentivized to remove content that sells regardless of how bad the quality. Cheap quality content that sells is easy money for them. They are allowing the market to be poisoned for short term gains. BGS not having a cut is one way to help them be less finically bias, but also if they took a second and looked at the current trajectory of the store and how it effects their image they could find ways to self moderate while still earning getting their cut.
Exactly. I think all the large companies are. Seems like we're at the tipping point here with all this bullshit, thank god. The entire system needs to collapse so we can start again, lol
I think if you want to pay for mods, you should go to Nexus and contribute towards the mod authors. I haven't bought or played Starfield yet, and my experience with mods is with Fallout. I'm not a fan of paid mods in general, but I hate the idea of Bethesda getting a cut when you've already paid $70+ for the game.
Funniest thing is thats basically what i could consider even remotely allowable in terms of mods that deserved to be paid, but this system will fail, like the others (if only i could say the same for the company itself tbh)
Paid mods always have been, and always will be, a slippery slope. I get that some of the great mods of our times, such as Dragonborn's Legacy, Sim Settlements 2, Fallout London and many more deserve some kind of compensation for the mod author's who spent their time and, in some cases, their own money on them, but the very problem we are seeing now was always going to pop up no matter what paid mod system was implemented. That's why I have always been against ANY paid mods from the get go because I knew that it was always going to be this way. In the past you modded your game at your own risk, understanding that a single mod could destroy your load order and break your game, but since they were free and only cost you time to get them to work, it was fine, but once a monetary value was added then they became a product that should work straight out of the box and that's not always the case. Now if you purchase mods and they break your load order then you are just out that money if the mod authors or community can't get it to work. I see both sides of the argument, but in my opinion, mods should have just been left as a labor of love that helped extend the life of Bethesda's games because let's be for real...without (FREE) mods, there is no way Bethesda would have been able to sell Skyrim 400 times in the last 10+ years, so they benefited financially from those mods through out the years. And some mod author's got actual jobs from showcasing their work. But it is what it is and I doubt that genie is going back into the bottle. I just know that I haven't touched a single Bethesda game since this latest iteration of "Creations" went live and don't really seeing myself doing so in the near future.
THIS!!! DLC, in my opinion, has always been a bit of a slippery slop with the logical conclusion that game companies will either make you pay for parts of a full game, think Bethesda letting you play Fallout 4 until you get to diamond city and a then pop up saying "hey to experience the rest of the story drop another $30 dollars," or as proposed by the CEOs of Rockstar and Ubisoft, making players pay to play a game for a certain time limit, say $10 a month. However, I digress, paid mods are the result of Bethesda profiting off the work of others and, as you said, Bethesda games would not be near as popular as they are today without the modding community. Without mods, most of these games would either be dead a few years after the end of official releases, or cult classic games like KOTOR, that survive off the strength of their stories, albeit with not nearly as large a fanbase as back in their hayday.
Honestly, I hate shaming, but half of the blame is on those who pay for these. The other half is on Bethesda making people so thirsty for content that they pull off some of the most anti-consumer tactics in gaming history.
Completely agree like why would Bethesda put in effort if their fans are gonna give them money no matter what they do. Like Bethesda fans are self-destructive levels of complacent Edit: I truly believe that Bethesda needs an undeniable failure that scares them into being better.
Who knows, maybe if Bethesda had started with high-effort, quality Creations in the beginning, we wouldn't be here? They always seem to start-off on "the wrong foot", and inevitably get saved by a loyal Community. I don't want them to fall-on-their faces, but maybe that's what they actually need? 🤔
So much this. If people didn't buy subpar "content" (especially those claiming to "review" them) there wouldn't be a market for it because it wouldn't be worth the effort to post it. It's simple economics. Similarly, people buy with the expectation that Bethesda has curated what's available on their store for quality and compatibility because nobody reads things like disclaimers and terms of service, they just tick the box and want to have fun. The reason "reviewers" are worse for the issue than ignorant buyers is that they create a loop of reviewing garbage mods for clicks, so people make more garbage mods for them to buy and review, so they get more views to their channel and need more garbage mods for their next video... Even if consumers never bought them, "reviewers" alone would prop up the market with getting their audience to effectively hateview the garbage mod reviews.
Spot on, for a second i thought about getting kinggath's mod, but seeing the cash grab stuff again along with this new "feature" tells me i absolutely should NOT feed this monstrosity further, and for that matter, stop wasting your money on these games anyways, was 76 and starfield not a good enough wakeup call?
I had a bad feeling especially if they got bought by Microsoft it would get Minecraft Bedrock level bad... looks like I was right, and I wish I wasn't... I still haven't updated Skyrim since before the Curios Creations update years ago.
@@arcadeportal32Yeah, my biggest worry is that the Bethesda modding scene will eventually devolve into a MC marketplace situation. I really hope this won’t happen, but knowing Microsoft & Bethesda, there’s a very real possibility it might.
@NCRVeteranRanger I really do worry about ES6. There is so much I can see going wrong with it, and the state of the engine compaired to other games that will be coming out around the same time, like Witcher 4 and maybe even another game from Larian. I just worried ES6 is just going to look super dated if they don't do something. Starfield even now feels like weeker Fallout 4, graphics and all, in space...
people who got cucked into accepting the monetization of mods getting cucked out of money for low quality mods? shocker. this is why the modding community benefits from an open and free meritocracy.
Paid Mods are for console users not PC users who have access to unlimited mods and tools. Consoles do not and it costs money to certify mods. I dont mind paying but i do want quality
@@BrandonDenny-we1rw theoretically you could still make free mods for console, the problem being... is that as soon as you make paid mods for one platform the industry (pretending to be ingnorant of the why but purely motivated by greed) pretends thats the standard and does it for PC too.
@@patchesix5848 thats why i said i dont mind paying. I dont. Its a business and its a service that costs money to create why should i expect it for free.
If BGS wants to support mod authors then Creations should be a Mod Author Donation system, where users can donate the amount of money they want to the mod author.
If people were donating to modders using the avenues that already exist, there’d be no modders volunteering for this one. Think about it. If mod consumers were really donating so freely, and Bethesda really taking such a brutally large cut, then why on earth would any Modder sign up for the program? Why not just let the donations roll in from all their fans? The truth is people only like to TALK about donating.
I bet many of these authors disagree with that, considering they are not releasing their mods for free. You can call it community-made DLCs, which is not a bad thing and is likely making more money for these creators.
@@UlissesSampaio They're DLC pretending to be mods, trying to piggyback on the goodwill mods have had for a very long time. Doing this will wittle down that goodwill over the years. Just like how DLCs initially tried to sell themselves as 'smaller expansion packs'... and now we rarely get actual expansion packs anymore. Sure, they'll happen occasionally (like Blood and Wine, or even Dragonborn and the Vampire thing for Skyrim), but by and large expansion packs are dead and gone, unfortunately. I hope the same won't happen to mods. I'm not pessimistic enough to think it will definitely happen, but this certainly angles us toward that direction. We might as well call things for what they are to head off such things.
@nicholasrova3698 dlcs are not a new thing (Oblivion's horse armor dlc was released 18 years ago) and we still get expansion packs to this day. I think that this store opens a better avenue for modders to make some money, and that is a good thing. Free mods will still be a thing imho.
i think they should, BUT it needs to be moderated. i mean some mods are already paid mods (technically) like The legend of the Dragonborn, which is paid via patron, now it is free to download but sme people still technically pay for it to exist. mods like LotDB can be purchasable mods and it i would be for it too. but the mods that would be purchasable need a level of quality that mods currently lack, like the mages college and such. mods that change the game in more ways than just a skin. i think even armor could work but they'd need to be impressive, immersive and well made. currently it isn't very good but paid mods and suporting creator without needing things like patron is a good possitive imo, just moderation is very much nesserery.
Yeah, here's where that weapon mod pack is actually breaking the CGTrader licence agreement. You cannot resell the model you bought in the digital or printed form, but can use it in your commercial projects multiple times after paying for it just once. However, his mod wouldn't be considered a project as it simply inject the models into the game without a quest, so essentially he his reselling the models, just as Nif's instead of OBJ's, however it's still the same models and textures so, yeah, he should probably take it off the creations page. I thought Bethesda had a rule of no ported assets for creations???
Paid modding is bad. Period. I don't care how you flip it around it's just the monetization of something that used to be a free, community effort. We had no issue of making quality free mods before. Now that passion is replaced with greed.
Do remember FNV and Fallout 3, they had micro dlcs that added a couple weapons and an Armour set or two. This is the same thing, but advertised as what it is, a small mod
Yes everyone is completely against the idea of paying people who make computer games for their work! As evidenced by paying for games on Steam. This argument is extremely ill thought out. Micro transactions aren't even a problem - it's just exceptionally greedy, poor quality stuff that's a problem and obviously loot boxes where you don't even know what you're getting are literal gambling, despite what Parliament decided because they're intensely stupid people. I believe the community would love to be able to have mod authors earn their living doing that. Turns out, that people want to be able to support creators of music, artwork, comics, roleplaying games, even huge authors like Brandon Sanderson who just had another $14 million Kickstarter for his RPG. But they want it to be above board, they want access to some quality stuff, and sometimes they want access to thing the rest of us think they're crazy for even buying at all or caring about. The mod scene started before there was any realistic way, whatsoever, for those coders to get paid and it also started very small. Fixing a broken quest wasn't that big a deal. But technology has moved along since I downloaded my first mod - Nexus Mods is now 23 years old. People have been born, got married and had kids since it started and that's just Nexus Mods. FYI people modded Doom in 1993...
@@flamose1 I don`t remember it in Fallout 3 and NV doesn`t really count in your argument as there were supposed to be quests for that stuff but Time Crunche caused it all to be cut
@@flamose1 a simple ini. tweak shouldn't be sold. Those dlc had ACTUAL content additions to the game. They didn't simply retexture a gun and call it a day, either.
There needs to be something to ensure that the good projects get noticed over the bad ones and the cash grabs. Rn it's just the wild west with great projects that are fairly priced getting the same attention as a $5 skin pack. So, I like your idea for the featured column.
I don't care how good the Creation is, I won't buy something that can be rendered inoperable with a single Bethesda update that can break functionality thoroughly.
The thing that really gets me about the Beowolf Healthy Parts one is that's something anyone could do in the creation kit in a couple minutes. When I saw it I considered just doing a free version of it myself and slapping it on Nexus, but it's such a nothing mod that it didn't feel worth it.
You wouldn't even need the Creation Kit, just use Xedit (If there's one for Starfield), I make on the fly edits for Skyrim all the time, that's why I don't buy mods, why buy them, when I can make my own?
Once you have to pay for content from a studio its no longer a mod, it becomes paywalled DLC. There is no inbetween, a mod is something done for free to a game thats not offered by the developers. Hence being a modification.
Well, we had a good run. Companies simply can not stand by idly when there's more money to be made. It doesn't matter what they destroy in the process.
I think mod authors should also be able to apply for that "Achievement Friendly" tag too. That spacer suit overhaul is really cool, but if I wanna ever get the "explore every system" or "reach level 100" achievement, I can't turn it on. Same with the Robin companion. Or DEREK. Or the mods that make Brigs and Cafeterias actually work. They're all verified, all quality, all but one is paid for, they're all 100% lore friendly, but you're punished for using them. I feel like they should use Achievement Friendly tag as sort of a quality definer. Like if the overall texture/mesh quality, voicework, mechanics, etc. are good enough, it should be elligiable for the "AF" stamp of approval. It'd also help weed out asset flips and 0 effort skin mods, as the quality would have to be top notch to get the stamp.
i actually think that bethesda needs to have an internal rating system for these mods early on, and introduce a really good user rating system moving forward. the internal rating system means there’s clear moderation and review that has already happened, and that there’s an initial way to judge quality of a mod before downloading. this would also push people to try and achieve a good Bethesda rating.
You are dreaming if you believe that BGS are going to spend a single shilling on that. They don't even QA their own games - now you actually expect them to test and rate thousands of mods? I agree with you, that it would be great for us players, though! It's a good idea, don't get me wrong! But you seem to be putting your hopes in the wrong company.
the game becomes just a storefront then ...where Bethesda charges out the aas for garbage and you're expected to buy all the individual bits as mods/dlc until you have something that resembles a complete game, but now at many many times the price
The game doesn't even feel finished and they're asking money for content. they add a skin system but no skins in the base game. ALL THESE MODS CAN BE DOWNLOADED FOR FREE BY THE WAY!
@@shaquillemartin5674 They're not surprised, they're engagement farming with videos like this. The "reviewers" alone could keep the paid mod market going by themselves, they get revenue from videos trashing garbage mods, so people keep making garbage mods to sell them to review.
The day Bethesda goes full paid mods is the day their games die completely because it's the only thing holding their bland, buggy and barely functioning games together for replayability😂 To update on this there's people out there who have over 500 to 1k+ mods and if each mod is worth a fiver and you get 1k thats 5 grand just for that many alone, that point look for another game company because Bethesda is only sponging off their player base which will only result in diminished returns.
I come from flight simulators, racing simulators, train simulators, and BeamNG. In those communities there’s a general expectation that most mods are free, and the mods that are paid are good enough to earn your money. There’s absolutely a place for that in Starfield, Skyrim, and Fallout… but it has to be done very differently than this.
When I seen the skins on the marketplace I chuckled. I hoped Bethesda wouldn't allow retextures/reskins but it seems I had too high of hopes. I personally haven't bought any creations because I worry an update will end up breaking mods like it has before.
Bethesda is gonna do whatever they want until they actually start losing money. Some of y’all keep complaining about this and then keep buying their stuff. Stop giving Bethesda money and they’ll be forced to change. Like correct if I’m wrong but remember when they defended 76 not having NPCs and or dialogue only to put both in when they faced so much backlash. All the people who buy regardless of quality, and the people who think we should appreciate Bethesda no matter what they do, are part of the reason Bethesda is as lazy as they are and they won’t stop till the money stops flowing in.
I do have to admit the paid mods are good, but and I’m glad that they put some that I actually love. But a few packs of mods that I actually really want to play desperately as fallout London and the Mojave mud pack info four I wish they could focus or get help for that for fallout.. Or better yet put new Vegas, weapons and fallout four like a weapon pack like they did with the other pack now that would be excellent
Buying individual mods doesn't make any sense, but a fool and their money are soon parted. Then again buying a game that you them have to assemble yourself with mods doesn't make sense either. IKEA furniture should require assembly, not a $70 video game. Modding your car, renovating your home, heck even building miniature hobby games with mods makes sense. Buying 1s and 0s in a digital space that you can never resell or trade is just brain dead.
I was against paid mods when they did the whole Horse Armour rubbish & I am even more vehemently against them now. A friend who makes mods had a Skyrim mod stolen and uploaded onto Creations and Bethesda did nothing until they heard "lawyer". No apology, no compensation, just a quiet removal & brushed under the carpet. Even Bethesda uploaded a broken mod to Creations (Trackers thing) and when it was finally fixed there was no notification, you just have to know it's been fixed & then to uninstall the mod & then reinstall to actually update it. That's right, you can't update the creation, you have to uninstall & reinstall... not to mention some will break when the game updates, in typical Bethesda "I'm gonna wreck it" style of game updates. (Wreck it Ralph film reference FYI) It was always going to be the wild west, they would never have the manpower to moderate creations & never intended to, it's quite literally a virus scan & that's it.
That's an argument for improving it, not an argument against the concept. How would they have the manpower to moderate it is like asking how the IRS could have the manpower to reduce tax evasion in the US - because each member of staff earns more money than they cost to employ. Literally how business works. But yes - the problems you are talking about, all need to be worked on and no, people shouldn't be able to steal each other's work like that.
well well well. Color me surprised. Edit" A day will come where we have to pay 70 or 100 $ for the plain base game and each quest will cost another 5$. This will only lead to developers not putting enough work or content in the base game (Cases which we already have now, of dividing content as DLC) and charging for quests outside the base game, which consumers already paid for. If Any of you support this shitty dev practice, you deserve to be treated as a cash cow.
Modders getting paid is fine, what is not fine is when companies get involved, they only care about money and not offering value as Bethesda clearly prove time and again. I hope creations fails miserable like every other moronic attempt from Bugthesda. That Skyrim quest mod is an insane exception, using that to justify paid mods is a joke, if people want to pay modders they can, we don't need Bethesda or any other awful company getting involved as it will only end in modders and players losing out.
This is why there's 0 faith in a good es6. It makes me sad knowing that it will be a worse/lazier mess than skyrim on release but with less content... so they can sell it to you as "paid content". They missed out in skyrim and you can see how desperate they are to add it in.
The last game I bought from Bethesda was Fallout 4 and their Bait and Switch "Season Pass" that was all filler DLC, full of low effort Garbage. I've never bought another Bethesda game after that, and never will. I'm done with Bethesda.
The only reason that I bought skyrim AE and starfield was because I thought they'd finally listen to their player base and given up on paid mods. NEVER AGAIN
I don’t mind paid mods but it’s mostly a question of quality and what it adds. Like for Fallout 4, I can live without the skins easy but I do like the enclave power armours and military posts as it adds more to the game. Skyrim is somewhat similar but I like the alternative armours for variety in choice and style, though the fishing mod is something I rarely touch and only have it because of the anniversary.
Funnily enough, even though people were originally upset and complaining about Bethesda adding-in their own Creations to the Shop, they seem to be some of the better additions, even if they are admittedly "overpriced". I just think the content needs to be "beefier" and more "substantial" to justify the asking price(s). If they wanna sell skins, do so in a pack of 5 or more, that's currently being sold for the price of just one, and make it work for at least several Weapons of a similar type. Todd acknowledged how the community was feeling about chopping up Quests and selling them to us piecemeal, but don't go and do the same exact thing with Skins and Outfits either. All this nickel and diming s**t needs to stop, like, right now!
Moderation and actual quality control are needed, as said. And the pricing. Why do so few, including Bethesda, not know how to price their mods. Kinggath is the only one who has gotten this right.
Paid mods should never have existed, I understand the appeal to mod makers but as soon as money enters the equation, It's no longer about passion anymore It's only about money.
I’m sorry but if I just spent $70 on a game the only additional paid content I should be buying is dlc that adds way more to the game than a $5 mod. Bethesda should NOT be charging anyone money for their “mods”
Bethesda isn't going to do anything really. Serious moderation would cost money. Honestly, someone needs to start uploading stolen content owned by different companies to get anything done. But I didn't pay for Starfield and still ain't given Bethesda the time of day, so good luck y'all.
i'm gonna be real, modders don't need bethesda to profit from their mods, their are plenty of websites like gumroad that are used to sell mods for games and i'm pretty sure the microtransaction currency bethesda use is just a way for them to weasel out of paying the creators what they're owed anyway i dunno if publishing mod as a creation provides any additional benefits but if a modder just wants to get paid for their work then either sell that work on a website or set up a patreon and just make sure your mod is something players want to pay for
I would only really pay for a full Game Overhaul mod or DLC Expansion sized mod. Nickel and Diming teeny tiny things is not okay to me and I will never spend my money on them.
You can see the numbers on every creation, how many people buyed it and is a lot of people. More people than the average Starfield players on Steam for example. So yeah, a lot of people are buying creations and they are mostly from Xbox or game pass, and probably are people who don't follow game news. We can hate it all we want, but the "normal" people will just see a cool cosmetic and buy it, look at Fortnite and Call of duty. lol
Appreciate you making this video. They're treating it like a MMO! There has to be some standards set, they released a vault tech skin for Vasco for 200 credits, and it looks atrocious! This is getting out of hand.
Just enabling the Escape mod glitched Gravity Well into nonexistence. The Vulture offered a gun you can't reload. Maybe working paid mods would be a nice change.
The paid mods should be big and substantial and quality checked. The skins are BS. I heavily judge the modders who sell those. I don’t buy into the “get it while you can $$$” mentality. They can release actual good content and have a reputation rather than grabbing a quick buck
I didn't mind it until the Anniversary Edition made my xbox one x no longer able to handle it. Doors, fast traveling, opening inventory, scrolling through my inventory. All of those can cause crashes now. Cave entrances cause screen tearing and sometimes infinite loading. And there's no way to reverse it on consoles.
Agreed on both counts. I do think, however, that the price anchor for mods should NOT be the typical mtx bs we see in life-service games. Since BGS earns a percentage, not a fixed amount per mod, however, they have no incentive to keep prices in an adequate range - on the contrary; they'd love it if people got used to spending as much money as possible in their store.
@@heyhoojoe Need policing, the people wanting it to die are just shitters in the face of people like kinggath and his crew, they made legit dlc for us but ugh these low quality mods are ruining it
I'm happy to pay for quality work. I would agree that obvious cash grabs should be moderated out, but who makes that decision? The people who made the horse armor? (For the record, i bought the horse armor out of spite ;) Most of the mods for Starfield that I use are free, and I've paid the author through other channels they offer (ko-fi etc) as a thank you for their work. Whereas some paid mods i've bought on the Creations store I've removed from my load order, because they just weren't for me and weren't worth the space they take up on my system. Were they well made? Yes. But I wish I was able to try them first to see if they would be something I'd use.
The first sparkle horse sold in World of Warcraft made more than Starcraft 2: Wings of Liberty. I would LOVE DLC sized mods, but skins are more bang for the buck.
as someone that has given money to free mod creators, I hate the creations program as you said alienates alot of people. I love the modding community of these games. but creations will make more issues cause it involves money while free mods made sure that people wanted to make something out of a passion and not for cash. I would love financially give to modders. but there maybe more issues but we'll see
My issue with paid mods is that the mod makers pretty much get nothing from the mod and only the Bethesda official mods allow achievements. Also, you pretty much have to be always online to keep the content, which can break some saves. They get an upfront payment and no royalties... They are also limited by how much they can actually make. Todd has been on record regarding how much content is too much. The interview in mind was involving the starfield bounty paid mod. He mentioned originally it was just meant to be a weapon skin mod, but they decided to add a story on it, and the price shot up for something that was so buggy it could brick saves.
Sadly there's this thing called a ratings board. ESRB here in the states, PEGI across the pond and so on. Adding nude mods in an official capacity would likely rate the game higher than what they intended or be outright banned in certain countries, removing a potential market for the game. However, what customers do to modify their game outside of official means is up to the customer alone.
Then the Creation Club would be full of Unrealistic Female Bodies made by people who have never seen a woman before, with Monstrously Gigantic Butts, Humongous gigantic Boobs, and tiny waists, just look on Nexus and you'll see what I mean.
From what i saw from the last update, they added the trackers alliance mission board and to access it you have to finish a 15-30 min quest line, which is literally "speak to the stranger" -> travel to Akila city and speak to faction leader -> "learn" how to track bounties -> "pick one mission" and do that mission with a cliffhanger. Oh? you wanted more? well The NPC tells you to go 1 of 2 boards to pick up mission, one on the same floor or one "elite" mission board downstairs.... The thing is, you can only pick missions from the "elite" board. oh what about the "normal" board? Well, here's the kicker... you have to pay real money on the creation tab to get ONE more mission that is irrelevant from the opening mission.
Good thing you dont speak for the companies. Im a console player and consoles do not get mods because the companies are hesitant to allow foreign scripts that arent tested. They do this so there arent any bugs that could brick someones console. I do not mind paying to bridge the gap between pc and console so yeah get over yourself.
there is a reason people don't want to pay for mods, mostly coming down to quality and compatibility. there is no guarantee a mod stays updated and if the mod is updated, it could have many bugs and glitches. there has to be some sort of standard for this to work
FOLON just released what is basically an entire Fallout sequel for free after many years of work... But ok lets pay for 15 minute quests and armor/weapon packs lol Absolutely ridiculous.
it reminds me of the issue with ff14 modding... It's technically illegal, rarely enforced but on top of it being against ToS some mod creators are selling mods for $2-10+, some look like utter garbage and some literally rip Square's assets and repurposes them, which is like double no-no... and because of people holding these items behind a paywall people are buying it once and uploading it to filesharing sites so others can have it for free. Modding should ALWAYS be free, just tip the creator when you want like on Nexusmod's download page... this stuff should never become a source of income because modding has ALWAYS been a love and passion project centered community.
instantly lost me, that castle thing at the start looked trash. bashed together textures scavenged from the akila city textures. the spacer suits again...just bashed together existing assets made by someone learning how to use the creation kit.
Sorry but you are simply wrong on the second one. That spacer overhaul is made by Zone79, who is by far the best outfit creator in the Starfield modding community. He is also one of the very few actually making custom modeled armors/cosmetics.All of his mods have tons of different variants for the spacesuits/helmets and such for a large level of customizability. Practically anyone playing Starfield with mods is running at least one of his mods. Not only that, he spent almost a whole year releasing extremely high quality free mods to build up a stellar reputation before releasing a paid mod. He is exactly the kind of person who SHOULD be allowed to post content to the store. He makes the content, it's high quality, it works well, and the value proposition of the content/money ratio is good.
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Bethesda needs to first reevaluate the value proposition of their own paid content, because Bards College blows it out of the water. Why is ‘Escape’ not a part of the DLC we already paid for? It’s better than 90% of Starfield’s quests.
They then need to start a ban wave beginning with the Beowulf attachment author and the Vasco skin author. Terrible, low effort grifters should not be allowed.
@@Joov Kind of damned if you do damned if you don’t though. People said the quality of the Creations don’t warrant paying for them and they really need to make better content if they’re going to charge. But when they do, it becomes “this is so good it should just be part of the game.”
@@evolab8983you aren't wrong, but in this case I think people are more upset that they enjoyed the paid quest more than the main game. Instead of adding more enjoyable Starfield content, they added a quest that made most of the game look lazy by comparison. So in this case, the quest should be free as a sort of apology for the main game not living up to expectations, and allow everyone to experience it without paying extra.
@@Joov escape is really great, and most people get it free so I don’t care about the price. Definitely agree though, there needs to be restrictions.
I think things should have to be *new stuff* to be paid. Not just skins or attachments, that’s a scam.
low effort grifters, so bugthesda would need to ban itself then
Regardless of how good the paid mods can be, it doesn't justify it because every time you buy them you slowly bring this practice to becoming the standard... ruining everything for everyone.
I thought it was supposed to be a way for us to support community mod authors, but Bethesda seems to just be turning it into another soulless micro transaction store.
it is and this pupets TH-camrs get their share for preach this stuff.
I mean its the Community mod authors that are using the store this way so its not like they have no blame in this.
Yeah they went the hands-off marketplace route like Steam does, which leads to the store being bloated with meme games, asset-flips, and unfinished early access games. And funnily enough one of the recent creations for Skyrim WAS an asset-flip... time truly is cyclical
It always was another soulless micro transaction store. Getting publicity with a huge release is all BGS was looking for in order to just drop all restrictions and let the cash flow.
Hope it gets fixed.
Can't wait for Elder Scrolls 6 to come in six separately purchased parts
They gonna milk us dry. Believe that
Prologue, Chapter 1, Chapter 2, Chapter 3, Final Chapter, and Post game. $12.99 each or $70 for the whole bundle
Each faction questline is a paid CrEAtIoN
Elder $35.99
Scrolls $59.99
6 $135.99 and spit in your cereal
Pay-to-play missions and content was always the logical end point of microtransactions. Bethesda is just escalating as usual.
Pretty soon we'll just come full circle and charge 25 cents to continue when you die like at the arcade back in the day.
Exactly. There's no way the suits at BGS are looking at how much money people are willing to spend for crumbs of content on the Creations store, and not get instant hard-ons. This is not the final version, and I don't want to enable them any further.
Yep, can't have the Devs sell us low-effort Creations for $7 and then be surprised that randoms are selling low-effort Skins for money. The bar for quality was in h*ll before anyone without a check-mark even got a chance to decide what Creation Club would be to the Community; it didn't stand a chance...
Gotta admit, the free-market approach to Creations is interesting to observe as someone who hasn't bought any. The Libertarian bros are having a moment right now.
@@InconsequentialGaming Its the free-market race to the bottom, see how little you can do whiling charging as much as you can. Its not a good look for BSG but profit first.
@@darkenzor money or no, when you set the tone for a thing, you ultimately play a part in how that thing comes to be, just like raising kids or taking a wife, you can't be a s**ty dad, and then be confused as to how your brats turned into statistics, or why your marriage is failing.
Had Bethesda started off on the right foot, and made quality content from the very beginning, I'm sure this conversation would be very different, and not be smeared with nearly as much apathy. It's almost like "f**k Bethesda", and who can really be mad at it?
Not sure what needs to happen, but the folks over at Bethesda have gotta learn to respect us, the customer, if they keep this s**t up, I don't see a future for them in this newer landscape, as sad as that sounds to say. 🤷
Remember the "Free Forever" movement?
Yes, sadly a lot of authors who were originally a part of that movement sold out.....cough...cough..Elianora..cough
@@XNyvedX Elianora is a hack. Its not hard to make and decorate cells. Its the easiest thing you can do in the tools other then edit npc inventories. Personally I always found her houses overly crowded and not very creative.
I've just spent the last few days porting my UC armour mods from Nexus onto Creations. For free, and I don't have an Xbox - I just want more people in the community to enjoy the stuff I make as a hobby. It really doesn't need to be any more complicated than that. Paid mods need to be carefully regulated by Bethesda - scammy asset flips will ruin it for everyone if left unchecked
TY for Your Mods.
Thank you for your work
Thank you for your service in the modding community, sir!
Problem is BETHESDA is the one making scummy asset flips.
Installed your mods, really amazing work on the UC space suits, definitely staying in my LO
Why does Bethesda allow this? I have a simple, honest answer.
Companies don't want some of the money. They want ALL OF THE MONEY.
And they will do ANYTHING to get more.
'Companies don't want some of the money. They want ALL OF THE MONEY.' reads like a James Stephanie Sterling quote, am I right?
Bro what do you prefer: battle pass and huge microtransactions or just paid mods? That's Bethesda's way of making money and it's better than ea's or ubisoft's
@@FakeAdirTV We prefer neither, that's the whole point of speaking out. Bethesda, EA and Ubisoft are all rolling in money, they're not some struggling mom n pop companies that depend on predatory business practices to stay afloat, and they don't need you to defend them.
If you think it's impossible to make money without doing that in the modern era, just look at baulder's gate, cyberpunk, elden ring, etc etc
@@FakeAdirTVYou're the exact model customer Bethesda and Microsoft are betting this on right now. And it's working.
@@FakeAdirTV you're part of the problem.
I think Bethesda, needs some standard of quality and originality for these mods. I also completely disagree with allowing mods that were once free, to become monetized. That has the potential to really damage the modding community.
I'm fine with it if they actually are significantly improved, or as a way for the developer(And there needs to be some kind of way for the developer to be verified as such) to add a "donate" button. Basically, "Hey, this mod's for free on the creation club, but you can also buy it for $1 if you'd like". Something like that seems "fine" until there's an actual donate button, at least if it's clearly labeled as such. An actual donate button would be better though.
The problem is that these mods need to be clearly labeled as also having a free version, and that any improvements really do need to be significant if they're charging for them.
Would you rather have them force modders remove their free mods to be on the creations store cause that's most certainly what they would do as the alternative, At the end of the day if you don't like it don't support it, it's a user to user decision after all
Funny enough it was the modders that requested this, originally you were not allowed to monetized already existing free mods.
They don't even have that for their games lol
Serana Dialogue Add-on will ALWAYS be FREE
The Bards college is the greatest argument for creations, but as of now it's the exception, not the rule
Agreed. I hope those kinds of creations will win out, instead of the low quality cash grabs. Although, maybe Bethesda lets those creators through because they relate to it...
Perfectly put
yeah, king gath and his team make some crazy good stuff.
This mod makes me wanna redownload the game. (I have mass effect rn, but my computer can't handle too many giant games at once)
Escape, vulture, east empire expansion, and a few others are as good.
Paid mods will kill the modding scene, if all mods are paid the amount of people modding will drop significantly. Myself included.
Same, why would I continue making housing mods and faction edit mods for free like I did for Skyrim and Fallout if I don't get anything free in return? Just look at Starfield Nexus this is already happening. By the end of year one Skyrim and Fallout 4 has WAY more custom weapons / armors / items then Starfield dose now. Everything being released for free is super low quality and is very seldom.
it's not about paying for mods, it's about Bethesda getting the money for work they didn't do while also restricting modding by only allowing the stuff on their own platform
I won't spend a dime anymore on Bethesda games
What this has done is only firmed my opinion. They don't want a well-regulated shop with a wide variety of mods from 1$ or so textures to 15$ DLC sized things. They want a microtransaction trash filled cash shop to make a bunch of money.
You didnt figure that out from fallout 76? Mate you're just delusional
@@zachrohler1047 76 is an mmo that's just par for the course. I had a small hope Beth wouldn't go full AAA dev trash with it in singleplayer. So small you'd need a microscope to see it, but hope.
@@xSaintAngelusx Just because 76 is an MMO, that doesn't excuse it being hot garbage.
@MrJemoederopeenstokj I've never played it. They lost me at the mmo part. Never mind anything else people don't like. I just meant the cash shop was normal by mmo standards as far as I saw. Which to be fair is one of the reasons I don't really like mmos.
Remember that Todd is a fan of how Bejeweled (yes, the garbage mobile casino style game) deals with conveying success to feed into the addiction loop and microtransactions. He has even mentioned this on a talk in a past.
With paid mods, achievements should be allowed...
It's fucking stupid
Yeah and they should enable console too. First they remove things like Mei Devine dress from players and then you try to use console command and poof, safe file ruined
And then the problem comes In where a god mode mod gets made paid, people buy it to cheat then it defeats the purpose of achievements.
Well dont make that achievment friendly then. @RobnDob
sadly achievements are only enabled for bethesda's official paid mods
the whole premise of paid mods was **supposedly** that bethesda could help fund and test big expansion size mods like falskaar or fallout london, they have *not* done this, theyve just pumped out the most low effort and even broken stuff possible for absurd prices. none of these reskins should even be allowed to be part of the creation club.
all this is doing at this point is *hurting* the modding industry. this has nothing to do with helping modders, its greed all the way through.
It's not paid mods for me, it's paying bethesda a cut of the profits for the mod.
It's their legally owned IP. So they should be allowed to take at least a small cut of the profits from these mods.
@@godhump222 Except it isn't a small cut, though, is it? It wasn't for Creation Club and for Verified Creations they won't even tell us. I can't help but to think the reason that they won't tell us the cut they're getting from Verified mods is because that it's massive compared to the pennies the actual authors are getting in return.
Oh, also, if they really want to sell and publish content that they themselves didn't even make...
Least they could do is update it on time. The StarSim: Mining Conglomerate creation took half a year to get a basic bug fixing patch. This is Bethesda's fault. They get all the money, and they get to decide when they push the single button required to update a modder's work. Stop shilling
@@joeswanson3058 Without any real evidence of a massive cut all your words are just fear mongering and conspiracy. We already heard in THIS video that the mod developers who made paid mods want to continue and value the money that's coming in from their hard work.
Also I'm pretty sure problems with individual mods is the mod authors problem. Stop trolling.
@@Hullabaloo27264 bite a curb, slop boy
@@Hullabaloo27264 Bethesda takes a cut, which means they aren't immediately incentivized to remove content that sells regardless of how bad the quality. Cheap quality content that sells is easy money for them. They are allowing the market to be poisoned for short term gains. BGS not having a cut is one way to help them be less finically bias, but also if they took a second and looked at the current trajectory of the store and how it effects their image they could find ways to self moderate while still earning getting their cut.
Bethesda are milking their remaining suckers for all they're worth.
Exactly. I think all the large companies are. Seems like we're at the tipping point here with all this bullshit, thank god. The entire system needs to collapse so we can start again, lol
I think if you want to pay for mods, you should go to Nexus and contribute towards the mod authors.
I haven't bought or played Starfield yet, and my experience with mods is with Fallout.
I'm not a fan of paid mods in general, but I hate the idea of Bethesda getting a cut when you've already paid $70+ for the game.
This
Mean while fallout London is essentially a new fallout game and it's free and better than any paid mod.
Fallout London is okay.
Fallout London I would pay a tenner for without batting an eye-lid. Same as Enderal.
Both are fantastic, Nehrim looks great too.
@@josceola8979so is starfield..
Funniest thing is thats basically what i could consider even remotely allowable in terms of mods that deserved to be paid, but this system will fail, like the others (if only i could say the same for the company itself tbh)
Paid mods always have been, and always will be, a slippery slope. I get that some of the great mods of our times, such as Dragonborn's Legacy, Sim Settlements 2, Fallout London and many more deserve some kind of compensation for the mod author's who spent their time and, in some cases, their own money on them, but the very problem we are seeing now was always going to pop up no matter what paid mod system was implemented. That's why I have always been against ANY paid mods from the get go because I knew that it was always going to be this way.
In the past you modded your game at your own risk, understanding that a single mod could destroy your load order and break your game, but since they were free and only cost you time to get them to work, it was fine, but once a monetary value was added then they became a product that should work straight out of the box and that's not always the case. Now if you purchase mods and they break your load order then you are just out that money if the mod authors or community can't get it to work.
I see both sides of the argument, but in my opinion, mods should have just been left as a labor of love that helped extend the life of Bethesda's games because let's be for real...without (FREE) mods, there is no way Bethesda would have been able to sell Skyrim 400 times in the last 10+ years, so they benefited financially from those mods through out the years. And some mod author's got actual jobs from showcasing their work. But it is what it is and I doubt that genie is going back into the bottle. I just know that I haven't touched a single Bethesda game since this latest iteration of "Creations" went live and don't really seeing myself doing so in the near future.
THIS!!! DLC, in my opinion, has always been a bit of a slippery slop with the logical conclusion that game companies will either make you pay for parts of a full game, think Bethesda letting you play Fallout 4 until you get to diamond city and a then pop up saying "hey to experience the rest of the story drop another $30 dollars," or as proposed by the CEOs of Rockstar and Ubisoft, making players pay to play a game for a certain time limit, say $10 a month. However, I digress, paid mods are the result of Bethesda profiting off the work of others and, as you said, Bethesda games would not be near as popular as they are today without the modding community. Without mods, most of these games would either be dead a few years after the end of official releases, or cult classic games like KOTOR, that survive off the strength of their stories, albeit with not nearly as large a fanbase as back in their hayday.
Honestly, I hate shaming, but half of the blame is on those who pay for these. The other half is on Bethesda making people so thirsty for content that they pull off some of the most anti-consumer tactics in gaming history.
Completely agree like why would Bethesda put in effort if their fans are gonna give them money no matter what they do. Like Bethesda fans are self-destructive levels of complacent
Edit: I truly believe that Bethesda needs an undeniable failure that scares them into being better.
Who knows, maybe if Bethesda had started with high-effort, quality Creations in the beginning, we wouldn't be here? They always seem to start-off on "the wrong foot", and inevitably get saved by a loyal Community. I don't want them to fall-on-their faces, but maybe that's what they actually need? 🤔
So much this. If people didn't buy subpar "content" (especially those claiming to "review" them) there wouldn't be a market for it because it wouldn't be worth the effort to post it. It's simple economics.
Similarly, people buy with the expectation that Bethesda has curated what's available on their store for quality and compatibility because nobody reads things like disclaimers and terms of service, they just tick the box and want to have fun.
The reason "reviewers" are worse for the issue than ignorant buyers is that they create a loop of reviewing garbage mods for clicks, so people make more garbage mods for them to buy and review, so they get more views to their channel and need more garbage mods for their next video... Even if consumers never bought them, "reviewers" alone would prop up the market with getting their audience to effectively hateview the garbage mod reviews.
Spot on, for a second i thought about getting kinggath's mod, but seeing the cash grab stuff again along with this new "feature" tells me i absolutely should NOT feed this monstrosity further, and for that matter, stop wasting your money on these games anyways, was 76 and starfield not a good enough wakeup call?
When Bethesda has enough $$$ Mods available they will code the base game to block external Mod managers , and Mods .
nobody wants paid mods.
I had a bad feeling especially if they got bought by Microsoft it would get Minecraft Bedrock level bad... looks like I was right, and I wish I wasn't... I still haven't updated Skyrim since before the Curios Creations update years ago.
I do
@@arcadeportal32Yeah, my biggest worry is that the Bethesda modding scene will eventually devolve into a MC marketplace situation. I really hope this won’t happen, but knowing Microsoft & Bethesda, there’s a very real possibility it might.
I’m okay with it.
@NCRVeteranRanger I really do worry about ES6. There is so much I can see going wrong with it, and the state of the engine compaired to other games that will be coming out around the same time, like Witcher 4 and maybe even another game from Larian. I just worried ES6 is just going to look super dated if they don't do something. Starfield even now feels like weeker Fallout 4, graphics and all, in space...
Buying something to make the spacers look more believable is insane
people who got cucked into accepting the monetization of mods getting cucked out of money for low quality mods? shocker. this is why the modding community benefits from an open and free meritocracy.
Paid Mods are for console users not PC users who have access to unlimited mods and tools. Consoles do not and it costs money to certify mods. I dont mind paying but i do want quality
@@BrandonDenny-we1rw theoretically you could still make free mods for console, the problem being...
is that as soon as you make paid mods for one platform the industry (pretending to be ingnorant of the why but purely motivated by greed) pretends thats the standard and does it for PC too.
@@patchesix5848 thats why i said i dont mind paying.
I dont. Its a business and its a service that costs money to create why should i expect it for free.
@@patchesix5848 and due to console having probably the biggest player between both platforms only makes them want to set that standard even more
Yeah, "mods" should be free. Official content like expansions, I am willing to pay for. Bethesda is just being greedy.
If BGS wants to support mod authors then Creations should be a Mod Author Donation system, where users can donate the amount of money they want to the mod author.
But this is all about Bethesda profiting from others work.
People don't donate to mod authors.
@@NovaFinch
Been on the Nexus in the last few years?
If people were donating to modders using the avenues that already exist, there’d be no modders volunteering for this one. Think about it. If mod consumers were really donating so freely, and Bethesda really taking such a brutally large cut, then why on earth would any Modder sign up for the program? Why not just let the donations roll in from all their fans?
The truth is people only like to TALK about donating.
@@HareDeLuneif this is THE NovaFinch, then yes…he’s been on the Nexus the last few years…
Bethesda doesn't deserve it's fanbase
These aren't "paid mods" they're DLC masquerading as mods. Mods are free and if someone wants to pay the author there's avenues to do so.
Exactly.Buy 4 of these things and then compare that you can buy a entire game with that money and then you realise how stupid it is
Yes, once it's offered by the studio behind a paywall its DLC and by definition no longer a mod.
I bet many of these authors disagree with that, considering they are not releasing their mods for free. You can call it community-made DLCs, which is not a bad thing and is likely making more money for these creators.
@@UlissesSampaio They're DLC pretending to be mods, trying to piggyback on the goodwill mods have had for a very long time. Doing this will wittle down that goodwill over the years. Just like how DLCs initially tried to sell themselves as 'smaller expansion packs'... and now we rarely get actual expansion packs anymore. Sure, they'll happen occasionally (like Blood and Wine, or even Dragonborn and the Vampire thing for Skyrim), but by and large expansion packs are dead and gone, unfortunately. I hope the same won't happen to mods. I'm not pessimistic enough to think it will definitely happen, but this certainly angles us toward that direction. We might as well call things for what they are to head off such things.
@nicholasrova3698 dlcs are not a new thing (Oblivion's horse armor dlc was released 18 years ago) and we still get expansion packs to this day. I think that this store opens a better avenue for modders to make some money, and that is a good thing. Free mods will still be a thing imho.
Paid mods shouldn't be a thing at all.
real
i think they should, BUT it needs to be moderated. i mean some mods are already paid mods (technically) like The legend of the Dragonborn, which is paid via patron, now it is free to download but sme people still technically pay for it to exist.
mods like LotDB can be purchasable mods and it i would be for it too. but the mods that would be purchasable need a level of quality that mods currently lack, like the mages college and such. mods that change the game in more ways than just a skin. i think even armor could work but they'd need to be impressive, immersive and well made. currently it isn't very good but paid mods and suporting creator without needing things like patron is a good possitive imo, just moderation is very much nesserery.
True
@@shamefulfox5744No
@@shamefulfox5744no
Yeah, here's where that weapon mod pack is actually breaking the CGTrader licence agreement. You cannot resell the model you bought in the digital or printed form, but can use it in your commercial projects multiple times after paying for it just once. However, his mod wouldn't be considered a project as it simply inject the models into the game without a quest, so essentially he his reselling the models, just as Nif's instead of OBJ's, however it's still the same models and textures so, yeah, he should probably take it off the creations page. I thought Bethesda had a rule of no ported assets for creations???
"There's a sucker born every nanosecond." - Todd Howard
"Sixteen times the sucker!"
They've just been waiting for the people who remember the horse armor dlc to let their guards down.
Paid modding is bad. Period. I don't care how you flip it around it's just the monetization of something that used to be a free, community effort. We had no issue of making quality free mods before. Now that passion is replaced with greed.
Do remember FNV and Fallout 3, they had micro dlcs that added a couple weapons and an Armour set or two. This is the same thing, but advertised as what it is, a small mod
Yes everyone is completely against the idea of paying people who make computer games for their work! As evidenced by paying for games on Steam. This argument is extremely ill thought out. Micro transactions aren't even a problem - it's just exceptionally greedy, poor quality stuff that's a problem and obviously loot boxes where you don't even know what you're getting are literal gambling, despite what Parliament decided because they're intensely stupid people. I believe the community would love to be able to have mod authors earn their living doing that. Turns out, that people want to be able to support creators of music, artwork, comics, roleplaying games, even huge authors like Brandon Sanderson who just had another $14 million Kickstarter for his RPG.
But they want it to be above board, they want access to some quality stuff, and sometimes they want access to thing the rest of us think they're crazy for even buying at all or caring about.
The mod scene started before there was any realistic way, whatsoever, for those coders to get paid and it also started very small. Fixing a broken quest wasn't that big a deal. But technology has moved along since I downloaded my first mod - Nexus Mods is now 23 years old. People have been born, got married and had kids since it started and that's just Nexus Mods. FYI people modded Doom in 1993...
@@flamose1 I don`t remember it in Fallout 3 and NV doesn`t really count in your argument as there were supposed to be quests for that stuff but Time Crunche caused it all to be cut
@@flamose1 a simple ini. tweak shouldn't be sold. Those dlc had ACTUAL content additions to the game. They didn't simply retexture a gun and call it a day, either.
@joeswanson3058 I definitely agree, the content should be moderated so it is actual additions to the game. Not a simple patch or cosmetic
Bethesda gets a Large cut of that "quick buck" so what is their incentive to stop it?
"Future" game sales, "good will"...? pffft.
$2 for a skin is ridiculous unless includes like 200 different skins. Skins should be like 10¢ each.
Agreed
I have a better offer: 0 cents
There needs to be something to ensure that the good projects get noticed over the bad ones and the cash grabs. Rn it's just the wild west with great projects that are fairly priced getting the same attention as a $5 skin pack. So, I like your idea for the featured column.
I don't care how good the Creation is, I won't buy something that can be rendered inoperable with a single Bethesda update that can break functionality thoroughly.
The thing that really gets me about the Beowolf Healthy Parts one is that's something anyone could do in the creation kit in a couple minutes. When I saw it I considered just doing a free version of it myself and slapping it on Nexus, but it's such a nothing mod that it didn't feel worth it.
You wouldn't even need the Creation Kit, just use Xedit (If there's one for Starfield), I make on the fly edits for Skyrim all the time, that's why I don't buy mods, why buy them, when I can make my own?
Once you have to pay for content from a studio its no longer a mod, it becomes paywalled DLC. There is no inbetween, a mod is something done for free to a game thats not offered by the developers. Hence being a modification.
The problem with paid mod system is they are gonna drown out the truly good mods with all the grifter slop that flood in.
Well, we had a good run. Companies simply can not stand by idly when there's more money to be made. It doesn't matter what they destroy in the process.
I think mod authors should also be able to apply for that "Achievement Friendly" tag too.
That spacer suit overhaul is really cool, but if I wanna ever get the "explore every system" or "reach level 100" achievement, I can't turn it on. Same with the Robin companion. Or DEREK. Or the mods that make Brigs and Cafeterias actually work. They're all verified, all quality, all but one is paid for, they're all 100% lore friendly, but you're punished for using them.
I feel like they should use Achievement Friendly tag as sort of a quality definer. Like if the overall texture/mesh quality, voicework, mechanics, etc. are good enough, it should be elligiable for the "AF" stamp of approval. It'd also help weed out asset flips and 0 effort skin mods, as the quality would have to be top notch to get the stamp.
i actually think that bethesda needs to have an internal rating system for these mods early on, and introduce a really good user rating system moving forward. the internal rating system means there’s clear moderation and review that has already happened, and that there’s an initial way to judge quality of a mod before downloading. this would also push people to try and achieve a good Bethesda rating.
You are dreaming if you believe that BGS are going to spend a single shilling on that. They don't even QA their own games - now you actually expect them to test and rate thousands of mods? I agree with you, that it would be great for us players, though! It's a good idea, don't get me wrong! But you seem to be putting your hopes in the wrong company.
Don't forget one of the paid companions mod is broken and there's no sign of it being fixed..
Which one is that?
@@josceola8979either the handgun or the Trackers Alliance quest mod
I saw someone on reddit post that some targets are bugged and freeze the bounties
@@josceola8979The Fly girl one. No lip sync.
@@joeswanson3058 Oh wow
What a joke
Low effort from Bethesda? I am very shocked by this
Right Lol
Paid mods should be lore friendly, no cheats, and achievement-friendly
the game becomes just a storefront then
...where Bethesda charges out the aas for garbage and you're expected to buy all the individual bits as mods/dlc until you have something that resembles a complete game, but now at many many times the price
The game doesn't even feel finished and they're asking money for content. they add a skin system but no skins in the base game.
ALL THESE MODS CAN BE DOWNLOADED FOR FREE BY THE WAY!
Oh hey, the problems everyone who wasn't shilling for Bethesda's paid mod system predicted would happen all came true. Why is anyone acting surprised?
No bro trust me only juice head and these Bethesda content creators is surprised.
**Pikachu face**
@@shaquillemartin5674 They're not surprised, they're engagement farming with videos like this. The "reviewers" alone could keep the paid mod market going by themselves, they get revenue from videos trashing garbage mods, so people keep making garbage mods to sell them to review.
The day Bethesda goes full paid mods is the day their games die completely because it's the only thing holding their bland, buggy and barely functioning games together for replayability😂
To update on this there's people out there who have over 500 to 1k+ mods and if each mod is worth a fiver and you get 1k thats 5 grand just for that many alone, that point look for another game company because Bethesda is only sponging off their player base which will only result in diminished returns.
I come from flight simulators, racing simulators, train simulators, and BeamNG. In those communities there’s a general expectation that most mods are free, and the mods that are paid are good enough to earn your money. There’s absolutely a place for that in Starfield, Skyrim, and Fallout… but it has to be done very differently than this.
When I seen the skins on the marketplace I chuckled. I hoped Bethesda wouldn't allow retextures/reskins but it seems I had too high of hopes. I personally haven't bought any creations because I worry an update will end up breaking mods like it has before.
let me tell a joke
You know those warriors from creation club? They have premium mods. Premium. Mods.
Let me guess, someone sold your .ini change for $3
A rating system and comments on a mods page is a great way to add accountability
That will never happen. Bethesda and accountability dont go together
Bethesda is gonna do whatever they want until they actually start losing money. Some of y’all keep complaining about this and then keep buying their stuff. Stop giving Bethesda money and they’ll be forced to change.
Like correct if I’m wrong but remember when they defended 76 not having NPCs and or dialogue only to put both in when they faced so much backlash.
All the people who buy regardless of quality, and the people who think we should appreciate Bethesda no matter what they do, are part of the reason Bethesda is as lazy as they are and they won’t stop till the money stops flowing in.
never liked the idea of paying for a mod not matter waht it is
I do have to admit the paid mods are good, but and I’m glad that they put some that I actually love.
But a few packs of mods that I actually really want to play desperately as fallout London and the Mojave mud pack info four I wish they could focus or get help for that for fallout..
Or better yet put new Vegas, weapons and fallout four like a weapon pack like they did with the other pack now that would be excellent
2:15. So they made what they shouldve in 2011 and what they couldve in 2016 and 2021?
Buying individual mods doesn't make any sense, but a fool and their money are soon parted. Then again buying a game that you them have to assemble yourself with mods doesn't make sense either. IKEA furniture should require assembly, not a $70 video game. Modding your car, renovating your home, heck even building miniature hobby games with mods makes sense. Buying 1s and 0s in a digital space that you can never resell or trade is just brain dead.
I was against paid mods when they did the whole Horse Armour rubbish & I am even more vehemently against them now. A friend who makes mods had a Skyrim mod stolen and uploaded onto Creations and Bethesda did nothing until they heard "lawyer". No apology, no compensation, just a quiet removal & brushed under the carpet.
Even Bethesda uploaded a broken mod to Creations (Trackers thing) and when it was finally fixed there was no notification, you just have to know it's been fixed & then to uninstall the mod & then reinstall to actually update it. That's right, you can't update the creation, you have to uninstall & reinstall... not to mention some will break when the game updates, in typical Bethesda "I'm gonna wreck it" style of game updates. (Wreck it Ralph film reference FYI)
It was always going to be the wild west, they would never have the manpower to moderate creations & never intended to, it's quite literally a virus scan & that's it.
That's an argument for improving it, not an argument against the concept. How would they have the manpower to moderate it is like asking how the IRS could have the manpower to reduce tax evasion in the US - because each member of staff earns more money than they cost to employ. Literally how business works. But yes - the problems you are talking about, all need to be worked on and no, people shouldn't be able to steal each other's work like that.
One thing Bethesda never does is listen to community feedback.
Bethesda is making us pay for Mods and still hasn’t increased the Mod Space for Fallout 4 and Skyrim. While Starfield gets 100gb?!
Blame the ps4 & xbox 1 outdated hardware for that n getting rid of Todd won't work either as well
@@Derivedwhale45 so much for next gen update
As if nobody sane didn't see this coming.
well well well. Color me surprised. Edit" A day will come where we have to pay 70 or 100 $ for the plain base game and each quest will cost another 5$. This will only lead to developers not putting enough work or content in the base game (Cases which we already have now, of dividing content as DLC) and charging for quests outside the base game, which consumers already paid for. If Any of you support this shitty dev practice, you deserve to be treated as a cash cow.
Modders getting paid is fine, what is not fine is when companies get involved, they only care about money and not offering value as Bethesda clearly prove time and again. I hope creations fails miserable like every other moronic attempt from Bugthesda. That Skyrim quest mod is an insane exception, using that to justify paid mods is a joke, if people want to pay modders they can, we don't need Bethesda or any other awful company getting involved as it will only end in modders and players losing out.
This is why there's 0 faith in a good es6. It makes me sad knowing that it will be a worse/lazier mess than skyrim on release but with less content... so they can sell it to you as "paid content". They missed out in skyrim and you can see how desperate they are to add it in.
But y'all will still eat up anything Bethesda puts a price tag on
The last game I bought from Bethesda was Fallout 4 and their Bait and Switch "Season Pass" that was all filler DLC, full of low effort Garbage. I've never bought another Bethesda game after that, and never will. I'm done with Bethesda.
The only reason that I bought skyrim AE and starfield was because I thought they'd finally listen to their player base and given up on paid mods. NEVER AGAIN
I don’t mind paid mods but it’s mostly a question of quality and what it adds.
Like for Fallout 4, I can live without the skins easy but I do like the enclave power armours and military posts as it adds more to the game.
Skyrim is somewhat similar but I like the alternative armours for variety in choice and style, though the fishing mod is something I rarely touch and only have it because of the anniversary.
People that don't kind about some things, usually covers their hypocrisy
I will never buy a single mod
lol Juicehead turning on Starfield
Funnily enough, even though people were originally upset and complaining about Bethesda adding-in their own Creations to the Shop, they seem to be some of the better additions, even if they are admittedly "overpriced". I just think the content needs to be "beefier" and more "substantial" to justify the asking price(s). If they wanna sell skins, do so in a pack of 5 or more, that's currently being sold for the price of just one, and make it work for at least several Weapons of a similar type.
Todd acknowledged how the community was feeling about chopping up Quests and selling them to us piecemeal, but don't go and do the same exact thing with Skins and Outfits either. All this nickel and diming s**t needs to stop, like, right now!
Moderation and actual quality control are needed, as said. And the pricing. Why do so few, including Bethesda, not know how to price their mods. Kinggath is the only one who has gotten this right.
Paid mods should never have existed, I understand the appeal to mod makers but as soon as money enters the equation, It's no longer about passion anymore It's only about money.
I’m sorry but if I just spent $70 on a game the only additional paid content I should be buying is dlc that adds way more to the game than a $5 mod. Bethesda should NOT be charging anyone money for their “mods”
And people are stupid enough to pay for them
By this logic we were already stupid paying forbthe game to begin with
@@joshmiller6260 Don't start. A lot of people are playing via game pass, and they are fucking right about that. This game does not deserve your money
@@mrfishsticks266 care to give a reason or just state your opinion as fact without a shred of reasoning?
Bethesda isn't going to do anything really. Serious moderation would cost money. Honestly, someone needs to start uploading stolen content owned by different companies to get anything done.
But I didn't pay for Starfield and still ain't given Bethesda the time of day, so good luck y'all.
Bethesda simply don't care anymore.
i'm gonna be real, modders don't need bethesda to profit from their mods, their are plenty of websites like gumroad that are used to sell mods for games and i'm pretty sure the microtransaction currency bethesda use is just a way for them to weasel out of paying the creators what they're owed anyway
i dunno if publishing mod as a creation provides any additional benefits but if a modder just wants to get paid for their work then either sell that work on a website or set up a patreon and just make sure your mod is something players want to pay for
I would only really pay for a full Game Overhaul mod or DLC Expansion sized mod. Nickel and Diming teeny tiny things is not okay to me and I will never spend my money on them.
Agreed. Or I'd pay for a big bundle thing for like twenty bucks, but five dollars for a suit of armor... f**k off.
You can see the numbers on every creation, how many people buyed it and is a lot of people. More people than the average Starfield players on Steam for example. So yeah, a lot of people are buying creations and they are mostly from Xbox or game pass, and probably are people who don't follow game news. We can hate it all we want, but the "normal" people will just see a cool cosmetic and buy it, look at Fortnite and Call of duty. lol
Appreciate you making this video.
They're treating it like a MMO!
There has to be some standards set, they released a vault tech skin for Vasco for 200 credits, and it looks atrocious! This is getting out of hand.
Just enabling the Escape mod glitched Gravity Well into nonexistence. The Vulture offered a gun you can't reload. Maybe working paid mods would be a nice change.
The paid mods should be big and substantial and quality checked. The skins are BS. I heavily judge the modders who sell those.
I don’t buy into the “get it while you can $$$” mentality. They can release actual good content and have a reputation rather than grabbing a quick buck
I didn't mind it until the Anniversary Edition made my xbox one x no longer able to handle it. Doors, fast traveling, opening inventory, scrolling through my inventory. All of those can cause crashes now. Cave entrances cause screen tearing and sometimes infinite loading.
And there's no way to reverse it on consoles.
In all honesty, I wish it would fail. On the other hand, I can respect someone's desire to make money off of something they worked hard on.
Agreed on both counts. I do think, however, that the price anchor for mods should NOT be the typical mtx bs we see in life-service games. Since BGS earns a percentage, not a fixed amount per mod, however, they have no incentive to keep prices in an adequate range - on the contrary; they'd love it if people got used to spending as much money as possible in their store.
Modders can make money on a Mandatory and Non-Mandatory way without giving Bethastda a cut
@@heyhoojoe Need policing, the people wanting it to die are just shitters in the face of people like kinggath and his crew, they made legit dlc for us but ugh these low quality mods are ruining it
@@GazingTrandoshanyour too stupid to even realize your getting scammed by Bethesda and the modders.
I'm happy to pay for quality work. I would agree that obvious cash grabs should be moderated out, but who makes that decision? The people who made the horse armor? (For the record, i bought the horse armor out of spite ;) Most of the mods for Starfield that I use are free, and I've paid the author through other channels they offer (ko-fi etc) as a thank you for their work. Whereas some paid mods i've bought on the Creations store I've removed from my load order, because they just weren't for me and weren't worth the space they take up on my system. Were they well made? Yes. But I wish I was able to try them first to see if they would be something I'd use.
Note I play on Xbox. I don't have access to nexus mods, so the Creations store means more to me than it does to PC players I think.
The first sparkle horse sold in World of Warcraft made more than Starcraft 2: Wings of Liberty.
I would LOVE DLC sized mods, but skins are more bang for the buck.
as someone that has given money to free mod creators, I hate the creations program as you said alienates alot of people. I love the modding community of these games. but creations will make more issues cause it involves money while free mods made sure that people wanted to make something out of a passion and not for cash. I would love financially give to modders. but there maybe more issues but we'll see
I'm willing to pay for mods that are worth it, but some are horrible. That Vasco mod for 200 credits, for example, should not be a thing.
My issue with paid mods is that the mod makers pretty much get nothing from the mod and only the Bethesda official mods allow achievements. Also, you pretty much have to be always online to keep the content, which can break some saves. They get an upfront payment and no royalties... They are also limited by how much they can actually make. Todd has been on record regarding how much content is too much. The interview in mind was involving the starfield bounty paid mod. He mentioned originally it was just meant to be a weapon skin mod, but they decided to add a story on it, and the price shot up for something that was so buggy it could brick saves.
If Bethesda grew up beyond 15 and realised that if they allowed body mods that would rake in millions.
Sadly there's this thing called a ratings board. ESRB here in the states, PEGI across the pond and so on. Adding nude mods in an official capacity would likely rate the game higher than what they intended or be outright banned in certain countries, removing a potential market for the game.
However, what customers do to modify their game outside of official means is up to the customer alone.
The body mods becoming official would seriously change the game's rating.
@@miguelcondadoolivar5149 it's already an 18+... What, are they gonna make 21+ games that kids are *still* gonna get somehow.
Then the Creation Club would be full of Unrealistic Female Bodies made by people who have never seen a woman before, with Monstrously Gigantic Butts, Humongous gigantic Boobs, and tiny waists, just look on Nexus and you'll see what I mean.
From what i saw from the last update, they added the trackers alliance mission board and to access it you have to finish a 15-30 min quest line, which is literally "speak to the stranger" -> travel to Akila city and speak to faction leader -> "learn" how to track bounties -> "pick one mission" and do that mission with a cliffhanger. Oh? you wanted more? well The NPC tells you to go 1 of 2 boards to pick up mission, one on the same floor or one "elite" mission board downstairs.... The thing is, you can only pick missions from the "elite" board. oh what about the "normal" board? Well, here's the kicker... you have to pay real money on the creation tab to get ONE more mission that is irrelevant from the opening mission.
Paid mods should not exist. I dont care how the modders feel about it either.
Good thing you dont speak for the companies. Im a console player and consoles do not get mods because the companies are hesitant to allow foreign scripts that arent tested.
They do this so there arent any bugs that could brick someones console.
I do not mind paying to bridge the gap between pc and console so yeah get over yourself.
there is a reason people don't want to pay for mods, mostly coming down to quality and compatibility. there is no guarantee a mod stays updated and if the mod is updated, it could have many bugs and glitches. there has to be some sort of standard for this to work
Its funny how some of you guys, Juice included, think that Bethesda actually care about quality.
So funny hearing you complain the same thing you were cheering about a couple months earlier, despite everyone warning you.
FOLON just released what is basically an entire Fallout sequel for free after many years of work... But ok lets pay for 15 minute quests and armor/weapon packs lol
Absolutely ridiculous.
it reminds me of the issue with ff14 modding... It's technically illegal, rarely enforced but on top of it being against ToS some mod creators are selling mods for $2-10+, some look like utter garbage and some literally rip Square's assets and repurposes them, which is like double no-no... and because of people holding these items behind a paywall people are buying it once and uploading it to filesharing sites so others can have it for free. Modding should ALWAYS be free, just tip the creator when you want like on Nexusmod's download page... this stuff should never become a source of income because modding has ALWAYS been a love and passion project centered community.
instantly lost me, that castle thing at the start looked trash. bashed together textures scavenged from the akila city textures. the spacer suits again...just bashed together existing assets made by someone learning how to use the creation kit.
He spent his time.
Sorry but you are simply wrong on the second one.
That spacer overhaul is made by Zone79, who is by far the best outfit creator in the Starfield modding community. He is also one of the very few actually making custom modeled armors/cosmetics.All of his mods have tons of different variants for the spacesuits/helmets and such for a large level of customizability. Practically anyone playing Starfield with mods is running at least one of his mods.
Not only that, he spent almost a whole year releasing extremely high quality free mods to build up a stellar reputation before releasing a paid mod. He is exactly the kind of person who SHOULD be allowed to post content to the store. He makes the content, it's high quality, it works well, and the value proposition of the content/money ratio is good.