I’d love to know your thoughts on the bellona. Which would you choose if looking for a budget dual boiler - this or the breville? Also if you enjoyed the video please consider leaving a 👍 - that stuff truly makes a difference!
Hi. You mentioned the Lelit Elizabeth but didn’t end up comparing it at the end. Would you mind sharing thoughts compared to that? Seems like a very close comparison
@@jt22420 I had thoughts filmed in the original cut but felt like the video went on too long so I cut them. I believe this is competitive to the lelit but you do loose the trusted name that is lelit. This machine isn’t built in Italy (though quality isn’t an issue here), and the lelit has a better pre-infusion system that integrates the steam boiler. The bellezza is equal if not better in build quality with thicker sidewalls and a heftier steam knob. The electronics on the lelit are superior. The bellezza uses full stainless boilers instead of brass for the lelit brew boiler. Either are excellent choices for small dual boilers. I think it’ll come down to personal preference and budget. Hope this helps!
As a person with a small kitchen and not a lot of counter space, I love the size/dimensions. Especially how it isn't very deep so the counter space in front of it is still usable
I have an Appartamento, but wanted to give a budget DB a try. Tbh if this was available a few years ago, I would have bought it over the Appartamento. Really great value at $1.5k CAD. I was surprised with how solid the build was, and the overall experience was good. But here were my main issues and the reasons why I returned it. - unable to adjust different pre infusion times for each button - Steam switch was a bit kitschy for me, it should have been mechanical - No startup timer and electric switch means no smartplug - Cups really didn't preheat sitting on top of the machine - Shot timer disappears as soon as the pump turns off. When you are pulling by weight, your eyes are on your scale when the button is pressed, so you miss the shot time. - The deal-breaker: I found the steam power dies super quick due to the 1L boiler. I steam for 2 cortados every morning, so about 160ml of milk. After about 20 seconds, the steam power drops and it struggles to keep a whirlpool. You can see the steam boiler temp go down from 135 to 115 or so.
when you had it, did you notice an increase in water usage? I see that the OPV line isn't routed back into the reservoir like most machines, so that leads me to believe you'd be going through a lot more water. i used distilled water with third wave packets and the cost ads up.
I'd much prefer Ascaso Steel Duo PID (which seems to be where the design probably drew some "inspiration" from anyway!). I realize as a thermoblock machine it does not compare apples to apples, and the steaming is likely better with this Bellona versus the Duo... But the Duo is made in Barcelona, even faster to get hot with excellent thermal stability, has external OPV, and does not reheat your water.
To each their own! And the ascasos are definitely beautiful. I personally find myself hard pressed to spend that money on a thermoblock when other options are available. Especially when a machine like this with dual stainless boilers is less. But maybe that’s just me 😄
Perhaps for the adventure seekers but you can plumb it in with a float valve (but it might not look so pretty when your done) Also I'm not sure if a vibe pump can work very well if the water tank is hidden under the counter top. It's worth a try but I wouldn't be surprised if it had to be at the same level or higher for it to work properly.
Thanks for your honest review as usual 😊, I've been waiting fot your review for almost a month then I gave up and bought it a week ago, and it's a white as well 😂, it is a good machine, few things I don't like such as the timing buttons not a real volumetric ones. Still struggling with the steam never got a successful result while it was very easy in the Bianca! I believe can't find a machine with all of these great features in that price! The competitors machines lelit Elizabeth and Profitec 300 are more expensive with almost more 500+ USD!
Ha sorry for making you wait! I truly don’t like to rush a video just to get it out quickly at the risk of missing important information. Glad you’re happy with it! It’s such a great little machine.
Bought this machine before seeing any review as old Rocket Giotto broke down and broughtbin for service ended up trade in. Yes was attracted by the price as same machine in Giotto cost nearly double plus it is for my mother who wants easy use and not too good in adjusting best coffee. Overall its very easy use, told was German brand only found out it was made in china afte viewing this. So far all good and the delay im hot water was noticed but not big issue. Now will see if this machine will suatain reliability and last as long as previous coffee machine
You mentioned the Lelit Elizabeth briefly as an alternative near the start of the video and then focussed on comparing with the Breville. I know you used the Elizabeth quite a bit when you reviewed it so was interested to know more about that comparison. Any difference in the cup? I purchased an Elizabeth after your review and love you honesty and the information you fill your videos with. Thanks Kyle
I would assume no big difference in Cup. As Kyle said taste is more dependent on Grinder and the Beans. Maybe for light roast the Elizabeths Steam preinfusion can result in better shots.
I would like to say the cup was nearly identical. They both have a timed pre infusion, vibration pump and dual pid control. The big difference would be going with a well known brand like lelit or opt for the more budget option of the bellezza. When it comes to the build quality I would give it to the bellezza in this comparison for it’s thicker sidewalls and heftier steam knob. But it’s close.
Just will note the elizabeth uses this kinda cool way of using back pressure from the steam boiler to push brew temp water for pre infusion. In that way, you get consistent around 2 bar pre infusion for the period of time of pre infusion rather than pump on, pump off, pump on. In theory, pump on, off, on, is much harsher on your puck and more prone to channeling than true consistent low pressure pre infusion. So imho, a big plus to the elizabeth, along with the fact you can use it on a smart plug timer for convenience. But the price right now for the Bellona can’t be beat.
I was also wondering about this. Great review, would be really interesting to have a slightly more in-depth between the Elizabeth and the Bellona. I’m thinking of switching from the MaraX which annoys me with very inconstant brew temperatures (mostly an e61 fault, so probably not fixed by the pricey way out of a Bianca) and am unsure between these two „small“ dual boilers.
It looks nice, I noticed it being available, nice that there's some dual boiler options that are affordable and some good features. I think stuff like this is kinda making the traditional E61 HX machines obsolete / unnecessary.
Amazing review as always sir Kyle! I think you should really take a look at the Gemilai espresso machine lineup. Their pricepoints will blow your mind. I know they are compromising on build quality but its really hard to complain when you can get a decent performing dual boiler at less than half the price of the Bellona, which you already thought is an affordable dual boiler machine.
Oct 2023 on sale $799 CD. A double boiler at this price, with these features, would have been on my consideration list. Still very happy with my Profitec GO,. Thank you for the review.
Finally an honest review, Made in China. However, it’s not the labor costs that keep this cheap, no matter what people say. It’s more so the parts and material that are even cheaper. Always, always, always with China product. It you doubt me select any and I mean any Chinese made automotive tool and put it the use.
Nice review. I like the separate water container and it cost less in this range. But, if I am going to buy a dual boiler in this design, I rather go for the rancilio Silvia pro x.
I bought mine two months ago. And ask your seller for a reduction. I bought mine for just 1000€ and at that it is an absolute steal. I'm very happy and the espresso is great. I could also learn how to steam well with this and I enjoy the workflow a lot.
@@Wisemanman Thank you a lot. How happy are you with the machine? The quality of the espresso is the most important thing for me? And of course the nine bar pressure! I hope it doesn’t go over 9 bars while brewing and it is set from the factory at 9 bars?
@@nichatkourou773 quite happy with the pressure (yes, it is indeed 9bars) measured right in the group head do you always get a good reading. Temperature stability and heating up is beautiful and I love the external water tank made out of glass, easy cleaning indeed. Everything is stainless steel which was important to me. Now the downsides. Pre-infusion is not really pre-infusion as mentioned in the video. No chance for pressure profiling and such, BUT at that price? I'm happy with what I have and the quality of the build is pretty darn good. Maybe a volumetric measurement would've been nice but I have my scale under anyways. Fits a carter everywhere mug plus my timemmore black mirror scale under a bottomless portafilter. Thus, I'm very happy. Since now I've started working at an espresso bar I love the steam lever even more.
@@Wisemanman Thanks again for being helpful! So you are happy with the quality of the espresso it produces? Of course we don’t look for pressure profiling at that price :)). When you say no valumetric measurement what exactly do you mean? Can’t you program a shot??
Thank you for this review. This is exactly what I am looking for in my “move up” machine. Btw I like the blue. It’s now #1 on my list against Breville infuser. Which is a lot cheaper. Btw the removable water is a must have for me. I am split if I need a dual boiler although I usually drink a flat white.
It's great to have someone that's not selling the product publish a review. Thank you Kyle! I am wondering if the pre-infusion could be set up separately for the 2 "volumetric" buttons. I can't remember which review it was but someone had a machine with 2 settings and used one for flushing the group head. It also seems like the Rancilio Silvia Pro X has very similar features. Any plans for the comparison??
Just picked up a second hand Bellezza Chiara at a great cost. Was a little skeptical at first, not being familiar with the brand, but it is turning out to be a really solid machine. Thanks for the review.
Not so sure that I'm a fan of external water tank but I guess you get used to it. QUESTION... What's the advantage of a SMALL dual boiler like this versus a higher grade E61 group but that's "Heat Exchanger"? Wouldn't the 2nd one be a better choice overall if both have a PID?
I just bought one. I’m having issues with the brew pressure dropping down to about 4-5 bar during the shot. I’m curious if you are having issues maintaining brew pressure during your extractions?
@@colinparenteau4637 I did had this issue with the Beeville grinder pro I used with my coffe brewer; I just couldn't get enough pressure. Then, I bought an espresso grinder, and the problem was solved
Hey Kyle, this is a great review. I’m curious: how much of a taste difference in espresso do you notice between the Bellona and your Lelit Bianca. I’m planning to upgrade from a Barista Pro to something better. Already have a DF64 for grinder. Many Thanks!
Would be good to see what’d come from the new Breville acquisition.. if you get a decent quality machine like the Elizabeth with all the goodies shipped with the BDB, that would be a killer machine..
Question for you. are the internals of espresso machines universal in terms interchangeability? If it is then finding parts down the road wouldn't be an issue. Secondly, at one price point can one expect to have the machine to be functional (with maintenance) for one's lifetime?
Hi Kyle great video thanks - quick question about those plastic/rubber tubes that show when U opened it up. What are they for on general? Do they touch the hot water or steam paths? Machine has a good price and even it's cold water is stored in glass with an SS tube, so appreciate your feedback as it will influence my decision cheers
This machine actually makes the Breville Dual Boiler look visually appealing (it's already very appealing if you don't consider the looks). The lack of support for smart plugs and an OPV that likely voids the warranty if adjusted don't make the Bellezza any more desirable. I'd spend a little more and get a BDB or a Lelit Elizabeth.
Fair enough. Though if honest this does seem like the approach of an enthusiast. Which is understandable. But for most people those $300-500 in savings is a no brainer if they don’t want to adjust the opv or have auto start features.
Design wise, i would prefer the bellona. The Sage machines all look like awkward plasticky piles of trash in my opinion. So as you can see, design is a matter of personal taste. I find it interesting that there is a dual boiler at this price point. Not many machines in this category. What i do not like is that it is assembled in China AND the producer pretends like it is a "made in germany" machine. As a german, i am very angry about this. I mean, look at their website. Everything on the website is there to make the customer think he is buying a handcrafted masterpiece of german engineering.
@@justbenny84 I totally agree with you, this is all made to be as confusing as possible so if you don't look carefully, you're gonna believe it is made in Germany while they in fact serve you the BS "Designed in... Made in a sh*thole place" ... So just for that reason alone I'd rather spend a bit more and get a real HX E61 from Italy or Germany, rather than a DB from China.
Thank you Kyle for your honest review. Is the water reservoir tank made of glass? Are there other machines you might recommend with it being glass? Thank you in advance.
I own this machine. Loving it for all the reasons you mentioned. The only thing is that the pressure cannot be adjusted, but rather a real-time measurement.
@@oksanatereshchenko7996 the pressure varies for me depending on grind size, how much grounds, and how hard you apply the tamper. I suggest you keep the machine and grind the coffee finer and put around 18-20g of coffee ground in a double portafilter to increase the pressure. I am able to pull some 9 bar shots but the shot is longer ~30s for 1:2 ratio.
@@oksanatereshchenko7996 I have the same issue. Mine is dropping as low as 4-5 bar during a 30 second 2:1 extraction. 20g in 40g out. I sent it back. Supplier changed the pump but I still get the same results. Interested if you’ve managed to figure anything out?
@@colinparenteau4637what pressure do you get when you back flush it? Mine easily and quickly gets up to 9 bar before i stop the pump and backflush. If youre getting 9 bar during backflush, and only 4-5 bar during a shot, then it is your grind size, basket size, puck prep etc. But its not the espresso machine/pump. It has a very simple OPV. All we can measure is back pressure before a realease, and as such, isnt a defining measurement for good espresso.
@@BGH-lw4ms thanks for the response. I do get 9 bar quickly and easily when I backflush. I’ve got a new ims basket, I wdt and I think my puck prep is pretty solid. I make dial in 20g to extract at 2:1 in 30 seconds. I get the pressure up close to 9 then depending on the coffee I use the pressure drops down slightly below 8 or sometimes all the way down to 4-5 by the time I reach 30 seconds. I read an article on Reddit where someone was having the same problem, where their machine was getting up to pressure with a blind basket but couldn’t maintain pressure during a shot. It turned out to be a weak pump. The pump could get to pressure with a blind basket but as the resistance lessened as the shot went on the pump could not hold pressure. I sent my machine back and the company I bought from says everything is fine.
have you noticed any inconsistencies with steam temp with this machine? I recently got this and i'm having issues with steaming milk. I have my steam temp set to 130. Some days, when steaming it will go from 130 and drop all the way down to 117, while some days it's able to stay within 130-125 temp. Do you know why this happens?
Comment on your hat: Have you tried decaf? I've found some delicious decaf beans from roasters like Stumptown coffee and more! I'd love a video on tasting differences between different decaffeination methods :D
Absolutely I have. The hat says coffee over caffeine. And what’s that’s saying is: coffee is more than simply a drug. It’s a way of life, and a product we ought to take seriously
On first glance I thought the water tank was a bit silly, and in ways it still kind of is. Of course the Bianca handles the external tank design much better. But in theory you could ditch the jar and rig up some kind of remineralized RO reservoir under your counter for a sort of "plumbed" in setup. Great features, but the square button/gauge surrounds look cheap/tacky, same with the silver illuminated buttons and those handles aren't doing it for me at all lol. But all in all if you're on a budget for DB, it looks great in the specs dept.
Yeah, due to the display and control buttons it looks more like a cheap Chinese design than even Breville/Sage Dual Boiler... I might get a refund for DB that developed a stream leak from the boiler after less than 1yr (they're saying that water level sensors are damaged and have trouble sourcing then or sth, strange as except the limited steam leaking the machine seemed to work fine), so I'm looking for something in similar budget. But DB seems so much more refined, the controls are well thought through, even details like preserving shot time that this machine supposedly doesn't do, not to mention programmable pre infusion pump power and timing. And the steam boiler hose fittings were supposedly improved in DB recently, and it is cheaper...
I'm planning to buy an espresso maker and this is definitely the best value option that I've found so far. It has a dual boiler and PID control which is extremely important in the coffee extraction process. However, I am concerned about the lifetime of this beautiful piece of engineering given that it was manufactured in China. Any thoughts there?
Lots of machines are assembled in China. I do not see that as a negative. It all depends on the specs and quality of the parts, for Bellezza these are designed in Germany and use Italian and Chinese parts.
I am still doing my research, but understand that the reason that more expensive machines have a back flush capacity is because they use stainless steel pipes. From a durability pov the plastic pipes, they will be a weak spot in the longevity of the machine. However, knowing this and the ease of accessing them, it's possible to change them yourself. I don't know what the specs are on the pipes to know how long they predict they last. The machine is under pressure and if a hose breaks I wonder what kind of damage it would do?
Have you used the La Spaziale S1 Mini Vivaldi II Espresso Machine? After my friend purchased one, less than a month later I had to get one myself. I believe it would be a great review for you to dive into. Keep up the good work!
Dude this sounds like a great machine it might give Gaggia Classic Pro with the Gaggiuino mod a run for the money! Nice with shout out for Emilee as well!
The non-adjustable OPV is kind of crazy - it’s not like the cost of an adjustable connector is more than a couple of bucks. My guess is the choice was speed of manufacture and not having to test the performance.
1. vs a classic E61 with water flowing around the group head, does the group head also have water flow for max temp. Can i expect to get the same flavor extraction as an E61 machine? 2. how does the preinfusion time work with the manual button?
It's different. A manual machine is always going to give you more flexibility, but also less stability. If you want a steady shot after shot I would go with an electric machine like this.
@@123marijn321 disagree, I make way more consistent shots with my flair then my Gaggia or Silvia. Because there is no temp surfing and better control of pressure
@paras the flair and robot can both make amazing espresso, with a good quality grinder you won’t have many limits on the standard of coffee you can make! As Marijn says, it’s a slower workflow than if you want to make a lot of drinks at the same time and you have to use something like a nanofoamer if you want to make milk drinks.
Also to answer your original question you can pull excellent shots with manual machines but it can be more difficult because temperature stability and you will use quite a bit of water to heat them up. If I was going that route I’d get the Flair 58 because of the temp control and standard portafilter size. The Robot would be my second choice if I had to pick and the Rok while it can pull good shots, it’s painful to use and potentially more expensive if you want to upgrade parts which it kinda needs to be a better machine. All that being said you’ll have to figure a good work flow to make them consistent and that’s where they are tricky. They will not be as consistent as an electric machine. Despite what the other guy said about pulling better shots, he more than likely has a good and consistent workflow so he is able to get better shots, but it sounds like the machines he’s using are single boilers which makes a difference.
How would you rate this machine vs the rancillio Silvia pro X? After you openend the machine from the back, you can clearly see that you wont be able to pre heat cups on this machine..
At this price point I'd rather spend a couple hundred dollars extra and get the Rancilio Pro X. Would be good to have your thoughts on how that might compare, value for money and features etc.
Hi Kyle. I bought one this week. Love the machine. But the cupholder makes a terrible noise when the pump goes on . Annyone know how to fix this? If put some pressure on it with my hand its gone. Thanks
Their entire line is interesting though it looks like they've been through the ECM parts bin. Made in China is a worry, that destroyed the Gaggia Classic's reputation for around a decade.
@@KyleRowsell Six weeks isn't close to long enough to evaluate a mew product's reliability, is the cost saving just manufacturing or quality of components as well? I am very curious to see how these hold up because they just took knocked a grand off the price of an E61 dual boiler.
@@nickborghesan2296 The Niche is nigh on impossible to get and is always on back order, so excuse the pun but it's a niche product, phones they've been doing for decades so have had time to engineer a workforce with tiny fingers not appropriate for plumbing. Time will tell.
@@Nevermindthrbrewmethod e61 DB are usually with larger boilers, rotary pump, and the brew group itself is more expensive. better comparison is with something like the Lelit Elizabeth which is only
Ok, I had to pull the trigger with 10 hours left on the sale. The price is unbeatable for everything offered. Only question I have at the moment is if there is a way to drain the steam boiler. Since the water valve comes from brew boiler, unless there is a drain valve there doesn't seem to be any way to drain the steam boiler, which could be an issue as over time the TDS will go up and cause scaling.
I don’t know why he keep insisting on comparing to the breville dual boiler, maybe this review isn’t in-bias? He mentioned Lelit Elizabeth early on but avoid calling it out later on. Because of the valid criticisms he’s brought up, Lelit Elizabeth or Rancilio Silvia Pro X, Profitec 500 all of which either made in Italy or Germany would blow this thing out the water IMO based on this review. Or even the Ascaso (not a dual boiler)
Great review just wanted to add that the glass water holder with stainless steel tube is a reflection of people being paranoid and possibly rightfully so of water being stored in plastic materials....
... which is one of the main reasons I would seriously consider upgrading from my breville to a plastic free italian-made machine.... Which is the reason this machine caught my eye...☕👍🇨🇦
Being engineered out of Germany, my guess is that given the EU's stellar record of banning of toxic materials in the food industry, more than anywhere else in the world... I would trust this machine being spec'd to EU food safety standards as a bonus.
I was looking for the BDB and everywhere shows it being discontinued. So I looked at the Elizabeth dual boiler. How does this compare to the Elizabeth v3?
I really like the looks of it! The only thing I don't like that's keeping me from pulling the trigger is the OPV routes water to the drip tray, resulting in a lot of wasted water. I'm wondering if there's a way to reroute it like others have done on different machines.
@@KyleRowsell Good to know, thanks! I'm still leaning towards the Elizabeth but really appreciate the in depth video on the Bellona. It answered a lot of my questions.
ECM Puristika has the exact same water tank setup. Not sure which came up with it. Puristika is pretty new, Could be they copied Bellona. But certainly not a coincidence that two German manufacturers come up with the same design within a few months.
I’m not sure either but I did see the puristika with this design in pre production at the show in Milan long before the bellona. Regardless I’d love to see more of it! It’s great.
@@KyleRowsell Yeah it is a cool design. I have a silicone tube stuck on a funnel, so I don't have to drag the machine out under the cabinets each time. Here you can place it as convenient, or quickly unpop the hoses to give the tank a wash. And less chance of accidentally pouring water onto components, when refilling the tank inside the machine.
The similarities to the Lelit Elizabeth is interesting. I have been looking for the Elizabeth type espresso machines. In the future I wish you would do a sound comparison on the vibration between these machines just as some people do with grinders. Elizabeth seemed quiet in your review and I'm wondering about this one and how many decibels it is.
Heh I just saw that I did comment 11 months ago but didn't remember or pay much attention about this machine until this week I see it on sale at (iDrinkCoffee) for only 1200$ instead of 1600$CAD. At such low price this is a real steal as otherwise the best option above is a (Lelit MaraX V3) which is about TWICE the price and doesn't even have a screen and isn't as stable temperature-wise since it isn't a Dual-Boiler. I still love the MaraX black edition I bought for my GF and it looks way better and more like a machine that could last a lifetime but when I saw the Bellona on sale, I told my best friend to immediately sell his (Gaggia Classic) of 650$ and to get this which will be wayyyyy better for just a few hundred bucks more, as otherwise a similar machine 100% made in Europe would be a (Profitec 300) that's like 1000$ more so it is a no brainer, and F the Breville prosummers plastic trash.
The water tank isn't quite unique: ECM Puristika. I think those buttons are a fairly common style that could be swapped with a different color. We put them on our rack control panels at work.
Looks cool I like it and a worthy rival to the Lelit Elizabeth, which is around the same price. Still think the Elizabeth's Steam based pre-infusion beats this one though.
I’m saving up for a Bellezza Francesca. What do you think of that machine? It’ll be my first machine and it looks like it’s an amazing value and I like that down the road I can add a flow control for about $300 with one of the various E61 kits. For $2300 it seems to do what other $3500-$4000 ones do. I’d looking at the Minion XL grinder paired with it. I just wish there were more reviews on the Francesca as $2300 is quite the investment.
From Canada here, the local espresso machine repair shop (which is a big one ) had serviced my duo boiler twice in the last 9 years. As of this year they have officially stopped servicing all breville models. According to them, breville stopped sending parts since mid 2022 and as of 2023 has stopped all communication. I contacted couple other shops and none services breville machines anymore. Anyone know any reputable shop that services breville machines in the west coast area ?( Vancouver, BC or even Seattle …)
Many China branded espresso machines and some OEM for foreign companies like this one shared very similar internal components. Perhaps all come from the same factory. 😅
@@KyleRowsell point is I'd rather buy the China branded one. Better quality and better price. Made with better components than the made for OEM counterpart!
Seems shady, I followed your link and got a 1,095 dollar price, then googled the same name and I got the same site, but a price quote of 799 dollars, same machine, on both it states the price has bee n drastically reduced, and all machines are AS IS, no returns. The price difference however seems weird, your link is 300 dollars higher, I thought I would mention it because if someone bought through that link, then found out they got shafted out of 300 dollars they might be perturbed at you. P.S. Same dimensions on height, weight, capacity etc.
Personally - I recommended Rocket Appartamento . I have bought one about half year ago - and continuing learning how makes better cup. It’s fascinating expiriens with heat exchanger machine with E61 group. Know I have new goal - bye and install flow control - its not too expensive and gives much more variable results in coffee making art ))) So I recommend “classic” )))
The problem is, it never provide consistent temp, and you can not control temperatures at all. With the flood of new espresso machines, the appartamento should be cheaper or it will be obsolete by new rivals.
@@RakanWD I bought my for 800$. As I know dual boiler espresso machine cost about 600, so difference wasn’t significant. And it looks and feels much expensive than it really was. About problems with temperature - it partly will soluted with flow control. Not directly of course
@@OlegPC I don't see how the optional E61 Flow Control will do anything to the temperature but as said above, the Appartemento at regular price is absolutely ridiculous. It was already and now even more with the huge price increase from Rocket during covid. A machine without PID is unacceptable at this price point and it's a shame because it's the most beautiful Rocket I'd say. Glad I bought my Rocket R58 before the price increase! I have the flow control but it doesn't seem to do much of a difference to be honnest.
@@PanzerIV88 Thanks. Will note you experience about flow control. I mean that flow control let change time for extraction for coffee in groups basket. Maybe it different type of taste corrections for extracted coffee. About PID - absolutely agree - machine makes much consistent coffee taste with this feature.
Possibly! That being said Ascaso doesn’t have boilers - it uses a thermoblock system which heats the water on the fly. Not bad but often less desirable.
It really makes me wonder why no company has done PID thermoblock for brew and traditional boiler for steam. From everything I've read, the Steel Duo is perfectly capable of delivering stable temperatures during brewing, but lacks the oomph necessary to steam a lot of milk at once.
@@akillersquirrel5880 You make a good point here. I've seen the opposite with the Diletta Mio which has a brew boiler and a thermoblock for steam. I've seen about a 5 sec delay from switching on the steam to actual steam coming out with the Steel Duo too, which I would find pretty annoying.
I’m looking at the Rancillio Sylvia Pro X dual boiler…. Do you think the .3 brew boiler vs this machines .5 is a huge deal? Hoping to pull shots back to back for a maximum of 10 people but most of the time just used for home use.
@@lpnew3 even though it has a pid. The pump will be pumping in cold water as you pull a shot. A 40ml shot will exhaust 12 pct of the boiler and the temp will drop by that much. So a piday not work that well. Of course the earlier water will be hotter and some people (decent espresso) are experimenting with temperature profiling so it might work well.
Parts made in Italy, parts cnced in Germany, assembled in China and then re-sent back to the rest of the world... Is that true? If so, not very eco friendly....
What kills it for is that it is manufactured in china. That is why i went for the profitec pro 600. Also profitecs machines just look better and the build Quality is superior in my opinion. Ive seen the Bellezza machines and to me they feel cheap.
@@seesaw7289 just compare the two machines side to side. I know bellezza managed to take great photos - but go to a dealer and compare the two, the differences are stunning!
I’d love to know your thoughts on the bellona. Which would you choose if looking for a budget dual boiler - this or the breville? Also if you enjoyed the video please consider leaving a 👍 - that stuff truly makes a difference!
Hi. You mentioned the Lelit Elizabeth but didn’t end up comparing it at the end. Would you mind sharing thoughts compared to that? Seems like a very close comparison
@@jt22420 I had thoughts filmed in the original cut but felt like the video went on too long so I cut them. I believe this is competitive to the lelit but you do loose the trusted name that is lelit. This machine isn’t built in Italy (though quality isn’t an issue here), and the lelit has a better pre-infusion system that integrates the steam boiler.
The bellezza is equal if not better in build quality with thicker sidewalls and a heftier steam knob. The electronics on the lelit are superior. The bellezza uses full stainless boilers instead of brass for the lelit brew boiler.
Either are excellent choices for small dual boilers. I think it’ll come down to personal preference and budget. Hope this helps!
@@KyleRowsell excellent thank you. Does brass have more issues than stainless?
As a person with a small kitchen and not a lot of counter space, I love the size/dimensions. Especially how it isn't very deep so the counter space in front of it is still usable
I would be interested to see a comparison with the Ascaso Steel Duo 😀
Thanks for the review. It is the last day on sale, I ordered mine right after watching the video. Confirmed what I was hoping to hear.
Glad to help
I have an Appartamento, but wanted to give a budget DB a try. Tbh if this was available a few years ago, I would have bought it over the Appartamento. Really great value at $1.5k CAD. I was surprised with how solid the build was, and the overall experience was good. But here were my main issues and the reasons why I returned it.
- unable to adjust different pre infusion times for each button
- Steam switch was a bit kitschy for me, it should have been mechanical
- No startup timer and electric switch means no smartplug
- Cups really didn't preheat sitting on top of the machine
- Shot timer disappears as soon as the pump turns off. When you are pulling by weight, your eyes are on your scale when the button is pressed, so you miss the shot time.
- The deal-breaker: I found the steam power dies super quick due to the 1L boiler. I steam for 2 cortados every morning, so about 160ml of milk. After about 20 seconds, the steam power drops and it struggles to keep a whirlpool. You can see the steam boiler temp go down from 135 to 115 or so.
when you had it, did you notice an increase in water usage? I see that the OPV line isn't routed back into the reservoir like most machines, so that leads me to believe you'd be going through a lot more water. i used distilled water with third wave packets and the cost ads up.
If the steam power die that fast sounds like a serious problem. Does anyone have the same problem?
I'd much prefer Ascaso Steel Duo PID (which seems to be where the design probably drew some "inspiration" from anyway!). I realize as a thermoblock machine it does not compare apples to apples, and the steaming is likely better with this Bellona versus the Duo... But the Duo is made in Barcelona, even faster to get hot with excellent thermal stability, has external OPV, and does not reheat your water.
To each their own! And the ascasos are definitely beautiful. I personally find myself hard pressed to spend that money on a thermoblock when other options are available. Especially when a machine like this with dual stainless boilers is less. But maybe that’s just me 😄
Perhaps for the adventure seekers but you can plumb it in with a float valve (but it might not look so pretty when your done) Also I'm not sure if a vibe pump can work very well if the water tank is hidden under the counter top. It's worth a try but I wouldn't be surprised if it had to be at the same level or higher for it to work properly.
Plump?
@@MrJusmobile lol... I meant "plumb", as in hook it up to the plumbing
Thanks for your honest review as usual 😊, I've been waiting fot your review for almost a month then I gave up and bought it a week ago, and it's a white as well 😂, it is a good machine, few things I don't like such as the timing buttons not a real volumetric ones. Still struggling with the steam never got a successful result while it was very easy in the Bianca! I believe can't find a machine with all of these great features in that price! The competitors machines lelit Elizabeth and Profitec 300 are more expensive with almost more 500+ USD!
Ha sorry for making you wait! I truly don’t like to rush a video just to get it out quickly at the risk of missing important information. Glad you’re happy with it! It’s such a great little machine.
Bought this machine before seeing any review as old Rocket Giotto broke down and broughtbin for service ended up trade in.
Yes was attracted by the price as same machine in Giotto cost nearly double plus it is for my mother who wants easy use and not too good in adjusting best coffee. Overall its very easy use, told was German brand only found out it was made in china afte viewing this. So far all good and the delay im hot water was noticed but not big issue. Now will see if this machine will suatain reliability and last as long as previous coffee machine
You mentioned the Lelit Elizabeth briefly as an alternative near the start of the video and then focussed on comparing with the Breville. I know you used the Elizabeth quite a bit when you reviewed it so was interested to know more about that comparison. Any difference in the cup? I purchased an Elizabeth after your review and love you honesty and the information you fill your videos with. Thanks Kyle
I would assume no big difference in Cup. As Kyle said taste is more dependent on Grinder and the Beans. Maybe for light roast the Elizabeths Steam preinfusion can result in better shots.
I would like to say the cup was nearly identical. They both have a timed pre infusion, vibration pump and dual pid control. The big difference would be going with a well known brand like lelit or opt for the more budget option of the bellezza.
When it comes to the build quality I would give it to the bellezza in this comparison for it’s thicker sidewalls and heftier steam knob. But it’s close.
Just will note the elizabeth uses this kinda cool way of using back pressure from the steam boiler to push brew temp water for pre infusion. In that way, you get consistent around 2 bar pre infusion for the period of time of pre infusion rather than pump on, pump off, pump on. In theory, pump on, off, on, is much harsher on your puck and more prone to channeling than true consistent low pressure pre infusion. So imho, a big plus to the elizabeth, along with the fact you can use it on a smart plug timer for convenience. But the price right now for the Bellona can’t be beat.
@@lbafro2011 I agree with this!
I was also wondering about this. Great review, would be really interesting to have a slightly more in-depth between the Elizabeth and the Bellona. I’m thinking of switching from the MaraX which annoys me with very inconstant brew temperatures (mostly an e61 fault, so probably not fixed by the pricey way out of a Bianca) and am unsure between these two „small“ dual boilers.
From all appearances you don’t need to descale this machine. Or, do you? What other cleaning is necessary, e.g. backflush?
It looks nice, I noticed it being available, nice that there's some dual boiler options that are affordable and some good features. I think stuff like this is kinda making the traditional E61 HX machines obsolete / unnecessary.
Thanks for watching Ben!
Amazing review as always sir Kyle! I think you should really take a look at the Gemilai espresso machine lineup. Their pricepoints will blow your mind. I know they are compromising on build quality but its really hard to complain when you can get a decent performing dual boiler at less than half the price of the Bellona, which you already thought is an affordable dual boiler machine.
Great suggestion!
Oct 2023 on sale $799 CD. A double boiler at this price, with these features, would have been on my consideration list. Still very happy with my Profitec GO,. Thank you for the review.
Where'd it go on sale for 799? I just picked it up a few days ago from iDrinkCoffee and it was 999 still.
@@Garyglchanare you in Canada? It’s $799 usd
@@c0s9 I see, it was written 799 CD which made me think it's Canadian Dollars.
I looked in the idrinkicoffee site and that was the listed price.@@Garyglchan
@@Garyglchan
Finally an honest review, Made in China. However, it’s not the labor costs that keep this cheap, no matter what people say. It’s more so the parts and material that are even cheaper.
Always, always, always with China product. It you doubt me select any and I mean any Chinese made automotive tool and put it the use.
Great review Kyle! When I first saw the clip I thought you were reviewing the Ascaso Steel, really similar looking.
Very similar design indeed. But very different specs!
Nice review. I like the separate water container and it cost less in this range. But, if I am going to buy a dual boiler in this design, I rather go for the rancilio Silvia pro x.
Why? In what way is the Silvia superior? Would like your thoughts
Really enjoyed this review Kyle!! Thank you for all your great content :)
It’s such a joy to make video for y’all, thanks for watching!
love the emily shoutout!
Coffee is community. Building other creators up and helping one another is what this is all about
I bought mine two months ago. And ask your seller for a reduction. I bought mine for just 1000€ and at that it is an absolute steal. I'm very happy and the espresso is great. I could also learn how to steam well with this and I enjoy the workflow a lot.
Hi. Where did you buy it from? Thanks
@@nichatkourou773 a distributor in the Netherlands if that is close to you I can tell you which one.
@@Wisemanman Thank you a lot. How happy are you with the machine? The quality of the espresso is the most important thing for me? And of course the nine bar pressure! I hope it doesn’t go over 9 bars while brewing and it is set from the factory at 9 bars?
@@nichatkourou773 quite happy with the pressure (yes, it is indeed 9bars) measured right in the group head do you always get a good reading. Temperature stability and heating up is beautiful and I love the external water tank made out of glass, easy cleaning indeed. Everything is stainless steel which was important to me.
Now the downsides. Pre-infusion is not really pre-infusion as mentioned in the video. No chance for pressure profiling and such, BUT at that price? I'm happy with what I have and the quality of the build is pretty darn good. Maybe a volumetric measurement would've been nice but I have my scale under anyways. Fits a carter everywhere mug plus my timemmore black mirror scale under a bottomless portafilter. Thus, I'm very happy. Since now I've started working at an espresso bar I love the steam lever even more.
@@Wisemanman Thanks again for being helpful! So you are happy with the quality of the espresso it produces? Of course we don’t look for pressure profiling at that price :)). When you say no valumetric measurement what exactly do you mean? Can’t you program a shot??
I d say the best bang for your buck is the Breville Dual boiler . However I m glad to see that now there are other options available.
It’s great to see!
Thank you for this review. This is exactly what I am looking for in my “move up” machine. Btw I like the blue. It’s now #1 on my list against Breville infuser. Which is a lot cheaper. Btw the removable water is a must have for me. I am split if I need a dual boiler although I usually drink a flat white.
It's great to have someone that's not selling the product publish a review. Thank you Kyle!
I am wondering if the pre-infusion could be set up separately for the 2 "volumetric" buttons. I can't remember which review it was but someone had a machine with 2 settings and used one for flushing the group head.
It also seems like the Rancilio Silvia Pro X has very similar features. Any plans for the comparison??
The pre infusion is not separable from the volumetrics. Thanks for watching! All the best!
Just picked up a second hand Bellezza Chiara at a great cost. Was a little skeptical at first, not being familiar with the brand, but it is turning out to be a really solid machine. Thanks for the review.
Could bellezza be the new lelit? Underrated, high value machines? 🤔 time will tell.
Not so sure that I'm a fan of external water tank but I guess you get used to it. QUESTION... What's the advantage of a SMALL dual boiler like this versus a higher grade E61 group but that's "Heat Exchanger"? Wouldn't the 2nd one be a better choice overall if both have a PID?
The Bellona can actually be plumbed in as described by the manufacturer. It also has a thread at the back to fit a the tube from your water line.
Pretty sure they have a plumb in kit available soon.
Hello just wondering if anyone has anymore information on this ?
A month with the bellona (black color and new edition). Its is beautiful, and I'm loving the experience. Plus, now in Canada is available for 1200cad
I just bought one. I’m having issues with the brew pressure dropping down to about 4-5 bar during the shot. I’m curious if you are having issues maintaining brew pressure during your extractions?
@@colinparenteau4637 I did had this issue with the Beeville grinder pro I used with my coffe brewer; I just couldn't get enough pressure. Then, I bought an espresso grinder, and the problem was solved
Hey Kyle, this is a great review. I’m curious: how much of a taste difference in espresso do you notice between the Bellona and your Lelit Bianca. I’m planning to upgrade from a Barista Pro to something better. Already have a DF64 for grinder. Many Thanks!
Another fantastic video and thank you for the pushing out killer quality content always. Pretty PLEASE get your hands on this new Eureka Zero!!
Thanks for the kind words! And I’d love to if I was able!
Would be good to see what’d come from the new Breville acquisition.. if you get a decent quality machine like the Elizabeth with all the goodies shipped with the BDB, that would be a killer machine..
I wouldn’t hold your breath for a cross over. I believe these companies will stay on their own path. But I’d love to be wrong!
Question for you. are the internals of espresso machines universal in terms interchangeability? If it is then finding parts down the road wouldn't be an issue. Secondly, at one price point can one expect to have the machine to be functional (with maintenance) for one's lifetime?
Hi Kyle great video thanks - quick question about those plastic/rubber tubes that show when U opened it up. What are they for on general? Do they touch the hot water or steam paths? Machine has a good price and even it's cold water is stored in glass with an SS tube, so appreciate your feedback as it will influence my decision cheers
This machine actually makes the Breville Dual Boiler look visually appealing (it's already very appealing if you don't consider the looks). The lack of support for smart plugs and an OPV that likely voids the warranty if adjusted don't make the Bellezza any more desirable. I'd spend a little more and get a BDB or a Lelit Elizabeth.
Fair enough. Though if honest this does seem like the approach of an enthusiast. Which is understandable. But for most people those $300-500 in savings is a no brainer if they don’t want to adjust the opv or have auto start features.
@@KyleRowsell Did you check what the pressure was set at from factory?
Design wise, i would prefer the bellona. The Sage machines all look like awkward plasticky piles of trash in my opinion. So as you can see, design is a matter of personal taste. I find it interesting that there is a dual boiler at this price point. Not many machines in this category. What i do not like is that it is assembled in China AND the producer pretends like it is a "made in germany" machine. As a german, i am very angry about this. I mean, look at their website. Everything on the website is there to make the customer think he is buying a handcrafted masterpiece of german engineering.
Mine was set for perfectly 9 bars from the factory, nothing to complain about.
@@justbenny84 I totally agree with you, this is all made to be as confusing as possible so if you don't look carefully, you're gonna believe it is made in Germany while they in fact serve you the BS "Designed in... Made in a sh*thole place" ... So just for that reason alone I'd rather spend a bit more and get a real HX E61 from Italy or Germany, rather than a DB from China.
Thank you Kyle for your honest review. Is the water reservoir tank made of glass? Are there other machines you might recommend with it being glass? Thank you in advance.
I own this machine. Loving it for all the reasons you mentioned. The only thing is that the pressure cannot be adjusted, but rather a real-time measurement.
Hello. What a pressure you have during double espresso? I’ve got this machine but the pressure is around 6 bar. Shall I return this device?
@@oksanatereshchenko7996 the pressure varies for me depending on grind size, how much grounds, and how hard you apply the tamper. I suggest you keep the machine and grind the coffee finer and put around 18-20g of coffee ground in a double portafilter to increase the pressure. I am able to pull some 9 bar shots but the shot is longer ~30s for 1:2 ratio.
@@oksanatereshchenko7996 I have the same issue. Mine is dropping as low as 4-5 bar during a 30 second 2:1 extraction. 20g in 40g out. I sent it back. Supplier changed the pump but I still get the same results. Interested if you’ve managed to figure anything out?
@@colinparenteau4637what pressure do you get when you back flush it? Mine easily and quickly gets up to 9 bar before i stop the pump and backflush. If youre getting 9 bar during backflush, and only 4-5 bar during a shot, then it is your grind size, basket size, puck prep etc. But its not the espresso machine/pump. It has a very simple OPV. All we can measure is back pressure before a realease, and as such, isnt a defining measurement for good espresso.
@@BGH-lw4ms thanks for the response. I do get 9 bar quickly and easily when I backflush. I’ve got a new ims basket, I wdt and I think my puck prep is pretty solid. I make dial in 20g to extract at 2:1 in 30 seconds. I get the pressure up close to 9 then depending on the coffee I use the pressure drops down slightly below 8 or sometimes all the way down to 4-5 by the time I reach 30 seconds. I read an article on Reddit where someone was having the same problem, where their machine was getting up to pressure with a blind basket but couldn’t maintain pressure during a shot. It turned out to be a weak pump. The pump could get to pressure with a blind basket but as the resistance lessened as the shot went on the pump could not hold pressure. I sent my machine back and the company I bought from says everything is fine.
Hi Kyle, thanks for the video!
Can you share your thoughts on buying this machine over a Rancilio Silvia Pro X?
Which machine do you prefer??
have you noticed any inconsistencies with steam temp with this machine? I recently got this and i'm having issues with steaming milk. I have my steam temp set to 130. Some days, when steaming it will go from 130 and drop all the way down to 117, while some days it's able to stay within 130-125 temp.
Do you know why this happens?
Hey Kyle, great review. What’s your opinion compare Bellona to Rocket appartmento please? Considering working flow, espresso, and steaming?
Comment on your hat: Have you tried decaf? I've found some delicious decaf beans from roasters like Stumptown coffee and more! I'd love a video on tasting differences between different decaffeination methods :D
Absolutely I have. The hat says coffee over caffeine. And what’s that’s saying is: coffee is more than simply a drug. It’s a way of life, and a product we ought to take seriously
On first glance I thought the water tank was a bit silly, and in ways it still kind of is. Of course the Bianca handles the external tank design much better. But in theory you could ditch the jar and rig up some kind of remineralized RO reservoir under your counter for a sort of "plumbed" in setup. Great features, but the square button/gauge surrounds look cheap/tacky, same with the silver illuminated buttons and those handles aren't doing it for me at all lol. But all in all if you're on a budget for DB, it looks great in the specs dept.
Yeah, due to the display and control buttons it looks more like a cheap Chinese design than even Breville/Sage Dual Boiler... I might get a refund for DB that developed a stream leak from the boiler after less than 1yr (they're saying that water level sensors are damaged and have trouble sourcing then or sth, strange as except the limited steam leaking the machine seemed to work fine), so I'm looking for something in similar budget. But DB seems so much more refined, the controls are well thought through, even details like preserving shot time that this machine supposedly doesn't do, not to mention programmable pre infusion pump power and timing. And the steam boiler hose fittings were supposedly improved in DB recently, and it is cheaper...
I'm planning to buy an espresso maker and this is definitely the best value option that I've found so far. It has a dual boiler and PID control which is extremely important in the coffee extraction process. However, I am concerned about the lifetime of this beautiful piece of engineering given that it was manufactured in China. Any thoughts there?
Many things are made in china. Doesn't mean it's going to fall apart next week.
Lots of machines are assembled in China. I do not see that as a negative. It all depends on the specs and quality of the parts, for Bellezza these are designed in Germany and use Italian and Chinese parts.
I am still doing my research, but understand that the reason that more expensive machines have a back flush capacity is because they use stainless steel pipes. From a durability pov the plastic pipes, they will be a weak spot in the longevity of the machine. However, knowing this and the ease of accessing them, it's possible to change them yourself. I don't know what the specs are on the pipes to know how long they predict they last. The machine is under pressure and if a hose breaks I wonder what kind of damage it would do?
Awesome review. Thanks!
Have you used the La Spaziale S1 Mini Vivaldi II Espresso Machine? After my friend purchased one, less than a month later I had to get one myself. I believe it would be a great review for you to dive into. Keep up the good work!
What do you will be a better choise the bellona or the elizabeth?
That's funny I just researched this machine yesterday!
Nice! Thanks for the comment Jess!
I like the blue lights!
Dude this sounds like a great machine it might give Gaggia Classic Pro with the Gaggiuino mod a run for the money! Nice with shout out for Emilee as well!
The non-adjustable OPV is kind of crazy - it’s not like the cost of an adjustable connector is more than a couple of bucks. My guess is the choice was speed of manufacture and not having to test the performance.
Well it is adjustable. They simply added a rubber seal. But yes I’m curious as well.
1. vs a classic E61 with water flowing around the group head, does the group head also have water flow for max temp. Can i expect to get the same flavor extraction as an E61 machine? 2. how does the preinfusion time work with the manual button?
Love your honesty! I'm wondering if you think one can make a similar or better cup with flair, rok, or cafelat?
It's different. A manual machine is always going to give you more flexibility, but also less stability. If you want a steady shot after shot I would go with an electric machine like this.
@@123marijn321 disagree, I make way more consistent shots with my flair then my Gaggia or Silvia. Because there is no temp surfing and better control of pressure
@paras the flair and robot can both make amazing espresso, with a good quality grinder you won’t have many limits on the standard of coffee you can make! As Marijn says, it’s a slower workflow than if you want to make a lot of drinks at the same time and you have to use something like a nanofoamer if you want to make milk drinks.
@@donh1572 there’s not really any temp surfing with this machine, it has PID.
Also to answer your original question you can pull excellent shots with manual machines but it can be more difficult because temperature stability and you will use quite a bit of water to heat them up. If I was going that route I’d get the Flair 58 because of the temp control and standard portafilter size. The Robot would be my second choice if I had to pick and the Rok while it can pull good shots, it’s painful to use and potentially more expensive if you want to upgrade parts which it kinda needs to be a better machine. All that being said you’ll have to figure a good work flow to make them consistent and that’s where they are tricky. They will not be as consistent as an electric machine. Despite what the other guy said about pulling better shots, he more than likely has a good and consistent workflow so he is able to get better shots, but it sounds like the machines he’s using are single boilers which makes a difference.
I love/hate the external tank. It would definitely be more convenient than built in tank.
How would you rate this machine vs the rancillio Silvia pro X? After you openend the machine from the back, you can clearly see that you wont be able to pre heat cups on this machine..
At this price point I'd rather spend a couple hundred dollars extra and get the Rancilio Pro X. Would be good to have your thoughts on how that might compare, value for money and features etc.
Pretty cool and very nice looking espresso machine, fun and informative video, in reference to the Breville or Bellezza, I agree with you.
Thanks for watching!
@@KyleRowsell your welcome sir
Bellezza Machines are superb. Absolute best bang for your buck imho. The build quality is insane.
The need for white LEDs instead of blue is gargantuan...
Glad we agree hah
Lots of plastics inside🤔 the price is also for plastic machine . Thanks a lot for your reviews.
Hi Kyle. I bought one this week. Love the machine. But the cupholder makes a terrible noise when the pump goes on . Annyone know how to fix this? If put some pressure on it with my hand its gone. Thanks
Their entire line is interesting though it looks like they've been through the ECM parts bin. Made in China is a worry, that destroyed the Gaggia Classic's reputation for around a decade.
None of these are bad things if the product is quality. And after 6 weeks of extensive testing I have no reason to believe it is not.
Niche zero is made in China. So is the iPhone
@@KyleRowsell Six weeks isn't close to long enough to evaluate a mew product's reliability, is the cost saving just manufacturing or quality of components as well? I am very curious to see how these hold up because they just took knocked a grand off the price of an E61 dual boiler.
@@nickborghesan2296 The Niche is nigh on impossible to get and is always on back order, so excuse the pun but it's a niche product, phones they've been doing for decades so have had time to engineer a workforce with tiny fingers not appropriate for plumbing. Time will tell.
@@Nevermindthrbrewmethod e61 DB are usually with larger boilers, rotary pump, and the brew group itself is more expensive. better comparison is with something like the Lelit Elizabeth which is only
Can the handle be replaced for something else? It''s too tall I believe to fit under my cabinets.
Ok, I had to pull the trigger with 10 hours left on the sale. The price is unbeatable for everything offered. Only question I have at the moment is if there is a way to drain the steam boiler. Since the water valve comes from brew boiler, unless there is a drain valve there doesn't seem to be any way to drain the steam boiler, which could be an issue as over time the TDS will go up and cause scaling.
There is a valve on the bottom of the steam Boiler to empty it.
Yes there is a valve on the bottom of the steam boiler.
I was at IDrinkCoffee this morning to buy my beans and saw the Bellona there for $999 CAD, its an absolute steal at that price.
Wow yes
Have you used the Bellezza Inizio v2? I would like to see a review on this machine as well the ones online are from shops selling them
I don’t know why he keep insisting on comparing to the breville dual boiler, maybe this review isn’t in-bias? He mentioned Lelit Elizabeth early on but avoid calling it out later on. Because of the valid criticisms he’s brought up, Lelit Elizabeth or Rancilio Silvia Pro X, Profitec 500 all of which either made in Italy or Germany would blow this thing out the water IMO based on this review. Or even the Ascaso (not a dual boiler)
Can you also do a review on the Profitec pro 300?
Possibly!
Great review just wanted to add that the glass water holder with stainless steel tube is a reflection of people being paranoid and possibly rightfully so of water being stored in plastic materials....
... which is one of the main reasons I would seriously consider upgrading from my breville to a plastic free italian-made machine.... Which is the reason this machine caught my eye...☕👍🇨🇦
Being engineered out of Germany, my guess is that given the EU's stellar record of banning of toxic materials in the food industry, more than anywhere else in the world... I would trust this machine being spec'd to EU food safety standards as a bonus.
I was looking for the BDB and everywhere shows it being discontinued. So I looked at the Elizabeth dual boiler. How does this compare to the Elizabeth v3?
I really like the looks of it! The only thing I don't like that's keeping me from pulling the trigger is the OPV routes water to the drip tray, resulting in a lot of wasted water. I'm wondering if there's a way to reroute it like others have done on different machines.
If honest I didn't notice a massive waste in water. I use TWW and I'm conservative with waste but it wasn't an issue personally.
@@KyleRowsell Good to know, thanks! I'm still leaning towards the Elizabeth but really appreciate the in depth video on the Bellona. It answered a lot of my questions.
well done. got my eye on this one...
if my DB breaks, I would totally look at this. Thanks
Thanks for watching!
ECM Puristika has the exact same water tank setup. Not sure which came up with it. Puristika is pretty new, Could be they copied Bellona. But certainly not a coincidence that two German manufacturers come up with the same design within a few months.
I’m not sure either but I did see the puristika with this design in pre production at the show in Milan long before the bellona. Regardless I’d love to see more of it! It’s great.
@@KyleRowsell Yeah it is a cool design. I have a silicone tube stuck on a funnel, so I don't have to drag the machine out under the cabinets each time. Here you can place it as convenient, or quickly unpop the hoses to give the tank a wash. And less chance of accidentally pouring water onto components, when refilling the tank inside the machine.
Did you just call it the baloney? 3:12
LOL I’m not even sure. I don’t remember saying this but good catch 😅
What about the La Spaziale Mini Vivaldi/Lucca, etc.? Costs just a bit more, true Italian, better?
The similarities to the Lelit Elizabeth is interesting. I have been looking for the Elizabeth type espresso machines.
In the future I wish you would do a sound comparison on the vibration between these machines just as some people do with grinders. Elizabeth seemed quiet in your review and I'm wondering about this one and how many decibels it is.
I think he would be better to test for sound. It's too subjective not to.
Heh I just saw that I did comment 11 months ago but didn't remember or pay much attention about this machine until this week I see it on sale at (iDrinkCoffee) for only 1200$ instead of 1600$CAD. At such low price this is a real steal as otherwise the best option above is a (Lelit MaraX V3) which is about TWICE the price and doesn't even have a screen and isn't as stable temperature-wise since it isn't a Dual-Boiler.
I still love the MaraX black edition I bought for my GF and it looks way better and more like a machine that could last a lifetime but when I saw the Bellona on sale, I told my best friend to immediately sell his (Gaggia Classic) of 650$ and to get this which will be wayyyyy better for just a few hundred bucks more, as otherwise a similar machine 100% made in Europe would be a (Profitec 300) that's like 1000$ more so it is a no brainer, and F the Breville prosummers plastic trash.
Very tempting at that discounted price point.
It’s hard to beat
what exactly does it mean the live pressure at the grouphead?
Hahahahah....rubber protection. Never stopped anyone before. 😂
😅😅😅
The water tank isn't quite unique: ECM Puristika.
I think those buttons are a fairly common style that could be swapped with a different color. We put them on our rack control panels at work.
I’m not sure that doesn’t mean it’s unique as that vast majority of machines don’t have this feature. I didn’t say that they crafted the idea.😄
How long did it pour on that double shot?
What about The Rancilio Silvia Pro ?? About the same price I would say…
Looks cool I like it and a worthy rival to the Lelit Elizabeth, which is around the same price. Still think the Elizabeth's Steam based pre-infusion beats this one though.
That feature on the Elizabeth is great.
I’m saving up for a Bellezza Francesca. What do you think of that machine? It’ll be my first machine and it looks like it’s an amazing value and I like that down the road I can add a flow control for about $300 with one of the various E61 kits. For $2300 it seems to do what other $3500-$4000 ones do. I’d looking at the Minion XL grinder paired with it. I just wish there were more reviews on the Francesca as $2300 is quite the investment.
Breville has their parts made in China but they machines are assembled in Australia for TQM
From Canada here, the local espresso machine repair shop (which is a big one ) had serviced my duo boiler twice in the last 9 years. As of this year they have officially stopped servicing all breville models. According to them, breville stopped sending parts since mid 2022 and as of 2023 has stopped all communication. I contacted couple other shops and none services breville machines anymore. Anyone know any reputable shop that services breville machines in the west coast area ?( Vancouver, BC or even Seattle …)
Many China branded espresso machines and some OEM for foreign companies like this one shared very similar internal components. Perhaps all come from the same factory. 😅
Lots of espresso machines share internal components. I’m not sure I follow your point
@@KyleRowsell point is I'd rather buy the China branded one. Better quality and better price. Made with better components than the made for OEM counterpart!
This is available for $799 USD now.
Seems shady, I followed your link and got a 1,095 dollar price, then googled the same name and I got the same site, but a price quote of 799 dollars, same machine, on both it states the price has bee n drastically reduced, and all machines are AS IS, no returns. The price difference however seems weird, your link is 300 dollars higher, I thought I would mention it because if someone bought through that link, then found out they got shafted out of 300 dollars they might be perturbed at you. P.S. Same dimensions on height, weight, capacity etc.
"Friendly"
It looks beautiful
It does!
What coffee grinder did you use in this video?
The niche zero
Personally - I recommended Rocket Appartamento . I have bought one about half year ago - and continuing learning how makes better cup. It’s fascinating expiriens with heat exchanger machine with E61 group. Know I have new goal - bye and install flow control - its not too expensive and gives much more variable results in coffee making art ))) So I recommend “classic” )))
The problem is, it never provide consistent temp, and you can not control temperatures at all.
With the flood of new espresso machines, the appartamento should be cheaper or it will be obsolete by new rivals.
@@RakanWD I bought my for 800$. As I know dual boiler espresso machine cost about 600, so difference wasn’t significant. And it looks and feels much expensive than it really was. About problems with temperature - it partly will soluted with flow control. Not directly of course
@@OlegPC I don't see how the optional E61 Flow Control will do anything to the temperature but as said above, the Appartemento at regular price is absolutely ridiculous. It was already and now even more with the huge price increase from Rocket during covid. A machine without PID is unacceptable at this price point and it's a shame because it's the most beautiful Rocket I'd say. Glad I bought my Rocket R58 before the price increase! I have the flow control but it doesn't seem to do much of a difference to be honnest.
@@PanzerIV88 Thanks. Will note you experience about flow control. I mean that flow control let change time for extraction for coffee in groups basket. Maybe it different type of taste corrections for extracted coffee. About PID - absolutely agree - machine makes much consistent coffee taste with this feature.
Ascaso Steel Duo PID would be my choice over this one, slightly more expensive but imo looks better and better switches (machine is made in Spain)...
Possibly! That being said Ascaso doesn’t have boilers - it uses a thermoblock system which heats the water on the fly. Not bad but often less desirable.
@@KyleRowsell yes, true, big difference between the two indeed...
It really makes me wonder why no company has done PID thermoblock for brew and traditional boiler for steam.
From everything I've read, the Steel Duo is perfectly capable of delivering stable temperatures during brewing, but lacks the oomph necessary to steam a lot of milk at once.
@@akillersquirrel5880 You make a good point here. I've seen the opposite with the Diletta Mio which has a brew boiler and a thermoblock for steam. I've seen about a 5 sec delay from switching on the steam to actual steam coming out with the Steel Duo too, which I would find pretty annoying.
I’m looking at the Rancillio Sylvia Pro X dual boiler…. Do you think the .3 brew boiler vs this machines .5 is a huge deal? Hoping to pull shots back to back for a maximum of 10 people but most of the time just used for home use.
My lelit has a small.boiler and the temp stability can be an issue. I don't know the Sylvia prox does it have a pid? Do you measure temp stability?
Pro X Temperature should be fine. However the drip tray is bit small so this could be more of an issue.
@@parasbhargava6047 it has PID and is supposedly extremely temperature stable
@@lpnew3 I’d probably get a third party option to counter the small tray
@@lpnew3 even though it has a pid. The pump will be pumping in cold water as you pull a shot. A 40ml shot will exhaust 12 pct of the boiler and the temp will drop by that much. So a piday not work that well. Of course the earlier water will be hotter and some people (decent espresso) are experimenting with temperature profiling so it might work well.
Although I may not have an espresso machine yet, I can promise you I will never own a Chinese made one.
Parts made in Italy, parts cnced in Germany, assembled in China and then re-sent back to the rest of the world... Is that true?
If so, not very eco friendly....
I don't know factually, but I would guess that the vast vast majority of complex consumer products are manufactured in a similar fashion
Hey Kyle, any plans to review the 9Barista?
I hope to!
No plug in water system big NO
What kills it for is that it is manufactured in china. That is why i went for the profitec pro 600. Also profitecs machines just look better and the build Quality is superior in my opinion. Ive seen the Bellezza machines and to me they feel cheap.
Profitec is a good brand, but You can get good build quality from china and poor build quality from Italy too.
Apple iPhones and iPads are made in China, as are all Apple products. Are they poor quality too?
@@seesaw7289 just compare the two machines side to side. I know bellezza managed to take great photos - but go to a dealer and compare the two, the differences are stunning!
@@seesaw7289 it is not china per se. But in this case you can see the Italien traditions.
Can it use E61 portafilters?
Yes!
I would look at the Lelit Elizabeth :)
I have! I’ve filmed a video on it
"2000 dollars"
"Budget friendly"
Espresso is weird... ^^
I would have like the water tank in the machine